# The State of Toby's Insides



## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Just got off with Toby's veterinarian. Overall he has an excellent report from his echocardiogram and his abdominal sonogram. The sonogram, with one exception, was "unremarkable", meaning everything looked good. His echo showed no progression of his mitral valve issues. Hooray!

The problem lymph node is in his abdominal area, near his intestines. The internist believes it's a simply lymph node doing it's job of filtering something out. It wasn't enlarged last time around. His recommendation is to do 6 week physical exams with x-ray if needed. If it were cancer more than one would be involved, even at the earliest stages. I feel so relieved! 

In talking with the vet I mentioned Toby was totally inactive last week due to the snow/ice yet he did not gain weight as I expected, but maintained, even with the same, if not more food! I also mentioned on our early morning hikes he poops twice. The first time the stool is firm, the second time it's much softer. I asked if that might relate to something going on in his intestines, maybe enlarging that node (I know, pretty off the wall, but I do think out loud a lot). She said probably not, but she suggested a GI blood test for him that is sent down to Texas A&M vet school labs for review. We'll draw his blood next monday (fasting-Toby will not be a happy Valentines boy). It's possible he's deficient in some digestive enzyme or has mild IBS issue.

Eventually we will get everything figured out, for a while.  Toby's pretty tired of being poked and prodded, but I keep on telling him it's for his best health.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Dallas Gold*

Dallas Gold

So glad that Toby got a good report!


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## Ninde'Gold (Oct 21, 2006)

Hooray for Toby!!!


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## lucysmum (Sep 2, 2010)

Well done Toby. Sending you an early extra valentines hug for you.


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## mdoats (Jun 7, 2007)

"Unremarkable" is very good. Glad to hear things are looking OK.

BTW... when I'm walking Rookie around the neighborhood or we go to the park down the street in the morning, there's usually just one normal poop to collect. When he's off leash at the dog park or hiking out on the trails, there's usually his normally poop, plus at least one other small, soft poop to collect. Sometimes two. I have always just attributed it to the extra movement getting things, well, moving.


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

Unremarkable - I love those reports! Yay Toby


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## Randysmama (Feb 4, 2011)

That is great news! Give Toby a big hug and kiss for me.


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

I am glad Toby's tests went well  Let me throw this out to you keeping in mind every dog is different.

Tucker had the normal/soft stool issue consistently when he got older. We never found anything wrong with him, not a food issue or anything else. My personal thought is that in some dogs (senior or not) once they have a normal stool that it relaxes the muscles a bit allowing the softer portion (not completely digested)to move down faster so they feel the need to go again, especially when being exercised. I took a 7yr old Goldie for a walk a few days ago for his senior owners (tough to get out in the cold and snow for them) and he did the same normal/soft thing too. Toby's inactivity during the past week may have something to do with this. 

Fiona is 8 and does one per day, no soft stuff whether a slow day or one filled with zoomies, go figure.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Yea for Toby. You know he's going to want some serious V'Day treats after that fast.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

GoldenCamper said:


> I am glad Toby's tests went well  Let me throw this out to you keeping in mind every dog is different.
> 
> Tucker had the normal/soft stool issue consistently when he got older. We never found anything wrong with him, not a food issue or anything else. My personal thought is that in some dogs (senior or not) once they have a normal stool that it relaxes the muscles a bit allowing the softer portion (not completely digested)to move down faster so they feel the need to go again, especially when being exercised. I took a 7yr old Goldie for a walk a few days ago for his senior owners (tough to get out in the cold and snow for them) and he did the same normal/soft thing too. Toby's inactivity during the past week may have something to do with this.
> 
> Fiona is 8 and does one per day, no soft stuff whether a slow day or one filled with zoomies, go figure.


Only with other dog lovers can we talk about poo and not think it's gross or improper! The state of Toby's poo has been an issue in my mind since he was about 3 or 4. It suddenly started being on the soft side :yuck: about then and we attributed it to several things, notably eating road kill and other indiscretions on a digestive front. We had his fecal checked repeatedly and at least once we saw tapeworm segments in his stool :yuck::yuck:, literally walked it up to the vet in it's baggie and they still couldn't find it! To be safe the vet prescribed a de wormer and it cleared up for a couple of months, then started up again being consistently soft. We tried all sorts of new kibbles with extra fiber, added fibrous veggies, etc, then found a great high fiber, no BHA additive (I suspect affects his thyroid levels) and that's when we started getting the firm poop, followed by a softie. I've been telling my vet my concerns and then how happy I was we were getting a firm one at least once a day. Today is the first time she suggested the GI work up and I immediately consented. She said it could disclose a digestive enzyme that's insufficient or perhaps mild IBS, which we can treat. I sort of suspected the follow up soft poops were just recent stuff in his GI tract, but perhaps this test will shed more light on what's going on down there. 

I just love all these specialized tests to help our pups be their healthiest, but my bank account sure doesn't. :no: During the sonogram the technician told me she just went to a seminar/convention and saw the latest 4D sonogram technology and said it comes with a hefty price tag to upgrade, meaning what they charge pet owners will be even more $$$$. She hopes veterinarians and traveling sonogram businesses can start offering it very soon. She said the specialists will need a lot of additional training to read the reports and films.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Penny & Maggie's Mom said:


> Yea for Toby. You know he's going to want some serious V'Day treats after that fast.


Oh yeah, going to Petco to pick up some Salmon Chummies is on my Valentines to do list for him. Those are his all time favorite treats. Costco used to carry them but I haven't seen them there in several months.  They smell just awful but he'll trade anything for them. I'll be feeding him those all day to make up for starving him for 3 hours extra!


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Sounds like great news! And it's good that they want to send the bloodwork to Texas A&M. If there are any GI issues going on, they'll catch it. They're the authority on that stuff.
If they're talking about testing for an enzyme deficiency, they're probably going to run the TLI test, right? Did they say anything about testing for SIBO, by any chance?


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

LifeOfRiley said:


> Sounds like great news! And it's good that they want to send the bloodwork to Texas A&M. If there are any GI issues going on, they'll catch it. They're the authority on that stuff.
> If they're talking about testing for an enzyme deficiency, they're probably going to run the TLI test, right? Did they say anything about testing for SIBO, by any chance?


No, but I can ask on Monday when we do the blood draw.


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Dallas Gold said:


> No, but I can ask on Monday when we do the blood draw.


Yeah, I'd ask her what she thinks about that. If she's sending the blood to A&M, I would imagine she's already planning to have them test for it, or has already decided that it's unlikely. But it wouldn't hurt to ask.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

So glad Toby's results were good and that he will get yummy (EUW ) Valentine treats!


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## Katie and Paddy's Mum (Mar 31, 2010)

I too am pleased to hear about Toby's results. Things do sound very positive. It's good you are going the extra distance to try to determine the cause of the second looser stool.

I know from experience, and it's rare - but on the odd occasion when Katie had two poops in one walk, the second is always softer. I attribute it to being undigested food! Or just an overly full colon  But if it was recurring all the time, I would probably want to find out if there was anything I could do to help.

You must definitely be relieved that things are looking good inside there. Hopefully if something small is out of balance they can supplement to help him!!

You're a very good doggy mum to your boy!!

Kim


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## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

Dallas Gold said:


> Only with other dog lovers can we talk about poo and not think it's gross or improper!


and we discuss it in graphic detail.

I'm glad Toby's tests were good and hope you get to the bottom of the softy poo problem.:crossfing

Your Valentine's day kisses will be oh so sweet:yuck:. give toby some chummies and kisses for me too.:smooch:


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## goldencontriever3 (Nov 7, 2008)

So glad to hear you got great news!! Give Toby a big hug from us!


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

*Update*



LifeOfRiley said:


> Sounds like great news! And it's good that they want to send the bloodwork to Texas A&M. If there are any GI issues going on, they'll catch it. They're the authority on that stuff.
> If they're talking about testing for an enzyme deficiency, they're probably going to run the TLI test, right? Did they say anything about testing for SIBO, by any chance?


Toby had a TLI/PLI/Cobol/Folate-S&H blood draw this morning, to the tune of over $200. We should get his results by Friday. He was not a happy Valentines boy this morning because of the 12 hour fast requirement. Never mind I gave him an extra meal last night at 7:55, to get it in the 12 hour window! I ate my breakfast with the pleading sad eyes making me feel awful. Since it is a BEAUTIFUL :smooch::smooch: day here we walked the short distance to the clinic and Toby thought about getting some fresh meat in the form of squirrels. My arm almost got jerked off of me walking down, and then back because he knew his "dinny" was forthcoming. He's a Happy Kissy Face boy again now. 

I checked on the required follow up on the lymph node. It can't be palpitated where it is so in 6 weeks we'll do another sonogram (ouch, my wallet is not happy ) with possible aspirate if still problematic.


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

Dallas Gold said:


> Toby had a TLI/PLI/Cobol/Folate-S&H blood draw this morning, to the tune of over $200. We should get his results by Friday. He was not a happy Valentines boy this morning because of the 12 hour fast requirement. Never mind I gave him an extra meal last night at 7:55, to get it in the 12 hour window! I ate my breakfast with the pleading sad eyes making me feel awful. Since it is a BEAUTIFUL :smooch::smooch: day here we walked the short distance to the clinic and Toby thought about getting some fresh meat in the form of squirrels. My arm almost got jerked off of me walking down, and then back because he knew his "dinny" was forthcoming. He's a Happy Kissy Face boy again now.
> 
> I checked on the required follow up on the lymph node. It can't be palpitated where it is so in 6 weeks we'll do another sonogram (ouch, my wallet is not happy ) with possible aspirate if still problematic.


Not sure how I missed this thread originally - but happy to hear he's a happy kissy face again! 

Gotta love all the tests - so good to know what's what. But I hear you about the $$. My dog is really the only time I say... whatever it costs... and pass the credit card. It's crazy how much it costs just to walk in the clinic door - before anything is even done! "Office call" is what it is on my vet bill. Argh.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Sweet Girl said:


> Gotta love all the tests - so good to know what's what. But I hear you about the $$. My dog is really the only time I say... whatever it costs... and pass the credit card. It's crazy how much it costs just to walk in the clinic door - before anything is even done! "Office call" is what it is on my vet bill. Argh.


I think the veterinarians we see want us to get a new puppy or a special needs Golden sooner than later, so they can continue to fund work on a new building they are currently working on for their pet orphanage.  Every time we go they ask, well, are you ready yet?


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Toby*

Happy Valentine's Day to Toby and his wonderful Mom!!


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Dallas Gold said:


> Toby had a TLI/PLI/Cobol/Folate-S&H blood draw this morning, to the tune of over $200. We should get his results by Friday. He was not a happy Valentines boy this morning because of the 12 hour fast requirement. Never mind I gave him an extra meal last night at 7:55, to get it in the 12 hour window! I ate my breakfast with the pleading sad eyes making me feel awful. Since it is a BEAUTIFUL :smooch::smooch: day here we walked the short distance to the clinic and Toby thought about getting some fresh meat in the form of squirrels. My arm almost got jerked off of me walking down, and then back because he knew his "dinny" was forthcoming. He's a Happy Kissy Face boy again now.


LOL. Glad to hear he's a happy guy again. I know Gunner was never happy when I had to have those tests run for him and had to fast him for the 12 hours. That poor dog did everything in his power to remind me that I'd 'forgotten to feed him.' :

That's really not a bad price for those tests. I mean, yeah - it's bad _enough_... but our vet charged us over $360 each time we had the TLI and the cobalamine/folate checked. We had the tests run three different times, so thank god we had insurance!

Fingers crossed that you get some good news from the tests.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

I'll be waiting to hear those results on Fri. Enjoy your Valentine's day you two.


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## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

I'm glad Toby is back to his happy self and trying to get a squirrel meal.
Enjoy the lovely day. Valentine's :smooch::smooch::smooch::smooch: to toby.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

coppers-mom said:


> I'm glad Toby is back to his happy self and trying to get a squirrel meal.
> Enjoy the lovely day. Valentine's :smooch::smooch::smooch::smooch: to toby.


Toby sends you return :smooch::smooch::smooch:! He settled for real dog food instead of squirrel today.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

LifeOfRiley said:


> LOL. Glad to hear he's a happy guy again. I know Gunner was never happy when I had to have those tests run for him and had to fast him for the 12 hours. That poor dog did everything in his power to remind me that I'd 'forgotten to feed him.' :
> 
> That's really not a bad price for those tests. I mean, yeah - it's bad _enough_... but our vet charged us over $360 each time we had the TLI and the cobalamine/folate checked. We had the tests run three different times, so thank god we had insurance!
> 
> Fingers crossed that you get some good news from the tests.


$360???? :uhoh: I knew our vet clinic was expensive, but I'm happy we weren't charged that much! Yikes! Where did they send the tests? Maybe it was extra overnight shipping?


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

Glad he got dinner and sending positive vibes for good results on Friday!


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## Belle's Mom (Jan 24, 2007)

Glad to hear Toby's tests are done....and now we just await the results.


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## Jean_NJ (Dec 15, 2010)

I'm glad your love received a good report.

Perhaps inactivity is effecting his pooping. Our Cocker isn't a big fan of snow or wet, but when Dunc was around he would at least play with him in those conditions.

Right after Dunc left I had to physically carry him outside he wouldn't go at all.

Yesterday he was playing bounce the ball down the steps outside, and he pooped. We then went for a walk in the state park near us for a long bit, he pooped twice. I think he just needed to get out and get some really decent exercise.


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## Tuckers Mom (Nov 12, 2010)

I am glad we are on the poop subject. Tucker has had that same style of stools since I got him. ( granted he's a big pup still) but it was really troubling at first. The first thing I did was switched him of of BB, it was too high in protein for him, and now he is on TOTW salmon and I mix 2T plain yogurt in his morning feed, and he gets dogzymes digestive enhancer with his evening feed. His first stools are hard, followed by soft, just as Steve suggested. He is on Interceptor so I don't feel like it's a worming issue, but I feel better knowing now that others have the same issues with their dog's stools. Thanks for the Post! Makes me feel better already....


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Tuckers Mom said:


> I am glad we are on the poop subject. Tucker has had that same style of stools since I got him. ( granted he's a big pup still) but it was really troubling at first. The first thing I did was switched him of of BB, it was too high in protein for him, and now he is on TOTW salmon and I mix 2T plain yogurt in his morning feed, and he gets dogzymes digestive enhancer with his evening feed. His first stools are hard, followed by soft, just as Steve suggested. He is on Interceptor so I don't feel like it's a worming issue, but I feel better knowing now that others have the same issues with their dog's stools. Thanks for the Post! Makes me feel better already....


Glad I could help! Maybe we could persuade the forum admin to start a poop issue thread?  

If his GI tests come back normal (and I hope they do), I'll just learn to live with the normal poop, soft poop scenerio and just make sure my poop bags don't have any pinprick holes in them. :yuck::doh: 

Today a recurring issue with Toby started up again: humidity intolerance. This is the first warm (57 degrees) humid day we've had in several months and Toby slowed and started walking behind me about one mile into our normal 3 mile walk. He wasn't panting, but I took him home to rest immediately while I continued the walk. It concerns me humidity bothers him and I can only conclude the minor mitral valve regurgitation issues are exaggerated by humidity.


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## Tuckers Mom (Nov 12, 2010)

awwww, Poor guy. Yes, I am in NC, and we are expecting nice warm weather this week, so It will be interesting to see how Tucker does. at a year old, I don't expect any issues, other than his massive shed going on.... sigh. Hug Toby for me!


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

*Results are In*

I got a call from Toby's vet this a.m. I was swimming in my Endless Pool so I was dripping wet listening on my waterproof phone, which isn't the best for sound quality. DH was on the other extension with his stereo going. Basically Toby has an overgrowth of one type of digestive bacteria. I'll get the report tomorrow and can name it then. The treatment is very involved and long term. He gets weekly injections of either Vitamin B or D (dang that phone!) for 6 weeks, followed by a follow up blood test in 3 months. The vet will take a simpler test in 30 days. 
She said this was most likely from all his eating indiscretions ( otherwise known as roadkill and bread tossed for birds) in the previous year or so. I asked why his daily probiotics didn't help this and she didn't know but suggested I keep him on them. This overgrowth may or may not relate to the one swollen abdominal lymph gland (we hope it is directly related to it and will resolve with treatment). We also are not sure if treatment will result in his weight normalizing (he's slightly low now) and his poops getting firmer consistently. I'll post about that once we know. 

She concluded by saying many owners like this treatment for their dogs so much they continue with periodic injections....hmmmm...

He goes in tomorrow afternoon as part of his afternoon walk. I can report the cost and his reaction after that. Hopefully he will be OK with no side effects. If it's Vitamin B I don't think he will because Barkley routinely got Vitamin B-12 injections with his acupuncture.


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## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

Dallas Gold said:


> She concluded by saying many owners like this treatment for their dogs so much they continue with periodic injections....hmmmm...


It sounds like your vet needs a new vacation home.

Seriously, I am glad they found this and have a treatment. I'll hope and pray this is what made his lymph node be reactive.:crossfing

I sure wish the humidity didn't bother Toby. Restricted access to the lovely road kill and such might make him get better faster though.


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## Tuckers Mom (Nov 12, 2010)

Well, I would suppose this is good news? At least you know what you are dealing with.... The Lady that used to be the rescue Chairperson of the Golden rescue here and Myself are good friends. I was chatting with her recently with Tuckers poops, and she said in addition to the enzymes, give him a whole egg yolk and 2T plain nonfat yogurt stirred into his food. She said this is what Vet's had suggested for one of her's that had developed Inflamatory bowel disease. I started doing that about a week ago and darned if it isn't working! much firmer, consistent stools.... Who knows... I hope you can get to a conclusion that you all can live with... ( hugs)


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## Belle's Mom (Jan 24, 2007)

Glad to hear you have some answers, but sad to hear about the humidity issue as we don't seem to be getting any weather relief in TX any time soon now.

Now just to get Toby to realize the reasons he should be choosier about what he eats!!

Keep us posted on how the injection goes.


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

May the vitamin shots work their magic. Hopefully you only get charged for the injection and not the vet visit every week:uhoh:


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

coppers-mom said:


> It sounds like your vet needs a new vacation home.


More like private school tuition. She had a baby about 8 months ago and I guess she's getting an early start on accumulating some cash for tuition! 

I think DH is going to be much more careful in what/where he lets Toby sniff in the future. I admit Toby is much faster at grabbing the bad stuff when I'm holding the leash, but I'm half blind and not as reactive on pulling the leash back...DH has excellent vision (20/10) and can see all of the stuff much better! We both think this is probably from all the disgusting bread one of our neighbor's tosses all around the house in his attempt to feed the birds and assorted wildlife, including the rats. :yuck:


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Tuckers Mom said:


> Well, I would suppose this is good news? At least you know what you are dealing with.... The Lady that used to be the rescue Chairperson of the Golden rescue here and Myself are good friends. I was chatting with her recently with Tuckers poops, and she said in addition to the enzymes, give him a whole egg yolk and 2T plain nonfat yogurt stirred into his food. She said this is what Vet's had suggested for one of her's that had developed Inflamatory bowel disease. I started doing that about a week ago and darned if it isn't working! much firmer, consistent stools.... Who knows... I hope you can get to a conclusion that you all can live with... ( hugs)


That's a good home remedy to try and I'm glad it is working. I'm a little squeamish about giving Toby raw egg, due to salmonella possibilities. Maybe I could try cooking it--that should work as well. I may try plain greek yogurt again too. Last time I tried it I used non-greek yogurt, just plain Dannon, and he was a little lactose intolerant. :yuck: Or at least I thought he was the one making all that gas! I know Dannon adds in sugar, even to the plain stuff, so maybe the Greek Yogurt would be a better option to try.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

Hoping the injections help Toby and that then he goes back to normal. Poor boy.
Do you use Dogzymes Digestive Enhancer?


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Dallas Gold said:


> I got a call from Toby's vet this a.m. I was swimming in my Endless Pool so I was dripping wet listening on my waterproof phone, which isn't the best for sound quality. DH was on the other extension with his stereo going. Basically Toby has an overgrowth of one type of digestive bacteria. I'll get the report tomorrow and can name it then. The treatment is very involved and long term. He gets weekly injections of either Vitamin B or D (dang that phone!) for 6 weeks, followed by a follow up blood test in 3 months. The vet will take a simpler test in 30 days.
> She said this was most likely from all his eating indiscretions ( otherwise known as roadkill and bread tossed for birds) in the previous year or so. I asked why his daily probiotics didn't help this and she didn't know but suggested I keep him on them. This overgrowth may or may not relate to the one swollen abdominal lymph gland (we hope it is directly related to it and will resolve with treatment). We also are not sure if treatment will result in his weight normalizing (he's slightly low now) and his poops getting firmer consistently. I'll post about that once we know.
> 
> She concluded by saying many owners like this treatment for their dogs so much they continue with periodic injections....hmmmm...
> ...


It sounds like SIBO, and if it is, it's the B injections that he'll need. You might want to ask your vet about putting him on Tylan powder. A LOT of people have success treating SIBO with Tylan.


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

LifeOfRiley said:


> It sounds like SIBO, and if it is, it's the B injections that he'll need. You might want to ask your vet about putting him on Tylan powder. A LOT of people have success treating SIBO with Tylan.


Your mention of SIBO reminded me of a website with some great info.

SIBO - EPI * Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency

And info on B12/Cobalamin (from the Texas A&M University website.)

B12 - EPI * Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency

Hope those links help.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Thanks Life of Riley and Golden Camper for the links. As soon as I get the report this afternoon I will re-read the report with the linked articles and hopefully gain a better understanding. Based on the brief phone consultation with Toby's vet I believe the deficiency is mild. No mention was made of the Tylan powder. I won't be seeing the vet this afternoon but will definitely follow up when the vet calls again. Interesting the protocol for treating colbalamine deficiency changed just last month. That protocol is what the vet described to me. 

Toby has lost a few pounds, but is just slightly under his ideal weight by perhaps a pound or two. He's always hungry and I understand this treatment increases the appetite. Oh boy! That will be interesting. Today he's shared some apple with me and even begged for a section of my orange, which he ate! I'll be stocking up on more green beans and carrots for my little Energizer Toby! He's also been extremely active today, grabbing a napkin out of my lap, rearranging one of our rugs, moving the sofa cusions with his head, and playing with his rubber chicken, tug rope, Wubba, nylabone and tennis balls. He's even chased a nasty squirrel from our back yard twice....I'm tired from watching him!


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## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

I am so glad Toby is feeling so frisky and is giving those squirrels a hard time.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Toby and I just got back from his first injection. He has a cobalamin deficiency. Normal ranges are 251 to 908 and Toby's is 179. His folate is also low at 7.4. Normal values are 7.7 to 24.4. The interpretation is it is consistent with distal small intestinal disease, EPI or small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. His TLI is normal so EPI was ruled out. His folate deficiency is consistent with disease affecting the proximal small intestine. He was given a Vitamin B complex injection intramuscularly. Ouch! They also took a rectal temp and blood pressure. He feels violated. :uhoh: 

We went ahead and scheduled his next 6 appointments. The little guy is going to feel like a pin cushion.

He's down a small amount of weight again, back into the 57 range. He's eating more than ever too. 

It wasn't all doom and gloom for Toby. The exam room has windows and this room looked out into the cat room. The house cat was resting in the window, in full view, looking at Toby during the entire exam. The cat looked like he was on display. Toby was very excited to go see the cat through the windows afterward! That cat isn't bothered by Toby's excited greetings, especially from behind glass!


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Dallas Gold said:


> Toby and I just got back from his first injection. He has a cobalamin deficiency. Normal ranges are 251 to 908 and Toby's is 179. His folate is also low at 7.4. Normal values are 7.7 to 24.4. The interpretation is it is consistent with distal small intestinal disease, EPI or small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. *His TLI is normal so EPI was ruled out.* His folate deficiency is consistent with disease affecting the proximal small intestine. He was given a Vitamin B complex injection intramuscularly. Ouch! They also took a rectal temp and blood pressure. He feels violated. :uhoh:
> 
> We went ahead and scheduled his next 6 appointments. The little guy is going to feel like a pin cushion.
> 
> ...


That's GREAT news! I've ridden the EPI roller coaster and was SO hoping and praying you wouldn't have to deal with that. It didn't sound like full-blown EPI to me, but with those symptoms, it's always possible. Glad to hear his TLI is normal! 

I didn't quite get it from your post - does she think it's a bacterial overgrowth, then? Or something else with the small intestine? At least it sounds like it'll be easily treated, in any case. Even though the poor guy might feel like a pin cushion.
Give him a big kiss for me.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

*The Veterinary Cat That Tormented Toby from his Exam Room Window Today*


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

LifeOfRiley said:


> That's GREAT news! I've ridden the EPI roller coaster and was SO hoping and praying you wouldn't have to deal with that. It didn't sound like full-blown EPI to me, but with those symptoms, it's always possible. Glad to hear his TLI is normal!
> 
> I didn't quite get it from your post - does she think it's a bacterial overgrowth, then? Or something else with the small intestine? At least it sounds like it'll be easily treated, in any case. Even though the poor guy might feel like a pin cushion.
> Give him a big kiss for me.


I'm relieved too it's not EPI.  The vet said it's a bacterial overgrowth and these injections should clear it up. I feel so bad for Toby because he's been dealing with this for some time now. Of course he's getting spoiled with a snack before bed and lots of good treats!


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

coppers-mom said:


> I am so glad Toby is feeling so frisky and is giving those squirrels a hard time.


Me too! Now that it's nice outside he enjoys tormenting them! Turnabout is fair play. They've tormented him all winter. Squirrels...beware!


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Glad to hear he's started on the treatment track. Hope that will do the trick.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Well if he gets bored with squirrels, Cody says he can come for a play date and help dismantle our garage.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Penny & Maggie's Mom said:


> Well if he gets bored with squirrels, Cody says he can come for a play date and help dismantle our garage.


Our first golden did a real number to our garage siding. We didn't discover it until we were prepping the house for sale. My first thought was OH NO, paint is carcinogenic...but he did this as a young puppy and lived to 13 1/2. Tell Cody there are tastier things to chew!


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Toby*

So glad Toby was entertained by the cat-what an adorable picture that is!!


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Dallas Gold said:


> I'm relieved too it's not EPI.  The vet said it's a bacterial overgrowth and these injections should clear it up. I feel so bad for Toby because he's been dealing with this for some time now. Of course he's getting spoiled with a snack before bed and lots of good treats!


Oh, I'll bet you were VERY relieved! SIBO can be not a lot of fun to deal with, but if I had my choice between that or EPI, I'd hope for SIBO every time. And it's great that she thinks the injections alone will take care of it! 
It's a helpless feeling when our pups aren't feeling well. That's when I've always wished that they _could_ understand every word I say, so they could understand that we're taking care of it and it's going to get better.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Toby's second injection was today. He was a crazy wild Energizer Bunny in the waiting area. First, the clinic's house cat came by to taunt him, setting him into a chirpy bark. Then the clinic was photographing some of their orphanage's rescues, including some cats and some darling little puppies. He wanted to go see them and chirped in protest when I made him sit down. Then staff came by to say hi--setting him off. When we got back into the exam room the nurse, one of our favorites, asked about his energy level. :uhoh: I told her that he reverted back to his normal puppy behavior and mischief of overturning every rug in the house, stealing things like kitchen towels off counters, and DH's socks, shoes, etc. I really do think he may be hyperthyroid now. His weight is still pretty low, at around 57.5 lbs. He eats like a horse. He resembles a jumping bean when the food dish is prepared. He must sit/stay before I put it in front of him and he complies thank goodness. We already knew the B vitamin shots would give him more energy, but this little guy is supercharged until about 8 p.m. when he crashes. I think we'll be retesting his thyroid levels soon. We just checked it 2 months ago and he was "normal"...

It's odd seeing Toby's white face and then witnessing his puppy behaviors again!:uhoh: 

The good news: his poops are firmer with each passing day.  I know, TMI. I hope this means he's less deficient in his cobolamin and folate levels.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Toby*

Sounds like Toby is having a fun time!


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## Augie's Mom (Sep 28, 2007)

Great news!!!
If you can't talk poop among friends then they really aren't friends.:--big_grin:


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## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

I am so gald Toby is feeling well and his poops are firmer.
I don't know if dogs react the same as people with their thyroid, but I used to have Grave's disease adn would go from hyper to hypo in 3 - 4 weeks.


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