# large breed puppy vs all-life stages



## canine_mommy (Dec 27, 2010)

I have been feeding Austin Wellness super5mix LBP and I think it's a very good food. He is 10 months old now, so switching him slowly to TOTW. The main difference between LBP and regular puppy food is the Protein/Fat content and the LBP formulas are designed to help with controlled growth of large breed puppies. Pro Plan wasn't good for us either.


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## leonidas7 (Sep 20, 2011)

canine_mommy said:


> I have been feeding Austin Wellness super5mix LBP and I think it's a very good food. He is 10 months old now, so switching him slowly to TOTW. The main difference between LBP and regular puppy food is the Protein/Fat content and the LBP formulas are designed to help with controlled growth of large breed puppies. Pro Plan wasn't good for us either.


I think I am going to take the wellness super5mix puppy and exchange it for the LBP super5mix. They gave us a sample today so I was looking on the back comparing ingredients and the third ingredient for LBP formula is deboned whitefish. Although I would prefer if they said exactly what kind of fish they use.


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## Deber (Aug 23, 2011)

We are on TOTW Sierra Mountain (lamb) and Vet told us the same, I compromised and mixed LBP with the TOTW and we seem to be doing fantastically and Vet agreed. My dogs too seemed to do much better on TOTW instead of the Eukanaba LBP (scratchy coats, lost interest in food). So we will go to total TOTW when they mature a bit more.


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## MGMF (May 13, 2009)

If TOTW is working for your puppy then I wouldn't switch. You can go crazy with diet and switching to often can cause more problems. I think TOTW is an ALS so it is fine for puppies and as I said before if it is doing so well for your pup why change? 

Here are some discriptions of ALS I found that may help:

What exactly does “All Life Stages” mean? »

Acana - all life stages vs puppy?? - Doberman Forum : Doberman Breed Dog Forums


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

My dogs have always eaten regular wellness puppy as when I started feeding it, there was no LBP. They also are switched to regular wellness adult at 4 months, again because when I started feeding wellness, there was no LB. This has worked for me for 11 years. I entertained feeding LB, but it is less calories per cup, so I would have to feed more, and I did not see that as a benefit...


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

My general rule of thumb with food is if it isn't broken, don't fix it.


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## aerolor (May 27, 2011)

I think your vet is giving you good advice. I believe large breed puppy food is more suitable than the general puppy or adult food for a golden retriever pup. A golden retriever puppy needs to be fed a diet suitable for slow sustained growth over a fairly long period of time and this is what the large breed puppy food is designed to do. If it were my puppy I would choose a brand of large breed puppy with good quality ingredients (the best I could afford) and stick with until fully grown.


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## aerolor (May 27, 2011)

I just wanted to add that the large breed puppy kibble is usually larger in size than regular puppy sized kibble (at least it is in UK). This, I think, is better for a large puppy as the larger size kibble is not shovelled/gobbled down so quickly.


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## AnimalLuver (Oct 13, 2011)

If you fed TOTW (all life stages food is absolutely fine for a puppy! Especially a large breed puppy!) and it helped your puppy strive, I would definitely not switch. TOTW is a good food IMO.

The difference between "Puppy Food" and "Large Breed Puppy Food" is that regular puppy food has higher percentages of protein, fat, and calcium, all which is believed to assist a pup in their growing years. A "Large Breed Puppy Food" has lower percentages of protein, fat, and calcium than regular "puppy food" because a large breed dog grows fast enough without these added amounts. If you look at the guaranteed analysis and ingredients of large breed puppy foods, and compare them to regular adult or all life stages foods, they are not very different at all, this is because a large breed doesn't need a bag that says "large breed puppy food", they can do well on adult/all life stages right from puppy. But if you look at the price tag, the puppy stuff is almost always more expensive....sales gimmick? I kinda think so.

In the Great Dane forum I'm a part of, due to the growth rate of a Great Dane, NO ONE feeds puppy foods, they are not needed, and can actually cause problems with a Dane. And actually most people on that forum feed TOTW because it's what works best for their dogs. Strange, but "puppy food", even "large" or "giant breed puppy food" is frowned upon on that forum HUGELY lol. 

Gotta be careful with vet recommendations too...sometimes they're selling the food and making profit off of it, but I can't understand why your vet would tell you to switch off of TOTW to a LBP when your pup was striving on TOTW. LBP can't do something magical that TOTW hasn't already done for your fur baby 

Find what works...don't worry about "puppy food", pay attention to how your dogs body reacts, and if they like a food or not, the ingredients in the food, and the guaranteed analysis. As far as I understand "puppy food" is most beneficial for toy/small breed dogs, and LBP is a sales gimmick (not that it will hurt your pup at all...but it's not necessary because he's a large breed pup)

Good luck with whichever you decision is


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## aerolor (May 27, 2011)

I don't know how English dog foods compare with the American Brands, but just out of interest, the large breed puppy food I buy has 1% less protein than regular puppy, but 3% more fat. 
When compared with the adult food the protein in the LBP is 1% higher and the fat is 2% higher. 

The prices of the large breed puppy, adult and regular puppy foods are exactly the same for the brand of food I buy. 

*Glucosomine and Chondroitin* is added to the large breed puppy and is not in the adult or the regular puppy food. 

Composition and analysis for the large breed puppy is as follows:-

*Composition: *

Turkey Meat Meal (min. 20%), Rice (min. 20%), Whole Grain Barley (min. 8%), Potato Protein, Refined Poultry Oil, Whole Linseed (min. 4%), Sugar Beet Pulp (min. 4%), Low Allergen Poultry Digest as Gravy, Alfalfa, Monosodium Phosphate (min. 0.8%), Natural Seawood (min. 0.5%), Sodium Chloride, Potassium Chloride, Methionine, Molluscs and Crustaceans (as a source of Glucosamine HCI), Chondroitin, Marigold Extract, Yucca Extract, L-Carnitine, Rosemary Extract.

*Analytical Constituents: *

Moisture 8%, Protein 28.5%, Oils and Fats 18%, Fibre 3.5%, Ash 6.5%, Calcium 1.1%, Phosphorus 0.8%, Vitamin A 12000iu/kg, Vitamin D3 1200iu/kg, Vitamin E (a-tocopherol), 600iu/kg, Copper (Cupric Sulphate) 12mg/kg. Contains Tocopherol rich extracts of natural origin. Vitamin E and C as EC permitted antioxidant. No added colourants, flavourings or preservatives.

Marketing always comes into it and influences our decisions, but when price and quality is the same or similar, I prefer to feed the LBP to my golden puppy. 

At the end of the day we all buy what we have confidence in, what suits our dogs and helps ensure they thrive.


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## Enzos_Mom (Apr 8, 2010)

Your pup doesn't have to be on large breed puppy - switching to an adult formula or an ALS formula early will also cause your pup to grow slower than regular puppy food. If you pup is doing great on what they're on, I wouldn't worry about it. Feed what works for YOUR dog, not what works for anybody else's. Good luck!


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## leonidas7 (Sep 20, 2011)

thanks for all your replies guys.. I've been doing some reading and it looks like the main benefit is the calcium and phosphorus % are different in LBP, thus "controlling" their growth.

I'm going to monitor how Leo is doing on the wellness puppy. He is currently getting about 50/50 (day 3 of switch) and if he is doing well by the end of the week, then I will switch him to 100% wellness.

TOTW seems like a really good food, and even if I end up switching him to wellness puppy, I would definitely want to feed him TOTW once he is older.

Wellness seems to smell pretty good too though, it isn't greasy and doesn't smell..


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## AnimalLuver (Oct 13, 2011)

Enzos_Mom said:


> switching to an adult formula or an ALS formula early will also cause your pup to grow slower than regular puppy food.


Which is exactly what you want with a large breed dog...slow steady growth. Growing slowly is easier on the joints, and reduces the chances of hip displaysia and other bone issues later in life. Not all puppy foods encourage faster growing, but many do so be careful. Also some people think that when a puppy grows slowly that they may not reach their full potential size, but they definitely do. The rate at which they grow does not affect their final size, but does affect their bones a great deal. The slower the better


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Don't change. If you had an issue that serious with the original food and the dog is thriving on an ALS food now, don't change. Keep the pup lean by adjusting amounts and you'll do as much to prevent growth problems as an LBP food would do.

We do feed Eukanuba LBP to our dogs for the first year, since I read Eukanuba's white paper on their development of the LBP formula and felt that it was grounded in solid science. It costs the same as the regular puppy food and the regular adult food. After a year, we switch the guys to Eukanuba PP 30/20, which is not an ALS food and not appropriate for pups. It's very calorie dense, so it's only really appropriate for highly active dogs.


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## Enzos_Mom (Apr 8, 2010)

AnimalLuver said:


> Which is exactly what you want with a large breed dog...slow steady growth. Growing slowly is easier on the joints, and reduces the chances of hip displaysia and other bone issues later in life. Not all puppy foods encourage faster growing, but many do so be careful. Also some people think that when a puppy grows slowly that they may not reach their full potential size, but they definitely do. The rate at which they grow does not affect their final size, but does affect their bones a great deal. The slower the better


Oh, I know. I didn't mean that it was a bad thing. I meant that if that's what you're trying for, you might as well have the dog on an adult or ALS formula now rather than transitioning to LBP, then transitioning AGAIN to an adult or ALS food later.


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## jweisman54 (May 22, 2010)

Izzy also had lots of food issues until she was about 7 months old. I switched her over to TOTW Sierra Mountain (lamb) and she has thrived on it. The protein is 25% which is perfect for a growing pup. I wouldn't switch if Leo is doing well on it.


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## leonidas7 (Sep 20, 2011)

day 4 checking in... I've been doing a lot of thinking and going back and fourth whether or not I should keep switching over to the wellness lbp or stay with totw... I don't know if he is just loosing his puppy fur, still seems a bit early for that (12 weeks) but he is starting to shed again... 

Just about five or so days ago, he was barely shedding any fur, now I feel like I am brushing him about 3 times a day and that still isnt enough.. 

I'm going to try and talk to the vet and maybe try and find another person locally to ask..

I wonder if he just needs grain free kibble....


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## desi.n.nutro (Mar 18, 2011)

I really believe in a LB puppy formula vs. an ALS formula. It is so much more than protein. Proper balance of fat, protein, calcium and phosphorus and other components for controlled- growth is key. Everyone always states on here, if you find a food that works you should stick with it. I agree. You should be able to find a food that has it all though, i.e., good skin and coat, Growth-control, good antioxidant protection. Over many years I have had many LB dogs (6 Golden’s – 3 other) and I always gave them a LB formula and I have never had joint issues. In fact the Poodle I have weighs over 100 lbs. His Mom had hip issues including dysplasia. His hips are OFA Good. I have studied the matter to the tenth degree and I suggest the Vet is giving you good advice.


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## Allie.G (Aug 29, 2011)

*pet food ratings*

I have learned a lot from the site below
regarding the best dog food on the market.
It gives a good analysis of the major brands and
I was surprised to see how some of the best brands
that our vets sell are rated.
Hope this is helpful.
Dog Food Glossary 
Cheers, Allie.G


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## leonidas7 (Sep 20, 2011)

Can you recommend a specific LB puppy food?



desi.n.nutro said:


> I really believe in a LB puppy formula vs. an ALS formula. It is so much more than protein. Proper balance of fat, protein, calcium and phosphorus and other components for controlled- growth is key. Everyone always states on here, if you find a food that works you should stick with it. I agree. You should be able to find a food that has it all though, i.e., good skin and coat, Growth-control, good antioxidant protection. Over many years I have had many LB dogs (6 Golden’s – 3 other) and I always gave them a LB formula and I have never had joint issues. In fact the Poodle I have weighs over 100 lbs. His Mom had hip issues including dysplasia. His hips are OFA Good. I have studied the matter to the tenth degree and I suggest the Vet is giving you good advice.


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## desi.n.nutro (Mar 18, 2011)

leonidas7 said:


> Can you recommend a specific LB puppy food?


I used the Natural Choice Large Breed Puppy formula which is chicken. Natural Choice has a LBP lamb too but one of mine has a major lamb intollerance. You can find all the LB foods on the site, nutro.com. You can also sign up for coupons while you are there. Let me know what you land on and what you think about the Natural Choice.

This is the list of key benefits from the site.

*CONTROLLED-GROWTH FORMULA® Puppy Food *
Large and giant breeds are prone to rapid growth, which could lead to hip and joint problems. Our CONTROLLED-GROWTH FORMULA® puppy food provides a unique blend of key nutrients needed to help maintain healthy, balanced growth from weaning to maturity.
*Natural Sources of Glucosamine and Chondroitin for Healthy Joints*
Good nutrition is important to large and giant breeds for strong hips and healthy joints. Research shows that these two components found in chicken meal help maintain healthy joint cartilage. 
*Balanced Calcium-Phosphorus for Healthy Balanced Growth of the Skeletal System *
Research shows that large breed puppies have a reduced requirement for calcium and phosphorus so this formula provides ideal calcium-phosphorus requirement.
*Adjusted Protein and Fat Levels *
Provides optimum protein and fat levels to help balance growth while providing plenty of protein for muscles, skin and coat. Excess weight can cause bone and joint problems for large breed puppies.
*Real Chicken Protein *
High quality real chicken protein for muscle development and body growth.
*L-Carnitine to help utilize fat *
*Chelated Minerals for Added Health *
Chelated minerals are more easily absorbed into your large breed puppy’s system. By providing chelated zinc, and other important minerals, this formula will help your dog stay healthy throughout its life.
*Guaranteed to Improve Skin and Coat*
With high levels or linoleic acid, combined with other key vitamins and minerals, all the nutrition your puppy needs for healthy skin and coat.
*SMART START® Formula* featuring ALA and DHA helps puppies with learning, brain and vision development.
ALA (Alpha-Linolenic Acid)
Research shows that puppies naturally convert ALA (Alpha-Linolenic Acid) to DHA (Docosahexaenoic Acid) to help support better learning. Puppies want to look their best, so we supply fatty acids for a healthy, shiny coat. *DHA*
Formulated with high levels of DHA (Docosahexaenoic Acid) from fish oil, a proven nutrient for brain development. _**Satisfaction guaranteed or your money back.*_


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## Kobys Mom (Aug 18, 2011)

Does anyone have any thoughts on ACANA Large Breed Puppy formula? My 6 month old retriever (Koby) has had some stomach issues over the last few months (mostly loose stool) and people at the pet food store reccomended it. thanks!


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## desi.n.nutro (Mar 18, 2011)

Kobys Mom said:


> Does anyone have any thoughts on ACANA Large Breed Puppy formula? My 6 month old retriever (Koby) has had some stomach issues over the last few months (mostly loose stool) and people at the pet food store reccomended it. thanks!


I didn't know they had a LB Puppy formula but generally they are good. You can get other good foods including "Grain Free"(s) for a much better price though. I could help with specific ingredients?


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## AnimalLuver (Oct 13, 2011)

Kobys Mom said:


> Does anyone have any thoughts on ACANA Large Breed Puppy formula? My 6 month old retriever (Koby) has had some stomach issues over the last few months (mostly loose stool) and people at the pet food store reccomended it. thanks!


I find myself boasting about Champion all the time. I do not sell or endorse it, just to mention that. Anyway, in my personal experience, I've seen great benefits with Orijen and Acana, that outweigh the benefits with other brands of dog foods. But of coarse that is my opinion, and my dogs individual reactions to the foods. 

I've never tried the grain inclusive Acana flavors (Large Breed Puppy is grain inclusive), just the grain free line, being Ranchlands, Grasslands, Pacifica, and Wild Prairie, so I can't exactly help you there sorry.

If the price of Acana is within your budget, it is a great food for sure!!! See how it works for your dog. It (Acana Pacifica) cleared up my 5mth old pup's runny stools within 2 days. (about to get graphic) went from light brown pudding poops that I'd attempt to pick up with a shovel, and smear it all over the grass .... to hard, dark little poops, the kind you could kick and wouldn't get stuck to your shoe! (not that I did that in celebration or anything weird!: hahah!)

Good luck!


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