# Keeping Records and How to Use



## HiTideGoldens (Dec 29, 2009)

I know that a lot of people keep records of judges and the results under each judge for each of their dogs. If you do, what is your threshold (if any) for deciding not to enter under a certain judge? For example, a friend of mine recently told me that for her dogs, if she's entered under the judge twice, there are no extenuating circumstances (behavior, etc) and the judge hasn't put the dog in the ribbons then she won't enter that dog under that particular judge again. We haven't had a repeat judge with Jack yet (and he's still very young) but I imagine it will happen at some point so I'm curious if others have a similar philosophy?

I know that this question might be geared toward experienced conformation folks, but anyone can feel free to chime in.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

I think it makes a difference if you showed to the judge previously with a puppy/young dog. They are not mature yet so the judge may not put them up for that reason...

I also imagine you might be more likely to try a judge again at a smaller show with less entries and handlers.


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## HiTideGoldens (Dec 29, 2009)

Oh definitely, this wouldn't apply for the puppy classes as much. And my friend meant "in the ribbons" meaning even placing in the classes for an unfinished dog, like if her dog took 3rd in Open she would still show to that judge again.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

If a particular breeder comes to a show on one day only, and his/her dogs win almost everything under that judge, I will never show to that judge again.


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## HiTideGoldens (Dec 29, 2009)

hotel4dogs said:


> If a particular breeder comes to a show on one day only, and his/her dogs win almost everything under that judge, I will never show to that judge again.


That's a whole other issue I hadn't thought of since I haven't seen it happen yet. What if that same judge put your dog up for Reserve or second in the class? Would you still not show to them again?


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I still would not show to that judge again, no matter what placement he/she gave my dog. They have made it clear what dogs/kennels they prefer, and my dog ain't one of 'em!


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

My decision making is a little more complex than that. I look less at whether the judge put my dog up on the day, and more at the dogs they did use in comparison. I try to assess what qualities those dogs had in common to try to determine which characteristics matter most to that judge, and try to be honest with myself about how my dog ranked against the competition.(Structure elements, coat colour/qualities, movement, showiness, kennel-style etc.) While I don't like fault judging, some judges do it andfor example many tooth-fairies cannnot get past something like dropped incisors, no matter how nice the rest of the dog is. If my dog was not strong in those areas, or has a fault they will not tolerate, then I will not show _that_ dog to that judge again. But I might give them a try with a dog that DID have those qualities they appreciated, or did not have the fault they detest, if I happened to have one. If it becomes apparent that politics were the major factor (ie playing to the handlers and putting up a variety of dogs for whom the handler was the only common factor) then I am not going to enter my dogs under them owner-handled again, although I may use a handler if they were willing to put up the handler with a dog similar to mine.
I do keep a list for judges who are rude or nasty to exhibitors, as well as those whose selections reveal that they have no apparent understanding of the breed standard (ie putting up something REALLY incorrect when there are correct dogs present.) None of those get a second chance.


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## gabbys mom (Apr 23, 2008)

On the other hand, my record keeping is less complex. Oz went out for a couple of showings as a puppy, then as a teenager and now as an adult- all of that was me as a newbie show owner and wanting to get him acclimated to the show ring (shouldn't have worried!). 

I have an Excel spreadsheet tracking the show, the judge, how old he was, how he placed, the # of points, who showed him (we've have a wonderful junior showing him, a pro and his breeder), and my general impressions- what the judge was looking for, was Oz a snot, did the crowd generally agree with the placements or did I have sixteen random people come up to me and tell me Oz should have taken it, etc.


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## Loisiana (Jul 29, 2009)

gabbys mom said:


> I have an Excel spreadsheet tracking the show, the judge, how old he was


:doh:

Yep, it's definately Friday afternoon. I couldn't for the life of me figure out why you were keeping track of how old your judges were!

TGIF!


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

hahahahahaha I saw that too, I thought maybe to be sure that he lives long enough to judge another show (seriously, have you seen some of the conformation judges??)




Loisiana said:


> :doh:
> 
> Yep, it's definately Friday afternoon. I couldn't for the life of me figure out why you were keeping track of how old your judges were!
> 
> TGIF!


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## esSJay (Apr 13, 2009)

Loisiana said:


> :doh:
> 
> Yep, it's definately Friday afternoon. I couldn't for the life of me figure out why you were keeping track of how old your judges were!
> 
> TGIF!





hotel4dogs said:


> hahahahahaha I saw that too, I thought maybe to be sure that he lives long enough to judge another show (seriously, have you seen some of the conformation judges??)


 
bahahaha you girls are cracking me up! 

I've only been to 2 shows before, but seriously, how are some of these judges still alive? 

Sorry Michelle, I have no contribution to the thread, but I'm enjoying learning about this topic.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

hotel4dogs said:


> If a particular breeder comes to a show on one day only, and his/her dogs win almost everything under that judge, I will never show to that judge again.


HAHAHAHAHA! Yep. Ditto that, Roger.  (And, no names mentioned!)


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Oy, an XL file is a really nice idea but no way am I that organized.
Trust me -- show long enough it becomes painfully obvious which judges are good ones and who ain't. You remember the great ones and the terrible ones, and the ones in between, another day, another dog, another show, and you probably have an equal shot with them, so go for it.
I have to say my LEAST favorite kind of judge is a breeder judge who puts up stuff that looks nothing like what they breed. Or, they put up a huge variety of dogs. Seriously -- this is their breed -- if they can't figure it out in the ring ahead of them, how the heck do they run a breeding program????


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Well, really, none of this matters. Everyone knows that you only enter a show based on what restaurants are in the city that the show is held. I get to a show and go "OH! so, S/HE's the judge!"
Spreadsheets, and files, and record keeping... Geeze :bowl:


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

LOLOL, so your spreadsheet is what restaurants are there, their hours, their best menu items....
I always learn so much from you 




Pointgold said:


> Well, really, none of this matters. Everyone knows that you only enter a show based on what restaurants are in the city that the show is held. I get to a show and go "OH! so, S/HE's the judge!"
> Spreadsheets, and files, and record keeping... Geeze :bowl:


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

Ha ha! Must admit that there is one show I will go to just to watch even if I am not enetered as we have a hole-in-the-wall Chinese hotpot restaurant where we ALWAYS go for dinner on Saturday night. Mama takes such good care of us, and knows when the show weekend is. If we are late she yells at us as she was worried we weren't coming!!!


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## gabbys mom (Apr 23, 2008)

Pointgold said:


> Spreadsheets, and files, and record keeping... Geeze :bowl:


Hehe. Add anal retentive lawyer + over excited newbie and it's not a good combo. :doh:


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

I don't show conformation, but I do show in obedience, rally and agility (starting to show in hunt tests).

There are some judges who just don't like the way a particular dog works - if I get a low score twice for no obvious reason, I will not show that dog under that judge again. For instance, one judge hit me with 2 points each time my King sat - why? In this judges view, King sat too slow. In my view, the judge didn't deserve my entry LOL 

Another judge does not interpret several Rally signs the way I do - I cannot figure out her criteria so after trying 2 dogs under her at 2 different shows, she too does not get my entry dollars.

I would like to point out that the first judge mentioned likes the way my current dogs sit - they sit so hard and so fast that you can hear those butts hitting. So I will show these dogs under him (the dogs sit that way naturally btw)

Sometimes after a while, it comes down to knowing a judge just doesn't like your dogs style, or in the case of conformation, how your dogs compares to the judge idea of the standard etc. Do you want to spend your money supporting the entry, or save the entry fees for another judge who is better able to match your expectations about your dog/training etc?

I keep spreadsheets and keep thinking of writing a software app.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

hotel4dogs said:


> LOLOL, so your spreadsheet is what restaurants are there, their hours, their best menu items....
> I always learn so much from you


 
It's all about priorities, my dear.


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## HiTideGoldens (Dec 29, 2009)

gabbys mom said:


> Hehe. Add anal retentive lawyer + over excited newbie and it's not a good combo. :doh:


That's me! LOL (Seriously, lawyer and newbie here! ) Maybe I'll add a column for restaurants though....hmmm...


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