# Why aren't you rescuing?......



## Moonbridge (Aug 26, 2014)

Hi all,

Does anyone else get flack for buying a purbred dog vs. getting a rescue? I'm so tired of having to defend my choice to go with a small responsible breeder as opposed to going to a shelter or rescue.

My stock answer is that we've rescued 4 guinea pigs, one of whom incurred a $1200.00 vet bill which I happily paid because that's the kind of commitment I make to a pet, and we've rescued a pregnant cat, housed her and all her kittens and then kept the 2 kittens that were the least adoptable. 

I grew up with dogs, all but one were rescues/strays/shelter dogs. The one dog that wasn't, my heart dog was a Golden Retriever from a BYB. She got me through my teenage years in a way that NO person could have. Is it wrong that I want to have another dog for it's full life and give my daughter the opportunity to have the kind of bond I had? I know it may not be the same, I'm not naive, but why do people feel the need to say anything?

Sorry for the vent. Our puppy should be born in about 3 weeks and I've been waiting for this litter for almost a year. I've been waiting for a dog for 20 years.....

Thanks for the shoulder.....

Moonbridge


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## gold4me (Mar 12, 2006)

Your choice as to where you obtain your puppy is just that YOUR CHOICE.


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## thomas&betts (May 13, 2014)

*Enjoy your puppy...you deserve it! Maybe like myself, after a life filled with rescue, you will love your pup so much, you will start looking for a rescue buddy for him/her! :doh:Just kidding: *


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Tell them : "Because I don't want to"

It's funny, the town I live in is Rescue Group Central. On the off chance I take my dogs into the public like at PetSmart, I get more comments of "Oh he's way too pretty to be a rescue dog" which, while insulting to rescue dogs (and not true), it is hilarious in that they instantly understand and appreciate good breeding!


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## dezymond (May 3, 2012)

I have never been asked why I didn't rescue a dog versus purchasing one. 

For myself, as a first time dog owner, I wanted the whole experience from puppyhood and I wanted a Golden Retriever. Looking at rescues didn't even come to mind when first looking for a puppy because I knew how hard it would be to find one. 

In the future, should I be lucky enough to have a dog in my life, I may consider a rescue. I have great respect for people who got their dogs from rescues and am happy that those dogs get a second chance at life. 

To me though, rescue or not, your dog deserves the best life possible. And no one has a right to question your choice in who you got your dog from.


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## Kally76 (Jun 14, 2010)

My answer has always been this..."If everyone got their pet from a responsible breeder, there would be no need to have rescues."


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## ArchersMom (May 22, 2013)

I usually don't have to explain it. I want a golden because I want a loving, family dog as well as a hunting companion. You can't hunt with a chihuahua. But even if i didn't, it's my decision. As long you care for your dog it's entire life and purchase from a reputable breeder, that's breeding for a purpose, you aren't contributing to the shelters. That's my take on it anyway.


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

Yep. It's your choice and you shouldn't be made to feel bad.


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## Pdljmpr (Apr 4, 2015)

Not really since we have a rescue cat and Cody is a rescue too.


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

It makes me angry when I hear people say why don't you go to the shelter. First of all I am happy for the shelter and rescue dogs who get good homes. But is it my responsible to rescue or adopt because someone else was irresponsible or life events happened. Then they get mad at breeders. Well if there wasn't breeders there would be no dogs. All mix dogs come from somewhere.


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## thomas&betts (May 13, 2014)

Kally76 said:


> My answer has always been this..."If everyone got their pet from a responsible breeder, there would be no need to have rescues."


But that may not be true. We don't know how many rescue dogs come from responsible breeders. We know responsible breeders ALSO have cancer and other genetic health issues, and we know uncaring pet owners dump dogs into shelters because of health care cost's, so you can't know what percentage are from responsible breeders. I have never know a shelter to break out a dogs pedigree. :uhoh: So...you want a puppy not a rescue, your choice, your reasons. You want "well bred", like any pet, your choice, but also your *RESPONSIBILITY.*


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## Tennyson (Mar 26, 2011)

Moonbridge said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Does anyone else get flack for buying a purbred dog vs. getting a rescue? I'm so tired of having to defend my choice to go with a small responsible breeder as opposed to going to a shelter or rescue.
> 
> ...


Depending on my mood I would give the nitwit 2 quarters and tell them to "go call someone who gives crap." It's coin that's well spent.
It's nobody's business.


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## thomas&betts (May 13, 2014)

ArchersMom:*" You can't hunt with a chihuahua."*Best line yet!


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## tietjs (Jun 30, 2014)

I nrescused my first Golden and had her for eleven wonderful years . when she passed I looked for a rescue and found non in my area, I feel in love with the breed , I wanted to support the bred , and I wanted to experience having a puppy , but you bet , everytime I take her to the dog park people try to make you feel guilty for not nhaving a rescue ,sad !


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## Kally76 (Jun 14, 2010)

thomas&betts said:


> But that may not be true. We don't know how many rescue dogs come from responsible breeders. We know responsible breeders ALSO have cancer and other genetic health issues, and we know uncaring pet owners dump dogs into shelters because of health care cost's, so you can't know what percentage are from responsible breeders. I have never know a shelter to break out a dogs pedigree. :uhoh: So...you want a puppy not a rescue, your choice, your reasons. You want "well bred", like any pet, your choice, but also your *RESPONSIBILITY.*


 Responsible breeders take their dogs back under the conditions you can no longer care for them. That's why I said "responsible" breeder. Also, "responsible" breeders diligently screen their customers so their dogs will not go to people whom will dump them at a shelter.


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## Moonbridge (Aug 26, 2014)

Oh you guys are just the best!!! You made me laugh and helped me to see it with fresh eyes.

I don't feel guilty for my decision to support a responsible breeder but it was nice to have the boost of support from you!!

The chihuahua comment made me laugh out loud. I know someone who is breeding her pair of mini chihuahuas next year and I just shake my head. She' s doing it just for the money and novelty. The dogs are much smaller than regular chihuahuas and I've just bitten my tongue time and time again. To each their own right?

I'm so excited to welcome a puppy to our home. We have a great yard, lots of supportive neighbours, a breeder we trust and I have the time and resources. Fingers crossed that a litter of healthy pups is born 

I'll keep you all posted of course!!!


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

When they pay the bills, they can tell you what to do. Till then, it's none of their business.
We tried to rescue - we don't have a fenced-in yard so that was that. And the shelter only had pit bull puppies - I wanted a puppy to grow up with my grandchildren and I didn't want that breed, I wanted a golden. 
All of which is no one's business but ours, unless I choose to share it. 

I seriously don't like people most of the time.


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

You've done your job. Get the pup and screw whatever people say.

You will find out who your friends are.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Here's a response for you...
I am not rescuing because I am supporting RESPONSIBLE breeders who make sure their dogs never end up in a shelter. If everyone did that, there wouldn't be any shelter dogs that needed rescuing.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I usually just smile and let it go. It gets too complicated explaining that there aren't really golden retrievers ending up in local shelters who need rescuing. And people tend to get loopy when you bring up the type of structure and look you want in a golden retriever and the fact that not all golden retrievers look the same to you + the importance of early foundation for training. 

Generally speaking - I do think we need more people rescuing dogs... but it's not golden retrievers that need homes. Not around here. 

I usually jump into the whole topic about all the pit bulls and bully mixes who need homes and give them an address to check out for dogs that forget about forever homes, need FOSTER homes. 

I can't be a foster home for these dogs because I have other dogs and a cat who does not have any fear of dogs + we do not have a fenced yard. A lot of these dogs need 1 dog homes and they absolutely need a fenced yard.

But I do think that people who like to preach and prop up themselves for adopting a dog from a rescue... probably are interested enough in the welfare of dogs to open their homes to adopting those dogs and breeds who desperately need homes. 

Usually - you get evasive maneuvers from people at this point. Because it's easy to talk about adopting desirable breeds like golden retrievers... it's another thing to actually rescue dogs who are very hard luck cases.


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## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

I have never been asked and I would not care. I would just ignore the person and move on.
I have done both rescue and buy from a breeder. My passed on lab mix was from a kill shelter and my dachshund was a stray - but all my goldens have been from breeders.

Who cares? Life is too short to worry about what other people think or do. I love dogs regardless where they came from. They all deserve a good home.


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## rabernet (Feb 24, 2015)

I've learned to stay out of these topics on FB too - the folks that believe you should ONLY adopt from a shelter refuse to open their minds to any other point of view and consider all breeders as evil and that there is no such thing as a responsible breeder. And they will "shout" over everyone else whose views differ. 

For us, we also wanted to raise a puppy, and we wanted a pure bred golden, not a golden mix, and the rescues here have so many rules about fenced in yard, no cats, etc. 

I read an article recently that I wished I had saved from a rescuer that realized that they eliminate a lot of good homes with all their rules, and how maybe they need to re-think how stringent they are. 

I KNOW we're a good home, when we bring a pet into our family it's for life. Diamond was always included in our road trips and vacation plans, we boarded her one time when she was under a year old, and with her reaction when we picked her up (she saw us from the outdoor run when we pulled up, and freaked out when we walked away from her to head to the front door and we could hear her howling because she thought we were leaving again), we decided we'd never board her again. Noah will be the same, all travels will include him, or we have family that will care for him in their home if we're unable to take him, or we just won't go.


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

This topic has come up a few times - I guess I am very lucky because I've never been asked. 

I think I'd react the way Christa said above. I'd just let it go and move on. Actually, I'd probably first say, because I had just lost my heart and soul dog, and I wanted another one just like her. And the only way I could do that was to find a breeding that was going to produce versatile Goldens like Tesia was, with a breeder who would pick the right puppy for me based on what I was hoping for. I did - and that's why I have Shala!


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

Before we got Chloe we looked at the Indiana rescue. At that time the Goldens that were available said no kids, or only dog homes. My sister has dogs and will always have dogs. She would be watching when we go out of town. Plus Chloe goes with us all the time over to her house. Plus two little kids are in our home a few days a week. Or the ones available had medical issues. After losing Jake to cancer that was not something we wanted to deal with. Now there are a couple young goldens in foster homes with children and other dogs that had they been available at that time they might of been a option.


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## Pilgrim123 (Jul 26, 2014)

"I read an article recently that I wished I had saved from a rescuer that realized that they eliminate a lot of good homes with all their rules, and how maybe they need to re-think how stringent they are."
I fully agree, Rabernet. I was told recently that I would not be considered for adoption because I had said the dog could retrieve tennis balls as part of its exercise. And yet my last two rescue dogs have been senior girls who have had, I believe, the best lives possible. My DH and I provide an excellent retirement home for dogs with no other options - at least our vet seems to think so! But I'm not "good enough" for some rescue groups.
But that is off topic. Really, if you want a pup from a reputable breeder, that's your choice. I wonder how many of the people who have suggested you rescue have actually rescued a dog themselves?


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

Just want to add: the Golden Rescue in my area also says, must have fenced-in yard. I have never had a yard, nevermind one with a fence. I called and talked to the woman there about my last dog, her life, etc. and how I would care for a rescue, she said she would take my request to the board or whoever it was that decides. And she called me back and said, they didn't even hesitate. They said they would let you rescue even though you don't have a yard (never mind a fenced-in one!). 

So - just to say, sometimes a rescue will bend that rule. It's always worth a call.


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## rabernet (Feb 24, 2015)

Sweet Girl said:


> Just want to add: the Golden Rescue in my area also says, must have fenced-in yard. I have never had a yard, nevermind one with a fence. I called and talked to the woman there about my last dog, her life, etc. and how I would care for a rescue, she said she would take my request to the board or whoever it was that decides. And she called me back and said, they didn't even hesitate. They said they would let you rescue even though you don't have a yard (never mind a fenced-in one!).
> 
> So - just to say, sometimes a rescue will bend that rule. It's always worth a call.


But you have to wonder how many good homes they've missed out on, who don't call, just see the requirement and move on.


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## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

I think the OP was a simple question, and I think a lot of people gave good answers. I personally will never buy a dog, but I don't judge people who do. Everyone has a right to choose where they will get their next pet from, though I do hope that they don't support pet stores or puppy mills, but again, I can't make anyone believe the way I do.

Hopefully this thread isn't going to turn into another rescue bashing thread. There have been enough of those here in the past.


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

I really respect people that rescue. It takes a special person to take on a rescue. Especially ones that have medical issues and questionable backgrounds. It's such a great thing that you do.

But I also think it's pretty nasty when people condemn you because you purchase a puppy. All dogs need loving homes. Not every person is a match to rescue and not every person is a match for a young puppy. As long as there are people to do both dogs will find loving homes no matter what.


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## Claudia M (Aug 8, 2012)

We have always had "rescues". We had Jack a border colie golden mix my husband picked up off the side of the road as an 8 week old puppy. We have two cats at the office and one cat at home. Darcy was semi-rescued as she was adopted from the breeder after she was taken back from an idiotic previous family. 
But if asked - I simply ignore them. I love all our pets the same regardless where they come from and they are all spoiled the same.


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## Harleysmum (Aug 19, 2014)

We were also rejected by rescue due to lack of fences. We ended up getting Harley free to good home. One thing I have been asked though was "why did it have to be a golden retriever, why couldn't it have been any dog". You guys know the answer to that though!


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

i have a ton of respect for people who rescue - my best friend rescued a yellow Lab who had been abused and I saw first hand what they both went through to get him to where he is today - and he still has issues and she still has to be very careful with him around strange dogs and strange people but he's come so incredibly far since he came to her that you wouldn't know he was the same dog. 
I couldn't do it. It would be a disservice to both the dog and to me for me to even try. I love Zeke (the Lab) and he loves me, and I'm forever grateful to Beth for the work she's done with him.


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## KathyL (Jul 6, 2011)

You shouldn't have to explain to anyone your decision on why you are doing what you are doing. I wouldn't explain or justify, if I answered at all, I'd probably say "because I want to".


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## thomas&betts (May 13, 2014)

:This thread is starting to sound like a rescue pressure thread now : although I know its not meant to be. Golden rescue is great, but your heart knows what's best for you. I don't think anybody should ever stop looking for Goldens to rescue, but most shouldn't try to do something so important to the animal if they can't stay committed for the life of the dog. Shaming someone into a rescue or any particular commitment including a particular type of breeding could lead to doubt and regret. The heart knows what it needs and appreciates and all the suggestions in the world can't change that.
I was told by several breeders (not rescue, and of the superior product variety) that I wasn't suitable for their puppies because my property wasn't fenced. Haha, what shallow though drives some to believe a fenced yard makes for a happy Golden! Remember, Goldens love to be with their people, and NOT caged in a "yard".


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## Brave (Oct 26, 2012)

I rescued both of my dogs. And so far I couldn't be happier. Having worked in rescue, I think there are a heartbreaking number of dogs that need homes. Good dogs. Dogs that would make great pets. If someone comes to me and says they are looking for a pet, I definitely recommend the shelter and/or a non-profit rescue first. But I don't begrudge anyone who is a responsible breeder nor someone who buys from a responsible breeder. I know many people here who bought from a breeder and I see how fantastic they are and their dogs. ❤❤❤❤❤❤

I personally choose to rescue because of cost. A well bred golden is far outside my price range atm and yes I could save up for it but I cannot justify the cost to my husband when we have "necessities" that the money could be spent on. 

And yes I realize the purchase price is a fraction of the overall cost. I'd rather save on the purchase so I know I have the money for the on-going costs. 

Really though.... Bear is the best dog I could have ever asked for and I wouldn't trade him for any one else. He makes me a better person. A better trainer. He keeps me sane and emotionally balanced. He drags me out of bed when my depression gets bad. He drags me into social situations when my anxiety tells me to stay home. 

And there are so many worthwhile dogs in rescue. I really don't understand the stigma some people (no one here) perpetuate that rescue dogs are broken somehow. Cause it's not true. 

At the end of the day.... Love your dogs. And let everything else roll off your back.


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## The life of Piper (Feb 24, 2015)

I had a terrible experience w/ a rescue. The dog, a supposed golden/lab turned out to be a beast that attacked all of us!!! Thankful we gave her up every day!


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## Kris L (Mar 2, 2013)

The life of piper, that's what really turned me off from our shelters that I was looking through. They kept bringing me goldish colored pit bulls and saying they were golden or golden mixes. Nice looking dogs but not the breed for me. We had no close by golden rescues. I am happy with my dog though and have found a nice lab rescue in the area for my second who will adopt to people without yards. Sorry I cannot quite on my phone. I also am happy I got the experience of raising a puppy and learned a lot.


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## The life of Piper (Feb 24, 2015)

Kris L said:


> The life of piper, that's what really turned me off from our shelters that I was looking through. They kept bringing me goldish colored pit bulls and saying they were golden or golden mixes. Nice looking dogs but not the breed for me. We had no close by golden rescues. I am happy with my dog though and have found a nice lab rescue in the area for my second who will adopt to people without yards. Sorry I cannot quite on my phone. I also am happy I got the experience of raising a puppy and learned a lot.


Exactly!! Every yellow colored dog was a golden. But I applaud those who rescue, tho I could never do it again.


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## brianne (Feb 18, 2012)

I would never bash rescues. I LOVE my rescue dog. The rescue group who allowed us to adopt him was a wonderful group of hard-working, dedicated folks who took the time to get to know me to decide if we would provide the best home for Chumlee and bent a few of their rules. But rescue simply isn't for everyone.

For people who berate you about purchasing your dog versus rescuing I would ignore them. Or maybe give them a long, puzzled stare, then change the subject.. It's really tiresome to try to keep up with the "politically correct" trend of the moment.

Enjoy your new puppy and remember to post lots of pictures - it's a rule  !


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

rabernet said:


> But you have to wonder how many good homes they've missed out on, who don't call, just see the requirement and move on.


It's a really good point. 

I will almost certainly rescue a senior Golden one day. It was my original plan after Tesia died. I just couldn't bear the thought of losing another one so soon after her, though.


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## Rob's GRs (Feb 25, 2007)

I will purchase and I will adopt from rescues during my life. Both are my choice. That being said, I can not give enough kudos and thanks to rescue's for assisting so many Goldens in need of love and a home. I can not imagine what could happen to all these poor dogs if no one rescued or worked in rescues. Not every Rescue organization is perfect and nor is everyone that breeds Goldens. Do what is best for you but no matter what or how you get your Golden always do the best you can with them during their (short) lives.


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## Rainheart (Nov 28, 2010)

I have personally done both so far. With my guy from a reputable breeder- you want a dog with a solid background of clearances behind him for health and as much longevity as you can get. Also, I didn't know it at the time, but we would be doing performance sports. 

Fenway, my rescue pup- I feel I also really lucked out with him. I did get him at 10 weeks of age, which helps a lot with socialization. But his background for health- we had no idea. I feared hip dysplasia for months on months due to his bunny hopping he was doing when running and the odd way he walked. Finally, when he was neutered, all my fears were relieved as his hips and elbows somehow look amazing. But, that is always a gamble with a rescue! That could've been a very very costly procedure to have done with my guy. He does have a very sensitive stomach, which leads him into bouts of colitis and I still wonder about his kidney function (especially since I got a letter from the rescue that one of his half-siblings was diagnosed with congenital kidney disease)... but he seems to be doing well. Bloodwork last fall checked out alright. Still, things you have to worry about with a rescue that you really don't have to be as concerned about with a dog from a reputable breeder (these things still can happen, of course, I'm not saying they can't). I sincerely say thank you to all those who do rescue! It is a great thing to do, there will always be dogs in need of homes, keep doing it! Who knows, I may always have a rescue pup. Fenway kind of was an accident, so that could be part of my future, too.

Anyway, I love both my boys- they are wonderful dogs. I wouldn't trade them for the world. Up next after veterinary school is going to be a conformation show male


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

I just want to say, as well, that I have incredible respect for people who rescue. There have been a few cases around me where the people have done SO much work with their dogs. It takes such dedication. 

As to the yellow dogs all being "Goldens" - I was just laughing with someone at the park the other day. He had a black dog who was a rescue - I asked if he knew what he is. Lab Cross. 

There are a million and 1 Lab Crosses in my neighbourhood. If it's black, it's called a Lab Cross. Second only to the "Shepherd Cross" which seems to mean, we have no idea what he is!!


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

I have gotten that judgmental bit from people who see my show dogs or hear me talk about puppies (and I LOVE puppies!). I'm kind of snotty about it. I respond by telling them with a put on "holier than thou" tone that I currently have four rescues and spent years volunteering for a GR rescue, and ask how many rescues they have. Whatever number they say, I suggest they go rescue another if they are so concerned, and they usually give some excuse why they can't. Then I ask them not to judge other people for their choices, because they have no idea what those people's situations are. I hate when people try to guilt others for their choices (for pets or anything else). It really annoys me. Live your own miserable life and let the rest of us live ours.



Brave said:


> I personally choose to rescue because of cost. A well bred golden is far outside my price range atm and yes I could save up for it but I cannot justify the cost to my husband when we have "necessities" that the money could be spent on.
> 
> And yes I realize the purchase price is a fraction of the overall cost. I'd rather save on the purchase so I know I have the money for the on-going costs.


Well, you and I know a bit about the cost of rescues, don't we?  Bear's bilateral TPLO surgeries probably cost a pretty penny. And my Isabelle is a candidate for _four_ surgeries, which I'm spending $100/month trying to avoid. In the end, well-bred dogs can be _much_ less expensive than rescues.



> And there are so many worthwhile dogs in rescue. I really don't understand the stigma some people (no one here) perpetuate that rescue dogs are broken somehow. Cause it's not true.


When I did rescue volunteer, I worked with the "unadoptable" dogs, and I can say that there are indeed many "broken" dogs in rescue. But the worst never get adopted out. They were the ones that tugged on my heart the hardest. None of them wanted to be broken, they just were. Mostly they are beautiful souls, until suddenly they aren't, either for medical reasons or temperament reasons. And the temperament ones were a huge challenge for me, and I was attacked more than once, but I felt so sorry for them because they weren't bad, just broken. They would never have a home or family, just me and the few others who worked with them. Not a good life, but at least a life. Some rescue dogs just aren't fit to live in people's homes.  I don't know what the ratio is. I'm sure my view is skewed because I worked only with the "bad" dogs.


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## gldnboys (Mar 15, 2012)

Sweet Girl said:


> I just want to say, as well, that I have incredible respect for people who rescue. There have been a few cases around me where the people have done SO much work with their dogs. It takes such dedication.
> 
> As to the yellow dogs all being "Goldens" - I was just laughing with someone at the park the other day. He had a black dog who was a rescue - I asked if he knew what he is. Lab Cross.
> 
> There are a million and 1 Lab Crosses in my neighbourhood. If it's black, it's called a Lab Cross. Second only to the "Shepherd Cross" which seems to mean, we have no idea what he is!!


LOL! I've actually noticed that pretty much any larger dog that looks like it has any Lab OR Shepherd in it gets labeled a Lab/Shepherd cross. And yes, it does seem like there are a million and one of them out there.


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## Brave (Oct 26, 2012)

DanaRuns said:


> Well, you and I know a bit about the cost of rescues, don't we?  Bear's bilateral TPLO surgeries probably cost a pretty penny. And my Isabelle is a candidate for _four_ surgeries, which I'm spending $100/month trying to avoid. In the end, well-bred dogs can be _much_ less expensive than rescues.


Yes. Bear's surgeries were a pretty penny. And I think that is part of why I find dropping over a thousand dollars on a well-bred golden daunting. And the proverbial point is they *can* be less expensive. There is ALWAYS a risk of something costing a pretty penny (aside from the purchase price). Allergies, obstructions, illness, joint care, etc. 



> When I did rescue volunteer, I worked with the "unadoptable" dogs, and I can say that there are indeed many "broken" dogs in rescue. But the worst never get adopted out. They were the ones that tugged on my heart the hardest. None of them wanted to be broken, they just were. Mostly they are beautiful souls, until suddenly they aren't, either for medical reasons or temperament reasons. And the temperament ones were a huge challenge for me, and I was attacked more than once, but I felt so sorry for them because they weren't bad, just broken. They would never have a home or family, just me and the few others who worked with them. Not a good life, but at least a life. Some rescue dogs just aren't fit to live in people's homes.  I don't know what the ratio is. I'm sure my view is skewed because I worked only with the "bad" dogs.


I think your experience might have lead to a skewed sampling. I was making a general statement, and as such there are exceptions to the rule. However broken dogs aren't the rule, they are the exception, imho. I've worked with dogs that we didn't know if they'd ever get to a point that they would become adoptable. But they are few and far between, in my experience. Walking through the shelters, the cage cards in some shelters read why a dog was given up. Reasons like a new baby, a move, a new job, no time for the animal, etc. Quite a few of these animals are given up because of their families, not because of anything they did. 

Again, I don't begrudge anyone their well-bred goldens. I adore all of your dogs, Dana. 

And I can agree that often those stuck in anger over animals in shelters, don't move from the passive emotion to actively helping. 

Adopt if you want.
Foster if you can. 
Volunteer if you have time. 
Donate if you are inclined. 
Educate others about responsible pet ownership, etc. 

<3


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## chloesmomMI (May 4, 2013)

I've been asked this question several times. I usually explain that the available rescue goldens weren't a match for us and we came upon a breeder who was willing to sell us one of her girls. I don't think I need to say more than that.


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## LJack (Aug 10, 2012)

Well...I get all technical on them. 

Definition of Rescue
To free from danger. 

I say I did rescue the Golden Retiever breed for future generations by supporting responsible breeders. :

My personal motto has always been 
Adoption secures the future of a dog
Buying from a reputable breeder secures the future of a breed

Both are equally honorable it just depends on how you feel called.


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## Leslie B (Mar 17, 2011)

My husband and I are breeders so we get a variation on that question. When one of these folks with blinders on finds out we breed, they will say "Oh, we would never purchase a dog when there are so many great dogs that could be rescued". The implication is that you can walk into the shelter on any given day and have your pick of healthy balanced dogs that fit exactly what you are looking for. Usually I just smile and wish these people good luck and head the other way. They have already made up their minds on what is "good" and no amount of discussion will allow them to be open to the possibity that someone might have made a good choice other than the one that they picked. 

Every so often I cannot help myself and have to engage one of these self appointed idiots and play their game. I tell them about our good friends who wanted a lab sized dog but did not want to pay the going price for a well bred lab pup. They went to the local shelter where the shelter helper, who did not know what an 8 week old lab pup should weigh, showed them a litter of lab cross pups. Yes, they will be 75 pounds as an adult she told our friends. Perfect and they picked one out and brought him home. Dude, as they named him might have had a lab for a mom but even as a pup it was clear that dad was a bloodhound. Today he is 135 pounds, drools, can set his head DOWN on the dining room table, and bays instead of barking. Of course, he has all the giant dog health issues associated with them. The hip surgeries alone for Dude would have purchased 4 purebred lab puppies from parents with generations of good hips. Our friends love him and will do anything to keep him going but....... Is that what YOU want to take home from the shelter I ask these folks and before they answer I jump into my next story of rescue disaster. I have plenty of them to share.

The people offering the most criticism for people "buying" from breeders as opposed to "rescuing" are usually the people who ended up with the animals as their pets. These people do not see the side to rescue that is not all sunshine and roses. Not every animal is able to be placed in a home with a family. Some are so tortured mentally that it is in the animals best interest to be humanely put down. For some, the treatment of their ailments is too much for their frail and neglected bodies. It is kinder to ease them out gracefully. While it is still in the animals best interest, no one wants that job believe me.


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## TexasGoldRush (Dec 12, 2014)

I actually thought of rescue 1st but when one of them told me I couldn't be on the list because I had a dog door, I decided to keep looking. As it is I ended up getting lucky and getting Ava and I am SOOOO happy with her.


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

I think part of the "problem" with the rabid elements in the rescue crowd is that they never see well-bred dogs from responsible breeders. Those dogs tend not to make it into rescue. In my years of volunteering for GR rescues, I cannot recall ever seeing a dog from a responsible kennel in rescue, not even the really prolific breeders (like Rush Hill, for example). If they do wind up in rescue, they are few and far between, and would immediately be taken by the breeder. No, what these rabid rescuers are used to seeing -- day in, and day out -- are the dogs from back yard breeders and puppy mills. And so, that being all they ever see, they come to believe that all breeders are like that.
























They only see daily the fruits of breeding horrors. They cannot even conceive of breeders selecting puppy homes more carefully than the rescues do, or of keeping track of their puppies for life, or of taking back any dog that is unwanted or uncared for. They don't see it, so it's not something they believe occurs. If they saw what responsible breeders do, they would realize that breeders and rescuers are on the same side. Sadly, they do not see it, so they do not consider it.


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## BuddyinFrance (May 20, 2015)

I have never been asked the question why we did not take a rescue dog but in my mind my reasons are very clear. I was bringing a new dog into a home with 3 excitable children so i wanted a pup from 9 weeks that we could socialise and educate our way and who I could feel confident in knowing his background. When my children are much older we will happily consider a rescue dog.


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## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

"Rabid rescuers" is a bit inflammatory, in my opinion. I think there are other ways to get a point across without making comments like that. To me, that is no different from the people who lump all breeders into the byb/puppymill category. It just happens to be from the other point of view.


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## Moonbridge (Aug 26, 2014)

My apologies for this thread taking the turn that it did. I really didn't see my comment turning into an opportunity for people to be unkind to the other side. 

We all love animals, that is clear. We (on this forum) all strive to do the best possible for our beloved canine family members.

I was just frustrated and posted without thinking through how it would affect people on all sides. Again, apologies.

Anyone that knows me knows that the last thing I ever try to do is stir the pot. I am more uncomfortable with conflict than you could imagine.

Vent over.


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## brodybond (Aug 22, 2009)

If he had not been a rescue I would never have known or lived the love of my dear Brody. Now he is gone and because I rescued that amazing dog, I will always rescue a Golden. I have to get through the birth of my first grandchild in August then will rescue in the fall. Already making some contacts. 
It is YOUR choice, I just made the mistake years ago of "buying" two lab puppies before I understood puppy mills. 
I do believe that until there is a hiatis in breeding we will have innocent dogs euthanized. 
Sorry, I feel strongly that we all should do our part to stop the bad breeding. You may be buying from who you think is a reputable breeder, but there needs to be a hiatus, period.
That is just this dog lovers opinion. I will only ever rescue. My guy was a purebred Golden in a Humane League because his family couldn't care for him. He brought us more joy and love than I can express, yes, bet bills too, but that is what pet ownership is all about.
Christine


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

fostermom said:


> "Rabid rescuers" is a bit inflammatory, in my opinion. I think there are other ways to get a point across without making comments like that. To me, that is no different from the people who lump all breeders into the byb/puppymill category. It just happens to be from the other point of view.


Sorry if that seemed inflammatory. I don't paint all rescuers that way (I volunteered for a GR rescue for many years). There are reasonable rescuers, and then there are the ones who are really over the top, irrationally over passionate, who will not listen to reason or consider the possibility of responsible breeders being a good thing. Those are the folks I was referring to, and they are the ones most likely to get in someone's face about choosing a puppy rather than rescuing.

Again, my apologies if it came off as me labeling all rescue people with that label. I didn't mean that at all.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Best thing in the world... imo... would be a future where no more dogs are bred irresponsibly or commercially so as to end up in homes that turn their dogs into rescue. And best thing in the world... imo... would be better technology to reunite lost dogs with their homes ASAP so these dogs never end up being rehomed by shelters and snatched up by rescues after the meager wait time is up (I've heard as little as 3 days, some places). 

Best thing in the world would be a time when all dogs have to be purchased from good breeders who are turning away bad or irresponsible homes to ensure there will not be any backyard or irresponsibly bred dogs coming from puppies they bred and sold. 

Best thing in the world would be all dogs coming from breeders who are making every effort to ensure that no dog produced by them end up in shelters or rescues. There was a recent case where a few dogs needed to be rehomed and a handful of breeders immediately stepped up to ensure these dogs did not end up in rescue and were privately rehomed into good homes. 

Best thing in the world would be a time when golden rescues close up completely because there is no further need for them. 

Best thing in the world would be a time where you have no where to go for a cheap or easy to get golden retriever. Or any dog.

**** I'm typing all this out, because sometimes you say these things to people who get uber judgmental to others about buying from breeders.... and they never truly consider how they benefit by the looser way things are now as far as dogs coming from byb homes and puppy mills. There's an assumption that all breeders are causing the so-called "glut" of purebred golden retrievers in rescues and shelters, but generally speaking majority of responsible breeders would move heaven and earth to make sure their dogs do not end up in rescues or shelters or even bounced from home to home. A lot of these breeders have it written in the contract with the puppy buyers that if anything should happen, the dogs have to come back to them. This unfortunately does not work out when people ignore contracts with breeders and/or dogs go stray and there is not enough time for their real homes to find them before they are rehomed or taken into rescue. 

I follow a few lost/found groups on facebook and really truly - you have people begging for the opportunity to adopt a purebred looking golden retriever if the owner is never found. To me that just tells you about how easily these dogs are rehomed if push comes to shove. Our breed is absolutely not one of those where the dogs languish for months or years in shelters. Even the dogs who spend a period of time in rescue - they live with fosters and there are other reasons why they are not immediately adopted out. 

Obviously it's probably a different story in different areas of the country... but even there, it is telling when you see rescues from my area or out east "importing" dogs from those other areas because you might have more demand in some states than others. <= But that again just tells you that this is not a breed that overly suffers the same way that other breeds do. 

It is by no means such a desperate situation for the breed to merit people making dire statements about never buying a dog while there's dogs suffering in rescue. Fact of life is that in many areas there's a lot of people who will only adopt because of financial reasons or common sense reasons (they don't want a puppy)... and all that is absolutely fine and reason enough for them to only adopt vs buying. I just wish people would not trumpet up their "I AM HOLIER THAN THOU BECAUSE I SAVED A LIFE BY RESCUING" dramas about dogs who either had been surrendered directly into rescue or who had been already saved by the rescue. 

I love it when people are down to earth and honest about their motivations for adopting... like, for example... if somebody says they adopt because they can't afford to buy a puppy from a good breeder. To me, that's fair. And there's a lot of people out there like that who can't begin to reason a $2000 price tag for a puppy when for what they want in a dog, they are just fine with a puppy from a rescue. 

I have friends like this who adopted a goldendoodle. Family of 7 or 8 kids (1/2 of those kids in their teens fwiw)... wanted a dog. This family absolutely could not afford to spend even a couple hundred or so on a dog. And they just wanted a dog. So they basically went to the shelter and picked out the dog that spoke to them - which was this doodle. To this day, this dog is the perfect dog for this family. Very quiet, very obedient, very clean, and very calm. The dog had been a stray... so who knows what his backstory was and or why his former owners never found him at the shelter to claim him in time. But he's in a new home where he was everything the family had been looking for in a dog.

When you buy a puppy - generally you have to rely on what a breeder knows about the lines they breed and what their dogs have produced in the past... and it doesn't always work out the way you plan. Some families get shell-shocked by how active a puppy is when they wanted a calmer and quieter dog. 

Adopting an adult dog is a better way to go because you generally get what you are looking for. At least in temperament... but even looks. The dog is not going to suddenly turn into something else within a few months. You buy what the dog looks like right on the spot. 

The advantage of buying a purebred puppy is partly being the primary influence in that puppy's young life and building the foundation towards the adult dog you wish to have.... it's also partly stacking the odds in favor of having the adult dog you wish to have as far as overall appearance. It might seem shallow to people who have never actually looked at one of those "breed specific" pet books and given a lot of thought about why they like one companion breed over another. The whole deal about owning a purebred golden retriever is enjoying everything that these dogs should be based on all the very careful breeding behind them. 

For people outside the breed, it's about having a golden colored dog with a lot of coat, friendly face, and happy temperament. 

For people who spend a lot of time within the breed - there are noticeable differences from one line to the next. Right down to even novices like myself being able to spot the differences between goldens produced by one breeder vs like my own dog's breeder. <= Which basically gives meaning to looking at pedigrees when seeking a puppy. It's not just about health... 

Me personally - I would stay away from some pedigrees because I don't like the heads on the dogs or how much coat they have. Some pedigrees and lines that I've seen seem to throw those traits more than others... so it does make some sense to nit pick at that level. And again it all goes towards stacking the deck and selecting as closely as possible the adult dog you "hope" to have. And generally it is possible to get exactly what you're hoping for.... 

And bottom line for all this, btw.... for me it comes down to the fact that you only own so many dogs in your life. There are definitely people out there who seem to collect dogs for a living.... but the rest of us generally keep 1-2 dogs at a time and don't go looking again until 12-15 years later. Which reduces the amount of dogs they actually own in a lifetime compared to others. <= Which is reason enough to at least buy the puppy you want, even if you adopt at the same time and or make sure that at least 1 of those dogs you bring home every 12-15 years was adopted (if that matters to you).


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

Moonbridge said:


> My apologies for this thread taking the turn that it did. I really didn't see my comment turning into an opportunity for people to be unkind to the other side.
> 
> We all love animals, that is clear. We (on this forum) all strive to do the best possible for our beloved canine family members.
> 
> ...


No need to apologize  Us dog folks are passionate and sometimes threads get a little heated. I didn't give you my circumstance about getting "flack" before because I've actually gotten the opposite of what you asked. In my instance it was about not getting a pup and adopting another rescue.

All my kids have been rescues. I didn't purposely set out on that path, they just happened to be there for me at the right time 

I got a little "flack" not getting a pup last time around. Comments like you deserve a pup this time and molding them into what you want etc.

The disappointment I saw in some peoples eyes really hurt when I adopted an 8yr old. The rescue people of course cheered me for it.

I don't pick sides but many do. I see both sides equally of people that rescue vs people seeking a well bred Golden.

People that rescue or purchasing a well bred pup both have valid points. But the highly opinionated on either side that push their views will always continue to do so.


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## GoldenMum (Mar 15, 2010)

It is on my bucket list to own one well bred pup, but that is years away as I have three fairly young dogs now. I just keep running across a Golden who I know I can really help. I have one from a small rescue. One from a member here, who was taking a pup from a bad situation. And one from a local shelter, but I will always volunteer to help with rescue of all breeds. I too hope one day there is no need for rescues, but I don't see that day coming in my lifetime.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

GoldenCamper said:


> The disappointment I saw in some peoples eyes really hurt when I adopted



Was this family who reacted this way? I couldn't imagine being so nosy or obnoxious as to feel disappointment over where somebody else got their dog... outside of having a more personal interest.


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## Swampcollie (Sep 6, 2007)

Moonbridge said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Does anyone else get flack for buying a purbred dog vs. getting a rescue? I'm so tired of having to defend my choice to go with a small responsible breeder as opposed to going to a shelter or rescue.


Tell them it's none of their business. (If you feel it's warranted, include some additional frills and dressings.)


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## Ripley16 (Jan 26, 2012)

I got asked "Why didn't you go to the shelter" so many times when I first brought Ripley home. Honestly, If the shelter had exactly what I wanted in a dog, I would have gotten a rescue. I knew I wanted a Golden, and seeing as they one of the most popular breeds in the world, if they ever end up in the local shelters, they do not tend to be there very long. In order to get exactly what I wanted, I went to a breeder who could provide me with exactly what I wanted in a companion. If I had known of a Golden in need of a home at the time I was preparing to bring a K9 companion into the family, I likley would have rescued. 

You have to think about what you want, what is best for you, and what is best for your future dog.


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

Megora said:


> Was this family who reacted this way? I couldn't imagine being so nosy or obnoxious as to feel disappointment over where somebody else got their dog... outside of having a more personal interest.


Oh heavens no Kate. The disappointed eyes came from people that thought a new puppy would somehow make me poop rainbows


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## Buddy's mom forever (Jun 23, 2011)

OP, you do what you want to do and you do not have to say anyone why.

I do not have a rescue dog but I have to say it hurts my heart that some people think of the rescue dogs, those beautiful souls, as second class dogs.


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## DevonTT (Aug 5, 2006)

Tell them if nobody bought dogs from responsible breeders, the only breeders left would be producing Goldens without a thought toward genetic health. We love the breed and want there to be healthy lines far into the future. Supporting responsible, knowledgeable breeders who breed for health, behavior and physical characteristics is the only way to ensure that the Golden Retriever breed isn't ruined.

All of my pets have been rescues, but I foresee a day when I will buy a puppy from a responsible breeder. With more research showing detrimental effects of early spay/neuter, I want to be sure my Golden is given every chance for a healthy life by neutering him well after puppyhood. Most rescues do not give you that choice.


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## SableHart (Dec 4, 2014)

Yes, several friends gave me a little bit of a hard time for working with a breeder instead of rescuing and it was a little frustrating that they didn't support our decision :/ A couple of friends also questioned if we were making an educated decision. 

I had a golden previously that helped me through my 20's, college and meeting my husband. After we had to put her down I knew I wanted another golden so I reached out to our vet for breeders that they work with. They are such awesome family friendly dogs!


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## Kcfrankl (Feb 13, 2015)

When we took our puppy in for his first visit to our vet we experienced something similar. The staff talked to one another like we were not even in the room, saying something to the effect, "can you believe they paid for this puppy"? And had we thought of getting a rescue? Mind you he is a beautiful white golden and only 12 weeks old at the time. Our thought was someone had to give this little guy and home. Our next golden will definitely be a rescue. Toby needs a friend!


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## migs (Nov 8, 2013)

Because purebred dogs need good homes too.


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## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

migs said:


> Because purebred dogs need good homes too.


My three rescues are purebred...


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## kwhit (Apr 7, 2008)

Buddy's mom forever said:


> ...it hurts my heart that some people think of the rescue dogs, those beautiful souls, as second class dogs.


Hurts mine, too...


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## GoldenSkies (Feb 27, 2014)

Yeah this is an annoying thing to go through. I get judged all the time by people, even if they don't say it out loud.
Dogs are dogs, they all deserve a home where they are loved. They certainly cannot tell the difference so I don't think everyone else should stress so much about it. 
I proudly took home a pure bred puppy because I made a responsible decision to adopt from a breeder who was ethical and bred to better the breed. I wanted to have the option of being able to show and compete with my dog and I wanted to know all about his pedigree. If people are going to judge me over that so be it. But I definitely made the right decision for me and I would not want to be the type of person who rescues a dog just because I want people to see me in a better light, I personally wasn't ready to rescue at the time. 
If I had the money, resources and time I would rescue all the dogs in the world. But it wouldn't be fair if I took home a dog wishing it was something other than it is.
I fell in love with my dog from the moment he was born into this world that's the reason I took him home. At the end of the day I did what I thought was best for me because afterall I am living my own life.
I get irritated when people judge others over what they decided to do. We all decided to take on the responsibility of another being and provide the best life possible for them, that's such a compassionate and powerful thing. As dog owners I think everyone should come together more and judge less.


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## MercyMom (Dec 19, 2011)

I admit. Count me guilty of preferring well bred Goldens over rescues. I do applaud those who rescue Goldens. I would never rule out the possibility entirely. My heart breaks for lost/stray Goldens. I want to see them find the best homes possible. I have considered fostering one, but my husband won't let me. I hope to buy another Golden puppy from a reputable breeder someday.


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## BajaOklahoma (Sep 27, 2009)

I just got my Old English Sheepdog puppy three weeks ago. I love the breed - in fact, I married my husband to get his Sheepie. I have gotten so much grief from "friends" and strangers. To be fair, I did apply to our state OES rescue. The puppies were already promised and they didn't have any young adults. We lost our almost 14 year old Sheepie in March and I wasn't prepared to deal with a senior right now. 

I do share posts on Facebook from our local shelters. I do have plans to foster in the future. 

One thing people forget about rescues. They are usually identified as a "Lab cross" or an "Aussie Mix" and so on. People want to have an idea about they getting into with a rescue dog. And the explanations/expectations are based on what they know about a particular breed.


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## foxgardener92 (Feb 21, 2014)

This is an issue I have had frequently. Some people get downright angry with me because I have a purebred golden and intend to get into breeding soon as a lifestyle to improve the breed in a responsible way. I see no reason why it should be anyone else's business and, to echo other's thoughts, we have beautiful golden retrievers today because of responsible breeders who have devoted time, effort, finances, and much love to the breed. I have great admiration for them. And out of that, I intend to join them in the effort to preserve the best in the golden breed retriever breed, loving all my dogs along the way!


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## SheetsSM (Jan 17, 2008)

foxgardener92 said:


> This is an issue I have had frequently. Some people get downright angry with me because I have a purebred golden and intend to get into breeding soon as a lifestyle to improve the breed in a responsible way. I see no reason why it should be anyone else's business and, to echo other's thoughts, we have beautiful golden retrievers today because of responsible breeders who have devoted time, effort, finances, and much love to the breed. I have great admiration for them. And out of that, I intend to join them in the effort to preserve the best in the golden breed retriever breed, loving all my dogs along the way!


And we do need more responsible breeders--I do hope for you that definition includes titling your girl in one or more events, obtaining at minimum the 4 core clearances recommended by the GRCA and finding yourself a mentor that will help you pore over the pedigrees & understand the depth of clearances & what kind of male will best compliment your girl. If you haven't begun any of that, I can see why people might get angry when you say you're going to get into breeding as a "lifestyle".


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## foxgardener92 (Feb 21, 2014)

SheetsSM said:


> And we do need more responsible breeders--I do hope for you that definition includes titling your girl in one or more events, obtaining at minimum the 4 core clearances recommended by the GRCA and finding yourself a mentor that will help you pore over the pedigrees & understand the depth of clearances & what kind of male will best compliment your girl. If you haven't begun any of that, I can see why people might get angry when you say you're going to get into breeding as a "lifestyle".


 Actually, I have been doing quite a bit of the necessary preparation to ensure that all pans out correctly. There really is no need to be presumptuous. I didn't decide to get into breeding yesterday, and I certainly do not take it lightly. I would appreciate a bit more courtesy in that regard. 
It is possible to be conscientious in doing things the right way AND have a good attitude in the process.


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## ArchersMom (May 22, 2013)

I don't think there was anything discourteous meant by SheetsSM. Most people who have aspirations to breed aren't even aware of all that goes into it. They come here and they learn that being a reputable breeder isn't as easy as it sounds. You haven't been on the forum long, so it's hard to know which phase you're at.


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## Lilliam (Apr 28, 2010)

When I started thinking about the fact that Billy was nearing 13 and Max had never lived alone, I started to think I needed to decide on what dog or get next. I loved labs and thought about a rescue lab. On the other hand I loved the experience with my breeder and Max is a dream dog. I ultimately decided to go back to Sue for another of her puppies. 

It wasn't easy, I felt like I *should* do rescue. Then I remembered all the dogs all my life who had been literally picked out of dog pounds. But oh boy did I get people give me grief over picking up Emma!!!!! 

Now that I have my two Delmarva goldens, I can't imagine not having either one.


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## foxgardener92 (Feb 21, 2014)

ArchersMom said:


> I don't think there was anything discourteous meant by SheetsSM. Most people who have aspirations to breed aren't even aware of all that goes into it. They come here and they learn that being a reputable breeder isn't as easy as it sounds. You haven't been on the forum long, so it's hard to know which phase you're at.


Be that as it may, benefit of the doubt would be nice. As for the difficulty involved in becoming a responsible breeder, I am well aware. I learned long ago not to get into anything in life without first doing my homework, so to speak. Rash decisions and uninformed decisions alike rarely work out in one's favor. With that being said, I am not dissuaded of my intention to get into golden breeding. If anything, whatever adversity presents itself only serves to strengthen my resolve to do it well. 
I am new to the forum, yes. And I must say SheetsSM's remarks were not in the welcoming and respectful tone that I've seen as the norm in other forums. It is important for longtime forum users to create an atmosphere that welcomes newcomers and encourages them to participate in constructive discussion. Condescending and presumptuous remarks right off the bat are not a good sign. I hope that will be considered in the future.


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## SheetsSM (Jan 17, 2008)

foxgardener92 said:


> Be that as it may, benefit of the doubt would be nice. As for the difficulty involved in becoming a responsible breeder, I am well aware. I learned long ago not to get into anything in life without first doing my homework, so to speak. Rash decisions and uninformed decisions alike rarely work out in one's favor. With that being said, I am not dissuaded of my intention to get into golden breeding. If anything, whatever adversity presents itself only serves to strengthen my resolve to do it well.
> I am new to the forum, yes. And I must say SheetsSM's remarks were not in the welcoming and respectful tone that I've seen as the norm in other forums. It is important for longtime forum users to create an atmosphere that welcomes newcomers and encourages them to participate in constructive discussion. Condescending and presumptuous remarks right off the bat are not a good sign. I hope that will be considered in the future.


I stand by my words, I do in fact hope that should you follow through with breeding and as you referred to it as a "lifestyle", that your definition of responsible breeding includes what I noted. Having done rescue work in Georgia, there are far too many touting to be responsible breeders but are doing nothing more than breeding a much beloved family pet. 

I assumed nothing, only stated what my "hope" for you as a breeder is & to offer insight why some folks you encounter may be put off on your aspirations to be a breeder. It would be far different with your girl who is now just over 2 to have said, I'm in lock step with my long time breeder who is well regarded in the golden community who is mentoring me through the process. Complete clearances are in place & my girl has already been titled in x,y,z... I would also hope that new members when asking for older members not to make "condescending and presumptuous remarks" do the same...


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## nolefan (Nov 6, 2009)

foxgardener92 said:


> ... I didn't decide to get into breeding yesterday, and I certainly do not take it lightly....


There are several people on this forum who have devoted time here for years, educating people about responsible breeders and on the flip side, seeing some serious train wrecks of health and behavior for dogs who, through no fault of their own, are suffering because they were produced by someone who didn't do the minimum of what has been proven to improve the odds of a dog being healthy and happy.

Unfortunately the experience almost without fail is that new or potential breeders without an experienced mentor simply are not interested in hearing that there is more to responsible breeding than just getting 4 health clearances and then playing with adorable, fluffy puppies. It consistently has been our experience that people come here wanting positive reinforcement for their plans without hearing a word about how they could learn from others' mistakes or do anything better. After awhile, it feels like beating your head against a brick wall with people who are so sure they have it all figured and want to cut corners and have the fun without putting in much of the work.

Rather than correcting someone else's manners, you might consider how well it would go for you to respond that you are looking forward to all you can learn here and sharing how excited you are, how you've already lined up a mentor and what venue you've been training your dog in for the past couple years. It's always been my experience that this is a very welcoming group for people who are doing so much for their dogs.


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## foxgardener92 (Feb 21, 2014)

nolefan said:


> There are several people on this forum who have devoted time here for years, educating people about responsible breeders and on the flip side, seeing some serious train wrecks of health and behavior for dogs who, through no fault of their own, are suffering because they were produced by someone who didn't do the minimum of what has been proven to improve the odds of a dog being healthy and happy.
> 
> Unfortunately the experience almost without fail is that new or potential breeders without an experienced mentor simply are not interested in hearing that there is more to responsible breeding than just getting 4 health clearances and then playing with adorable, fluffy puppies. It consistently has been our experience that people come here wanting positive reinforcement for their plans without hearing a word about how they could learn from others' mistakes or do anything better. After awhile, it feels like beating your head against a brick wall with people who are so sure they have it all figured and want to cut corners and have the fun without putting in much of the work.
> 
> Rather than correcting someone else's manners, you might consider how well it would go for you to respond that you are looking forward to all you can learn here and sharing how excited you are, how you've already lined up a mentor and what venue you've been training your dog in for the past couple years. It's always been my experience that this is a very welcoming group for people who are doing so much for their dogs.


 I appreciate your candor. I can see how things may look from your end. You did what was demanded of me at the start: provided some background and reasoning to aid understanding. Thank you for that. I completely understand how it would be frustrating over the years to see people wanting the fun without the work and willing to cut corners to get there. I also understand that when you see so many doing something a certain way that is wrong and (justifiably) frustrating, it is easy to assume that is always the case in such situations and respond accordingly in the future. 
However, it is not always that way. And that should be an encouraging thing! If we could have a discussion in person, or if we had known each other for years as friends, you would know what others know of me. Namely, I do not get into things naively for the fun of it. That is simply not who I am. I understand that there is a lot that goes into breeding and raising goldens ethically and in a forward-minded way.
I also do not believe that I need to immediately present my 'resume' to everyone or a detailed description of my plans in this venue. I do not feel that I need to prove myself to strangers on the internet at very preliminary interaction. 
My original post was intended to be a contribution to the discussion on the OP topic. I certainly did not intend to start a disagreement. 
It is truly my business who my mentor is and where my dogs are involved. If I choose to share that information and ask for opinions, that would be the time to tactfully offer them. 
Given the hostile and judgmental environment I have experienced on this forum so far, it should be no surprise that I am quite hesitant to submit myself to further unsolicited scrutiny. 
And as for SheetSM's comment about the breeders in GA who aren't doing things the right way, I have the following to say. Do not make vague, unsubstantiated accusations about other people. You don't even live in this state, so I doubt you have as much of an inside scoop as you think. 

All that being said, if you would like to call a truce and start over with mutual respect and a positive tone, I would be happy to participate in that. If not, I will likely be leaving this forum and looking elsewhere for constructive conversational community.


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## SheetsSM (Jan 17, 2008)

foxgardener92 said:


> And as for SheetSM's comment about the breeders in GA who aren't doing things the right way, I have the following to say. Do not make vague, unsubstantiated accusations about other people. You don't even live in this state, so I doubt you have as much of an inside scoop as you think.


Now who's being presumptuous & making accusations? I did live in Georgia, if you would look at the pic attached to all of my posts you would see Duke who is my Georgia boy I fostered & adopted through Golden Retriever Rescue Atlanta. I was quite active in the rescue community during my time there. I was their most southern volunteer in the state & logged a bunch of miles cleaning up the mess for breeders who had no business to be breeding. Let's not presume I don't know what I'm talking about. For someone who is new here & so defensive when all I did was make my hope's about someone looking to breed as a "lifestyle" & not understanding why people might take offense to that, I do wonder what your path will be. Looking at my nearly 4-month old pup, who I purchased from an actual responsible breeder, I can only hope every pup that comes into this world gets to have the best start in life that she was afforded.


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## Trin57 (Jul 11, 2015)

I'm tired of the guilt as well. Even my kids are laying into me, but I want a Golden pup like I had before.


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

foxgardener92 said:


> I appreciate your candor. I can see how things may look from your end. You did what was demanded of me at the start: provided some background and reasoning to aid understanding. Thank you for that. I completely understand how it would be frustrating over the years to see people wanting the fun without the work and willing to cut corners to get there. I also understand that when you see so many doing something a certain way that is wrong and (justifiably) frustrating, it is easy to assume that is always the case in such situations and respond accordingly in the future.
> However, it is not always that way. And that should be an encouraging thing! If we could have a discussion in person, or if we had known each other for years as friends, you would know what others know of me. Namely, I do not get into things naively for the fun of it. That is simply not who I am. I understand that there is a lot that goes into breeding and raising goldens ethically and in a forward-minded way.
> I also do not believe that I need to immediately present my 'resume' to everyone or a detailed description of my plans in this venue. I do not feel that I need to prove myself to strangers on the internet at very preliminary interaction.
> My original post was intended to be a contribution to the discussion on the OP topic. I certainly did not intend to start a disagreement.
> ...


This is an absolutely, eminently reasonable post. I, too, noticed the *assumption* that she must not know anything or be doing the right things, and I think it was unfair, though understandable. And now another person has been chased off. Unfortunate.

My feeling is that we need more breeders who want to breed good dogs. And I don't think everyone has to start at the top of the food chain in order to get into breeding. Many great, great breeders started by breeding two of their pet dogs together.

There tends to be a lot of assumptions and jumping to conclusions here, and some super unfair pile-ons. Not to say that that happened here. It didn't get to that point. But it had the potential. Foxgardener92 bailed before it did, so thankfully it didn't go there.

I think we should cut people who say they want to get into breeding a LOT of slack. They need encouragement rather than a test or laundry list of things they are commanded to do. It's the difference between inspiring people and souring them, and it's all in the approach.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> My feeling is that we need more breeders who want to breed good dogs. And I don't think everyone has to start at the top of the food chain in order to get into breeding. Many great, great breeders started by breeding two of their pet dogs together.


 Dana - I think a lot of us really want more people out there doing the right thing as far as getting into the breed, learning from the older generation, and continuing the work that those people have done as far as improving health, conformation, and structure. I went to a dog show today and got to sit back and look around... and there was a mixture of really old grand dame breeders showing up.... and I had a nice chat with a young guy from Indiana who came up to show one of his puppies. For that matter, the last time I did a show at this location, one of the local breeders was helping a puppy person learn all the stuff about showing (grooming, set up, showing what collars to buy, what leads to buy, and really walking that puppy person through what goes on at a show). This same breeder made sure she came over to visit with me that time too when I was grooming - because she'd never seen me before and she told me to ask anything or let her know if I needed help. So really truly, there are people out there who really are trying to encourage the next generation of people who will continue to show, train, and maybe down the road keep doing what they themselves do right now. 

All that is good.

The problem is that so many people get into breeding and they build walls around themselves because of what they think of others, what they are willing to spend, and how much extra-curricular stuff they will do to maintain connections and "find themselves" and so on. There's a lot of people who don't want to go to dog shows, they don't want to pay for obedience training classes, and they might quibble about spending money on unnecessary vet bills (ie clearances). 

There will always be people breeding the dogs they have without any connection to anyone who knows anything in the breed teaching them. It is what it is... and for a lot of people who have never actually had a really nicely bred dog, they don't really know the difference anyway. 

Bottom line though - just having a lot more people making puppies left and right out there... isn't going to improve the breed. Not if these people are out there on their own with no guidance or education or interest.


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