# Best Dried Food?



## Maggie'sVoice (Apr 4, 2018)

I like feeding a food with better looking ingredients too. But I will say this... As long as the food delivery the right levels of all the vitamins and mineral, that is a healthy food. Ingredients are vehicles that deliver nutrients. So as long as the dog doesn't have an issue with a certain ingredient, the food is good. There is good research behind the Royal Canin. So it's safe and ok to feed.


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## CAROLINA MOM (May 12, 2009)

> My pup does get itchy and can get hot spots in summer from skin irritations and his coat not drying properly, his coat is EXTREMELY thick and dense. He loves the water but I have to be super careful he doesn't get hotspots. Royal Canin claims their food helps with skin


There are a lot of members including myself that feed Purina Pro Plan formulas. I happen to feed the Purina Pro Plan Sensitive Skin and Stomach formula because my boy has a sensitive stomach. It contains a lot of Omega 3s, I feed the salmon formula. He has a nice thick coat, neither his skin or coat is dry and he's never had a hot spot. 

I have a small beach at the end of my street where I take my boy swimming several times a week during the summer. He swims in the Inter Coastal Waterway-it's salt water, he rolls in the sand on the beach. I usually hose him off when we get home and let him air dry...... still no hot spots. 


I adopted my boy at the age of 2 from my County shelter, he was 15-20 pounds underweight-he was a stray, and was having stomach issues, very thin coat. I tried numerous brands/formulas. Several forum members that were breeders recommended it. My boy is 10 now, he's doing great on it, has a great coat.


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## ZeusMyPup (Apr 12, 2019)

Thanks for your response, I'll check it out! Your boy sounds like mine. They sure do like to roll too don't they? : 0


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## katiekate81 (Apr 12, 2019)

I agree with the above, seems many member here feed Purina Pro Plan, whether they be the Large Breed Food, Large breed Puppy food or the sensitive skin and stomach formulas.

Two of my three are on PP (one on the large breed puppy, another on the sensitive formula) and they love It, and are doing fantastic on it.


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## carlswans (Jan 6, 2013)

What Should We Be Feeding Our Pet? 

I am one of many pet owners who are deeply saddened at the loss of their pet to nutritional deficiencies of taurine or diet induced Dilated Cardiomyopathy (DCM). We find we are blaming ourselves for feeding a ‘BEG’ diet to our loved pet, as we were thinking we were feeding the ‘best.’ My Golden was not even five years old when she was diagnosed with DCM and passed just a day later. She was being fed a high priced, and well marketed BEG diet. After a time, I now have another Golden, and am doing what I can to educate myself and to feed her the best kibble, based on up to date qualified knowledge on this serious issue affecting many breeds. 

“BEG” diet are ‘suspect’ diets. BEG stands for Boutique Exotic ingredient, and Grain-free. 

 Boutique - A boutique diet is one made by a pet food manufacturer who does not employ an appropriately qualified team of experts to study and formulate their diets. These companies often rely on marketing trends rather than testing and nutritional research. 
 Exotic Ingredients- These are ingredients not classically found in pet foods and consist of animal proteins such as kangaroo, buffalo/bison, ostrich, alligator, duck, lamb, salmon, venison, and rabbit. 
 Grain-free: These are diets that are free of ingredients such as barley, buckwheat, corn, oats, quinoa, and rice. More recently, these traditional grains have been replaced with pulse ingredients (legume seeds such as peas, lentils, various beans and chickpeas) and it is these pulse ingredients that are currently thought to be a major contributor to the development of NM-DCM. 
The best thing one can do is to buy your dog food from a company that meets criteria/guidelines from both: 

(1) AAFCO (Association of American Feed Control Officials)
and
(2) WSAVA (WSAVA's is a global veterinary community, with a primary purpose to advance the quality and availability of small animal medicine and surgery, creating a unified standard of care for the benefit of animals and humankind.”) criteria.

https://www.wsava.org/WSAVA/media/Arpita-and-Emma-editorial/Selecting-the-Best-Food-for-your-Pet.pdf

It is recommended that your food company employ at least one full-time nutritionist(which must be a PhD or boarded DVM nutritionist), that all the company’s diets are formulated by nutritionists at these levels of expertise, and that the company not release a formula without testing and trialing that formula using the feed trial protocols established by the AAFCO. In other words, no diet is sold until it proves that it nourishes real dogs, under real conditions, rather than just having the right nutritional math but never having been tested. The company should do a huge amount of quality testing, and every batch coming into the plant should be tested. The company should manufacture the diet themselves, so it can control the ingredients and quality; it should not just send a recipe and a bag label design to a plant that makes food for many companies. And the company should subject its diets to peer-reviewed scientific research and be able to back up any of its claims with data that is available to the public. This is the unanimous assessment of cardiologist and nutritionists who uncovered the taurine-DCM relationship.

There are four US dog food brands that we know satisfy these criteria:
Purina (most formulas)
Hills (Science Diet)
Royal Canin
Eukanuba 

A lot of Dog Food brands have done an excellent job marketing their kibble and their delicious human-appealing ingredient words, and a pretty poor job making sure that they’re nourishing our dogs. It is difficult to find even a single lots-o-stars brand that employs a full-time nutritionist, let alone meets the other criteria. So, you’ll find that when it comes to talking about lower-risk foods, the same companies are going to get mentioned a lot. 
Purina (most formulas), Hills (Science Diet), Royal Canin, and Eukanuba


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## fourgoldens (Dec 29, 2007)

We have been using RC for Goldens for the last 9 months and this is the first time with no allergy meds. It also contains taurine in the ingredients panel. 
Sorry for your loss, carlswans. Very good information shared.


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## Cody'sMom (Nov 7, 2010)

Hudson's breeder studies dog food and recommended "Nutrisource adult chicken and rice". (note: NOT nutr*O*source)

Hudson was on adult food from day one. 

I tried to study dog food when I had Cody but it is SO confusing! I trust Hudson's breeder and left it up to her to tell me what food was best.

Connie and Hudson :wavey:


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## Mde13004 (Feb 20, 2019)

I have a question. I too always strive to give my pet the best food. My breeder had the puppies on Chicken Soup for the Soul puppy formula. I changed from that to Royal Canin but switched over to PPP because of Royal Canins use of chicken biproduct meal and Leo's development of allergies. Is chicken biproduct meal bad or less nutritional?


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## Maggie'sVoice (Apr 4, 2018)

Mde13004 said:


> I have a question. I too always strive to give my pet the best food. My breeder had the puppies on Chicken Soup for the Soul puppy formula. I changed from that to Royal Canin but switched over to PPP because of Royal Canins use of chicken biproduct meal and Leo's development of allergies. Is chicken biproduct meal bad or less nutritional?



Grade 3 Byproduct meal will contain muscle meat, feathers, feet and potentially any middlings of grain hulls and is whats in the cheapest foods in Walmart and grocery like Ol' Roy, Purina and Pedigree amount many many others. Grade 1 is the best form and only contains muscle meat and organ meat. So it is much much more clean then a grade 3 form of chicken Byproduct meal.


I'm not necessarily a fan of all the organ meat as the organs filter out a lot of the toxins in the body like kidneys, liver and spleen. So to process out that stuff how much does it damage the quality of the protein!? This is technically why I like Chicken Meal and not the Byproduct meal. Though any from of a meat meal is better then fresh meat like chicken, lamb, beef etc.


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## Coltsfans2007 (Jun 5, 2018)

Royal Canine- Golden Retriever. I switched after a LOT of research regarding the DCM issue and listening to the vice from Tufts University. I had to grudgingly "unlearn" a lot of stuff I bought into, especially regarding corn products. But my 3 Goldens are doing wonderfully on it and I could not be more pleased.

I think there are a number of good foods out there, but the vast bulk of them are the "boutique" variety with absolutely no science behind their claims. Even raw foods are a waste of time and they all do poorly regarding the DCM issue. 

Ive come around 180 degs on food in the past year.


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## Kora2014 (Sep 15, 2014)

I have been feeding Kora Grain Free for 5 years now as this was recommended by her Breeder. I have Tessa on Grain Free puppy food, but I am starting to think that maybe Grain Free isn't the best option after reading these posts?
Should I be taking them off Grain Free food?


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

Kora2014 said:


> I have been feeding Kora Grain Free for 5 years now as this was recommended by her Breeder. I have Tessa on Grain Free puppy food, but I am starting to think that maybe Grain Free isn't the best option after reading these posts?
> *Should I be taking them off Grain Free food?*



Yes - read the thread stickied at the top of this section about Taurine and DCM.


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## harrym (Nov 13, 2010)

I'm switching Amber to Purina Pro Plan weight management formula. Only the Focus blend is available in large breed. The Savor blend comes in adult only. How important is it to use *large breed* blend for a nine year old dog?


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## jeffscott947 (Jun 9, 2019)

Coltsfans2007 said:


> Royal Canine- Golden Retriever. I switched after a LOT of research regarding the DCM issue and listening to the vice from Tufts University. I had to grudgingly "unlearn" a lot of stuff I bought into, especially regarding corn products. But my 3 Goldens are doing wonderfully on it and I could not be more pleased.
> 
> I think there are a number of good foods out there, but the vast bulk of them are the "boutique" variety with absolutely no science behind their claims. Even raw foods are a waste of time and they all do poorly regarding the DCM issue.
> 
> Ive come around 180 degs on food in the past year.



By chance did Tuft's say why corn will pass thru a dog's GI tract, untouched..without being digested? I am set against corn for any of my dogs, but am always open to new thoughts, when backed up by science-study and not Social Media.


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## Maggie'sVoice (Apr 4, 2018)

jeffscott947 said:


> By chance did Tuft's say why corn will pass thru a dog's GI tract, untouched..without being digested? I am set against corn for any of my dogs, but am always open to new thoughts, when backed up by science-study and not Social Media.


Lol corn does not pass through a dogs gi tract undigested. That's a myth and people that don't understand say this. Let me explain

First, corn is the most digestible grain there is at over 91% digestibility. The next most digestible grain from rice, barley, wheat, soy and sorghum (these are the most common heading in dog food) is 84% digestibility.

Secondly, the corn outer kernel when whole is made of cellulose, this is 100% indigestible. That in indisputable. When corn is ground it breaks the cellulose part exposing the inner part of the corn and that part of the corn is completely different. As a whole piece of corn is ingested, that keeps a large portion of the inner portion from being digested properly. Once ground, all of what is digestible, is able to be digested.

You're uneducated about corn (not being condescending just explaining) as this is what is preached by food companies trying to sell their foods apart. This was actually what was preached by Nutro manufacture. Corn is one of if not one of the most complete grains for a dog. It contains protein, fats, carbs, linoleic acids and alpha-linoleic acids. No other grains (generally used in dog foods) have all of those. Science Diet finally caved from pressure to remove corn does one of their formulas roughly 10 yesterday ago and after removing corn, they had to add 4 additional ingredients to replace what was missing with the corn removed.

So unless a dog has a sensitivity to corn (high protein content and that's what dogs develop allergies/sensitivities to), there isn't any reason corn should be kept from being fed to a dog. Now, they're is no good reason to feed sot or wheat, and corn is in foods that usually contains wheat and soy and I can see that as a reason. You can choose not to feed corn but know why you make that choice with an educated reason and not with misinformation. :wink2:


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## jeffscott947 (Jun 9, 2019)

Maggie'sVoice said:


> Lol corn does not pass through a dogs gi tract undigested. That's a myth and people that don't understand say this. Let me explain
> 
> First, corn is the most digestible grain there is at over 91% digestibility. The next most digestible grain from rice, barley, wheat, soy and sorghum (these are the most common heading in dog food) is 84% digestibility.
> 
> ...


*Sources plz?*


*My take is that Corn (and other grains) are only digestible to the extent to which they’re processed. Since we have no idea about how these companies are processing, *I presume it is the cheapest way possible (Yes..I ran a few NYSE companies before retiring, and I bet the pressures from stock holders is even more intense these days)



I will not KNOWINGLY be feeding fillers instead of real food to my pups unless there is SCIENTIFIC evidence, NOT thoughts distributed by parties with a vested interest. (vets get $$ and sell food too..kinda like Human doctors promoting meds.


While on the subject..I posted where PPP vitamins were sourced from: Vitamin B from CHINA and the others from :"trusted sources around the globe".


I recall concern about where Hills was sourcing its vitamins..but not Purina. I will say it again..
"trusted sources around the globe".=* LOWEST BIDDER...CHINA INCLUDED!*


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## Maggie'sVoice (Apr 4, 2018)

jeffscott947 said:


> *Sources plz?*
> 
> 
> *My take is that Corn (and other grains) are only digestible to the extent to which they’re processed. Since we have no idea about how these companies are processing, *I presume it is the cheapest way possible (Yes..I ran a few NYSE companies before retiring, and I bet the pressures from stock holders is even more intense these days)
> ...


Source would be University of Kentucky or University of Kansas. Can't remember specifically as that info was from 10 years ago or so. Also got that info from the R&D from Hills and Purina which I've been to many food manufacturers facilities.

I can only help educate. I can't make you learn. Corn is not a filter. The definition of a food filter is an ingredient that has no nutritional value. Corn as a ground ingredient is absolutely not a filler. The outer kernel of the corn is cellulose (a filler) but what's inside that is made available is NOT a filler. Filler ingredients are things like peanut hulls used in foods like science diet weight management to make a dog feel full with low volume and calorie intake.

As far as the vitamins and minerals I've been saying for awhile that almost all foods use a vitamin package from China. Precise holistic, the food I feed, uses 100% sourced vitamin and mineral package. Some people claim that some get their vitamin C and others from Germany but Heyman gets all of their stuff from China as well lol.


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## jeffscott947 (Jun 9, 2019)

Maggie'sVoice said:


> Source would be University of Kentucky or University of Kansas. Can't remember specifically as that info was from 10 years ago or so. Also got that info from the R&D from Hills and Purina which I've been to many food manufacturers facilities.
> 
> I can only help educate. I can't make you learn. Corn is not a filter. The definition of a food filter is an ingredient that has no nutritional value. Corn as a ground ingredient is absolutely not a filler. The outer kernel of the corn is cellulose (a filler) but what's inside that is made available is NOT a filler. Filler ingredients are things like peanut hulls used in foods like science diet weight management to make a dog feel full with low volume and calorie intake.
> 
> As far as the vitamins and minerals I've been saying for awhile that almost all foods use a vitamin package from China. Precise holistic, the food I feed, uses 100% sourced vitamin and mineral package. Some people claim that some get their vitamin C and others from Germany but Heyman gets all of their stuff from China as well lol.



As I said ...it all depends on how corn is PROCESSED! As for out Purina Pet Food Plant here..No way I would get that close considering the stench and filth outside..It is amazing that the county hasn't shuttered the place .. Money still talks, even in Nevada.



Ten year old information is ancient in these days..Since I am not an expert..My vet and my own experiences will stand until I can find current data. I actually prefer The Dentist's opinions at dogfoodadvisor to anything that old..
In other words..PURINA NOT! Same for MARS! Kirkland's Chicken and Rice is looking better by the day (Diamond to Kirkland specs). I trust Costco over Purina any day..not that I trust any of them where the almighty $ is involved.


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## Maggie'sVoice (Apr 4, 2018)

jeffscott947 said:


> As I said ...it all depends on how corn is PROCESSED! As for out Purina Pet Food Plant here..No way I would get that close considering the stench and filth outside..It is amazing that the county hasn't shuttered the place .. Money still talks, even in Nevada.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Corn is corn. 10 years or not it's digestible the same way. It makes NO DIFFERENCE HOW IT'S PROCESSED. Once it's ground, it makes no difference. You expose everything inside the kernel and it's all digestible expert the outer part of the corn. It can't be explained to you any other way. 

I'm done, I can't help people if they can't understand something. Go do some research, it's it there. I have you the information but your ignoring it not wanting to believe anything but your own misconceptions


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## jeffscott947 (Jun 9, 2019)

Maggie'sVoice said:


> Corn is corn. 10 years or not it's digestible the same way. It makes NO DIFFERENCE HOW IT'S PROCESSED. Once it's ground, it makes no difference. You expose everything inside the kernel and it's all digestible expert the outer part of the corn. It can't be explained to you any other way.
> 
> I'm done, I can't help people if they can't understand something. Go do some research, it's it there. I have you the information but your ignoring it not wanting to believe anything but your own misconceptions



I agree..This is discussion pointless and you have provided nothing except your own take on whatever you read 10 yrs ago to enhance your position. My own 25+ years of positive dog rearing speaks for itself! (Kirkland Chicken and Rice..NO CORN! LOL)


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## Maggie'sVoice (Apr 4, 2018)

Not my own take, but some people you can't talk to. No matter what one they believe something true or false it's all they stay with.

You know that's diamond made dog food (Kirkland's). Diamond has been the most recalled brand of dog food since 2005. You're going off about food but the company that makes it has one of the worst track records. But I'm probably lying about that too.


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