# Types of Collars for Training Dogs



## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

This woman has no clue what she's talking about re/choke chains. The way she describes using the collars is EXACTLY why there are injuries to dogs necks. It's not how I was trained to use the collars and generally people I know who use choke chains do not use the collars that way. 

Those injuries are not because of the collars. It's how the owners USE the collars. In the wrong hands any collar could be dangerous. As is taking classes from monsters as this woman apparently did.

And even with the prong collars - what she describes is inaccurate as well.

Is that what people like Tippy and others think is going on when people like myself use choke chains? Or use corrections. No wonder.


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## Isaac (Aug 31, 2012)

I definitely agree with Megora about the inaccuracy of the linked article. Really, different collars correspond to different training methods, and if used properly are probably ok. That being said, I personally prefer flat collars to any other as they are more aligned with my views on training, that is, the almost exclusive use of positive reinforcement and manual manipulation where necessary. 

Another problem I have with the various correction collars is that they have the tendency to become a kind of crutch or stand-in for genuine training. A gentle leader might keep a dog in line, but more often than not does little to train the desired behavior. Similarly, perhaps excepting dedicated/knowledgable trainers, chokers, prongs and the like tend to become the end and not the means to training behavior. Additionally, as Megora suggested, they can be misused by owners to detriment of the dog. For my money, I'll stick to a flat leather collar and lead.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

Megora said:


> This woman has no clue what she's talking about re/choke chains. The way she describes using the collars is EXACTLY why there are injuries to dogs necks. It's not how I was trained to use the collars and generally people I know who use choke chains do not use the collars that way.
> 
> Those injuries are not because of the collars. It's how the owners USE the collars. In the wrong hands any collar could be dangerous. As is taking classes from monsters as this woman apparently did.
> 
> ...


That is the way I was instructed to use the choke chain (in a training class 20 years ago), hard fast jerk, keep it as high on the neck as possible. 

How do you use it?


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Thanks for posting the article. Dr. Yin does nice work with dogs.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

mylissyk said:


> That is the way I was instructed to use the choke chain (in a training class 20 years ago), hard fast jerk, keep it as high on the neck as possible.
> 
> How do you use it?


20+ years ago, people were a lot more backwards and thuggish as far as training, imho. 

As far as how I train with choke chains - 

1. I will not put a choke chain on a dog who pulls. Particularly in situations where the dog is highly likely to be pulling. A dog needs to first learn to walk on a loose lead before I pull the choke chain out. Jack was almost a year old and in competition classes before I pulled out our show chain (and yes, if you show in conformation, majority of people are using choke chains "show chains").

My instructor 20 years or so would not let people use the choke chains until they had trained through 3 levels of classes. The reason for using the collar is to polish up on attention/focus/position. 

2. I would not put a choke chain on a dog who would require a correction that needed practice re/putting the collar on a fence post and warming up like you are doing a karate chop. Or however that woman described how her instructor trained her. <=- This is a sure way of hurting a dog's neck. 

The corrections (with a regular collar or choke chain) I use are a quick pop and release followed by instant praise and reward when the dog responds. It is not hauling on the leash and yanking the dog off its feet. A pop is literally rotating your wrist and releasing. That's it.

If I ever hauled a dog with a correction - and I've never had to do that with Jacks - I would not do it with a choke chain. 

3. Placing a choke chain high on the neck? I have zero idea how you could do that with a chain that essentially sits loose around the dog's neck. The only way it would stay tight is if somebody put it on backwards. Put a choke chain on backwards and it does not release after a correction. 

With prongs the attraction they have for a lot of trainers I know is that they require only a finger squeeze as far as a correction.

*** The reason why you had so many neck injuries reports with both these collars is because you had your puppy-class-trained pet owners walking their pulling young dogs around the block and hauling on them trying to get control. 

It's not the actual collars. It's the idiots using them. And I pretty much guarantee that we will start to hear more about injuries from nose collars. Something more drastic than the tell-tale ring around the nose that these dogs have. It happens every time you have lazy instructors whose way of teaching is handing out collars to do all the training for people, as opposed to actually teach people how to train their dogs.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

Totally agree 20 years ago methods were archaic, much better methods now.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

mylissyk said:


> Totally agree 20 years ago methods were archaic, much better methods now.


20 years ago - what it came down to was my family dropping out of classes with that first instructor we had and finding somebody who used more positive methods. Positive back then wasn't anything as extreme (and borderline silly) as it is right now. It actually meant people working harder to train their dogs to enjoy training, while also using collars and corrections as necessary.

I think the problem at the time though was a majority of trainers who were easily accessible for your average dog owners were using those heavy handed methods. 

Our first instructor was available through the school system and she was CHEAP. The second instructor cost a bit more and she was out of the way. 

About now, I think the big positive is that your average pet owners are not going to be exposed to instructors who tell them to alpha pin their dogs for ten minutes every day. Unless they are watching cesar milan. 

There are negatives still though. As always. Where I attend classes, you generally have a lot of people who are really dedicated to working with their dogs and training. But get out in public and you see a lot of dogs wearing coat and skin ruining nose collars and harnesses, mainly because their owners have no other way of controlling their dogs. And either that or because their instructors neglected to teach them appropriate corrections for behaviors, these people are either not correcting the dogs or they are borderline abusive with the corrections they use.


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