# Suggestions on dealing with a difficult breeder



## SheetsSM (Jan 17, 2008)

Sorry that your pup is unwell--please make sure you're working with a cardiologist in getting the right diagnosis, prognosis & treatment plan.

As for your breeder, unless she's breaking her contract I doubt there is any legal recourse.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

You know... if a breeder charges MORE for any kind of health guarantee, whatever that may be... she's probably not somebody you want to buy a puppy from. And I very much doubt that she would have done more than give you your $200 back as far as that guarantee.


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## vcm5 (Apr 20, 2011)

I agree - in what way is she breaking her contract? If she is not breaking her contracted and you opted out of whatever guarantee, its hard to understand how you could have legal ground.


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

Hi there,
I just started talking with sandy regarding a 5 month old puppy named burnsey who he admits has a slight heart murmur. I was trying to find her kennel on line to research her and I came across your post here. Was riley born on the 5th day of a month this year (or maybe it was a 4th).
I am a little worried as I am trying to get more photos of Burnsey and she is unable to provide. I get that doggies have heart murmurs but a little alarmed of your experience. 
I also have this fear that she took riley back from you and maybe trying to resell him. 
Does your vet say that life for riley is going to be tough? I love goldies and can provide for them but if they are set up for failure that is unacceptable.

I would really appreciate it if you could send me a note back about your entire experience.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Are you the other person whose puppy has a heart murmur - that the OP mentioned?


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## Shalva (Jul 16, 2008)

Riley's Human said:


> Hi all, I introduced Riley a couple of weeks ago and mentioned that the breeder we purchased him from is washing her hands of any responsibility for his heart murmur. The purpose of this post is twofold. First of all I am trying to make contact with the other person who's new puppy also developed a heart murmur after being taken home. The breeder is Sandra Lynn of Waterdown and her dogs are registered under the kennel name "Felicity's". I am hoping that person will see this post and contact me. I'm interested in the response she received when she informed the breeder of the pup's affliction.
> 
> Secondly, I am seeking thoughtful suggestions as to how to proceed in dealing with this woman. When I purchased Riley I opted not to pay an extra $200 far a health guarantee because she very proudly documented the health clearances of her bloodlines, and if any normal health issues occurred throughout his life I was fully prepared to deal with them. However when at 12 weeks my vet discovered he had a gr 2 heart murmur which had progressed to gr 3 by 16 weeks I felt that the breeder should take some reponsibility. We are too attached to Riley to give him up and will deal with whatever circumstances present themselves throughout his life, but my requests to have her at least cover the cost of the diagnostic ultrasound have been met with animosity and accusations that I am trying to extort money from her. I've given up trying to reaon with her and am now contemplating legal action. Some honest, objective input would be very much appreciated.


I agree with the others. You chose to get your pup from a irresponsible breeder, and then chose not to buy the health guarantee, so you don't have a health guarantee. What part of the contract (assuming you have a contract) did the breeder break? What part of the health guarantee that you didn't buy did she break? 

Honestly what I see is buyers remorse. You made a poor decision about where to buy your puppy and the health guarantee and now you want to go back after those decisions to the breeder. 

I am sorry that your Riley is sick... I am sure he is a very nice puppy and it is terrible to see them sick... had you gotten him from a reputable breeder we would have been right there assisting you and supporting you... but what's done is done. I honestly don't think you have grounds for legal action and don't think that you will get anywhere with the breeder. Hopefully you can have the echo done and find out it is a harmless murmur... many of them are, even noisy murmurs can be nothing but that, noisy.


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## MGMF (May 13, 2009)

I don't know why anyone would need to pay any extra for a health guarantee. Shouldn't the puppies they place be healthy for the original price. I think that is a scam if you ask me and someone I would have walked away. Don't know what more the 200. would have helped you anyway how the breeder is responding. I really don't know what you can do with the breeder and it is sad to know they washed hands with you. As a breeder you would think they would at least want to know your puppies outcome for future of their breeding program. Did they have the puppies to a vet before they came home to you. I know I give my families get the vet certificate when they are seen around 6 or 7 weeks. If so maybe you can call the vet and see if they will possibly give you any history. In the mean time I would get the puppy to a cardiologist.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

The only legal action you might have would be if your state has puppy lemon laws. If you can prove this person is selling puppies she knows have heart problems you may have a case through state laws.


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

Actually SAS is hereditary, not necessarily congenital. I have seen numerous cases where the murmur didn't develop until further down the line. That is why you cannot get a cardiac clearance until 12 months. All clear parents, etc does not insure all clear hearts on pups. In Maine, there are lemon laws. Get an echo and figure it it.


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## heartgoldens (Jul 25, 2012)

Until further diagnostics are done (echo), you don't quite know what you're dealing with yet. We got a golden a long time ago that was diagnosed with a rather loud murmur (5/6) at her first vet visit after we got her. We went to the cardiologist, had the echo done and turns out it was an innocent murmur. She has always had the murmur to this day, but no physiological cause for it and remains healthy at 12 years of age (knock on wood). I notified our breeder just to let her know and she was kind enough to refund some of the purchase price of the puppy to help cover the cost of vet bills, although she was not obligated to at all and certainly not something I expected.

Although your breeder should be more involved, sounds like there were many red flags going into this. The additional charge for a health guarantee would be one of them.

Please keep us updated on what the echo says.


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## Mayve (Aug 21, 2012)

Not to be harsh, but if you opted out of the health guarantee...why would you then expect her to do anything for you. 

Having said this I have never heard of someone having to pay extra for a health guarantee and I would have walked. .we live and learn. 

As others have said, get the echo and see what you are trully dealing with!!!! I am hoping it is just and innocent murmur...good luck


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## darealsunny (Oct 9, 2012)

It does not seem like there are lemon laws in Canada, but here's the post asking about it two years ago.

http://www.goldenretrieverforum.com...discussion/75442-puppy-lemon-laws-canada.html


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## Wendi (Jul 2, 2012)

I do think you have a right to expect the animal you purchased to be in good health, even without buying a health guarantee. Paying extra for the health guarantee, to me, is like purchasing extended warranty, not a warranty period. 

You don't buy a guarantee when you purchase a lot of things, but there still is an expectation that the item will be in good working order when purchased new. Unfortunately, with most things all you can do is return the item.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

I had a puppy come from a breeder, and my vet found a 4/5 heart murmur. I returned the puppy within the first 48 hours, bc his prognosis was very grim. The breeder then had the puppy examined by a cardiologist who agreed. I will never forget that waterfall sound in the heart, and the sadness of a beautiful puppy who would not live to be two. My heart goes out to anyone dealing with a serious murmur.


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## jazz (Jun 2, 2012)

Thanks for the heads up on the breeder . I'm close to Waterdown in Cambridge


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

I agree with others that you probably don't have any legal recourse here. I don't know the breeder or the details beyond what you posted here, but I don't know of any law that would enable you to seek financial restitution from the breeder in the situation you described. A puppy lemon law probably wouldn't help you at this point.

I'm very sorry that your pup has a murmur. Since pursuing the breeder for money probably won't go anywhere, it might be time simply to figure out what you can do to manage the condition moving forward from here. Why not start a thread about the murmur? There are some knowledgable folks here and those of us without much heart murmur experience are still very supportive and friendly.

I'll keep an eye out for Riley threads.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

BTW - you can add Riley to k9data and put his full heart murmur diagnosis up there so the information is available publicly. Just be careful to only put totally accurate, verifiable information about it.


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## Claudia M (Aug 8, 2012)

I am total agreement with the others who posted here. Just the so called health guarantee extra charge would have made me walk away immediately. Since you decided to still deal with this creeder and did not purchase the health thingy I do not see how you can take that breeder to court. 
The only thing you can do is use your word of mouth power by telling your story on these forums, facebbok etc and hopefully this breeder will either change the way they do business or stop breeding altogether.


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

*Response to Megora*

Hi there,

No I have not purchased a pup from her. I was hoping Riley's human would give me a birthdate or riley so I can just know if they are from the same litter.
I have asked for some more detailed information on the pup's parents and I have not heard anything back. Nor has she been able to send me pictures of him in present time. So I am a bit nervous - no I have not put any money down.

My late Ryley was diagnosed with a heart murmur on and off over the years and some vets were horrified and some were not so worried. My thoughts were to be cognizant of it but what could I really do? I don't know how many open heart surgeries are done on doggies.

Some of the posters here have lovely looking goldies.. I will have to be in touch.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

I have never heard of a breeder charging extra for a health guarantee, and I agree with the others, I would have walked away.

This is not meant to offend, but why, after reading what has been posted on this thread, by members much more knowledgeable than myself, would you even still be considering a puppy from this woman?

I have 2 wonderful goldens from southern ontario. There are many reputable breeders in this area to choose from, why not use one of them and save yourself some possible heartache.

I know there is someone in Waterdown area, that is breeding "comfort" goldens, GR's crossed with cocker spaniels resulting in a "golden retriever looking" dog weighing 40-45 lbs. This is not the same person, is it?


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## Ripley16 (Jan 26, 2012)

I wouldn't have considered a breeder who expected more money to receive a health guarantee. A reputable breeder will provide a written guarantee which is included in the cost of the puppy. Our breeder provided a health guarantee for hereditary conditions for life, a 1 year pet insurance policy, lifetime guarantee that if we could not care for the dog any longer that she would take the dog back and find it a new home, as well as CKC registration. If you are purchasing a pup from a breeder, I think the above is necessary to find in a breeder. I wouldn't have gotten a dog from a breeder without it.


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

*Reply to Milkie's mom*

Good morning,
I am not in fact pursuing a puppy from this breeder. I sent back an e-mail to her requesting information on parents and more pictures of Burnsey. I will assume this questions are tough for her to answer as I have not heard again from her. I also found she had other ads posted for other breeds so my thoughts are that she breeds a lot. And no this is not meant to say she is a bad breeder as I have no knowledge of her facilities. My spidery senses tell me that if she cannot provide pictures to me of him today and information on his parents the. She is not the breeder for me.

Thank you.

I am located in Kelowna, BC and there are not a lot of breeders out here who have the goldie style in love. I do love the taller lankier type.


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

There is no "taller, lankier type." There is one type, different colors. To the extent a dog differs from the one type (i.e., the breed standard) it is an inferior dog, with (to my mind) a correspondingly heightened risk of health problems and indicative of a bad breeder.

If you want a taller, lankier Golden, get an Irish Setter.


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## bioteach (Nov 13, 2010)

It's a real shame that a breeder is only out for the money and doesn't care about the pups themselves. Our breeder took the entire litter to a canine cardiologist AND opthomologist at her own expense and had each pup cleared before offering them for sale. She does that each and every time. 

I truly hope that Riley fares well and thrives in your loving arms.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

heureuse_jesuis said:


> Good morning,
> I am not in fact pursuing a puppy from this breeder. I sent back an e-mail to her requesting information on parents and more pictures of Burnsey. I will assume this questions are tough for her to answer as I have not heard again from her. I also found she had other ads posted for other breeds so my thoughts are that she breeds a lot. And no this is not meant to say she is a bad breeder as I have no knowledge of her facilities. My spidery senses tell me that if she cannot provide pictures to me of him today and information on his parents the. She is not the breeder for me.
> 
> Thank you.
> ...


I am sorry if I misunderstood your first post. It appeared like you were considering a puppy from this breeder.

I definately think you should go with your "spidey" sense, especially if she cannot send you pictures of the pup or answer your questions.

I was, asking if she is the same breeder in Waterdown that is advertising "comfort' retrievers--AKA mini golden retrievers.

I am not sure what you mean by taller lankier type. There was recently a post about a litter in BC that a lot of the forum member were impressed with, unfortunately I cannot find the post about it right now. Maybe another member can help with this. If you are looking for a puppy in BC, I am sure someone on here can help you find one in your area. If you are looking in Ontario, Animation Acres has some nice dogs.


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

Hi Millie's Mom,

Sorry if I came across short - not intended. I actually did receive some pictures today of the pup. I have asked some questions to dig deeper and see if there is a pedigree line. I do not believe from his pictures that he is bred with a cocker he looks like a beautiful golden- I will see how she responds. I do wish Riley's Human would look again at the posts.

As for Danas Runs - I think that was a very "short" reply. I infact just lost my tall lanky Golden at 13.5 years in early September this year. He stood taller and from my research this can happen with early neutering. No he was not a setter - he was a goldie through and through. He died as peacefully and gracefully as he lived - in his sleep. I did not have him as a pup, I got him at two and he was the best golden for me. To say that he was inferior is solely your opinion. If I could figure out how to load pictures of him I would.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

heureuse_jesuis said:


> Hi Millie's Mom,
> 
> Sorry if I came across short - not intended. I actually did receive some pictures today of the pup. I have asked some questions to dig deeper and see if there is a pedigree line. I do not believe from his pictures that he is bred with a cocker he looks like a beautiful golden- I will see how she responds. I do wish Riley's Human would look again at the posts.
> 
> ...


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

*Here is my Ryley wye*

Hi Millie's mom,

Ah - Whistler is little. From some research it looks like the Waterdown breeder may be breeding shitzu as well as in my research I did a reverse phone number look up and found an ad with her phone number in the Hamilton Spectator.

I think the pictures uploaded.


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

*Thank you for the note of breeder in Ontario*

I will have a look and see. 
I feel bad for the little guy in Ontario (if he exists) if the breeder is not above board. Everyone needs a home with or without issues. I feel guilty for thinking I would still even consider, I thought my mind was made up but then pictures of him arrived. They are truly amazing graceful creatures who deserve nothing but the best. Depending on more e-mails from her, maybe he is meant to live his life in the Okanagan with my husband and I and enjoy a lovely active life full of travel and new experiences. 

I am sure some would say that that even the slightest consideration for this pup is insane. There are no guarantees in life and I am confident in myself that I will know my next funny fellow the instant I see him. My Ryley came to me from the Bargain Finder for free and I knew he had been cared for well enough and the people who had him, had such a busy life and were doing what was needed for him. He was wonderful superior doggie who had no health issues until the last few years when he became a senior. In true golden style he started and ended everyday including his last with tail wagging, enthusiasm, smiles and kindness. The pictures of him I received just after he passed confirm it was quick and he looks at rest in one of his favourite spots in the living room.


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## golden_eclipse (Apr 1, 2011)

I think the previous poster who said a lanky dog is inferior, didn't mean to be insulting. To explain maybe a littler where she is coming from. 

Reputable breeders use the golden retriever standard set out by the AKC/GRCA as their blue print for breeding. They decide along with health history, health clearances, temperament, work ability and the standard, who they should breed, and which dog they should breed him or her to. 

Along with that, to be successful at not being "subjective" or kennel blind, a breeder much compete with their dogs, to gain affirmation that their choice does serve the purpose and function the breed was intended to serve. 

Many back yard breeders, take none of this into account, they generally breed often and indiscriminately. Thus they end of with specimens of the breed that resemble little in temperament, purpose and looks of what the breed was originally intended for. Many of these tend to be wiry, tall, lacking in a prominent head piece, and generally are prone to many genetic problems since the health testing was never completed. They are also unpredictable in temperament, since no affirmation of a solid temperament was done on dogs in the pedigree before breeding. 

That doesn't mean to say that every reputable breeder breeds the same STYLE, a lot of breeders have their own style, one of those might be a little more leg, or an english style. But its important to know that TYPE is across the board, type is staying true to the standard. There are many different visions of what the standard looks like, these differences are described as style. 

That poster I think was saying, in short, Look for the health clearances and the competition, before you look at what style the breeder is breeding. Because knowing you are dealing with a reputable breeder is the first order of business. 

I hope that clears up some possible negative feelings.


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## golden_eclipse (Apr 1, 2011)

heureuse_jesuis said:


> I will have a look and see.
> I feel bad for the little guy in Ontario (if he exists) if the breeder is not above board. Everyone needs a home with or without issues. I feel guilty for thinking I would still even consider, I thought my mind was made up but then pictures of him arrived. They are truly amazing graceful creatures who deserve nothing but the best. Depending on more e-mails from her, maybe he is meant to live his life in the Okanagan with my husband and I and enjoy a lovely active life full of travel and new experiences.
> 
> I am sure some would say that that even the slightest consideration for this pup is insane. There are no guarantees in life and I am confident in myself that I will know my next funny fellow the instant I see him. My Ryley came to me from the Bargain Finder for free and I knew he had been cared for well enough and the people who had him, had such a busy life and were doing what was needed for him. He was wonderful superior doggie who had no health issues until the last few years when he became a senior. In true golden style he started and ended everyday including his last with tail wagging, enthusiasm, smiles and kindness. The pictures of him I received just after he passed confirm it was quick and he looks at rest in one of his favourite spots in the living room.


I think viewing buying this puppy as rescuing is one way to see things....but remember you will give this woman money. This money she will use to bring two maybe three more ENTIRE litters of poor helpless puppies into the world. You might feel like you are rescuing one puppy, but in fact you will be supporting the process of creating tens of puppies that are not carefully bred, and will likely suffer severe health problems, and struggle to find a home that can financially support these health problems.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

heureuse_jesuis said:


> Hi Millie's mom,
> 
> Ah - Whistler is little. From some research it looks like the Waterdown breeder may be breeding shitzu as well as in my research I did a reverse phone number look up and found an ad with her phone number in the Hamilton Spectator.
> 
> I think the pictures uploaded.


Your Ryley is a lovely looking boy. If the breeder is breeding shih tzu's then it is not the same one. FYI--Hamilton is the biggest town near Waterdown, so it would make sense she would advertise in that paper.

I have posted a pic of my 2 1/2 year old golden. Would you consider her "long and lankier"?
photo.JPG


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

Sorry picture didn't upload properly.


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

*It must be the slimmer*

Hi Millie's mom,

Yes I would consider your sweet girl lankier - slimmer. That must be what I like .

Hello to the poster regarding giving money to this breeder. I appreciate the insight and outlook and comments on "inferior". I prefer how you said "style". I must be sensitive as Ryles was perfect.

Hmm - I know I have posted numerous times and probably way off topic - sorry for this. I hope soon I will have 15 so I can pm Rileyshuman. To maybe get a sense of what she saw at the breeders.

Thank you all,


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

*Ryley's height*

This will make some of you cringe. Ryley stood about 26 inches. I used to be able to have him beside me standing and touch his back with my finger tips. I loved that. And I stand 5'7".


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

heureuse_jesuis said:


> Hi Millie's mom,
> 
> Yes I would consider your sweet girl lankier - slimmer. That must be what I like .
> 
> ...


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

*Yes slender is the style I like*

I attribute some of his slenderness to the amount of exercise we gave him, hikes, running on the beach, runs when he was younger and of course a balance raw diet. 

Thank you for all of your input and kind words. I will be patient and see what goldie becomes available and is right for me. Perhaps not a puppy puppy.


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

I forgot to add I love a long full tail.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

Mine don't have full tails, or very thick coats either. That puppy's mom has even less coat than she does. On the upside, it makes grooming a lot easier.

Good luck with your puppy search. You can PM me, when you have enough posts, if you like. And please posts pics when you get your new "baby".


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## Brooklane Bentley (Oct 29, 2012)

heureuse_jesuis said:


> I attribute some of his slenderness to the amount of exercise we gave him, hikes, running on the beach, runs when he was younger and of course a balance raw diet.
> 
> Thank you for all of your input and kind words. I will be patient and see what goldie becomes available and is right for me. Perhaps not a puppy puppy.


 
We spoke with the Waterdown breeder you were in contact with and hopefully my first 15 posts go quickly, so I can share the information we have if you are interested. 

We just purchased our next goldie boy from another breeder and can't wait to bring him home! We found a fantastic breeder that had a line that fit what we were looking for - just like you are.

Good luck in your search!


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

Good evening Brookelane,

I too have information on this breeder. I would be very happy to hear where you found your new addition. So yes post quickly and then you can pm me.

I hope Riley is doing well, it would be nice to hear.

Please post pics of your newbie too when you get them.


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## Riley's Human (Sep 16, 2012)

I've not been back for a while, but have noted various attitudes and responses from different members. I'm responding to your queries first as you seem to have some possible information about the breeder I purchased Riley from. I must ask though, if Burnsey is not your puppy, how are you associated with him? 
Riley was born on May 5'th of this year. His father's name was Winslow and I don't recall the name of the mother. I received your pm but apparently can't reply until I've made 15 posts.


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## Riley's Human (Sep 16, 2012)

*I also prefer them "lanky".*



DanaRuns said:


> There is no "taller, lankier type." There is one type, different colors. To the extent a dog differs from the one type (i.e., the breed standard) it is an inferior dog, with (to my mind) a correspondingly heightened risk of health problems and indicative of a bad breeder.
> 
> If you want a taller, lankier Golden, get an Irish Setter.


There are in fact two different breed standards, the English and the American. 
See this link for details: Golden Retrievers|British English White Cream Golden Retrievers - The English Goldens

The "lankier" type is also my preference in body and head style, ie. less stocky, traditionally with a rounded cranial profile and somewhat more tapered or "conical" muzzle. These goldens also seem to be more readily found in the more coppery to reddish shades than their English counterparts. Both types of goldens are beautiful. A traditional American type, however, would never be confused with an Irish Setter.


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

Riley's Human said:


> There are in fact two different breed standards, the English and the American.
> See this link for details: Golden Retrievers|British English White Cream Golden Retrievers - The English Goldens


I'm sorry, I sure don't want to be offensive, but the description of the "differences in KC and AKC standards" for Goldens in your provided link is just . . . well, it's just wrong and biased and misleading. And I actually laughed at the pictures offered for comparison. I can do the same thing to show bias the other way. See?

Here is a representative English Golden:









Here is a representative AKC standard Golden:









I can do the same thing with the other photos. I personally would not use that link as any kind of authority. I'm sure there are folks here with intimate knowledge of the differences between the standards, if there are any, but I don't think that link is it. Someone educate me if I'm wrong, please.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

DanaRuns said:


> I'm sorry, I sure don't want to be offensive, but the description of the "differences in KC and AKC standards" for Goldens in your provided link is just . . . well, it's just wrong and biased and misleading.
> 
> I personally would not use that link as any kind of authority. I'm sure there are folks here with intimate knowledge of the differences between the standards, if there are any, but I don't think that link is it.
> 
> I agree, it is amazing how some breeders can manipulate the facts. I looked at this website and it is certainly not a place that I would consider buying a puppy. It has all the red flags that point to a less than reputable breeder.


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## solinvictus (Oct 23, 2008)

English Goldens 

*English Goldens Are Healthier......Right?

*Wrong. The claim that English Goldens have lower cancer rates is based on a survey done in the U.K. conducted years apart from a similar (but not identical) U.S. survey. It is important to note that this survey was not a study of English style Golden Retrievers vs. American style Golden Retrievers, but rather one study done in the U.K. and one study done in the U.S. Neither survey was done with the intent to control against one another, and both were on only a few hundred dogs each. There was no control for who reported, no control for what style of dog they actually had (all the "U.S." dogs could have been 'English style' dogs living in the U.S.!), and no control for what role diagnostics played in the differences in rates. 

All the other research on cancer in Golden Retrievers, and it's extensive, has shown us that there's no increase or decrease in risk depending on whether your dog is English style or American style. The people who sell light Goldens as "White" "Platinum" or "English Cream/Creme" often cite these two surveys as bogus proof of the superior health of their dogs. They prey on unsuspecting puppy buyers, many of whom are distraught over losing a beloved pet to cancer and are just hoping to avoid the pain of losing another young dog. These unscrupulous breeders often charge excessively high prices for their puppies, marketing them as "rare" or "exotic." It is wrong for these "breeders" to lie to unsuspecting and trusting puppy buyers just to make a buck. 
Portions of this article are adapted from the GRCA website and "What Exactly Is An ENGLISH Golden Retriever?" by Bev Brown.


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## Shalva (Jul 16, 2008)

I htink that she is also misreading .... 

Yes there are two different standards... actually there are more than that as each kennel club from the various countries has their own standard ... 

So the English Standard that you refer to is not the Standard for English Goldens as a separate breed rather it is the Golden Retriever Breed Standard in the United Kingdom. If you go to Canada you will find that the Golden retriever standard is written differently than here in the U.S. this does not mean that there is a separate breed of Canadian Golden retriever, it is just the breed standard of that countries kennel club. There is a New Zealand Kennel Club Golden Retriever breed standard, and Australian Golden Retriever breed standard etc etc etc. 

The reality is that many of us who breed golden retrievers of English or European descent do breed to the breed standard of the UK Kennel Club. The style of dog is slightly different but there are pros and cons to the dogs that are more American in style and pros and cons to dogs that are more English in style but the reality is that they are the same breed and the breed standards are country specific not breed specific. The reality is that someone could breed to the Peruvian breed standard if they so desired. It does not mean that there is a Peruvian golden retriever, it just means that a dog might fit their breed standard better than it fits the one here. 

Personally I bring my dogs up to Canada to show, the Canadian standard seems to fit my dogs better. It does not mean that my dogs are Canadian golden retrievers... 

as far as health and such... no difference... my goldens are no healthier or less healthy than american dogs that is just a farce and it seems that the breeder that you are looking at is perpetrating a falsehood in an attempt to make her dogs out to be something more than they are....


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## Riley's Human (Sep 16, 2012)

*Thank-you for your thoughtful responses.*

Just wanted to say that I appreciate the feedback I've received since I first posted about Riley's condition. He is doing well and will be back in to the vet this month for a checkup at which time we will be planning his cardiogram.

I also wanted to clear up a bit of apparent confusion. Perhaps from a strictly legal point of view I don't have a case for breach of contract. However that does not negate the fact that this woman presents herself as being the epitome of a responsible breeder, proudly showcases the bloodlines of the dogs she breeds yet, when confronted with medical proof that not one but two of the puppies from this litter have heart murmurs, first suggests that my vet is not capable of making such a diagnosis accurately and then, when the murmur progresses to a higher level of intensity basically says "sorry about your luck" and refuses to acknowledge any responsibility on her part. Not by any stretch of the imagination could such attitude be considered justified.

The decision to buy from her was not made lightly either. My wife and I first went to see two other pups from an earlier litter (different mom than Riley's) which she had for sale. During that visit we met Riley's parents and spent well over an hour discussing breeding practices, holisitic treatments, over-vaccination controversy, and were shown years worth of photo albums of sires, dames, ribbons and champions. In short we were impressed and I wrote a check for a $300 deposit on a pup from the upcoming litter. In the intervening period up until Riley was about six weeks old we were in constant communication via email and received photos of past litters and (apparent) testimonials from satisfied owners. Only when it came time to arrange to come to pick a puppy and make final payment did warning flags arise. The price she now specified was $300 more than what we had originally discussed. That's when she said we could have him for less if we didn't want a health guarantee. Things escalated from there to the point where we asked for our deposit back, but she refused. By then we agreed to pick a puppy since, in spite of our concerns about her business practices, we trusted her breeding ethics and the puppies were adorable. The rest you already know. So, do I have buyer's remorse? Certainly, but not because we made a hasty or ill advised decision. It really results from a culmination of events and a very uprofessional attitude from this breeder. We love Riley deeply and wouldn't trade him for the world, regardless of whether she sees fit to accept any financial reponsibility. However, I would suggest that you steer clear of buying a dog from Sandra Lynn based on our personal experience with her questionable ethics and practices.


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## Vhuynh2 (Feb 13, 2012)

I am sorry, it still seems to me that you did not spend enough time researching this breeder before making your decision. Are they a member of the GRCA? Their local GR club? And mostly importantly, did you check for all four clearances on all the dogs in 5 generations behind your pup?? Because any breeder could pose as a reputable breeder but it is up to you to find out for yourself. I looked up Felicity's on OFFA.org. There were only two clearances done on ONE golden retriever with that prefix. Many backyard breeders "prey" on people who are less knowledgeable. Almost happened to me too, as I knew nothing at the time.. And then I found this forum.


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## Riley's Human (Sep 16, 2012)

*You're missing my point*



DanaRuns said:


> I'm sorry, I sure don't want to be offensive, but the description of the "differences in KC and AKC standards" for Goldens in your provided link is just . . . well, it's just wrong and biased and misleading. And I actually laughed at the pictures offered for comparison. I can do the same thing to show bias the other way. See?
> 
> Here is a representative English Golden:
> 
> ...


I didn't post my original response for any reason than to illustrate that there are in fact different physical qualities and characteristics to certain types of goldens. Your rather offhanded remark that there are no "lankier" types, or that the poster should purchase an Irish Setter were rather insensitive. I also didn't post the link regarding the differences in breed standards as representing any particular authority, but rather to illustrate that there are most certainly different styles of goldens which the pictures clearly illustrate. I intended no bias as to one being superior to another, only my own personal preference to which I am most certainly entitled, as are you to your own.


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

Riley's Human said:


> Your rather offhanded remark that there are no "lankier" types, or that the poster should purchase an Irish Setter were rather insensitive.


You're right, it was. I'm sorry.


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## Riley's Human (Sep 16, 2012)

DanaRuns said:


> You're right, it was. I'm sorry.


No harm. BTW, your dogs are beautiful.


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## Bellas Mum (Jan 15, 2013)

Thank you for posting this information. Learning a lot on our puppy quest.


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## Bellas Mum (Jan 15, 2013)

Thank you so much for your post. We are learning so much on our puppy quest and found this at the absolute right time.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

Where are you located in Ontario? If you are looking for a puppy, I would recommend, that you
start a new thread, there are lots of people who can recommend good breeder in Ontario


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## TanyaD (Feb 22, 2013)

I am SO sorry for your pup...how is he now?
I am also SO glad I came across your post: I have been talking to the same Sandy for a bit now about a 6 month old she wants to sell...she's being a bit shady about the cost, her last (VERY WORDY!!) email saying something about charging extra for a health guarantee.

I am so sorry about your issues, and sincerely hope Riley is doing well....and thank you SO MUCH for your post. I had a red flag weeks ago about this person, and now I know for certain.
Thanks so much...and prayers for Riley.


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## TanyaD (Feb 22, 2013)

Brooklane Bentley said:


> We spoke with the Waterdown breeder you were in contact with and hopefully my first 15 posts go quickly, so I can share the information we have if you are interested.
> 
> We just purchased our next goldie boy from another breeder and can't wait to bring him home! We found a fantastic breeder that had a line that fit what we were looking for - just like you are.
> 
> Good luck in your search!


I don't know what that means as far as "hoping the 15 posts go quickly"...but I'd like info on her. I've been talking to her and she just emailed me about 12 times with recommendation letters and pedigree info...but COMPLETELY ignored my earlier email about my confusion with her cost/extra $$ for health guarantee.

Thanks!
Tanya


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## TanyaD (Feb 22, 2013)

Riley's Human said:


> Just wanted to say that I appreciate the feedback I've received since I first posted about Riley's condition. He is doing well and will be back in to the vet this month for a checkup at which time we will be planning his cardiogram.
> 
> I also wanted to clear up a bit of apparent confusion. Perhaps from a strictly legal point of view I don't have a case for breach of contract. However that does not negate the fact that this woman presents herself as being the epitome of a responsible breeder, proudly showcases the bloodlines of the dogs she breeds yet, when confronted with medical proof that not one but two of the puppies from this litter have heart murmurs, first suggests that my vet is not capable of making such a diagnosis accurately and then, when the murmur progresses to a higher level of intensity basically says "sorry about your luck" and refuses to acknowledge any responsibility on her part. Not by any stretch of the imagination could such attitude be considered justified.
> 
> The decision to buy from her was not made lightly either. My wife and I first went to see two other pups from an earlier litter (different mom than Riley's) which she had for sale. During that visit we met Riley's parents and spent well over an hour discussing breeding practices, holisitic treatments, over-vaccination controversy, and were shown years worth of photo albums of sires, dames, ribbons and champions. In short we were impressed and I wrote a check for a $300 deposit on a pup from the upcoming litter. In the intervening period up until Riley was about six weeks old we were in constant communication via email and received photos of past litters and (apparent) testimonials from satisfied owners. Only when it came time to arrange to come to pick a puppy and make final payment did warning flags arise. The price she now specified was $300 more than what we had originally discussed. That's when she said we could have him for less if we didn't want a health guarantee. Things escalated from there to the point where we asked for our deposit back, but she refused. By then we agreed to pick a puppy since, in spite of our concerns about her business practices, we trusted her breeding ethics and the puppies were adorable. The rest you already know. So, do I have buyer's remorse? Certainly, but not because we made a hasty or ill advised decision. It really results from a culmination of events and a very uprofessional attitude from this breeder. We love Riley deeply and wouldn't trade him for the world, regardless of whether she sees fit to accept any financial reponsibility. However, I would suggest that you steer clear of buying a dog from Sandra Lynn based on our personal experience with her questionable ethics and practices.


Thank you so much...you've helped make my choice VERY clear...and just in the knick of time. My spidey senses too were going crazy!!

SO happy that Riley is doing well. 

Will be searching a REPUTABLE breeder here in Ontario.

Thanks so much again.


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## Brooklane Bentley (Oct 29, 2012)

Tanya - you followed your instinct and that's what matters. My correspondence with this breeder was very strange and after I questioned her on a few things about the bloodline of her dogs, she blocked my email address after writing me a 1000 word essay on why I didn't deserve to own a dog. One of the strangest experiences I've ever had. We bought a new golden boy from a great breeder and are completely in love with our newest family member.


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

I am in southern Ontario and heavily involved and familiar with the reputable breeders here. (I am the VP of the Toronto club!) 

I have never heard of the breeder the OP bought their pup from. She is not a member of any of our regional breed clubs, I have never seen her at our clearance clinic, or at a show or hunt test. She is not active and involved with the reputable retriever breeders in our area. That should be a red flag. If someone is breeding Goldens and not active in dog sports or the breed clubs, I would ask why not?

Also, both the GRCC and the GRCGT require a warranty in their COE. It is not something to pay extra for!!


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## osborne (Jun 14, 2013)

I was doing some research online regarding this breeder, Sandy Lynn, Waterdown, Ontario. Glad I came across this forum. I too have had some lengthy discussions with her and did sense some evasiveness in her responses. One really interesting.....I asked her kennel name and she claimed that she did not have one but rather used her own name. Never even a mention of Felicity's. I met with her and she had all sorts of pictures, etc. of her dogs.....in fact, I met Winslow, Ryley's father. The health issue is something I am not prepared to compromise. I had a feeling something was a bit fishy......definite Red Flags came up. This 
breeder does breed Shih Tzu pups also as well as Pugs. Chats and chats about holistic veterinary care. Her strange price scale puzzles me as there seems to be a *"bait and switch" style* to it and other topics. I am going to walk and leave my small deposit with her. I was supposed to pick up my pup this week. Thanks to all for the posts. Hope Ryley's health continues to be stable and you have many years of joy with him.


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

Osborne,

Wow, that must be hard leaving a puppy you expected to bring home pretty soon, but you did the right thing, and the right puppy will find you.


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## Janbpi (Jan 25, 2014)

*Riley*

Can you update me on Riley's progress? I am considering a Golden and have read that sometimes the pups grow out of a murmer by 6 mos of age


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## KaceyL (Aug 3, 2016)

I wish I had seen this post before purchasing my puppy from this woman. She is 12 weeks old she seemed okay when we brought her home, but we are now dealing with the diarrhea. She was checked out yesterday by our vet and they said she has no murmur. I felt this woman was reputable by the way she talked about her past her beliefs. She sent me all kinds of pictures of her dogs that she has had? I must have 20 emails she sent me with different dogs their history their ancestry history. She was okay the first day when I text her some questions. As soon as I contacted her when she wouldn't eat I was only asking for suggestions not a refund. My next text won't be so polite I might contact her vet and ask them some questions regarding her breeding and her ethics.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

KaceyL said:


> I wish I had seen this post before purchasing my puppy from this woman. She is 12 weeks old she seemed okay when we brought her home, but we are now dealing with the diarrhea. She was checked out yesterday by our vet and they said she has no murmur. I felt this woman was reputable by the way she talked about her past her beliefs. She sent me all kinds of pictures of her dogs that she has had? I must have 20 emails she sent me with different dogs their history their ancestry history. She was okay the first day when I text her some questions. As soon as I contacted her when she wouldn't eat I was only asking for suggestions not a refund. My next text won't be so polite I might contact her vet and ask them some questions regarding her breeding and her ethics.


Talk to your vet about getting your puppy treated for coccidia. Sooner the better. Your vet should have automatically discussed this with you since it is so common.

I have no comment really about the breeder, etc... I haven't really looking further than your post. 

With coccidia - it's something which may flare up because of stress or minor digestive issues. People sometimes switch puppies on different foods right away or there's other stuff which occurs which causes stress to the system.


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## Julz Williams Adamson (Jun 10, 2017)

Re Sandy Lynn Golden Breeder 706 Center Road RR2 Hamilton Ontario L8N 2Z7. She is not a good breeder at all I was surprised when I went to her home to buy a Golden Retriever for her price advertised. No breeder bases dogs on price on a non breeding contract. There prices are based on No breeding or breeding. I was shocked at the condition these puppies were kept in. 2 puppies in a small wire kennel. The mother and father kept in the basement. Of which I asked to see and she refused. I really wanted to take all the puppies away from her, she gave me the creeps. To me see is running a puppy mill. I am so sorry your dog was sick when you bought him. A good breeder would have offer to help. I did take the very tiny puppy as I new something was wrong with her. Turns out she had Guardia and was 15 weeks old and looked no more than 8 weeks old. I got her home and took her straight to my vet who said she had a ear infection in both ears, and also that she had Guardia a parasite. She weighed only 19.4 pounds. He ran multiple test on her and her heart thank god is strong and fine. After 300.00 dollars in vet bills she now doing well and gaining weight. Believe me she is worth every penny. I am just so shocked that she is till allowed to breed knowing her track record. I also found out some very interesting info on this breeder all the documents she has on lines of the dogs and photos of awards do come from Felicity's" an American Kennel in California. She got her female from their. She truly has no experience in showing or anything else for that matter. She is not a good qualified breeder. She a good liar. She talk about feeding the dogs well when she was feeding the puppies a cheap food full of filler and very high in sugar. My warning is to everyone stay away from this breeder. I am also upset with our laws in Canada as to who can breed dogs. This woman should never be allowed to breed. My dog was so sacred every time I raised my hand to pat her head. I have to wonder if she was hit. If you like I love to hear and keep in contact as to how Riley is doing.


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## Katie B (Aug 31, 2017)

*My Shih Tzu from Sandra Lynn*

I purchased my Shih Tzu from Sandra back in March. He was 9 weeks old. His name is Milo. Beautiful personality. I love him very much. When we took Kim to be neutered, the vet did retinue blood work. Discovered that he has a very serious liver problem. It is costing us a lot to see him get well. I have been in touch with Sandra and don't get a good response from her. I now know that I had chosen a poor breeder. She will not hold up to her responsibly. 

Milo will have his ultra sound soon which will cost us many dollars. Then following that he will have to have surgery, which is not cheap. I somehow feel she is responsible for this situation. She will not answer my emails. I don't expect she will help in any way. I don't believe she even cares.

You know what, Sandra Lynn, we will get through this and Milo is better off without you. I hope you see this and feel remorse for little Milo and the other puppies you have had that have been sick. I somehow hope you get caught and would be banned from breeding or seeking any kind of animals.


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## Mother Tucker (Dec 20, 2011)

I just came across this lady while searching Kijiji for an older golden that may need rehoming, and also for some research. There appears to be a very large number of “wanted” golden retriever puppies these days, or is it just me?
i tried responding to the ad, no text reply and answering machine is full. Sadly, she will have an overwhelming response and make a fast buck.









Kijiji - Buy, Sell & Save with Canada's #1 Local Classifieds


Visit Kijiji Classifieds to buy, sell, or trade almost anything! New and used items, cars, real estate, jobs, services, vacation rentals and more virtually anywhere.




www.kijiji.ca





i lost my Tucker to hermangiosarcoma in February. I am looking to adopt a retired golden or one that needs a home, or...a new puppy, which I said I wouldn’t do...it is very lonely without him.

I haven’t read the rules in full, but am wondering if this is somewhere I can search


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

Gosh that ad is a disaster.. which is it, 7 or 13 generations of hips done? And that's as it should be but does this person not know which she has, 7 or 13? And doesn't spell worth a durn, spey instead of spay? Excellents are more like 4.something%, not 3%... and her first litter but 5 generations in the breed? YES. TONS of people looking for dogs right now.. just be careful. You won't find a wonderful puppy on kijiji... wonderful litters are spoken for before they are on the ground most of the time.


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## tikiandme (May 16, 2010)

Mother Tucker said:


> I just came across this lady while searching Kijiji for an older golden that may need rehoming, and also for some research. There appears to be a very large number of “wanted” golden retriever puppies these days, or is it just me?
> i tried responding to the ad, no text reply and answering machine is full. Sadly, she will have an overwhelming response and make a fast buck.
> 
> 
> ...


Go past the General Forums and get to the Golden Retriever Puppies and Seniors section. The third sub-forum down is Choosing A Golden Retriever Breeder And Puppy. If you post there and give them your location and what you are looking for, hopefully you will get some replies. Good luck in finding your golden.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

Mother Tucker said:


> I just came across this lady while searching Kijiji for an older golden that may need rehoming, and also for some research. There appears to be a very large number of “wanted” golden retriever puppies these days, or is it just me?
> i tried responding to the ad, no text reply and answering machine is full. Sadly, she will have an overwhelming response and make a fast buck.
> 
> 
> ...


If you are looking in Southern Ontario, I would recommend Carol Lee at Ambercroft Goldens.


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## SoCalEngr (Apr 11, 2020)

Mother Tucker said:


> I just came across this lady while searching Kijiji for an older golden that may need rehoming, and also for some research. There appears to be a very large number of “wanted” golden retriever puppies these days, or is it just me?
> i tried responding to the ad, no text reply and answering machine is full. Sadly, she will have an overwhelming response and make a fast buck.
> 
> 
> ...


My $0.02...

"Show me", don't "tell me". Give me the registration #s, and I can find all the wonderful information out for myself (although I get that the breeder would want to highlight their dog's qualities).

And, from what I can tell based on my limited participation on these forums, most of the people who would care about all those superlatives are already dialed into the breeder community, and wouldn't need to be told anything more than name (and, maybe, a registration number).

My general rule, as a consumer, is to "be a buyer", don't "get sold". It's too easy to be dazzled by sales pitches. Know what you care about, and what questions you need to ask, and you can cut through the noise and make informed decisions.


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## ellablue (May 12, 2020)

Mother Tucker said:


> I just came across this lady while searching Kijiji for an older golden that may need rehoming, and also for some research. There appears to be a very large number of “wanted” golden retriever puppies these days, or is it just me?
> i tried responding to the ad, no text reply and answering machine is full. Sadly, she will have an overwhelming response and make a fast buck.
> 
> 
> ...


you are lucky I too got in touch with her but something was fishy A) her name on the ad is Anne B)she texted me and when I asked where to send a deposit she had no e transfer no way to send $$ but to either drop it to her or mail a cheque or money order trough the bank C) her price was puzzling to me no a fix price but depending on what you are ready to put out D) she overwhelmed me with text at 10:30 at night at least 30 text messages with tons of pictures and a bunch of nonsense plus her texting was erratic could not understand what she meant Once I put her name through a google search it took me to this site and pretty much it seems she is running a puppy mill


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## 208747 (Apr 30, 2020)

Well I could see where she is coming from mainly because you decided not to pay the $200 for the health guarantee if I am understandings right. So since you decided not to purchase the health guarantee it is your responsibility not hers to cover the medical costs. So I dont think there is a legal action you could take but I am not an expert so I couldn't tell you a for sure. But to me if the breeder truly cared about the breed and the puppies she is producing she would maybe cover some of the costs but not all of them since you did decide to not purchase the health guarantee. Thats just my opinion like I said i am no expert so....
@ellablue what make you think she is running a puppy mill?


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## ellablue (May 12, 2020)

Patriot the Golden said:


> Well I could see where she is coming from mainly because you decided not to pay the $200 for the health guarantee if I am understandings right. So since you decided not to purchase the health guarantee it is your responsibility not hers to cover the medical costs. So I dont think there is a legal action you could take but I am not an expert so I couldn't tell you a for sure. But to me if the breeder truly cared about the breed and the puppies she is producing she would maybe cover some of the costs but not all of them since you did decide to not purchase the health guarantee. Thats just my opinion like I said i am no expert so....
> @ellablue what make you think she is running a puppy mill?


did you read all the posts in here? Here is one that went to her house in 2017
Re Sandy Lynn Golden Breeder 706 Center Road RR2 Hamilton Ontario L8N 2Z7. She is not a good breeder at all I was surprised when I went to her home to buy a Golden Retriever for her price advertised. No breeder bases dogs on price on a non breeding contract. There prices are based on No breeding or breeding. I was shocked at the condition these puppies were kept in. 2 puppies in a small wire kennel. The mother and father kept in the basement. Of which I asked to see and she refused. I really wanted to take all the puppies away from her, she gave me the creeps. To me see is running a puppy mill. I am so sorry your dog was sick when you bought him. A good breeder would have offer to help. I did take the very tiny puppy as I new something was wrong with her. Turns out she had Guardia and was 15 weeks old and looked no more than 8 weeks old. I got her home and took her straight to my vet who said she had a ear infection in both ears, and also that she had Guardia a parasite. She weighed only 19.4 pounds. He ran multiple test on her and her heart thank god is strong and fine. After 300.00 dollars in vet bills she now doing well and gaining weight. Believe me she is worth every penny. I am just so shocked that she is till allowed to breed knowing her track record. I also found out some very interesting info on this breeder all the documents she has on lines of the dogs and photos of awards do come from Felicity's" an American Kennel in California. She got her female from their. She truly has no experience in showing or anything else for that matter. She is not a good qualified breeder. She a good liar. She talk about feeding the dogs well when she was feeding the puppies a cheap food full of filler and very high in sugar. My warning is to everyone stay away from this breeder. I am also upset with our laws in Canada as to who can breed dogs. This woman should never be allowed to breed. My dog was so sacred every time I raised my hand to pat her head. I have to wonder if she was hit. If you like I love to hear and keep in contact as to how Riley is doing.


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## 208747 (Apr 30, 2020)

@ellablue oh ok well I have been reading the posts but I havent gotten to that one. Thank you!!!


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## Jjj (Jun 20, 2020)

I dealt with this person and ended up walking away from my deposit after reading this thread and also talking with a reputable breeder that this lady was a con artist . I put down a deposit thinking she was reputable... after that any questions re contract details vist etc were met with I'll tell you next month.. ?? 
Had a bad feeling and withholding info is never a 
Hope someone can be warned from this post. What else can I do to stop someone else from supporting her. ?


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## lvlogan (Oct 31, 2011)

We adopted a puppy from a breeder that had a malformed left mitral valve and a hole in his heart. His cardiologist was superb. This was a congenital condition so I notified the breeder. I did not want money, I wanted her to know of the condition as it may (should) influence her program. I was met with hostility and denial. Cooper lived to 11 with outstanding care from several specialists. My fault for choosing the wrong breeder and a mistake I will never make again. I am really sorry about Riley, goldens can teach heartbreaking lessons sometimes.


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## tragicwardrobe (Jan 25, 2021)

I purchased my golden from here a while ago; The breeder is definitely a little sketchy. We went to look for a litter and she had a 6 month old there she was looking to sell. She never gave us a set price; she basically told us to make an offer. She then said it was an additional $200 for some kind of certificate that we opted out of. We ended up going for the 6 month old because she was so cute and was already "crate trained/potty trained". When we took her home she was terrified of the crate. It was almost like she was crated up the entire 6 months of her life, and she did not want to be in there ever again. We tried making it a comfortable safe place with treats, toys, bedding and she was still terrifed. We got rid of the crate all together and she was so happy. She also was 100000% not potty trained in the slightest bit haha. I didn't mind training her, but the breeder was not transparent at all. Another thing that was odd is she was very skiddish. If you raised a hand near her, or walked too fast at her she would run fast away or duck like she was scared you'd hit her. I have no idea if she was hit in the past, but it took nearly 4 months to gain her trust that I was just trying to pet her and not hit her. She had very bad separation anxiety as well. She also had blood in her poop when we got her, and an ear infection. I've had her for about a year now and she's the sweetest dog in the world. She's potty trained, she trusts me fully, she constantly wants to be cuddled and loved. I love my baby to death.


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## tragicwardrobe (Jan 25, 2021)

ellablue said:


> you are lucky I too got in touch with her but something was fishy A) her name on the ad is Anne B)she texted me and when I asked where to send a deposit she had no e transfer no way to send $$ but to either drop it to her or mail a cheque or money order trough the bank C) her price was puzzling to me no a fix price but depending on what you are ready to put out D) she overwhelmed me with text at 10:30 at night at least 30 text messages with tons of pictures and a bunch of nonsense plus her texting was erratic could not understand what she meant Once I put her name through a google search it took me to this site and pretty much it seems she is running a puppy mill


She would send a ton of text mesages of pictures to me as well, there was novels of text all in a row. After I purchased the pup, I texted her a couple questions and was either ignored or responded with short answers. No fix price, asked for a money order.


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## MissBud (Mar 15, 2021)

Julz Williams Adamson said:


> Re Sandy Lynn Golden Breeder 706 Center Road RR2 Hamilton Ontario L8N 2Z7. She is not a good breeder at all I was surprised when I went to her home to buy a Golden Retriever for her price advertised. No breeder bases dogs on price on a non breeding contract. There prices are based on No breeding or breeding. I was shocked at the condition these puppies were kept in. 2 puppies in a small wire kennel. The mother and father kept in the basement. Of which I asked to see and she refused. I really wanted to take all the puppies away from her, she gave me the creeps. To me see is running a puppy mill. I am so sorry your dog was sick when you bought him. A good breeder would have offer to help. I did take the very tiny puppy as I new something was wrong with her. Turns out she had Guardia and was 15 weeks old and looked no more than 8 weeks old. I got her home and took her straight to my vet who said she had a ear infection in both ears, and also that she had Guardia a parasite. She weighed only 19.4 pounds. He ran multiple test on her and her heart thank god is strong and fine. After 300.00 dollars in vet bills she now doing well and gaining weight. Believe me she is worth every penny. I am just so shocked that she is till allowed to breed knowing her track record. I also found out some very interesting info on this breeder all the documents she has on lines of the dogs and photos of awards do come from Felicity's" an American Kennel in California. She got her female from their. She truly has no experience in showing or anything else for that matter. She is not a good qualified breeder. She a good liar. She talk about feeding the dogs well when she was feeding the puppies a cheap food full of filler and very high in sugar. My warning is to everyone stay away from this breeder. I am also upset with our laws in Canada as to who can breed dogs. This woman should never be allowed to breed. My dog was so sacred every time I raised my hand to pat her head. I have to wonder if she was hit. If you like I love to hear and keep in contact as to how Riley is doing.


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## MissBud (Mar 15, 2021)

Omg this is crazy!! We just got our puppy a week ago from her. He was extremely under weight. We took him to the vet right away and he tested positive Giardiasis. WE NEED TO SHUT THIS CHICK DOWN!
Her ad is so misleading, it shows a birth date but on the puppy vet papers it’s different. Also, her house smelled so bad.
How is your dog now? I see this is 4 years ago. She also made us sign CKC papers, and said a copy was ours but I noticed when we left she took them!!


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## MissBud (Mar 15, 2021)

How is your dog now? We just purchased a puppy from her and he has a parasite so we’ve been giving him medication from the vet. I wish I had seen this sooner and would have purchased elsewhere. So scared my dog won’t have a long healthy life now


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## Bella_LB (Apr 2, 2021)

@MissBud this is so crazy! I stumbled upon this post because my kids and I purchased a Shih Tzu from her 5 weeks ago. Our little Lily Pie is an adorable little spunky thing. But after a few weeks, we were concerned with some breathing issues. I took her to the vet this week for her shots and a check up. Only to find out that she has a grade 5/6 heart murmur. Its going to be $800 just in tests to find out how to treat it, and then surgeries and she will need medications for the rest of her life. And even at that, they cannot guarantee how long she will live. If we do nothing, she will die within a year or 2. I texted this crazy woman that evening and she is now not responding and she has blocked my number from her phone!!!! I am a single mom and cannot afford these vet bills on my own. My 3 kids are devastated and cannot stop crying that their precious pup is sick. I just want my $1500 back


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