# Training Plan for the Excitable and Distractable Dog



## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

Can you give an example?

The only thing I'm thinking is that's teaching her to ignore you and just focus on the distractions, because you're going to be much more boring than what's going on around her. 

Like with Storee, her downfall is balls. After months of putting her away for being a goof because there was a ball somewhere (she'd blow me off to go try to get it) I started working very simple things with the ball as the reward - attention work over HERE, then we'll go over THERE and get the ball. As the lightbulb goes on in her head she's more willing to go do what's 'needed' to get me to get the ball out for her and we're progressing. If that makes sense.....


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

I would free-shape attention in those areas. Don't lure with food, but wait and ANYTIME she so much as looks at you, click and treat. Keep some notes. Sit relaxed at a table with 10 treats out. Notice how long it takes you to get 10 offered head-turns your direction. Over several sessions, it should take noticeably less time.

So... you've taught attention, but haven't been able to practice much around distractions?


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

Bender said:


> I started working very simple things with the ball as the reward - attention work over HERE, then we'll go over THERE and get the ball. As the lightbulb goes on in her head she's more willing to go do what's 'needed' to get me to get the ball out for her and we're progressing. If that makes sense.....


Paging Dr. Premack... !!!


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

FlyingQuizini said:


> Paging Dr. Premack... !!!



Do you think he'd give her drugs to help?


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## Loisiana (Jul 29, 2009)

I've done something similar with Flip. Take him somewhere exciting and just let him CHILL and learn that he doesn't have to get involved in everything around him. For the 4 weeks we actually drove to Houston and took a class (back when he was 7 months), I would get there 30 to 45 minutes early and we would just sit together on the sidelines and watch the dogs already working. It helped him learn that a dog can run past him and he doesn't have to get all worked up about it. I was looking instead for him to just relax, which he would every week before class started (eventually). Sometimes we'll go to Petsmart and I'll just sit on a bench for awhile so he can hang out and watch everything going on. Actually that's something I did with all my dogs. It wasn't about teaching him to ignore that really exciting stuff going on over there, it was about teaching him that it wasn't really all that exciting after all.


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

When I *show* Quiz, I make sure to get there early enough to let him soak up some of the atmosphere. I never really did it in training, but that might be b/c I tried to be very systematic in how I trained -- with an aim of training in increasingly distracting areas as I felt he could handle it. I also used the food stick to help lure attention and would sometimes go back to it if I mis-judged his ability at a particular training site. Never felt it was a problem, as he was able to wean quickly back off the stick.


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## RedDogs (Jan 30, 2010)

We do something similar... "adventure walks." We'll go into town and just walk around. He's on his mushing harness, so some pulling isn't a big deal and isn't ruining our LLW or our heeling. If he DOES offer attention at ANY point I'll feed and/or start playing. 

Prior to this, we would do nice walking or heeling, and start out close to the car, only going further when he was doing well... really careful training. But it was frustrating and not progressing as fast as I expected. We do NOT live in town and I've never taken him as much as we should. He's used to free running in safe areas here, which is great, but completely different than the people/dogs/smells of town. 

On our first adventure walk, once around the block, no attention. Second lap, he had 2 times of attention and a bit of play. third time he was attentive a whole block and we played with a stick he picked up. Fourth time, all around attentive and wild-fun. We jumped up onto a public building porch, down, off and tug. Up. Down. Tug. It was great. We kept it up, 5x a week for a while, it made a HUGE difference.

I got the idea after a neuro-something class I was in.... my understanding was all of the little things were new and exciting and firing the neurons... but with some habituation/casual exposure, he would be less set-off by things because of being exposed. And it seemed to work very well.

I wanted to be able to do the 20 min 2x a day recommended by behavior professionals...but I just couldn't make it happen given how far away we live. What we were doing seemed to make a difference. I elected to walk rather than sit still because I thought we would be able to see more AND be less stressed. If we were in one spot there would be a high chance of barking at some point and I don't want to let him practice that or be that frustrated. 

Unfortunately when we had the periods of 0* weather I kinda lost track and we haven't been out as much. And it shows!

I don't know how this would actually compare to a well executed gradual-introduction-of-distractions (which we DO use in training set ups!) or a premack setting. I'm wimpy and while I recognize that premack does/should/is useful... It's not something I'm good at using or comfortable doing. I really should spend more time developing my skills there.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

There is a college campus I took her to and it is full of sensory overload--students on bikes, skateboards, some with rolling backpacks, squirrels chasing each other. She was VERY excited, and would not stop shaking. The plan is to go there a couple times a week, park myself somewhere and pull out a book and ignore her. Let her watch what's going on until she decides it's no big deal, settles down and even falls asleep. Then take her home. 

I have taught attention, and I do take her to the park and train with good results but it is a quiet park. I try not to use too much food in my training, but will initially teaching something or if I am doing repetition. 

I'd really like to push her so that I can show her at least by next spring when she turns three. The major challenge I have is her distractability so I have to deal with that. She can do everything--but she has a hard time when she thinks the world is full of very fun and interesting things. O.O


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

GoldenSail said:


> The goal being that the last thing she remembers is how boring everything else is, but how fun I am. What do you think?


I think the part I'm stuck on is that the dog is supposed to "remember" that the environment is boring and you are fun. To me, that's expecting the dog to think like a human.

If you sit and do nothing, you are attempting to habitualize her to the environment. My concern is that habitualization alone is going to be environment-specific and you'll need to repeat the process in several locations. To me, adding the ability to reinforce what you want (attention to you) would greatly speed up the process, and you'd be teaching her that attention, even in novel, interesting locations, pays better than defaulting to the environment.

Definitely keep notes of some sort to follow your progress. I'd love to hear how it goes.


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## Loisiana (Jul 29, 2009)

I think some things can be generalized to a point with most dogs. If you take a dog that's not used to being around other dogs too much it might go a little beserk if you put it in a room full of other dogs. But if you start bringing it to places full of dogs often enough many dogs will learn that being surrounded by a room full of dogs isn't that big of a deal. It wouldn't have to be the same room with the same dogs every time. (Of course some dogs have "issues" and need more work in order to overcome them, so that is why I said many dogs).

Of course you can't prepare for everything, and that's when a strong attention program is important. (Like the time we had a homecoming parade full of marching bands go right by our obedience trial!). I think the two work well together - get the dog used to as much as possible, and have them learn to ignore those things you haven't prepared for that the dog might find interesting.

For me the important point I try to get across to the dogs is that as long as we are working, they should be paying attention to me and not what is going on around them. But if we are not training they are free to look around and soak up the atmosphere as much as they like.


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## sammydog (Aug 23, 2008)

FlyingQuizini said:


> I would free-shape attention in those areas. Don't lure with food, but wait and ANYTIME she so much as looks at you, click and treat. Keep some notes. Sit relaxed at a table with 10 treats out. Notice how long it takes you to get 10 offered head-turns your direction. Over several sessions, it should take noticeably less time.
> 
> So... you've taught attention, but haven't been able to practice much around distractions?


I used this with Mira when we got ready for the National. We started in the backyard (easy). I did reward with food. Then we built up duration, look at me for 5 seconds, reward, built up to 30 seconds of her looking at me (sitting at heel) then moved to the front yard, then to the park, then to inside Home Depot or the pet store. I am sure we looked absurd just standing in the middle of the store with her looking at me, but it really seemed to help her understand wherever we go she should pay attention to me. Whenever I moved to a new location I shorten the time up and built up again. Then we worked on heeling, pivots, etc etc... But my main thing was just building the focus.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

I have trained her in Home Depot and at pet stores and she does reasonably well, those distractions aren't as bad as a busy college campus. I may use food, but I don't want to use it anymore than I need it--for reasons previously stated. Also, while she is a food motivated dog she is not overly so. As I type she has a cup of food sitting in her bowl that she is not eating. *sigh* My dog will never be fat  She went through this hunger/growth stage and I was feeding her four cups a day. She is out of it now and I am trying to scale back so that she'll eat when food is presented to her again....

As far as walking around the distractions--I have thought of this but I think it is too active at first. I want her to settle and walking around is not settling her, it's making her more excited. I may walk her around and will do some training after she gets a little used to the environment. 

When I get to a point where I am showing her I will use the same strategy I am now. Getting her used to and calm around her environment by arriving several hours before.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Also I can work her in that area for very brief, brief periods for play and interaction with me. It's not where I want it or get at other, less exciting parks... I know it will take longer, but I much prefer the motivation coming mainly from that over anything else....


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## cisobe (Feb 22, 2010)

I'm also very interested in your results. Tobey is a very exciteable and distractable dog as well. He has his good days and bad days... Bad days = walking a 65+lbs 16wk old puppy who lunges and pulls for leaves, twigs, people dogs, etc. Lately, it's been a lot more bad days than good.

He seems to be able to focus on other things way more than he can focus on me (i.e. he'll stare down a leaf, or another dog, and just focus on it as I try to pull him away). Sometimes he can barely focus for more than a few seconds on me, than his head is darting all over the place looking at various other things...:doh:


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Well, I got delayed because I was sick but jumped back on the wagon this week. It's actually going well. It didn't take her too long to start to get familiar with the distractions and area and start wanting my attention instead  We have a ways to go yet, but I am going to start bringing other things to work on now too, like her dumbbell. 

I also have discovered a magic bullet--training bumper! It helps as I like to avoid doling out lots of treats, because have experienced some trade-offs with food and attention heeling  I don't have problems with any of the other behaviors, but getting a nice, nice heel is work! I definitely will do better with my next one as I think I rushed Scout through on some things which is my fault more than the not using lots of food (which I did in the beginning).


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Thought I would update. Scout is getting much better--I am tickled! 

I did take a lesson from a different trainer last month. She had me go back and break up attention exercises into smaller pieces and uses the attention stick. I had tried that after buying Janice Gunn's dvds awhile ago, but honestly Scout is generally not food motivated enough to think that staring at food is fun. I get much better results if I use the bumper (which I prefer play as a motivator over food because it is more interactive with me). 

However, there is a distinct problem with the bumper in that it is large and would be difficult to phase out. It is more of a leap to take away the bumper and expect attention than it is to hide food behind an armband in steps. So, we've been using food and better footwork. Things are going pretty well. I worry about using lots of food, so I try to make it a point of praising and playing whenever she earns the food reward. But I feel at this point if I want the heads up the food is giving her something that she knows to look at rather than before where I just had her encouraged to look up but did not designate a spot. I look forward to phasing out the food though!

We've been heeling through crowds of people though--short segments with attention on me. Yay!


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## Loisiana (Jul 29, 2009)

I use food for a long time to pin point a focus area. And unlike many people, I will pull it back out often to remind the dog exactly where their spot is.

Flip's attention seems to be getting better too. Still a long way to go, but he improving.


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