# Jade and toilet issues



## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Over the last couple of months,whatever time I went to bed or got up in the morning (1am bed up 5am or 6/7 am example)I was coming down to jade having messed on her bed she was completely unaware that she had done it.
It wasn't an issue as beds can be hosed but we were very worried as it was so unlike her.

2 weeks ago Garry had to take Honey for her monthly Cartrophen injections and mentioned it to the vet.

Now this is where I feel such a bad mum and should have realised (for gods sake I have had dogs for 28 years)as had noticed that she was a bit stiff getting up but put it down to the fact that she was lying down for 6 hours in the day and all night. 
The vet suggested that it maybe arthritis in her back end,and the pain was blocking her nervous system therefore unable to control her bowel,and suggested we put her on Metacam (I am not a fan of Metacam as my gsp hemorrhaged on it when combined with another drug)but due to Jades age we felt it was the best option.
Now for the good news Jade has not had a toilet accident in 2 weeks and even managed to chase a cat (that is a no no here but was a joy to see)
But as you can imagine I am very upset that I didn't see the signs of her pain before.


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## Doodle (Apr 6, 2009)

Wow that's interesting. Thanks for sharing so that others will know to watch for something like that. Don't beat yourself up though. Sometimes we're just too close and we don't see things that maybe we think we should have...like not seeing the forest through the trees. Hind sight is always 20/20.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Dogs don't show pain in ways we can easily recognize, it's easy to miss. I wonder all the time what Daisy is really feeling.

YAY for Jade! I was watching 7 Pounds the other night (movie) and there was a great dane in it (Duke). They live only on average of 7 years ... Jade is more than 10 now? Wow, she's in a league all her own 

Thanks for PMing me, Tracey. You know I always want to know right away about Jade, thank you for understanding 

I hope she continues to feel better, and how wonderful for you that you are able to help her with this.


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## Oaklys Dad (Dec 28, 2005)

Glad to hear that Jade was diagnosed and is doing much better. Don't beat yourself up over not figuring it out sooner.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Oh, and how possibly could a bad mum take a great dane as far as you have taken Jade? She's beating all the odds ... that just doesn't happen without someone watching over with great care :heartbeat


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## Tanyac (Jun 18, 2008)

OMG Tracey, that's such brilliant news! I know how much you worry for Jade, but sometimes a solution is just around the corner as in this case. How fab that she could run up the garden like that!!!

You weren't to know she was in pain, how could you with no outward signs? The dedication love and care you and Gary give to that old girl makes you a 5* owner in my book, no guilt needed as far as i'm concerned!!! Just feel good that if it was because of that shes now more comfortable due to the medication...

Yay, no more potty accidents!!!!

Tanya


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## maggie1951 (Apr 20, 2007)

honeysmum said:


> Over the last couple of months,whatever time I went to bed or got up in the morning (1am bed up 5am or 6/7 am example)I was coming down to jade having messed on her bed she was completely unaware that she had done it.
> It wasn't an issue as beds can be hosed but we were very worried as it was so unlike her.
> 
> 2 weeks ago Garry had to take Honey for her monthly Cartrophen injections and mentioned it to the vet.
> ...


 
We never spot it in our own dogs i think because we are with them 24/7 and like you i am not a fan of metacam but i gave it to Meg because of her age and it did her good as well.
I am glad Jade is feeling better and can do what Charlie loves doing chasing cats.


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## twinny41 (Feb 13, 2008)

Just found this post and glad to hear Metacam has been effective. I dont like to give any drugs if it can be avoided but as I tell reluctant patients, sometimes it's neccessary. Meg had metacam for at least 5 years and it helped her. I was always a bit worried about kidney damage but she lived to 15 yrs, and without it where would she have been? What drug did Nybble have in combination?
By the way I agree with others. Dogs are very good at not displaying pain as they are not aware there is a treatment so they put up with it! Also, as others have said the fact that Jade is now a grand old lady is testament to what a wonderful Mum you are.


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Patsy I would need to go through Nybbles insurance form to find the other medication.

I am worried about kidney damage I follow her out every morning to check the colour of her wee have been doing that for about 6 months,but am going to take a sample to the vets now on a monthly basis, that is a fiasco I run up behind her and as she squats I put a container under her at which point she tries to walk off usually peeing over my hand:doh:

The other thing I meant to say on my first post is that before Jade looked very ribby sp? which we put down to her age but since she has been out of pain there is not a rib in sight so she was obviously tucking up due to the pain, that is what is making me feel so bad.
But thank you all for your kind words.


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## rictic (Feb 16, 2009)

hey jade well done girl.

at least you spotted it tracy. and jade can sleep in comfort and not have the pain.


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## Faith's mommy (Feb 26, 2007)

glad to hear she's doing better. please post more pictures of that sweet girl.


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## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

It's hard to tell when they are feeling bad or hurting.
I'm glad Jade is doing and feeling better.


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Jade is back to the vets tomorrow.

I had a fantastic time today visiting Izzys pups they are just beautiful, and Izzy was amazing.
But got back home and Jade has not had a good day she had urinated in her sleep 4 times and then one more time when I got home, the vet did phone earlier in the week to say a little protein in her urine and it maybe a good idea to take her in for a blood sample,as may indicate the start of Kidney failure,in which case Metacam would not be the right medication for her.
I asked at the time if there was anything else they could prescribe and they said yes but not as effective in pain relief,what makes it so hard is that she has been amazing since on the Metacam.
So what do we do, Metacam no pain and Kidney failure or go with a lesser effective drug for longer.

Its okay I dont need answers to this I know what we will do I just needed to post.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

What are you going to do, Tracey?

I'm worried about Jade now  I don't like to think about kidney failure. I know Jade is way up there now. I'm expecting bad news any day, as I'm sure you are too. 

I'm just worried :heartbeat


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## Tanyac (Jun 18, 2008)

I don't know what to say Tracey, other than my thoughts will be with you and Gary for your visit to the vet tomorrow with Jade. I'll be praying HARD that the vets can sort her issues out... poor girl!!!

Take care, and keep us up to date with how she's doing.


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## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

I hope the vet has some answers for you for the kidney problems and the pain. We will say a prayer for you.


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Thank you everyone,

Jade has been to the vet we couldn't take her earlier as they wanted her not to have eaten for 6/8 hours.
They have taken blood tests and we will get the results on Monday,for now we know it could be one of three things UTI but seems unlikely as that would have shown up in her urine sample, Urethra Sphincter incompetence or the start of Kidney failure.

We have started Jade on a course of Clavaseptin which will help if she has USI quite often this condition happens in older dogs (by no means all the time)when a bitch is spayed before a first season,as Jade was (it can be due to the fact that the vulva doesn't develop to the right size (Jades is very small)
and the muscles don't develop as strongly so therefore lose of control.

Obviously are worst fear is that it is her Kidneys, for the time being she is staying on the Metacam,it will be maximum benefit after one Month at which time we can start to reduce the dose but is will still give the same benefit.

We are having several other tests on her blood,to cover most if not all her organs, as we feel that is the best we can do for her.

I am hoping it is USI as it can be treated to a point and can just put blankets on floors in her favorite rooms.

Sorry for the long post with my manic ramblings.

Thank you for your support and will update on Monday when the results are in.


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## Tanyac (Jun 18, 2008)

Hi Tracey, just sent you a PM then found your posting here. It looks like you've got a long weekend ahead I don't suppose they were going to get a diagnosis today, and that tests would have to be run which take some time.

I'll keep my fingers crossed for you and Gary (and Jade & Honey of course) that its something which can be fixed.

Take care, thinking of you all.
Tanya


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

The fly in the ointment think Garry is flying back to Idaho on Sunday wont know until tomorrow (it a bugger booking flights such short notice)so will have to give him the results over the phone.


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Bumping up for you guys that have given support but not read the latest.:wave:


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I'm hoping for the USI option too. The kidney failure idea scares me.

You are hardly manic ... of course what you feel inside doesn't always come through in words, I know that well. 

We'll wait until Monday. Will you know then if it's the USI or (please please no) kidney failure? I'll be looking for an update.

And I always say a prayer for Jade, and you Tracey too :heartbeat


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## rictic (Feb 16, 2009)

sure hope it turns out not to be kidneys tracey.


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## davebeech (Feb 11, 2006)

only just found out about Jade, fingers crossed for good results !! we'll be thinking of you


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## goldensmum (Oct 23, 2007)

Bloody hell - only just found this , so sorry that you are having to face this nightmare. Hope and Pray that it is not kidney failure and is just (if there is such a thing, but you know what i mean) incontinence or an infection that can be treated.

Sending hugs and best wishes for Jade and you and Garry


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Thank you everyone for your good wishes for Jade I know she cant go on forever but after last year when we called the vet to the house 3 times in one day as she couldn't get up so said on 3rd visit to come and pts then she saw him and practically ran off, then on 18 Nov her Bloat surgery for 4 hours you start to think they are invincible, which of course she isn't.

If it is Kidney failure we will deal with it, as long as she is not in pain we will Carry on (which is why I want to keep her on the Metacam if poss)but I wont see her in pain and keep her going for my selfish reasons that would be a betrayal to her.

Anyway lets see what tomorrow brings.


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## twinny41 (Feb 13, 2008)

Thinking of you all and hoping the news is good.


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## mist (Jun 23, 2007)

Tracey, I'm sorry only just found this, hugs, fingers and paws crossed,

love and Ollie kisses 
tracey & the furries


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## maggie1951 (Apr 20, 2007)

Hugs for Jade and you


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

It's tomorrow.

Thinking of you Tracey, and Jade too.


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

I just phoned the Vets and the results are not back yet, they said as it was Friday when they were done they may not be back until Tuesday or even Wednesday, so why the hell did they say it would be Today
I am a little annoyed to say the least.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Dammit. Okay, we'll just wait another day, or two ... waiting is the worst


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## goldensmum (Oct 23, 2007)

I would be annoyed too and with just cause - sending a few more hugs your way


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## Tanyac (Jun 18, 2008)

Bu**er, **** and blast!!!!!!!!

Tracey you know where I am if you need a chat

Give those vets a kick up the backside and tell them how upset you are with this!! Maybe they could hurry it along a bit... (maybe the receptionist forgot it was the weekend??).


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Hannah the vet just phoned, she had the results sent straight to her.

NOT any major concerns with her Kidneys so Jade can stay on the Metacam for her Arthritis in her back, but in my relief of hearing that I didn't ask if it is USI so need to phone back.

However there is something wrong her Globulin is increased, to find out what it is they need more blood and urine.
she has said it could be a couple of things, it could be a bacterial infection in her blood or one of various Cancers multiple myeloma is one form that is only found in older dogs, but could be another form, from one nightmare to another.

Jade is quite happy in herself.
Believe me I am not as calm as this message sounds.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Heavy sigh ... this is what it's like to have an older dog. And Jade is so beyond her breed's average lifespan already. She is a grand matriarch :heartbeat

Yes, one nightmare to the next. Always wondering what's lurking, what's around the next corner. 

Big hugs to you, Tracey. I do understand where you're at.


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

I cant stop crying, I just don't know what to do for the best,at the moment Jade is free from pain and happy.

If we go ahead and have the other tests,and it is not a bacterial infection in her blood (only further tests will show) but is multiple myeloma do we put her through the chemotherapy tablets at her age, I don't know the side affects but think there must be side affects.
If it is some other form of Cancer they would need to scan would she survive the anesthetic and if she did and they found something it would probably take us back to the same conclusion of 1st October 2007 with Nybble I just don't think I could cope with that again.

If Jade is free from pain is it wrong for me to let nature take its course. And not give her all the stress of treatment that has no guarantees,just for my selfishness .


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## perdie (Oct 30, 2008)

Oh Tracy Im really sorry you&Jade are going through all this, what a difficult &upsetting predicament. Ive already said before you're really brave, I cry just reading this post and you are no way a bad mum! You're the best ever&have always given me great advice &comfort when ive been at my wits end with Jamie. You will make the best decision for Jade. Lotsa love&kisses to you&Jade. xxx


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## Ruby'smom (Feb 4, 2008)

I dont know what to say Tracey 
so I am sending you a hug and hope it helps a little


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I don't think it's wrong at all, Tracey. Jade has already outlived all expectations and averages for her breed. Do you think she's going into a general winding down stage?  Like you said, the stress of the treatments might be too much for her at her age -- I understand you wanting to spare her that, especially at her age and with no guarantees. But let's not go there until we know, k?

Today Jade is pain free, she is her beautiful old happy self :heartbeat Today is good for Jade. 

{{{hugs}}}


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## davebeech (Feb 11, 2006)

I wish I could offer some words of comfort for you, we're all here for you and Jade no matter what.


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Shona, Steph, Jo (will call soon), and Dave thank you for your kind thoughts and words they are much appriciated.
Will give myself a much needed kick up the bum to get my self in gear and stop being so selfish and feeling sorry for myself.
To all that have repliyed thank you it has been a thread of 2 parts so a little confusing (bit like me really)need to get a grip with threads but thank you all.


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## twinny41 (Feb 13, 2008)

Tracey, so sorry to hear of what might be. 'Might' being the key word here. Positive thoughts that the outcome is not as bad as you fear. Jade is once again very much in my prayers x.


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## maggie1951 (Apr 20, 2007)

honeysmum said:


> Shona, Steph, Jo (will call soon), and Dave thank you for your kind thoughts and words they are much appriciated.
> Will give myself a much needed kick up the bum to get my self in gear and stop being so selfish and feeling sorry for myself.
> To all that have repliyed thank you it has been a thread of 2 parts so a little confusing (bit like me really)need to get a grip with threads but thank you all.


Tracey how could you say your confusing :uhoh: lol


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## goldensmum (Oct 23, 2007)

Tracey - sorry the news wasn't totally positive, but as Patsy says the word is might. The thing with the bloody cancer word is as soon as we hear it our minds either shut down or go into overdrive. The only people who can ultimately make any decisions are you and Garry and Damien - having said that if I were in the same position I would probably get the blood/urine tests done and see what the results of that are, and only then can you realistically think about future treatment or not. I don't think it would be selfish of you to let nature takes it's course if you decided against treatment - it would only be selfish if you put Jade through treatment that would ultimately not help her. (hope that makes sense). I'm sure your vet would also be able to guide you.

Whatever you decide, you know that you have our love and support. You have made the right decisions for Jade from the day you got her, and I don't think that will change now.

Sending hugs for you all


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Have called the vets and Hannah who has been treating Jade is doing home visits on Thursday so she is coming here to do some more blood tests (I unfortunately am the one that will be chasing her up the garden to get a sample) oh well they do say urine is good for the skin.:uhoh:

At least we will know what is going on and can then make an informed decision but now I am hoping it is a Bacterial blood infection (never thought I would say that) as I would think antibiotics will sort that. 

It is so strange to be posting all this as Jade is doing great and has even put on more weight she is back to 65kg.

Anyway thank you all for your continued support


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## maggie1951 (Apr 20, 2007)

fingers crossed that its Bacterial infection :crossfing


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## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

Keeping positive thoughts for it to be a bacterial infection. Hugs to you and Jade.


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Hi everyone,

Vet came and took more blood Jade took one look at her and ran off up the garden,
but bless she came back when I called her.
I managed to get a urine sample this morning but she is getting wise so had to wait until she was mid stream and run up behind her and shove it under her,I was under the impression she thought I stole her dignity.

Results wont be back until some time next week as they need to send them off this time.

I asked if she had USI and she said yes its all connected to the arthritis in the spine same as the bowel issue, thought she did have as off the Clavaseptin for 24 hours and was back to square one.

What has me confused is I asked if a bacterial infection in her blood could be treated with Antibiotics and she said its unlikely to be that,so why did she say that on the phone I wrote everything down as she was speaking.
Anyway wont know until next week, nothing I can do about that.
Thank you all for your continued support.


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## rictic (Feb 16, 2009)

the worst is not knowing hun.

at least if you knew you could do whatever you need to do.

good thoughts for jade.


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## goldensmum (Oct 23, 2007)

Waiting is always the hardest part - poor Jade's dignity has been well and truly offended - hugs on their way


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Thank you both, nothing I can do but wait I did feel bad about having the vet coming here,as she should feel no anxiety here so it felt like I had betrayed her,(sounds daft I know) they have before but that is when she has been ill and I know things are not right but she has been doing great, last night we were playing in the garden,and I was gob smacked as she was really interacting and running at me (Jade run)then had front paws down bum up tail wagging how can she be ill.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Confusion and waiting  We're here with you, Tracey.

BUT, Jade is having good moments, I'm really happy about that


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

I am confused also, thank you for your support, I don't feel in a great place just now,but I do appreciate all the support. 
What will be will be a thousand wishes wont alter her results,so I move on and forget any negative thoughts until I hear next week.
You guys rock thank you.


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## davebeech (Feb 11, 2006)

regardless of the vet, it's nice to hear that Jade was so perky...........Keep it up Jade !!!


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## Tanyac (Jun 18, 2008)

Sorry Tracey I only just picked up on the news now, but I thought it might be some time before the results were in, but agonies for you in the meantime. That's why this forum and the friends we meet here help us to realise we don't have to face things all alone, with nobody to talk to.

So we'll all wait, and hope for a good outcome on this one Tracey, but in the meantime, just enjoy every day you have with Jade, it made me smile that she has been playing with you, that's so lovely to hear. Jade is a very special girl and I know you love her very much!

You are such a good support to others Tracey, time to let others give you a little of that support in return.

Take care, will be thinking about you and Jade and Honey. Will give you a call over the weekend.
Tanya


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## Finn's Fan (Dec 22, 2007)

Tracey, wishing that Jade's troubles are easily treated and quickly resolved.


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## perdie (Oct 30, 2008)

I cant imagine what a great dane with its bum in the air looks like!LOL also cant imagine trying to catch wee mid-stream oo-er! 
We're all sending good thoughts&hugs your way Tracy, hoping for the best for you all. Like Dave said its great to hear Jade is so perky&having fun like the over grown pup she is  lotsa love xxx


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## goldensmum (Oct 23, 2007)

Jade must be feeling pretty perky down to do the head down, bum up - and that's what's important. Think you need to start walking round with camera/phone at the ready to grab these moments.

More hugs and best wishes on their way


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## rictic (Feb 16, 2009)

jade baby, i wanna see a pic of you with your bum in the air.

i bet it's higher than most dogs heads lol.

tracey, i truly hope all ends well with jade hun.

pray it's nothing too serious.


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## twinny41 (Feb 13, 2008)

Any news on Jade? Keeping everything crossed for good news. X


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

No news yet Patsy, thank you for asking,as they had to send the new samples away it takes longer, they were sent off last Thursday so hoping I will get a call
either this afternoon or Tomorrow.
Jade is doing great in herself thank goodness,and since she has been on the medicine and tablets no accidents, apart from when I was at Tanya's but back on tablets she has been fine, for a month or more.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I'm glad Jade is doing well, that's good to hear


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## honeysmum (Dec 4, 2007)

Vet just phoned with Jades results she is absolutely fine no sign of Cancer or anything else nasty.

They put the abnormalities down to an acute infection,which has now cleared up as she has been on antibiotics.

She has been doing so well I kept on saying to myself she couldn't possibly be ill, and thank god I was right. 

How stupid am I put the phone down and burst into tears.

Thank you everyone for all your good wishes and support.


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## Ruby'smom (Feb 4, 2008)

WoooHooo all our prayers and well wishes have worked their magic once again 
great news and come on after all this waiting and worrying you are well within your rights to have a good cry


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## maggie1951 (Apr 20, 2007)

Thats just fantasic news tracey i would have done the same as you burst into tears with relief


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## goldensmum (Oct 23, 2007)

Fantastic News - don't know about you crying but I've got a blooming big lump in my throat. So pleased for you and Jade


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