# Thoughts on $4,500 Golden Retriever Puppies?



## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

Hello!

I have a list of what seems to be reputable breeders from my perusing of the threads on here. Generally it seems that the golden retriever puppies from these breeders (ones that indicate prices on their websites) range from $2,000 to $3,000.

But then there is Sunnyside Goldens who prices their GR puppies at $4,500.

AKC GOLDEN RETRIEVERS | SUNNYSIDE GOLDENS

I am not saying by no means their puppies should be worth less, but I’d just like your thoughts on puppies that are priced a lot more than puppies from known breeders (such as Delmarva, puppies are $3,000). Sunnyside Goldens seems a little more “new” too.

Litters

Or do you think this is due to the increased demands of having a puppy during the pandemic?

What’s a reasonable price for a GR puppy? How about the most you would pay for a quality and healthy one?

Not looking for arguments or judgements here! Just your personal thoughts.


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## Brave (Oct 26, 2012)

Right off the bat, Sunnyside shows they are breeding not just Goldens but also doodles. That is a hard pass for me. 

In addition to that, they appear to only be breeding their girls to their own boys; which while I wouldn't say it's unheard of, it's definitely suspicious because of all the dogs in the world... what are the odds that your boy is the best choice for all three of your girls? 

These are the 2021 breeding plans for their Goldens...
Out of Lincoln
-Rose
-Sunny
-Stella
-Luna
-Scarlett
-Cleopatra

Plus 2 other litters (Lhotse x Pedro and Reign x Mateo)

There are zero registered names on this site. Nor links to their clearances (not even any mention of clearances). I will try to dig up more info if I have the time today but this for me is a hard pass. You can do so much better for much less than $4500.


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## Maggie'sVoice (Apr 4, 2018)

4500? My thoughts? hahahahahaha at that breeder. My guess would be no clearances and naked the price because of COVID. But, even with clearances, that's an INSANE amount of money for a puppy.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

Brave said:


> Right off the bat, Sunnyside shows they are breeding not just Goldens but also doodles. That is a hard pass for me.
> 
> In addition to that, they appear to only be breeding their girls to their own boys; which while I wouldn't say it's unheard of, it's definitely suspicious because of all the dogs in the world... what are the odds that your boy is the best choice for all three of your girls?
> 
> ...


Learned so much from your response, thank you SO much! They’re so popular but that’s probably because they market their business pretty well on social media. I trust your advice only because you made so many good points, definitely removing them from my list now. Appreciate your help!


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

Maggie'sVoice said:


> 4500? My thoughts? hahahahahaha at that breeder. My guess would be no clearances and naked the price because of COVID. But, even with clearances, that's an INSANE amount of money for a puppy.


Gosh thank you so much! I thought $4,500k was a lot for a puppy but I’m new so I didn’t really know if I was overthinking it. Glad to know I’m not the only one who thinks that’s a lot!


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## nolefan (Nov 6, 2009)

Over 20 dogs on their site and 15 litters planned between now and summer. How many dogs live in the house with them as pets and how many are living out in kennels full time? Lots of working dogs live in kennels, but typically they have daily training and exercise and work with people - If these dogs are kept purely as breeding stock, what kind of life do they really have? I have to wonder where 15 litters of puppies are raised, in the house? Or out in a kennel? What is the protocol for raising them? 

There are clearances claimed for a few of the dogs but no registered names available to research them. No links of any kind. The people have figured out how to farm puppies successfully and are making a killing off of the dogs they produce. Not a setup I'd care to support.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

THIS IS NOT THE REAL SUNNYSIDE GOLDENS! THESE PEOPLE ARE PIGGYBACKING OFF OF SOMEONE ELSE'S KENNEL NAME! (Yes, I'm yelling..............) Please do not buy a dog from these frauds.


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## Brave (Oct 26, 2012)

ArkansasGold said:


> THIS IS NOT THE REAL SUNNYSIDE GOLDENS! THESE PEOPLE ARE PIGGYBACKING OFF OF SOMEONE ELSE'S KENNEL NAME! (Yes, I'm yelling..............) Please do not buy a dog from these frauds.


Thank you! Because I was looking Sunnyside up on k9data but they had a different website then this one. This is another excellent point. Plus some of their bitches don't look old enough to be producing. And I still couldn't find any clearance info or registered names of any kind. 

OP - fwiw, I just paid $3000 for my girl. She came from health tested parents. $3000 is the high end for my location. Other areas might have reputable litters for less than that. I've seen some reputable breeders in the north east area selling for $1800-$2500 but that was a few years ago. The bottom line is you want registered names so you can verify health clearances on OFA.org. If any breeder isn't willing to provide that information, then it should be a hard pass. 

OFA is super handy in that if all the four core clearances are met, they issue what is called a CHIC number. If that number is there, then the dog is up to date on their clearances. The only clearance I might give wiggle room is the EYES cause they are done annually and I haven't sent mine in yet even though we got them done in November. But if I were a breeder, I'd still have my paperwork on hand to show potential buyers. So just be aware and don't meet puppies until you can verify the clearances on the parents. Cause we all know puppies are cute and you're gonna fall in love the first time you see them.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

nolefan said:


> Over 20 dogs on their site and 15 litters planned between now and summer. How many dogs live in the house with them as pets and how many are living out in kennels full time? Lots of working dogs live in kennels, but typically they have daily training and exercise and work with people - If these dogs are kept purely as breeding stock, what kind of life do they really have? I have to wonder where 15 litters of puppies are raised, in the house? Or out in a kennel? What is the protocol for raising them?
> 
> There are clearances claimed for a few of the dogs but no registered names available to research them. No links of any kind. The people have figured out how to farm puppies successfully and are making a killing off of the dogs they produce. Not a setup I'd care to support.


They’re sneaky! They constantly put updates in their IG stories of them socializing/housebreaking the pups you’d think they’re transparent about how their litters are being raised at first glance. But you make excellent points! Thank you.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

ArkansasGold said:


> THIS IS NOT THE REAL SUNNYSIDE GOLDENS! THESE PEOPLE ARE PIGGYBACKING OFF OF SOMEONE ELSE'S KENNEL NAME! (Yes, I'm yelling..............) Please do not buy a dog from these frauds.


Oh that’s awful  Now I’m definitely going to look into the _real_ Sunnyside Goldens you’re speaking of. Thank you! Your yelling is justified, I am getting a little upset now that they’re charging so much for their puppies after all the points everyone is making on here.


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## Brave (Oct 26, 2012)

chonouie said:


> They’re sneaky! They constantly put updates in their IG stories of them socializing/housebreaking the pups you’d think they’re transparent about how their litters are being raised at first glance. But you make excellent points! Thank you.


TBH - I'm leery of people who are that active on social media. Because it's just marketing. You tag all the cute puppy photos with the popular hashtags and let the people asking for puppies come rolling in. Post often for engagement in the algorithm. That doesn't mean they are actually doing things correctly or following the GRCA COE. Just means they know how to get views and engagement. Goldens are super popular on IG (think the likes of Tucker Budzn). So of course BYBs or mills are gonna use IG to promote their puppies while people are frothing at the mouth over quarantine puppies.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

Brave said:


> Thank you! Because I was looking Sunnyside up on k9data but they had a different website then this one. This is another excellent point. Plus some of their bitches don't look old enough to be producing. And I still couldn't find any clearance info or registered names of any kind.
> 
> OP - fwiw, I just paid $3000 for my girl. She came from health tested parents. $3000 is the high end for my location. Other areas might have reputable litters for less than that. I've seen some reputable breeders in the north east area selling for $1800-$2500 but that was a few years ago. The bottom line is you want registered names so you can verify health clearances on OFA.org. If any breeder isn't willing to provide that information, then it should be a hard pass.
> 
> OFA is super handy in that if all the four core clearances are met, they issue what is called a CHIC number. If that number is there, then the dog is up to date on their clearances. The only clearance I might give wiggle room is the EYES cause they are done annually and I haven't sent mine in yet even though we got them done in November. But if I were a breeder, I'd still have my paperwork on hand to show potential buyers. So just be aware and don't meet puppies until you can verify the clearances on the parents. Cause we all know puppies are cute and you're gonna fall in love the first time you see them.


Thank you! I told myself my budget would be around $2,500...$3,000 at most if I have to. But $4,500 plus an extra $500+ to fly the puppy to you? That was crazy to me!

I’ll start researching more on that website! Appreciate you sharing your honest thoughts and experience!


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

Brave said:


> TBH - I'm leery of people who are that active on social media. Because it's just marketing. You tag all the cute puppy photos with the popular hashtags and let the people asking for puppies come rolling in. Post often for engagement in the algorithm. That doesn't mean they are actually doing things correctly or following the GRCA COE. Just means they know how to get views and engagement. Goldens are super popular on IG (think the likes of Tucker Budzn). So of course BYBs or mills are gonna use IG to promote their puppies while people are frothing at the mouth over quarantine puppies.


Huh, that is such a good point. I never thought of it that way. Makes sense, in the forums I read that reputable breeders wouldn’t need to market their puppies on social media. Good stuff to know, I’m writing that one down!


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

chonouie said:


> Oh that’s awful  Now I’m definitely going to look into the _real_ Sunnyside Goldens you’re speaking of. Thank you! Your yelling is justified, I am getting a little upset now that they’re charging so much for their puppies after all the points everyone is making on here.


The real Sunnyside Goldens are my dear friends and are wonderful, reputable breeders. They follow the GRCA COE, are extremely active in our local club (the daughter is our president, the mom is on the board and is the field chair), and every dog they keep is titled in multiple venues. They have 5 or 6 generations of therapy dogs (some have passed now). 

Unfortunately, they just sent their most recent litter home about 3 weeks ago and I don't think they are planning on another any time soon.


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## SRW (Dec 21, 2018)

chonouie said:


> Not looking for arguments or judgements here! Just your personal thoughts.


My thought is that all breeders of "doodles" are nothing more than puppy mills.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

ArkansasGold said:


> The real Sunnyside Goldens are my dear friends and are wonderful, reputable breeders. They follow the GRCA COE, are extremely active in our local club (the daughter is our president, the mom is on the board and is the field chair), and every dog they keep is titled in multiple venues. They have 5 or 6 generations of therapy dogs (some have passed now).
> 
> Unfortunately, they just sent their most recent litter home about 3 weeks ago and I don't think they are planning on another any time soon.


Do you have a link to their website? I’m in absolutely no rush to get a puppy right now, but I still definitely want to look into them!


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

The Elliotts? 
It's my pet peeve- I hate it when people steal a kennel name, especially one who does clearances and titles their dogs- and then start using the work those folks did to build their own inadequate program. 
I wish they would have reg their kennel name w AKC. What this sort of person does is stealing, nothing less. And if someone will steal they will also lie. Rogues and thieves.


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## SRW (Dec 21, 2018)

I'll say it again. The AKC could prevent many of the issues discussed in this and similar threads.
Like many breeders, the AKC seems more motivated by money than the betterment of any breed.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

And you would be right- of course- but that'd mean they would have to step beyond being a registry. 
I wish it were not so expensive to reg a kennel name. But that'd keep the new and crappy out of the game, qualifying to register one's kennel name has real rules involved.


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## stsmark (Feb 1, 2020)

I looked on their site and the pups from Reign and Mateo are 5,000.00!


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

stsmark said:


> I looked on their site and the pups from Reign and Mateo are 5,000.00!


Oh wow, I didn’t even realize they had anything more than $4,500! It seems they can up their prices only because people are actually buying from them.


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## SRW (Dec 21, 2018)

Prism Goldens said:


> And you would be right- of course- but that'd mean they would have to step beyond being a registry.








American Kennel Club


The AKC is the recognized and trusted expert in breed, health and training information for dogs.




www.akc.org




From web site it appears that the AKC goes far beyond being just a registry.


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## livduse (Dec 14, 2019)

No!!! Stay away! They also breed doodles which means they don’t care at all about preserving the breed. Their goldens also do not resemble standard at all. They don’t do clearances or participate in AKC events. They are definitely a puppy mill. My boy is from one of the top show breeders in the nation and he was $3000. I’d be happy to put you in contact with them.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

livduse said:


> No!!! Stay away! They also breed doodles which means they don’t care at all about preserving the breed. Their goldens also do not resemble standard at all. They don’t do clearances or participate in AKC events. They are definitely a puppy mill. My boy is from one of the top show breeders in the nation and he was $3000. I’d be happy to put you in contact with them.


Crazy how they’re selling their puppies for $5,000 while top show breeders are humbly pricing theirs at $3,000! Yes please I’d love to inquire more information from where you got your boy! I also want a boy golden hehe.


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## livduse (Dec 14, 2019)

chonouie said:


> Crazy how they’re selling their puppies for $5,000 while top show breeders are humbly pricing theirs at $3,000! Yes please I’d love to inquire more information from where you got your boy! I also want a boy golden hehe.


I know right! Some breeders are so unethical. I got my boy from leongolden kennels in Wellington, Florida. They don’t update their website much, but they’re active on Facebook. I also like Nautilus goldens and goldrox goldens.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

livduse said:


> I know right! Some breeders are so unethical. I got my boy from leongolden kennels in Wellington, Florida. They don’t update their website much, but they’re active on Facebook. I also like Nautilus goldens and goldrox goldens.


Wonderful, I’ll definitely check them out thank you!


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## livduse (Dec 14, 2019)

chonouie said:


> Wonderful, I’ll definitely check them out thank you!


Let me know if you have any questions or need help contacting them. They truly are the best golden breeders I’ve come across.😊


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

livduse said:


> Let me know if you have any questions or need help contacting them. They truly are the best golden breeders I’ve come across.😊


Oh wow!! Thank you so much I appreciate that 🥺 I’ll look into them soon and will definitely let you know if I’ll need assistance!


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## SoCalEngr (Apr 11, 2020)

I live in SoCal, and feel like we paid at the top of the "going rate" for our golden.

And?

I'm looking at $4,500 and thinking "that seems a bit much". Mind you, if that had been the market rate in SoCal, we'd have paid it. But...

I will note that we were looking at "comfort retrievers", in large part because of the size (25lb-to-40lb vice 60lb-and-up). These dogs came with $6K-and-up pricing. I'm sure there's a buyer for every price (or else, the prices wouldn't be where they are), but I'm okay letting others buy those puppies.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Prism Goldens said:


> The Elliotts?
> It's my pet peeve- I hate it when people steal a kennel name, especially one who does clearances and titles their dogs- and then start using the work those folks did to build their own inadequate program.
> I wish they would have reg their kennel name w AKC. What this sort of person does is stealing, nothing less. And if someone will steal they will also lie. Rogues and thieves.


Yes, although Karen has remarried since Mike died. She told me that they have tried to register the kennel name multiple times over the years and have been denied because it’s a “common word” or some such BS. You would have to ask her as I’m a little fuzzy on the details since I get them second hand, but I’m under the impression that they have fought against these people using the name for a very long time. 

Rogues and thieves indeed.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

They've changed that- btw- any common word isn't auto tossed out now. I think AKC changed that about 5 years ago, I got denied a few years ago for that same reason- prism is a real word, too. But as soon as I saw in the minutes they'd changed that, I reapplied and got it. 
I didn't realize he'd died.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Prism Goldens said:


> They've changed that- btw- any common word isn't auto tossed out now. I think AKC changed that about 5 years ago, I got denied a few years ago for that same reason- prism is a real word, too. But as soon as I saw in the minutes they'd changed that, I reapplied and got it.
> I didn't realize he'd died.


I will tell her that next time I see her!


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

chonouie said:


> Do you have a link to their website? I’m in absolutely no rush to get a puppy right now, but I still definitely want to look into them!


Here is a link to the website: Welcome 

They don’t post litters on there, so I don’t think I’m breaking any rules. If this post gets edited, I will PM you the link.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

ArkansasGold said:


> Here is a link to the website: Welcome
> 
> They don’t post litters on there, so I don’t think I’m breaking any rules. If this post gets edited, I will PM you the link.


Wow they have absolutely stunning Goldens. Thank you again, appreciate it.


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## Nova Golden Dream (Oct 26, 2020)

There are two issues, I wouldn't buy a puppy from this breeder. 

But I have no issue with breeders charging whatever the market will support. A good breeder won't use price as the only differentiator between buyers. The demand for puppies has increased faster than the supply.

I personally would spend over $6k for a well-bred puppy from a good breeder if I could get that puppy before Christmas. I would spend $0 on a poorly bred puppy. Unfortunately I just can't find one until 2021.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

Nova Golden Dream said:


> There are two issues, I wouldn't buy a puppy from this breeder.
> 
> But I have no issue with breeders charging whatever the market will support. A good breeder won't use price as the only differentiator between buyers. The demand for puppies has increased faster than the supply.
> 
> I personally would spend over $6k for a well-bred puppy from a good breeder if I could get that puppy before Christmas. I would spend $0 on a poorly bred puppy. Unfortunately I just can't find one until 2021.


What are the two issues you believe are with this breeder? I personally have taken them off my list but it’s good to know why people wouldn’t want from breeders that way I can learn for things to look out for.

Personally for me in my golden pup search right now getting a puppy before Christmas isn’t my goal. Right now I’m just trying to get on a waiting list and even that part holds difficult with so many people wanting a pup while they’re working from home!

I’d be very interested in knowing how this demand for puppies will be affected once people are called back to the office.


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## gingy (Sep 23, 2020)

chonouie said:


> Hello!
> 
> I have a list of what seems to be reputable breeders from my perusing of the threads on here. Generally it seems that the golden retriever puppies from these breeders (ones that indicate prices on their websites) range from $2,000 to $3,000.
> 
> ...


Our puppy will be 3500$ from the a very reputable breeder in Va -4500$ seems ridiculous except if the a Golden is healthy and leads a reasonably long life they are priceless. Probably raised the price because there is so much demand?


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## Nova Golden Dream (Oct 26, 2020)

chonouie said:


> What are the two issues you believe are with this breeder? I personally have taken them off my list but it’s good to know why people wouldn’t want from breeders that way I can learn for things to look out for.
> 
> Personally for me in my golden pup search right now getting a puppy before Christmas isn’t my goal. Right now I’m just trying to get on a waiting list and even that part holds difficult with so many people wanting a pup while they’re working from home!
> 
> I’d be very interested in knowing how this demand for puppies will be affected once people are called back to the office.


I am going to buy one puppy, and he or she will be my only dog for about ten years. You can't guarantee success, but I want to do everything in my power to give the dog the best start in life and to be the type of dog I want. I spent a lot of time researching dog breeds before deciding on the Golden Retriever. 

This breeder doesn't appear to be selecting breeding pairs based on a verifiable criteria or standard. There is no way to verify that the puppies they sell will have the characteristics that I want. Their decision to breed unrecognized cross breeds shows that they don't value the breed standard. They use key words to suggest they are vetting their breeding pairs against a standard, but provide no actual documentation. 

They are also breeding a lot of dogs. If they had a track record of producing successful dogs, then I would be more inclined to trust that they are giving these dogs needed socialization.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

chonouie said:


> What are the two issues you believe are with this breeder? I personally have taken them off my list but it’s good to know why people wouldn’t want from breeders that way I can learn for things to look out for.
> 
> Personally for me in my golden pup search right now getting a puppy before Christmas isn’t my goal. Right now I’m just trying to get on a waiting list and even that part holds difficult with so many people wanting a pup while they’re working from home!
> 
> I’d be very interested in knowing how this demand for puppies will be affected once people are called back to the office.


I don't think the demand will be all that affected, since good breeders haven't really changed their 'ouput' much.. if anything, many are not making as many puppies as prior to Covid. We have very real worries about how many of these puppies will suffer once they don't have 24/7 company... 
And I can't speak to the issues for that member but I can't imagine anyone wanting one of those puppies - there are SO many things and the least of them is the stealing of a well-established kennel name.


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## Brave (Oct 26, 2012)

Prism Goldens said:


> I don't think the demand will be all that affected, since good breeders haven't really changed their 'ouput' much.. if anything, many are not making as many puppies as prior to Covid. We have very real worries about how many of these puppies will suffer once they don't have 24/7 company...


We're still crate training Molly. My partner works from home due to COVID and I know his work wants him back in the office as soon as it's safe... but like Molly still can't be up and unsupervised while he's focusing on his job. So she's is crated. Are no other WFH ppl doing this with puppies?


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## SoCalEngr (Apr 11, 2020)

Brave said:


> We're still crate training Molly. My partner works from home due to COVID and I know his work wants him back in the office as soon as it's safe... but like Molly still can't be up and unsupervised while he's focusing on his job. So she's is crated. Are no other WFH ppl doing this with puppies?


Right after we brought Kona home, our trainer brought up this concern. So, we have done some work on crate training with Kona.

However, when we're home Kona's typically not crated. She's just over 12 months, but early on took to laying down on tile or cooling pad while we work (i.e., ignore her). At times, she'll come over to say hello, and I try to take a short break to give her some attention (it's also a good practice to break up my work day). She also is scheduled in for "potty walks", etc. But, we've developed a rhythm to our daily routine, and Kona seems to have "_figured it out_".


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

I have two puppies right now- 15 & 16 weeks. And when I am not watching them directly, or they are not out playing in the yard or training or something else that I am attending, they are in crates. I think it is foolish to _trust _a puppy who is as likely to inappropriately put something into his/her mouth as not. Plus that makes for ease as adults when a crate is needed.


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## Brave (Oct 26, 2012)

Molly sat and stared at the outlet WAY too long yesterday. The outlet she's already licked twice that has been artfully covered in bitter apple so she will stop licking it. I don't trust her at all. She would 100% get into mischief. If not licking outlets, then chewing cords, then digging under tables, sofas, chairs, desks; then digging the water out of bowls and throwing the bowls around. She is a tornado wrapped in dopamine activation codes and fuzz.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

do wish we had a 'haha' button...


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## SoCalEngr (Apr 11, 2020)

Prism Goldens said:


> I have two puppies right now- 15 & 16 weeks. And when I am not watching them directly, or they are not out playing in the yard or training or something else that I am attending, they are in crates. I think it is foolish to _trust _a puppy who is as likely to inappropriately put something into his/her mouth as not.





Brave said:


> Molly sat and stared at the outlet WAY too long yesterday. The outlet she's already licked twice that has been artfully covered in bitter apple so she will stop licking it. I don't trust her at all. She would 100% get into mischief. If not licking outlets, then chewing cords, then digging under tables, sofas, chairs, desks; then digging the water out of bowls and throwing the bowls around. She is a tornado wrapped in dopamine activation codes and fuzz.


We did not actually bring Kona home until she was already 20 weeks (met her at 18 weeks). I don't know if it was the result of training at the breeder's, or "good fortune", but we have experienced none of the mischief (however cute in retrospective) that others have described. I will gladly acknowledge that, while we have done our best to work with Kona, most all of her behavior/attitude came "turn key". We just picked it up and carried forward (our trainer said she's very people-oriented and likes to please).

For what it's worth, the fact that the breeder had older puppies available was a definite factor in our decision to move our timeline up a few years.


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## stsmark (Feb 1, 2020)

After SoCal mentioned Comfort Retrievers I looked them up. 7000.00, I can’t believe people pay that for a mix.


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## SoCalEngr (Apr 11, 2020)

stsmark said:


> After SoCal mentioned Comfort Retrievers I looked them up. 7000.00, I can’t believe people pay that for a mix.


I would agree...if the discussion was strictly about 1st generation offspring and the inherent uncertainty about genetics and characteristics. But...

Golden retrievers started as a mix. The line, however, has been sufficiently stable that genetics, appearance, and temperament are very predictable. But, none-the-less, that wasn't always the case.

Somewhere down the line, the same may be said for "comfort retrievers". The notion of a "golden retriever" in a 30lb package was very appealing to us. And, I would like to believe that there may actually be a concerted effort to get to a line where, like the golden, the "breed characteristics" become predictable and repeatable. But, as has been observed in other discussions, this involves both time and the willingness to kill offspring that don't measure up to the desired outcome. The first is difficult, but doable. The second? Not really, anymore.

With that said, we seriously considered that price. But, the reality was that (a) the effort is not mature enough yet to predictably produce results, (b) too many are just jumping onboard the doodle-wagon, and first/second generation offspring do not represent the level-of-effort that should be rewarded with the prices being asked, and (c) right now, there's nothing "as golden" as "a golden".


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

The difference in a doodle being a mix and a comfort (Cocker X Golden ) being a mix and the original mixing that made Goldens is that there was one kennelmaster- he kept immaculate records- they ran on all the offspring until generations later we had a true breed. No one is doing that w doodles or cocker mixes. It would be impossible without a diligent kennelmaster, and many many dogs. The people doing the mixes today are willy-nilly mixing the least of the original breeds (because no one would allow a good safe bloodline to take part in this foolishness) and no understanding of genetics except for use of buzzwords, as well as no way to run on all the offspring.


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## Brave (Oct 26, 2012)

Prism Goldens said:


> The difference in a doodle being a mix and a comfort (Cocker X Golden ) being a mix and the original mixing that made Goldens is that there was one kennelmaster- he kept immaculate records- they ran on all the offspring until generations later we had a true breed. No one is doing that w doodles or cocker mixes. It would be impossible without a diligent kennelmaster, and many many dogs. The people doing the mixes today are willy-nilly mixing the least of the original breeds (because no one would allow a good safe bloodline to take part in this foolishness) and no understanding of genetics except for use of buzzwords, as well as no way to run on all the offspring.


except for the Dalmatians.  But that wasn't considered a mix, they did a specific outcrossing to get rid of a specific gene that caused an issue then they brought that outcross back into the fold and after a bunch of time passed the AKC registered any with that outcross as purebreds still.


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## SoCalEngr (Apr 11, 2020)

Prism Goldens said:


> The difference in a doodle being a mix and a comfort (Cocker X Golden ) being a mix and the original mixing that made Goldens is that there was one kennelmaster- he kept immaculate records- they ran on all the offspring until generations later we had a true breed.


Agreed. With respect to the "comfort retriever", I did as much Google-foo as I could on the breeder that trademarked that name. I thought there was some "goodness" there (it could be all smoke-and-mirrors, but it sounded like there was a plan being followed), but it just (a) needed more time, and (b) wasn't on a scale that would move towards sooner-vice-later. That's when we made our final decision that "nothing is as much like a golden retriever...as a golden retriever". 😁


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

SoCalEngr said:


> Somewhere down the line, the same may be said for "comfort retrievers". The notion of a "golden retriever" in a 30lb package was very appealing to us. And, I would like to believe that there may actually be a concerted effort to get to a line where, like the golden, the "breed characteristics" become predictable and repeatable. But, as has been observed in other discussions, this involves both time and the willingness to kill offspring that don't measure up to the desired outcome. The first is difficult, but doable. The second? Not really, anymore.


I don't think this bit about killing the undesirable puppies is necessarily true in this day and age for this particular species (although I'm sure there are those that would do it). I'd like to think that the "undesirables" would be culled from the program by giving them away to good families versus culling by killing. 

Also, I do not believe that Goldens need to be mixed with Cockers (or other breeds) in order to downsize them. There are enough well-bred undersized Goldens that one with the desire could downsize within a few generations. Mixing with Cockers is just cutting corners. The discipline to do this the right way is what is lacking. There is a not an organized group of people intent on producing smaller Goldens and developing a new breed like there were in Miniature American Shepherds, for example.


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## SoCalEngr (Apr 11, 2020)

ArkansasGold said:


> Also, I do not believe that Goldens need to be mixed with Cockers (or other breeds) in order to downsize them. There are enough well-bred undersized Goldens that one with the desire could downsize within a few generations. Mixing with Cockers is just cutting corners. The discipline to do this the right way is what is lacking. There is a not an organized group of people intent on producing smaller Goldens and developing a new breed like there were in Miniature American Shepherds, for example.


Hadn't thought this one through. Speaking to "wanting a smaller version of a golden retriever", your absolutely right. Thanks!


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## stsmark (Feb 1, 2020)

SoCal, the reasons you passed on a Comfort are the same reasons I made my comment. 
I get folks wanting a small Golden but I can’t see what would justify the huge premium for a hybrid. 
The breeder who claims to have invented Comfort Retrievers on their site regular pups are 7k but if you participate in their Guardian program and allow them breed your dog they’re 500.00. I know many breeders offer this but the large difference just strikes me as odd.


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## Jmcarp83 (May 4, 2018)

ArkansasGold said:


> Yes, although Karen has remarried since Mike died. She told me that they have tried to register the kennel name multiple times over the years and have been denied because it’s a “common word” or some such BS. You would have to ask her as I’m a little fuzzy on the details since I get them second hand, but I’m under the impression that they have fought against these people using the name for a very long time.
> 
> Rogues and thieves indeed.


She actually brought this up recently on a Facebook post and I think she mentioned looking into trademarking the kennel name.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Jmcarp83 said:


> She actually brought this up recently on a Facebook post and I think she mentioned looking into trademarking the kennel name.


She posts about it every 6 months or so just to remind people. Her and Megan are such good people and responsible breeders, it just lights my fire that someone is doing that to them. I hope she does get it trademarked.


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## Chrissy1227 (Sep 30, 2019)

gingy said:


> Our puppy will be 3500$ from the a very reputable breeder in Va -4500$ seems ridiculous except if the a Golden is healthy and leads a reasonably long life they are priceless. Probably raised the price because there is so much demand?


Hi! Which breeder is your puppy coming from? If you don’t mind sharing. Thanks!


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## Rion05 (Jan 4, 2016)

Those prices are insane!  Much, much more than the two golden pups that I have purchased from titled parents. The stealing of the kennel name and the doodling would be complete dealbreakers for me. It is frustrating to think that more reputable breeders are charging less, with much more thought and planning going into the litter. Websites are ZERO indication of the quality of the dogs. Ugh!


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## drdawg (May 31, 2011)

chonouie said:


> Hello!
> 
> I have a list of what seems to be reputable breeders from my perusing of the threads on here. Generally it seems that the golden retriever puppies from these breeders (ones that indicate prices on their websites) range from $2,000 to $3,000.
> 
> ...


Run as fast as you can. No pedigrees, no clearances, no titles and they breed mutts as well (doodles, etc).


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## drdawg (May 31, 2011)

drdawg said:


> Run as fast as you can. No pedigrees, no clearances, no titles and they breed mutts as well (doodles, etc).


Not that that price is unacceptable for the right breeding!


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## PiperRoseMom (Jun 4, 2019)

stsmark said:


> I looked on their site and the pups from Reign and Mateo are 5,000.00!


OMG !!!!! That is ridiculous !!!


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## SRW (Dec 21, 2018)

RubysMom said:


> OMG !!!!! That is ridiculous !!!


What was it that P.T Barnum said?


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## Rion05 (Jan 4, 2016)

You can likely get a VERY well-bred golden puppy from fully health tested parents for $1,800-3,500 (regional differences, I understand). One might pay more for a special pup from a special litter, but that is very rare. How "breeders" are managing to charge that much from parents sans proof of the actual pedigree and actual clearances is mind-boggling. Kuddos to the OP for asking questions. It is sad to think that people are so desperate for a puppy that they are paying crazy prices for a puppy with questionable health and with possibly thoughtless breeding.


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## chonouie (Dec 8, 2020)

Rion05 said:


> You can likely get a VERY well-bred golden puppy from fully health tested parents for $1,800-3,500 (regional differences, I understand). One might pay more for a special pup from a special litter, but that is very rare. How "breeders" are managing to charge that much from parents sans proof of the actual pedigree and actual clearances is mind-boggling. Kuddos to the OP for asking questions. It is sad to think that people are so desperate for a puppy that they are paying crazy prices for a puppy with questionable health and with possibly thoughtless breeding.


I knew it was expensive but it's even more validating to read how experienced golden retriever owners such as yourself are mind boggled about this. Now that I'm realizing how many puppies these "breeders" are selling, they easily can make ~$30,000 from one litter--assuming there are 6 available puppies and they charge $4.5-5k for each one! 

My initial budget was $2k but I live in the East Coast where it's apparently a little more pricey, so I bumped it up to $3k if I get lucky to be on a waitlist.....don't know if I can ever justify a $5k puppy......


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## stsmark (Feb 1, 2020)

chonouie said:


> I knew it was expensive but it's even more validating to read how experienced golden retriever owners such as yourself are mind boggled about this. Now that I'm realizing how many puppies these "breeders" are selling, they easily can make ~$30,000 from one litter--assuming there are 6 available puppies and they charge $4.5-5k for each one!
> 
> My initial budget was $2k but I live in the East Coast where it's apparently a little more pricey, so I bumped it up to $3k if I get lucky to be on a waitlist.....don't know if I can ever justify a $5k puppy......


The other interesting and sketchy thing is they list like 8 litters to come in 2021. Each litter shows iirc 8-10 pups. Virtually each one shows as reserved with initials and state abbreviations. I didn’t hit the “buy now” button but I’m sure there’s deposits involved. If that’s not the definition of Puppy Mill I don’t know what is.


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## Aw9nineteen (3 mo ago)

We purchased a golden from them that died of cancer two years ago. Please DM me if you need more information. The entire experience was terrible.


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## sam34 (9 mo ago)

SoCalEngr said:


> the same may be said for "comfort retrievers". The notion of a "golden retriever" in a 30lb package was very appealing to us.



What a strange name for a cross. Why get an unpredictable high price designer cross when you could get a fairly predictable breed that checks most of the boxes? They aren't gold, but a Boykin would be a great choice in a small package. A Toller would "look" like a golden but not have the same temperament. (Or maybe some joker would cross the 2 and get the worst out of each. Mid Atlantic Toykin Retriever, anyone? It would be almost guaranteed to retain the "scream").


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## GOAussies (Dec 3, 2021)

chonouie said:


> Hello!
> 
> I have a list of what seems to be reputable breeders from my perusing of the threads on here. Generally it seems that the golden retriever puppies from these breeders (ones that indicate prices on their websites) range from $2,000 to $3,000.
> 
> ...


Oh. My. Goodness. $4500 is, in my opinion, way too much to pay for a golden retriever puppy! Yes, I know that it's normal for golden retriever puppies nationwide to be priced at $2-4000, but seriously, who can really afford that?? I only know of one purebred golden retriever in my small town and I'm sure it's because most people around here can't afford to pay the outrageously high price for a golden retriever puppy.


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