# Changing foods: loads of diarrhea



## Avalanche 4 (Oct 19, 2017)

My wife takes 2 wks to change over to a new food ... Very slow, gradual, and cautious ... I mean she starts with a tablespoon of the new on the first day, and increases the % each day for the 2 weeks until fully changed over ... Has always worked for her


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## usually lurking (Apr 21, 2017)

8-10 times a day is not normal, either. Is that a typo? What are you feeding, how often, and how much? How quickly did you move to 50/50? It should take you a week (two, if you have a dog with a sensitive stomach) to transition completely. 

If he has diarrhea, stop feeding for 12 hrs, then offer small portions of boiled chicken (or lean ground beef) and rice very 3 hours or so, slowly building up to a full meal of chicken and rice. Feed that for a week, then slowly transition back to kibble over the course of a week.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

usually lurking said:


> 8-10 times a day is not normal, either. Is that a typo? What are you feeding, how often, and how much? How quickly did you move to 50/50? It should take you a week (two, if you have a dog with a sensitive stomach) to transition completely.
> 
> If he has diarrhea, stop feeding for 12 hrs, then offer small portions of boiled chicken (or lean ground beef) and rice very 3 hours or so, slowly building up to a full meal of chicken and rice. Feed that for a week, then slowly transition back to kibble over the course of a week.


No, it's not a typo. He's always pooped a lot, but he's had recurring UTIs, so I didn't make any diet changes until those were cleared up. The massive amount of poop is why I am changing his diet. He's been getting 4 cups a day. That's what it took to get him from clearly too thin (his ribs and hip bones could be seen), to a healthy body condition. He was eating 3 times a day. We're moving to twice a day. I also started at 50/50. It's what I've always done but it hasn't agreed with him at all.

I have plenty of ground turkey, would that be okay instead of chicken?

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## Siandvm (Jun 22, 2016)

hahuston said:


> No, it's not a typo. He's always pooped a lot, but he's had recurring UTIs, so I didn't make any diet changes until those were cleared up. The massive amount of poop is why I am changing his diet. He's been getting 4 cups a day. That's what it took to get him from clearly too thin (his ribs and hip bones could be seen), to a healthy body condition. He was eating 3 times a day. We're moving to twice a day. I also started at 50/50. It's what I've always done but it hasn't agreed with him at all.
> 
> I have plenty of ground turkey, would that be okay instead of chicken?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Ground turkey is fine, boiled, mixed with white rice in a 1/3 meat to 2/3 rice ratio. 
I believe, if I remember correctly, that he is still quite little, so I would not stop feeding for 12 hours. Maybe just skip 1 meal then start with the turkey and rice. Small meals more frequently for now. 
Even for iron stomached dogs, I would not recommend starting at a 50/50 mixture. Their gut micro flora has to have time to make the change. With Rayder, who very much likes to have diarrhea if he can, I figure out how much he needs of each food and then figure out what proportion makes my life easier. Usually 20-25% new and 75-80% old. I feed that for a couple of days at least and if all is well I move up from there maybe to 50/50, maybe less (make the math easy on yourself). It I always give 2-3 days at each level before increasing.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

Siandvm said:


> Ground turkey is fine, boiled, mixed with white rice in a 1/3 meat to 2/3 rice ratio.
> I believe, if I remember correctly, that he is still quite little, so I would not stop feeding for 12 hours. Maybe just skip 1 meal then start with the turkey and rice. Small meals more frequently for now.
> Even for iron stomached dogs, I would not recommend starting at a 50/50 mixture. Their gut micro flora has to have time to make the change. With Rayder, who very much likes to have diarrhea if he can, I figure out how much he needs of each food and then figure out what proportion makes my life easier. Usually 20-25% new and 75-80% old. I feed that for a couple of days at least and if all is well I move up from there maybe to 50/50, maybe less (make the math easy on yourself). It I always give 2-3 days at each level before increasing.


He's 6 months old, 42lbs. Thank you so much!

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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

Wow. That is A LOT of poop. Definitely not normal. Our guys only go 1-2 times per day. What food was he on previously and how much was he eating? Have you had a fecal done?


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

jwemt81 said:


> Wow. That is A LOT of poop. Definitely not normal. Our guys only go 1-2 times per day. What food was he on previously and how much was he eating? Have you had a fecal done?


He's been on several varieties of Pure Balance foods with no diarreah, but lots of poop. 4 cups per day. No fecal samples since the diarreah started, but samples done in the last few months.

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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

hahuston said:


> He's been on several varieties of Pure Balance foods with no diarreah, but lots of poop. 4 cups per day. No fecal samples since the diarreah started, but samples done in the last few months.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Four cups a day is A LOT of food. At around 6 months old, we always cut back from 3 cups per day down to 2. I had never heard of Pure Balance, so I just looked it up and I'm not too fond of the ingredients. I don't like that they use peas (starch = potential cancer cause). You also want to avoid anything that is grain-free. Have you ever tried Pro Plan or Eukanuba? Those are 2 excellent foods that many people have outstanding results with.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

jwemt81 said:


> Four cups a day is A LOT of food. At around 6 months old, we always cut back from 3 cups per day down to 2. I had never heard of Pure Balance, so I just looked it up and I'm not too fond of the ingredients. I don't like that the use peas (starch = potential cancer cause). You also do not want to feed anything that is grain-free. Have you ever tried Pro Plan or Eukanuba? Those are 2 excellent foods that many people have outstanding results with.


He wasn't gaining weight, so the vet had us increase his food until he got to a good body condition. I'm hoping that if I find a food that he can better absorb, he'll poop less and need less food.

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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

hahuston said:


> He wasn't gaining weight, so the vet had us increase his food until he got to a good body condition. I'm hoping that if I find a food that he can better absorb, he'll poop less and need less food.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


I would highly recommend trying Either Pro Plan or Eukanuba. They both are very solid foods with decades of research and proven results behind them. I just don't trust all of these newer food brands that are popping up all over the place and grain-free is a very dangerous fad as it can be significantly nutrient-deficient, taurine being one of those ingredients, which is essential for heart health.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

jwemt81 said:


> I would highly recommend trying Either Pro Plan or Eukanuba. They both are very solid foods with decades of research and proven results behind them. I just don't trust all of these newer food brands that are popping up all over the place and grain-free is a very dangerous fad as it can be significantly nutrient-deficient, taurine being one of those ingredients, which is essential for heart health.


While he started on the grain free varieties, I had moved him to some that was gluten free but not grain free. He did well with the transition within the brand. 

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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

hahuston said:


> While he started on the grain free varieties, I had moved him to some that was gluten free but not grain free. He did well with the transition within the brand.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Just curious if there was a reason for going with a gluten-free food? Generally, dogs do not require a gluten-free diet as they don't have the sensitivities to gluten that some people do. I've actually never even heard of a gluten-free dog food before, so that's a new one for me.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

jwemt81 said:


> Just curious if there was a reason for going with a gluten-free food? Generally, dogs do not require a gluten-free diet as they don't have the sensitivities to gluten that some people do. I've actually never even heard of a gluten-free dog food before, so that's a new one for me.


The breeder had him on a grain free variety of Pure Balance. We continued that until the Hovan Slow Growth Plan updated their recommendations and said not to feed grain free while doing the slow growth plan, so I changed within the brand. Since he's never had gluten, it made sense to avoid that until later. So no real scientific reason, just seemed like the right thing to do.

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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

That was too quick of a change. Should of been a week or two of mixing and gaining more new food.


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

I would try pro plan.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

Soooooo...it seems there is at least one little girl sock involved. Asher puked one up, then, before I could retrieve it, he chowed it down again.[emoji44]The vet advised me to start him on the bland food diet suggested, make sure he stays hydrated and bring him in tomorrow. If he vomits more, then he needs to come in today. 



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## cwag (Apr 25, 2017)

That booger! So is the sock still in him? He's a funny mess, but I'm not paying his vet bills.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

cwag said:


> That booger! So is the sock still in him? He's a funny mess, but I'm not paying his vet bills.


Yes, the stinker swallowed it down again. I was nursing my son and just couldn't untangle myself fast enough to get to Asher. Soooo frustrating!

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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

hahuston said:


> Soooooo...it seems there is at least one little girl sock involved. Asher puked one up, then, before I could retrieve it, he chowed it down again.[emoji44]The vet advised me to start him on the bland food diet suggested, make sure he stays hydrated and bring him in tomorrow. If he vomits more, then he needs to come in today.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Be very careful with those types of things. Socks, blankets, towels, etc. can easily cause an obstruction, which is not a cheap surgery. If you don't already have a crate for when you can't keep an eye on him, now is the time to invest in one.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

jwemt81 said:


> Be very careful with those types of things. Socks, blankets, towels, etc. can easily cause an obstruction, which is not a cheap surgery. If you don't already have a crate for when you can't keep an eye on him, now is the time to invest in one.


I have 2 crates and a baby gate that extends across the kitchen. We have worked so hard to make sure this doesn't happen and yet, here we are.

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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

He goes in for surgery tonight. The sock is in his stomach and looks too big to pass. She'll look around for the retained testicle and remove it if she can while she's in there.

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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

Sending good thoughts for your family and Asher. Naughty boy!!

Hope everything goes well.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

Charliethree said:


> Sending good thoughts for your family and Asher. Naughty boy!!
> 
> Hope everything goes well.


Thanks! No more folding laundry in the front room. We were clearly NOT as careful as we thought we were.

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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

Accidents happen and they can be so fast! If there is an 'upside' it is that you know sooner than later that there is a problem. 
Again - fingers crossed!


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

Good luck to your puppy. Those little socks are so easy to swallow. Chloe doesn’t eat socks. But she has gotten a couple of my nieces little socks and plays with them. We take those away right away. They are so easy to swallow.


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## cwag (Apr 25, 2017)

I'm sorry you all have to go through that. It could happen in a flash to anyone. Rukie ate some pieces of a cheap tennis ball and I was anxious about until I saw the red fuzz in his poop.:surprise:


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## Siandvm (Jun 22, 2016)

hahuston said:


> He goes in for surgery tonight. The sock is in his stomach and looks too big to pass. She'll look around for the retained testicle and remove it if she can while she's in there.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Did they try to induce vomiting? We know he CAN vomit it because he did and ate it again. Inducing vomiting is so much easier than doing a surgery...


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

Siandvm said:


> Did they try to induce vomiting? We know he CAN vomit it because he did and ate it again. Inducing vomiting is so much easier than doing a surgery...


No, she didn't even present that as an option. I didn't think to ask. My grandmother is dying and my attention and heart are divided.

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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

Siandvm said:


> Did they try to induce vomiting? We know he CAN vomit it because he did and ate it again. Inducing vomiting is so much easier than doing a surgery...


I was wondering this as well. All that it takes is a little bit of hydrogen peroxide to induce vomiting. I'd hate to see you have the expense of an unnecessary surgery if this is something that the induction of vomiting could resolve.


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## Siandvm (Jun 22, 2016)

hahuston said:


> No, she didn't even present that as an option. I didn't think to ask. My grandmother is dying and my attention and heart are divided.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


I’m so sorry — it really sounds as if you have a lot on your plate at the moment. Perhaps there was a reason they did not suggest it. It’s so hard to know the whole story over the internet — that’s why this is not how vetting is done. Sending good thoughts to you, your grandmother, and Asher.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

Siandvm said:


> I’m so sorry — it really sounds as if you have a lot on your plate at the moment. Perhaps there was a reason they did not suggest it. It’s so hard to know the whole story over the internet — that’s why this is not how vetting is done. Sending good thoughts to you, your grandmother, and Asher.


I called her. She said she didn't think inducing vomit will work since it's a little past the stomach, but not so far that it's totally into the intestines. It was an easier explanation for her to give me at the time.

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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

Siandvm said:


> I’m so sorry — it really sounds as if you have a lot on your plate at the moment. Perhaps there was a reason they did not suggest it. It’s so hard to know the whole story over the internet — that’s why this is not how vetting is done. Sending good thoughts to you, your grandmother, and Asher.


But if you hadn't mentioned the possibility of inducing vommitting, I wouldn't have thought to ask. It was helpful. Thank you.

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## cwag (Apr 25, 2017)

How is Asher?


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

cwag said:


> How is Asher?


Asher came through surgery just fine. After two hours of surgery, with two surgeons involved, thoroughly exploring his stomach and contents, then all of his intestines, there was NO SOCK to be found anywhere. What looked like an obstruction was huge amounts of gas...So they thought. He also has pancreatitis and very inflamed lymph nodes in his intestines. She checked the fluid of the lymph nodes and it's just inflammation, not anything scarier. 

Given his symptoms, surgery was still called for since everything points to a life threatening blockage. While they were in there, they removed a well buried, retained testicle and carefully checked out his internal organs since he has some other things going on. 

We brought him home the following day and guess what Asher just pooped out? If you guessed the elusive toddler sock, you're right. The doctor thinks she massaged it right into his rectum when she was looking for the sock. Once in the rectum, she couldn't feel for it because of the pelvis. Asher needed some assistance with complete removal , but it's out.

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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

Oh gosh. What a story. I know you dont think it’s funny but I did chuckle. Glad he is doing well.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

Cpc1972 said:


> Oh gosh. What a story. I know you dont think it’s funny but I did chuckle. Glad he is doing well.


The doctor, staff, and myself, all had a good chuckle after some exclamations and head shaking. He isn't drinking water like he should be, so I think I'm going to have to start giving it to him via syringe/medicine dropper. I feel so bad for the little dude. He's eating well, peeing and pooping, so those are all good signs.

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## Anele (Dec 12, 2014)

I'm so sorry about your grandmother. I am keeping your family in my thoughts.

Thank goodness all is well with Asher. Accidents do happen-- it's so much harder to control the environment in larger families. I speak from experience! Once he's well, you might want to start some prevention training just in case the management side temporarily fails. (Because we can be perfect 99/100 times but of course, the puppy will notice that 1%!)

The goal is a default "leave it," where he sees the sock but doesn't go after it. Again,"default" is key! Start off by having him on leash (a short one!) and the sock on the ground OUT of his reach. Every time he chooses to look away, say "yes" and give him a very high value treat. Repeat this in different rooms. Also practice walking away from the sock, and then walking towards it so that he's seeing it anew. Have one of your older kids toss the sock (again, not within his reach) so that he sees the sock actually falling to the ground. When he chooses to look away (with no cues from you), say "yes" or whatever your marker word is, and reward. Practice a lot... think of different scenarios where he might come upon one and "proof" for those times.

You can also work on "take" and "bring" if you haven't already. Work on him taking (on command) and bringing safe items to you, and EVENTUALLY, when you feel pretty good about his lessening sock love, you can see if you can get him to bring you a T-shirt, and with time... a HUGE sock. (Not a child-size one that he can inhale.) Have super super high value treats ready and monitor very closely. 

Sending you much peace and love during this very difficult time.


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## Our3dogs (Apr 3, 2008)

Happy to hear everything "came out" successfully. You might have mentioned trying this - but to get him to drink more, perhaps try some low-sodium chicken or vegetable broth? Usually I find ours will drink it. Or you add a lot of it into their kibble and they drink and eat at the same time. Good luck!


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

Our3dogs said:


> Happy to hear everything "came out" successfully. You might have mentioned trying this - but to get him to drink more, perhaps try some low-sodium chicken or vegetable broth? Usually I find ours will drink it. Or you add a lot of it into their kibble and they drink and eat at the same time. Good luck!


Yep, I've been adding fluid to his food. I think he'll drink frokm his bowl just fine when he doesn't have to wear the cone any more. Thanks for the suggestion.

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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

When it comes to fabric, I learned don't trust x-rays and go straight to an ultrasound.


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## hahuston (Jul 5, 2017)

cubbysan said:


> When it comes to fabric, I learned don't trust x-rays and go straight to an ultrasound.


I didn't consider that, however, in retrospect, it was the sock they saw on x-ray. She had accidentally massaged the sock into his colon. When she couldn't find the sock, the vet assumed it had been gas pockets on the xray.

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