# 4-Month Old Misha being BBAAADD!!!



## jc.corbett (Mar 2, 2010)

Hello all. This is my first post to the forum.

Misha (4 months old now) came from a breeder here in Arizona (Windsor Goldens). She is completely potty trained (knock on wood), knows "sit", "stay", "down", "down stay", "wait" (when ready to eat from bowl), and "off". She gets in and out of my car like a champ ! She knows the command "seat" means to get in the passenger seat if she decides to get behind the wheel! She does not know "come" yet. I have been doing a PetSmart Puppy Class (mixed usefulness), at which she is an absolute lunatic (uber friendly). I had a local trainer come by the house, who told me she will not be ready for formal training until mid-March, but she gave me some tips. One of them was that you CAN play a kind of tug-of-war, as long as the command "give" is obeyed when you say it. She does this well. However, I have noticed in the past couple of weeks that Misha is getting more aggressive, and generally responds less to the "sit" command then she did a month ago even. When she comes into the house once a day, she goes for the cat food. I put my hand in front and tell her "leave it" (which works with other items), but she goes down on her front paws, starts barking/growling, and mock biting my hand. When I then stand up straight and tell her to sit and behave, the behavior escalates: she flicks her tail, barks/growls more, snaps at me, then runs away if I attempt to correct/discipline her. I kind of lost my cool tonight when she jumped on my arm over this cat-food challenge. I yelled, then punished her by putting her in the laundry room (her usual hangout). I know this is a big no-no, but I was really frustrated. After this, she was leery about coming near me. I fear that this may be related to #3, below.

I'm sorry for the lengthy intro, but I wanted to be clear. Here are my questions:

1. Is the tug-of-war type game described above no good even though the trainer said ok?

2. Should I start start training again from scratch with treats and then phase them out?

3. Is the squeeze-the-snout when biting technique a bad idea? It worked when she was a younger puppy, now it just seems to upset her. Will this cause her to fear me?

4. Should I have her on leash when she comes in the non laundry room part of the house once a night?

5. How should I react when she challenges me on the cat food?

6. Am I going to be ok? (she seems to be growing more distant)

Below is a picture of my beautiful girl:


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

Welcome to the board! I'm glad you joined us. If you read through several of the threads in the Puppy up to 1 year section you will find a wealth of information already posted. Puppy owners have experienced what you are many times over and there is fantastic advice and tips in those threads. 

I put my answers in red below.

http://www.goldenretrieverforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=19



jc.corbett said:


> Hello all. This is my first post to the forum.
> 
> Misha (4 months old now) came from a breeder here in Arizona (Windsor Goldens). She is completely potty trained (knock on wood), knows "sit", "stay", "down", "down stay", "wait" (when ready to eat from bowl), and "off". She gets in and out of my car like a champ ! She knows the command "seat" means to get in the passenger seat if she decides to get behind the wheel! She does not know "come" yet. I have been doing a PetSmart Puppy Class (mixed usefulness), at which she is an absolute lunatic (uber friendly). I had a local trainer come by the house, who told me she will not be ready for formal training until mid-March, but she gave me some tips. One of them was that you CAN play a kind of tug-of-war, as long as the command "give" is obeyed when you say it. She does this well. However, I have noticed in the past couple of weeks that Misha is getting more aggressive, and generally responds less to the "sit" command then she did a month ago even. When she comes into the house once a day, she goes for the cat food. I put my hand in front and tell her "leave it" (which works with other items), but she goes down on her front paws, starts barking/growling, and mock biting my hand. When I then stand up straight and tell her to sit and behave, the behavior escalates: she flicks her tail, barks/growls more, snaps at me, then runs away if I attempt to correct/discipline her. I kind of lost my cool tonight when she jumped on my arm over this cat-food challenge. I yelled, then punished her by putting her in the laundry room (her usual hangout). I know this is a big no-no, but I was really frustrated. After this, she was leery about coming near me. I fear that this may be related to #3, below.
> 
> ...


She is a cutie!


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## C's Mom (Dec 7, 2009)

I'm not sure if I'm reading your post right. How much time does Misha spend with you?


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## RedDogs (Jan 30, 2010)

She sounds like a normal smart puppy!

I would definitely play tug if you are both enjoying it.

YES use treats. She's a very small puppy. Use treats in training every time you're working on something new or making it harder. And really, for manners, there's no reason to ever completely fade them out, especially with a dog under 18 months.

Find a new trainer if you have to wait though...that seems odd.

Do pick up the food when she comes in the house. It's way easier for you. Your routine of "LEAVE IT!" and the stop hand is very much being received as play. When my dogs are playing they go through a similar thing! She is not challenging you. There's something super tasty there and she's being a silly puppy.

Spend more time with her inside, teaching her manners and just hanging out. If she's spending most of her time alone, she is definitely bound to be wild when she is with you. A young puppy should not be spending much time unsupervised.

Do not grab her for mouthing. Have a toy read and toss that or have treats and do some quick "Sit!" reinforce. Step away with her following. Sit!, reinforce... repeat.


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## jc.corbett (Mar 2, 2010)

Mylissyk:

Misha is only outside during the day while I am at work, but with access to her crate which is inside the laundry room door. See below.


C's Mom:

I leave the house at 7 am, and return at about 4. During the day, she is outside in a 21 feet by 7 feet dog run made of brick with a few of her toys. She has access to the doggy door which leads into her crate, pushed up against the door. As soon as I get home from work, and all weekend long, she has the laundry room all to herself. On the weekends this is all day long. The laundry room has a view of the house, and has a tall doggy gate in the doorway. I am in an out of that room all the time playing with her.

During the week, I typically spend at least 2-3 hours a night walking, sitting, training, and playing with her. It is during this evening time that I let her out of the laundry room and into the house for a little while. My girlfriend is a substitute teacher and does not work every day, so she spends time with her during the day if she is not called.


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## nolefan (Nov 6, 2009)

JC..... just had to let you know you're not alone.... Duncan is 17 weeks and we ADORE each other. However there are some days when I catch myself wondering why I didn't just adopt a nice 2 or 3 year old rescue golden. 

The people here have excellent advice... hang in there and repeat after me.. "This too, shall pass."


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## C's Mom (Dec 7, 2009)

I really don't mean to come off as rude so please don't take my post as such but is there any way that you can allow Misha more time in the house with you, without doing training, rather than her staying in the laundry room? I think you are going to be missing out on some important socializing/bonding/teaching time with you and your GF is she only comes out of the laundry room for training. Dogs are such social beings, especially Goldens, and love to be in the same room we are in.


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

If you are concerned about her bonding, spend more time with her. Put her on leash and attach her to you when you're home, so she can't wander off. 

For the cat food, my advice would be to start feeding the cat regular meals - don't leave out the buffet. Start by putting the food away at night, then giving an hour several times a day for the cat to eat, and gradually make it so there are two mealtimes and no food out otherwise. It's much better for the cat to not graze anyway, and then your pup won't have that 'battle'. Or put the cat food in a room with a gate so that it's not an option to get into. Problem solved! She's not at the age where she's going to understand why you don't want her to get into the cat food, and it's MUCH better tasting anyway so most dogs will go for it. 

You may want to consult a trainer for the biting if it continues. Bitter apple on the hands sometimes does a nice job of teaching manners though.... 

This too shall pass though!

Lana


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## Jersey's Mom (Nov 25, 2007)

She's not being bad... she's just being a puppy. And an under-stimulated one at that. If I am understanding your schedule and set-up correctly there is a lot of time where you and/or your girlfriend are in the house with the dog confined away from you in her run/room area. Don't get me wrong, for times that you both need to be out of the house (and realistically, there will be those times as you both work), your setup sounds enviable. But that's no excuse to keep the dog out there like an ornament or an accessory until you deem it's time for drills or for a scheduled visit into the house. I really don't mean that as judgmentally or rudely as I'm sure it comes across.... but the simple fact is you have a 4 month old golden retriever puppy who is not being provided with the attention and supervision she needs. Dogs are social animals, and goldens are more social than most... they want and need to be with their people as much as possible. I assume you got a dog to be a companion, and I can tell from your post that you love Misha very much... so please understand I'm not trying to accuse you of being neglectful or mean or anything like that. It's just that I think you may be underestimating how much of your time a puppy (and an adult dog for that matter) demands in order to be happy, healthy, and properly stimulated.

The good news is, there's no major issues going on here. That distance you feel can be quickly bridged by devoting more time to bonding with your pup. The land-shark phase will pass, and more quickly with the excellent advice provided to you by members above. Tug can be a great game, and a wonderful stress reliever for the dog... though your trainer is right that learning self-control (in the form of "leave it" or "game over" or some similar cue) is important. None of the mouthing or behavior that you are noticing is directly related to tugging. I agree with others that the cat food should be placed in a location that is off-limits to the dog yet accessible for the cat. As you progress through teaching your dog the "leave it" command, that cat food will actually come in handy for a high value enticement somewhere down the road (though you better be ready to reward with steak when she successfully leaves it!). But beyond that, it's best to manage the situation to avoid her experiencing success at stealing it.

Tethering can be a great management tool for a young pup who is still learning the rules of the house. Keeping her leashed to you while doing some household chores or otherwise cannot provide 100% supervision will help avoid destructive behavior (which could be harmful to Misha as well as your belongings), potty mistakes, and other general mischief. But 2-3 hours of tethered time and a few short walks should not constitute a day's worth of bonding with your dog. 

Treats are a great tool for reinforcement, as is play. At 4 months, small food rewards are easiest and most clear for your pup... so it's a great place to start. Keep exploring training options in your area... if you have the time, read up on some theories/methods (there are book reviews all over the forum if you run some searches... and probably more than a few in the product review area of the site... plus if you're interested I"m sure we could rustle up a few suggestions for you)... and keep finding new and exciting ways to build a relationship with your pup. You won't regret it.

Best of luck!!

Julie and Jersey


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## jc.corbett (Mar 2, 2010)

Thank you all so much for your suggestions and advice. None of it was taken as rude in any way. I love my dog dearly and want the best for her. You all have been a great help and an inspiration as well. I started tonight by having her with me in the house almost the entire evening, on leash for most of that time. We sat together, played tug together, attempted to snuggle (she is very high energy and has a hard time sitting still), and practiced some sit-stays and comes (with treats!). I also tried to get her familiar with the vacuum cleaner (which she hates), as I would like to get one of those brushes with the vacuum attachment. 

Regarding Jersey's Mom's comment, "2-3 hours of tethered time and a few short walks should not constitute a day's worth of bonding with your dog." aside from simply spending more time with her, could you be more specific as to what would be considered "bonding", in your experience?

Thanks again, you guys are great!


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## C's Mom (Dec 7, 2009)

jc.corbett said:


> Thank you all so much for your suggestions and advice. None of it was taken as rude in any way. I love my dog dearly and want the best for her. You all have been a great help and an inspiration as well. I started tonight by having her with me in the house almost the entire evening, on leash for most of that time. We sat together, played tug together, attempted to snuggle (she is very high energy and has a hard time sitting still), and practiced some sit-stays and comes (with treats!). I also tried to get her familiar with the vacuum cleaner (which she hates), as I would like to get one of those brushes with the vacuum attachment.
> 
> Regarding Jersey's Mom's comment, "2-3 hours of tethered time and a few short walks should not constitute a day's worth of bonding with your dog." aside from simply spending more time with her, could you be more specific as to what would be considered "bonding", in your experience?
> 
> Thanks again, you guys are great!


I can't express enough how pleased I am to read your post! Thank you so much for listening to what we had to say about spending more time with your beautiful girl, and she is beautiful - you have done her and you a big favor in the long run.
In time your girl will sit still/relax more with you and snuggle - you are going to love it!


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## Florabora22 (Nov 30, 2008)

jc.corbett said:


> Thank you all so much for your suggestions and advice. None of it was taken as rude in any way. I love my dog dearly and want the best for her. You all have been a great help and an inspiration as well. I started tonight by having her with me in the house almost the entire evening, on leash for most of that time. We sat together, played tug together, attempted to snuggle (she is very high energy and has a hard time sitting still), and practiced some sit-stays and comes (with treats!). I also tried to get her familiar with the vacuum cleaner (which she hates), as I would like to get one of those brushes with the vacuum attachment.
> 
> Regarding Jersey's Mom's comment, "2-3 hours of tethered time and a few short walks should not constitute a day's worth of bonding with your dog." aside from simply spending more time with her, could you be more specific as to what would be considered "bonding", in your experience?
> 
> Thanks again, you guys are great!


Lol, when you've got a frisky furball with razor sharp teeth it does seem hard to bond with it, I know. : I just spent a lot of time playing with Flora, letting her follow me around the house, doing chores and letting her watch, things like that. I talked to her a LOT (I'm a dork), and took her to lots of places when she was a puppy to get used to things.

I'm so glad you're making an effort to spend more time with her. Goldens are fascinating dogs and they make the best of friends, and it would be a shame for you to miss out on that.

Puppyhood is very hard and quite a trying time, but it is so worth it in the end. Good luck to you and Misha!


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## turtle66 (Feb 19, 2010)

> I also tried to get her familiar with the vacuum cleaner (which she hates)


Our Golden hated the vacuum cleaner at first, too but she got used to it pretty fast with a little trick: Every time I used the vacuum cleaner I had some kibbles in my hand and I was throwing those to her direction...Nowadays, Lilly thinks the vacuum cleaner is a 'treat machine' and she will actually come in from playing in the garden when she does hear the noise of the vacuum cleaner and will explore if this machine will still have some treats for her 
(Hmm, may be I 'overdid' it)

Heike with a photo from Lilly when she was about 4 months...


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