# Establishing a good foundation for a puppy agility prospect



## holycarp (Jan 3, 2021)

Hello everyone,

I'm looking for ideas on things I can train/teach Iris (4 months old) to start building a good foundation for the future! So far, some of the things I've taught:

rear leg awareness by backing up to place her rear legs onto a box/step
more rear leg awareness with pivots
stand->down->stand pushups for general core strength
starting paw pods. They're hard!
verbal only cues to teach her that the words I say actually mean something!
Of course we train a lot of the standard puppy stuff, too, but what are some other ideas for foundation agility things? She absolutely loves to work and needs a LOT of training sessions to actually be content/satisfied for the day


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## Tagrenine (Aug 20, 2019)

holycarp said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> I'm looking for ideas on things I can train/teach Iris (4 months old) to start building a good foundation for the future! So far, some of the things I've taught:
> 
> ...


I think going to a foundation agility class would be the best. Something I learned in my new videos is that Susan Salo never lets her dogs see bars on the ground. She doesn’t want her dogs to think bars can be on the ground. Whether or not it makes a difference I have no idea. 
Further, definitely start encouraging independence from your puppy. We started doing obedience and transitioning to agility was hard because he was always looking at us for the next cue.


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## holycarp (Jan 3, 2021)

Tagrenine said:


> I think going to a foundation agility class would be the best. Something I learned in my new videos is that Susan Salo never lets her dogs see bars on the ground. She doesn’t want her dogs to think bars can be on the ground. Whether or not it makes a difference I have no idea.
> Further, definitely start encouraging independence from your puppy. We started doing obedience and transitioning to agility was hard because he was always looking at us for the next cue.


We live in Boston and there are actually a lot of foundation agility classes, but they're all full  That's why I'm looking for ideas to work on until we can find one. I'm hoping for some openings by the end of the year.
Mm that makes sense. Every morning we go on a 1.5 mile hike through the woods and I let her have a ton of freedom to explore as she wants. I of course also take that opportunity to practice lots of difficult recalls. Our cone work is also at a distance, with me sending her on wraps from 10-15 feet away. I'm not really worried about ever lagging behind at a greater distance than that.


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## Tagrenine (Aug 20, 2019)

holycarp said:


> We live in Boston and there are actually a lot of foundation agility classes, but they're all full  That's why I'm looking for ideas to work on until we can find one. I'm hoping for some openings by the end of the year.
> Mm that makes sense. Every morning we go on a 1.5 mile hike through the woods and I let her have a ton of freedom to explore as she wants. I of course also take that opportunity to practice lots of difficult recalls. Our cone work is also at a distance, with me sending her on wraps from 10-15 feet away. I'm not really worried about ever lagging behind at a greater distance than that.


What we did in our foundation class was teach the proper jumping form. We set the bar to like 6 inches, maybe, and taught the dog how to jump properly. We taught a stay and jump, a send, and introduced the target.
For now, maybe get a single jump, a 2x2, and a wobble board if you don’t already have one.
The Goldens in our classes didn’t have any issues with the teeter but the other dogs did.


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## holycarp (Jan 3, 2021)

Oh interesting. I think for something like proper jumping form, I'd want to wait until we get an instructor (just to be safe). 2x2 is definitely a good idea- I'll grab one of those. Instead of a wobble board I've been having her balance on other things, but that definitely can't hurt. Thanks!


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## Tagrenine (Aug 20, 2019)

holycarp said:


> Oh interesting. I think for something like proper jumping form, I'd want to wait until we get an instructor (just to be safe). 2x2 is definitely a good idea- I'll grab one of those. Instead of a wobble board I've been having her balance on other things, but that definitely can't hurt. Thanks!


Sure! I’ve really enjoyed agility and it’s amazing to watch their progress once they grasp things. Felix’s littermate is rocking the agility course right now and I can’t wait for him to get to her level 🤣


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## holycarp (Jan 3, 2021)

Tagrenine said:


> Sure! I’ve really enjoyed agility and it’s amazing to watch their progress once they grasp things. Felix’s littermate is rocking the agility course right now and I can’t wait for him to get to her level 🤣


Haha yeah, we've got a LOT of relatives to live up to


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## DevWind (Nov 7, 2016)

You can do "jumps". Just put the bar on the floor or so low that she's only stepping over it. Do you have a ladder? Put it on the floor so she can walk between the rungs. Teach her touch. Have her touch her nose to your hand. Work on basic obedience. Obedience is the foundation of everything! Do you have a training club in your area? Some of them want you to reach a certain level in obedience classes before agility. Usually a level that will take until she's 2 years old. You shouldn't jump her before she's 2. A start line stay is essential in agility. People are always so impressed by my start line stays....it's nothing to my dogs because I taught them to stay no matter what before introducing them to agility.


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## holycarp (Jan 3, 2021)

Abeille said:


> You can do "jumps". Just put the bar on the floor or so low that she's only stepping over it. Do you have a ladder? Put it on the floor so she can walk between the rungs. Teach her touch. Have her touch her nose to your hand. Work on basic obedience. Obedience is the foundation of everything! Do you have a training club in your area? Some of them want you to reach a certain level in obedience classes before agility. Usually a level that will take until she's 2 years old. You shouldn't jump her before she's 2. A start line stay is essential in agility. People are always so impressed by my start line stays....it's nothing to my dogs because I taught them to stay no matter what before introducing them to agility.


Hmm, ladders are a good idea, thanks. I do have a jump but I'm going to iron out single cone work before introducing it.
Yeah I count basic obedience as the 'standard puppy stuff' I mentioned. We're doing a CGC class with our club. And another obedience for agility thing that @ceegee recommended I look into a while ago. I'll trial her in rally as soon as she hits 6 months to get used to working in the ring.
I'm going to x-ray her every couple of months after ~15 to check when her growth plates close. She won't be spayed until at least that long, so I'll likely be able to start her before 2.


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## DevWind (Nov 7, 2016)

holycarp said:


> Hmm, ladders are a good idea, thanks. I do have a jump but I'm going to iron out single cone work before introducing it.
> Yeah I count basic obedience as the 'standard puppy stuff' I mentioned. We're doing a CGC class with our club. And another obedience for agility thing that @ceegee recommended I look into a while ago. I'll trial her in rally as soon as she hits 6 months to get used to working in the ring.
> I'm going to x-ray her every couple of months after ~15 to check when her growth plates close. She won't be spayed until at least that long, so I'll likely be able to start her before 2.


Sounds like you are on the right track! Honestly, I would save the money and just wait until she's 2 for the x-rays. That way you can just do OFA and know an official status. Many agility classes have an age requirement anyway.


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## Tagrenine (Aug 20, 2019)

holycarp said:


> Hmm, ladders are a good idea, thanks. I do have a jump but I'm going to iron out single cone work before introducing it.
> Yeah I count basic obedience as the 'standard puppy stuff' I mentioned. We're doing a CGC class with our club. And another obedience for agility thing that @ceegee recommended I look into a while ago. I'll trial her in rally as soon as she hits 6 months to get used to working in the ring.
> I'm going to x-ray her every couple of months after ~15 to check when her growth plates close. She won't be spayed until at least that long, so I'll likely be able to start her before 2.


Don’t X-ray her that often, her growth plates will probably close around 12 months but anyway, most clubs won’t let puppies under 18 months jump regular height. Our classes kept it to 6 inches for all dogs under 18 months.
Just do OFA’s at 2.
I’m usually all for diagnostic imaging but exposing her to radiation often for the sake of determining growth plate closure may have a detriment. We don’t really know much about radiation exposure via radiographs in dogs, especially on their reproductive anatomy


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## holycarp (Jan 3, 2021)

Tagrenine said:


> Don’t X-ray her that often, her growth plates will probably close around 12 months but anyway, most clubs won’t let puppies under 18 months jump regular height. Our classes kept it to 6 inches for all dogs under 18 months.
> Just do OFA’s at 2.
> I’m usually all for diagnostic imaging but exposing her to radiation often for the sake of determining growth plate closure may have a detriment. We don’t really know much about radiation exposure via radiographs in dogs, especially on their reproductive anatomy


Ha! Yeah fair point. Her mom's a vet and she wouldn't allow me to do that anyway. I think I did see 18 months for our clubs too.


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## pawsnpaca (Nov 11, 2014)

Julie Daniels will be offering a few classes through Fenzi Dog Sports Academy that may be of interest to you. I highly recommend her "Baby Genius" and "Empowerment" classes.








Fenzi Dog Sports Academy - Julie Daniels


Online dog training classes for obedience, rally, agility, tracking, nosework, dog behavior, freestyle, and foundation skills.




www.fenzidogsportsacademy.com





I took early versions of some of these classes with Julie in person when she owned her White Mountain Agility School in New Hampshire and they were great. Julie lives in Deerfield, NH now (so just a couple hours north of you) and teaches primarily through Fenzi, but it might be worth your while to reach out and see if she's still offering some private lessons. Just getting a "to do" list and one on one guidance might be really helpful to you!

I agree with a lot of the suggestions you've already been given. Here are a few more...

1. Get your puppy on a wide variety of surfaces (carpet, bare floor, asphalt, grass, sand, tarps, rubber mats, cardboard, ball pit, baby pool, whatever you can think of).
2. Definitely work her on safe surfaces that move. A wobble board or tippy board is easy to DIY.
3. If you are planning to teach stopped contacts, start teaching the concept of "two on, two off" (you can use the bottom step of the stairs, or any low platform or plank)
4. Start teaching a rear cross. You can do this by switching sides as she goes around a cone, or on the flat by spinning her out away from you as you turn and pick her up on your opposite side.
5. If you have access to a A-Frame or contact trainer or can set up a wide plank at a low angle somewhere, start teaching her how to control her descent by shifting her weight BACK so she doesn't injure her shoulders (obviously I'm talking very low angles here and don't over do it at this young age!). Use a treat or toy to get her used to moving up/across/around on the plank so she learns how to handle the slant.

With any and all of these suggestions... safety first!


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

I am keeping my options open with my pup (6 months now) - she is fascinated with my AFrame & low teeter and I have been teaching her to safely navigate all types of things like rocker panels, crawling, pods, front end awareness, rear end awareness, some obedience, ladders, differing surfaces etc. She has been in a few classes where obstacle courses are set up and a few single classes with core work with more obstacles.

Basically surfaces, climbing, body awareness and the freedom to explore her body and environment. Jump be aware that no jump work above her wrists - I usually use hoops and larger cones for shadow handling type things. She has been introduced to 2x2 weaves but only to the extent that no body bending is required just passing 'through'. She has done low ladder and cavaletti work at introduction levels (also a baseline towards what I may want for her heeling). Weight shifting as mentioned above -- both forward and back. I am using the forward weight shift primarily for tuck sits, while the rear weight shift will be used for contacts (should I decide to re-enter agility)

Try to build confidence in going over, through, around etc but you don't really need to do agility specific things at young ages - just build curiosity and confidence to try new things. As their bodies develop and change, different things may startle them at different times - for example: with Wren she was fine with sway bridges until around 4 months, then reacted and had to be encouraged to go over them; she is fine now but may react again at some point. With my male goldens, they tended to be fine with the teeter pivot when young and then start to do that pause as they develop (I dislike that pause and want them to own/slap down the pivot  - I work hard on that but this is somethhing I have had to teach at later ages as the problem doesn't pop up for awhile )

Since goldens are large and relatively slow to mature, I have typically waited until after 18 months to start more formal agility and jump training. To date I have not had injuries or arthritis issues with my dogs and I believe it has a lot to do with the late starting of this training.

Some additional things to think about:

Working away from you while still keeping focus on you
Working close to you on both left & right sides
Decide what your arms/ hands/hips, feet will be cuing -- that is; if your hand goes to shoulder height does that mean to go further from you than if it is raised at a 45 degree angle, do you keep your arm out as a signal to maintain distance and bring it back in when you want to cue your dog to come closer? Start watching teams you admire and start learning how you are going to cue your dog before you actually start  That way you won't have confusion based on retraining.

I too highly recommend Julie Daniels -- I have taken privates and gone up for her camps many times. She is several hours from me so I no longer make the trek (and now have more than 2 dogs which also makes it harder LOL) , but if she does privates it could be worth your while, and her FDSA courses are great.

Maybe audit a few courses with FDSA or DaisyPeel or any one of a number of wonderful trainers to get ideas (Susan Garrett also comes to mind but I don't recall her having other than subscriptions, could be wrong) . FDSA actually brings in may excellent trainers who cover many aspects of agility so might well be a good place to strat,


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

My dog, Logan, enjoys agility. He started at one year old. We kept jumps very low until he hit 18 months. He's almost 21 months old now and I think we are doing 18" jumps currently. I've taken August off to be in the mountains and can't remember. We have done a ton of two on/two off training, release words, all the obstacles at this point -- he loves A-frame and dog walk the most. He isn't intimidated by the teeter, but we aren't completely full height yet on it or A-frame. I do plank drills and am working on the exercises in the book Weaves that Wow. We practice wrapping cones. I haven't checked out Fenzi's agility classes, but I loved taking Get Ready to Rally from them.


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## Eclipse (Apr 21, 2014)

Foundation cues for left turn, right turn, and go straight/keep going (verbal and physical)

Also, work on a solid stay, and after it is solid, make it super solid with distance added. And don't forget to add distractions. If you can leave your dog on the startline and 100% trust them for a 20' lead out or however long it is - it will help you get past some of the tricky course openings.

I see a decent amount of performance Goldens in agility where the dog and owner argue with each other on the start line stay - and they end up abandoning their lead out because the dog won't stop scooting forward.


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## holycarp (Jan 3, 2021)

Eclipse said:


> Foundation cues for left turn, right turn, and go straight/keep going (verbal and physical)
> 
> Also, work on a solid stay, and after it is solid, make it super solid with distance added. And don't forget to add distractions. If you can leave your dog on the startline and 100% trust them for a 20' lead out or however long it is - it will help you get past some of the tricky course openings.
> 
> I see a decent amount of performance Goldens in agility where the dog and owner argue with each other on the start line stay - and they end up abandoning their lead out because the dog won't stop scooting forward.


Yep yep. We've worked up to left and right wraps on a verbal only cue. I'm not super concerned about additional conework now since she learns so fast anyway. Every morning we go on an off leash walk through woods (plus swimming), which gives ample opportunity for distracting recalls and stays. I don't see anything to be concerned about yet with her stays- we'll need them in a few months once we start showing in rally.


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## Eclipse (Apr 21, 2014)

holycarp said:


> Yep yep. We've worked up to left and right wraps on a verbal only cue. I'm not super concerned about additional conework now since she learns so fast anyway. Every morning we go on an off leash walk through woods (plus swimming), which gives ample opportunity for distracting recalls and stays. I don't see anything to be concerned about yet with her stays- we'll need them in a few months once we start showing in rally.


Rally is awesome. It's probably the best thing my Novice A self did while I waited for Penny to be old enough for agility. It helped me lay foundations that I wouldn't have had if I had just done agility - I didn't know which places taught puppy agility when I started.


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