# Cancer Prevention with Nuvet Products



## Kmullen (Feb 17, 2010)

I personally have used it on my last golden that died of a weird cause! Supposively helps with hips...he had severe HD. I would never use it. But, I have some australian Shepherd friends who love it and it makes their coat better. Did not go into detail with them, but they claim a whiter (where the white is).


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Snake oil.
Pyramid scheme.
And no way would I buy a dog from ANY breeder whose "health guarantee" is null and void if you do not use it.


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## jackie_hubert (Jun 2, 2010)

Isn't it a pyramid scheme? I thought those are illegal...


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

ahhh, guilt marketing....since about 65% of goldens will die of cancer, they can make you feel good and guilty if yours does, because you didn't use their products....


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

They've spent a whopping *8 years* in research and development, and they claim to understand why our pets get cancer and what will prevent it? :uhoh: 



hotel4dogs said:


> ahhh, guilt marketing....since about 65% of goldens will die of cancer, they can make you feel good and guilty if yours does, because you didn't use their products....


Yep. But they'll probably be out of business by the time many people who DO use their products find out that it didn't work.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> Who believes in Nuvet? and tell us why?


I'll guess it's people who like to feel that they can prevent something bad like cancer or hip dysplasia or whatever from happening. Or that they have some kind of control. For that reason, I can't say I blame them. I know that people give other products (Missing Link, raw food, etc) for the same reason. It might not work, but it makes the owners feel proactive and hopeful that they can keep their dogs healthy and safe. And it can't hurt, right?

Where I object is when breeders base "guarantees" on the use of nuvet as a prevention of a disease, like it's a sure bet or whatever. Same thing if as Pointgold and others have said that these breeders get any profits for pitching nuvet as some kind of wonder supplement.


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## Braccarius (Sep 8, 2008)

Megora said:


> It might not work, but it makes the owners feel proactive and hopeful that they can keep their dogs healthy and safe. And it can't hurt, right?


The way they are marketed and the fact that you can't really tell what the heck is in it is quite wrong. I would be interested in seeing an unbiased study on cancer and displaysia rates in dogs that take Nuvet versus dogs who do not. I wouldn't be surprised if it found the ones on Nuvet had a higher incidence of the things they claim to prevent due to the breeders who push them.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Braccarius said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if it found the ones on Nuvet had a higher incidence of the things they claim to prevent due to the breeders who push them.


At least with the hip dysplasia, I suspect that would have more to do with the breeders using a vitamin supplement to distract prospective owners from a less than stellar clearance history. 

Either that, or it could be the owners overexercising puppies and young dogs because they are assuming that the vitamin supplement will stave off any consequences. 

Again, that is something that bothers me when I see nuvet pitched on websites. It seems to take some common sense responsibility away from the breeders and owners.


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Megora said:


> It might not work, but it makes the owners feel proactive and hopeful that they can keep their dogs healthy and safe. And it can't hurt, right?


I can understand why people would want to try it. Absolutely. But I'm not convinced that it can't hurt. I think there might be a danger in overdoing it with the supplements, or getting a negative effect from combining the wrong supplements.
There's been a lot made of that lately, with all the "natural" supplements that we humans take. I would think there's just as big a risk with our dogs.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

LifeOfRiley said:


> I can understand why people would want to try it. Absolutely. But I'm not convinced that it can't hurt. I think there might be a danger in overdoing it with the supplements, or getting a negative effect from combining the wrong supplements.
> There's been a lot made of that lately, with all the "natural" supplements that we humans take. I would think there's just as big a risk with our dogs.


Well, yes. But I have the same opinion about giving your dogs _any_ supplements (skin, joint, digestive, coat) when it isn't needed. If you are feeding your dogs a good diet, they shouldn't require something extra for their digestive system or skin, right?


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

I read somewhere, that the breeders who sell this get HALF of the cost of the vitamins. So if they have even four puppy owners buying it it works out to $100 a month. If they breed more... you get the idea, extra income...


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Bender said:


> I read somewhere, that the breeders who sell this get HALF of the cost of the vitamins. So if they have even four puppy owners buying it it works out to $100 a month. If they breed more... you get the idea, extra income...


Yep. This is what bothers me when I look at some of those breeder websites out there. That, and again any breeder making a statement that these supplements are miracle cures for diseases or conditions the dogs might otherwise have.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

They've been around a loooong time, scamming people. Their older marketing absolutely claimed that NuVet cured everything under the sun if you gave it to your dog, and PREVENTED everything under the sun if you started puppies on it. My old pal GRM based her "health guarantee" on it. Says a lot right there...


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Megora said:


> Well, yes. But I have the same opinion about giving your dogs _any_ supplements (skin, joint, digestive, coat) when it isn't needed. If you are feeding your dogs a good diet, they shouldn't require something extra for their digestive system or skin, right?


They might--many dogs eat a healthy diet and still develop digestive issues. The causes may be genetic, environmental or something else that is totally unrelated to nutrition, yet added supplements can help. B12 does wonders for SIBO and EPI dogs. EPI has a genetic component because some dogs just cannot make the necessary enzymes or whatever from diet alone.

Overdosing on supplements is dangerous for a dog. Too much Vitamin A for example, is toxic.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Can anyone find the President of NuVet's educational background? Does he even have a DVM? Also, they brag about their advisory board on the website but don't name the board members??? Odd...


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

arsenic and lead are both all natural....


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Dallas Gold said:


> They might--many dogs eat a healthy diet and still develop digestive issues. *The causes may be genetic, environmental or something else that is totally unrelated to nutrition, yet added supplements can help.* B12 does wonders for SIBO and EPI dogs. EPI has a genetic component because some dogs just cannot make the necessary enzymes or whatever from diet alone.


But you wouldn't give supplements unless there was a need, right? And I mainly mean giving these things to young structurally sound puppies who have no health issues.


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

The reason B12 works as an injectable in those situations is because it cannot be absorbed from the intestines and needs an exogenous administration.

I do give my apparently healthy 8 week old pups fish oil and dasuquin or cosequin... because it DOES make me feel better. I have had good results with OFA since I started. HOWEVER maybe it's because all of my dogs are related.... so good genetics coupled with the same environmental factors.

I have seen breeder contracts where HD is not guaranteed unless you can produce all of the receipts for the Vitamin C you were to maintain your pup on!! I have seen Nuvet advertised on both "disreputable" and "reputable" golden breeders' websites, some of whom frequent this forum. I think it is time for breeders to be honest about the dogs we sell and understand that Nuvet, etc isn't going to prevent the problems that are inherent in this breed. I rescued a beagle in vet school who lived to be 17 years, who received a rabies vaccine every other year and a distemper vaccine annually. She also came to me with heartworm. Purina dog chow was her food of choice until she became geriatric and ate k/d. Clearly, food, environment, vaccines, and no supplements didn't shorten her life!!


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## HiTideGoldens (Dec 29, 2009)

I have a friend who swears by NuVet who recently gave me a bottle to try on our 2. I was hesitant because of the way its marketed, but figured I'd try it just to see if it did anything. (We routinely give fish oil, digestive enhancer, joint supplement and cran-tri-c to our dogs.) After 3 weeks I didn't notice anything different on Jack, but I did notice Chloe started chewing the hell out of her two front paws and the vet thinks it's a yeast infection. Fun times. So.....even if I can't actually blame NuVet for this wonderful new development, I don't think I'll be using it anymore. They don't list the ingredient amounts, and while I understand it's a trade secret, blah blah blah, I'd like to actually know if there's something in there that she had a negative reaction to. But I don't know what ingredient is 1% and what ingredient is 50% of the product - no bueno.


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## DianaM (Feb 18, 2010)

One of the breeders we visited did this whole nuvet thing. I didn't know much about it at the time. Yet another reason (of many) that I'm glad we did not go with her!


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Megora said:


> But you wouldn't give supplements unless there was a need, right? And I mainly mean giving these things to young structurally sound puppies who have no health issues.


Well, yes, I gave Toby Cosequin DS and fish oil from the day we adopted him at 5 months. Our vet encourages it for Golden Retrievers. Toby is structurally sound, orthopedically.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Dallas Gold said:


> Well, yes, I gave Toby Cosequin DS and fish oil from the day we adopted him at 5 months. Our vet encourages it for Golden Retrievers. Toby is structurally sound, orthopedically.


But can you say for sure that your dog is structurely sound because of those supplements? Or is it something you believe because it worked out for your dog?  And has he gotten xrays to prove that there is no hip or elbow dysplasia? 

^ I'm actually curious if giving supplements would make much of a difference in puppies - as in ensuring a dog will have good hips instead of dysplastic hips. Especially since my vet believes that hip/elbow dysplasia is something that puppies are born with.  

If there is something I can give the next puppy to ensure he has great hips for obedience/performance training, you can betcha I'll be doing that. Except for giving mega doses of fish oil or glucosamine or vitamin c - as my gut feeling is that too much could be harmful, especially for a puppy. 

But I think that's why people fall for the Nuvet promises. Because there are a lot of people out there who are looking for a way to cheat genetics in some way for their dogs. 

And it's not just Nuvet. 

I have a horse and dog catalog over here that I order MSM (for my horse) and other things from, and there are supplements for every imaginable condition for dogs and horses. Supplements that promise to fix or prevent anything and everything...


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

No I can't say if he's structurally sound because and solely because of the supplements. He was blessed with good genetics. He was radiographed at his first sedated dental cleaning and he has no hip or elbow issues in the vet's opinion (not OFA). The anti-inflammatory effects of the fish oil also help other things systemically, just like they do with humans. We didn't place Toby on anti-inflammatory levels of Omega 3s until he was an adult but he did receive a small dose during his formative year. 

I will always give my Golden retrievers these two supplements (absent a fish allergy) with the recommendation and blessing our our trusted (and respected) veterinarian.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I was looking at the recommended mega doses of fish oil, and I simply can't do that with my adult dog (who does get 2 pills of salmon oil a day). Especially since he also gets plenty of the same vitamins and nutrients in his food. You talk about vitamin overdose...


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

I only give the recommended dose of dasuquin w/MSM and fish oil. You could certainly over do it with fish oil (have to be careful with fat soluable vitamins). I have never believed in Vit C. HD and ED are certainly genetic. But I believe you can alter the course (exacerbate) severity in some dogs with improper husbandry (i.e. management, feeding, etc). Obviously you will not make a dog with HD non dyspalastic w/supplements. As I have said ad nauseum in previous threads golden #2 was OFA Fair at 24 months and mildly unilaterally dysplastic at 44 months. I reradiographed her because I could feel a skip when she heeled. At that time, there was only Cosequin DS. I started her on that. The skip went away and never returned. She got her UD and was working on her RE (had 2 legs), when her splenic tumor ruptured. She was 100% sound when she died at almost 12 years. Since my experience with her, goldens #3,4,5,6,7,8, and 9 have all been raised on cosequin or dasuquin w/MSM and fish oil. Golden #3 is very sound jointwise and is 11 1/2 years old.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

@Sally's Mom - definitely, I'm hoping with my guy that I will have the same success in keeping him sound and active all through his life.

There is somebody in our rally class who has a bernese with either bi or uni hip dysplasia (I forgot to ask her which it was). That dog is only 2 and at least last night she was as stiff and gimpy as my two old men were in their senior years with their old age arthritis.  She looked very uncomfortable and I now know what a bunny hop looks like. 

I hugged my Jacks and told him he was not going to get like that. 

I do believe that he is as sound as he is now because I kept him very thin when he was a puppy and young dog and limited and controlled his exercise.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

So NO Nuvet fed dog has EVER developed cancer? BS!


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Megora said:


> I was looking at the recommended mega doses of fish oil, and I simply can't do that with my adult dog (who does get 2 pills of salmon oil a day). Especially since he also gets plenty of the same vitamins and nutrients in his food. You talk about vitamin overdose...


 
Many vets recommend the 300 mg combined DHA/EPA per 10 lb of body weight. It is considered at therapeutic dose.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

It's interesting to me that Selka took gluc and condroitin all his life. When he had the xrays for his limp, the (idiot) vet told me first :the good news is he is 11 and a half and has NO ARTHRITIS at all, anywhere!! The bad news is he has terminal bone cancer. You can imagine what I said (later) to her!!!

People and dogs get cancer every day who never smoked, drank, ate badly etc. It's the environment in general. cancer sucks.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Penny & Maggie's Mom said:


> Many vets recommend the 300 mg combined DHA/EPA per 10 lb of body weight. It is considered at therapeutic dose.


Which means that my guy would have to take 8 pills a day vs the 2 I give him. :uhoh: I'm sure it's nothing compared to how much he gets from the four pumps from the liquid salmon oil, but it still freaks me out thinking of cutting up four of those pills per meal. I think it's because one is a human product and the other is packaged for dogs so you assume it's been tested on dogs and the dosages are safe, etc.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Megora said:


> Which means that my guy would have to take 8 pills a day vs the 2 I give him. :uhoh: I'm sure it's nothing compared to how much he gets from the four pumps from the liquid salmon oil, but it still freaks me out thinking of cutting up four of those pills per meal. I think it's because one is a human product and the other is packaged for dogs so you assume it's been tested on dogs and the dosages are safe, etc.


The EPA/DHA of the capsules we use for Toby are 684 per capsule (total fish oils of 1200 mg), which means just 2-3 capsules for him at just under 60 lbs. He actually chews them like a treat, piercing the gel cap himself. If you didn't want to give 8 pills a day but wanted the benefits of anti-inflammtory levels (and I gather this isn't a concern for your dogs) you could probably find a pill that is more concentrated with the EPA/DHA Omega 3s.


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Megora said:


> But
> But I think that's why people fall for the Nuvet promises. Because there are a lot of people out there who are looking for a way to cheat genetics in some way for their dogs.
> 
> And it's not just Nuvet.
> ...


I think I have the same catalog. 
There's one product, in particular, that they market as a cancer prevention supplement. I was skeptical of those claims, but thought it might have other benefits so I tried it with Riley for a short time. It didn't agree with him, so we stopped.

What really gets me about this company is that they not only suggest giving your dog three of their supplements, daily (at least two of which are blood thinners) but they tell you that the dose can be doubled or tripled if you want to see more immediate or dramatic effects. That _can't _be good.


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## IowaGold (Nov 3, 2009)

I don't believe in the slightest that giving glucosamine/chondroitin/MSM/Fish Oil/Whatever will PREVENT HD/ED, etc. (if it did, my youngest wouldn't have ED). But I do believe in starting active dogs young. At least my dogs do plenty of stupid things as youngsters. I'm certain they do some damage to their joints that isn't evident at the time. Giving gluc/chon/fish oil preemptively means that these supplements are in the system before the dog starts showing signs and my hope is that they help the dog be able to repair these minor damages decreasing the injuries impact in the future.

Re: Mega doses. I don't think you can call the anti-inflammatory doses of fish oil "mega doses" (as you would call 5000mg of Vitamin C). Yes, it's more than one would give a "normal" dog, but if the dog has problems that is the real *proven, recommended* dose. Do I give the anti-inflammatory dose to my middle dog? Nope, because she is OFA good/normal and does not appear to have any arthritis issues at this time (she gets the "normal dog" dose which is about 1/2 of the anti-inflammatory dose). Do I give the higher dose to my youngster with ED? Yep, because she benefits from the anti-inflammatory action. Will I give fish oil to the next puppy? You betcha, but at the "normal" dose until I see a reason otherwise.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

IowaGold said:


> I don't believe in the slightest that giving glucosamine/chondroitin/MSM/Fish Oil/Whatever will PREVENT HD/ED, etc. (if it did, my youngest wouldn't have ED).


Right. G/C/MSM might lessen symptoms or slow down the damage to cartilage, and fish oil might lessen inflammation, but neither can change the fundamental formation of a joint.


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## Ryder's mon (Aug 27, 2011)

My golden has been on it Nuvet since he came home with me at 10 weeks old as this was a stipulation from my breeder. He is now 2 years old and recently diagnosed with osteosarcoma with pulmonary metatisis. There you have it folks... while i believe supplements can help to a certain degree, they do not protect them from diseases in which the breed is predisposed to. Since he is receiving chemo treatments, he cannot take the Nuvet vitamin.


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

So sorry to hear about your dog.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

I'm sorry to hear about your dog, and at such a young age. I'm sending you special thoughts and prayers for you and your pup. Two years of age is too young..


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

How awful. I'm so sorry your youngster has that awful diagnosis. Prayers coming your way.


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## BayBeams (Jan 3, 2010)

Ryder's mon said:


> My golden has been on it Nuvet since he came home with me at 10 weeks old as this was a stipulation from my breeder. He is now 2 years old and recently diagnosed with osteosarcoma with pulmonary metatisis. There you have it folks... while i believe supplements can help to a certain degree, they do not protect them from diseases in which the breed is predisposed to. Since he is receiving chemo treatments, he cannot take the Nuvet vitamin.


I am so sorry to hear of your young pup having this devastating disease. If you like why don't you start a separate thread for your pup so you can share your journey and the forum can offer support and prayers. So many of us have been down that cancer road but for one so young is tragic.
Sending positive thoughts to you and your pup.


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## Claire's Friend (Feb 26, 2007)

They guaranteed me it would stop Morgan's seizures.....right. It made them worse !


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## oakleysmommy (Feb 20, 2011)

So sorry to hear this...prayers for you and your family


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Sally's Mom said:


> There! I hope I got everyone's attention. I was on the Icewind Golden Website(which I think I found in the AKC Gazette) where I learned new fun facts about cancer prevention. The Nuvet position is that there are only 2 reasons dogs or cats will get cancer. The reasons are 1)your pet has to have a low immune system and 2)your pet has to have a toxin present. Seriously who out there is drinking the Koolaid that believes this? If cancer prevention is so obvious why didn't my mother who walked 3 miles daily, ate blueberrries and oatmeal, took her flaxseed, etc out live her mom's death age when her mom was a smoker and had strokes starting at 60 years? Who believes in Nuvet? and tell us why?


 
Don't even get me started. I have made my share of rants about that snakeoil on this forum over the years... 
The fact that "breeders" who push this stuff all use the same scripted "health guarantee", void if NuVet is not use, is enough for me. It's a pyramid scheme. These "breeders" get a monthly statement from the company listing which of their puppy buyers are purchasing the crap, they get a kickback, and if a buyer is NOT on the list, they don't have to do a dang thing when the dog is dysplastic, has elbow dysplasia, or any other health issue. Nice.


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## lvlogan (Oct 31, 2011)

I had to respond to this one. All of my kids are given their immunity supplement and 2 of my seniors also take their Joint Health. I could be completely just lucky but I have a thriving 12 and 10 year old. They also have a great diet, plenty of off-leash play and swimming and annual ultrasounds/blood work. I have no health concerns with either of them (I say this while I knock on wood)
I like the supplements even if it isn't doing what they claim, the supplements are filled with good stuff that are human-grade ingredients and really can't hurt. I feel good about spending the money to maybe give them an extra advantage to their health. That alone seems worth the risk, they either add no value or they do add some, either way, I will take that chance.


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

Many goldens are thriving at 10-12 years... I have had 3 and at least 2 died from cancer...


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## goldens9 (Apr 7, 2020)

Some golden puppy breeders required that if we buy their golden puppy, we would sign a contract to spend some 150 a month at NuVet for supplements for the life of the Golden, using the breeder's sales number. Such a huge turn off. I can buy a lot more higher quality fresh supplements for less than 150 a month. A retired vet told me that the biggest cancer cause in Goldens are over vaccination chemical toxins, and recommended No vaccines and use nosodes as an alternative as he had his own Goldens and this vet said he never vaccinated his Golden Retrievers due to Goldens are too sensitive to toxic chemicals injected in the body as the body cannot get rid of injected toxins so it is a perfect storm to grow cancer. So avoided any breeders that would force a contract to buy Nuvet for life of the golden I purchased from them. I know the breeder wanted the commission, but I know better than NuVet what supplements to give and want the freedom to do better. I have already researched and can get a lot of fresh supplements for less than the 150 a month that breeder wanted us to spend at NuVet. Wanting us to sign a contract for nuvet was so unprofessional. It is OK to recommend supplements and ask if we buy supplements from NuVet would be so kind to use the golden breeders sales number, but the ultimate decision should be up to us. After that experience, learning that NuVet was going after breeders to force puppy contracts to force puppy buyers to buy nuvet supplements for life, that has made me to avoid buying any NuVet products ever.


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