# Do they drug test show dogs? Are there ways to enhance movement of an older dog?



## MillysMom (Nov 5, 2008)

I posted this on the Westminster thread, but I jumped in towards the end and never got a response. 

Forgive me if this is a stupid question, I am still very new to Goldens and dog shows, and am trying to learn as much as possible about both.

Are there any ways to enhance the movement of an older dog? I know with age can come stiffness, and was wondering if things like Adequan, daily Cosequin or glucosamine are allowed to be used on a show dog? Do they drug test the dogs? Would this mask stiffness? Especially Adequan, as it is injected, and can really make a huge difference (I haven’t used it in dogs, but I have in horses and it is like night and day with the way an older horse’s movement changes with the stuff). I know when I put my old Beagle on Cosequin (granted this is so much milder than injecting Adequan) with in 3 weeks she went from having trouble walking and completely unable to climb the stairs off the porch to running around the farm like she did when she was 5.


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

MillysMom said:


> Are there any ways to enhance the movement of an older dog? I know with age can come stiffness, and was wondering if things like Adequan, daily Cosequin or glucosamine are allowed to be used on a show dog? Do they drug test the dogs? Would this mask stiffness?


There isn't any drug testing at this point - From time to time I hear a lot about who's using what - thyroid supplements for more coat, sedatives, pain killers for lame dogs...the cheaters will cheat - they always find a way. AKC has clarified their rules about medications - but IMO they are as clear as mud. I have a hypo-thyroid dog and I do continue to show him in companion events.

There was some discussion about thyroid drugs - whether those dogs were eligible to compete based on that particular medication - the consensus from AKC was that they were OK in Obedience/Agility/Tracking but not in the breed ring (which is fine because he's not breed quality and is neutered anyhow). 

I've used adequan for my dogs - though not my current dogs (yet) - I know how much it can help an achy dog feel better. There are a lot of agility dogs on adequan and cosequin - performance enhancing? Maybe. What about supplementation - is that ethical? When I had horses we supplemented with yucca - we had some good results - performance enhancing? Maybe. Caught on drug tests? No...But not all "supplements" are so benign. And if certain supplements are beneficial to the dog's health would I choose to take him off those supplements to compete or step back and look at the bigger picture, continue to supplement and not show? I'd probably pull from showing if I had to make that choice.

Erica


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

No drug testing as of yet. Here's the thing - nothing that could be given will make bad movement good. Anabolic steroid use is not something that anyone planning to use a dog for breeding is going to want to play around with, and analgesics to mask pain are tricky in that a dog can exacerbate an injury if he doesn't feel pain and performs through it.

It's a dicey subject. There has been some administration of caffeine - (obviously not Stumpy! lol) to keep "ring sour" dogs "up", but for the most part, aside from cosmetics, what you see is what you get.


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## sammydog (Aug 23, 2008)

What an interesting thread. I never thought of things like that. I give my dogs glucosamine with the hopes that in their later years they will not have joint pain. But I don't think it affects their performance... As they age if they do show pain I would want to give them something stronger... But at that point I would probably be retiring them from those high jumps! I have also heard of flyball dogs getting honey and some of those high calorie pastes to keep their energy high during long weekend tournaments...

For the AKC companion events, since you are not trying to beat out another dog for a title, there may be a different outlook on things. Although I remember hearing a few years ago that an agility person was caught changing her score on the scribe sheet! I would never want to win or Q that way!!!


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## Rob's GRs (Feb 25, 2007)

What, could you not imagine a dog like below and a handler looking like that guy below as well.... LOL...


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

LOL Rob both those pictures are gross!!! Unbelievable that dog is a Whippet!


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

sammydog said:


> For the AKC companion events, since you are not trying to beat out another dog for a title, there may be a different outlook on things.


Not every sport - in Obedience to get an OTCH you have to beat a certain number of dogs for points. There are people pushing dogs through a lot of physical problems...

Erica


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## sammydog (Aug 23, 2008)

MurphyTeller said:


> Not every sport - in Obedience to get an OTCH you have to beat a certain number of dogs for points. There are people pushing dogs through a lot of physical problems...
> 
> Erica


Ooops! I have heard that before, but totally forgot. My bad... So do you think a certain level of testing would be beneficial to the sport?


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

MurphyTeller said:


> There are people pushing dogs through a lot of physical problems...



That just sounds borderline abusive to me.


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## Augie's Mom (Sep 28, 2007)

Those pics look out of a sci fi thriller, please say those aren't real.


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

Augie's Mom said:


> Those pics look out of a sci fi thriller, please say those aren't real.



I know the dog one is definitely real, and have no reason to believe the human one isn't too. That dog is a Whippet if you can believe that! She has a genetic mutation I believe.


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## sammydog (Aug 23, 2008)

Yes, I have seen pictures of "bully" whippets before. I know some people on this board have whippets so they may have some better resources. But here is an article...

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/12/science/12dog.html


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## Rob's GRs (Feb 25, 2007)

The whippet picture is real and here is the story behind it..



> The pic is the result of a mutation in the myostatin gene. The mutation first appeared in racing lines of whippets several years ago. The "double-muscle" gene is recessive, so dogs with one copy of the gene look very much like a whippet is supposed to look-- thin and wiry. Dogs with two copies of the gene look like the pic below.


The muscle guy is me..... LOL 
That human picture is a photoshopped pictured that has floated around for some years as to what some bodybuilders "think" they could some day get to using (or over using) steroids and such.


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

sammydog said:


> Ooops! I have heard that before, but totally forgot. My bad... So do you think a certain level of testing would be beneficial to the sport?


I don't think it'd change anything. These dogs are trained and expected to work through it. Some of these dogs are UDX 30+ with thousands of OTCH points, the dogs are visably lame but they are never excused from the ring....I don't have an answer...horses are excused from the hunter, dressage and jumper rings all the time because of soundness issues...

Erica


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Rob's GRs said:


> What, could you not imagine a dog like below and a handler looking like that guy below as well.... LOL...


That's a "bully Whippet" which is a bizarre mutation. Scarey.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

They should definitely test them for drugs if the have an "accident" in the ring.


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

I think obedience judges should *definitely* excuse lame dogs from the ring, but I doubt you'll ever see it if it's a "known" handler showing a "known" dog.


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

vrocco1 said:


> They should definitely test them for drugs if the have an "accident" in the ring.


I think they should publish the handler and owner's names some place with high visability if the dog has an accident in the ring...but that's just me.
Erica


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## goldengirls550 (Jun 12, 2008)

sammydog said:


> Yes, I have seen pictures of "bully" whippets before. I know some people on this board have whippets so they may have some better resources. But here is an article...
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/12/science/12dog.html


I actually read that exact article when doing my research paper back in December. I don't like that philosophy at all


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

MurphyTeller said:


> I think they should publish the handler and owner's names some place with high visability if the dog has an accident in the ring...but that's just me.
> Erica


 
??? I've seen dogs who have been well ex'd still have an accident in the ring - it happens. However, if a handler consistently runs dogs in and his/her dogs do, then I'd believe that they weren't properly caring for their charges.

Many years ago, I was showing Tiller at the Ft. Detroit Specialty in 12-18. He'd been ex'd, all was well. James Reynolds was judging. Just after he'd examined him, and we'd done our go around, Tiller deposited THE largest pile I have EVER seen other than from a bovine. I was mortified! CLEAN UP IN RING 1!!!!!! I wanted to die, as I highly respect Mr. Reynolds - and he also happens to be an elegant gentleman. I thought I was a goner. When he pulled his cuts, he pointed to me and announced in his deep, proper voice "I am giving you blue in spite of your little indescretion." Gads. I almost think that was worse. He did go on to take Reserve. I'll do ANYTHING to never have that happen again.


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

On a similar, though much smaller scale and slightly less embarassing note, I was the only one that had a puppy have an doodoo accident in our puppy class. Not only that, he also threw up the same night! It was my fault, it was before I discovered his wheat allergy and the training treats kept making him sick  And it was a particularly good night for him and he was earning tons of treats.. poor guy's tummy just couldn't handle it. 

I really can't imagine the embarassment of it happening in a conformation show ring. Although I am of the mindset that they are DOGS and accidents can happen.


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