# Looking for a dark, old-fashioned golden



## bb'smom (Jan 3, 2009)

*Long legged blondes*

Me too! We have been spoiled with our two beauties--very tall, shorter coats and great athletes...great dispositions-very smart too! But Boomer died suddenly--he had just turned 8 and we are looking but very concerned about health. Most of the webpages I've checked seem to have shorter, more block-headed types...beautiful but not our type.

I'd be interested in the forum's input.

Thanks,
Gerrianne


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## Oaklys Dad (Dec 28, 2005)

The dog you are describing would be considered a "Field Type Golden" in advertisements. There are still lots of people out there breeding them.


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

Oaklys Dad said:


> The dog you are describing would be considered a "Field Type Golden" in advertisements. There are still lots of people out there breeding them.



I think they were saying they are finding "field golden" breeders but the dogs they breed are much smaller and not exactly what he's looking for.

I think Dillon is a perfect example of what the OP described he wants. He's TALL, long legs, extremely soft (almost oily soft) coat that's very short to his body with not a whole lot of feathering, except on his tail. He's got a narrow (not blocky AT ALL) head but that may also be due to him most likely being neutered at a young age too. He's about 70lbs. Here's one of the only decent full body pics of him I have. 










Of course I didn't get him from a breeder, so I have no recommendations, but is this kind of what you meant as far as looks?


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Rhonda Mulholland at Sand Dancer as well as TippyKayak's breeder Windrush(Lisa Weinberg) fit that bill.

[email protected] Phone: 207-743-8852


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## bb'smom (Jan 3, 2009)

This is the type we are looking for--our guys are much blonder but I love the redder ones too! 

We will travel too-no problem!


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## bwoz (Jul 12, 2007)

If you're looking to purchase from a breeder, field/agility, etc events are always good because you get to see the dogs and become familiar with the breeders in your area. Rescue is a good option too because most pups there are already done growing and what you see is what you get. 
In CT, I've met lots of Sunfire dogs and they participate in field. Beautiful and I think what you may be describing. Good luck to you.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

I agree about Sunfire.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*BB's Mom & Gunny*

*Please be sure to check out Roger at American Lab Rescue in Willington, CT.
He is JUST GORGEOUS!!!
HE'S ON THIS FORUM!!!
Here is Roger's Link:

http://www.goldenretrieverforum.com/showthread.php?p=730774#post730774*


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Do you think Roger is a Sunfire golden? He's in the right area, and he sure looks like one. I wonder if it would be worth checking in with them?


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## bwoz (Jul 12, 2007)

I'd hope if the rescue has the actual AKC papers that they would have contacted the breeder but I guess you never know the circumstances. I'm sure a reputable one would take this boy back.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Lilly*

Lilly

Can you check w/American lab Rescue and see if they have checked with the breeder?


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## cham (Feb 21, 2008)

These shots are of my Mitchell, a rescue out of AL. I think he is the type you might be looking for. These shots were take by his foster mom and the rescue before the adoption took place. He is rather thin in these photos, he is now up to 67lbs of solid muscle. Are you looking for an unspayed female to use as a foundation bitch? If not, I would check with the various rescues.


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

Just a comment/word of advice....

I know several breeders here won't tend to bother much if they have a puppy person who is really focused on color or type over everything else. My girl's breeder gets the odd person who wants to come look at the pups before they commit or want to return the dog if it doesn't end up the right color - she usually doesn't even reply if that's their big concern. Plus most breeders who are going for color are overlooking health or other more important factors - something to keep in mind when looking.

There are darker dogs out there for sure and I know you'll find the perfect pup, but just keep that in mind when looking. It's nice to have the perfect looking dog, but if they end up with health problems or have a horrible temperment you can't live with you're not going to be as happy.

Lana


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Ljilly28 said:


> Rhonda Mulholland at Sand Dancer as well as TippyKayak's breeder Windrush(Lisa Weinberg) fit that bill.
> 
> [email protected] Phone: 207-743-8852


True, and Rhonda did just have that litter, right? So she might actually have dogs ready to go right now. I'm not sure, but it would be worth calling. And while I am heartbroken to have lost Gus (my dog from her) at six of a very rare lymphoma, her lines have generally very good longevity. And Gus was an ideal Golden: drivey and fun outdoors, but a perfect gentlemen and a snuggler indoors.

Rhonda's dogs aren't terribly tall, though. They are certainly more old-fashioned, with a little less bone and blockiness, but they're also a little on the small side. Though Jill, your Finn is right smack in the middle of standard, right?

Lisa's dogs have more "show" influence, since she's consciously trying to breed dogs that do well in both conformation and working situations, the real "all-purpose" Goldens. So you'll definitely see a little more of that "show" look and bone. Still, the dogs do look very classic and regal, and they certainly aren't as blocky or heavy boned as the dogs who are bred exclusively for show.

Both those breeders have heavy influence from the Sunfire dogs, especially Sunfire's XX Muleteam Borax, a very classic, beautiful, smart dog. Actually, Lisa's (in my opinion) most promising bitch is also a Sunfire dog, Sunfire Windrush's Mrs Peele.

The Sunfire website has lots and lots of pictures.

Just one proviso: I don't know what your lifestyle is like, but all of these dogs, from Sand Dancer, Windrush, and Sunfire, come from real working lines. They need tons of exercise and stimulation in order to be good, happy companions. They won't make good couch potatoes. A couple of walks around the block on a leash each day won't be enough to work out their energy and fulfill their need to work. Plan on long off-leash walks in the woods or on enrolling in obedience, agility, hunting, or field classes.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Cham*

CHAM:

Your Mitchell is just beautiful and I agree wholeheartedly-check with Golden Ret. Rescues and shelters, too.


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

*Reply*

Yes, Dillon is the body build I'm looking for. My gal had a tad longer coat and some more feathering. She was a cross between a very large field trial-type mom and a show-line sire. Anybody know a breeder with this type of dog?



missmarstar said:


> I think they were saying they are finding "field golden" breeders but the dogs they breed are much smaller and not exactly what he's looking for.
> 
> I think Dillon is a perfect example of what the OP described he wants. He's TALL, long legs, extremely soft (almost oily soft) coat that's very short to his body with not a whole lot of feathering, except on his tail. He's got a narrow (not blocky AT ALL) head but that may also be due to him most likely being neutered at a young age too. He's about 70lbs. Here's one of the only decent full body pics of him I have.
> 
> ...


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

Thanks for all this info. I'm off to the websites now. 

Concerning energy level, I do have a question. My gal was pretty high energy outside - up until she was around 5, we usually played ball for about 45 minutes each night. She had free run of 2/3's of an acre, but unless she had another dog visiting, she wasn't much of an explorer. We usually did a 1.3 mile walk/jog every night.

Do you think that the dogs from these breeders will need more exercise than that?

Thanks again.





tippykayak said:


> True, and Rhonda did just have that litter, right? So she might actually have dogs ready to go right now. I'm not sure, but it would be worth calling. And while I am heartbroken to have lost Gus (my dog from her) at six of a very rare lymphoma, her lines have generally very good longevity. And Gus was an ideal Golden: drivey and fun outdoors, but a perfect gentlemen and a snuggler indoors.
> 
> Rhonda's dogs aren't terribly tall, though. They are certainly more old-fashioned, with a little less bone and blockiness, but they're also a little on the small side. Though Jill, your Finn is right smack in the middle of standard, right?
> 
> ...


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## bwoz (Jul 12, 2007)

IMHO I think it just depends on the individual personality of the dog too. I've seen some laid back performance type pups, and I've seen high energy showy types. I think if you go with a breeder, they should be able to tell you alot about the personality of the litter you're looking into. Good luck, keep us posted.


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

I have to agree with you here. Both of the goldens we've had have been half performance and half show. One was high energy and one is laid back. I've seen the same in pure show lines and pure field trial line dogs that friends have. A lot has to do with personality I think. In fact, the breeder of the dog we currently have has her daughter as well. Our girl is pretty mellow and reserved except when she's chasing her Chuck-it. Her daughter is an extrovert and exuberance plus. A good breeder usually tries to match buyer's personality and puppy personality, I think.




bwoz said:


> IMHO I think it just depends on the individual personality of the dog too. I've seen some laid back performance type pups, and I've seen high energy showy types. I think if you go with a breeder, they should be able to tell you alot about the personality of the litter you're looking into. Good luck, keep us posted.


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## Suzie G (Jun 29, 2008)

Hi, Suzie G. here

My Maggie is a Field Golden.(Topbrass) She weighs about 57 # and is a dark golden color. Her dad is about 70 #. Her mom was 55#

Have any of you read studies about early spaying/neutering (before 2 yrs of age) and the effect it has on bone development in athletic dogs ? 

Maggie is about 21 mo old and has not been spayed. She is the only Golden in our obediance class that is intact. Among all of the Goldens there-that look like they are of the "Field " type- she is the shortest. All of the others (spayed and neutered ) have very long legs. The research I have seen suggests that early spaying can lead to the lengthening of the leg bones. Have any of you heard of anything like this ?


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

*Response*

Unfortunately, I haven't read much about this issue. Sorry!


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Suzie G. said:


> Have any of you read studies about early spaying/neutering (before 2 yrs of age) and the effect it has on bone development in athletic dogs ?


The research is still emerging, but it does seem that dogs who are fixed before puberty is complete end up with more growth in the long bones, and therefore end up leggier. I've certainly read at least two persuasive studies on the subject. I think that's sort of largely accepted here on the forum, and while lots of vets still subscribe to spaying/neutering at six months, many, many breeders and Golden enthusiasts now encourage waiting until eighteen months or even two years.

I don't think it's fair yet to say it's "proven" that it's better to wait for health reasons, but it does seem that, after more research, practices will change.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Gunny said:


> Thanks for all this info. I'm off to the websites now.
> 
> Concerning energy level, I do have a question. My gal was pretty high energy outside - up until she was around 5, we usually played ball for about 45 minutes each night. She had free run of 2/3's of an acre, but unless she had another dog visiting, she wasn't much of an explorer. We usually did a 1.3 mile walk/jog every night.
> 
> ...


That might do it, but it might be on the short side, especially if that last walk of the night is leashed. Do you have any interest in obedience or agility competition? The dogs seem to really benefit from a real working situation, and once you get into it a little, it's incredibly rewarding to develop that relationship with your dog.

Either way, discuss it with the breeder and be realistic and honest about your lifestyle. A good breeder will have a very good idea about the kind of exercise and stimulation the dogs will need, and good communication is the best way to get matched up well. If the breeder thinks the dog will be too much for the situation, accept that assessment.

Also - just to clarify something else I wrote: show dogs aren't necessarily low-energy, just as working dogs aren't necessarily high-energy. I definitely wasn't trying to make that distinction. I was speaking from personal experience about Sunfire, Windrush, and Sand Dancer dogs. It is absolutely possible to get yourself into more dog than you're ready for.


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## Bogey's Mom (Dec 23, 2008)

Ljilly28 said:


> Rhonda Mulholland at Sand Dancer as well as TippyKayak's breeder Windrush(Lisa Weinberg) fit that bill.
> 
> [email protected] Phone: 207-743-8852


Wow! That dog is sooooo pretty.


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## beargroomer (Jan 2, 2008)

Ljilly28 said:


> Rhonda Mulholland at Sand Dancer as well as TippyKayak's breeder Windrush(Lisa Weinberg) fit that bill.
> 
> [email protected] Phone: 207-743-8852



OMG, this dog is gorgeous! 

You seem to know Golden pedigrees well and know which breeders specializes in a certain type. I'm addicted to K9data and just starting to recognize some of the famous dogs in different pedigrees. It's so much fun!
I'm going to have to email you to get your help finding the perfect brother to Gibson and Fyodor! Will you help?


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

beargroomer said:


> I'm going to have to email you to get your help finding the perfect brother to Gibson and Fyodor! Will you help?



I've now seen TWO mentions of this... is this happening sometime soon?? How exciting!!


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Bogey's Mom said:


> Wow! That dog is sooooo pretty.


That dog Ranger is a half brother to Tippykayak's pup Comet, and bred by Rhonda Mulholland at Sand Dancer using a sire owned by Lisa Weinberg at Windrush, a dog with a Sunfire name, lol. 
http://www.k9data.com/pedigree.asp?ID=79154
He's a tremendous dog in person, a lean 77ish lbs. 

Here is Ranger's littermate Rodin, Finn& Gus' father:










Rhonda has one litter right now, Sky x Tommy that should result in big, old-fashioned golden's with similar looks to Ranger and Rodin(Sky is their sister).

The other litter, I dont think will fit the bill bc , as Brian said, they will be smaller and high energy. 

Getting Rhonda to part with one of those Sky puppies though will be like adopting a child! Sky is her pride and joy. Their other sister Flare was killed by a car the first week she went to her new family, and I think that was pretty traumatic for the breeder.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

beargroomer said:


> OMG, this dog is gorgeous!
> 
> You seem to know Golden pedigrees well and know which breeders specializes in a certain type. I'm addicted to K9data and just starting to recognize some of the famous dogs in different pedigrees. It's so much fun!
> I'm going to have to email you to get your help finding the perfect brother to Gibson and Fyodor! Will you help?


Lol, I think the best advice is to run it by Ambika(Hank)!


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## Sucker For Gold (Jan 13, 2009)

Gunny, 

I'm from Erie. Don't know if I can help you at all, but I'd be glad to make a couple calls for you. We bought a field red from a local BYB 9 years ago. We just lost him in January. He was tall, weighed in at 78-80 and was plenty trim. I would imagine that females related to him probably would have gotten into the 60 lb.+ range

I have not talked to this breeder since we bought, so I don't know if they even still breed. But I would be more than happy to give then a call and see if I can't get some leads for you to the breeders that they went to if they don't still breed.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

Swampcollie has some beautiful field type Goldens. His GR's are very active and need the right family. I'm not sure if he breeds GR's anymore.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

I just realized when looking at the Sunfire dogs and Selka's pedigree on k9data that Sunfire's Winchester was Selka's grand sire on his dam's side! I knew he had Sunfire on his sire's side as his dad was Sunfire's Valiant Apollo but both sides! WOOHOO!!

I would never consider Selka and Gunner field goldens though. They love to retrieve but were bred for obedience.They have many Champions of both field and conformation in their pedigrees though. And though they have gotten "redder" as they have aged, they were very blonde as younger dogs.


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

Oh, thank you so much!!! I"d love to know if there is someone in your area that's still breeding these dogs in your area.

I'm so sorry for your loss. What happened?



Sucker For Gold said:


> Gunny,
> 
> I'm from Erie. Don't know if I can help you at all, but I'd be glad to make a couple calls for you. We bought a field red from a local BYB 9 years ago. We just lost him in January. He was tall, weighed in at 78-80 and was plenty trim. I would imagine that females related to him probably would have gotten into the 60 lb.+ range
> 
> I have not talked to this breeder since we bought, so I don't know if they even still breed. But I would be more than happy to give then a call and see if I can't get some leads for you to the breeders that they went to if they don't still breed.


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

Thanks so much! It would be wonderful to find a good breeder in that area.


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

Thanks for the advice! I recognize that foremost is the health of the bloodlines. After my Golden was diagnosed with Lymphoma, I spent hours and hours reading about golden health issues, and talked to numerous vet internists, oncologists, and researchers at Univ. of Penn. Veterinary School. I've already walked away from some litters just because I didn't feel comfortable with the breeder's practices or dogs. I've also visited some shows, etc. So I'm being very careful about breeders. I'm just trying to find a good match for my circumstances and lifestyle - I love jogging with a dog and playing catch, and I have over 2/3's of an acre fenced in (more unfenced land) that is available for dogs to run freely. I'm trying to find a dog with a good disposition, personality and intelligence. I also just prefer the dark color and the more athletic build. I've owned 9 dogs over the course of my life to date, (7 of whom were working dogs) so I've had some experience with breeders - just not golden breeders. I know I may have to compromise a bit on color - the golden I adopted last year is a lighter red - but if I'm going to get a puppy, it'd be nice to get one with something of the look I like.

Thanks again for your helpful advice 



Bender said:


> Just a comment/word of advice....
> 
> I know several breeders here won't tend to bother much if they have a puppy person who is really focused on color or type over everything else. My girl's breeder gets the odd person who wants to come look at the pups before they commit or want to return the dog if it doesn't end up the right color - she usually doesn't even reply if that's their big concern. Plus most breeders who are going for color are overlooking health or other more important factors - something to keep in mind when looking.
> 
> ...


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## Sucker For Gold (Jan 13, 2009)

Gunny said:


> Oh, thank you so much!!! I"d love to know if there is someone in your area that's still breeding these dogs in your area.
> 
> I'm so sorry for your loss. What happened?


We lost Rusty on Jan 11th after a 2 month battle with hemangiosarcoma (heart & spleen) . In 2000 we lost our German Shepherd to Hemangio of the liver. We are on a roll with this disease:no:. Unfortunately we have fallen head over heels in love with goldens after having had Rusty and we can not live without one. We will be getting a baby girl (show type) on March 7th. This time, like you, we are spending great amounts of time trying to learn about anything and everything that will give us an advantage over cancer.

As for your breeder search, let me make at least one phone call to Rusty's breeder and see if I can find anything out. They are/were a BYB (or at least they were 9 years ago). Unless their operation has changed greatly in that time, I would not recommend them. However, with a little bit of luck, I can find out who their original breeders were and maybe we can chase the trail from there. In all honesty, I was just looking at Rusty's pedigree last night and I don't see anyhthing that stands out in the way of a great line, so this might be a dead end, but it's worth a shot. Maybe some digging will turn up something.


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

*Reply*



Sucker For Gold said:


> We lost Rusty on Jan 11th after a 2 month battle with hemangiosarcoma (heart & spleen) . In 2000 we lost our German Shepherd to Hemangio of the liver. We are on a roll with this disease:no:. Unfortunately we have fallen head over heels in love with goldens after having had Rusty and we can not live without one. We will be getting a baby girl (show type) on March 7th. This time, like you, we are spending great amounts of time trying to learn about anything and everything that will give us an advantage over cancer.
> 
> As for your breeder search, let me make at least one phone call to Rusty's breeder and see if I can find anything out. They are/were a BYB (or at least they were 9 years ago). Unless their operation has changed greatly in that time, I would not recommend them. However, with a little bit of luck, I can find out who their original breeders were and maybe we can chase the trail from there. In all honesty, I was just looking at Rusty's pedigree last night and I don't see anyhthing that stands out in the way of a great line, so this might be a dead end, but it's worth a shot. Maybe some digging will turn up something.


I'm so sorry for your loss - Goldens in particular seem to really bond to our hearts. There's some research going on about canine cancer, particularly at Univ. of Penn. for lymphoma, but unfortunately, funding has _always _been a major issue with veterinary research studies.

Thanks for any information you can turn up in your search. I do so much appreciate your efforts.


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## paula bedard (Feb 5, 2008)

Just read through the thread and want to wish you good luck in finding your new best friend. May you find the pup the want very soon. I'm partial to Red Golden's too. My first Golden Love was my Red Boy Sam. He too was a big dog. I have Ike now and his shading is much lighter. He has gotten a bit darker over the last year, but I'd be very surprised if he darkened up to Sam's coloring...

My signature below is deceptive, Ike is in bright sunlight and Sam's pic was taken in the shade.


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

paula bedard said:


> Just read through the thread and want to wish you good luck in finding your new best friend. May you find the pup the want very soon. I'm partial to Red Golden's too. My first Golden Love was my Red Boy Sam. He too was a big dog. I have Ike now and his shading is much lighter. He has gotten a bit darker over the last year, but I'd be very surprised if he darkened up to Sam's coloring...
> 
> My signature below is deceptive, Ike is in bright sunlight and Sam's pic was taken in the shade.


They both are so sweet. Sam looks like my girl. Goldens are special dogs, aren't they?


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Any uPdates??!!


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

I'm sorry - you're email got detoured to the spam filter! I've contacted Wynwood Kennels but haven't heard back yet. I've also searched more for other breeders, but no one seems to be having puppies until fall. Unfortunately, my best time to get and train a pup is May - August when my teaching load is lighter.

Thanks for checking in. Please let me know if you have any other leads!



Ljilly28 said:


> Any uPdates??!!


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Everyone on the forum seems to adore their Dichi goldens:http://www.everythinggolden.com/new_page_233.htm

Topbrass will definitely have darker red http://www.topbrass-retrievers.com/litters.htm


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## bb'smom (Jan 3, 2009)

*Breeders*

Any experiences here with Gaylans?


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

Ljilly28 said:


> Any uPdates??!!


Do you by chance have contact information for Wynwood besides the email address? I've tried to email them twice, but not heard back. I really love their philosophy and their dogs, and the timing of the one litter would be great. I'm afraid when I emailed them the first time, my email got scrambled because our university email system is having problems at the moment. I fear they must think I'm a total idiot because the email disappeared before I was finished and I found it later in my outbox - grrrr. I would love to talk to the owners to assure them I'm a responsible person with a somewhat flexible schedule as a university professor and a very experienced dog owner (I grew up on a small farm and am experienced with everything from dogs to poultry, rabbits, ponies, etc.) 

Does anyone have alternative contact information for Wynwood? 

Thanks so very much in advance!


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## NuttinButGoldens (Jan 10, 2009)

I love all Goldens, but Red Goldens Rule


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## Gunny (Feb 21, 2009)

I agree! Love that picture!! When I was young, we had a farm collie and an English shepherd. ( I grew up on a small farm.) The English Shepherd used to sleep like that - always cracked me up!!





NuttinButGoldens said:


> I love all Goldens, but Red Goldens Rule


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## bb'smom (Jan 3, 2009)

*New Pup on the Way*

Well, we have taken the plunge-8 weeks after Boomer went to the Bridge-we made a deposit with Top-Brass Retrievers for a TorchxRipley puppy. Our sweet Bailey is so lonely without his brother and we could not resist the looks of these dogs. Hopefully, we will be in full puppy mode by the end of May!

No dog will ever replace Boomer ut I'm sure he is happy for us.

Gerrianne


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## Bogey's Mom (Dec 23, 2008)

Congratulations to you!!! I hope this will help your family heal. Pictures?


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## telsmith1 (Sep 11, 2006)

bb'smom said:


> Well, we have taken the plunge-8 weeks after Boomer went to the Bridge-we made a deposit with Top-Brass Retrievers for a TorchxRipley puppy. Our sweet Bailey is so lonely without his brother and we could not resist the looks of these dogs. Hopefully, we will be in full puppy mode by the end of May!
> 
> No dog will ever replace Boomer ut I'm sure he is happy for us.
> 
> Gerrianne


Congrats! I have a Topbrass girl and she is awesome! I wouldn't trade her for the world!


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

bb'smom said:


> Well, we have taken the plunge-8 weeks after Boomer went to the Bridge-we made a deposit with Top-Brass Retrievers for a TorchxRipley puppy. Our sweet Bailey is so lonely without his brother and we could not resist the looks of these dogs. Hopefully, we will be in full puppy mode by the end of May!
> 
> No dog will ever replace Boomer ut I'm sure he is happy for us.
> 
> Gerrianne



Whooooooo hoooooooooooooo Would I ever like one of those puppies!


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