# Calm River Golden's Puppy with health issues



## CAROLINA MOM (May 12, 2009)

I am so very sorry for the health problems your Lucie is having. She's really pretty. 

Has your vet given you a referral to a Specialist or Specialty Clinic? You may even want to contact your State's Vet School. Most Vet schools have Small Animal Clinics and offer a wide range of services including surgeries.


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## Goldieluvr1 (May 2, 2014)

So very, very, very feeling what you are going through. Words are never enough, but offer our prayers. 

San Diego has one the best best vet schools/hospitals at UC San Diego, and I believe, not 100% that they are affiliated with UC Davis....We considered bringing our Goldie down for a medical issues. 

https://ucvmcsd.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/

Also, just like you, fell into the trap of "English Cream Golden's", which is how I found my way here. We lost our light colored Golden at age 18 months to polycystic disease. She was the smallest in her litter. 

I absolutely just have so much admiration for you in not giving back the puppy and your commitment to her. Many others would, without realizing what would indeed happen to her. 

There are resources available to you since this is going to be so costly, specifically one in San Diego, https://face4pets.org/, and here is larger list: https://bestfriends.org/resources/financial-aid-pets.

Even though pet insurance wouldn't cover her current medical issues, you might want to look into if as it would cover other potential problems. We learned the hard way with our Labrador Retriever, $10k for TPLO surgery, 7k for the surgery, and almost 3k for rehab. We insured him after that, and it did help offset other health issues he had not related to hips. 

Highly recommend Healthy Paws. Doesn't help with the deafness, and I would ask a ton of questions to rep before signing up and get as much in writing as possible. We are dealing with a potential hip dysplasia diagnosis currently with our Golden, and have already been reimbursed for all of the costs. 

You can always pursue legal action, but that is costly. 

Lucie is SO blessed to have you as her mama, and it's obvious you love her to the moon and back. Wishing you wagging tails and lots of puppy kisses.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

SoCalGolden said:


> Hi all, Here is my long vent/story. Thank you in advance for reading.
> 
> About two weeks ago my 6 month old Golden Retriever Lucie (English Cream but I get it now, was diagnosed with unilateral deafness due to a congenital defect where her ear canal is totally closed off. This was missed by the breeder's vet and also our vet for a number of visits until she had an ear infection that prompted them to really look closely.
> 
> ...




^^^ Reading through all this, I am very sympathetic and sorry you are going through this. A lot of us feel like we are talking to walls when we repeatedly tell people not to buy puppies from just anyone, not to price shop (buy the cheapest available pups), and make sure that the breeders are being selective and breeding for health (doing all clearances). And long schpeel short - I wish all of us were wrong and puppy people would have 12+ years with their dogs without any problems. It's people like yourself who just want a nice dog and thought you were paying a lot for a guaranteed nice dog who are basically walked all over on by schemers out there.  


What you are experiencing with your puppy - is what happens when you have people jumping into dog breeding without any breed knowledge, experience, or accountability. And they rely on "hobby status" as an excuse for not working very hard to be known and respected in the local golden clubs. And even as you have experienced, they skip or skimp on clearances because (1) they would not want to retire a breeding dogs due to failures and (2) their puppy people don't know any better.


With the ear thing - really best of luck and hope it can be resolved. I've never heard of anything like that... and hope that it can get "fixed". 

Temperament - might be many things. At 6 months - you get a lot of dogs exhibiting certain behaviors which get reinforced. I'll never forget when I went with my baby sister to camp which was done on a church member's property. Church member had dogs - and there was an adorable shihtzu pup among those. All the kids kept chasing around after that puppy, picking it up, wanting to hold it and pet it, and would not leave it alone. Before the end of the week that puppy was growling and snapping at hands. 

I think with a lot of families who get golden pups - and they have kids who are very high energy and rather like littermates - you have resource guarding behaviors and correction type behaviors showing up. And it might be exasperated if the pups are hurting/sore somewhere. 

I'd work with the kids to really get them to understand that they can't just climb on her, grab her, or grab anything from her. Avoid the situations that make her growl. 

All the very best - and hope everything sorts out.


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## nolefan (Nov 6, 2009)

My heart goes out to poor Lucie at her rough start in life. I would start by contacting UCDavis vet school and asking for referral. I hope you've respectfully requested the refund of the full purchase price on your girl. This ear issue doesn't appear to be something you would hold the breeder responsible for, but it seems like the least they could do in helping to care for the puppy they produced.

It's a shame that they are breeding Lizzie with her failed elbow https://www.ofa.org/advanced-search?f=sr&appnum=1952061 and their other girl, Grace, https://www.ofa.org/advanced-search?f=sr&appnum=1796214 without any clearances except her hips. Maybe you will save someone researching this breeder in the future by mentioning the issues you've found with them here on this forum. You might consider mentioning the breeder's name in the title of the thread. I believe you can edit this yourself. 

I would also enter your girl's registered name on k9data.com so that there is permanent record of her ear issue, give the formal diagnosis in the notes. It may be something a breeder doing pedigree research might see and find helpful. If you have her diagnosed with Ichthyosis through lab work, you might consider submitting that information to be registered on OFA so there is record of that, and also on k9data.

I hope that professional help with training and behavior assessment for Lucie could help you get her turned around when her hearing is restored. I have 3 children and understand what a hard place you are in. A dog who is fearful is a safety hazard for children and their friends, please manage her carefully to be sure that she's not put in a situation that is too much for her until you have been able to have the surgery and had some assistance in working through this with her. I'm sorry that you've had such a tough time and glad that you're sharing your experience here in hopes that others will learn from it.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

So odd, I heard of a deaf Golden this year on the other side of the country. A little puppy.. the vet missed it, the breeder (who unlike yours is a good breeder) missed it, and 3 weeks after go home, the people noticed it. Profoundly totally deaf both ears. 

Did I read right that they offered you half your $$ back? Take it. You live in a state that has a lemon law and you might be able to pursue them that way- even a threat might get your money back. 

I just hate how people take up breeding w zero idea what they're doing, produce affected ICT dogs because they don't bother testing or if they do don't want to spend $ on a stud dog from outside who's clear. It is nothing but wrong to breed animals and not take every precaution one can to prevent the pet home from having issues. I am sure sister is also ED since no one does just hips. And another sib. So there is an elbow problem w the pedigree. 
I second the thought that you should make a k9data page for her, and if you don't know how, just pm me her reg paperwork and I will do it for you. Put their name out there so google will pick up on this thread. And try to make the best of it. It's not her fault she was born with so many issues. ICT can be a mess and it is tied to IBD too, I have read, so there's something else to be watching out for.


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## SoCalGolden (Jan 28, 2019)

I am so sorry to hear about your puppy. Absolutely heartbreaking. I appreciate you sharing that you also fell for the 'English Cream' hype. I hate learning lessons the hard way and hope to save somebody else from doing the same. We are working on insurance and wish we had gotten it day 1. Another lesson


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

I put in any clearances on all the Calm River dogs on k9data. 
Not a lot to see there. Only the stud dog has all the core 4 and while he has some DNA tests listed there is no ICT test there. However, since both his sire and dam are carriers, it would be any thinking person's assumption that he is at least a carrier since there's only a 25% chance he's clear (25% he's affected and 50% chance he is a carrier which if he sired your pup, we know he is).


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## SoCalGolden (Jan 28, 2019)

Thank you! We did respectfully ask for a refund and CA Puppy Lemon Law does entitle us to 150% of purchase price toward vet bills (which still won't cover it) We do have a lawyer working on it after they told us that 'their lawyer' said that because Calm River Goldens is in Washington state, it doesn't apply. I just want them to do their part toward her bills and breed responsibly moving forward. Seems to me that even if you do all the right things as a breeder (though they did not) you can still have a puppy with serious problems and you need to be prepared to deal with it as a cost of doing business. I appreciate the offer about K9data. I plan to update there and OFA and i'm ordering the ICH test so that I can get that on the record too. I may take you up on your offer if I can't figure it out but once I dig into something, look out! Our kids definitely were expecting a puppy they could play (responsibly) with, not one that we have to keep telling them they can't play with, or touch on the head, and on and on. We are working very very hard on that and are hopeful that as her pain level declines she will feel better and be better.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

Remedy exists if within one year after the purchaser has taken physical possession of the dog after the sale by a breeder, a veterinarian licensed in this state states in writing that the dog has a congenital or hereditary condition that adversely affects the health of the dog, or that requires, or is likely in the future to require, hospitalization or non-elective surgical procedures.

Scroll down on this link to California- IF the table reads like I am reading it, it appears that this is your remedy-3. Retain and Reimburse: Retain the dog, and receive reimbursement for reasonable veterinary fees for diagnosis and treating the dog in an amount not to exceed 150 percent of the original purchase price. 

In FL, it's a DIY process- you don't need a lawyer, etc. But your clock is ticking.


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## puddles everywhere (May 13, 2016)

So going to throw this out there in hopes of learning something. While this instance sounds like a physical problem with the ear there are many breeds that have attempted to go "white" and created some serious problems with deaf dogs. Is it safe to assume there could be a genetic issue now or in the future with trying to breed for color as the priority?


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

puddles everywhere said:


> So going to throw this out there in hopes of learning something. While this instance sounds like a physical problem with the ear there are many breeds that have attempted to go "white" and created some serious problems with deaf dogs. Is it safe to assume there could be a genetic issue now or in the future with trying to breed for color as the priority?


Probably not, because it would be both ears then.

I read up about this w/r to breeding double merle dogs (collies). Basically these dogs are born lacking the stems cells which create pigment. Those same stem cells also create hearing cells in the ears.


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## Richard Miller (Jan 30, 2019)

An owner of one our puppies recently posted concerning the health issue of a puppy they bought from us. We understand completely the heartbreak of having a puppy with serious health issues. Every story has two sides - we would like to express our view of this painful situation. We sent the following e-mail out today to our current deposit holders of future puppies.

Dear Future Calm River Puppy Owner:

You, along with many others, currently have a deposit with us for a future Calm River puppy. Sadly, a Calm River puppy from our litter born in December of last year has been diagnosed with a very rare ear condition in which one ear canal does not have a direct opening into the eardrum. The other ear is completely normal. This is a very rare condition and all nine other puppies in this litter are healthy and doing well. This ear issue was missed by our vet when the puppy was examined prior to being sold. It was also missed on the first two routine vet visits by the puppy with the new owner. None of the several vets I have spoken with have ever seen this condition in person. We have offered the owners of this dog a free replacement puppy or a refund in accordance with our contract - in fact we have offered the owners more than our contract states in an effort to compensate them for this difficult and painful situation.

The owners of the puppy with the ear issue posted an angry Instagram post earlier today. We understand that they are very upset - we are heartbroken as well. We want you to know the facts so that you can make an informed decision about your future puppy - and as always, we will gladly refund your deposit at any time prior to the birth of the puppies...

August 27, 2018 - a litter of 10 pups are born to Cooper and Lizzie

October 23, 2018 - All puppies develop normally - our vet checks them and certifies them healthy two days before they go to their new homes at 8 weeks of age. The puppy in question in shipped via airplane to San Diego on October 23.

November 12, 2018 - The family of the new pup sends us the following e-mail:
"Hey Richard,
Sorry for the delay. Work has been hectic, and this kept getting pushed to the bottom of my inbox. 
Working with Richard and Cheryl was just a wonderful experience. I searched far and wide for the perfect breeder and we found it at Calm River. It’s immediately apparent that they have tremendous affection for their dogs and are looking for owners that will create warm and loving homes. We worked with Richard and Cheryl completely remotely from San Diego, picked our puppy out over Facetime and then a few weeks later collected our happy and healthy puppy from the airport with no problems whatsoever. Lucie is perfect, smart and sweet, obviously well cared for and socialized. She’s very confident and has adjusted to our crazy family of 5 (3 young boys) perfectly. We couldn’t be happier.
Bill"

January 15, 2019 - The family in San Diego lets us know the puppy has an ear problem. We ask our vet to speak with their vet. We pay to have a second vet evaluate the dog. The dog does have an ear issue. The family states they want to return the puppy and find another puppy . We send the following e-mail:

Hi Bill:
Thank you for taking the puppy to the vet today.... Assuming you do not want a free replacement puppy from us, we can offer the refund as stated in our contract and we are willing to share the expense of airfare back to Seattle - the contract states you pay the return airfare but we want to share this expense.

I know the financial refund in no way makes up for the pain and frustration you have experienced with this dog. You waited a long time for the puppy – we all had very high expectations for the puppy – and it appears the puppy is not going to work for your family - or as a therapy dog - in spite of your great efforts and expense to make it work. The vet (who saw the dog) was very impressed with everything you have done on behalf of the dog – in no way do we fault you.

Please understand this is painful for us as well – we have never had a puppy returned – instead we hear wonderful things about our pups. I realize this in no way helps you or your family. The vet said the pup was very sweet and cooperative during the exam but agreed that the ear might be very painful (fluid backup or pressure?) and that pain might explain the behaviors you have witnessed. Our plan is to have a local specialist examine the ear and if possible, correct the issue so the pup can enjoy a happy, normal and long life.

Let us know when it will be convenient to return the dog and we can arrange airfare at an agreeable time / date.

Again, our apologies on the pain, expense and inconvenience this has caused you and your family.
Richard

January 28th - The family in San Diego changes their mind and decides to keep the puppy - they post an angry Instagram post. 

We understand how frustrating it is to buy a puppy and eventually find out it has a health problem - we had a similar issue with a dog we purchased when our children were little - it was heartbreaking. We do not take the responsibility of puppy breeding lightly - we spent several years searching for our three dogs and we visited well over 50 breeders before we choose our dogs. We have explained in detail the OFA health clearances of our dogs on our web site. We have never heard of any ear issues with our dogs or their ancestors. Our vet has assured us this is a very rare condition and unlikely to happen again but we want you to make an informed decision. Our dogs live with us in our home, vacation with us and are wonderful companions. You are welcome to visit at any time. Please let us know if you want to continue with your deposit or have it refunded.

Richard and Cheryl Miller
Calm River Goldens


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Do your dogs have all OFA clearances - and posted on OFA? Can you provide a puppy buyer with an AKC registered name for any dog you are breeding - and can they look up full clearances on OFA?

What about DNA testing - since the puppy also would seem to have ichy - and she mentioned that you are repeating the litter?


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

Richard Miller said:


> We do not take the responsibility of puppy breeding lightly - we spent several years searching for our three dogs and we visited well over 50 breeders before we choose our dogs. We have explained in detail the OFA health clearances of our dogs on our web site.
> 
> Richard and Cheryl Miller
> Calm River Goldens


I would throw out there that you do indeed take dog breeding lightly for several reasons- the first of which is the rest of that sentence. No responsible breeder would buy puppies to breed, no matter how long or how many visits you made. Breeders grow them up, get their clearances, and then hire an appropriate match as stud dog. No where on your site do I see 'detail on OFA' nor do I see any registered names so your site visitors can decide if the clearances are there or not before contacting you.
A k9data pedigree link would be a good idea as well. One that works. 
The elbows are a big problem in your pedigree. A responsible breeder wouldn't be breeding a bitch w ED. 
And the ICT. Well, that is just irresponsible. The sire and dam of this puppy have no overriding reason to be bred to each other, and it shows your lack of knowledge that you DID breed them. ICT can be horrible. https://www.pawprintgenetics.com/ or https://embarkvet.com/ can give you some of the information you need to be breeding any of your dogs. Most of these conditions are recessives that work on a Punnett Square scheme. It is obvious that the stud dog is at a minimum a carrier for ICT because both his parents are carriers. It is also obvious from this puppy's skin symptoms that the dam of the litter is at least a carrier especially when you factor in this dog's testing which proves that side of your family has carriers-https://www.ofa.org/advanced-search?appnum=1621398. I notice you have your stud dog's DNA testing on k9data and do not have ICT listed. Did you really spend the money to do two tests when the whole panel costs the same as two disease tests? Or are you not listing 'carrier' or 'affected' because you fear it will raise questions? Do the right thing. Be transparent. The puppies you sell are not toasters, sold and gone. They are a part of people's lives and as such deserve the best possible start.It is your responsibility -as a person breeding dogs and claiming to be responsible- to act responsibly. 

Dogs are not livestock, to be bred on one physical trait such as color. That appears to any knowledgeable person to be what you are doing.


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## SoCalGolden (Jan 28, 2019)

*update: Ichthyosis Affected Puppy*

Hi all, I really appreciated the support and information regarding my puppy Lucie and our concerns about her health. I wanted to add an update and ask for advise. Lucie had her ear surgery two weeks ago and is scheduled to get her stitches out tomorrow!!! She seems to be doing well and we all (Lucie I think too) will be delighted to get that cone off of her head :wink2: A 50 pound puppy all doped up with a giant cone is a walking disaster. The surgeon removed all of her inner ear workings and basically closed up her ear canal entirely. Their reasoning was that her ear drum was not present in the CT scan and trying to restore her hearing would have carried a high chance of complications and further surgeries as well as would not necessarily have been successful. She was already deaf in that ear so it also didn't change anything for her. We are just happy she will no longer be in pain! 

In the meantime, her skin issues have persisted and I had the genetic testing done for Ichthyosis. She did come back as 'Affected.' Though I'm not at all surprised, I'm still sad and frustrated. The amount of skin that constantly is falling from her body is mind boggling. You would have to follow her with a vacuum if you wanted remotely clean floors. We haven't tried anything diet or supplement wise with her just yet, as she seems to have a sensitive tummy and we have been focused on surgery recovery. She does have a prescription shampoo that she was given when her skin flared up to an extreme level. It seems to be helpful for a day or two after washing her with it. Does anybody out there also have an Ich affected dog and can offer any advise beyond a fleet of Roombas:grin2:

The good news is that right now it doesn't seem to bother her.

Thank you in advance for your tips and tricks!
Jenn


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

I'm so sorry for the ICT affected because first I know you didn't know that you were chancing it when you got your puppy.. and secondly because I know how hard it is to clean around an ICTaffected puppy. I had one here for a short while and it took forever to get all the flakes out of my car upholstery (cloth) after one ride to go home. I vacuum daily anyway but I 'd have had to do it constantly to have anything resembling clean floors. I could have picked up with a cup some measure of flakes around her crate several times a day. 

I'd like to see you post the pedigree on k9data, and ask you to send the ICT test in to OFA for listing. While there is precious little there for buyers to research, spending the small fee to list it there will insure that anyone wise enough to check out the sire and dam will see they've made an affected puppy And Iwould put the deaf piece on k9data too as an honorific. If you can't figure out how to do it you can PM her reg paperwork to me and I will do it for you and send you a link.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

I see that you already made a k9data page- putting her on OFA would be a good idea too. Nicely done!

I see these people are repeating this breeding... stud dogs that are not carriers are so easily found- it's not like he's a CH or MH or even a CD..... it is a shame they know they will likely make more ICT affected puppies and are doing it anyway. from their site: "Lizzie and Cooper are the perfect couple -
​
This is the 2nd litter from Lizzie and Cooper. The first litter was outstanding in every way! Beautiful puppies with that make for perfect family dogs. Hike all day with you outside - calmly lay at your feet in the house. Both dogs have champion pedigrees and perfect dispositions. Both are beautiful, calm and naturally obedient dogs.
​Puppies of this litter will have soft, creamy white coats and an athletic build."


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## Val King (Jun 23, 2016)

OMG! I just posted something similar with missing molar thread...I did exactly the same thing in the English Creme thought process...I too want to report Mothers Farm School AKC pedigree Goldens from Santa Fe, NM as fraudulent in their advertising... I'm sorry you are going thru this...just picked up my one year old who was missing 4-5 adult molars and they had to pull two more that had no roots and were abcessed...this forum is so incredible and helped show me breeder did not do clearances which would have definitely prevented me from purchasing from her...her prices have even gone up 1K and she has been using same sire with many dames with no clearancesfor 7 years...she needs some oversight and of course I am devastated that my puppy's dental health is so compromised!!! My heart goes out to you...Supposedly rumor has it they have less cancer...who knows, but did I trade for other anomalies?


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## Val King (Jun 23, 2016)

BTW, I filed a Better Business Bureau complaint...noted this breeder had removed herself from BBB where a previous complaint had been filed for nondisclosure of undescended testicle in sire and the puppy they purchased.


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## JulesAK (Jun 6, 2010)

I am so sorry for you and your beautiful girl. She is absolutely gorgeous. I also want to commend you for sticking with her and offering her the best chance at a wonderful life with your family.
Best of luck to you both 

Jules


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

Val King said:


> OMG! I just posted something similar with missing molar thread...I did exactly the same thing in the English Creme thought process...I too want to report Mothers Farm School AKC pedigree Goldens from Santa Fe, NM as fraudulent in their advertising... I'm sorry you are going thru this...just picked up my one year old who was missing 4-5 adult molars and they had to pull two more that had no roots and were abcessed...this forum is so incredible and helped show me breeder did not do clearances which would have definitely prevented me from purchasing from her...her prices have even gone up 1K and she has been using same sire with many dames with no clearancesfor 7 years...she needs some oversight and of course I am devastated that my puppy's dental health is so compromised!!! My heart goes out to you...*Supposedly rumor has it they have less cancer*...who knows, but did I trade for other anomalies?



It's nothing more that that - rumours. Incorrect, unscientific information. English cremes have no magic gene that protects them from cancer. They are all Golden Retrievers, and cancer is sadly prevalent in the breed.


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## Val King (Jun 23, 2016)

Question? If my puppy has hypodontia (7 affected teeth), are there additional congenital anomalies I should watch for?


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## Val King (Jun 23, 2016)

So now that I'm obsessing about lack of clearances, I remember picking up my puppy whose mom is now pregnant for third time in 3 years...I noticed she has eye that was cloudy like a catract. asked breeder and she said she probably injured it crawling under fence...do you think it could be PA? Really worried about lack of clearances!! Thanks!


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

Val King said:


> So now that I'm obsessing about lack of clearances, I remember picking up my puppy whose mom is now pregnant for third time in 3 years...I noticed she has eye that was cloudy like a catract. asked breeder and she said she probably injured it crawling under fence...do you think it could be PA? Really worried about lack of clearances!! Thanks!



It could have been juvenile cataracts - you'll likely never know. Best you can do is get your dog's eyes checked annually at a clearance clinic or by a veterinary opthamologist.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

DK what you mean by PA- 
if you meant PU (pigmentary uveitis) that does appear to be a thing one can inherit ...but we have no tests for it at this time to predict with (DNA). 
Cataracts in dogs often do not make their eye cloudy but nuclear sclerosis does make for cloudy eyes.


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## CaiqueCrazy (Jun 26, 2019)

*Thank you, thank you, thank you!*

Thank you so very much for sharing your experience with Calm River Golden's. I have been following them on my Facebook page for over a year in hopes of getting a puppy that looks just like Cooper! I am not new to Golden's, have had 7 of them as my children were growing up, 3 at a time. What an exciting time that was in my life. We also had our share of bad experience with breeders. We had hip and eye issues over the years. Even had to put a puppy down at only 7 months old because he could barely walk. The breeder replaced him with yet another puppy with hip issues. Eventually learned that the breeder lied to us about the clearances. We were even blackballed from joining the Evergreen Golden Retriever club because they wanted us to stay silent! We eventually learned more about the breed and made better decisions with future purchases. Flash forward to the present; we are now in our 60's and haven't had a dog in over 14 years. It is time! I literally was getting ready to call Richard to schedule a visit to their kennel. There is a planned breeding of Lizzie and Cooper with puppies being reserved for the 2020 winter breeding. I wanted to be first pick male! Something told me to Google reviews first, and thank God I found your review! You have saved us from possible future heart break and I thank you for that!


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

Because it got brought to the top of threads again when you posted, I went and looked @ their site again, hoping they'd learnt something from this...sadly not. They're breeding the same two dogs again. This shows such a lack of education imo, there's nothing compelling about the stud dog to make him the only fit for their obviously carrier (if not affected) girl. Neither of their girls have elbow clearances.


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## beachhousesji2 (12 mo ago)

SoCalGolden said:


> Hi all, Here is my long vent/story. Thank you in advance for reading. About two weeks ago my 6 month old Golden Retriever Lucie (English Cream but I get it now, was diagnosed with unilateral deafness due to a congenital defect where her ear canal is totally closed off. This was missed by the breeder's vet and also our vet for a number of visits until she had an ear infection that prompted them to really look closely. Learning this was heartbreaking. Not because she is deaf on one side because that seems pretty workable, but because it seemed like the missing puzzle piece that maybe explained so much of our/her struggles with a puppy that seemed to want little to do with us and growled aggressively and acted almost like she had been abused. She was in pain and couldn't hear us very well
> My husband and I both grew up with dogs. Mostly goldens but also labs and a ridgeback. We also had a sweet wonderful lab, Tioga, who was our first baby preceding our 3 boys. Fast forward 15 year, our kids are 13,12, and 8 and sweet Tioga passed away about 2 years ago and we finally felt ready for a fur baby. We chose an 'English Cream' because we read the (hype) that they were healthier in addition to being sweet, smart, and spectacularly gorgeous. After losing Tioga to cancer who wouldn't want to avoid that if possible. One of our children has struggles and we want a BFF for him. I am also a therapist and I work with struggling kids and teens. My goal was to have our dog join me in sharing her love as a Therapy dog. We found Calm River Golden's website and spoke with Richard. Their site is lovely and he seemed kind and knowledgable. The dogs are touted as AKC, healthy, from Champ lines and all that. We trusted this meant all was well at their small operation was doing everything they could to ensure their puppies had the very best shot of a healthy life and a great temperament. I thought we were pretty knowledgeable and were making sure that the breeder wasn't sketchy or a puppy mill. Until things started going badly for poor Lucie, I just didn't know what I didn't know. I think most people probably don't. Sketchy doesn't have to look dirty or seedy and whether or not it is malicious is hard to judge. The obviously extremely knowledgeable people on this site have helped my understanding of OFA clearances, genetic testing, pedigrees and such to grow exponentially. I now know 1000% more and enough to realize that I still don't know much. I can now very clearly see how our breeder relied on my and other's lack of knowledge to make his less then ideal dogs seem like "the perfect couple". You have to know that you should and also how to dig a little to see the missing elbow clearances and understand that in all likelihood Lizzy didn't pass that test and that her full sibling has elbow dysplasia! That is surely not on the website and the k9data.com has almost no information and the link is broken for Lizzy. Our Lucie has also struggled with her skin since day 1. She was a little flakey when we got her (puppy dandruff Richard said) until one day she exploded skin. It was honestly like nothing I have ever seen. The vet said he had never seen anything like it. This snow storm of skin now reoccurs unless we continue to wash her with the medicated shampoo the vet provided. She actually has been to the vet for puppy shots, skin issues, ear infections, and not ear issue; 9 times since we got her 4 months ago. She has yet to be officially diagnosed with ichthyosis but i'm working on that. What i can see is that her parents are not tested (or at least the results are not shared) but that, based on the pedigree history her Sire Cooper has to be a carrier and Lizzy is 50/50. See, I even learned how this recessive genetic condition works! The fact that Lizzy and Cooper were intentionally bred without looking into this is deeply concerning. That we have told them we have a likely Affected dog and they plan to breed the two again is horrifying.
> Upon learning of all of Lucie's issues CalmRiver offered us a 'replacement puppy' or 1/2 of her 2.5K purchase price. I would be lying if I said that we didn't consider sending her back. We did b/c that is our Vets recommendation based on all of her issues and her bx problems (growling at the kids and concerns that this could progress to a serious safety issue.) As we waited 5 days to hear back from Richard and her infected ear seemed to feel better and we got a handle on her skin, her behavior began to improve. We also saw the writing on the wall as to what would likely happen should we return her. Getting a new puppy from them knowing what we now know, was never an option for us. She still requires a CT scan and then surgery as there is a swollen and painful mass where her inner or some portion of it, seems to be. We are looking at vet bill and will easily spend 10K on her first year. I am beyond furious at Calm River and very concerned; both that other unsuspecting people may also suffer a similar experience, and that puppies who have higher then necessary odds of painful conditions will be knowingly bred.
> I would welcome advise on how I might alert others to this unethical breeder. We are also looking for a reputable Vet who can preform the surgery in the San Diego area.
> ...


Dogs are like children, not cars.
I was looking for the site for Calm River Goldens and found this article. I must tell everyone of my expriences with Calm River. This is not a breeding farm. This is a family who shelters these pups in thier very nice living room with a cutom built "contaiment that allows the mother and father to easily step in and out to give thier love and cleanings to thier treasured pups. This is not a walmart or car dealership, it is a very well orchestrated adoption process. It starts with videos and zoom meetings of each pup and their mothers and fathers...as they grow and nurture. Then the selection process is full on video and interaction. You are given selections, you are invited to Richard's home to see your selections. To hold them to smell them to love them and make that hard choice of life long friends that will be with you for all thier lives. Test of all the pups is routinely done, there is no guarantee, this is God's creation and sometimes things happen as they do with humans. I can tell you that after having the life experience of being part of the lives of 7 of this type of breed, from puppy, to final separation, that this family is the stalwart of providing the most wonderful companions I have ever experienced: Norris and Karen Palmer


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

beachhousesji2 said:


> Dogs are like children, not cars.
> I was looking for the site for Calm River Goldens and found this article. I must tell everyone of my expriences with Calm River. This is not a breeding farm. This is a family who shelters these pups in thier very nice living room with a cutom built "contaiment that allows the mother and father to easily step in and out to give thier love and cleanings to thier treasured pups. This is not a walmart or car dealership, it is a very well orchestrated adoption process. It starts with videos and zoom meetings of each pup and their mothers and fathers...as they grow and nurture. Then the selection process is full on video and interaction. You are given selections, you are invited to Richard's home to see your selections. To hold them to smell them to love them and make that hard choice of life long friends that will be with you for all thier lives. Test of all the pups is routinely done, there is no guarantee, this is God's creation and sometimes things happen as they do with humans. I can tell you that after having the life experience of being part of the lives of 7 of this type of breed, from puppy, to final separation, that this family is the stalwart of providing the most wonderful companions I have ever experienced: Norris and Karen Palmer


I hope you continue to feel this way once your puppy is old enough to have ED or you have to deal with ICT... because these prior posters issues (other than the ear) were totally predictable and preventable. Totally. It's a lack of care or knowledge or both on the part of the breeder who could keep them in a palace and would still have done a horrid job by making puppies who will have skin disease due to his overlooking or not grasping 3rd grade biology.


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## beachhousesji2 (12 mo ago)

Prism Goldens said:


> I hope you continue to feel this way once your puppy is old enough to have ED or you have to deal with ICT... because these prior posters issues (other than the ear) were totally predictable and preventable. Totally. It's a lack of care or knowledge or both on the part of the breeder who could keep them in a palace and would still have done a horrid job by making puppies who will have skin disease due to his overlooking or not grasping 3rd grade biology.


Those are pretty strong charges with no proof. I am of course sorry your pup got hit, but it happens and you are portraying it as an "intent". One pup out of how many?


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## beachhousesji2 (12 mo ago)

beachhousesji2 said:


> Those are pretty strong charges with no proof. I am of course sorry your pup got hit, but it happens and you are portraying it as an "intent". One pup out of how many?


Also we are going for our third one.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

beachhousesji2 said:


> Those are pretty strong charges with no proof. I am of course sorry your pup got hit, but it happens and you are portraying it as an "intent". One pup out of how many?


Not mine- and also not really- Ichthyosis is what it is, and it is easily avoided as are all the other diseases we have tests for. Breeding two carriers is just stupid.


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