# sudden snarling and biting, no warning



## murphy1 (Jun 21, 2012)

Very frightening situation. I'd check in with the Vet asap. Thank God your wife was not injured.


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

That is a very scary situation. Have you discussed it with your vet? I would say her rib cage needs to be examined if it hasn't been yet. It's possible something is hurting her. 

Dogs send many signals that humans don't always pick up on, and it sounds like this is one of those times. I would suggest you find a good certified behaviorist (more than a trainer--a person who has studied animal behavior and is certified in that) to give you an assessment. I had one do that for one of my dogs, and she interviewed the members of the family, took a history of my dog, observed her in her home, etc., then she gave me a training protocol to work with her. She helped me and my dog a lot. 

Good luck. It sounds like Q is a really nice dog with some fear about things from her past. I hope you can get through this with her. One caution: someone, somewhere will undoubtedly tell you you and your wife need to dominate Q and become the pack leaders, etc. If anyone suggests anything other than positive reinforcement with her, I'd run. A fearful dog, especially a Golden, will only be made more fearful and more fear-aggressive using dominance-type training techniques.


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## Jim Y (Feb 23, 2013)

*thanks*

Yes, a vet visit is also planned for tomorrow. Including checking if there's something damaged around her ribcage that makes her extra sensitive there, but I doubt it - she's been handled quite a bit in general with no trouble. There's just something about a person resting their head there, that seems to freak Q out.

And yes, we're very grateful my wife is all right.


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## USAFWife74 (Jan 13, 2013)

Scary!!! Hope you get some answers and help! Q sounds like a lovely, misunderstood golden. 


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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

Firstly, bless your heart for adopting a rescue. I have a couple of rescued dogs, both who had been abused in one fashion or other, and reality is that we need to take our time to figure out what they feel comfortable with and what scares them, and understand that something we have done has made them afraid enough to growl or snap (warn), if that should happen. She has only been with you six months, and for some dogs that is not enough time to really trust their new circumstances or family, and believe that 'this time' it is for real. The good news, is that she does have good bite inhibition - those incidences where she has warned with a snarl and snap could have been bites if that is what she intended to do, she chose not to bite. 
Dogs do not 'bite' without warning, their body language speaks volumes, telling you how they feel about what is going on. Signs of stress (discomfort) with the situation to look for - panting out of context (is not hot or been exercised), or mouth closed and lips pulled tight, ears back, looking or turning their head away from the dog or person, leaning away or moving away trying to avoid the interaction or 'freezing' (not moving at all). If she is 'saying' she is stressed, your best option is to give her space, try to figure out what is causing her anxiety and work from there to help her feel better about the situation. The book: On Talking Terms with Dogs by Turid Rugaas gives a basic understanding of dog body language.

Have you had her in for a thorough vet check? If not, suggest starting there, to rule out the possibility an old injury to her rib cage, that maybe did not heal properly and could be causing her pain. 
Also get her into positive reinforcement obedience classes, working with reward based training helps to build trust,(she may have good reason not to trust based on past experiences) going to classes helps to build the bond, and teaches us how to communicate effectively with our dogs. Our relationship with our dogs is not about being 'in charge', it is about 'education'- teaching them how to do what we want them to do, when and where we want them to do it and if we consistently reward them for doing it, odds are extremely good that they will repeat the behavior.


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## quilter (Sep 12, 2011)

I once had a cat that you could not pet past her rib cage. The second you moved your hand past the rib cage to the abdomen, she would spin around and attack your hand. It was awhile back and if I remember correctly, it turned out she had some urinary tract infections. But not always. Anyway, I chalked it up to a quirk and stopped touching her there. She had no other issues. 

It doesn't sound like anything having to do with who is in charge.


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## Jim Y (Feb 23, 2013)

Thank you everyone for replying.

We took her to get checked by the vet today. They did blood sample and urinary infection tests. We will have the results tomorrow.

This Jim's wife, my name is Sandra. I'm glad she didn't hurt my head, but after she pulled my hair I found myself to be fearful of her today. I know dogs can sense my fear. I want to be able to be friends with her again, but she and I are tense. She seems to be sensing my energy. Now, my question is what to do, how can I feel safe around her and rebuild feelings of positive energy and showing her love, so we can be happy again. 

Thank you.


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## lhowemt (Jun 28, 2013)

Sandra it's just like training or teaching children. You have to go back 3-4 steps to where she is comfortable and build build build on that. Definitely read the book on dog body language, most people drastically misunderstand or don't see dog body language. Go back to fun things that are controlled. Sit, down, etc. Leave it would be good practice for her to learn you are a benevolent leader-you are in control but give freely and can be trusted. But leave it is a bit more advanced if you are having trust issues. Do you do any games, shake, touch it, etc. Lots and lots of those, build a bond. Use lots of rewards /treats and you can toss them so you don't have to get close to her mouth. Learn to play catch. Definitely a private lesson with a behaviorist or the best trainer around. Hang in there, she needs you to be patient for her.


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## USAFWife74 (Jan 13, 2013)

Thank you for wanting to try. I understand you are afraid. 


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## Jim Y (Feb 23, 2013)

Thank you for your quick reply. 
This is Sandra agian. Quetzal and I went on a walk this morning and I'm trying to regain trust in her and viceversa. She seems to be doing ok. She still sniffs me here and there. I am working on my fear of getting bitten by her. I served her breakfast this morning and commanding her to sit and wait until she was allowed to get her food, and so far she's responding good to that. "come" is still a command she doesn't respond well to me.


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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

Understand that it was a very traumatic incident for both of you. Take your time, trust must be earned, (both ways) allow her to do the approaching (as much as possible) and reward her for it, in fact reward as many behaviors as you can find to reward, a little praise a tiny treat will help to improve things. If you can, enroll in reward based training classes. It will give you the opportunity and a little more confidence to work with her in a controlled positive environment, help build your confidence in her and her trust in you, and can help to improve things all around.


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## KeaColorado (Jan 2, 2013)

During a therapy dog class I took with Kea (taught by a canine behaviorist), I learned that generally, dogs don't like to be cuddled. It's something they can learn to tolerate or even like if they're desensitized to it from a young age, but hugging, kissing, laying on the dog, etc. could all provoke unpleasant behavior in certain dogs. All of the dogs in Kea's therapy dog class were put through testing to ensure that they wouldn't, God forbid, have the reaction you described if someone were to grab them around the neck and give them a hug. We were also taught to watch for signs that our dogs were uncomfortable or fearful and "be their advocates" to get them out of the uncomfortable situation. 

It sounds like you're doing the right thing by walking her and feeding her, but please do seek the help of a professional. I promise it will be money well spent. A good friend of mine had a golden mix puppy who started to show aggressive tendencies toward her at about 6 months of age. My friend is small, she weighs around 100 pounds. She was worried about managing the behavior of a large and potentially aggressive dog, and she was fearful around him, just as you described. She sought the help of a behaviorist who came to her house and worked with her, the dog, and her husband. His behavior improved tenfold and she has told me that if they had not gone that route, they probably would have ended up rehoming him. 

Thank you for loving Quetzal enough to seek answers. BTW, what a cool name


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## Our3dogs (Apr 3, 2008)

It's times like this when we wish our dogs could talk. Since you don't know her past history, possibly she had children, teenagers, or adults being allow to lay on her, and then being punished if she reacted to this. Perhaps she was hit or pushed there as punishment. Now she has little tolerance for it. At least you do know this is a trigger for her. As already said, Sandra, it would help for you to take her to a good rewards-based obedience class. Not sure if you and your husband have already attended one, but if you have not (or just your husband did with her) it does help for you and the dog to bond together and understand what is expected of each other. As also mentioned, rewarding her for her good behavior with tiny treats will help both of you relax a bit. Best of luck to all of you. You are both doing everything to make this work all the way around.


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## Jim Y (Feb 23, 2013)

Thank you everyone. 

We did take her to the vet yesterday, and the tests (blood, urine) came out all normal. No signs of physical distress. The vet was able to recommend a trainer (licensed behaviorists apparently being nonexistent/unavailable here in Utah) and we scheduled a session this evening. It was very helpful - many new games and training techniques were discussed, and we learned about Quetzal's psychology and body language. Most importantly, we learned what to look for as signs if Q gets stressed out or if some boundary is being crossed. Both Sandra and Quetzal now seem much more happy and confident with each other.

Thanks again, everyone - we will keep you posted on our progress.


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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

Bless your hearts for hanging in there with Quetzal, and it sounds like you found a good trainer (very important). It is important to keep in mind that these things take time, patience, compassion, and the willingness to keep an open mind and learn from and listen to our dogs.
Almost 4 years ago, I adopted an abused dog that had been rescued from a shelter, he was terrified of people,(men in particular) touch, collar, leash, being abandoned (again) - you name it. It took a lot of time, patience, compassion for how he must be feeling, and allowing him to decide what he was comfortable with to earn his trust and build a bond with him. Today I have the most amazing, loving, bonded friend and companion that anyone could ask for. 
I wish you well on your journey with Quetzal.


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