# recommendation for a pedigree expert?



## golden_fan (Jun 6, 2011)

Hello! I am wondering if anyone knows a golden retriever pedigree expert...I am over in Europe and am interested in bringing back a European golden for possible breeding in the States. Someone who knows something about European lines would be great, but I would appreciate anyone who could talk to me about line-breeding, etc., even if they don't know the European lines.

Thanks so much!!!


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

The first 2 names that come to mind for me are members sterregold, located in the US but very into the European lines, and annef, a judge and breeder in England. Hopefully they will chime in on this thread.

I have been breeding for 30+ years, but with American lines. It's almost impossible to discuss the pros and cons of linebreeding without knowing the dogs in question.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Your best bet is to post the pedigree and let the experienced folks on the forum take a gander.


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## golden_fan (Jun 6, 2011)

So...we are novices, and primarily we are looking for a family pet, but we would also like to start showing and breed an occasional litter, health clearances permitting. In particular, I would like to contribute some puppies to any litter we breed to a service organization that provides dogs to help people with disabilities. My primary goal, both for myself and for my little "line" is a calm, relaxed, attentive, sensitive dog, who can settle easily, which I think will be helpful to people with disabilities.

My second goal is health and longevity, especially avoiding epilepsy and elbow problems. The dogs over here are checked yearly for eyes, and cancer rates are lower, so I worry less about that.

Of course conformation is something to strive for, for a variety of reasons. We also intend to pursue working certificates for our dogs, for their pleasure and ours, and because we think it is the best thing for the breed to keep the instincts intact.

We are on the list for a female from a kennel we adore over here, and feel very fortunate to have found them. 

My first question is this--we were planning to get two females, spaced a year to 18 months apart (remember, we are novices). Two females would obviate the need to manage opposite sex dogs when one goes into heat without a real kennel arrangement. But a German breeder suggested we should bring a boy back, because a stud that would work for our girl(s) without being a total outcross would be hard to find in the US. They exist, but there are so few that if they aren't available when we are ready we would be out of luck, and they might be the best bet. 

So--if anyone has thoughts about:

1) which dogs or lines I should focus on for calm, relaxed temperament (in European/UK lines)--

2) or dogs/lines to avoid!

3) advice about line-breeding in our specific situation or just in general so that I will pick our second dog correctly

4) about our two girls versus one boy/one girl in our slightly unusual situation of bringing a puppy to a continent in which it would be difficult to do any sort of line-breeding, I would be most appreciative. Of course, as you all are no doubt well aware, goldens are addictive, and I think it likely we will eventually end up with more than two, but I want to plan for two and then see how things work out... 

Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Link to test breeding removed at the request of the OP.


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## Selli-Belle (Jan 28, 2009)

I would just caution you that European Golden usually do not do very well in A K C shows. They can, but you would need to purchase a pup with that in mind.


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## golden_fan (Jun 6, 2011)

Thank you Tippykayak for that test breeding!

And thank you Carolyn for your caution. Of course you are right.

Shows serve an important role in the development of the breed, and I am sure it is enjoyable to win them. For me, however, if the puppies we bring back don't do well in the AKC but they do end up being healthy, happy, long-lived dogs that we enjoy in our family, and who help the people they are place with cope with their disabilities, I will be pleased.


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## CarolinaCasey (Jun 1, 2007)

I think it would be prudent to get one female and then another in 18 months to 2 years. Getting a male as a puppy and just assuming that he will be the best complement to the bitch is a long shot. There will likely be other males that would suit her better- which would be best chosen after she has grown up. There are many people in the US that are reputable and knowledgeable about European Lines and have finished dogs at stud. You will likely be able to select one of these healthy specimens to contribute to your line.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

I hate to be a killjoy and maybe I read this wrong and you have been in goldens for a while and know these breeders well, but it is difficult to envision a fantastic quality pup worthy of being a foundation dog for a whole breeding program going to someone from a different country without years of a prior, trusting relationship. Breeders producing topnotch dogs are very protective of them, especially giving breeding rights to someone who may not show/work them.


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## annef (Feb 23, 2008)

I know many of the European lines and also many European breeders. Please feel free to pm me and I will try and help. I certainly would not sell a puppy to be shown at AKC shows as the KC and FCI standard is different. I do know of a litter planned in France which should be lovely and is a repeat of a very sound and lovely young dog and the owner does export. I have judged in Germany many times so I am familiar with many of the dogs there. You are also very welcome to email me at [email protected]

Annef


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## Sally&Sindy (Jun 10, 2011)

As for me, I greatly admire the breeding-line which is based on the "World Champion Standfast Agnus". 

In Europe, amongst others, you may find this breeding-line in nurseries like Xanthos (UK) and Van de Beers Hoeve (NL). 
In Russia Standfast Agnus´s son "Sahib Norsken" and his grandson "Multi-Champion Lexus Erl Gray" are well known. I by myself would really like a puppy from this line for breeding in my nurserie. 

These dogs are characterized by an athletic figure, strong bones, legs and backs, very beautiful head, a good neck, excellent movement, pure-breed temperament, the hair not too long. These dogs transmit their qualities to future generations. 
The dogs of this line have saved their hunting-qualities and are not just decorative dogs.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Sally&Sindy said:


> As for me, I greatly admire the breeding-line which is based on the "World Champion Standfast Agnus".
> 
> In Europe, amongst others, you may find this breeding-line in nurseries like Xanthos (UK) and Van de Beers Hoeve (NL).
> In Russia Standfast Agnus´s son "Sahib Norsken" and his grandson "Multi-Champion Lexus Erl Gray" are well known. I by myself would really like a puppy from this line for breeding in my nurserie.
> ...


That is a gorgeous dog.


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