# How does this forum feel about golden doodles and other golden mixes?



## AlanK (Jun 28, 2008)

I have seen a few that I thought were cute. 

I am not a big fan of that particular mix though. Does anyone know if that is a recognized breed by any organization?


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I'm afraid your friend might not feel very welcome here, I know I wouldn't if I had a golden doodle.

But that being said, I think everyone here knows how much I LOVE Koda -- our resident golden doodle from Singapore. I don't see his owner post very much but I'm always so happy when she does, I love to see pictures of Koda.

I personally would love to see more pictures of golden doodles, I'm very curious. But that's very politically incorrect in the world of golden retrievers. What can I say ... Koda got my attention and captured my heart :heartbeat


----------



## spruce (Mar 13, 2008)

don't alot of people have golden mixes? (I'm possibly one, but I can't imagine what he is if not all golden)

I wouldn't go bragging on the fact I had (purposely bought) a doodle; but, like ya said, it works for her


----------



## ReleaseTheHounds (Feb 12, 2009)

Don't introduce your friend to the forum. She'll be treated like a pariah that once dated a nazi that hates children that once stepped on a butterfly for fun in the middle east (which she loves)

spare her the heartache.


----------



## paula bedard (Feb 5, 2008)

You might use the new Google feature on the forum and find all the other threads/posts where Doodles popped up. I really don't have a strong opinion one way or the other. I know that Koda, who JoEllen mentioned, is absolutely adorable and I too wish his Mom would post more often. I believe another member has a Doodle by accident, thought she was getting a Golden, but I forget the members name. I've met Doodles out and about and they were sweet, quite large, and intelligent. 

The non-shedding aspect is hit or miss, most do still shed. I hope your friend doesn't think she's getting a hypo-allergenic dog.


----------



## Romeo1 (Apr 19, 2008)

ReleaseTheHounds said:


> Don't introduce your friend to the forum. She'll be treated like a pariah that once dated a nazi that hates children that once stepped on a butterfly for fun in the middle east (which she loves)
> 
> spare her the heartache.


Well, if that is true then that's a shame. I too, think Koda is adorable and have nothing against Golden Doodles.


----------



## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

I personally hate that these "breeders" are making a buck off from designer breeds. I love goldens and I love poodles. It just makes me sad that people will continue to support a breeder who not only mixes breeds intentionally, but then misrepresents them. 

On the other hand, I have no problems with mixed breeds. My boys are the first purebred dogs I have ever had. My Jasmine is a lab/golden, as best we can guess. We know her mother was a golden. I also offer to foster the mixed puppies that we get in, regardless of whether they look golden or not.


----------



## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

I agree with others about not introducing your friend to the forum. A lot of us are very strongly against all of these designer breeds. It's not that we're against the dogs themselves, but the people who breed them and the people who purchase them for crazy amounts of money. First off, there is no such thing as a hypoallergenic dog. They just don't exist. EVERY dog sheds. People are spending a fortune on these muts (yes, they are mutts) when they could spend much less and rescue a mixed breed from a shelter who desperately needs a home. These designer dog breeders are just contributing to the amount of dogs that are euthanized every year because there simply aren't enough homes for them.


----------



## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

I recently met my first ever goldendoodle...now when they work out they do look quite cute but oh my, this one was almost cut in half....front a poodle, back a golden...very, very unusual looking dog. I believe a new breed should only be created for a reason...there hould be a genuine need for the characteristics of a certain mix of dogs. More often than not the motive will be money for 'doodle' breeders...they are jumping on the badwagon to make a quick buck...I would not want to line their pockets...


----------



## ReleaseTheHounds (Feb 12, 2009)

> These designer dog breeders are just contributing to the amount of dogs that are euthanized every year because there simply aren't enough homes for them.


I've never seen a single shred of evidence to support this tug at your heartstrings statement. Keep in mind that there are people that will take this sentiment and use it against anyone who would ever buy a puppy to begin with. Did you buy a puppy jwem? If so, why did you not jsut go get a GOlden rescue? (if you got a golden rescue please disregard my rant)

The point is, you are assuming that if the option to buy a Goldendoodle was not available, a dog would get adopted which you cannot as most people just won't get a rescue under any circumstances for a variety of reasons.


----------



## mdoats (Jun 7, 2007)

Honestly, unless your friend is able to stand reading some VERY strong opinions about doodles, she might not be comfortable here. People who rescue dogs that are golden mix are usually VERY welcome. People who choose to purchase a golden doodle aren't exactly ridiculed, but they don't get the same warm treatment. I don't think I've ever seen a poster who owns a doodle personally attacked, but the discussions about doodles do get very heated and she might take it personally even if it's not intended that way. In your shoes, I probably would not recommend this forum to her.


----------



## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

Jo Ellen said:


> I'm afraid your friend might not feel very welcome here, I know I wouldn't if I had a golden doodle.
> 
> But that being said, I think everyone here knows how much I LOVE Koda -- our resident golden doodle from Singapore. I don't see his owner post very much but I'm always so happy when she does, I love to see pictures of Koda.
> 
> I personally would love to see more pictures of golden doodles, I'm very curious. But that's very politically incorrect in the world of golden retrievers. What can I say ... Koda got my attention and captured my heart :heartbeat


She does upload the most beautiful photos of a very precious Koda. In fact, I actually logged in the other day to tell her how much I smile when I see this beautiful dog. And, I do notice she doesn't post much here which really bothers me.

Which member brought home what they thought was a full-bred Golden only to find out that her dog was a GoldenDoodle? That was a real eye opener. I can not exclude people, but that is just me.


----------



## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

My point is that people who are spending a fortune on these mixed breeds are missing out on the chance to actually rescue a dog from a shelter for MUCH less money. That aspect is VERY obvious. There are more and more of these designer breeders every day.

And no, my golden is not a rescue. He was a birthday gift. However, EVERY single one of my cats, except for one, is a rescue from a shelter. I have also had many shelter dogs in my life, from a golden/lab mix, a spaniel/lab mix, and a rescue beagle. ALL of those dogs came from a shelter. I also donate to the ASPCA every single month. My problem is with these breeders that are trying to attract all of these people with very minimal knowledge about dogs (health clearances, etc.) and getting them to pay HUGE amounts of money for these mixed breed puppies. These people could spend MUCH less and go to a shelter and actually save a dog's life, but they're not because they are spending hundreds and hundres of dollars on these designer mutts. They are being sold simply as a fashion statement. THAT is what pi$$es me off to no end.


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

Ah, well, my friends dog is going to cost only 50 dollars more than what I paid for Max - and I got a great deal on such a beautiful dog as Max.  I know the no shedding bit was the most important thing to her - not because anyone is allergic but because she keeps such a nice house - golden's are some of the worst shedders. She was telling me that this dog won't shed and will have the best of both worlds when it comes to personality. I don't have anything against any dog - who can help but to love them all!! Max is my first purebred dog and I got him because of my love of this breed since I was just a little girl. I'll let her know that her pup may still shed and can get the personality traits of either dog - which reminds me, I'm not familiar with the personality traits of poodles... might look that up just to ease curiousity...
In any case, it seems to me that the puppies from the litter Helenanne is getting hers from is wanted and I don't think that breeders that breed and meet a demand are the cause of all the homeless doggies in the world. I think moreso, the issue is all the irresponsible owners who don't pay to get their dogs spayed/neutered, become pregnant and have litters of truly unwanted puppies. Some "breeders" are horrible breeders, don't get me wrong - but I think the main population burst in shelters is due from bad owners, rather than bad breeders.


----------



## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

Certainly no one can blame the puppies themselves but be aware that not every Goldendoodle ends up with the Poodle non-shedding but high maintenance coat and the Golden's sweet docile temperment.

What angers most people is that many, if not most, of the "breeders" of these dogs market them as something they are not, and then charge outrageous prices for them, based on those inaccurate statements.

And, just as with a pure bred, I would expect to see hip, eye, heart and elbow clearances on the retriever parent and all of these plus whatever tests are standard for the poodle parent. If not, then I would run and never look back. Since poodles and goldens share some of the same genetic problems but possibly not on the same gene, you can definitely get problems such as hip/elbow dysplasia, etc.

Goldendoodles are not a recognised breed and, just as with cockapoos, probably never will be.

My friend who home boards gets a lot of goldendoodles in. Most of them shed, those who do not, need to be professionally groomed every 6 weeks or so. Some are very very sweet; a couple are pretty hyper but I would assume that they had hyper parents to start with. One of them is like Koda, just adorable, but 3 or 4 of the others are very strange looking. Absoutely no consistency whatsoever in temperament, shedding or looks.

I have owned a doodles before-one, we think, was a Dober-doodle  His mom was a miniature brown poodle, daddy was a travelling salesman  He was a sweet sweet boy, shed like a maniac and did need a lot of grooming and matted very easily. The other one was a schnoodle, bought to get him out of a local (not a chain) pet store (I know, this was years ago). He was very hyper, did not shed (since neither breed in him was a shedder), was high maintenance and more than a bit whacky. He developed epilepsy and eventually we had to put him down.

Personally, I would prefer to see people go to a good Poodle breeder. Well bred Poodles are wonderful wonderful dogs and extremely intelligent.


----------



## Romeo1 (Apr 19, 2008)

momtoMax said:


> I don't have anything against any dog - who can help but to love them all!!


Exactly.....


----------



## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

I totally understand why people get upset about Doodle breeders , but I find it very, very sad that people will be excluded from a community because they are owned by a Doodle. That just stinks IMHO...


----------



## JBAMM (Oct 2, 2008)

I'm a live and let live kind of guy, and I don't fault anyone for making whatever purchasing decisions they want to make - but if I had selected a Goldendoodle, I'd think I would want to find a forum where I could discuss my choice of dog with others that made that same choice.

I don't think I'd hang out on a Golden Retriever site or a Poodle site for that matter - that's just me.


----------



## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

At one time there were not many Goldendoodle specific forums. Maybe they are out there now. Maybe a "Doodle" forum exists.

Your friend can try here http://www.goldendoodles.com/forumfaq.htm . This one is in the UK http://www.doodlepups.co.uk/forum1/index.php. I don't know anything about these forums. I just found them doing a quick Google search.


----------



## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

Here is a forum, but it doesn't look like it's very active right now. 

http://www.chatevo.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=427


----------



## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

jwemt81 said:


> Here is a forum, but it doesn't look like it's very active right now.
> 
> http://www.chatevo.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=427


Chatevo isn't very active at all. I was/is a member there.


----------



## ReleaseTheHounds (Feb 12, 2009)

I disagree with the statement that people that buy goldendoodles just want a fashion accessory. SOme people just are not informed about the world of dog breeding and think about that sentence for a second. Why would most people BE informed about the world of dog breeding?

People make mistakes, not everyone is Paris Hilton, and not all goldendoodle owners are evil Puppy mill supporters. I find it ironic and a little sad when I get 4 pm's a day from outraged mods at somethign sarcastic that I said, but a goldendoodle owner gets shredded and dumped in a ditch whenever they appear and the only sound from the peanut gallery is high fives.


----------



## Kohanagold (Nov 5, 2008)

I dont think that its that people here dont like the dogs or the owners. I mean, if somebody came here with a goldenXshepherd, they'd be accepted. The problem with doodles is the marketing and then the price (as set by the producers). They're not "nonshedders" and they're not "the best of both worlds". No matter what the price, they are a mutt and rarely the purchase price of a doodle reflects that. Here, doodles sell for MORE than a registered, purebred, from champion and health cleared stock puppies sell for. Why? Because they're "non shedding and the best of both breeds". Its simply not true. And yet people pay the price (both financially and in not getting what they were expecting).

I think poodles are great dogs. I think goldens are great dogs. In a different time and place where they were accidently bred and puppies were produced and they weren't given some fancy name or sold based on fallacies, it might be a different story. But many are very against the intentional breeding of these dogs, and it is very difficult not to take it personally when you've got one. The topic does come up from time to time and I really dont want to beat a dead horse but I also think, regardless of the price of this puppy, your friend is being taken for a ride at the expense of the new puppy. BJ


----------



## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

Kohanagold said:


> I dont think that its that people here dont like the dogs or the owners. I mean, if somebody came here with a goldenXshepherd, they'd be accepted. The problem with doodles is the marketing and then the price (as set by the producers). They're not "nonshedders" and they're not "the best of both worlds". No matter what the price, they are a mutt and rarely the purchase price of a doodle reflects that. Here, doodles sell for MORE than a registered, purebred, from champion and health cleared stock puppies sell for. Why? Because they're "non shedding and the best of both breeds". Its simply not true. And yet people pay the price (both financially and in not getting what they were expecting).
> 
> I think poodles are great dogs. I think goldens are great dogs. In a different time and place where they were accidently bred and puppies were produced and they weren't given some fancy name or sold based on fallacies, it might be a different story. But many are very against the intentional breeding of these dogs, and it is very difficult not to take it personally when you've got one. The topic does come up from time to time and I really dont want to beat a dead horse but I also think, regardless of the price of this puppy, your friend is being taken for a ride at the expense of the new puppy. BJ


Very well put! Doodles are not any different than any other mixed breed dog out there. Because they are mixed, there is no uninformity between them. There is no consistency in the coat, health, size, or temperment. Some doodles will have a more dense coat and shed a lot while others might not shed much at all. A lot of these dogs also end up in shelters because their high energy level becomes too much for some people. These breeders say that they guarantee a non-shedding pup with excellent health, but they have no way to back any of that up!


----------



## Romeo1 (Apr 19, 2008)

Kohanagold said:


> I dont think that its that people here dont like the dogs or the owners.


I certainly hope that isn't the case. It would be quite insensitive to speak so poorly of these dogs considering we have a couple of members with Doodle dogs. Koda and Karen (Mak) now has a Labradoodle.


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

People make mistakes said:


> My friend is getting her dog from a very reputable breeder. They also run a very wonderful kennel business. They don't only breed golden doodles, but also Goldens and Poodles, maybe one or 2 more. Their goldens are 600 while their golden doodles are 399. Everyone who has gotten their dogs from them have nothing but positives to say.


----------



## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

I don't want this to sound offensive at all; I really, really don't, but there is really no soft way to put this. NO reptuable breeder breeds mixed breeds.


----------



## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

momtoMax said:


> My friend is getting her dog from a very reputable breeder. They also run a very wonderful kennel business. They don't only breed golden doodles, but also Goldens and Poodles, maybe one or 2 more. Their goldens are 600 while their golden doodles are 399. Everyone who has gotten their dogs from them have nothing but positives to say.


I think most people on here, including the GREAT breeders, would have issues with someone who has a 'kennel business' and breeds several breeds of dogs, including cross breds being considered a reputable breeder. Price aside, I don't know of any golden breeder with quality dogs who would produce 'doodles'. I'm sure they are nice people, have nice dogs and the owners of their puppies are thrilled, but are the health checks being done? If a doodle ends up shedding, will they return the money and take the puppy back without a problem? 

I work at a boarding kennel and we have several doodles who come in, some are fine, some have the poodle 'aloof' temperment, and almost all of them DO SHED. One sheds a lot and needs constant grooming, the people who bought her are keeping her but didn't want all the work that she takes.

As long as your friend is aware she may very well end up picking hair up from everything in her house, and she has a good groomer, and she's aware of the potential health issues from goldens AND poodles that may affect her pup... I wish her luck, puppies are awesome!

Lana


----------



## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Emma&Tilly said:


> I recently met my first ever goldendoodle...now when they work out they do look quite cute but oh my, this one was almost cut in half....front a poodle, back a golden...very, very unusual looking dog. I believe a new breed should only be created for a reason...there hould be a genuine need for the characteristics of a certain mix of dogs. More often than not the motive will be money for 'doodle' breeders...they are jumping on the badwagon to make a quick buck...I would not want to line their pockets...


Actually, before the designer dog phase hit the labradoodle (and I think goldendoodle added later) WAS created for a reason. Here is the history

http://labradoodle-dogs.net/labradoodle-history.php

And I do know that labradoodle and goldendoodles sometimes work out really, really well for assistance dog programs: guide dogs, service dogs, autism dogs, etc.

So, I do think very, very few people (like assistance dog programs) are doing things right and trying to create a quality dog that they can use. But the article does address that the quality of these dogs is poor because people think all it takes is a poodle and a golden, and then they end up with willy nilly.

I took a tour of Guide Dogs for the Blind in San Rafael several months ago. they mostly use labs, occasionally goldens--but they LOVE the crosses. They have so much money, so many numbers, and good research that I think they do it well and for a purpose. I was told that they have the greatest success rate with the mixes and wold love to bring in more goldens--but they tend to be more soft than they want and labs can be a little bit more forward than they want  I also believe that a smaller organization, Guide Dogs of the Desert, uses goldendoodles.

...but still I would agree when it comes down to the marketing them as designer dogs. I would venture to say that most people inentionally breeding goldendoodles are at best BYBers--keeping in mind that many BYBers are nice, wonderful people that take care of their dogs!


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Very few people here believe that a breeder who breeds golden doodles is reputable. That theme comes across loud and clear, it would be impossible for a member to miss it.

Are you feeling defensive now? I feel defensive for you. I think your friend would feel the same way.

Please don't misunderstand me ... I have nothing at all against golden doodles, or you, or your friend, or not even responsible breeders of golden doodles -- YES, I do think it's possible to responsibly breed golden doodles  Good thing our new reputation feature doesn't let members take away reputation points -- I might lose all of mine with that one statement 

I'm just saying this forum may not be the best climate for a golden doodle owner. THOUGH, if I had a dog like Koda, I would be as proud as proud can be, anywhere ... even here :wave:


----------



## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

...and I don't have a problem with anyone who has a goldendoodle and I wish that breeders of said dogs were more educated. Still--whether designer dog or purebred the mistake is a common one!


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

Ah, well, I'm not all educated like you are about breeders, breeding, etc. I know enough that if the people who get their dogs from there love their dogs and the people who use their kennel find them to be great and caring - I know I don't have any issues with them. I am for sure going to talk to my friend about what I've learned - so she understands that her dog may still shed and if not, may require the 6 week grooming of a poodle. I know my friend is so excited about her puppy and I'm not going to rain on her parade. There are a lot of downfalls to watch for with any breed or mixes so you're ****** if you do, ****** if you don't. I know that her little girl will love their new addition no matter what - all puppies are lovable. And yes, mom and dad both have all clearances like reputable breeders do - even though they aren't. I will make sure she understands that she is not guaranteed a non shedder and the best of both worlds.


----------



## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

I know most people here dont have a problem with the people that have a golden doodle. Their problem is the people that breed them specifically for big money profit and advertising them as non shedding hypo allergenic dogs. And I am one of those. I hate that people are breeding dogs strictly for the cool names and nothing about improving a particular breed standard or health of future dogs. Some people just go to a "breeder" that say my dogs are hypo allergenic and then the puppy isnt and he/she ends up in shelters or rescues because they shed and people dont want them anymore. 

If you google Labradoodle or goldendoodle you get dogs that look so different you would never know they are from the same litter. Some look like poodles, some look like shaggy dogs and some have wavy fur. Some make look alike but have totally different personality some poodle, some golden. 

There are alot of members that have golden mixes, other breeds and they are always just as welcome as anyone else. Like me, I have an eskie, and I got just as many good wishes for her when she had her two surgeries as I have gotten for my goldens. I would like to think we would be just as nice to a goodle doodle owner. 

I went back and read the first thread that Koda's mom posted and she has gotten nothing but compliments on her dog. For me I would love to have a golden doodle like Koda but I will get it from a rescue or shelter. Would never buy one for big bucks thru a "breeder". And this forum was very helpful to a member that bought a golden and than found out that he/she was a golden doodle. The breeder lied and bred both on the property. In fact, I think someone on the forum told them exactly what to do to file suit and turning the breeder into the CKC. 

To anyone that has come to the forum, if you are not feeling welcome because of owning a doodle, I am sorry.


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

Jo Ellen said:


> Very few people here believe that a breeder who breeds golden doodles is reputable. That theme comes across loud and clear, it would be impossible for a member to miss it.
> 
> Are you feeling defensive now? I feel defensive for you. I think your friend would feel the same way.
> 
> ...


Ah, I'm not defensive - as an outsider to this breeding thing, I can understand the reason why you must breed selectively so that I can have a golden retriever that is all I expect a golden retriever to be. However, I must also say that I think some of you are over zealous when it comes to things like this and I find it sad that a good number of you would discriminate against my friend and her soon to be puppy (who you could all end up loving as much as this Koda if you were more open minded.) - it's like shooting the messenger and not the message. In MHO, it will be your loss not getting to know my friend - as she is a great, funny, and top quality person. But you're right, I wouldn't for sure mention this site to her after the replies and whether you realize it or not, that's a real loss for everyone here. It would be different if someone said, this is a fullbred forum only vrs. oh, well, we like all golden mixes... except for this satan spawned one - too bad, so sad. I don't hold it against you, we are all entitled to our opinions and you understand much more than I do - but I do find it terribly sad all in all.


----------



## BHVHarley (Nov 6, 2008)

Tell your friend to join the forum and tell she will meet 95% great folks and 5% not so great. Tell her just to read nice post and ignore post that are not so great or not so nice. I do not care what a kind of Golden she has so long she treat it like own child and kick the poor baby outside. 

Andrea


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Please tell your friend to do some homework!! 89% of all first generation golden doodles (i.e., a golden/poodle cross) shed, most of them very heavily. 
PLEASE...I board several of them here. ALL of the ones I board shed a LOT. Warn her in advance that the "non-shedding" is a myth!!!
I do board some Australian labra-doodles that don't shed (2 to be exact) but they are not lab/poodle crosses. They have labra-doodle parents at least 5 generations or more up the "pedigree". 
If she knows that, and doesn't care, then that's fine. I just hate to see people thinking they're getting something that they're not.




momtoMax said:


> Ah, well, my friends dog is going to cost only 50 dollars more than what I paid for Max - and I got a great deal on such a beautiful dog as Max.  I know the no shedding bit was the most important thing to her - not because anyone is allergic but because she keeps such a nice house - golden's are some of the worst shedders. She was telling me that this dog won't shed and will have the best of both worlds when it comes to personality. I don't have anything against any dog - who can help but to love them all!! Max is my first purebred dog and I got him because of my love of this breed since I was just a little girl. I'll let her know that her pup may still shed and can get the personality traits of either dog - which reminds me, I'm not familiar with the personality traits of poodles... might look that up just to ease curiousity...
> In any case, it seems to me that the puppies from the litter Helenanne is getting hers from is wanted and I don't think that breeders that breed and meet a demand are the cause of all the homeless doggies in the world. I think moreso, the issue is all the irresponsible owners who don't pay to get their dogs spayed/neutered, become pregnant and have litters of truly unwanted puppies. Some "breeders" are horrible breeders, don't get me wrong - but I think the main population burst in shelters is due from bad owners, rather than bad breeders.


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

BHVHarley said:


> Tell your friend to join the forum and tell she will meet 95% great folks and 5% not so great. Tell her just to read nice post and ignore post that are not so great or not so nice. I do not care what a kind of Golden she has so long she treat it like own child and kick the poor baby outside.
> 
> Andrea


Thanks Andrea for your kind words but I am unsure it would be a good thing to introduce my friend, who will be just as excited and happy with her puppy as we all were with ours, and have to face negativity from anywhere, you know? I think perhaps the people who have posted have their heart in the right place - but much too liberally right. While IMHO it is good to take a stand on issues that matter to you - if you are not careful about it, sometimes you find yourself standing on someone else. I just don't want her to be stood upon. Does that make sense? 


I appreciate all the honesty and I've put in my two cents - maybe someday all residents of this forum will accept all dogs with golden in them. It seems today is not that day.


----------



## Lisa_and_Willow. (Dec 18, 2007)

I would welcome anyone on this board no matter if the had a golden, a doodle or a golden mix because although I am a golden lover I am more about being a *dog lover.*

I agree that the doodle discussions may get a little heated sometimes but I hope that people can see that there is lots of good advice about breeding, genetics and false advertising of these dogs in the threads. 

Whatever breed you get you have to be prepared to look after that dog for the rest of it's life. I just want potential doodles owners realise that their promised non-shedding puppy may be the opposite.


----------



## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

I dont think that anyone said your friend would be descriminated here, just that we dont like that people breeding them as something new and exciting. And it is not just the doodles, it is all the new "hybred" dogs. Dogs should bred to a standard not for gain. 
Like I said, everyone is nice to Koda and her Mom when she posts pictures here. Ask your friend to join and let her make up her own mind. I think you both will be surprised at her reception. If she doesnt come here with the attitude that we will hate her and be mean to her, then I think she will fit in just fine. And people that disagree with her, put them on ignore, it is a great feature that I think is not used enough by people.


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

hotel4dogs said:


> Please tell your friend to do some homework!! 89% of all first generation golden doodles (i.e., a golden/poodle cross) shed, most of them very heavily.
> PLEASE...I board several of them here. ALL of the ones I board shed a LOT. Warn her in advance that the "non-shedding" is a myth!!!
> I do board some Australian labra-doodles that don't shed (2 to be exact) but they are not lab/poodle crosses. They have labra-doodle parents at least 5 generations or more up the "pedigree".
> If she knows that, and doesn't care, then that's fine. I just hate to see people thinking they're getting something that they're not.


 
For sure I will thanks!


----------



## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

I'm not really against Labradoodles and Goldendoodles. I believe they were originally produced with the good intention of being potential service dogs.

I think if people want to research and work hard to produce a new, sound, bred-with-a-purpose dog, I'm okay with that. That's where all our beloved breeds came from originally, anyway.

What bugs me to no end are the "designer dogs" that are bred purely for money... Pugapoos, Cavachons, Comfort Retrievers, Maltipoos, Yorkipoos, etc.


----------



## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

When people describe Goldendoodles, I always wonder why they didn't just get a well-bred poodle. A poodle is a loyal, intelligent, even-tempered water retriever with a low-shedding coat. And when you buy a poodle, you can have a greater guarantee of its look and health than with a mix.

The poodle gets a bad rap, and that stinks.


----------



## Tahla9999 (Nov 21, 2008)

> What bugs me to no end are the "designer dogs" that are bred purely for money... Pugapoos, Cavachons, Comfort Retrievers, Maltipoos, Yorkipoos, etc.


The designers breeders that bred for money are no different than the people who bred goldens for money.

Oh, but I agree with your post though. 

Took me awhile, but I have nothing against breeders who bred goldendoodles as long as they are responsible breeders.


----------



## Steinsk (Nov 24, 2008)

"Don't introduce your friend to the forum. " 

I am a total "newbie" on the forum, so I should maybe be a little careful. Also, the last thing I want to do is to put off or offend experienced forum members that have already given me so much support. But let me try to write something..

A discussion about breeders and breeds is one thing, but I find it a little strange to advice someone to stay away from the forum because they have a goldendoodle. 

Although this forum is for Golden Retrievers, I think the owner of a goldendoodle - if he or she is a good, loving and caring dog owner - should be received with respect and kindness. I see the point in having a discussion about breed and mixing, although as a very new dog owner I haven't come far enough to have any strong opinion about this.. But to advice the owner to stay away from the forum - if they come here for support and advice - seems unnecessary harsh to me. Love the "sinner", right?

Maja doesn't have any papers, and I cannot be sure she is a pure bred Golden. In buying her, I might have "supported" something wrong. But I am so grateful for the help and support I have found here!

EDIT: On reading the whole thread (instead of just some few posts) I see there are also many welcoming voices here. This is a wonderful forum!


----------



## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

Tahla9999 said:


> The designers breeders that bred for money are no different than the people who bred goldens for money.


True. But to me, there's a whole new level of arrogance to breeding a "Yorkichon" for money, and demanding even more money due to the "breeds" uniqueness.

BYBs suck in any shape, size or business model.


----------



## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

"Marketing Dogs," Gawd that sounds bad, but I guess breeders do "Market Dogs." Even the reputable ones do in their own way. I must be really mushy today.

I met a Goldendoodle not long ago. The owners favorite breed is the Golden Retriever and they had recently lost theirs. They felt at the time another Golden would be too hard to bring into their home, so they chose a Goldendoodle. They were fully aware of not falling for hype.


----------



## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

While I would never encourage someone to buy a Doodle from a breeder, and am against Doodles (and other mixes) being marketed as something they aren't and their breeders making huge profits by selling them under those false pretenses... if someone were to join the forum with a Doodle, I would of course welcome them with open arms just as I would with any other new member with any other mixed breed dog. 

To me, at that point, what's done is done and as long as they are thrilled with their new family member, I'm thrilled for them to be here.


----------



## Lisa_and_Willow. (Dec 18, 2007)

tippykayak said:


> When people describe Goldendoodles, I always wonder why they didn't just get a well-bred poodle. A poodle is a loyal, intelligent, even-tempered water retriever with a low-shedding coat. And when you buy a poodle, you can have a greater guarantee of its look and health than with a mix.
> 
> The poodle gets a bad rap, and that stinks.


I agree with this. Standard poodles are on the list of dogs I would like to have.


----------



## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

I am against anything that results in more health problems for dogs and more dogs in rescue.

I may be wrong but I think you said somewhere back at the beginning that "everyone loves a puppy" That is so true and the reason there are SO many goldens in rescue and also why goldendoodles will end up in shelters because they really aren't nonshedders, or the best of both worlds etc.


----------



## Doodle (Apr 6, 2009)

I agree with the others who said that they have issues with people breeding and charging exorbitant prices for these dogs just because they can. But I personally, and I think many of us here, would welcome your friend as a new member just like we do others with goldens and other mixed breed dogs. There are many of us here (myself included) who, before being educated by this forum, bought our dogs from less than reputable sources, but we have not been "thrown out" for it. I think if your friend introduces herself and shows that she loves this puppy like we all do ours, there should be little problem. 
Just as an aside....has anyone else heard about the personality difficulties these labradoodles and goldendoodles can have? Maybe I just happen to know an unlucky group of people, but I know 4 people that have these dogs and they all have something "a little off" about them, ranging from unusual temperments to OCD.


----------



## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Doodle said:


> has anyone else heard about the personality difficulties these labradoodles and goldendoodles can have? Maybe I just happen to know an unlucky group of people, but I know 4 people that have these dogs and they all have something "a little off" about them, ranging from unusual temperments to OCD.


I agree. The temperament in a mixed breed dog is just as unpredictable as the coat, size, build, etc. You could get a really nice, stable dog, or you could get the hyperactivity and neuroses of a badly bred Golden mixed with those of a badly bred Poodle.

Add to that that a vast number of "doodles" whose parents aren't ideal Poodles or Goldens. Since most (all?) reputable breeders won't let their dogs be incorporated into the breeding programs of these profit-oriented breed mixers, the Poodles and Goldens used may not have good temperaments or good health to begin with.

My personal experience with mixed breed dogs of this type confirms my concerns that these dogs are vastly more likely to have health and temperament problems than purebred dogs are.


----------



## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

Doodle said:


> I agree with the others who said that they have issues with people breeding and charging exorbitant prices for these dogs just because they can. But I personally, and I think many of us here, would welcome your friend as a new member just like we do others with goldens and other mixed breed dogs. There are many of us here (myself included) who, before being educated by this forum, bought our dogs from less than reputable sources, but we have not been "thrown out" for it. I think if your friend introduces herself and shows that she loves this puppy like we all do ours, there should be little problem.
> Just as an aside....has anyone else heard about the personality difficulties these labradoodles and goldendoodles can have? Maybe I just happen to know an unlucky group of people, but I know 4 people that have these dogs and they all have something "a little off" about them, ranging from unusual temperments to OCD.


I don't know that they are off or have personality difficulties, instead I think that many, too many people get them because they are cute and supposedly hypoallergenic. They never research the dogs or the breeds that go into the mix. 

I cannot imagine any Labradoodle who doesn't need extensive exercise every single day. Same with a lot of Goldendoodles. Plus, they are not purchased with forethought for training that is entirely necessary. 

I don't think that the breeders give the buyers any constructive advice for how to raise these dogs to be happy, mentally healthy dogs. Poodles are extremely intelligent and Goldens and Labs are high energy (especially Labs). That can be a horrible combination for someone who is inexperienced when it comes to dogs.


----------



## AcesWild (Nov 29, 2008)

momtoMax said:


> Ah, well, my friends dog is going to cost only 50 dollars more than what I paid for Max - and I got a great deal on such a beautiful dog as Max.  I know the no shedding bit was the most important thing to her - not because anyone is allergic but because she keeps such a nice house - golden's are some of the worst shedders. She was telling me that this dog won't shed and will have the best of both worlds when it comes to personality. I don't have anything against any dog - who can help but to love them all!! Max is my first purebred dog and I got him because of my love of this breed since I was just a little girl. I'll let her know that her pup may still shed and can get the personality traits of either dog - which reminds me, I'm not familiar with the personality traits of poodles... might look that up just to ease curiousity...
> In any case, it seems to me that the puppies from the litter Helenanne is getting hers from is wanted and I don't think that breeders that breed and meet a demand are the cause of all the homeless doggies in the world. I think moreso, the issue is all the irresponsible owners who don't pay to get their dogs spayed/neutered, become pregnant and have litters of truly unwanted puppies. Some "breeders" are horrible breeders, don't get me wrong - but I think the main population burst in shelters is due from bad owners, rather than bad breeders.



okay you need to tell your friend the following things
-She is paying more for a mixed breed dog than a purbred, why not rescue one?
-There is no way to garuntee that this dog is going t shed less or be hypoallergenic, i have actually seen dogs that shed more.

I would recommend not getting a puppy and getting an older that she knows isn't going to shed much and that she can rescue.


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I want to make sure I haven't been misunderstood so let me clarify.

I would absolutely welcome any new member with a golden doodle, whether they got one by plan or by accident. I won't enter into the debates about breeding golden doodles ... except to say that I think Koda is awesome and I would LOVE to have one just like him on my block. Or in my home


----------



## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Jo Ellen;840365
I personally would love to see more pictures of golden doodles said:


> Here are GoldenDoodles Cassie&Annabelle from our Ferry Beach walk crew:


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

They look happy and fun-loving. Something about that Koda dog though, I've not seen another golden doodle quite like him. I saw one at the lake a couple of summers ago and I was impressed then too. 

Thanks for the pictures!


----------



## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

On the topic of those who purchase mixed breed dogs:

They're just as welcome here as anyone else. As a rule, folks on the forum in general get more worked up about pet store puppies than Golden mixes, and we're certainly very friendly to people who own or have owned a Golden from a store or a BYB. 

I think more care could be taken in expressing that we don't necessarily approve of mixing Goldens with other breeds, but we would never hold those views against the dog or an owner.

And one quick note on coats when it comes to Golden/Poodle mixes: not only do they shed as much as a Golden more often than not, sometimes they come out with _very_ high maintenance coats. Poodle coats, as a rule, are mat resistant, but can you imagine Golden fur combined with a tight curl? I shudder to think.


----------



## MyCodyBoy (Sep 27, 2008)

My neighbour is a Vet and we had a discussion a while ago about hipdisplaysha. he told me that they are seeing more mixed breeds like the goldendoodles and labraddogles coming in whith HD rather than pure breeds.

My only issue is the cost of these dogs, and the fact that I have no idea what sort of personality my dog will have. Getting a pure breed dog does not guarantee any personality trates but at least you can know what to expect of the dog.
And I also have issues with mix breeding as a whole for any dog. can you just imagine what is going through these dogs minds and the confusion they might feel. Imagine a boarder collie mixed with a boxer. the dog wouldn't know his foot from his tail. a retriever should be a retriever and a hunter should be a hunter, they shouldn't be mixed.


----------



## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

momtoMax said:


> Just wondering. My closest amiga is getting a golden doodle...I think that's how you say it. A mix between a full fred golden retriever and full bred standard poodle. For her, it works - golden attitude and no shedding like the poodle. They are cute curly furry things... Anyways...so the question is this: Is this forum for full breds only or do you not mind having those around who are part to half golden retriever? She'll be bringing home her little bundle of joy in early July. I was just wondering if I should introduce her to this forum or not. Thanks for your answers!!
> 
> golden doodle picture


 
Have your friend read this thread. If she can handle it....then I don't see why she couldn't come aboard. I have nothing against doodles...and I see nothing wrong in getting one from a breeder. But tis a passionate subject and she's have to be thick skinned.....


----------



## Pudden (Dec 28, 2008)

the Pudden is a mixed-breed; she's part golden and part lab (half or 1/4) from a rescue, and no one has asked us to leave yet


----------



## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

Pudden said:


> the Pudden is a mixed-breed; she's part golden and part lab (half or 1/4) from a rescue, and no one has asked us to leave yet


Ah, but you rescued her. That is an "acceptable" mixed breed in the eyes of many and you are a wonderful rescuer.

But if you had purchased her...that would be abhorrant and she would be a mutt. No offense meant....just trying to make a point.


----------



## Pudden (Dec 28, 2008)

Lucky's mom said:


> Ah, but you rescued her. That is an "acceptable" mixed breed in the eyes of many and you are a wonderful rescuer.
> 
> But if you had purchased her...that would be abhorrant and she would be a mutt. No offense meant....just trying to make a point.


but even if I had bought her...she'd be the same Pudden, the same healthy, athletic, sweet, wonderful Pudden. Whether she was bred intentionally or by accident, she' one well-bred mutt, I'd say .


----------



## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

Pudden said:


> but even if I had bought her...she'd be the same Pudden, the same healthy, athletic, sweet, wonderful Pudden. Whether she was bred intentionally or by accident, she' one well-bred mutt, I'd say .


 Yep...I agree. She is a sweetheart!


----------



## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

I dunno, I think Doodles evoke a stronger reaction than any other Golden combination mixed breed around here.


----------



## buckeyegoldenmom (Oct 5, 2008)

My definition of a reputable breeder of goldens or poodles, would not do crosses like the Doodle. Just my opinion, I know. 

I do however have a sister with a doodle. (She has always had goldens before) Three years ago she got Derby her doodle. Derby is a sweety, but he is very very big and yes he sheds and she has to have him groomed every few months and spends hours brushing him.

By the way, my sister's next dog will probably be a golden! I think she got into the Doodle hype a few years back and she paid more than she should have.


----------



## paula bedard (Feb 5, 2008)

I knew I'd heard that Delaware has a Doodle day at the Beach...I found the link  It's the Dewey Delaware Doodle Romp. Nope sorry, it didn't work...I'll try to find another link...

ok, hope this one works: http://www.goldendoodles.net/Dewey2.html


----------



## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

People can always join and NOT tell people how they've acquired a pup  
How sad would it be to have to do that.

Oh, I have one Golden from a BYB. One Golden from a responsible breeder. His Dad took BIB one year at Westminster. This Golden was returned to the breeder and we gave him a home at a year old. And then there is the Golden I would give a home to in a split second. His name is Bailey. He was purchased from a Pet Store. If when I'm looking to give another dog a home and I happen to find a GD in need, he or she will not be excluded from our home because I would be afraid of being excluded here.


----------



## pburchins (Mar 11, 2009)

The puppy pictures are cute. I grew up with Standard Poodles and I have had 2 Goldens. Personally, I don't think they should cross breed the dogs. Their are certain wonderful distinct personalities of both breeds and in the same token both breeds do have negative quality. Just because the cross breed them does not guarantee the best of both breeds will appear. They had a golden doodle at a golden rescue group here in Atlanta a few months ago and I personally felt bad for the dog because it was not cute at all. The same goes for the half german shepherd have golden. It was just ugly.

Regarding not being welcome........I would hope she would be welcomed but she can't expect everyone to agree with the crossbreeding onpurpose.


----------



## paula bedard (Feb 5, 2008)

I googled Doodles and found many Doodle forums. I bet your friend could find plenty of info about what to expect with her new little Doodle.


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

pburchins said:


> They had a golden doodle at a golden rescue group here in Atlanta a few months ago and I personally felt bad for the dog because it was not cute at all. The same goes for the half german shepherd have golden. It was just ugly.


 
How odd, I've never seen a dog that was not absolutely adorable or even close to approaching ugly. I could see the world over of dogs and not find one that isn't adorable in their own special way.


----------



## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

momtoMax said:


> How odd, I've never seen a dog that was not absolutely adorable or even close to approaching ugly. I could see the world over of dogs and not find one that isn't adorable in their own special way.


Some dogs grow on you. I never thought doodles were cute either. Nor sheep dogs. Now I think doodles are adorable. Not sure about sheep dogs.

The only dogs I don't view as attractive are ones that are unhealthy.


----------



## Phillyfisher (Jan 9, 2008)

tippykayak said:


> When people describe Goldendoodles, I always wonder why they didn't just get a well-bred poodle. A poodle is a loyal, intelligent, even-tempered water retriever with a low-shedding coat. And when you buy a poodle, you can have a greater guarantee of its look and health than with a mix.
> 
> The poodle gets a bad rap, and that stinks.



Exactly. I have met some wonderful standard poodles. My problem is with the non-reputable breeders of them. I do think people get caught up in a popularity of doodles, and buy one without doing all of their homework. I think a lot of these puppy buyers would end up with a purebred dog (for the same or less money) that exactly meets their lifestyle and needs, rather than a doodle. If a person buys a doodle after doing all of their homework, that is fine. I think people get upset here with non-reputable breeders taking advantage of uneducated puppy buyers. I know I do not like see anyone taken advantage of. We happened to decide on a golden before doing our homework. When I started doing my homework on goldens, I found this site and really learned what I should look for when buying ANY dog. 

Your friend is certainly welcome here. Hopefully she has done her homework and fully understands what she is and is not buying. Dogs are wonderful additions to any family.


----------



## Joe (Apr 9, 2005)

momtoMax said:


> Just wondering. My closest amiga is getting a golden doodle...I think that's how you say it. A mix between a full fred golden retriever and full bred standard poodle. For her, it works - golden attitude and no shedding like the poodle. They are cute curly furry things... Anyways...so the question is this: Is this forum for full breds only or do you not mind having those around who are part to half golden retriever? She'll be bringing home her little bundle of joy in early July. I was just wondering if I should introduce her to this forum or not. Thanks for your answers!!
> 
> golden doodle picture


 

Hi, 

your friend is more than welcome to join. I realize that not everyone has a full bred Golden Retriever and thus there is a need for some kind of a discussion for owners of Golden Retriever mix dogs.

To this extend, couple years back, I've created a Miscellaneous section called: Other Pets; and that is basically a place to post pictures or talk about any other dog breeds, like for example Golden Doodle. 

Nonetheless, she should realize that this forum's other topics and threads are 99% dedicated to a Golden Retriever full bred dogs and should think about the risks coming with being our member (see some comments above).

So, it's really up to her. But from my point of view, I'd be more than happy to have her here.

Joe


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

But we have quite a few members that have golden retriever mixes that don't post in the Other Pets section, and we don't expect them to. 

That being said, I think it would be very difficult for an owner of a golden doodle to find a comfortable place here.


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

Lucky's mom said:


> Some dogs grow on you. I never thought doodles were cute either. Nor sheep dogs. Now I think doodles are adorable. Not sure about sheep dogs.
> 
> The only dogs I don't view as attractive are ones that are unhealthy.


 
****, not sheep dogs! They are by far one of the cutest dogs ever!!:bowl: 

I think even the unhealthy ones are cute but they get also get a great deal of pity from me.

Then again, I think even rats are cute in their own way. That's just how I'm built.


----------



## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

momtoMax said:


> ****, not sheep dogs! They are by far one of the cutest dogs ever!!:bowl:
> 
> I think even the unhealthy ones are cute but they get also get a great deal of pity from me.
> 
> Then again, I think even rats are cute in their own way. That's just how I'm built.


But, rats are cute! And smart and affectionate


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

Tahnee GR said:


> But, rats are cute! And smart and affectionate


 
Oh I know! and clean! and social! They can make wonderful pets.


----------



## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

Rats are cute. I have a friend who is owned by a Pet Rat. I know a few members here own snakes, too. 

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but a buyer must always educate themselves and beware.


----------



## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

My daughter had white rats as pets in jr. high. They give me the creeps. 
She also had an iguana named Igor who was adorable.


----------



## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

My older son had rats growing up. He wanted a gerbal but I was viciously bit by a gerbal once and I said no. Some one said that rats didn't bite so I suggested a rat instead. We had three or four rats and none bit and were soooooo sweet! They make great pets.....


----------



## Tinsley (Nov 11, 2008)

I think we need to be careful not to treat someone differently because of decisions made by them. Personally, I'm not 100% keen on pedigrees, purely because of how some people try to make so much money out of breeding them. The reason I bought a pedigree was for that guarantee he is likely to be in good health for the majority of his life, and to know exactly where he came from. I would never not have a goldendoodle golden lab etc, but I don't agree with them being bred purely because of how they are marketed, its not fair on the poor old dogs!

I love my Rupert, naturally I am biased, but he is just an amazing dog. My boyfriend has a standard blue poodle called Baron, and he is also an amazing dog! I just like them both as they are and don't see why they are bred together really. But then if someone came on here and had paid an awful lot for a goldendoodle etc, I wouldn't feel the need to make any major point to them etc, as far as I am concerned part golden = just as welcome! It is not like they would be joining the forum to tell us how real goldens aren't half as good as goldendoodles etc, they'd be here for the advice like the majority of us. Like others have said too, when buying a dog we don't always know 100% what we are getting into or everything about what we buy, but that is because there is so much false information, particularly for goldendoodles, about hypoallergenicy and the no shedding etc...


----------



## marshab1 (Aug 28, 2006)

I'm going to say that based on the responses her in this thread and responses to threads made by doodle owners in the past that your friend and their puppy would be welcome. 

Most of the negative comments about doodles are made towards the breeders, who charge exhorbiant prices for puppies, make promises that are not kept, and then rather than take back the dogs and puppies that the owners no longer want so they end up in shelters. Those same comments are made about full bred golden breeders that do the same things. 

We don't hold it against the dog or the owner. But while the forum is for pleasure, a place to show off our goldens and tell stories. It has also evolved into a place where you can learn, there is a lot of good quality information about the breed, breeders, rescues, etc. 

You friend may be OK with the fact that her new puppy is going to shed and need regular grooming, but becasue of this forum she now knows ahead of time ad can make an informed decision. And threads like this or posts made by doodle owners can help other potential doodle owners make that same decision. We are all helping to educate the public.


----------



## AcesWild (Nov 29, 2008)

I think if she really wants a dog that doesn't shed that a Labradoodle would be a better choice. I met one at a dog park today and asked the people why they choose that one. They had heard of the more shedding and wanted something less which the dog didn't shed much they said. He was going to be huge that much I ca tell. 2 months younger than Macie (pure yellow lab) he was a good 4-6 inches taller than her at the shoulder.

He was terrified of Moxie mostly because she was being grumpy and the kids that owned him got a kick out of watching him get chased away by a dog 1/4 his size.


----------



## paula bedard (Feb 5, 2008)

Ooh, now rats! My SIL had a rat as a pet for a few years. He said Uno was very affectionate and SMART. Unfortunately Uno developed cancer and died relatively young. Evidently, rats are prone to cancer.  My daughter had mice and gerbils that were not very friendly critters and they died within a year of her getting them. I told her no more tiny critters, they didn't fare well in her care.


----------



## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

]

Where I live, Falmouth Maine, is a hotbed of Doodlei-sm. I can list about twenty by name from various dog walks/training classes. One thing I notice is that the owners feel a touch sorry for me that I just have plain, boring old goldens, lol, and will often talk about having a purebred golden doodle/labradoodle. I just smile - what can you say? I cannot imagine a golden breeder I admire or a comparable Poodle breeder participating in this fad.


----------



## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

AcesWild said:


> I think if she really wants a dog that doesn't shed that a Labradoodle would be a better choice. I met one at a dog park today and asked the people why they choose that one. They had heard of the more shedding and wanted something less which the dog didn't shed much they said. He was going to be huge that much I ca tell. 2 months younger than Macie (pure yellow lab) he was a good 4-6 inches taller than her at the shoulder.
> 
> He was terrified of Moxie mostly because she was being grumpy and the kids that owned him got a kick out of watching him get chased away by a dog 1/4 his size.


 Again, it's the same crapshoot on the shedding. If the dog has more Lab characteristics, then there will be much more shedding. If more poodle, less shedding. My lab actually sheds more than my goldens. And I hear that from all the folks I know who own both.


----------



## marshab1 (Aug 28, 2006)

fostermom said:


> Again, it's the same crapshoot on the shedding. If the dog has more Lab characteristics, then there will be much more shedding. If more poodle, less shedding. My lab actually sheds more than my goldens. And I hear that from all the folks I know who own both.


I've noticed this too. ANd if someone has allergies depending on which kind a lab can actually be worse. Tinkerbell sleeps on my bed curls up in a chair with me no problems. And no allergy meds. The lab I pet sit for...I have to take allergy meds the whole time I am at their house. Same with any short haired dog.


----------



## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

There are lots of threads and posts here about "doodles" and other intentional mixes.

I agree with the GRCA's stand on GoldenDoodles. Additionally, I've seen many coming through my classes and none have proven to be what was promised. They are NOT hypoallergenic, they DO shed, and many are extrememly high strung. As hybrid vigor is not applicable to mixing two breeds of dogs, and as reputable breeders of either Poodles or Goldens will not allow mixed breedings, very few are being produced out of parents with a history of health clearances.

Cute? Sure. Some are very cute. But they are mutts. And there is no consistency in the breedings, so you cannot be sure what you are getting.


----------



## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Pointgold said:


> They are NOT hypoallergenic, they DO shed, and many are extrememly high strung. As hybrid vigor is not applicable to mixing two breeds of dogs, and as reputable breeders of either Poodles or Goldens will not allow mixed breedings, very few are being produced out of parents with a history of health clearances.


You know what's weird? I haven't yet met a Doodle that _was_ low shedding. I know statistically that some of them are going to come out with a poodle-like coat, but I've only met the shaggy, messy-coated, shedding Golden/Poodles and Lab/Poodles.

And that high strung thing, in my purely anecdotal experience, is the norm with those mixes. 

Again, no insult intended to anybody's wonderful, mellow dog, shedding or otherwise. I just want to point out a concerning trend I've noticed in my personal experience.


----------



## moverking (Feb 26, 2007)

tippykayak said:


> You know what's weird? I haven't yet met a Doodle that _was_ low shedding. I know statistically that some of them are going to come out with a poodle-like coat, but I've only met the shaggy, messy-coated, shedding Golden/Poodles and Lab/Poodles.


I did meet one at a farmer's market in Currituck, NC....she was an 8 month old and very sweet and calm (could be one of the very small percentage that initially started the low shed/great temperament craze) And her color was just beautiful....stud was a Standard mahogany poodle and a reddish Golden dam...
Anyway, the owner raved about the fact that he could romp and wrestle with her wearing black and come up without a hair. Of course I said 'OK show me', lol. He obliged with a tussle and then picked her up and walked around with her as a shoulder scarf....had a little dust and bits of hay on him....but not more than a few hairs and I had to look hard for them...

This is not a post to say 'see, they can be low shed and great tempered.....obviously the vast majority are _not_. Just wanted to share that I met 'the odd one out'.


----------



## damita (Jun 4, 2009)

momtoMax said:


> Some "breeders" are horrible breeders, don't get me wrong - but I think the main population burst in shelters is due from bad owners, rather than bad breeders.


Maybe off topic but I think the source of dogs for bad owners are the bad breeders? Food for thought - if the bad owners were unable to get dogs (good breeders are pretty picky about where they place their pups) would we still have the same problem?


----------



## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

moverking said:


> I did meet one at a farmer's market in Currituck, NC....she was an 8 month old and very sweet and calm (could be one of the very small percentage that initially started the low shed/great temperament craze) And her color was just beautiful....stud was a Standard mahogany poodle and a reddish Golden dam...
> Anyway, the owner raved about the fact that he could romp and wrestle with her wearing black and come up without a hair. Of course I said 'OK show me', lol. He obliged with a tussle and then picked her up and walked around with her as a shoulder scarf....had a little dust and bits of hay on him....but not more than a few hairs and I had to look hard for them...
> 
> This is not a post to say 'see, they can be low shed and great tempered.....obviously the vast majority are _not_. Just wanted to share that I met 'the odd one out'.


It makes sense. Around 1/10 Poodle mixes are going to have that low-shedding quality. And I bet more than 1/10 will have a good temperament. I've just met the other nine so far.


----------



## goldengirls550 (Jun 12, 2008)

momtoMax said:


> My friend is getting her dog from a very reputable breeder. They also run a very wonderful kennel business. They don't only breed golden doodles, but also Goldens and Poodles, maybe one or 2 more. Their goldens are 600 while their golden doodles are 399. Everyone who has gotten their dogs from them have nothing but positives to say.


I would be curious to know where her purebreds came from. No reputable breeder will breed mixed breed dogs, it's just a fact... and there are NO reputable breeders who would sell their dogs to someone who would breed them to a different breed. The dogs that go in to making "doodles" and what not, are often oversized/undersized, of questionable health and temperament, of questionable pedigree...

GRCA's stand on Goldendoodles: http://www.grca.org/allabout/a_doodle-white.html#doodle

PCA's stand on "doodles and mixes": http://www.poodleclubofamerica.org/breederref.htm


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I have a question. If no reputable breeder will breed mixed breed dogs, how do we come up with new breeds?


----------



## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

I have no problem with mixed breed dogs. I do have a problem with "designer breeds" (no such thing) and asking a lot of money for basically a mutt. 

How do people know you are going to get the non shedding part? Sure poodles do not shed, they require HIGH coat maintenance, but goldens and labs do and their genes are included. Just makes me ponder. Also I find goldens to be high energy (same with labs) and poodles are nuts. Always running around having a good time. Combining these two traits in my mind is asking for A LOT of dog. I would think a poodle with a more sedate breed would be a better combo. 

PERSONALLY I think goldendoodles and labradoodles are a crime against nature, but that is MY opinion only as I do not care for poodles. I love labs and goldens.


----------



## damita (Jun 4, 2009)

*New breeds*



Jo Ellen said:


> I have a question. If no reputable breeder will breed mixed breed dogs, how do we come up with new breeds?


Can you give me an example of a "new breed" so that I can do some research and try to come up with an answer for you?


----------



## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

The most recent breeds I can think of are the Boykin Spaniel, maybe the Catahoula Leopard Dog, and they are not all that recent.

The AKC is always adding "new" breeds but they are usually the rarer breeds that have been around in Europe for awhile and are just now getting a following in the US.

Among other requirements, the AKC requires a written standard and several generations of breeding only members of that breed to each other, and breeding true-ie, consistency and predictability, as well as meticulous record-keeping.


----------



## Romeo1 (Apr 19, 2008)

Wasn't the Golden Retriever created from several breeds?


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I know "new" breeds are rare, unless you're looking in the Amazon rain forest : but theoretically, all known breeds were new at one time, weren't they? Many many years in the making?


----------



## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

There are lots and lots of great responses on the forum about this, but I'll take a stab at it: 

There's a huge difference between a mixed breed dog and a new breed of dog. Crossing a Golden and a Poodle does not result in a new breed. New breeds are created when individuals or groups get together and incorporate strains from different breeds together over many generations to create dogs that breed true with each generation, and then they select from those true-breeding dogs to aim for particular characteristics over time.

Quick definition: breeding true means that two animals of the same type produce offspring that are consistently of the same type. When you breed a Golden and a Poodle (two different types), you get offspring that vary wildly in terms of temperament, size, build, coat, etc., essentially a grab-bag of characteristics from both types. When you breed two Goldens, even the most different in terms of color and size, you get a relatively reliable litter of dogs that should fit the Golden Retriever standard fairly closely.

The creation of the Golden Retriever, for example, involved the incorporation of several breeds into a program, accomplished meticulously over time. Eventually, that very specific type was recognized as a new breed, long after they were breeding true to a particular type.

The Australian Labradoodle is the closest thing in doodle-world to come to a new breed, as those breeders are attempting to select for particular characteristics and create animals that breed true by breeding Labradoodles with Labradoodles, not Poodles with Labs. They're still a long way from anything that could be considered a real breed in terms of repeatability of characteristics, and they're even further away from getting their dogs recognized as a unique breed. They also have a vision of their ideal dog that makes no sense for me, but whether I like a breed's characteristics or not is not the definition of a breed. 

So while the Labradoodle or the Goldendoodle could one day be considered a breed (and I hope this is never the case), first generation mixing of breeds is the first of many, many steps, and those who are repeatedly crossing first generation animals aren't attempting to create a breed, just to produce dogs they hope will have a particular type or a particular marketability. 

What Tweedmouth did to create the Golden Retriever is miles, even parsecs away from what your typical "Doodle" maker is doing.


----------



## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

tippykayak said:


> There are lots and lots of great responses on the forum about this, but I'll take a stab at it:
> 
> There's a huge difference between a mixed breed dog and a new breed of dog. Crossing a Golden and a Poodle does not result in a new breed. New breeds are created when individuals or groups get together and incorporate strains from different breeds together over many generations to create dogs that breed true with each generation, and then they select from those true-breeding dogs to aim for particular characteristics over time.
> 
> ...


Well said!!


----------



## damita (Jun 4, 2009)

Tippykayak - I think you posted a great response and I couldn't have done better myself! Great post!


----------



## momtoMax (Apr 21, 2009)

Hot ****!! Over 100 responses!! I read you get points for things like, how long your threads get to be. I wonder how to look at how many points I have... Hmm. Thank you all for getting to the 100 mark!  *whistle*


----------



## Tinsley (Nov 11, 2008)

momtoMax said:


> Hot ****!! Over 100 responses!! I read you get points for things like, how long your threads get to be. I wonder how to look at how many points I have... Hmm. Thank you all for getting to the 100 mark!  *whistle*


lol! I wish I had the faintist idea of how things work with the new user parts, I get the rep bit but no idea about the green and red bars, will have to do some researching!


----------



## timberwolf (Apr 1, 2009)

Tippykayak - Bravo!!!!!


----------



## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

momtoMax said:


> Hot ****!! Over 100 responses!! I read you get points for things like, how long your threads get to be. I wonder how to look at how many points I have... Hmm. Thank you all for getting to the 100 mark!  *whistle*


Really? I should start a doodle thread!


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

GoldenSail said:


> Really? I should start a doodle thread!


Or an Obama thread :wave:


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Oh, and by the way Tippykayak ... thank you for the explanation. That makes sense.


----------



## Abbydabbydo (Jan 31, 2007)

*Well here in Iowa*

They don't cost more than BYB dogs. Not a good thing but the ones in Abby's pack are well loved and well taken care of. We don't do designer here much  And don't think Gomar bin Laden is getting attacked, he is the meanest one in the pack.
Coco:








Riley Jean:








Coco:








Abby wondering about a Rottie pup:








Takes all kinds and I would welcome your friend to the board.

PS Coco and Riley really don't shed as much as Finn, but that is not saying much. 
Am I against it? Sure. But the ones I know are best loved and taken care of.


----------



## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Jo Ellen said:


> I have a question. If no reputable breeder will breed mixed breed dogs, how do we come up with new breeds?


I have a friend with a Shiloh Shepherd. The breed is not AKC recognized but is registerable by one of the rare breed organizations. She did not like what happens to a breed when popular. Here is a link to their history--1962 was when she started. Recent enough? 

http://www.shilohshepherds.org/kennelof.htm


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

LOL, I love the last picture, Marcy.

I'm going to go read your link, GS. Thanks.


----------



## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

Poor girl looks really worried! LOL. I have seen that same look on Danny's face before.


----------



## Abbydabbydo (Jan 31, 2007)

Rottie turned out to be fun, but I could tell she was thinking about jumping in the boat. I would throw my life in between the Abs and an agressive dog. And she would give hers for me.


----------



## dnewman220 (Jun 23, 2009)

*Hello*

I am new to this forum and I also have a 9 month old Goldendoodle. If your friend is looking for a good forum for her to join I would recommend Doodlekisses.com.


Dawn


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I would love to see pictures of your goldendoodle, Dawn


----------



## dnewman220 (Jun 23, 2009)

I just posted a few on my page--I need to get some more recent ones though.


----------



## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

Welcome to you and Molly,
She is adorable. We love all dogs here so I hope you will stick around. Does she shed or a non shedder? That muddy paws picture just made me crack up.


----------



## marshab1 (Aug 28, 2006)

Molly is adorable! Welcome to the forum.


----------



## dnewman220 (Jun 23, 2009)

Thanks for the welcome! I guess it depends what you call shedding...lol. She leaves no hair on my furniture, clothes, etc. When I comb her out really good she leaves a very small bit of fur on the comb. But she is a first generation mix...so I am open to the fact that she may shed eventually! I really don't care if she does or not...I have 3 cats who shed like crazy so what's one more! LOL


----------



## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

She is adorable for sure!


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I think Molly is absolutely adorable. I posted on most all of your pictures LOL

I think I have a thing for goldendoodles :


----------



## PhuFighter (Jun 22, 2009)

it's not the dog's fault where it's genes came from. I love all dogs and I don't see why we can't love this one too


----------



## dnewman220 (Jun 23, 2009)

Thanks--we love her.


----------



## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Tell us about her personality


----------



## Noey (Feb 26, 2009)

I was reading early comments in this thread about telling your friend not to come to the forum. I think they should logon and enjoy. You will find many people who care deeply about dogs. We have many people adopting golden’s and quite frankly unless you do a DNA on all of them you can't be 100% your adopted golden is 100% golden just because it "looks golden." And we don't give a hard time about them.

You find the same issues when people talk about breeding. And yes I understand all the technical items etc, it’s very educational, but I would never reject anyone for looking for a place to gather with people with similar interests. Just let your friend know it's a forum full of people who have very varying views and are not afraid to voice them. And they don’t have to comment on anything they don’t like.

I love Goldendoodles, I now have to toggle back a few and look for what I think is a posted picture. Half golden is golden enough for me.
I like the folk on this forum, those who think like me and those who don’t. They make for an interesting place to come to and it’s a community who love Golden’s, so I think your friend is welcome.


----------



## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

Noey said:


> I was reading early comments in this thread about telling your friend not to come to the forum. I think they should logon and enjoy. You will find many people who care deeply about dogs. We have many people adopting golden’s and quite frankly unless you do a DNA on all of them you can't be 100% your adopted golden is 100% golden just because it "looks golden." And we don't give a hard time about them.


This is a common misconception. A lot of adopted goldens were turned into the shelter or owner surrendered with papers. So yes, there are proven purebred goldens in rescue. No DNA test needed any more than you would if you bought one directly from a breeder.

I have two goldens (both adopted from the rescue I foster for) and a lab/golden. My lab/golden doesn't get nearly the attention here as my golden boys do. That's what happens when you have a forum that is specifically aimed towards a certain breed of dog. If this were a retriever forum rather than a golden retriever forum, I am sure that the reception would be totally different. I don't take offense at it, and I am pretty sure that the other folks who have different breeds along with their goldens feel the same way.


----------



## heartofgold (Oct 27, 2007)

I love goldendoodles! 

The people who breed them are another story though. People who pay money for "designer breeds" (I call them mutts) are as ignorant as the people who breed them. But then again sometimes ignorence is bliss. 

These are mixed breed dogs plain and simple. I would search for one in a shelter or rescue though. 

Nothing against the dogs but I would never pay for one.


----------



## dnewman220 (Jun 23, 2009)

Thank you for asking. She is just so sweet. I had labs in the past...very excitable ones I might add. And I was prepared that she was going to be this wild and crazy puppy--but she is actually quite mellow. Very playful, don't get me wrong...but she is just very content with sitting with me or just laying by my feet. She does however think that every single person or animal she meets should want to play with her--but I am not sure if that will just be her personality or her still being a puppy. I have 3 small children--ages 7, 4 and 2 and she is fantastic with them. She has added so much joy to our lives.


----------



## fight4usmak (Apr 11, 2009)

I just can't believe that this is the same forum that I once felt so comforted, cared for, and incredibly welcomed. Quite honestly, I can't believe what I'm reading.
For heaven's sake people, we're talking about a dog! No matter what the breed, have we forgotten what dogs (of any breed of mix) offer us?! Unconditional love, companionship, friendship, a wag of a tail in our darkest moments, a welcome at the door like no other, healing, laughter, etc. etc. 
I have seen many members on this forum that do NOT have GR. They are welcomed memebers of this forum. why would you treat someone so differently just because they have a doodle? Regardless of the breed, arent they coming here for support and understanding?
Working at various shelters, I come across several breeds that I do not like for one reason or another. Would I show them any less love or understanding?! Absolutelut not!!!
Yes, there are some bad doodle breeders out there, but guess what? There are many bad GR breeders as well! Does that mean I would love a GR any less? Absolutely not! In fact, our rescue Golden came from a horrible breeder, and that's why I showed my love and compassion that more!
Did I ever think I would have a Labradoodle? Never crossed my mind, didn't think one way or another. Could I imagine life wihout my doodlebug? Not any more. He is proving to be one of the sweetest, most loving, friendly, smart, and affrectionate dog I have ever had. Believe me, after losing Mak, it was going to take one special pup to fill his paws. Well, Shaggy has warmed our heart and has shown us that life goes on.....
Like I said earlier, it's just so difficult to believe that this is the same forum that got me through my darkest days (and for that I will always be extremely grateful!). To read some of the comments, just makes me very sad and so disappointed.
Karen


----------



## dnewman220 (Jun 23, 2009)

Thank you so much for your compassion, Karen.


----------



## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

As a member of the GRCA, I agree with their stand on Doodles. I am opposed to intentional breeding of Golden Retrievers with anything, and particularly then marketing them as something that they are not.

This would go for Golden Pyreness, Golden Irish, Golden Labradors, Golden Newfies, Golden Doodles, Soft Coated Goldens, and Goldmaraners, as "recognized" by the American Canine Hybrid Club http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/americancaninehybridclub.htm which would appear to recognize and "register" a Golden Retriever crossed with a frog, if it were done.

That said, I love all dogs, and certainly don't hold against the dogs what the people who are producing them have done. I am very much against charging exhorbitant prices for dogs that are not what they are marketed to be - they are _not _healthier/smarter/hypoallergenic, etc etc.


----------



## fight4usmak (Apr 11, 2009)

By the way, when I think of my friends that don't think twice about dropping $1,000.00 or more on a purse, piece of jewelry, ugly dress or pair of shoes, etc. etc., I just think, must be nice! Why would I look down on someone because they spent that much on what will hopefully be, a beloved member of their family?! There are families out there that have been waiting a long, long time for these doodles to come about. It might be due to allergies, or just because they want the traits of a Golden/Lab mixed with a Poodle. Why would you fault someone for that? And mind you, this is coming from a person that spends many hours a well working long and hard to find godo homes for homeless pets. Every dog deserves a loving family, no matter what kind or where they come from. I won't spend more then $50.00 on a purse, but I don't judge my friends that will spend a $1,000.00 or more. And of you use the argument about how there are so many homeless dogs being put to sleep, well remember, most of you didn't get your GR from a shelter.
Also, we were given Shaggy as a gift, we did not pay. Shaggy is already in the works for the Shriner's Hospital pet therapy program. Most of his little puppy mates are eithor Goldendoodles or Labradoodles, and the room is just filled with so much love and joy.
Karen


----------



## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

> There are families out there that have been waiting a long, long time for these doodles to come about. It might be due to allergies, or just because they want the traits of a Golden/Lab mixed with a Poodle. Why would you fault someone for that?


I do have a problem with a breeder mixing these two breeds, calling them by a "cutsie" name and implying that they are hypoallergenic just because they have poodle in them. And I have a problem with "breeders" who will mix two different breeds of dogs just to make a buck. I don't have a problem with the dogs, I have a problem with the people who breed them.

Again, I have a mixed breed that I do not call a labragolden or a goldendor. She doesn't need a cutsie breed name tied to her. She is a mutt, and that's fine with me. I also have two goldens who came from shelters, one of whom was turned in with his AKC papers. So I am very aware of the fact that there are already tons of dogs in shelters without irresponsible breeders adding to those statistics. And I am not ashamed of my stance on this subject regardless of how many people say "tsk tsk, I thought this was a nice forum with nice people". 

We are all allowed to have our beliefs and we have the right to voice those beliefs. Just like those who tsk tsk us.


----------



## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

fight4usmak said:


> By the way, when I think of my friends that don't think twice about dropping $1,000.00 or more on a purse, piece of jewelry, ugly dress or pair of shoes, etc. etc., I just think, must be nice! Why would I look down on someone because they spent that much on what will hopefully be, a beloved member of their family?! There are families out there that have been waiting a long, long time for these doodles to come about. It might be due to allergies, or just because they want the traits of a Golden/Lab mixed with a Poodle. Why would you fault someone for that? And mind you, this is coming from a person that spends many hours a well working long and hard to find godo homes for homeless pets. Every dog deserves a loving family, no matter what kind or where they come from. I won't spend more then $50.00 on a purse, but I don't judge my friends that will spend a $1,000.00 or more. And of you use the argument about how there are so many homeless dogs being put to sleep, well remember, most of you didn't get your GR from a shelter.
> Also, we were given Shaggy as a gift, we did not pay. Shaggy is already in the works for the Shriner's Hospital pet therapy program. Most of his little puppy mates are eithor Goldendoodles or Labradoodles, and the room is just filled with so much love and joy.
> Karen


 
I'm not judging those who buy Doodles for exhorbitant fees. My issue is with those who _produce_ them, and market them using untrue claims such as better health, "hybrid vigor", non-shedding, hypoallergenic, etc etc, making buyers _believe _that they are worth paying those high prices for. 
I don't doubt that he fills a room with much love and joy. So can most dogs, including any other mixed breed that you might find at any given shelter, or for sale in parking lots across the country for $25.00. 

I believe that there is a fairly large percentage of GRF members who have indeed gotten their GR's from rescues or shelters.

Aside from all of that, I am very happy for you and your family that Shaggy is helping to fill the emptiness that Mak left. He's a cute puppy.


----------



## WLR (May 11, 2008)

I really don't have any malace toward GD's per se', I guess what annoys me the most is the sensationalist attitude of the "breeders" where in 1 recent post I saw them looking for 2500$ for a GD pup.


----------



## fight4usmak (Apr 11, 2009)

I'm going to walk away from this thread now, before I offend or get into it with those that were incredibly kind and supportive to my family during a horrible time. I will never, ever forget the kindness of those that endured the journey with us.
Not to mention, my typing is just terrible when I get heated-up 
Hugs,
Karen


----------



## fight4usmak (Apr 11, 2009)

*I just had to post this pic.......*

Shaggy absolutelu adores Ryan :0)


----------



## fight4usmak (Apr 11, 2009)

*One more of Kobe and Shaggy *

Shaggy has also helped Kobe to move on.....


----------



## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

fight4usmak said:


> I'm going to walk away from this thread now, before I offend or get into it with those that were incredibly kind and supportive to my family during a horrible time. I will never, ever forget the kindness of those that endured the journey with us.
> Not to mention, my typing is just terrible when I get heated-up
> Hugs,
> Karen


I hope that you are not assuming that those who were kind and supportive during your ordeal with Mak would have been anything other than that if it were another breed. I know that I wouldn't. My feelings abot Doodles and other mixed breeds being intentionally produced have nothing whatsoever to do with the people who might own them.


----------



## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

Pointgold said:


> I hope that you are not assuming that those who were kind and supportive during your ordeal with Mak would have been anything other than that if it were another breed. I know that I wouldn't. My feelings abot Doodles and other mixed breeds being intentionally produced have nothing whatsoever to do with the people who might own them.


Nor, do I think, do those feelings extend to the dogs themselves. I think sometimes we lose sight of that - the doodles that I've met have all been sweet and loveable, and their owners have been very nice people. I think the issue here is the breeding and marketing of the dogs as something they are not. 
And if one of my friends plopped down a gazillion dollars for a designer bag, I'd probably think he or she was nuts - but if that same person plopped down a gazillion dollars for a knockoff, I'd say they were certifiable. The mixed breeds are just that to me, a knockoff - not really a Golden, not really a Poodle, just a wannabe on both counts. (Just my opinion)


----------



## fight4usmak (Apr 11, 2009)

And our family and friends in the UK, believe that the American GR is a bad knock-off! I suppose we are all entitled to our opinion, I just never thought I would encounter such rude and insenstive remarks on this forum.


----------



## Romeo1 (Apr 19, 2008)

fight4usmak said:


> And our family and friends in the UK, believe that the American GR is a bad knock-off! I suppose we are all entitled to our opinion.


Shaggy is an adorable love bug! Wow, he is really growing up fast. He and Ryan look inseparable. Thx for posting new pix of him.



> I just never thought I would encounter such rude and insenstive remarks on this forum


I agree. I'm sorry you had to read it.


----------



## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

fight4usmak said:


> And our family and friends in the UK, believe that the American GR is a bad knock-off! I suppose we are all entitled to our opinion, I just never thought I would encounter such rude and insenstive remarks on this forum.


I guess I missed the rude remarks. I hope you're not referring to my explanation of the creation of new breeds. I'm not a fan of the Australian Labradoodle breed standard as set out by their club, but that doesn't mean I hold anything against any mixed dogs out there, and I had no intention of being rude. Quite the contrary, actually.


----------



## Brian (Sep 20, 2011)

Just an opinion, but I believe there is a reason to experiment with cross-breeding goldens. Having had 5 in over my lifetime, and having seen the breeds awful propensity for developing cancer, I am all in favor of a "healthier" golden. Of course their claims have yet to be statistically proven.....


----------



## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Brian said:


> Just an opinion, but I believe there is a reason to experiment with cross-breeding goldens. Having had 5 in over my lifetime, and having seen the breeds awful propensity for developing cancer, I am all in favor of a "healthier" golden. Of course their claims have yet to be statistically proven.....


 
So, how does this work, please? I mean, how does cross breeding them produce healthier dogs with less of a propensity for developing cancer?


----------



## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

Brian said:


> Just an opinion, but I believe there is a reason to experiment with cross-breeding goldens. Having had 5 in over my lifetime, and having seen the breeds awful propensity for developing cancer, I am all in favor of a "healthier" golden. Of course their claims have yet to be statistically proven.....


Welcome to the forum! What a strange thread to bump up from 2 years ago as your first post. Actually, if you are going to purchase a golden and you purchase one from a reputable breeder, you may run into the occasional cancer, but more likely not. By breeding goldens willy nilly to other breeds, you are not only breeding in the genes for cancer, displaysia, heart conditions, etc but the genes that whatever is being breed to the golden has the propensity towards. Hybrid vigor is a fallacy promoted by breeders of designer breed dogs.


----------



## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

fight4usmak said:


> And our family and friends in the UK, believe that the American GR is a bad knock-off! I suppose we are all entitled to our opinion, I just never thought I would encounter such rude and insenstive remarks on this forum.


Since this thread was made active again today, I just saw this. 

This statement "And our family and friends in the UK, believe that the American GR is a bad knock-off!" really surprises me. I have many friends in the UK and none of them have ever considered our Goldens to be "bad knock-offs".  They appreciate them in exactly the same way that I do the English style. I appreciate a good one no matter... Many of the UK members right here on this forum regularly admire US dogs, and vice verse.


----------

