# Poor little Schnauzer...



## Blaireli (Jun 3, 2008)

One of my sister's clients came in with their SIXTEEN-WEEK-OLD Schnauzer with completely white gums and she sent it immediately up to MedVet. It had developed AIHA, the horrible disease that took my Heidi Bug, after a vaccine reaction. With Heidi, there was no trigger that we could find. Unfortunately, just like my Heidi, he had a hemolytic crisis and was not able to pull through. Obviously, I didn't know this poor puppy or his owners, but I wanted to share his story with everyone here. I want people to be more aware of this devastating disease and the fact that it can literally strike at ANY time and at any age. How heartbreaking.

Rest in peace, sweet puppers.


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## riddle03 (Jun 9, 2005)

Oh, how sad that baby didn't even have a chance to live life. Play at the bridge sweet puppy.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

How very sad. Blair, we now have a sticky on AIHA...... I think once anyone is touched by this not so rare disease, they want everyone to be aware and learn about it. There is research going on for a cure by the Morris Animal Foundation (fund # 338). The woman who owns www.thetrumancollar.com lost a dog to it and now donates a sizeable (if I remember right 20%) portion of everything made there to research.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

Makes you so scared about vaccines and other things that trigger this disease.

God speed sweet baby.


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## sharlin (Feb 26, 2007)

You must be special little one to have been called so young.
Play Hard & Godspeed.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Debles said:


> Makes you so scared about vaccines and other things that trigger this disease.
> 
> God speed sweet baby.


Sure does Deb.... I was never this neurotic before.... I SWEAR !!!!!


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## Blaireli (Jun 3, 2008)

I know, I think I've become slightly (read: incredibly) neurotic, as well. I didn't realize how much until after dinner last night at Brooke's house. I had all three dogs over there, and Brooke was like, "Blair, you have to stop." I didn't even realize that I had checked their gums probably five or six times EACH in the last hour.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

I still check Cody's a couple times daily. The others probably a couple times a week.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Blaireli said:


> I know, I think I've become slightly (read: incredibly) neurotic, as well. I didn't realize how much until after dinner last night at Brooke's house. I had all three dogs over there, and Brooke was like, "Blair, you have to stop." I didn't even realize that I had checked their gums probably five or six times EACH in the last hour.


Blair, being the outsider looking in, from the time Heidi started having anemia trouble, I thought it very possibly due to the stress of her recent surgery. Cody came into rescue ill like that after a long period of neglect (abuse in my opinion). He was 17 months old. So we never really knew a cause, altho springers are predisposed. My gut feeling is it was brought on by the stress of his living situation.... although that was when I became obsessed about nutrition, over vaccination etc....... any possibility that I could control, since there is so much that we can't.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Blair*

Blair:

So very sorry to hear about the Schnauzer. Sixteen is just an incredible age to live to. I know we are NEVER ready to part with our pets.
The longest any of my dogs have ever lived is to 12 years old.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Karen519 said:


> Blair:
> 
> So very sorry to hear about the Schnauzer. Sixteen is just an incredible age to live to. I know we are NEVER ready to part with our pets.
> The longest any of my dogs have ever lived is to 12 years old.


The schnauzer was only 16 WEEKS old...... just a baby.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Debles said:


> Makes you so scared about vaccines and other things that trigger this disease.


I always worry that people are going to be turned off of vaccines because of things like AIHA. Please, everyone remember that AIHA is a condition that is believed to be triggered by stress on the immune system. While a vaccine can act as a trigger, a dog is much more likely to get AIHA from an infection that a vaccine would prevent than from the vaccine itself. 

For example, there's an extremely small chance a dog will get AIHA in reaction to a vaccine for parvo, but a much larger chance that a parvo infection itself would trigger it.

I'm also so, so sorry to hear about such a young pup being taken so suddenly. I'm checking Ajax's gums when I get home from work.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

I'm not at all anti vaccination. However, I am against OVER vaccination. Many vets agree with vaccinating every three years. However, in Dallas most vets routinely vax yearly, even with a rabies medication that states it is a 3 year product. Dr Jean Dodds is currently the co-founder of the Rabies Challenge Fund (http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/ ) with research being done by Dr Ronald Schultz. Hopefully, this will offer some answers. BTW, co-founder Kris Christine is a member here and has posted lots of info.


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

I often thought that this is what killed my GSD Zeus. I sent him to the bridge before any of the bloodwork could come back for cancer because he was literally suffocating to death - losing oxygen in his blood.

They initially told me it looked like cancer of the spleen or liver, according to x-rays and preliminary tests. He was peeing syrupy blood and his gums were pale white. He also collapsed on me a couple times.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

cubbysan said:


> I often thought that this is what killed my GSD Zeus. I sent him to the bridge before any of the bloodwork could come back for cancer because he was literally suffocating to death - losing oxygen in his blood.
> 
> They initially told me it looked like cancer of the spleen or liver, according to x-rays and preliminary tests. He was peeing syrupy blood and his gums were pale white. He also collapsed on me a couple times.


I'm so sorry about Zeus. ALot of time with AIHA their spleen is very enlarged. It's a terrible terrible disease and claims so many.... often at such young ages. Hugs to you.


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## 3 goldens (Sep 30, 2005)

Karen, that puppy was only 16 WEEKS old. I feel so sorry for it's owners.

For years I have carried on about this disease and how ProHeart6 brought it to my Hunter and killed him. Once you have been thru the nightmare, you do not forget, you never stop worrying about your other ogs. And now that I am hearing of it more and more often, it scares me even more. This is the youngest dog I have heard of developing AIHA

I NO LONGER GO WILLY-NILLY INOT EVERY VACCINE THA COMES ALONE AS I ONCE DID. MY DOGS STOPPED GETING LEPTO AND LYME WHEN I FOUND THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A CAE OF LYME DOWN HERE, AND ONLY ONE CASE OF LEPTO IN THE ENTIRE AREA. I ONLY GET KENNEL COUGH WHEN BOARDING THEM BECAUSE IT IS REQUIRED---EVEN KNOWING IT ONLY PROTECTS AGAINS A FEW STRAINS OF IT. FORGET THE TARTAR PREVENTION VAXD THAT IS OUT NOW.

Betty, I order Truman Collars for Honey and KayCee a couple of years agto, the Irish Plaid (green plaid) for KayCee and the Mum (color of mum flowers for Honey. And it think itis 25% sent to the Morris Foundation.

Also, Jean Brudd has a gift shop on hr site, www.thepetguardian.com that mostly deals withgifts, etc for people to send to others who have lost a pet. I got the most beautiful golden retriever picture frame there. Anway, Jean sends part of evey order to one of 3 charaties, one being Meisha's Hope Fund at Morris Animal Foundation. Jean lost her Tasha to AIHA followin ProHeart6 injection. One of the other charaties is one that takes care of senior or other handicapped unadoptable dogs. Can't think of the 3rd one.

All I can ay is anyone who has ever dealt with this diseae, watch their dog the way I watched Hunter die will never be able to get it out of their mind, will forever be checking their dogs gums, rushing to the vet if anything seems slightly amiss.


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## 3 goldens (Sep 30, 2005)

I really think it is a matter of TO MUCH stuff being pumped into them and wrecking their immune system. It is known that rabies vax last 3 years, but many places---like where I live--require it eery year. Many vets don't want to give up the money and will vax against everything every single year. My vet went to 3 year vax schedule for most things a fw years back, and in fact, once a dog ges up around 8, he says no more vax no matter how old the dogs lives to be---except state required rabies.

It is also known that some antibiotics are more prone to bring on AIHA than others. You take a dog that in one year gets all the vax, gets heartworm every month, flea/tack, say 9 times, has allegie and ges steroids and antibiotics 2-3 times a year....that is a lot of drugs going into it's body. And Ihonestly believe that is why we are seeing more ofthis disease than we did just 6 years ago. Hec, I had never evenheard of it back then.


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## Blaireli (Jun 3, 2008)

tippykayak said:


> I always worry that people are going to be turned off of vaccines because of things like AIHA. Please, everyone remember that AIHA is a condition that is believed to be triggered by stress on the immune system. While a vaccine can act as a trigger, a dog is much more likely to get AIHA from an infection that a vaccine would prevent than from the vaccine itself.
> 
> For example, there's an extremely small chance a dog will get AIHA in reaction to a vaccine for parvo, but a much larger chance that a parvo infection itself would trigger it.
> 
> I'm also so, so sorry to hear about such a young pup being taken so suddenly. I'm checking Ajax's gums when I get home from work.


I definitely agree! I hope nobody thought I was putting this on here about vaccines. I'm definitely pro-vaccine. Brooke said that this was the first time she has ever seen a case this bad as a vaccine reaction. 

After contacting Heidi's old owners, I learned that she had a horrible vaccine reaction to an all around vaccine just before they rehomed her. They almost lost her then! Does this have anything to do with the AIHA? Probably not, as there were almost two years in between.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Blaireli said:


> I definitely agree! I hope nobody thought I was putting this on here about vaccines. I'm definitely pro-vaccine. Brooke said that this was the first time she has ever seen a case this bad as a vaccine reaction.
> 
> After contacting Heidi's old owners, I learned that she had a horrible vaccine reaction to an all around vaccine just before they rehomed her. They almost lost her then! Does this have anything to do with the AIHA? Probably not, as there were almost two years in between.


I didn't think you would. Your sister's a vet, so you're in as good a position as anybody to understand that vaccines are vastly more likely to prevent a life-threatening problem than cause one. I just like to clarify that point on these threads, though, because sometimes vaccines get a bad rap online, even though study after study after study confirms that those horror stories are statistically minute. Vets have many more stories of unvaccinated dogs suffering or even dying from easily preventable diseases than of dogs suffering from vaccine reactions.

It sounds like she had some kind of immune-mediated disorder if she had that bad reaction before as well. I wish we understood these immune processes better.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Blaireli said:


> I definitely agree! I hope nobody thought I was putting this on here about vaccines. I'm definitely pro-vaccine. Brooke said that this was the first time she has ever seen a case this bad as a vaccine reaction.
> 
> After contacting Heidi's old owners, I learned that she had a horrible vaccine reaction to an all around vaccine just before they rehomed her. They almost lost her then! Does this have anything to do with the AIHA? Probably not, as there were almost two years in between.


Prrobably not Blair.... but it could speak to the condition of her immune system.


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