# Counting Ch and GCh points (in AKC)



## Alaska7133 (May 26, 2011)

First I have neither problem, because it have no points. But I was curious if you win a bunch of 1 and 2 point shows and it takes awhile to get 3 majors, do those extra points count towards a GCh? For instance say your wins are a 5 pt major, 5 @ 1 pt shows, and 3 @ 2 pt shows, which mean your dog isn't finished. So then you go in to win 2 majors at 3 pts each. Your total points are 22 pts. And you finally go those 3 majors you needed. Do those 7 extra points count towards your GCh? Or do all GCh points have come in the best of breed ring? 

So now what if you dog finishes their Ch on a Friday of a 3 day cluster, then your dog goes in the best of breed ring the rest of the weekend right? So what happens to those in the lower classes? Do those dogs potentially show for less points if that dog is removed and brought up to the best of breed ring? (I mean drop the win from say a 3 pt to a 2 pt win?)

Our shows are very low points up here since we don't have many dogs. So often our shows are just 1 or 2 points.

For those interested in what all this means:
Ch is champion (finished)
GCh is grand champion
Major is a 3, 4, or 5 point show
Shows are 1 to 5 points each. To have a Ch you must have 3 major wins. The amount of points a show is worth is determined by the number of dogs and bitches in the show and the region of the US you are in.

Please correct me if I'm wrong!


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## LJack (Aug 10, 2012)

*AKC Championship*

Okay this is the part I am most comfortable with as I have not had to deal with Grand points yet.

One thing I do know is that class competition points are. It the same as grand points and do not transfer.

The AKC Championship requires 15 point total while requiring 2 majors of 3 or more points. 

So, a dogs can easily and often get "minor-ed" out. This means the dog has as many minor points as it needs but is lacking the majors. This means 9 or sometimes 10 points. 9 is ideal because if you pull two 3 point majors you are done. If you get two 5 point majors you have only over shot by 2 points. Though if you are sitting at 8 points and you win a 2 point show you will end up at 10.

In your example you would have gone past "minoring" out by 1 or 2 shows. Since they do not transfer, you in essence have wasted points others could have used.

Though there are no hard and fast rules, here is what I have seen and some of my opinions on it. 

There is not a rule that would stop you from gathering an unlimited amount of minor point wins. Usually out of good sportsmanship and of course thrift most owners will not show a "minor-ed" out dog at a minor point show. The exceptions I have seen are:

1. They believe the dog has a real chance of going breed or best opposite sex. 
where these additional defeated dogs will push the points to 3.

2. It is a small specialty that has just 1or 2 point but they still want have the 
Opportunity at a win that will be publicized in the GRCA news. I am not a 
fan of this one as it is not what I consider good sportsmanship.

There is also no rule that would stop a finished Champion from competing in the classes. You see this when:

1. A dog has won his final major and finished an earlier day during a cluster 
where moving this dog up to the best of breed competition would break
the major for the remaining class dogs. This is very good sportsmanship 
as majors are hard to come by. In these instances the dogs are usually 
handed off if with a handler or they are shown less polished as they are no 
longer trying for the win. I once heard of a dog finish one weekend a still 
shown in the classes the next weekend since moving this dog would break 
that entire shows chance at majors. Of course if the major breaks anyway, 
move the dog up.
2. I have not seen this in person, but have heard of it happening. Showing a 
newly finished dog in a specialty that is a solid major in an effort to garner 
an impressive win or add that the dog finished with x-number of majors or 
x-number specialty wins. I am not a fan of this one as it is not what I 
consider good sportsmanship.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

GCH points only come from the BOB ring. 

Lush finished her CH at 19 months and her GCH at 21 months. She was never "singled out" by having all her single points but no majors etc, bc she had both her majors and just went looking for a point to finish. 

Yes, if you move your class dog up, the you can win GCH points, but the other people back in the classes do potentially lose a point or the major. On the other hand, if you decide to keep your class dog in the classes to hold the major and sacrifice your chance to win GCH points, then you have to be SURE you show the dog poorly enough not to turn around and get the win. When a dog is on a hot streak, there is potential to try and do the sportsmanlike thing, but end up badly anyway if you win again. 

Once you have a GCH title, you can then decide if you'd like to try for a Show Dog Hall Of Fame. This is elaborate, and it is when winning Best Of Breed starts feeling disappointing if you do not win in the Group. By the time you are working for SDHF and to be in the top twenty, the show becomes about group winning and trying to make it to Best In Show at the day's end.


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## LJack (Aug 10, 2012)

*Grand Championship*

This is where they need to have 3 majors (Championship is just Two) and a total of 25 points. Here is the info from AKC. 

"A dog must be (1) a Champion of Record or (2) have been transferred to BOB competition based upon the owners’ records of their having completed the requirements for a CH title to be eligible for Grand Championship (GCH) competition.

The American Kennel Club requires a dog to obtain a total of 25 points with three major wins (a major win is worth three points or higher) to become a Grand Champion. The majors must be won under three different judges and at least one other judge must award some of the remaining points – so you need to win under at least four different judges. Also at least one Champion of Record must be defeated at three of these shows.

Best of Breed – BOB
Best of Opposite Sex – BOS
Select Dog – SD
Select Bitch – SB"


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## Alaska7133 (May 26, 2011)

Thanks for clarifying that you can't bring points over from class to BOB. I do have a friend here in Anchorage that is trying to get enough points for her boy to be in the hall of fame. I hope he makes it, it's a lot of work to get that far.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

SDHF- 25 points:
You get 15 points for Best in Show (5 of them from your Group 1)
Reserve best in show is 7.5 points
Group 1 is 5 points
group 2 is 3 points
group 3 is 1 point
BOB at the National is 5 points
Regional specialty BOB is 3 points
Regular specialty BOB 1 point


When you look at the whole country, you can kind of see how many GCH points a really competitive dog garners while out and about, and how far off even a very winning dog is just emerging from the classes. Here are "lifetime" GCH points counted up: 

No. 1 GCH CH Summits Emery Its In The Bag	Bitch	1640 
No. 2 GCH CH Shadowland's Paws For Applause At Tristar CD RE SH	Bitch	639 
No. 3 GCH CH Venture's Boys N Toys	Dog	603 
GCH CH My Buddy's Boppity-Bop Blue Moon RA	Dog	603 
No. 5 GCH CH Gemini Fallchase The Butler Did It	Dog	562 
No. 6 GCH CH Gaia Of Yoshida Enterprise	Dog	561 
No. 7 GCH CH Scion Hott Pants RN	Bitch	552 
No. 8 GCH CH Trance Mission Jp Cunard Adventure	Dog	531 
No. 9 GCH CH Goldenway's Caramel Chew-Chew	Dog	454 
No. 10 GCH CH White Birch Darby Hill Light My Fire	Dog	437 
No. 11 GCH CH Summits The Titanic	Dog	365 
No. 12 GCH CH Easthill Broxden Woodland Lettuce Entertain You	Dog	351 
No. 13 GCH CH Summits Sonny Side Up	Dog	349 
No. 14 GCH CH Gosling's Reel Deal	Dog	342 
No. 15 GCH CH Glengowan's Great Balls Of Fire	Dog	322 
No. 16 GCH CH Rush Hill's River Road Payoff JH	Dog	314 
No. 17 GCH CH Numoon Yukon Anticipation	Bitch	307 
No. 18 GCH CH Tempo's U'Ve Got What Gets Me	Dog	294 
No. 19 GCH CH Forevers Quest For Atlantis	Dog	293 
No. 20 GCH CH Eagleridge's Return From Bombay	Dog	285 
No. 21 GCH CH Glaciers Ringing In The New Year	Bitch	279 
No. 22 GCH CH Wingold's Eagle Scout RN JH	Dog	258 
No. 23 GCH CH Pulai's I Want More... Goldenale	Bitch	254 
No. 24 GCH CH Highlight's A Million Comments	Bitch	252 
No. 25 GCH CH Easthill Broxden Woodland Turnip The Volume	Dog	248 
No. 26 GCH CH Summits Every Fashion Venture	Bitch	247 
No. 27 GCH CH St Andrew Romp 'N Stomp CD JH	Dog	244 
No. 28 GCH CH Valentia Iron Gate Time Is On My Side	Dog	241 
No. 29 GCH CH Pennylane Jansun Justin Credible	Dog	236 
No. 30 GCH CH VanReel's There Goes My Money CDX JH	Dog	225 
No. 31 GCH CH Shor'Line Jetoca High Seas Adventure RA TDX JH	Dog	221 
No. 32 GCH CH Rush Hill's Drama'Geddon JH	Dog	220 
No. 33 GCH CH Regency Raise The Bet	Bitch	214 
No. 34 GCH CH Hillock's Bacardi CD RE	Dog	212 
No. 35 GCH CH Jazzin's Final Jeopardy	Dog	206


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