# Biting when I pull him along



## CedarFurbaby (Jun 6, 2016)

I am now full of bruises on my arms and feeling like a failure at handling Cedar...

He has always been a challenging dog, though lately he's been pretty good with no issues for a few months now. We always had overarousal issues. He would have a meltdown over one thing or another, jumping and biting over just about anything. I felt like we have gotten so far, because he stopped going into a meltdown over so many things. He can handle being at obedience class with lots of dogs around him and most of the time can perform some really good stuff. 

The only thing that hasn't changed is that he absolutely hates it when I pull him along with a leash. I guess I haven't realised how much he hated it because he would allow it sometimes. Though that may depend on the accumulation of stress within the day. 

Since a few months ago, if he is on a haltie, and he starts biting for whatever reason, I tell him no bite and I hold the haltie in a way that closes his mouth. When he stops biting, I immediately release him. This had seemed to work for some time, and he stops quickly. But not today. We did have a big morning, so he is quite tired. Usually I tell him to come along cheerfully and wait for him to comply but I was impatient today and it was late, so I just ended up pulling him. I should have known better. Although perhaps it woulnd't have made a difference - in the past I would ask him to come and after he came he would have the melt down too. Although he did stop the biting and then I released him, he just laid down and wouldn't move after that. I had dumbly forgot to take treats because I figured it was just a toilet break. And since he wasn't moving, I decided to head home and go get the treats. And I left him by himself a few houses down from my house, but not leashed up or anything. I guess he could have run off and get hit by a car, so I shouldn't have done that.... But luckily he didn't, he was right where I left him when I came back. Then we walked home and I rewarded each time he was walking nicely beside me. By that point, my feeling is that he's too riled up to do much, so I just wanted to get him home quick. Two minutes after getting home, he fell asleep straightaway. So he is actually really tired. 

I don't know how to deal with it anymore. Although I've been thinking of it as an overarousal issue, I'm wondering if it is an aggression issue and pulling him is a trigger? Any thoughts are much much appreciated.


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## usually lurking (Apr 21, 2017)

I'm not sure why any dog would enjoy being "pulled along." Biting is his way of expressing his displeasure at what you are doing. Get a buckle collar and teach him to walk on a leash one step at a time. If he is too strong for you and you can't get his attention long enough to teach, get a trainer to show you how to use a prong collar. It is not a long term solution, but is useful to stop pulling long enough to train the behavior that you want, so that he can be transitioned to a buckle collar.


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## puddles everywhere (May 13, 2016)

See if this gives you some new ideas. She has lots of videos on this subject, find one that works for you. Spending time with your dog is supposed to be fun for both of you. Hope it helps.


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## silver9 (Jul 11, 2017)

I'm waiting for his puppy training class to learn how to really hold the leash for a walk. Right now, it's just a way to keep him out of bad spots (the wood chips under the deck or the middle of the street) but he has no real attention to it. The only advice I am following is "act like a tree" when he starts going in an area he shouldn't but don't pull him (I accidentally pulled him though once or twice - suddenly ran into a squirrel carcass...but he didn't get mad). 

"Heel" is the furthest thing from his mind, and he's also WAY too distracted by scents to make it even 1 house down the sidewalk. At the breeder he never had a leash on...or collar. He scratches it all the time. I am trying to get him used to the feel of it for now. Next week, official training starts. He's 15 wks tho (when I got him) so he'll have the rabies shot at 16 wks and then I can go to the class (though all those puppies are younger and vets won't do rabies before 16 weeks... yet they require rabies shots... odd...anyway...). I could also use the youtube videos... I feel like my life has been all youtube / blogger training for the last week. I didn't bother too much with the leash yet since there's so much else to do & they can only handle so much. I am a little afraid I'm reinforcing bad leash behavior but it's only for a week and a half. 

Also, I've never gone more than 5 minutes without it getting all tangled up in his legs or underneath him. The collar is on tight enough (sort of - I can go tighter but am a little concerned to do that)... I am not sure why that is happening.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

At 15 weeks, with no prior leash training, he just simply doesn't know what you want him to do on leash. Make staying with you a game at this point, carry toys and treats to encourage him to walk along with you, or even make it a chase game. 

Please don't leave him alone like that again, a hosts of bad things could have happened, including someone taking him.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

How old is cedar now? As well as working on loose leash walking you can also teach him to carry something. Unfortunately impatience and frustration will travel down the leash. If he refuses to move you can try taking a deep breath and waiting him out - make sure you ignore him. Try not to pull him along. Teaching him to walk well on a leash takes time and won’t happen overnight, I know Sona had a relapse as a teenager.

Edited to add - try teaching ‘magic hand’
https://positively.com/contributors...ion-zero-pressure-control-with-1-simple-game/


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## silver9 (Jul 11, 2017)

mylissyk said:


> At 15 weeks, with no prior leash training, he just simply doesn't know what you want him to do on leash. Make staying with you a game at this point, carry toys and treats to encourage him to walk along with you, or even make it a chase game.



Once I have a treat, he's a magnet... a jumpy magnet. I have been able to teach him "off" and "sit" though - to get the treat. So, that's good. Though he doesn't always do it. (also "come" is sort of dependent on his mood). 

I should watch some more youtube training videos on leash walking but I hate them in a way because whatever dog they use is perfect in 10 seconds and nothing has ever gone like that.


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## CedarFurbaby (Jun 6, 2016)

Cedar is 18 months old. 

We're working on loose leash walking, and Cedar is not great but he's okay. If I worked with Cedar the whole way, command - treats - command - no treats - command - treats/feed him every few steps/ask him to heel, then sure he can focus on me. But that's probably not the point of a walk, and he likes sniffing stuff. 

You are right, I will just have to be more patient with him. But there are times where I will end up pulling him, such as when he is in the way of other people, or someone is pushing a cart towards us and I want him to stay away from that blind person etc.. These 'natural' situations just occur some times, so I hope he can learn to deal with that. I guess most of the time he is okay and learning to deal with it, just when he is overtired/overstimulated that he can't deal with it. In general I just let him sniff what he wants and stay as long as he wants to. I think I will just wait him out or tell him to come instead of pulling, as he clearly finds it stressful to some degree. 

Yes I have tried to get him to carry things, but his main interest is the sniffing, so he's not that motivated to carry things - he would do it if I asked though, but not for too long. 

This morning we went for a short walk - 15 minutes only. But he was clearly still out of it. We didn't use a halti, and instead used a front clip harness instead (we use both regularly). With the harness, there is no pulling him because he can resist much better. It was only 15 min, but he wanted to chew sticks all the way, didn't care for anything else. At first I asked him to leave it etc., and he does, but he was just in that state, so it was the next stick and the next stick. Finally we just did heels, sits, drops, stands to move some distance. I gave him a lot of praise, so he was happy about it. After a bit of 'working' he walked nicely, but soon relapsed into sticks. So we had another session of working. No pulling ahead at all, it was all loose leash, he just didn't want to move with me, so we went home as quick as I could make it. 






Wicky said:


> How old is cedar now? As well as working on loose leash walking you can also teach him to carry something. Unfortunately impatience and frustration will travel down the leash. If he refuses to move you can try taking a deep breath and waiting him out - make sure you ignore him. Try not to pull him along. Teaching him to walk well on a leash takes time and won’t happen overnight, I know Sona had a relapse as a teenager.
> 
> Edited to add - try teaching ‘magic hand’
> https://positively.com/contributors...ion-zero-pressure-control-with-1-simple-game/


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

silver9 said:


> Once I have a treat, he's a magnet... a jumpy magnet. I have been able to teach him "off" and "sit" though - to get the treat. So, that's good. Though he doesn't always do it. (also "come" is sort of dependent on his mood).
> 
> I should watch some more youtube training videos on leash walking but I hate them in a way because whatever dog they use is perfect in 10 seconds and nothing has ever gone like that.


Just keep in mind he is a baby. He is really young to be learning all this. He will learn, just be patient. Training classes will really help.


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## DevWind (Nov 7, 2016)

He is old enough to be working on these skills. It really kind of sounds like he’s in charge. If he was mine, I’d put him on a buckle collar and have someone work with me with a pinch collar. I wouldn’t pull but I would give him a pop. He needs to learn that you will not tolerate him biting you......ever. Definitely get him into a class.


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

There are two conversations going on here, if I'm reading this correctly. One is Cedar, who is 18 months old. The other is a 15 week old puppy. 
Cedar's walks sound to me like no fun at all - just training sessions and trying to get him to go where you want him to go. Give him 10 minutes to explore and sniff and get sticks, and then try settling into a "formal" walk. Max is always so excited to get to the park, his brain is just in "OH MY GOSH!" mode for a bit, so I've learned to let him get it out of his system. Also, how do you hold a halti so he can't open his mouth? That sounds not at all comfortable. 

The 15 week old puppy is a baby, so don't expect too much.


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## silver9 (Jul 11, 2017)

Yeah, sorry. I was reading a bunch of posts in the puppy forum & got a little mixed up when I saw this one.


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## CedarFurbaby (Jun 6, 2016)

Abeille said:


> He is old enough to be working on these skills. It really kind of sounds like he’s in charge. If he was mine, I’d put him on a buckle collar and have someone work with me with a pinch collar. I wouldn’t pull but I would give him a pop. He needs to learn that you will not tolerate him biting you......ever. Definitely get him into a class.




He is in a class. But that collar is not allowed.


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## Anele (Dec 12, 2014)

Huge, huge hugs to you, CedarFurbaby. I know you have done so much work with Cedar all along, and have been so thoughtful and careful in how you approach his challenges. It had to be very disappointing to "pay the price" for an instance of impatience when your patience level is normally very high. Don't blame yourself for being human!

I understand your question about aggression. There are always things dogs don't enjoy, and any dog can bite, but you want to know if his level of tolerance is lower than most dogs-- because, let's face it... sometimes dogs are pulled a little, and most of them don't escalate into biting as a result. I think the best course of action is to seek help from a vet behaviorist. This way you will have a professional assessment of his behavior as well as good plan. No one here, unfortunately, is qualified to answer your question without being able to actually observe him. One of the posters who struggled with jumpy/mouthy behavior found that her dog had anxiety. If I recall correctly, he was treated with medication, and she altered certain things about her lifestyle. While she was disappointed in things she couldn't participate in with her dog, she found other ways to bond with him, and they bring each other great joy. 

I think it speaks volumes to your training that he stayed in one spot. You've put enormous amounts of time into working with him and this was an instance where it paid off. 

IF (and this is only IF) you feel it is safe to do so, one thing you might want to try after he stops biting (or preferably before when you see "the look") is to give him a massage. Have him sit down and massage his shoulder blades in circles, and on his chest, too. I have found this technique to work in calming my dogs down. But again-- only try this if you feel safe. 

Please keep us updated.


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## CedarFurbaby (Jun 6, 2016)

Anele said:


> Huge, huge hugs to you, CedarFurbaby. I know you have done so much work with Cedar all along, and have been so thoughtful and careful in how you approach his challenges. It had to be very disappointing to "pay the price" for an instance of impatience when your patience level is normally very high. Don't blame yourself for being human!
> 
> I understand your question about aggression. There are always things dogs don't enjoy, and any dog can bite, but you want to know if his level of tolerance is lower than most dogs-- because, let's face it... sometimes dogs are pulled a little, and most of them don't escalate into biting as a result. I think the best course of action is to seek help from a vet behaviorist. This way you will have a professional assessment of his behavior as well as good plan. No one here, unfortunately, is qualified to answer your question without being able to actually observe him. One of the posters who struggled with jumpy/mouthy behavior found that her dog had anxiety. If I recall correctly, he was treated with medication, and she altered certain things about her lifestyle. While she was disappointed in things she couldn't participate in with her dog, she found other ways to bond with him, and they bring each other great joy.
> 
> ...


Thank you so much for the hugs...really needed them. 

I did have a chat with my vet about anxiety medication, and have to fill out a lengthy questionaire about behavior (which I have been putting off) so I think I will try some or at least have something on hand.

Yes I know what you mean about massage, I just tried giving Cedar these shoulder massages the last two days and he likes it a lot. Cedar isn't a cuddly dog, but at certain times he really wants cuddles, touching and massages. I think this is Cedar 'asking' (with a paw) for what he needs to calm down. I think you're right that once over the threshold, it is not a good idea anymore.


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