# More Skin Problems for Duke



## ggdenny (Nov 2, 2008)

Hi, I'm back again with another question about Duke's skin. This is an area that he has had on his chest since he came to us as a foster. His dermatologist thinks it's akin to acne or even an undetermined allergy. Food allergies haven't been ruled out, but the dermatologist feels it's unlikely. We shampoo the area with Ketochlor prescription shampoo 3 times a week and use a steroid spray, but it doesn't seem to make that much of difference. Now, I'm beginning to see a tiny bit of the pattern start on his lower stomach - the little tiny black spots.

I'm just wondering if anyone here has seen anything similar or can lend some advice?


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## Buddy's mom forever (Jun 23, 2011)

bumping up


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## Finn's Fan (Dec 22, 2007)

Has the dermatologist checked that it is/isn't a staph infection? Also, has Duke had his thyroid checked? Skin problems often go hand in hand with hypothyroidism in goldens.


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## ggdenny (Nov 2, 2008)

Finn's Fan said:


> Has the dermatologist checked that it is/isn't a staph infection? Also, has Duke had his thyroid checked? Skin problems often go hand in hand with hypothyroidism in goldens.


The derm has never mentioned staph or thyroid, but I'll email them in the morning. I sure want every possibility considered. Thanks for the ideas!


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## vrmueller (Jun 14, 2008)

I would also agree with having his thyroid checked. Poor boy! Do a search on low thyroid symptoms (skin issues) in dogs and show the vet. Keep us posted.


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## ggdenny (Nov 2, 2008)

I emailed Duke's dermatologist this morning with the picture and asked about the possibility of low thyroid. I'll let everyone know what he says.


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## ssacres (Sep 29, 2012)

My Bess had that and I had her tested for thyroid problems. Nothing showed up. I am a totally natural girl when I can be. Research tumeric for dogs. It has helped Bess. Her skin looks much better and she doesn't lick it anymore. It seems to be getting better. I just like the natural way out if I can do that for my girls.


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## Buddy's mom forever (Jun 23, 2011)

ssacres said:


> My Bess had that and I had her tested for thyroid problems. Nothing showed up. I am a totally natural girl when I can be. Research tumeric for dogs. It has helped Bess. Her skin looks much better and she doesn't lick it anymore. It seems to be getting better. I just like the natural way out if I can do that for my girls.


Would you mind sharing how did you use turmeric and what amount? Thanks.


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## ssacres (Sep 29, 2012)

*tumeric*

I buy it in capsules and order from Swansons vitamins. I give Bess one 720 mg capsule per day. I put the whole capsule in a spoonful of yogert. It also seemed to help Allie with her skin problems. She got two per day and at some point I may up Bessy to two pr day. I take it too.


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## ggdenny (Nov 2, 2008)

Well, Duke has now been to the veterinary medical teaching hospital twice for his skin issues. The first appointment was with his primary vet and she did a lot of scrapes and swabs - turns out some of what is going on is that Duke has a bacterial infection that he's now on Cephalexin for 3 weeks. His primary also prescribed another shampoo that she thinks will help with the area on his chest where it appears that he has hundreds of blackheads (see pic in my first post). The shampoo should help with promoting clear pores and healthier skin growth.

Yesterday Duke went for his appointment with derm. After lots of barking, playing and entertaining the staff they finally got Duke to settle down enough for an exam. He is so cute! Anyway, we're gonna try a 30-day food trial to either rule in or rule out food allergies as the culprit for his skin problems. He's been prescribed Royal Canin HP, which, my God, is very expensive ($65 for 17.6 pounds!). Duke may have to get a job  The real downside is that because we also have Connor both boys have to switch to the Royal Canin HP because the test must ensure that Duke doesn't get even a whiff or taste of other food. We even had to get prescription treats.

If the food trial is negative for food allergies we'll proceed with allergy testing and possible shots/pills. I'll keep everyone posted.


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## youarecool (Oct 4, 2012)

ggdenny said:


> Well, Duke has now been to the veterinary medical teaching hospital twice for his skin issues. The first appointment was with his primary vet and she did a lot of scrapes and swabs - turns out some of what is going on is that Duke has a bacterial infection that he's now on Cephalexin for 3 weeks. His primary also prescribed another shampoo that she thinks will help with the area on his chest where it appears that he has hundreds of blackheads (see pic in my first post). The shampoo should help with promoting clear pores and healthier skin growth.
> 
> Yesterday Duke went for his appointment with derm. After lots of barking, playing and entertaining the staff they finally got Duke to settle down enough for an exam. He is so cute! Anyway, we're gonna try a 30-day food trial to either rule in or rule out food allergies as the culprit for his skin problems. He's been prescribed Royal Canin HP, which, my God, is very expensive ($65 for 17.6 pounds!). Duke may have to get a job  The real downside is that because we also have Connor both boys have to switch to the Royal Canin HP because the test must ensure that Duke doesn't get even a whiff or taste of other food. We even had to get prescription treats.
> 
> If the food trial is negative for food allergies we'll proceed with allergy testing and possible shots/pills. I'll keep everyone posted.



oh no, you fell for their trick, didnt you? ive had MAJOR issues with my goldens skin problems, been to about 9 different vets around the area..every vet had a different solution, but about 7 out of the 9 vets wanted me to buy their RIDICULOUSLY priced royal canine diet. not to mention, go to Dog Food Analysis - Reviews of kibble and its really not that good... its only given 2 stars... i give my dog taste of the wild the fish kind. its a 6 star food, and has no beef, chicken, lamb, grain...all of which dogs are _mainly_ allergic to. and its 50 bucks for a 30 pound bag, not a 60 for a 18 pound bag.

i understand what the purpose of the royal canine HP is all about..but its first ingredient is grain. would you like to live on rice for your whole life? what if all your dog is allergic to is grain? or just chicken? wouldnt you rather try dog foods that WONT cost you 200+ a month and do your own elimination process? wouldnt that be crappy, to never know that the only problem is one ingredient and if you just tried yourself, you could have been saving money? and feeding your animal something other than grain? it is true though while you're doing trial/error, dont feed your dog ANYTHING except this diet. because one treat is going to affect the skin, and will stay in his system for weeks.

allergy testing is VERY expensive.. i got qouted about 700 dollars for the testing, and first month or two of shots...and wait, theres more glorious news: *only 60 percent or less of dogs have a positive reaction to allergy testing. and it takes atleast a year to see any improvement...if you're lucky enough to be part of the 60 percent.* and between that time, you're spending hundreds of dollars on shots. 


try to find a vet who cares about your dog, not money. after constant antibiotics, and trips back to the vet just to repeat the process... ive decided to give him a very low steroid dose once every other day, to keep his chronic allergies at bay. once his skin is in a fair condition, im going to test for a thyroid deficiency, because he shows signs of thyroid problems, which could cause his skin issues. i know steroids can have bad effects, but my vet told me that at such a low dose there shouldnt really be any. and with yearly blood work i can have a peace of mind. and i'd rather have my dog live a slightly shorter life and feel great, then be selfish and make him suffer in itchy and scratchy skin so i can have him for another year.

not trying to jump down your throat.. i guess im just venting thru my own personal frustrations with all these vets that didnt give me any real solutions until now. i make minimum wage, and had to spend 350 dollars each vet visit, every 3 months for a year..and not ONE vet told me about thyroid issues, or the idea that steroids could be beneficial and not threatening at _low _dosages


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## Buddy's mom forever (Jun 23, 2011)

Thanks for the update. I hope for the best outcome, what ever would be the solution of your boy's problem.


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## Wendy427 (Apr 4, 2009)

*Please include ACV in your remedy protocol!*

@ggdenny & youarecool: In addition to going grain-free for allergies, please, please read through this link. (btw, I've heard that even years of low-dose steroids can cause liver damage.):

Apple Cider Vinegar for Dogs

There are many, many posts about dogs' skin issues on earthclinic. Just read through them; I'm sure there are people who've experienced exactly what you both are experiencing, and are sharing their successful remedies.


*Very Important:* If you decide to get it, ONLY get the ORGANIC "Apple Cider Vinegar". This organic ACV contains the nutrient-rich sediment, which is called "the Mother". One of the better brands is *Braggs* sold at the Health Food store, e.g., Whole Foods, or the health food section of your local supermarket.

Here's one of this forum's links with info about how to treat hot spots and allergies, etc.:

(Itchy scratchy)http://www.goldenretrieverforum.com/...-scratchy.html (Itchy scratchy)

I thought I might add that my goldens (both Lacey and Renny) are on TOTW and I've regularly added ACV to their food. In the four years of having Lacey, she never had even one hotspot, rash, or allergy! I've only had Renny for a week now, but I'll be keeping him on the same protocol. He has thicker fur than Lacey had, and I still haven't seen any skin issues.


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## Hausberg_Kids (Aug 15, 2008)

We have had chronic skin and ear problems with our girl since we got her. We have tried different foods, different medicines, natural remedies, Great Dane lady yeast program, and now we are on a food trial. We had a complete thyroid panel done and sent to MSU, only one level came back slightly lower, but all was still with in normal range. They tried to push the Royal Canin and Science Diet but I refused. They said she had to be on a protein source that she had never had before. So, we are now on California Natural with kangaroo meat. We also were told that with a food trial, the minimum time on the food has to be 8 weeks to get a complete trial. No other treats, medicines nothing can be given for 8 weeks except the food and then water. Good Luck with your pup! We have been at this for over 5 years now and have still not figured out what is going on with her skin and ears


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## ggdenny (Nov 2, 2008)

youarecool said:


> oh no, you fell for their trick, didnt you? ive had MAJOR issues with my goldens skin problems, been to about 9 different vets around the area..every vet had a different solution, but about 7 out of the 9 vets wanted me to buy their RIDICULOUSLY priced royal canine diet. not to mention, go to Dog Food Analysis - Reviews of kibble and its really not that good... its only given 2 stars... i give my dog taste of the wild the fish kind. its a 6 star food, and has no beef, chicken, lamb, grain...all of which dogs are _mainly_ allergic to. and its 50 bucks for a 30 pound bag, not a 60 for a 18 pound bag.
> 
> i understand what the purpose of the royal canine HP is all about..but its first ingredient is grain. would you like to live on rice for your whole life? what if all your dog is allergic to is grain? or just chicken? wouldnt you rather try dog foods that WONT cost you 200+ a month and do your own elimination process? wouldnt that be crappy, to never know that the only problem is one ingredient and if you just tried yourself, you could have been saving money? and feeding your animal something other than grain? it is true though while you're doing trial/error, dont feed your dog ANYTHING except this diet. because one treat is going to affect the skin, and will stay in his system for weeks.
> 
> ...


I appreciate your input and totally understand your frustration. However, I feel quite comfortable with the approach recommended by my vets and I trust them completely. The vets at the University of Wisconsin Veterinary Medical Teaching Hospital (VMTH) have provided medical care for all of our golden retrievers for over 20 years and have never ever pushed expensive medical care on us. In fact, in every instance, including cancer care, they have always been sensitive to wanting to try more conservative, less expensive approaches initially. With respect to Duke's skin issues we've been at this for 2 years now and until this last appointment the derm vets have been taking a very conservative approach by using topical and oral steroids, antihistamines, prescription shampoos, and oral and topical antibiotics.

The bottom line is that my vets definitely care only about my dogs and not about money. The university can't compete with the private sector so pricing at the VMTH is very fair.

Moving to a food trial was really the next logical step and we feel it's the right direction to take. It's only for a month and if it yields answers to his skin problems, great. If not that's also great because it will indicate some type of environmental allergen. Perhaps it can be argued that another food choice would have been better and less expensive, but we are where we are and need to stick with it for the next month.

We also talked in depth with the derm vets and if things proceed to allergen testing the cost was quoted at being $250 for the skin and blood testing, and as much as $30 a month for the shots/drops. This is nowhere near the astronomical amounts I've seen posted here and on other forums.

My wife and me are very open to other treatments mentioned here, especially the apple cider vinegar. As things progress I will keep folks posted here.


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## youarecool (Oct 4, 2012)

well thats good. thats whats important; as long as you feel you are doing the right thing. atleast you have a long standing history with your vets. the vets i went to really made me feel like they were just wanting money, and not considering trying less expensive but helpful options. and that is crazy cheap for the allergy shots and testing...very lucky.


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