# puppy snapped? at my son. I am devastated :(



## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

How old is your son? Can he understand what teasing is? (My two yr old and four year old grandsons understand this. Sasha gets along with them fine)

It sounds like Oscar is being a dog and jumping at someone waving their hands etc. Sasha would do that too. I don't see it as aggression, it's being a mouthy teething puppy. 

I think it is your son who needs to learn how to be appropriate around a dog. You can just tell Oscar"No Bite!" and give him a teething toy.


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## RedDogs (Jan 30, 2010)

The HUGE question here, is "how old is your son." As he is not following directions AND as you weren't there for this incident (or not watching) you NEED to be supervising 100% puppy and kid interactions. If you are going to the bathroom. Take the puppy with you. IF you are making dinner, have puppy on leash in there with you or tied to the wall or gated in the room.

Good news? No one got hurt. That's also good because it lets us know your puppy was very polite in saying "stay away." Polite puppies are great.

Things to think about: The play time and sight of another dog may have been stress components of this...alone, none of those would likely have gotten him so worked up, but all of those AND your son AND his behavior created more than your puppy can handle. Avoid situations where your puppy is at the end of his leash and being worked up. Through training and re-directing him (see a dog coming? Pull out the best treats ever and feed little tiny crumbs, one at a time). 

I would NOT say the issue with the bone is over. You will need hundreds if not thousands of reps to maintain that work and I woudl not have your son participate for weeks/months depending on your puppy and his age. Even for dogs who do not resource guard, if they live with kids, we "approcah and give treats" a couple times a week for the life of the dog. Prevention is easier than dealing with problems. 

It all comes down to supervision. If you can be good about that, it can probably go well. But if not..... there's a lot to think about.


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## kerry (Oct 2, 2010)

It was definately a warning grumble  
I know that puppys play nippy etc but this was not the normal getting carried away playing sound, although i didn't actually see what happened and may be over reacting I want to be on the safe side and nip a problem in the bud if there is one.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

Great detailed advice Red Dogs!

I would also recommend a Puppy Manners obedience class right away for you and puppy. It works wonders and builds a great bond.


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## kerry (Oct 2, 2010)

RedDogs said:


> The HUGE question here, is "how old is your son." As he is not following directions AND as you weren't there for this incident (or not watching) you NEED to be supervising 100% puppy and kid interactions. If you are going to the bathroom. Take the puppy with you. IF you are making dinner, have puppy on leash in there with you or tied to the wall or gated in the room.
> 
> Good news? No one got hurt. That's also good because it lets us know your puppy was very polite in saying "stay away." Polite puppies are great.
> 
> ...


Thanks, my son is 7 years old. re the bone, we did intend to just keep on always giving a treat as a trade for the bone, but you don't think its a good idea for my son to do it?

With the correct supervision now, do you think we will end up with the happy, family dog we want Oscar to grow into? 
Should I be getting my son to feed him his meals, groom him etc?


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## Jamm (Mar 28, 2010)

Joey would do that when he was younger, i think it sounds totally normal, hes a puppy and was just trying to play with your son from what it sounds like.


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## RedDogs (Jan 30, 2010)

There is growling that is not play. And we DO need to address the cause. But YAY he growled and let us know. Now we can address the causes of his stress. No need to worry much. Otherwise, you might not have realize how much your son causes stress at times.

I would NOT have your son do trades until you and other adults have spent several weeks on the trades. Your puppy is already worried about your son and worried about bones, so we want to make sure he's had a LOT more practice with trades before your son takes a turn.

Feeding, etc: It depends on how well your son follows directions and how well you can supervise. There's no harm in doing things your puppy likes, IF your son will follow directions and IF they are both having a good time. Definitely think about getting in a basic training or puppy class. But I would co-enroll in a basic/puppy agility class and be SURE your son is going to that one. Kids tend to like it better and it's a great way to learn about how to be a good trainer and they're often more emotionally invested in the success compared to basic obedience alone, and this can lead to better results and a better kid-dog relationship.

We can't make guarantees about the results of the situation, not only because this is an online forum, but there are SO many variables in your home environment and we are dealing with animals. However, MANY puppies who behave similarlly DO go on to be happy and healthy adults. Does it happen all the time? No. The most common reasons in my experience: Adults do not supervise and puppy is picked on by the kids (intentionally or unintentionally), family neglects basic training and puppy socialization, family does not follow directions and puppy is stressed by various situations and interactions, lack of supervision and management.... and did I say supervision?


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

I am confused now Red dogs. It sounds to me like the adult needs to work on the obedience of the dog. Through an obedience class. Once the dog is well behaved and the child understands the rules, then the child (if old enough) could do an agility class with the dog.
Dogs get very excited/worked up during agility.. without obedience that could be asking for trouble especially with a child and a dog who has already growled.
A 14 week old puppy's growl is probably a play growl, not an aggressive one. That would be rare in a golden.


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## kerry (Oct 2, 2010)

Debles said:


> I am confused now Red dogs. It sounds to me like the adult needs to work on the obedience of the dog. Through an obedience class. Once the dog is well behaved and the child understands the rules, then the child (if old enough) could do an agility class with the dog.
> Dogs get very excited/worked up during agility.. without obedience that could be asking for trouble especially with a child and a dog who has already growled.
> A 14 week old puppy's growl is probably a play growl, not an aggressive one. That would be rare in a golden.


I wouldn't describe the noise he made as a growl as in the rumbling sound but more a quick ra ra ra bark/growl if that makes sense. Oscar seems to love Dillon at any other time and doesn't seem nervous around him. He jumps on his bed in the mornings to wake him up lay by his head and loves playng football and tug with him.


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## RedDogs (Jan 30, 2010)

A puppy can be enrolled in many classes at once, including a basic training class (and kids can/should attend...) and agility or tricks. Most puppy/foundation agility classes, in my experience, are fairly calm... if you end up in one that's wild...find another. The more calm and focused the dog's are, the better they will work. This does NOT mean they can't run fast!

In situations like this, I recommend basic training for home manners and communication between humans and dogs, but the agility is to help with the child-dog bond and relationship. 

I do a lot with kids. In households where kids are roughhousing with dogs, not following 'rules' well, etc... agility or a tricks classes really help turn around the situation. The kids often very much want the dog to do well with those activiites and more readily apply/learn 'good training practices'. They'll start to be more involved in the basic training, because it relates to the agility training. They'll stop the inappropriate roughousing, beucase it's not conductive to their goals. They spend time setting up appropriate and silly obstacles in the backyard and playing with the puppy in ways that are not roughhhouseing, not teasing, not disrupting other training. They're more emotionally invested in the success of the dog/puppy. Does that make a bit more sense? 

And at home...kids definitely should and can be involved. However, with higher stress situations, like the trades, where we know the puppy has previously had a problem, an adult should be working on that for several weeks so that we have a VERY strong history of reinforcement before the child is involved in that piece.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

kerry said:


> I wouldn't describe the noise he made as a growl as in the rumbling sound but more a quick ra ra ra bark/growl if that makes sense. Oscar seems to love Dillon at any other time and doesn't seem nervous around him. He jumps on his bed in the mornings to wake him up lay by his head and loves playng football and tug with him.


Thanks Kerry. That is what I assumed. It sounds like he was playing in that puppy way. Puppies don't know what is appropriate until we teach them. Same with kids. : )

I think if you do some obedience and teach your son the rules and follow through with both son and dog, all will be well and they will be best buds! You'll forget you worried about this!


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## kerry (Oct 2, 2010)

Thankyou all very much  Red Dogs i am going to look into both classes straight away and I make sure that Oscar and Dillon are always supervised when together.

Debles, I really hope with all my heart that it was playful. We are all going to sit down this evening and write out the rules and they are going to be put up on the living room wall. 
Any suggested rules? Mybe I will run the rules past you guys first if thats ok.


He is a really lovely pup and I so want to get it right for him. I am prepared to put as much work in as necessary.

I will stick to my hubby and I trading for the high value goods for a few weeks as suggested. 
Should we be trading for toys as well eg. reward for 'drop', he is always happy to give them up but is it wrong that we take them even when playing, we always rewardwith voice


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## iansgran (May 29, 2010)

My grandson who lives with us is 8. He goes to obedience classes with us most of the time, even decided he wants to be a dog trainer. But he is never alone with Jaro, 7 months, and Ian does not take things away from Jaro. When playing fetch he will offer him a treat IF he drops the ball, but he is not allowed to take it away. Little boys this age are very excited and full of energy and don't always think about how their moves can agitate the dog. It is as much about training your son as your dog. I learned early that dog training is more about me than my dog. But I absolutely know how you feel, and how you are worried. However, I do not think you need to be. Just follow the things RedDogs said and you should be fine.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

Reddogs gives good advice. But from what you describe, your son was teasing Oscar, and Oscar responded appropriately, in dog speak. 

Good management, and training, of both the puppy and your son will result in the happy, family dog you want Oscar to grow into.


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## Griffyn'sMom (Mar 22, 2007)

A puppy can get overstimulated and just plain wild. They also can get cranky just as a child can from being tired. (Think of the reaction a 2 year old gives when they are taken away from the playground.  ) Puppies will do this between 3-4 months of age. They are still learning the ropes.

Practice NILIF and get your son in on the training. They will grow to respect each other - you'll see!


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