# English Golden Breeders in NC



## ethel (Jan 31, 2008)

I am looking for an English Golden breeder in NC. We have had 3 "backyard" Goldens. Two have had cancer. Fred @ 6 yo with Spinal cord tumor and Ethel @11yo with Osteosarcoma and Hemagiosarcoma. I have been impressed with the controlled breeding of the Enlish Golden. Any advise out there?


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

Good luck in your search for a dog. Just be careful not to over-pay for an "English Cream".


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

yikes, sorry to hear about your past golden's health problems!  i would recommend looking on the breeder referral list for the golden retriever club in your area to start wtih. but there are a ton of breeders and people in your area i would imagine who could point you in the right direction as far as breeders go.


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

oh yes, like Vern said, its easy to fall in the "designer" golden trap and pay an exhorbatant amount of money for one. i would not recommend doing that, and honestly, any breeder who charges more than $2000 in some cases for a "rare english white golden" is probably less than reputable.


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

Actually, since English Goldens have been so popularized, you need to be very careful when looking at breeders. Many less than reputable breeders are jumping in to make money with "rare English cremes" or other such nonsense. 

I know that Rob (Conqueror Goldens) is on the Forum and has English lines, so hopefully he can chime in.

This website may be a good place to start

http://www.englishgoldens.net/home.htm

Oops-I see that this is no longer functional-too bad.


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## Chaucer and Mom (Feb 26, 2007)

http://www.tanglewoodgoldens.com/

Joanne Cava has an excellent reputation. 

BTW... I know from exerience that not every breeder on the English Golden website is reputable.


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## heather R (Feb 23, 2008)

The website www.englishgoldens.net is still operating; I just clicked on it. It lists breeders in U.S and Canada. I also went to goldens having more english in them after hearing that the lifespan of Amer. goldens had dropped to 10 yrs. Our first golden lived to 13 1/2; the 2nd to 12 1/2.

I also checked with local golden retriever club for names of well regarded breeders; them checked their dogs backgrounds on K9 data. org as well as OFA base.

It took a while but our almost 2 yr. old is a delight

heather R


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## TheHooch (May 9, 2007)

Welcome to the forum Heather.


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## heather R (Feb 23, 2008)

Thanks for welcome! I'll try to post pic of Kelsi but seem to be having trouble with my mail system.

heather R


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## SerineKat (Feb 21, 2008)

I got my golden while living in the UK. I found the breeder through petfinder forums. Just start looking around on the internet. You'll find one. A couple more good things about English breeds is that they tend to be smaller (mine is 70 lbs, female at 1.5 years) and they are also more chilled out.

FYI - the English Creams are NOT as rare in the UK as they are here and I've heard that you can't show the creams... that the color isn't formally recognized.


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## maiapup (Nov 22, 2007)

I'm not sure about the smaller bit. My girls are the following, 10 year old, 65 lbs., 8 year old 62 lbs. and 3 year old 59 lbs. These dogs are from pretty well known American lines.

I think that some of the comments made may be the experience that particular person with one or a few dogs because there is no factual information to support some of the comments I've heard but I caution people about making general assumptions. Golden retrievers..whether from the UK, Australia, America, S. America have the same health/temperament problems. One country is not immune, they all originated from the same dogs from the UK to create the Golden Retriever.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

SerineKat said:


> I got my golden while living in the UK. I found the breeder through petfinder forums. Just start looking around on the internet. You'll find one. A couple more good things about English breeds is that they tend to be smaller (mine is 70 lbs, female at 1.5 years) and they are also more chilled out.
> 
> FYI - the English Creams are NOT as rare in the UK as they are here and I've heard that you can't show the creams... that the color isn't formally recognized.


 
A 70 female at 18 months would be considered on the large side here in the US. You'd be hard pressed to find a bitch in the show ring over about 65 pounds. 

Ethel - I am curious as to what you mean when you say that you are impressed with the "controlled breeding" of the UK dogs?


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## ethel (Jan 31, 2008)

By "controlled breeding" I mean that efforts are made to refrain from in-breeding and checking/clearing medical history. I know there are no guarantees.
We lost our gal this morning from the dreaded hemangiosarcomas. I cannot express the severe agony I feel. She tried her best to PLEASE us until the end. I will forever cherish the 11 years I had with her.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

ethel said:


> By "controlled breeding" I mean that efforts are made to refrain from in-breeding and checking/clearing medical history. I know there are no guarantees.
> We lost our gal this morning from the dreaded hemangiosarcomas. I cannot express the severe agony I feel. She tried her best to PLEASE us until the end. I will forever cherish the 11 years I had with her.


 
I am so sorry for your loss. 11 years is too young.

Reputable and responsible breeders here in the US _do_ all clearances, and consider the vertical pedigree as well. In-breeding is rare. Careful linebreeding IS done to strengthen and set a strong history of good genetic clearances. I am concerned to think that those marketing "English Goldens" would be misleading people to think otherwise. I can name any number of breeders using European bloodlines who actually do NOT do all clearances. It's an unfounded blanket statement to make, truly. I have pure American bloodlines, and stick to them, and enjoy excellent health and longevity - 14 to 16 years being normal for me.


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## chesneygirl007 (Nov 5, 2007)

I am going thru tanglewood goldens. The website is tanglewoodgoldens.com. They actually just did a breeding that I am on the reservation list for the 3rd male. The breeder has no more reservations left on the litter I am on but she does have reservations for male on the other litter she is breeding later this year. They just did the breeding about a 2 weeks ago now just waiting to hear if the dog is pregnant. How long does it take to find out if shes pregnant??? Ugggg the wait is killing me!!!!

Kim
Nj


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

chesneygirl007 said:


> I am going thru tanglewood goldens. The website is tanglewoodgoldens.com. They actually just did a breeding that I am on the reservation list for the 3rd male. The breeder has no more reservations left on the litter I am on but she does have reservations for male on the other litter she is breeding later this year. They just did the breeding about a 2 weeks ago now just waiting to hear if the dog is pregnant. How long does it take to find out if shes pregnant??? Ugggg the wait is killing me!!!!
> 
> Kim
> Nj


 
28 days from the first breeding.


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## chesneygirl007 (Nov 5, 2007)

So they actually dont know for almost a month if the dog is pregnant? I figured they would know in like 2 weeks after the dog is bred you know like a human. The dog was bred the weekend of feb 23 so i guess i wont be hearing anything til the end of the month. Wow gonna be a long month!!!

Kim


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## marie22 (Jan 26, 2008)

I just got a puppy in NC and the father came from this breeder:
http://www.seasonsgold.com/Puppies.html

I know they do all of the health clearances and have puppies right now. I had a long talk with the breeder I got my puppy from and he was really concerned with the cancer problem and said he was very careful in choosing the dogs he bred not to be susceptable (as much as that might be possible). 

They aren't the cream color, don't know about the English lines but I thought you might be interested anyway.

Good luck!

Marie


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## alsublett (Jan 9, 2008)

*Two pups*

I have a 9month old furry boy and a 3 month old furry girl. They are perfect in every way. I also have a 10 year old son, 8 year old daughter, and a 2 two year old son who adore them.

Both of my furries are British creme. They are my heart. They play hard with me and my Husband, but are gentle and precious with my kids. 

I got both of them from Golden Creek Kennels in Raleigh NC. You can check out their website www.goldencreekkennels.com and find out more. There is a good video on the site. I have been to the kennels almost once a week for the last year... I now volunteer there after having such a great experience. Although a year ago I had never heard of them, I now consider the owner a good friend of mine.

There is an Open House there this Sunday where you could meet all of the "moms" and "dads". Some will be in kennels for viewing (the boys, three moms w/ pups, and some boarders) and all of the girls will be in the field or in the pond. It is a lot of fun... so much so that I always go and bring my two goldens to play as well!


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## maiapup (Nov 22, 2007)

I'm curious what a volunteer would do at a breeding facility such as this? Do they have hired staff? I'm perplexed why someone would need 'volunteers' ?


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## maiapup (Nov 22, 2007)

Wow...they sure have a lot of females!!


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## chesneygirl007 (Nov 5, 2007)

I was suppose to buy a puppy from a litter there but I pulled out. I didnt get a good vibe and she couldnt supply me with the paperwork I wanted to see until I picked up the dog. I think she is more like a hobby breeder she has way too many females and male being bred at the same time. A good breeder only has 1 or 2 selective breedings a year. I had asked the owner alot of question before pulling out and I was very uncomfortable with what she said. I am not paying I think it was $1500 for a dog that I didnt feel comfortable with the breeding. I also noticed the other day I think it was under puppies that the male that was going to be the father of my puppy that I pulled out from had fatherered 3 different litters that were very close to when they were born. Also this breeder is not AKC registered. When I asked her about it she said she hadnt been for "personal reasons". I am sure the puppies are fine but I want a better guarantee and yes she does give a very good guarantee on the puppies but something dont sit right with all those dogs getting bred at the same time. The breeder I am going thru owns the female but not the male and from what I have been reading that is the sign of a good breeder.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

chesneygirl007 said:


> I was suppose to buy a puppy from a litter there but I pulled out. I didnt get a good vibe and she couldnt supply me with the paperwork I wanted to see until I picked up the dog. I think she is more like a hobby breeder she has way too many females and male being bred at the same time. A good breeder only has 1 or 2 selective breedings a year. I had asked the owner alot of question before pulling out and I was very uncomfortable with what she said. I am not paying I think it was $1500 for a dog that I didnt feel comfortable with the breeding. I also noticed the other day I think it was under puppies that the male that was going to be the father of my puppy that I pulled out from had fatherered 3 different litters that were very close to when they were born. Also this breeder is not AKC registered. When I asked her about it she said she hadnt been for "personal reasons". I am sure the puppies are fine but I want a better guarantee and yes she does give a very good guarantee on the puppies but something dont sit right with all those dogs getting bred at the same time. The breeder I am going thru owns the female but not the male and from what I have been reading that is the sign of a good breeder.


 
Her "personal reasons" are because she was suspended by the AKC:"

"The AKC’s Management Disciplinary Committee has suspended Susan Harb (Raleigh, NC) from all AKC privileges for a period of two (2) years, effective June 7, 1999 and imposed a $300 fine for having submitted, or caused to be submitted, three litter registration applications for puppies from three Golden Retriever litters, which she knew, or should have known, did not contain the personal signature of her co-owner. (Golden Retriever)"

This is not a hobby breeder. This is a High Volume Breeder. I just cannot imagine that they have others "fostering" their dogs, essentially using those families to raise them, train them, provide their care, and then take them back just for breeding purposes (and their dogs are bred a LOT - I love the statement "Colt will sire a number of litters this year"...) and making a lot of money off them. Nice racket if you can stomach it. 

I really have a hard time with places like Golden Creek. They sure know marketing, though...


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

I see the term "hobby breeder" used a lot. I have always used this definition from the GRCA booklet on Acquiring a Golden Retriever:

http://www.grca.org/acquiring.htm#hobby

PG, Arcane, Ambertru, Ambika and myself are some of those on this board who are what I consider to be "hobby breeders." We do not breed for money but for love of the breed. We prove our dogs in some area of dog sport-this enables us to constantly assess our dogs against the standard and against other dogs as well. All clearances are done and litters are carefully planned, with a definite purpose in mind. Almost always when we breed, we breed to keep a puppy with the purpose of advancing our breeding program. We do not always breed our bitches to our dogs-we want to breed to the best possible male for our bitch, and that male may be across the country. We belong to at least one, often more, dog organization such as the GRCA or local kennel clubs.

Breeders such as the one in North Carolina being discussed are what I consider to be high volume, for profit breeders. Nothing inherently wrong with this at all, and very nice puppies can come from these HVBs, as long as clearances are being done, and full disclosure is made when nececessary to puppy buyers, and dogs and puppies are healthy and well-socialised. I still believe that AKC and UKC are the preferred registries for the US and also feel that those not using them as a registry usually have issues with their record keeping or DNA requirements. There are good HVB's and bad ones (as we have experienced on this forum). There are some who straddle the lines of hobby breeder and HVB.

Then there are pin money breeders, usually scaled down versions of a high volume breeder but with much fewer dogs. Again, nothing wrong here, as long as clearances are done, etc., as stated above.

Puppy mills to me are those high volume breeders who do not really care about the dogs or a breeding program. They don't do clearances, don't really plan breedings, and dogs and puppies are frequently in poor health and live in deplorable conditions. They don't really care where their puppies end up, as their motive is money.

BYB's can vary widely from those who love their dogs, do some clearances (they are rarely aware of all necessary clearances) and try to be careful in placing their puppies, to those who view their dogs and the resulting puppies as commodities, want their money for the puppy and then that's it.

Sorry for the hi-jack but it has been bothering me


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

Tahnee GR said:


> I see the term "hobby breeder" used a lot. I have always used this definition from the GRCA booklet on Acquiring a Golden Retriever:
> 
> http://www.grca.org/acquiring.htm#hobby
> 
> ...


This sounds like a very fair and realistic assessment.....


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## paula bedard (Feb 5, 2008)

I feel like I'm taking a internet course on the "Proper Breeding, Care, and Placement of your New Golden Retriever Puppy"


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## lgnutah (Feb 26, 2007)

marie22 said:


> I just got a puppy in NC and the father came from this breeder:
> http://www.seasonsgold.com/Puppies.html
> 
> 
> ...


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

lgnutah said:


> marie22 said:
> 
> 
> > I just got a puppy in NC and the father came from this breeder:
> ...


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## lgnutah (Feb 26, 2007)

Thanks for your input. 
That's why I love this site. 
I looked at the site and couldn't come up with any questions/problems--I don't know enough to be able to analyze the site.


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## chesneygirl007 (Nov 5, 2007)

Thats why after I put the deposit on the dog I came on here and learned alot of questions to ask and when she couldnt supply me with the correct answers or at least the paperwork to back it up I pulled my deposit. I would of had a puppy already I was due to pick it up on feb 2 but I pulled it. Now I am on a reservation list with tanglewood goldens in NC and I am waiting to find out if the dog is pregnant now. She bred them about 2 weeks ago. 

I am glad I came on here I learned alot about what to look for in a dog breeder.

Kim
NJ


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## chesneygirl007 (Nov 5, 2007)

Pointgold said:


> Her "personal reasons" are because she was suspended by the AKC:"
> 
> "The AKC’s Management Disciplinary Committee has suspended Susan Harb (Raleigh, NC) from all AKC privileges for a period of two (2) years, effective June 7, 1999 and imposed a $300 fine for having submitted, or caused to be submitted, three litter registration applications for puppies from three Golden Retriever litters, which she knew, or should have known, did not contain the personal signature of her co-owner. (Golden Retriever)"
> 
> ...


 
How did you find out her personal reasons? When I asked her she wouldn'st supply them and wouldnt supply any paperwork that I asked for thats why I pulled my deposit and went with Tanglewood Goldens instead.

Kim


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## arcane (Sep 18, 2007)

Tahnee GR said:


> I see the term "hobby breeder" used a lot. I have always used this definition from the GRCA booklet on Acquiring a Golden Retriever:
> 
> http://www.grca.org/acquiring.htm#hobby
> 
> ...


well written post Linda  I agree 100%


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

chesneygirl007 said:


> How did you find out her personal reasons? When I asked her she wouldn'st supply them and wouldnt supply any paperwork that I asked for thats why I pulled my deposit and went with Tanglewood Goldens instead.
> 
> Kim


 
I went to the AKC site and typed in her name. It is a matter of public record, as the AKC publishes all disciplinary actions.


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

Tahnee GR said:


> lgnutah said:
> 
> 
> > To be honest, if you look back in several of her pedigrees, you will see my old guy Scout listed. He was the sire of a dog sold to someone who used that dog at stud, etc. I am still not entirely sure how I feel about having my dogs back there.
> ...


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

cubbysan said:


> Tahnee GR said:
> 
> 
> > Can somebody explain what an International show or Champion is? I always thought it would be the next step after American or Canadian Championship.
> ...


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## telsmith1 (Sep 11, 2006)

Tahnee GR said:


> I see the term "hobby breeder" used a lot. I have always used this definition from the GRCA booklet on Acquiring a Golden Retriever:
> 
> http://www.grca.org/acquiring.htm#hobby
> 
> ...


So, I take it, that to this board, I am considered a BYB?


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## DelmarvaGold (Mar 7, 2006)

telsmith1 said:


> So, I take it, that to this board, I am considered a BYB?


Maybe she just missed your name as you do not post often. I wasn't listed but I take no offense.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

telsmith1 said:


> So, I take it, that to this board, I am considered a BYB?


I saw two dogs breeding out in my backyard a few weeks ago.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

BTW... I guess I'm OK because Jesse's Mom was bred in someone else's back yard.


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## DelmarvaGold (Mar 7, 2006)

vrocco1 said:


> I saw two dogs breeding out in my backyard a few weeks ago.


Now you KNOW Jesse does NOT like an audience :uhoh:


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## Carsonsdaddy (Nov 1, 2006)

DelmarvaGold said:


> Now you KNOW Jesse does NOT like an audience :uhoh:


Uh oh..... Vern, do you need the couch again???


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

Carsonsdaddy said:


> Uh oh..... Vern, do you need the couch again???


I promise I'll only stay a month or two.


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## Carsonsdaddy (Nov 1, 2006)

vrocco1 said:


> I promise I'll only stay a month or two.


As long as I have steak, lobster and beer right?


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

Oh yeah! The good beer of course.


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## alsublett (Jan 9, 2008)

She does not "need" volunteers. I go by and play basically. I have become friends with the owner, so I have lunch with her and then we go play by the pond with them. I am also there if she goes out of town to stay with them. The staff still comes, but I would be there all night. I go because I love it and can't get enough... also my son is "on staff" as the official pooper scooper!

I am sorry to see all of the bad press that is being given to Golden Creek. I have only been involved with them for a year now, but I have several friends who have been with them for much longer. Having been present for a couple of births, I can say that these pups are loved and adored from the second they come into this world. These dogs are handled, loved, in the house, babied and adored. I have never seen anything like it. So, regardless of what you have heard or read - I love it, my dogs are perfect, and I will continue to recommend them with out any reservations.


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## alsublett (Jan 9, 2008)

Pointgold said:


> I went to the AKC site and typed in her name. It is a matter of public record, as the AKC publishes all disciplinary actions.


 
I went to the AKC site. Here is what is written:

The AKC’s Management Disciplinary Committee has suspended Susan Harb (Raleigh, NC) from all AKC privileges for a period of two (2) years, effective June 7, 1999 and imposed a $300 fine for having submitted, or caused to be submitted, three litter registration applications for puppies from three Golden Retriever litters, which she knew, or should have known, did not contain the personal signature of her co-owner. (Golden Retriever)

I will admit I have no idea what this mess means... It looks like there was not a signature on a form... is this really a huge deal that is worthy of so much bad press?

None the less - again, I say, my dogs are great. My vet says that I got the "BMW's" of the breed. He tells everyone about my breeder and has had many people call me for a reference. After a year of talking about it, he finally came to Golden Creek's Open House this past Sunday. Even though he has three dogs of his own, he is now wanting to add a fourth after meeting the pups there.


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

hmmm...I can see you have had nothing but good experiences with the breeder in question...BUT a kennel that owns THIRTY females...(36 dogs in all according to their website) is just mind blowing to me...that is a huge scale operation and I would personally never but a puppy from a place like that. This is my personal requirements in a breeder but I would want somebody that has no more than 1 or 2 well planned litters a year, and breeds to produce a puppy with the plan of keeping a pup to continue their lines...if they aren't breeding to keep a puppy to continue their breeding programme then they must be breeding for money IMO. I would want a breeder to have an obvious concern in keeping the dogs they breed to the breed standard and have an interest in working their dogs aswell. 

I would be interested to know how many litters those 30 bitches produce a year.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

alsublett said:


> I went to the AKC site. Here is what is written:
> 
> The AKC’s Management Disciplinary Committee has suspended Susan Harb (Raleigh, NC) from all AKC privileges for a period of two (2) years, effective June 7, 1999 and imposed a $300 fine for having submitted, or caused to be submitted, three litter registration applications for puppies from three Golden Retriever litters, which she knew, or should have known, did not contain the personal signature of her co-owner. (Golden Retriever)
> 
> ...


It means that she forged the signature of the co-owner. It means that no matter the intent, she knowingly disregarded the rules. 

If that is not a big deal to you, how about the fact that if you look at the OFA & CERF databases and see that, considering the very high number of dogs she has (or, has others keeping for her until time to breed them...) there are relatively few clearances, and they are spotty at best.

To me, the "BMW" of the breed would be carefully bred litters, with a complete ancestral history of solid health clearances, titled dogs, anda breeder who has not been suspended from the AKC, nor has a "staff" and "volunteers' caring for her dogs which are her income.


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## maiapup (Nov 22, 2007)

I agree with PG on this and further, this kennel/facility whatever was not forthcoming with the other member when she contacted her, so if this facility operator felt she didn't do anything wrong, why wasn't she just honest with the member when she asked about clearances, AKC, etc. 

Oftentimes actions speak louder than words. : ) To me, it speaks volumes just looking at the website. Which is why it's important not to rely on spiffy, fancy websites as a sign of goodness and peace in the world. :smooch:

Besides the staff, volunteers, friends taking care of the large amount of puppies.... why do you need an open house for a kennel/breeding operation, it sounds more like a department store. lol


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## arcane (Sep 18, 2007)

maiapup said:


> friends taking care of the large amount of puppies.... why do you need an open house for a kennel/breeding operation, it sounds more like a department store. lol


not defending anyone in particular here but I have puppy families back all the time to play with/socalize/visit with our litters. Its something i enjoy doing. Keeping in touch and people love the puppy fix's! I also have a puppy OPEN house for every litter born here. Adoptive families get to meet and play with puppies at 5 wks, it offers people a chance to see them, get ideas about personalities,preferences and just plain ease the wait time a bit  it is much better in the summer months where the pups can run and really stretch their legs......yippeee for spring/summer litters!


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## rradovitch (Mar 15, 2008)

Golden Creek Kennels is a great breeding facility. Although I have heard of some bad "experiences to be", I personally have one of their dogs and she is truly a great dog. She has the best temperament of any golden I have ever seen. My mother is a veterinarian and I have been around dogs all my life. When I purchased Zoe, I was provided with clearances on both parents. Another concern people here have had is that she has too many dogs. I'm not sure what this matters. The bitches she has are not over breed. All dogs get a great deal of attention and their facility is super-clean and large, very well maintained. If anything, having more bitches means she has more experience, as long as her dogs are not being over breed. People also seem to have a problem with their fostering program. If the foster parents are aware of the situation and enjoy the companionship, then what is the problem. This is just my opinion on this situation and I thought I needed to share my experience. I'm sure I will be flamed for this.


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

its not even so much that her having a ton of puppies worries us that she "overbreeds her bitches" (although that is a valid concern).. its that to honestly give proper care and attention and socialization to a litter would be pretty hard with SEVERAL litters at once.


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## rradovitch (Mar 15, 2008)

I agree that giving multiple litters attention would be "hard" but with help, it is definitely possible. Although this is a challenge, this is her only job, unlike other breeders who may go to work and breed dogs.


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

I am sorry if you consider peolple who are trying to help you understand why there is a problem with this kennel as a "flame". All you need to do is look at the "Available Puppies/Dogs" age and see Mary Rose whelped a litter in February 2008 and then see she herself was born on 12/04/06. This means this dog was barely one year old when bred. I am sorry but by anyone who knows anything about responsible breeding practices this in just wrong. Your dog may very well be the best dog you have ever seen, I think you need to consider yourself lucky.


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## maiapup (Nov 22, 2007)

And to me, the use of the word 'facility' says it all. This may be her only 'job' but I personally would never purchase a Golden from someone who has a 'facility' like that. Fosters, volunteers, open houses for the public, it is just a business if you ask me and not necessarily someone doing something to better the breed, the fact that there is breeding of very young dogs speaks volumes.

Despite those attempting to defend this person as having a great dog, it still doesn't address the fact that she was not honest to the other lister who asked good valid questions, regarding AKC, Clearances, etc. Why the dishonesty?? 

I do hope others that thought about going there would at least have some cause for concern by the conversations around this and can take away valuable information when they are searching for a puppy from someone who cares about the breed and is just not in it for the $$$$.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

rradovitch said:


> Golden Creek Kennels is a great breeding facility. Although I have heard of some bad "experiences to be", I personally have one of their dogs and she is truly a great dog. She has the best temperament of any golden I have ever seen. My mother is a veterinarian and I have been around dogs all my life. When I purchased Zoe, I was provided with clearances on both parents. Another concern people here have had is that she has too many dogs. I'm not sure what this matters. The bitches she has are not over breed. All dogs get a great deal of attention and their facility is super-clean and large, very well maintained. If anything, having more bitches means she has more experience, as long as her dogs are not being over breed. People also seem to have a problem with their fostering program. If the foster parents are aware of the situation and enjoy the companionship, then what is the problem. This is just my opinion on this situation and I thought I needed to share my experience. I'm sure I will be flamed for this.


 
No one will flame you, you are not the one operating this "breeding facility."
May I ask what clearances you were provided with? 
Can you see the concern that all this woman wants from her dogs are more puppies which equal more litters? That she has other people rearing and caring for her dogs and all she wants is their reporductive capacity?
Why would she not be forthcoming with the information which potential puppy buyers requested? An AKC suspension is not an insignificant problem for a breeder. The concerns raised and the negative comments from others in this thread are valid. It is nice that you have a sweet dog. There are lots of sweet dogs raised properly and without the concerns that this particular manufacturer brings up.


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## rradovitch (Mar 15, 2008)

Call it a facility, call it what you'd like. This woman delivers the puppies in the living room of her home. Open houses are a great way for people to see her "facility." She obviously has nothing to hide as the public is welcome to come into her home, see her layout, meet her dogs/puppies and interview her. I can not speak for Susan and I am not sure why she held back information from a possible buyer. As far as what happened with the AKC no one really knows what happened, this was 9 years ago and if she did make a mistake I'm sure she learned from it.

As far as it being a "job", she may be in it for the money but that does not mean she does not have quality dogs that she cares for properly. Both parents had clearances for both elbows and hips.

I am happy that people are voicing their concern about this breeder, but I do feel they need to hear positive experiences as well. Lay it all out there and let them make their own decision based on the information they gather.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

rradovitch said:


> Call it a facility, call it what you'd like. This woman delivers the puppies in the living room of her home. Open houses are a great way for people to see her "facility." She obviously has nothing to hide as the public is welcome to come into her home, see her layout, meet her dogs/puppies and interview her. I can not speak for Susan and I am not sure why she held back information from a possible buyer. As far as what happened with the AKC no one really knows what happened, this was 9 years ago and if she did make a mistake I'm sure she learned from it.
> 
> As far as it being a "job", she may be in it for the money but that does not mean she does not have quality dogs that she cares for properly. Both parents had clearances for both elbows and hips.
> 
> I am happy that people are voicing their concern about this breeder, but I do feel they need to hear positive experiences as well. Lay it all out there and let them make their own decision based on the information they gather.


 
And in order to make their own decision based on information they gather, they should check the OFA data base and see that there are a total of 11 of her dogs in the OFA database, with spotty clearances. Given that there are 36 dogs featured on her website alone, this indicates a real lack of clearances. 
Also, check the AKC.
And check the CERF database.


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## kennya (May 15, 2008)

*New Member*

I also have a male Golden from Golden Creek Kennells. He is four years old. He has had many medical problems. One of which id definitely congenital. I am currently getting all my facts together with my vet so I can report this correctly but when I found this website and forum I thought it would be the responsible thing to do to atleast let people know that overbreeding can cause the passing on of congenital diseases. I never considered this when I did the research for my dog. I was too taken in by the website, the description of family dogs. etc. I did not do my research. I have been in touch with the owner Susan Harb . Please Please be careful before you purchase a dog from her.


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## Debra (May 8, 2008)

This is a great place for information, I am learning so much! I do wish I learned all this 5 months ago before I got my baby from a so-so breeder!:doh:


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## AmyinAr (Feb 26, 2008)

maiapup said:


> And to me, the use of the word 'facility' says it all. This may be her only 'job' but I personally would never purchase a Golden from someone who has a 'facility' like that. Fosters, volunteers, open houses for the public, it is just a business if you ask me and not necessarily someone doing something to better the breed, the fact that there is breeding of very young dogs speaks volumes.
> 
> Despite those attempting to defend this person as having a great dog, it still doesn't address the fact that she was not honest to the other lister who asked good valid questions, regarding AKC, Clearances, etc. Why the dishonesty??
> 
> I do hope others that thought about going there would at least have some cause for concern by the conversations around this and can take away valuable information when they are searching for a puppy from someone who cares about the breed and is just not in it for the $$$$.



excellent post! and honestly, seeing the 2 year suspension as 'not a big deal' saddens me. If this is her life, she knows the rules and therefore knowingly broke them.
In the horse world (the show world I am familiar with) suspensions generally happen after several incidents were reported and several slaps on the wrist. I don't know that it's the same with dogs, but that alone would make me wary ...
I am glad everyone who has great dogs from her does, but it is only fair to question the dealings of someone with that many dogs.


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## kennya (May 15, 2008)

Radovitch,
this is Kennya and I recieved your private message apparently I cannot send you one back as I do not have enough posts yet.
Kennya
I truly wish I could give you this info, your pups name Zoe sounds so familiar
I would rather respond in a private message (I'm not sure why).


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## rradovitch (Mar 15, 2008)

Kennya- I sent you an email but I'm not sure if you can reply to it...being a new member and all. If not, go over to the picture forum and tell a few people "nice picture." I think you only need 5 posts.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

I just found this thread and can say, I can understand you being defensive about where your pup came from. Especially if she seems wonderful.

The people here have been in the dog world a long time and know their stuff.
After buying from a back yard breeder and several hobby breeders, I would NEVER buy a dog from a breeder who was suspended by the AKC, whose dogs weren't registered by the AKC , who didn't have ALL health clearances and guarantees and I am very leery of how many dogs she has. I don't have a magic number but that looks like a puppy making factory to me, no matter how clean it is and how wonderful the dogs are.
Sorry, JMO. It's an accident waiting to happen.


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## kennya (May 15, 2008)

thank you kindly but truthfully said, I am so thankful I found this website and thread, Please take the advise of those that are trying to tell you not to purcase a dog for Golden Creek Kennels in North Carolina. It is not worth the risk of some serious DNA issues.


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## kennya (May 15, 2008)

To all families and individuals who have or plan to purchase a dog from Golden Creek Kennels In ADDITION to my dogs other congenital diseases we also now know as of 5/30 there are more problems, he has absorption problems, which will now hurt his chances of survival as his body reaches a point where is does not absorb the meds any more. Severly chronic allergies both environmental and food related, urinary issues we are still looking into, and possible some additional neurological problems. All my vets, regular, neurology, internal med, neurosurgery and dermatology have told me that there should never be this many issues in one dog . They are shocked the the breeder has never done DNA testing on the congenital ones we have identified, she only mentioned the particular litter TJ came from and said none of those dogs have had any problems. This is too serious not to make sure, and also test some of The females that came from his litter that might have been already pregnant.
I feel Like i am writing about doggie poligamy, anyway, just do not take a chance, she will still sell plenty of dogs, which is sad, but for those of you who read this thread, please take note and pass the word.
thank you


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

kennya said:


> To all families and individuals who have or plan to purchase a dog from Golden Creek Kennels In ADDITION to my dogs other congenital diseases we also now know as of 5/30 there are more problems, he has absorption problems, which will now hurt his chances of survival as his body reaches a point where is does not absorb the meds any more. Severly chronic allergies both environmental and food related, urinary issues we are still looking into, and possible some additional neurological problems. All my vets, regular, neurology, internal med, neurosurgery and dermatology have told me that there should never be this many issues in one dog . They are shocked the the breeder has never done DNA testing on the congenital ones we have identified, she only mentioned the particular litter TJ came from and said none of those dogs have had any problems. This is too serious not to make sure, and also test some of The females that came from his litter that might have been already pregnant.
> I feel Like i am writing about doggie poligamy, anyway, just do not take a chance, she will still sell plenty of dogs, which is sad, but for those of you who read this thread, please take note and pass the word.
> thank you


Kennya, I am so sorry to hear about the suffering of your baby. It is unconscionable to breed dogs in the manner she does. Even pups with full clearances and optigen testing can break our hearts with illnesses and injuries, so she does not even give her dogs and owners a fair, fighting chance. So sorry for you!


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## New Golden Fan (Jul 17, 2010)

Regrettably, although they have a nice website, my advice is to steer clear of Golden Creek Kennels. We excitedly purchased an English Cream Golden puppy. The owner was careful not to disclose the age along the way of the puppies, but sold them at one day less than 7 weeks old. That was, from what I've learned, a bit on the young side. She hurried us to choose and get out the door. Although she said if there were any problems to let her know and that they had a warranty... her concern was not genuine nor sincere.

Within several weeks of having our puppy home it became evident that she had some serious issues (beyond normal puppy) with biting, aggression, and jumping. We engaged a professional trainer who confidently believed he could get her under control. After a 2 hour session. he threw up his arms and said he had never seen such a dominant puppy - only this kind of behavior in adult dobermans and german shepherds and recommended that we contact the breeder about taking her back. This was heartbreaking to hear. But we were thoroughly at our wits end - with bites and scratches all over our family's bodies. 

The owner - Susan - was completely unhelpful and unsympathetic. We called, and she did not call back. We called again and somehow caught her. Her response to our situation was to say "Well - you chose the dog". She was not willing to let us exchange the puppy for another, nor give us any of our money back. We followed up with additional emails and phone calls to discuss our issues further and she would not even respond at all. We have been unable to reach her at all after that one phone call. 

A good breeder would want their dog to be with the appropriate family and in the appropriate environment. This is not a good breeder, nor a good business person. I fear what other things I have subsequently read are true - this is a puppy mill...they don't seem to care about the health, behavior or placements of their puppies. They just care about collecting your check. 

Avoid this business and select another breeder.


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