# How many of you give your golden supplements for immune system?



## Yaichi's Mom (Jul 21, 2012)

Thank you for the excellent question!! I have been thinking the same thing.

I gave my Yaichi COQ, Curcumin, Krill Oil, oil of Oregano & Gluco everyday in her later years and I am convinced that this helped prolong her life, however I haven't started Brisby who is 8 months old tomorrow on anything yet other than a puppy vitamin, feed her Orijen Lg Br Puppy, her filtered water only and also give her natural greek yogurt with a bit of green & red powder daily. 

I would also be very interested in reading what others are doing relative to natural supplements to boost the immune system and at what age.

I totally agree that it's important to boost our GR's immune system to the best of our abilities considering the cancer risks all of our dogs potentially face. 

Thanks for asking this question!!


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## MyBentley (May 5, 2009)

My Bentley will be 12 yrs. old in April. I feed him Acana Pacifica which is an all life stages grain-free formula. He also gets a 3-6-9 gel cap (borage, flax, sardine & anchovy oils); a spoonful of organic non-fat dry yogurt, and bits and pieces of fresh food like banana, apples, blueberries, salmon, etc. every day.

I think the daily diet is very important; but when it comes to cancer, genetics and the number of vaccines/meds play just as important of a role IMO. I've had a number of dogs; and more and more, I think keeping vaccines to a minimum and using as little of heartworm/flea products as possible is key. 

If you were trying to optimize a dog's digestive and immune system by what you feed, then a well thought out diet of home-cooking would be ideal. It's not an over-processed dry product which does very little for gut flora health.


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## coaraujo (Nov 2, 2012)

This is a great question! I can't wait to hear everyone's replies. I want to supplement with more, but haven't been able to figure out exactly what yet. My boys (5 months and 7 months) eat a prey-model diet with Salmon Oil, Glucosamine/Chondroiton/MSM, and Vitamin C. I'm on the market for a probiotic, but want to find an all natural non dairy one. I'd love to hear the brands people use as well. Right now I use Grizzly's Wild Salmon Oil, Triple Flex, and Ester C respectively. I want to find more natural supplements - weather it be herbs/plants etc. Look forward to peoples responses!


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## coaraujo (Nov 2, 2012)

MyBentley said:


> I think the daily diet is very important; but when it comes to cancer, genetics and the number of vaccines/meds play just as important of a role IMO. I've had a number of dogs; and more and more, I think keeping vaccines to a minimum and using as little of heartworm/flea products as possible is key.


I completely agree with this - I've read a number of articles about the detrimental effects of vaccines and heartworm/flea preventatives. I'd love to hear if anyone has any natural remedies for things like that. I know one natural anti-flea formula is in this article:
10 Healing Herbs for Hounds and Humans | Dogster


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

My old dogs had no supplementation whatsoever, just a prey model raw diet, they both lived to 18 and 16 without any health issues. With tuco I supplement because I no longer have the support raising him that I had with my parents so I'm abit more involved, tuco gets

Greens powder
Fish oil
Coconut oil
Diatomous earth
Glucosamine
Chondrotin


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## Wendi (Jul 2, 2012)

Our oldest living dog lived to be 17, my parents free fed her Kibbles and Bits, I kid you not and pretty much any human food she wanted. She wasn't fat. She actually died from a stroke. She was purchased from the news paper.

They no longer feed K & B or free feed. There was a long break between her and their next dogs. Now they feed a high quality kibble. We'll see how long these dogs live.


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## KathyL (Jul 6, 2011)

MyBentley said:


> My Bentley will be 12 yrs. old in April. I feed him Acana Pacifica which is an all life stages grain-free formula. He also gets a 3-6-9 gel cap (borage, flax, sardine & anchovy oils); a spoonful of organic non-fat dry yogurt, and bits and pieces of fresh food like banana, apples, blueberries, salmon, etc. every day.
> 
> I think the daily diet is very important; but when it comes to cancer, genetics and the number of vaccines/meds play just as important of a role IMO. I've had a number of dogs; and more and more, I think keeping vaccines to a minimum and using as little of heartworm/flea products as possible is key.
> 
> If you were trying to optimize a dog's digestive and immune system by what you feed, then a well thought out diet of home-cooking would be ideal. It's not an over-processed dry product which does very little for gut flora health.


No comment here on supplements although I do believe they play a vital role. I just did a double take when I saw Bentley's photo.


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

A good all natural flee and tick powder that both kills and repels flees, ticks and mosquitoes is 1 part of each
DE food grade
Neem
Yarrow


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Having lost 2 dogs to cancer, I do have a different perspective on this?

I see excess weight, exercise (lack), stress... these things among else as possible triggers. I believe that most cancers are hereditary, but there may be triggers or conditions which set the cancers off. 

I feed my dogs good food. I don't get control freaky about it because I do know of dogs who were holistically raised and raw fed who still died early from cancer. 

The supplements I give them are mainly for their physical health - whether that is Ester C which the older guy gets and I'll be putting Bertie on later (I held off because I read too much about excess calcium causing more problems than it's worth in a growing puppy) or something like Glycoflex III for their joints (both dogs get 2 pills a day) or Grizzley Salmon Oil for their skin (both dogs get this) and overall health since we've had a very gray winter.... 

I also give both dogs apples, potatoes, brussels sprouts, cooked carrots... Jacks FOAMS AT THE MOUTH when I have brussels sprouts on my plate and expects me to give every other sprout to him. And darnit I love my sprouts and want them all for myself. : Too many brussels sprouts, for example, will give your dog gi upset, but that veggie boosts vitamin C and it has some cancer fighting properties (dark green veggie). 

I read something about some guy claiming that a diet of foods high antioxidants CAUSES cancer, or something to that effect. Not sure if that would sway me from seeing the benefit in feeding my dog apples, cranberry juice, etc....


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

Megora said:


> Having lost 2 dogs to cancer, I do have a different perspective on this?
> 
> I see excess weight, exercise (lack), stress... these things among else as possible triggers. I believe that most cancers are hereditary, but there may be triggers or conditions which set the cancers off.
> 
> ...


The percentage of dogs under the age of 10 Passing away from cancer has increased significantly, can't remember the stat but I think the percentage that die from cancer increased almost by 4 times, since the 50s, the rise has been particularly high in low risk breeds, while higher risk breeds like goldens, it's just occurring earlier and more vicious, I believe it's because of EXCESSIVE corn and grains in diets, along with too but processing, over vaccination, along with the over use of chemical meds and heartworm, flee, and tick preventatives.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I disagree. Primarily because I know people who were just as hysterical as all that about all of that, and their dogs died young from cancer anyway. 

I think we'd all love to believe that cancer is something we can control or completely avoid, but that's naive thinking in most cases.


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## 4Goldens' (Apr 3, 2012)

Interesting thread, I did start my goldens on immune building supplements when I found out my Bridgett had cancer. I am positive this prolonged her life for a year. Not positive of her primary source of cancer, but she had a breast tumor, liver tumor and tumors in her lungs. The doctors were astounded how healthy she appeared to be until right up to the end. They were shocked she lived past their predictave 4 months for a whole year. We used Transfer factor and Nutramin, Flaxseed oil and Essiac tea. 

While using Nutramin mineral clay we had no fleas at all. I use no flea medication anymore at all. 

Forever we thought we were being the good doggy parents, keeping up with all shots vets recomend and keeping those nasty fleas away by using frontline. I truly think by doing all this contributes to unhealthy dogs. My sister who is a dog owner and has a love for animal like no other, took her dogs to the vet only when absolutely necessary, never got shots other than rabies because it is the law. All of her dogs have lived to be at least 16 years old.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> My sister who is a dog owner and has a love for animal like no other, took her dogs to the vet only when absolutely necessary, never got shots other than rabies because it is the law. All of her dogs have lived to be at least 16 years old.


Did she own goldens though? 

One of my neighbors owned a golden who ate grocery store kibble, got every vaccination possible, was given fronline, and I believe her owners spritzed her with OFF every day every summer that they spent up by the lake (because of biting flies). She lived to be 17 years old and would have lived longer, except they chose to put her to sleep because she couldn't use her legs anymore. 

Her full brother was raised/kept etc the same way and he died from cancer when he 6 or 7. His owners now own a St. Bernard who is pushing 12 years and is as healthy as anything... except for pretty bad hips. 

It really just follows that genetics plays a huge role in whether those cancers show up in your dog or not.

**** I do think that stress plays a big role in the demise of our dogs. And I only think that because my Danny didn't have a single lump beyond very minor lipoma's on his side and neck until after we lost Sammy. And in the 6 months after we lost his older brother, all of those tumors took off. I believe that's probably the point when the tumor on his spleen started growing... 

I read as well the role that some people think that hypothyroidism plays in the growth of cancer cells. Obviously this concerns me since in addition to being a naturally anxious little dog, Jacks also has thyroid issues. In fact both his vet and I were thinking the C word when she raised his thyroid supplement dose to bump up his numbers a little and they plummeted further. It's a sickening thing to be sitting there watching the vet feeling all over your dog's body to check his lymph nodes. <- Fortunately it wasn't the C word, but I think that seems to indicate that some of these things are related. 

Thyroid problems are very hereditary, btw.


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

I feed a raw diet to my girls. I supplement all with Vit. E, Vit. C, Fish Oils. As they get older I put them on Glucosomine/Chondroidin. Does it help? Who knows as there is no scientific studies to say yay or nay. All any of us can do is what we BELIEVE to be best for our dogs. As long as one does that, no one can ask any more.
As for those that think that cancer is more prevalent today then 30, 40 or more years ago I tend to disagree. I believe the biggest change is we look more for a reason WHY today then in previous generations. I also the WWW plays a lot into this. The world is SO much smaller than it was back then. We hear and read about so much more than back then. As for Goldens there has not been any large enough study done to determine if they are living shorter life spans than they did years ago. Lots of anecdotal evidence can be pointed to, but that is of course not scientific evidence.


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## 4Goldens' (Apr 3, 2012)

My personal opinion only, I do think it is a number of things that are causing the so called raising numbers of cancer in Goldens. No. 1 Goldens are talked about by everyone, everyone wants a Golden/ how often do you see blogs about mutts, how many studies are done about the "Mixed Breed" No. 2 My own vet agreed with me when I had mixed feelings about the vaccinations, my research indicated that these could potentially be causing big problems. No. 3 Flea killing chemicals? After starting my dogs on Nutramin, a mineral from the earth, No fleas. Why in the world would I have ever trusted in putting chemicals in my dog, because I trusted in my vet just like we trust in our doctors, take this pill. Food, Food, Food. Even in us humans you see rates of cancer in children like never before. GMO's enough said. 

When I was little all of our dogs grew to be old, today period. in the human race and the animal world we are surrounded by toxins. Weed killers, food, fragrances, I could go on and on. 

Though I do belive this can be hereditary.... I think there is more for us to thing about.


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

It's not nessesarily the age they live to but the QUALITY OF LIFE. I had two dogs that lived to 18 and 16 , which is particularly extraordinary because the oldest was a 32 inch tall tibetan mastiff 180 lbs, and a 90lb golden, which i think the average ages for those sizes are 8 and 10, but understand they were incredibly healthy, as they got older whenever we strayed away from our usual vet they didn't believe how old they were, they had almost no health issues, literally the only health issue was a emergency visit because Macin got into the grapes and the fact that he ate so many grapes and lived was partially attributed to his size, partially the quick visit to the vet and also his great health. Macin was scaling my garage until he was 17, and Max was walking 10km a day with my father to the day he passed. I attribute this to a raw diet, lack of vaccinations and no use of any chemical preventatives, not even any additional supplementation just prey model. Cancer is largely hereditary but you can't deny the massive increase in cases occurring, and the increasing number of deaths in both canines and humans, and many of the factors changing this are processed diets with increasing preservatives and of the few studies done many show that there is a large connection between decreasing auto immune health, and vaccination. Earlier cases of cancers probably couldn't have been prevented perhaps only delayed by a proper diet, but later cases surely could, especially when you look at the patterns in the rise of low risk
Of cancer dogs most of the increase is abit later in life. I saw a very interesting study Afew months ago analyzing that polish immigrants in Canada had a much lower risk of breast cancer and they could not find any genetic differences they had the only difference was that their diets were much more solid and unprocessed, lots of butcher meats and whole veggies. People who deny the connections between the increase in these sicknesses and the change in diet and vaccinations are just as, if not more foolish than those who claim that cancer could be altogether prevented by changes


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## Yaichi's Mom (Jul 21, 2012)

Tuco said:


> The percentage of dogs under the age of 10 Passing away from cancer has increased significantly, can't remember the stat but I think the percentage that die from cancer increased almost by 4 times, since the 50s, the rise has been particularly high in low risk breeds, while higher risk breeds like goldens, it's just occurring earlier and more vicious, I believe it's because of EXCESSIVE corn and grains in diets, along with too but processing, over vaccination, along with the over use of chemical meds and heartworm, flee, and tick preventatives.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Well said :dblthumb2 That is my CBT ( current best theory) also.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Tuco - I read your comment and I honestly wasn't thinking about anything your family might have done with your dogs... but there is the possibility that genetics helps a LOT with those dogs. 

I have a friend whose Newf lived well into her teens (I think she was almost 20). No extraordinary care beyond the care this family gave all their dogs. The vet begged the family to donate blood for a study - to see what it was about this dog that allowed her to live so long. 

And that's generally my first thought always when I hear about dogs living for a VERY LONG TIME beyond the norm for their breeds. It comes down to genetics. 

With goldens - you expect the females to live at least 12 years and the boys to live 11. And the higher edge is girls living to 14 or 15, and boys to 12 or 13. The average is 10 because of cancer.


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## gold4me (Mar 12, 2006)

I have read this thread with interest and what I feel is truly my opinion. I have lost 4 goldens to cancer. Our first two did not get the benefit of raw food, supplements, limited vaccinations and flea toxins as I was learning and it was 15/20 years ago. As I learned better management of nutrition and care I switched to raw food, titers, flea and tick management without the meds. I went to chiropractors, added supplements to boost the immune system, checked for the best breeders for clearances and longevity and still I lost the next two goldens to cancer. Why???? I don't know and probably never will so now I do the best possible nutrition, supplements and medical care and ENJOY each and every day with my Gambler. That is all I can do. Even though we suffered horribly over our losses I would have my boys and girl in my life again. Every minute spent with them out shines the pain of losing them.


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

Megora said:


> Tuco - I read your comment and I honestly wasn't thinking about anything your family might have done with your dogs... but there is the possibility that genetics helps a LOT with those dogs.
> 
> I have a friend whose Newf lived well into her teens (I think she was almost 20). No extraordinary care beyond the care this family gave all their dogs. The vet begged the family to donate blood for a study - to see what it was about this dog that allowed her to live so long.
> 
> ...


I only had contact with 1 of my goldens siblings whom died at 9, also male I believe lymphosarcoma. And my Tibetans siblings all 5 I had contact with, tuco beat out his oldest sibling by 6 years, 3 died from cancers, 1 from serious heart issues and another had some sorta auto immune disorder, that's why I strongly doubt genetics played much of a role, also note all his sibs that died from cancer were diagnosed between 7 and 11 years old


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Tuco said:


> I only had contact with 1 of my goldens siblings whom died at 9, also male I believe lymphosarcoma. And my Tibetans siblings all 5 I had contact with, tuco beat out his oldest sibling by 6 years, 3 died from cancers, 1 from serious heart issues and another had some sorta auto immune disorder, that's why I strongly doubt genetics played much of a role, also note all his sibs that died from cancer were diagnosed between 7 and 11 years old
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


That was the case with our neighbor's golden (put to sleep because of old age at 17, brother died from cancer when he was young) or that newf who I guarantee was the only one who lived as long as she had. And not too many male St. Bernards living into their teens with little to no health concerns.

You can't sample things like this long lived dog or that and immediately assume it was the care given the dog that made those cases unique. Most times the families themselves have no clue why they got so lucky with those specific dogs. That's why the newf's vet was so eager to have that dog's blood sent in somewhere and analyzed. There was more that he was asking and the owner declined because she didn't want her dog dismembered and parceled out.


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

Megora said:


> That was the case with our neighbor's golden (put to sleep because of old age at 17, brother died from cancer when he was young) or that newf who I guarantee was the only one who lived as long as she had. And not too many male St. Bernards living into their teens with little to no health concerns.
> 
> You can't sample things like this long lived dog or that and immediately assume it was the care given the dog that made those cases unique. Most times the families themselves have no clue why they got so lucky with those specific dogs. That's why the newf's vet was so eager to have that dog's blood sent in somewhere and analyzed. There was more that he was asking and the owner declined because she didn't want her dog dismembered and parceled out.


Again, not only long lived, but quality of life, sure a dog may live a long time on a crumby diet, but they may be plagued by joint issues, ear infections, sickness, etc, not only did my dogs live long but they had no health issues whatsoever, their joints and autoimmune health were uncanny for there age, and I doubt that's a genetic anomolie 


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Tuco said:


> Again, not only long lived, but quality of life, sure a dog may live a long time on a crumby diet, but they may be plagued by joint issues, ear infections, sickness, etc, not only did my dogs live long but they had no health issues whatsoever, their joints and autoimmune health were uncanny for there age, and I doubt that's a genetic anomolie
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


That wasn't the case with that newf who lived well into her teens...

That wasn't even the case with the golden who lived well into her teens (her last year was rough because of her hips completely failing). 

Genetics is everything.


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## A1Malinois (Oct 28, 2011)

I occasionally give straight pure bovine colostrum to mine. I stopped because I couldnt trust the source I ordered from after the bottle smelled really stale inside. So I am looking for a new source. 

Ruby gets Hepato Support for her liver which has milk thistle. Thats about all my dogs get. 

My cats get L-lysine supplement for their immune system and a coat enhancer which has made my long haired look like he rolled in a bottle of Garnier hair conditioner


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

Megora said:


> That wasn't the case with that newf who lived well into her teens...
> 
> That wasn't even the case with the golden who lived well into her teens (her last year was rough because of her hips completely failing).
> 
> Genetics is everything.


I'm sorry but saying genetics is everything is ridiculous, there are numerous studies in humans and Afew in canines that show sicknesses and general health are based equally if not more on environmental factors, ESPECIALLY when there are drastic differences in the same fillial generation. From what I've learned so far at my university courses we are taught that environmental factors play a huge role in their health


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Tuco said:


> I'm sorry but saying genetics is everything is ridiculous, there are numerous studies in humans and Afew in canines that show sicknesses and general health are based equally if not more on environmental factors, ESPECIALLY when there are drastic differences in the same fillial generation. From what I've learned so far at my university courses we are taught that environmental factors play a huge role in their health
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Genetics is everything. 

A good example would be the vaccines for people. I have 3 siblings who had a certain vaccine which likely caused brain swelling which likely triggered epilepsy for them. 

Epilepsy runs in my family from the maternal side. It skips a generation most of the time, but generally it takes stress or illness to trigger it. And it generally goes away unless there was actual brain damage. 2 of my sibs have outgrown epilepsy, the third still has it. In his case, there was both the vaccination, but he also had brain damage right at childbirth due to the doctor pulling him out by forcepts on the skull. 

I had a fourth sibling who had the same vaccine and same problem. She died in childhood due to meningitis, but she likely would have been like my other two sibs growing up. The rest of us were _not_ given the vaccine (2 of us because we were always too sick to get the vaccine, and then my youngest sib the doctor looked at the family history and recommended skipping the vaccine) and are "normal". 

That vaccine is given to all kids really. If it CAUSED epilepsy equally despite genetics, we would have a huge problem in healthcare right now. Because all kids would have epilepsy. 

The same applies to dogs as well. If vaccinations like rabies or distemper CAUSED cancer, then we would have an epidemic that crosses all breeds and we would see more similarities between the types of cancers per breed. There are other breeds who have worse cancer problems than goldens. 

Cancer isn't just caused by environmental factors. There is a genetic component as well. 

A good example of that would be those dogs I know who owned by people who did everything thing they could to wrap their dogs in bubble wrap and only feed raw and so forth.... still died young because of cancers like lymphoma.


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

I'm not saying genetics does not play a role I'm saying its half the equation, genetics may make them more prone to certain things. It's the accumulation of vaccines, diet, and everything else. Macin had siblings with heart issues, cancer and autoimmune issues, Macin not only had none but lived 6 years longer, he may have had genetics that made him more prone to those issues, but often it takes something to make it tick, vaccines particularly the rabies vaccine are known to cause autoimmune issues and suspected to cause joint issues, perhaps if he had had those vaccines that genetic risk would tick and cause those issues like his brother, or heart issues and cancer, if he was being fed very well and nutritiously it would prevent it but if he were eating science diet like his sister it may have ticked that genetic risk and he would have developed one. My mom is a very good example, her mother and father have heart disease, her brother has heart disease, right from an early age she has led probably one of the healthiest lifestyles of anyone I know, she's in her 50s now, is a yoga teacher, swims daily, is a naturopathic doctor and eats extremely well, all of her direct family has heart disease and developed it before her, the only difference is they are on a hardy Danish diet which consists highly of meat, cheese and starch, which don't get me wrong it's not unhealthy, but it could be better suited for someone without heart disease, All of them developed it in their 30s, my mom is 53 now and has perfect blood pressure, cholesterol, and heart health. Genetics is not the reason she is so healthy in fact her whole genetic line is very prone to heart issues, diabetes, and high blood pressure, the reason she had not gotten any of these issues is she changed the environmental factors to go in her favor. 


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Again, if vaccines CAUSED health problems, then we would have an epidemic.

If not giving vaccines provides an ideal life, then I'm sure I'd know a lot more people with record breaking doglets who are outliving most. 

Don't give your dogs vaccines or heartworm prevention and yep - feed raw. Your dog. Your vet bills. Your responsibility. 

But what it comes down to is hip dysplasia is something the dogs are born with. And cancers are not all the same cancer caused by X or Y. 

We do know what causes rabies, distemper, parvo though... and what avoids those diseases.

The thing that's alarming here in Michigan as well as your area there in Ontario... is there are reports of Parvo cases going up. Even in older dogs. There is a show here in MI that I attended where 6 month old poodles came down with Parvo and died. There may have been other cases as well... 

And Dallas Gold posted a thread on distemper as well... 

I've read at least in one place where somebody made the comment that these cases are happening with more frequency because people are undervaccinating their dogs. That may be true or not, but still it is a prime reason why I definitely want everyone to keep up on getting that rabies vaccine.


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## Tuco (Jan 3, 2013)

Megora said:


> Again, if vaccines CAUSED health problems, then we would have an epidemic.
> 
> If not giving vaccines provides an ideal life, then I'm sure I'd know a lot more people with record breaking doglets who are outliving most.
> 
> ...


Again, not saying to not vaccinate, I'm saying to reduce vaccination, I'm saying to reduce it, parvovirus distemper and rabies are serious diseases with a high fatality, I vaccinated tuco as a puppy, but it has been shown that the shot keeps high titres for 7+ years, the rabies challenge has still not ended and its year five, every extra vaccine you give is causing inflamation and shocking the immune system and the results have been shown to accumulate


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## A1Malinois (Oct 28, 2011)

Lincoln hasnt seen a vaccine in 4 years and Ruby has not seen a booster shot in...I think 7 years about. They all seem pretty fine...however I still do HW prevention thats not a risk im willing to take.


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