# Jonesy



## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

Gotta say I love how those "English Cremes/Creams" now come from Romania. At least call them European style but of course "English Cream/Creme" is the phrase that garners the big money.

Solid Rock looks to be a for-profit breeder. Just make sure both parents have OFA hips/elbows, hearts checked by a veterinary cardiologist and eyes checked annually by a veterinary opthamologist. You can check OFA clearances at www.offa.org, ask for copies of the others.

Puppies should be kept clean and properly socialised, which means the litter is either in a house or is frequently in the house to be exposed to household noises, etc.

Champions back more than one generation in a pedigree are meaningless. I have been breeding for over 30 years and I tell people that it takes just one poorly planned breeding to undo what I have worked for 30 years to achieve. My lines are behind at least one of her dogs and I am not happy about it. 

Not a breeder I would recommend but I don't recommend for-profit breeders.


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

Smeralia, if it is the same kennel name that came up on my search, sells doodles. Again, not one I would recommend. I don't recommend for-profit breeders nor breeders of mixed-breeds.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Solid Rock is a known mill-type operation, and they do not do clearances.

Additionally, (and this poor dead horse has been beaten repeatedly...:doh there is no such thing as an English Creme Golden (nor British White, or Alpine White, etc etc etc...)


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Please do a search on this forum for English Cream or American vs English, etc. There is much good information that you can learn, if you truly wish to make an educated, informed decision when purchasing a puppy. Also, there is good thread that will provide information regarding utilizing internet sites while looking for a Golden:

http://www.goldenretrieverforum.com/showthread.php?t=32279


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

Pointgold said:


> Solid Rock is a known mill-type operation, and they do not do clearances.
> 
> Additionally, (and this poor dead horse has been beaten repeatedly...:doh there is no such thing as an English Creme Golden (nor British White, or Alpine White, etc etc etc...)


But, what about a Romanian Creme?  Sounds like a good name for a new cocktail. Perhaps a Black Russian with whipping cream added?


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

There were clearances on at least one girl I checked, but it doesn't mean that they have all clearances on all of their dogs. 

There seem to be a lot of kennels with "Rock" in their name, Heritage Rock is a notorious one that comes to mind right away. They are also in the South.


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## mdoats (Jun 7, 2007)

Jonesy,

I don't know anything about that particular breeder, but for more information on lighter colored Golden Retrievers, you can read past discussions on this forum by clicking here.


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

I swear I am gonna start breeding Rare American Reds...I'll make a bundle...


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Emma&Tilly said:


> I swear I am gonna start breeding Rare American Reds...I'll make a bundle...


 
It's embarrassing, having our friends from the UK here on the forum with us, seeing what a fuss is made in this country over "rare British (fill in the blank with the appropriate unGolden color) " or 100% English Cremes, etc etc. You must think we are batty... 
(And especially when they come from Romania! :doh


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## TheHooch (May 9, 2007)

I take it no more British Creme with my coffee every morning?????


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

TheHooch said:


> I take it no more British Creme with my coffee every morning?????


Nah-you're gonna have to take your coffee with Romanian Cream :wavey:


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## Lisa_and_Willow. (Dec 18, 2007)

Emma&Tilly said:


> I swear I am gonna start breeding Rare American Reds...I'll make a bundle...


Ohh I'll have one! Is £1000 enough? I'm bored of all the Cream ones around here!


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Lisa_and_Willow. said:


> Ohh I'll have one! Is £1000 enough? I'm bored of all the Cream ones around here!


You might try *L'Oreal Power Reds Permanent Haircolour Gel Bright Copper Red R75 *on those Cream/Creme/White/Platinum Brit dogs over there, and that way you won't have to import any from America - remember, British Cremes are healthier than our dogs, so if it is just a color/colour preference, simply dye 'em! And then, when Black Golden Retrievers become the rage in the UK, just switch to black dye. :doh:


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## DanielleH (Nov 4, 2006)

vrocco1 said:


> But, what about a Romanian Creme?  Sounds like a good name for a new cocktail. Perhaps a Black Russian with whipping cream added?


LMAO!!!:lol:
You guys are always great for a good laugh!


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

Pointgold said:


> You might try *L'Oreal Power Reds Permanent Haircolour Gel Bright Copper Red R75 *on those Cream/Creme/White/Platinum Brit dogs over there, and that way you won't have to import any from America - remember, British Cremes are healthier than our dogs, so if it is just a color/colour preference, simply dye 'em! And then, when Black Golden Retrievers become the rage in the UK, just switch to black dye. :doh:


LOL! forget that...I am gonna go straight in with PINK!! I'll start my own trend...


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Emma&Tilly said:


> LOL! forget that...I am gonna go straight in with PINK!! I'll start my own trend...


 
Perfect. I love it. If you are going to perpetuate a scam, do it BIG!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think it's gonna be a big seller...


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

The rare British Pretty in Pink Retriever.......


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

ooh yes PG, you are on the right track...but I pictured more 'hot pink' than 'baby pink'...you should really put more effort into your breeding programme you know...the pinker the better, remember thats all that matters!!! Here's my prototype anyway...I think she will be a hit...I'd better get on and make a website, these bad boys won't sell themselves!


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## twinny41 (Feb 13, 2008)

Aw Tilly in pink................to make the boys wink!!


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

I wonder if the OP will ever come back. I'm a sensitive soul and my gut reaction would be to be embarrassed. Silly, I know, but...

Maybe I'm just mushy today...


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## Susan6953 (Jun 9, 2008)

Besides what everyone else has said about clearances, they have an awful lot of puppies available. It is hard to see how all the puppies can be properly socialized when there are so many litters in a short amount of time.

That said, I don't think there is anything wrong with preferring one color to another as long as you understand that they are all the same breed.

I suggest contacting the local golden retriever club and getting a list of local breeders. Even some of the breeders who didn't have puppies available emailed me back to suggest who might.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

Well, I wasn't very helpful and I apologize. You can also use this list of puppy referral people. http://www.grca.org/puppyreferrals.asp 

I know when I was looking for a pup the group gave me the name of a hobby breeder whose Girl seemed to have very light pups in her last litter. I wasn't looking for a pup of a specific color. I was looking for a reputable breeder. It can't hurt to try.


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## GoldenKat (Dec 4, 2007)

Have you tried http://www.tanglewoodgoldens.com/ ? They sell the lighter colored goldens and are located close to Charlotte, NC.

Good luck!

By the way, the pink golden was hilarious!


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

Kimm said:


> I wonder if the OP will ever come back. I'm a sensitive soul and my gut reaction would be to be embarrassed. Silly, I know, but...
> 
> Maybe I'm just mushy today...


I apologise for my silliness in this thread...but I think the reason for any embarrassment was squared directly at the 'known mill-type operation' brought up in this thread...I don't think anyone implies that there is anything wrong with having a preference for UK type golden retrievers...a quality dog is a quality dog...it is the breeders selling less than quality puppies at ridiculous prices and calling them 'rare white goldens' that people should be cautious of, which I think is the message of this thread, albeit put across in a droll and lighthearted way...

(I am still gonna sell my pink retrievers though...)


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## Wilson's REAL Mom (Nov 10, 2006)

OK, I wasn't going to say anything, but since it got brought up, I'll voice my opinion. I am the owner of one of these very light Goldens. I went into it with my eyes wide open. The breeder who sold her to me went out of her way to explain that they aren't rare, a different type of Golden, and this particular girl isn't English. And most people would say I paid too much for her. However, the main reason that I liked her lineage was because of the number of dogs that live to unbelievable ages. Her great-grandmother just died at the age of 17!

Having said all that, whenever someone brings up the subject of these "English Cream" or whatever you want to call them, the way "people" jump on the bandwagon to make fun of them makes me cringe. For the most part, I love the way that people on this board are so supportive and nice, but this one issue really bugs me. I do not have particularly thin skin, so if it gets to me, I can only imagine what some of the other owners of these beautiful dogs feel.

BTW, I paid $1800 for my girl. She was 20 months old, already house broken, had basic obedience training, had all her puppy medical stuff (including spay) out of the way, and was past all the puppy mischief. Her parents (and way back in her lineage) have clearances (the ones they do in Europe...can't remember the name of that right off). I know her lines for generations and generations. I know what to expect from her (including the fact that now, and almost 2, she is turning from almost white to a beautiful light honey color). I figure I got a pretty good deal.

Anyway, that's JM(NS)HO regarding whether or not y'all are hurting people's feelings on this subject.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

I don't really mind the silliness. I enjoy a good Pink Golden myself. I just found little information was being given and not much guidance or education. 

I get a bit sensitive sometimes. Not so much for myself, but for others. Maybe it's a flaw...


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

Wilson's REAL Mom said:


> OK, I wasn't going to say anything, but since it got brought up, I'll voice my opinion. I am the owner of one of these very light Goldens. I went into it with my eyes wide open. The breeder who sold her to me went out of her way to explain that they aren't rare, a different type of Golden, and this particular girl isn't English. And most people would say I paid too much for her. However, the main reason that I liked her lineage was because of the number of dogs that live to unbelievable ages. Her great-grandmother just died at the age of 17!
> 
> Having said all that, whenever someone brings up the subject of these "English Cream" or whatever you want to call them, the way "people" jump on the bandwagon to make fun of them makes me cringe. For the most part, I love the way that people on this board are so supportive and nice, but this one issue really bugs me. I do not have particularly thin skin, so if it gets to me, I can only imagine what some of the other owners of these beautiful dogs feel.


As an owner of a pale/cream/English type golden it is sad that you feel you are being made 'fun of' because of your preference...considering you made a very researched and informed decision about your choice of breeder I personally don't understand why you should feel that way...it sounds like you did everything right and you should be proud of your choice of breeder and dog...again, no one has ever said that it is in any way wrong to prefer that type of dog...why on earth would it be???! But I can see how it angers people to see breeders trying their best to sell a dog for something that it isn't. This forum constantly raises awareness about what makes a good breeder so I don't see why it should be any different when it involves 'English creams' or whatever name they are given...like I said before, a quality dog is a quality dog...the same goes for the breeder...if a good breeder proves the quality of their breeding dogs whether that be in the show ring or the field then it doesn't matter what colour or type the dog is. 

There are countless other threads about this topic and I have probably chimed in at some stage in most of them...this is the first time I recall anyone getting a little lighthearted with the subject...it normally remains a very serious and informative discussion indeed....again the focus being the breeders that have seen where they can make a quick buck and how to avoid them. There have been links given on this very thread to previous threads in which this has been brought up so an abundance of information is at the readers finger tips, especially Mdoats link which provided excellent information...like PG said, this horse has been well and truly beaten to death so maybe that is why people are more likely to provide links to lots of info than type the same posts eveytime this topic is brought up.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Wilson's REAL Mom said:


> OK, I wasn't going to say anything, but since it got brought up, I'll voice my opinion. I am the owner of one of these very light Goldens. I went into it with my eyes wide open. The breeder who sold her to me went out of her way to explain that they aren't rare, a different type of Golden, and this particular girl isn't English. And most people would say I paid too much for her. However, the main reason that I liked her lineage was because of the number of dogs that live to unbelievable ages. Her great-grandmother just died at the age of 17!
> 
> Having said all that, whenever someone brings up the subject of these "English Cream" or whatever you want to call them, the way "people" jump on the bandwagon to make fun of them makes me cringe. For the most part, I love the way that people on this board are so supportive and nice, but this one issue really bugs me. I do not have particularly thin skin, so if it gets to me, I can only imagine what some of the other owners of these beautiful dogs feel.
> 
> ...


 
Given the circumstances of your purchase of your girl, I don't feel that you are at all a member of the "I have a Rare English Creme/British White Golden Club" at all. Her breeder in no way was perpetuating the scam that is at the root of our frustrations (and associated "silliness" - if we didn't make light of it we'd probably go crazy!) She was honest with you. The price that you paid is not, IMO, way too much, given that she was spayed, trained, etc, and more importantly that she has a strong genetic background. 
Please know that we, and I think that I can safely speak for most us, are not making fun of the dogs, or even the people that buy them. The issue has been discussed so many times, in a forthright and informative manner. The information is out there, and lots of it is here on the GRF. We have, attempted to, and will continue to, educate potential puppy buyers in the hopes that they will NOT pay inflated prices for what is nothing more than a marketing scam, and at the same time have encouraged people to look for the most important aspects when buying a Golden - genetic health, structure, temperament, and longevity. We do no less when someone is looking for ANY Golden, no matter the color. Our frustration lies with the people who are breeding extremely light dogs and marketing them as something that they are not, most without benefit of clearances or consideration of any of the other important points. 

If, after having good, sound information made available to them as regards the purchase of a puppy or dog, a person chooses to buy a dog simply because of the color and thinking that it is somehow "rare" or "special", disregarding everything else, then that is their perogative. And, as with anyone who takes the risk of buying a dog bred without benefit of an ancestral history of genetic clearances, I pray that they don't suffer the heartbreak of a crippled or debilitated dog later, no matter the color. And I will say that as a breeder, _I _cringe when I learn of such situations, especially when the owners have paid far too much money for a puppy without that solid health history.


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## jonesy (Sep 14, 2008)

Thanks to all of you for the information. I am now looking into breeders in Ontario Canada, and wondered if anyone knows anything about Chrys-Haefen Breeders, Young Country Goldens, and Blackpool Goldens? I am so new at this research and I don't want to make a mistake, but I love to be educated. Thanks for any help!


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## Thor0918 (Feb 28, 2008)

Jonsey you have taken this all so well! Welcome to the forum and enjoy yourself!! We really can be fun here.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

jonesy said:


> Thanks to all of you for the information. I am now looking into breeders in Ontario Canada, and wondered if anyone knows anything about Chrys-Haefen Breeders, Young Country Goldens, and Blackpool Goldens? I am so new at this research and I don't want to make a mistake, but I love to be educated. Thanks for any help!


It's good that you are doing your homework! Welcome to GRF!


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

jonesy said:


> Thanks to all of you for the information. I am now looking into breeders in Ontario Canada, and wondered if anyone knows anything about Chrys-Haefen Breeders, Young Country Goldens, and Blackpool Goldens? I am so new at this research and I don't want to make a mistake, but I love to be educated. Thanks for any help!


 
Your attitude and desire to be a well informed buyer is most admirable, and I'm happy to see it. While I know that Chrys-Haefen is a very well established kennel, I am unfamiliar with the others - we do have several Canadian breeders on the board who might be able to provide references. 

Good luck in your search!


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## lovealways_jami (Apr 17, 2007)

I too joined this forum asking if anyone knew anything about "alpine goldens"... I look back and do laugh at myself now being educated from this forum. BUT I do think we should be a little more welcoming to the people of the forum and let them know they are not by any means the only ones whove asked these questions. 
Yay to the OP for not running out the forum door! 
The "Alpine Goldens" I was referring to a year ago do have clearances... I look at their site pretty often as I still think they are gorgeous. I guess everyone has their preferences... Touchy subject I try to stay away from, but not everyone is breeder here and not everyone understands what all of the fuss is about... Im not trying to "stir the pot" as it seems this has been squared away in a very mature manner. I wish there was a warm and fuzzy feeling for the new members... thats all


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## dogsportgirl01 (Jun 26, 2010)

Tahnee GR said:


> There were clearances on at least one girl I checked, but it doesn't mean that they have all clearances on all of their dogs.
> 
> There seem to be a lot of kennels with "Rock" in their name, Heritage Rock is a notorious one that comes to mind right away. They are also in the South.


Heritage Rock is their(SolidRock's) daughter that also breeds.

I have a dog from Solid Rock. Accually, her mom is from Solid Rock and her dad is Heritage Rock. Our golden we got from them is the best thing in the world to us. She has an amazingly great temperment and is such a good girl. She is definitely not show quality though, but thats not what we bought her for. Shes perfect for a companion golden! 

Solid Rock are very nice people, they provided us with a great pet golden and we couldnt have asked for a better dog!


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