# Advice needed - stubborn dog



## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

This may be his way of doing his 'acclimation'.

Give him the space to see & smell & experience his surroundings. In the competition world, whole classes and a lot of time is devoted to this; if he is unsure he needs to take his time, don't cajole or be stern or baby him, just allow him the time 

When he wants to go a different way stand still, simply stand still. Or let him choose which way to go as long as it is a safe choice.

Good luck, have fun with your boy


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## CAROLINA MOM (May 12, 2009)

Welcome to the forum, congratulations on Magic, hope you'll share pictures of him with us. 

I have a former puppy mill momma, she was not socialized and had been abused before I got her. I am guessing Magic was not socialized or exposed to different things such as being outside. He's experiencing things he's never seen before, is unsure of them and some of them are scaring him. It will take time, but he can overcome them. 

Try to be very patient, gentle and loving with him, you want this to be a pleasant experience and something he will look forward to and enjoy. I suggest maybe trying an Easy Walk Gentle Leader Harness on him, here's the link from Amazon. I got one for both of my guys, works great. My boy use to be horrible on a leash, pulled really hard, using the EW Gentle Leader Harness stopped his pulling. 

Pet Halter Harnesses : Amazon.com: PetSafe Easy Walk Dog Harness, Large, Black/Silver



When you take Magic out for a walk, take some high value treats with you so you can have him look at you, this will draw his attention to you instead of what is scaring or distracting him. 

Remember to make this a fun and enjoyable experience for him, be gentle and loving. He needs to gain confidence in himself and his surroundings, it takes time but he'll become confident.


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## Leslie B (Mar 17, 2011)

Start "walking" him on lead in the house and in the yard where he is comfortable. Seems silly but walking him around the house can teach him that he follows the leash and not the other way around. Lots of treats when he gets it right and lots of patience when he refuses. Do not give in and let him lead you. As he gets it at home and walks on the leash without any refusals you can start to expand your walk to up and down the street in front of your house. If you have any sitting or demands to go another direction you went to fast or to far. Pull in your work to the last stage where he followed willingly and confidently.


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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

Magic said:


> I know many dog trainers say there is no such thing as a stubborn dog just a bad handler but I don't know how else to describe this. My boy Magic was rescued from a puppy farm six months ago where he never went for a walk. After many months I am now able to walk him well, still pulling a little but 100% better than he was. I realise that sometimes he refuses to move as he is scared but other times he refuses to move simply because he wants to go a different way. I have tried everything, fussing him, giving treats, ignoring him, using a "stern" voice, nothing helps, he will sometimes sit for ten minutes on the pavement and just refuse to budge. In the home Magic is a dream and does everytihing asked of him, he willingly gives paw, sits and lays down when asked. Anyone else have this problem or know a way to cure it?


 Bless your heart for taking Magic in, and consider that six months is really not very long to learn that the world is truly a safe place to live. Please understand that never having been exposed to 'your world' which is so much different than what was his world was like, just a few months ago, is scary for him. Fear in our dogs is very real for them, whether we understand what they are afraid of or not, it is a survival skill, it keeps them alive. When our dogs encounter something that causes them to feel afraid, could be a sight, a smell we cannot detect, a sound we cannot hear, or a situation/location/event (or something similar) they have formed an unpleasant association with or have never experienced before, their options are few. Their options are 'flight', 'fight' or 'freeze'. Most dogs if they have the choice will move away/create distance from something they fear, (flight), if they cannot, by virtue of being on leash, or are cornered, they may opt to try to warn off the scary thing, bark, growl 'act' aggressive, in order to make it go away, as a last resort they will physically defend themselves (fight). Some dogs will 'freeze' uncertain whether it is safe to move forward, unable to move away, they do 'nothing' remain still, may try to make themselves small, in hopes that the danger will pass, and they will remain unharmed.
Consider whether Magic would 'run away' if he were not on leash, in those situations you feel he is just being 'stubborn', if he may be 'freezing' since he has no other choice? Consider whether his refusal to move, is happening in the same location, if so it could be a smell or sound that he can detect and you cannot, it could be something visual, that he is uncertain about. It could also be that he is feeling overwhelmed, unsafe, the walk may be too long, perhaps it is a different route, or there may be too much going on in the environment, for him, and he needs to 'retreat' to a location/environment that he feels safe, it is time to go home, and try again another day. 

'Sitting' is a calming behavior for a dog, they may 'sit' when they are feeling anxious, uncertain with what is going on, and they use it to try to calm themselves down. Pay close attention and watch for other signals, are his ears pulled back, flat against his head, is he licking his lips or nose, turning his head away (perhaps looking back in the direction he came), his eyes open wider than they normally would be, the corners of his mouth pulled back, perhaps creased, if so he is 'telling' you he is feeling anxious or afraid.

Suggest getting the book: On Talking Terms with Dogs: Calming Signals by Turid Rugaas. It gives a basic introduction to dog body language and how they try to communicate what they are feeling, to us as they would other dogs. 

If he won't move forward, will he move back? if so, what is the harm? Encourage him to do so. If not, give him some time, perhaps try redirecting his focus, engage his mind, by asking him to respond to a cue, 'watch' (to make eye contact with you), touch his nose to the palm of your hand, or perform a simple trick that he enjoys doing at home, such as shake a paw, reward him (praise and a treat or two, for that, and then happily, encourage him to follow you, go 'back' (retreat) in the direction you came.


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## Magic (Nov 21, 2015)

*Magic*

Thanks for your replies everyone. It not the walking that is a problem now, I have a gentle leader and and he walks so much better. I also know when he is scared and always stand and wait for him to look around etc. The only problem I have is that when he does not get his own way he flatly refuses to move, I have had to stand next to him for ten minutes several times on a walk before he then realises I am not going to give in and we walk my way. I believe if I just let him go the way he wants it is telling him he is the pack leader?


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

Magic said:


> Thanks for your replies everyone. It not the walking that is a problem now, I have a gentle leader and and he walks so much better. I also know when he is scared and always stand and wait for him to look around etc. The only problem I have is that when he does not get his own way he flatly refuses to move, I have had to stand next to him for ten minutes several times on a walk before he then realises I am not going to give in and we walk my way. I believe if I just let him go the way he wants it is telling him he is the pack leader?


Sir Maxwell sometimes does the same thing - so to avoid frustration on my side, I bring a book. Yup, that's me, the crazy lady in the park, standing there with book in hand, while dog plants himself in the grass. It may not be perfect, but it keeps me from getting annoyed - and lately, when I pull out the book, he gets up and moves.


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## Buddy's mom forever (Jun 23, 2011)

laprincessa said:


> Sir Maxwell sometimes does the same thing - so to avoid frustration on my side, I bring a book. Yup, that's me, the crazy lady in the park, standing there with book in hand, while dog plants himself in the grass. It may not be perfect, but it keeps me from getting annoyed - and lately, when I pull out the book, he gets up and moves.


You are not alone .

When my Buddy did that I used to sit next to him. Had people couple times stopping the cars to see what happened and do we need any help. Noooo we are just taking a break :doh:.


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

I think the response Sunrise gave to you is perfect.

To add rescue pups need a whole lot more time and patience on our part. Reading into their behavior and making adjustments comes with time. Dogs say a whole lot to us and eventually we figure out what they are trying to say. Figuring out each other leads to success


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## gdgli (Aug 24, 2011)

You have a long term project. I have experience with this. Good luck.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

6 months is no where near long enough for him to lose his fear and be confident. When he plants himself and won't move, it is still fear and uncertainty. Please be patient with him. 

Does he have a toy or treats that he particularly likes? Try taking them with you, get him excited about the item and toss them a few feet in the direction you want to go. Or hold it and you walk a step or two forward with the item just out of reach. 

Just keep working at it, you have made great progress so far! Thanks for taking in special pup.


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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

Magic said:


> Thanks for your replies everyone. It not the walking that is a problem now, I have a gentle leader and and he walks so much better. I also know when he is scared and always stand and wait for him to look around etc. The only problem I have is that when he does not get his own way he flatly refuses to move, I have had to stand next to him for ten minutes several times on a walk before he then realises I am not going to give in and we walk my way. I believe if I just let him go the way he wants it is telling him he is the pack leader?




Absolutely not! He knows you are not a dog, and he has no inclination or desire to 'lead', he is relying on you to guide him and keep him safe, that is what a 'leader' does. What you are telling him is that you can be trusted to listen to him when he is telling you he is not comfortable/feeling safe with what is going on in the environment he is in. 

Pay close attention to his body language, make a mental note of what he looks like when he is at home, where he is feeling safe, and 'compare' it to when he is out on a walk, I suspect, he is telling you, even before he sits, that he is not feeling relaxed or safe. 'Survival' and safety, is hard wired into any animal, it is their number one priority, to stay safe, to stay alive. That does not mean you should not take him out, it means that you need to help him, work with him to change how he feels about those things he is uncertain about. Take it slow, try not to expect too much, lack of 'real world' socialization, takes time and a little extra work to over come, but it can be done, if we are patient and work at their pace.


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

Chloe will do the same thing if we walk her in our neighborhood. She doesn't do it at the park at all. Just be patient I am sure you will get over the hump.


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## Pilgrim123 (Jul 26, 2014)

When we adopted Girly at 8yo, she was an absolute horror to walk. With patience and a gentle leader halter, we've now worked out a compromise. If I put the halter on her, we go my way at my pace, which is handy for visits to the vets or in town, but if I just use a lead and her normal collar, then she knows she's allowed to take me for a walk!


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