# breeder has ignored all requests for AKC papers



## queenie (Apr 19, 2008)

Almost two years ago we purchased a golden retriever puppy from what we believed to be a reputable breeder in eastern Connecticut. We paid $1600 for a pet quality pup that we neutered at 6 months old. When I first requested the papers when he was almost a year old, I was told they would send them along all I needed to do was send proof of the neutering. I did and I waited, and waited. Every time I talk to the breeder there is a new excuse, he can't find the paper work, they moved, they are requesting duplicate paperwork. 

While we were assured he was a healthy pup, he has had on going health issues. After 18 months of diligence, he is doing very well. When I told the breeder about the dogs health issues, the breeder insisted that there were no such problems in any of his dogs - well of course there wouldn't be if they choose not to listen when they are told that issues had developed. 

I don't want anything from them but the AKC papers, actually the paper word to obtain AKC registration. Is there any recourse for dealing with a breeder who won't provide paper work? I do have the signed contract. I just think at this point he doesn't want his kennel name on a dog that has so many issues. 

HELP!

Queenie


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## Lestorm (Feb 25, 2007)

If this happened in the UK I would be sending a copy of the contract, which states you will recieve the papers after neutering, to the KC. I really cannot understand why you didnt get the papers at the time of purchasing your puppy as they should come together.


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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

Wow - $1600 for a pet quality puppy is extremely high! That would even be considered a lot if the pup came from champion parents. It is possible that they were suspended from the AKC for some reason and the litter wasn't registered? What is the name of the breeder?


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## Jax's Mom (Oct 16, 2009)

1600 is about average in this area. I'm sorry you are going through this....wish I knew how to help.


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## Packleader (Nov 27, 2007)

I would recommend that you contact the AKC and explain the situation and what you have done to meet your end of the contract and what the breeder has not done. You may have to provice a copy of the contract to them but if you have met your end and they haven't the AKC may be able to help you.


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## Muddypaws (Apr 20, 2009)

Does this breeder belong to any GR clubs? I would report him to the AKC and to any club affiliation especially GRCA.

We received the registration paper work the day we got our puppies. He should have given them to you with the contract. I hope your puppy is doing better and you can alert others to this questionable breeder.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

I've bought three AKC dogs from well-titled lines with multigenerational clearances in New England (well, one in Westchester just across the CT/NY border) and never paid anywhere near $1600, so I think it's high even for this area.

Who is this breeder? I think the CT Golden community would really like to know. This kind of behavior is common among scam breeders, and might indicate the breeder was suspended by the AKC.

It also could be an honest mistake or a problem with co-ownership.

Health issues can happen even to the most carefully produced dogs, though most great breeders don't write it off with something like "that never happens."


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## slip_kid (May 12, 2009)

i wonder if it's the same breeder that sells "nordic" and "standard GR" and "half nordic/half standard GR's"...

$1,600 sounds about their price range in eastern CT. and they don't do health clearances.


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## eirepup (Apr 14, 2010)

When I got Finn I was told the breeder would send us his IKC papers we kept ringing and he made up excuses for ages and then changed numbers we also couldn't remember exactly where he lived because it was in the countryside and we got directions as we went so we never got his papers, he had loads of health problems too and now I look back I realise it was a puppy mill. Its a very frustrating situation . . . sorry to hear you are going through it hope you manage to get his papers.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

What is the name of the breeder? It could be there is somebody else here who has experience with them. Either that, or it could serve as a warning to other people looking for puppies. 

It could be different states have different rules regarding AKC papers, but I did buy a 'pet quality' puppy from a large breeding kennel here in Michigan. Based on how much I paid for my puppy ($900), I received a limited registration. 

This means that even if I didn't neuter my puppy, it meant I couldn't breed him and have his litters recognized by the AKC. At least from what I understand. 

And I received the papers when I went to pick the little guy up and handed in my check. One thing you might want to keep in mind is you should have the registration paperwork, pedigree, and other various paperwork (microchip, worming, etc) in an envelope before you and the puppy leave the kennel. 

I had the same experience with my previous two goldens who were purchased from smaller hobby breeders.

At least that is my experience in buying a puppy in person. I'm not sure how the paperwork is handled when the breeder ships the puppy to you.


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## queenie (Apr 19, 2008)

Because he pup was being sold as a pet and not for breeding, it was to be a limited registration. Once he was neutered and we provided proof, the papers would be sent to me. I REALLY want to believe that this breeder is not as creepy as I am now beginning to suspect. I looked up the AKC web site and there is a number to call that verifies record keeping of breeders. I will call them in the morning. 

As for all his medical problems - thank heavens for Pet First Insurance! They were wonderful through it all. He had a series of problems, but the ones that were causing most of the problems were allergies - both environment and food. Special diet, allergy shots, along with amply fish oil supplements and he's a new dog. I am surprised how well it did go once things were diagnosed. 

Thanks again, 

Queenie


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## msdogs1976 (Dec 21, 2007)

Muddypaws said:


> We received the registration paper work the day we got our puppies. He should have given them to you with the contract.


Same here. Should be an easy process.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

If it were me I would get council from an attorney. Its amazing what a simple letter from an attorney will do!

And if that didn't get results I would sue! You were ripped off in my opinion..they did not live up to the contract.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

I have a solid guess as to who this breeder might be; there's perhaps another (awesome!) member here struggling with the same issue- maybe even from the same litter.

It is frustrating. I've had my issues too trying to get papers on expensive pups on several occasions. I think the paperwork is sometimes the least appealing part of having a litter for some breeders who otherwise do a great job and love the pups more than the documents. Other times, I think other kinds of breeders attempt to "hide" how many pet pups they are really producing and see no reason pet owners need papers. Still others have a powerful fear that a pet owner will be a backyard breeder in sheep's clothing so to speak, and really want proof of spay/neuter before they feel great about handing over any proof of ownership. 

Usually, by being a squeaky wheel and persisting/ not going away, you do eventually get the papers. But 2 years is ludicrous! Do the breeders own both the mom and the stud dog? Do they belong to Yankee Golden? At this point, you are well within your rights to inform the stud dog owner and/or an influential leader of the club so they can help you. 

Have you searched this forum for any past threads about them?

It stinks when you choose a breeder and hold up your end of the bargain, and then they let you down.

A certified letter from a lawyer might work? A link to this thread might work?


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## inge (Sep 20, 2009)

_Because he pup was being sold as a pet and not for breeding, it was to be a limited registration. Once he was neutered and we provided proof, the papers would be sent to me_.

Same here...with that difference, that I got the papers immediately after I gave my breeder the spay certification.


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## Willow52 (Aug 14, 2009)

When we brought Hank home, the breeder gave us a folder with all his registration papers, litter certificate, feeding/care information, coupons for food, health record, etc. 
Hank's breeder was a hobby breeder, no clearances to speak of, but organized and caring. I believe my daughter paid $300. for him (he was a gift to me).


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## queenie (Apr 19, 2008)

I spoke to someone at the AKC and they gave me some great advise on how to proceed. The breeder was Ripley Golden Retrievers originally in Preston, CT. They moved, I believe, to Stonington, and now have relocated to central Florida. In spite of what they may have claimed, or stated on their contract and other material I received, they were not the breeders (according to the AKC) but they owned the sire and 'purchased' the litter from the owners of the dame and sold them as theirs. 

I was unaware of the breeding protocol involved, and they seemed to be reputable, she (husband and wife) is an officer with the GRCA. I will save my opinion of them for now, but I would NEVER do business with them again.

The solution is fairly simple. I send all my information, and thankfully I'm a paperwork pack rat, and send it to Case Management at the AKC. They were able to find the litter and the litter was registered, but of course, not to Steven and Frances Brentson the owners of Ripley Golden Retrievers. 

Thank you for all your help, I really appreciate it.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Love to see pictures of your pup!


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

queenie said:


> they owned the sire and 'purchased' the litter from the owners of the dame and sold them as theirs.


Does anybody know if this something that is commonly done?

Glad you have a start in getting those papers.

At the time I picked up Brady, his breeder filled out the paperwork with me, to make sure I put her kennel name in his name. He was also sold as pet / limited registration, stating to neuter him at one year, but I had his registration back from the AKC before he was 12 weeks old.


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## Kand3 (Nov 3, 2008)

Hi Queenie! I just realized I haven't logged onto GRF since January, but I was alerted to this thread and wanted to respond. I basically could have written your post! 

We purchased our Bailey from Ripley Goldens back in December 2008 and have had a very similar experience to yours. She has had a number of health issues which were either denied by or blamed on us by the breeder. 

After waiting for over 8 months for her AKC registration paperwork we finally did receive her registration slip in August 2009. However, they signed off as owners and resigned as co-owners which is something we never discussed or agreed to. Since receiving her paperwork we have tried very cordially (for the last nine months!) to clarify this issue so that we could register her in our names but have never received a response.

You have done the right thing filing a complaint with the AKC Case Management Department and we intend to do the same. I had put it off truly hoping we could just resolve it amicably but it doesn't appear that is going to happen. Like you, we would simply like to register our dog whom we have provided an excellent home to, in our own names! 

Please feel free to PM me anytime if you would like to discuss more!


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## robbie5539 (Sep 19, 2010)

My wife and I just placed a deposit with Ripley Goldens here in Florida. We just visited the breeder recently and everything seemed to be legitimate so your post is quite concerning. Did your problems with them ever get resolved? Did you have to involve the AKC? Who were the sire and dam of your pet and what kind of health problems did they have?


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

robbie5539 said:


> My wife and I just placed a deposit with Ripley Goldens here in Florida. We just visited the breeder recently and everything seemed to be legitimate so your post is quite concerning. Did your problems with them ever get resolved? Did you have to involve the AKC? Who were the sire and dam of your pet and what kind of health problems did they have?


Hey Robbie,

Try to write fourteen more posts throughout the forum so you can start using the PM system. I'm not sure you're going to get a public answer to your question.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

I'd make a complaint to the GRCA. There are problems here (and elsewhere) on several levels. You are not alone.


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## queenie (Apr 19, 2008)

I took myself off the radar this summer to chill out and concentrate on the things that really matter. My dog's medical issues are ongoing but we are seeing some progress. We still need to pay close attention to his environment, diet, and medication, but his quality of life is pretty good these days. 

I put his file away at the beginning of summer and decided to concentrate on a healthy, happy summer. I just got his file out and will begin again to get things in order, although there is nothing other than personal satisfaction to be gained.

To Robbie 5539:
While my experience with this breeder was at best disappointing, perhaps you will have better luck. From the outset they appeared knowledgable and caring, but looking back most of it appears to have been a sale pitch. Once the puppy was off the premises things changed dramatically.

Medical Issues:

Dental problems: This involved visits to both a vet and a canine dentist. The breeders response was that both the vet and the canine dentist didn't know what they were talking about. There was (is) a small anatomical anomaly that although benign, suggested that a small tumor may have existed. As I indicated above it was just an anomaly, however, there were adult teeth that never came in. Compared to his other medical problems, this has not been a concern.


ALLERGIES: BOTH ENVIRONMENT AND FOOD 
My dog was a miserable puppy. The only way I could think to describe it was to compare it to a colicky baby. He was miserable. After weekly visits to the vet, and constantly monitoring his behavior, environment, and diet, we had him tested and discovered why his life had been so problematic. Again, we are making progress. 

Food: Our options are extremely limited. We order special food; it's expensive but not outrageous at about $75-100 a month - not the options offered at the vet, these made him even sicker. All treats must be carefully scrutinized and people food treats are very limited. He gets a daily probiotic, a omega supplement, an antihistamine twice a day. He has some digestive problems that we have coped with by using raised dog bowls and daily dosages of Gas X. I may be the only person who has had to teach my dog how to burp. 

Environmental allergies are also a major part of the problem. The dog is given shots every two weeks and it had been helping a great deal. It's a commitment, it's expensive, but the results are worth the effort. When we recently purchased a summer house (it's very small), it had to have central air, hard wood floors, and a lawn with as little rye grass as possible. 

All of this is vet supervised and not by just one vet. We have a vet at both our winter and summer home - they are in total agreement about the medical treatment. Faxes are sent seasonally to bring everyone up to date. 

And although it's just a memory now, let's not forget the time dealing with panosteitis that went on for over a year.

I'm sorry to go on and on, but as you can see it's been a challenge, a very expensive challenge. What made me resentful was the dismissive attitude of the breeder. If there had been support or a small amount of compassion, I would have been alright with things, but there was none.

The sire was Nautilus Ripleys BMW M5 (Rocket) of whom they spoke about exhaustively, it was the information about the dam, Miss Ruby Red Holiday, that details became sketchy. I should have been more proactive but at the time I still wanted to trust that they were scrupulous breeders.

After all the medical problems, it was no wonder that behavioral issues were present. We worked with several trainers and found one that made the world of difference. We now have a happy guy who is loved and thoroughly enjoys his life. To us pets are more than chattel, they are members of the family and it's a lifelong commitment.

Recently, when in the middle of a cuddle fest with the dog, my husband reflected that Toby was our fate because he needed us. I can't help but agree.

Good luck with your search, I wish I could have been more supportive, but I think you can understand my (strong) hesitation regarding this breeder.

Kind regards,

Queenie


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## Lestorm (Feb 25, 2007)

robbie5539 said:


> My wife and I just placed a deposit with Ripley Goldens here in Florida. We just visited the breeder recently and everything seemed to be legitimate so your post is quite concerning. Did your problems with them ever get resolved? Did you have to involve the AKC? Who were the sire and dam of your pet and what kind of health problems did they have?


 
Oh dear! I expect you have heard quite enough


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## NuttinButGoldens (Jan 10, 2009)

Toby is a very lucky pup indeed. I'd say the majority of owners would not have the means to deal with this sort of situation.

I think you are right. It was destiny 



queenie said:


> I took myself off the radar this summer to chill out and concentrate on the things that really matter. My dog's medical issues are ongoing but we are seeing some progress. We still need to pay close attention to his environment, diet, and medication, but his quality of life is pretty good these days.
> 
> I put his file away at the beginning of summer and decided to concentrate on a healthy, happy summer. I just got his file out and will begin again to get things in order, although there is nothing other than personal satisfaction to be gained.
> 
> ...


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## robbie5539 (Sep 19, 2010)

Thanks everyone for your responses. Queenie, I really appreciate you sharing your story with us. I hate to hear that Toby has had such a hard time, but like the others said, he is a lucky guy to have such caring owners! One similarity in our experience that sticks out to me is that there was a wealth of information on the sire of this litter, but not for the dam. 

After we did considerably more research, my husband and I ended up taking our name off of the list for one of the Ripley puppies. We came across several inconsistencies that made us uncomfortable with the whole situation. Obviously, the ideal approach would have been to do that research before placing the deposit. I think we definitely learned a lot from the experience, and are now on the right track. 

MrsRobbie5539


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## Momx3 (Aug 18, 2010)

robbie5539 said:


> Thanks everyone for your responses. Queenie, I really appreciate you sharing your story with us. I hate to hear that Toby has had such a hard time, but like the others said, he is a lucky guy to have such caring owners! One similarity in our experience that sticks out to me is that there was a wealth of information on the sire of this litter, but not for the dam.
> 
> After we did considerably more research, my husband and I ended up taking our name off of the list for one of the Ripley puppies. We came across several inconsistencies that made us uncomfortable with the whole situation. Obviously, the ideal approach would have been to do that research before placing the deposit. I think we definitely learned a lot from the experience, and are now on the right track.
> 
> MrsRobbie5539


That was probably a good decision. There are lots of good breeders in FL - if you go to the breeder page you can ask about it and will get a bunch of names.


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## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

This is just sad on so many levels. I too have a poorly bred dog but the biggest fault is mine. I bought her. I don't have regrets I love her TONS, and have learned a lot of the process. 

I just find it so sad that there are people like this breeder that out there. My biggest concern is the average person. When you are thinking 'wow wouldn't it be cool to get a dog for our family' you don't know about parent clubs, clearances etc. You think if it is AKC registered that is a good thing. Robbie, I am glad you were able to back out and decided to pursue a different avenue. I hope you find a fabulous puppy, and I hope you post pictures here.


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## nixietink (Apr 3, 2008)

robbie5539 said:


> Thanks everyone for your responses. Queenie, I really appreciate you sharing your story with us. I hate to hear that Toby has had such a hard time, but like the others said, he is a lucky guy to have such caring owners! One similarity in our experience that sticks out to me is that there was a wealth of information on the sire of this litter, but not for the dam.
> 
> After we did considerably more research, my husband and I ended up taking our name off of the list for one of the Ripley puppies. We came across several inconsistencies that made us uncomfortable with the whole situation. Obviously, the ideal approach would have been to do that research before placing the deposit. I think we definitely learned a lot from the experience, and are now on the right track.
> 
> MrsRobbie5539


Good for you! I think you made a really great choice. You always want to start right in order to give your future companion the best chance at a long, healthy life. 

Let us know if you need any breeder referrals!


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## jackie_hubert (Jun 2, 2010)

There is so much to learn when it comes to picking the right breeder. I too was overwhelmed and I work at a shelter! All this insider information that you just don't know when you think you just wanna get a dog. 

Robbie, I think your decision is an excellent one. Good luck on your puppy search! Stay in touch!


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## CarolinaCasey (Jun 1, 2007)

robbie5539 said:


> Thanks everyone for your responses. Queenie, I really appreciate you sharing your story with us. I hate to hear that Toby has had such a hard time, but like the others said, he is a lucky guy to have such caring owners! One similarity in our experience that sticks out to me is that there was a wealth of information on the sire of this litter, but not for the dam.
> 
> After we did considerably more research, my husband and I ended up taking our name off of the list for one of the Ripley puppies. We came across several inconsistencies that made us uncomfortable with the whole situation. Obviously, the ideal approach would have been to do that research before placing the deposit. I think we definitely learned a lot from the experience, and are now on the right track.
> 
> MrsRobbie5539


I'm so glad that you have found us and were able to find more details about Riley Golden Retrievers.

There really ARE some excellent breeders in Florida. If you need to, start a new thread so we can give you some referrals. A place to start is the Golden Retriever Clubs in FL... I think one is called Everglades GR Club.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

I would encourage anyone who has experienced "difficulties" with this breeder to contact the GRCA (Golden Retriever Club of America). They are representing themselves as "officers" of the club, and the issues with them should be reported.


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