# I might be paranoid, but good thoughts for Guinness please!



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Call the vet and get him in. Any change in eating habits like that means he doesn't feel good somewhere. Sending good thoughts.


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## Tayla's Mom (Apr 20, 2012)

I'm a call the vet type of person and if it's nothing well then that's fine, but every time I've had a "feeling" I've been right.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

I'm for sure going to call the vet when they open in 54 minutes!
I've always believed that for a lab or golden to not eat, or slowly in this case, is a sign that something is definitely wrong.


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Sending hugs and prayers for Guinness.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Jennifer*

Please let us know what the vet says when you call.
I would get him in, also.
The slow eating is concerning


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## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

I hope all is well with Guinness, keeping my fingers crossed.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

10:30 appointment


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## rooroch (Nov 7, 2012)

Let us know what the vet says. I have labs and they always eat unless something is not right. Good luck.


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## CAROLINA MOM (May 12, 2009)

I'm glad you're able to get Guinness into the Vet this morning. 

You know your dog better than anyone, when you see or feel something is off, time to be proactive, especially at age 13.

My thoughts are with you and your boy. 

Hope it's nothing serious.


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

Good luck at the vets.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

I came home a little early to give everyone a chance to go to the bathroom before taking G up to the vet. I always give them a treat for coming back into the house and he turned his nose up at the treat. Glad I made the appointment. Leaving in a few minutes


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Back from the vet.
The didn't find anything obvious. He said that his belly was maybe a little tense but that could be just the way he is.
Guinness had a full blood work up about a month ago that was all normal. We took blood to send to the lab but they are to just hold it right now. He was going to give him a shot of an anti-nausea but then (of course) Guinness eargerly ate the 3 treats they offered him! We decided to hold off on the shot.
I left with instructions to keep an eye on him. If he's no better by tomorrow we will have the lab run the bloodwork and maybe do X-rays as well.
Of course on the way home he threw up! Luckily I was close to home so when he started whining and drooling I pulled over and got him to a nice grassy area. Pretty much just digested food in the vomit.
I called the vet back and let them know. Also, I had some cerenia left over from Bear so asked if I could give Guinness one of those, they were okay with that.
So right now I'm just watching and waiting to see how he will feel tomorrow.
I had to pill him to get the cerenia down since he of course has no interest in food again!


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## amy22 (May 11, 2008)

Aww your poor guy. Hope he feels better soon


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Have his b12 vitamin checked. Also, there a blood test for digestive enzymes that is sent to Texas A&M. I recommend getting that. Dallas Gold can give you more information about that test.

Xrays, ultrasound, mri might be helpful too. He definitely is not feeling right. I would be quite aggressive about a diagnosis.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

We've never done a test specifically for B-12. Unless it is part of the senior panel, than no it has not been checked.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

I'm keeping my fingers crossed for your boy and hope it's just a gastric episode. That said when I read your description of his symptoms I got shivers because they mimic both of my boys who were diagnosed with hemangiosarcoma. IMO, I'd get the blood run immediately (as in this afternoon) to check for, at a minimum, hematocrit levels, check his gums for signs of anemia and dehydration, get the radiographs and if you can get an abdominal ultrasound. I really hope you don't find an enlarged spleen or other abdominal organ. He's at that age where these things just pop up overnight it seems. My first golden was 13 1/2 when it happened and the second was 12 years 8 months. I would discount the taking of the treats- especially if it happened when he was at the vets. Dogs will get a rebound at the vets like that because being around other people gets them excited.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Jennifer1 said:


> We've never done a test specifically for B-12. Unless it is part of the senior panel, than no it has not been checked.


don't worry about the B12 now- there is probably something else going on IMO. Texas A&M has a gastro lab that runs all sorts of panels for digestive enzyme deficiencies but you really need to rule out some other stuff first before going down that route.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

oh, one more thing- blood work can change in a heartbeat it seems. It's one of those labs that shows what is happening in a moment and I've read of several cases where people take their dogs in, get good lab results, then the next month something happens and it changes. I hope this isn't the case with Guiness though.


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## Lennap (Jul 9, 2010)

Fingers crossed that this is just some 24 hour thing that will pass, although 12 hours would be better of course.

I totally udnerstand how one would get freaked with a 13 year old - don't blame you a bit!


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Dallas Gold said:


> I'm keeping my fingers crossed for your boy and hope it's just a gastric episode. That said when I read your description of his symptoms I got shivers because they mimic both of my boys who were diagnosed with hemangiosarcoma. IMO, I'd get the blood run immediately (as in this afternoon) to check for, at a minimum, hematocrit levels, check his gums for signs of anemia and dehydration, get the radiographs and if you can get an abdominal ultrasound. I really hope you don't find an enlarged spleen or other abdominal organ. He's at that age where these things just pop up overnight it seems. My first golden was 13 1/2 when it happened and the second was 12 years 8 months. I would discount the taking of the treats- especially if it happened when he was at the vets. Dogs will get a rebound at the vets like that because being around other people gets them excited.


Actually he already had those exact symptoms almost 1 year ago, and it was a bleeding spleen (luckily benign). He had an emergency splenectomy so that isn't the culprit this time.
At the time of the surgery, the vet gave everything a once over and didn't see any signs of anything on the other organs. That was a year ago though.
Also, his gums were good. That was the first thing I checked this am! Still good at the vet-not pale or tacky


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

He didn't want to eat dinner either 
Unless he is super hungry tomorrow morning, it looks like we go back to the vet. I'm going to want both chest and abdomen x-rays, plus send out the bloodwork.


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Oh dear, I'll be saying a prayer for him.


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## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

What worries me is the tense abdomen, as you described. 
From one day to the next, my Toby started heavy breathing, belly that was a bit tense and swollen, took him to the vet and it turned out to be hemangiosarcoma and we had to let him go four days later. He had a complete geriatric profile done a couple of month prior with all normal, that day I took him to the clinic he was anemic from a bleeding tumor. All can change very quickly. 
Your boy already had the spleen removed, don't want to scare you, he could still have hemangio. I so hope not. 
Insist on x-rays and ultrasound.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

When his spleen was removed it came back as benign hematoma.
I will say I am concerned about hemangiosarcoma somewhere else, although, wouldn't there have been some trace of it in the spleen?
I think the vets major concern at this point is obstruction.
My other thought that just dawned on me is both cats had diahrrea yesterday. Is it possible to have a stomach bug going around? If so, does Guinness's lack of a spleen make him more vulnerable to it? Kenzie is totally fine during all of this.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Praying that tomorrow finds him feeling better. He's not the type to get into something and eat something that could cause an obstruction is he? Stools ok?


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Right now I'm wishing I would have insisted on X-rays today.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

If your other animals have been sick, yes it could be an illness. Be sure to let the vet know about the other animals.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

When I first got him 10 years ago he would eat rocks. I think it was because he was a stray and never knew when his next meal was coming from. I haven't seen him eat a rock in over 9 years. 
He does eat grass from time to time but not enough to cause a problem.
We have had a lot of rain this year for the first time in several years so just about every weed seed around has germinated in the last few months. I guess it's also possible that he ate something toxic.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

His morning stool was fine. He did have some diahrrea after he vomited but that isn't unusual for one to follow the other in my experience


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

Jennifer1 said:


> He didn't want to eat dinner either
> Unless he is super hungry tomorrow morning, it looks like we go back to the vet. I'm going to want both chest and abdomen x-rays, plus send out the bloodwork.


Sorry your Guinness is not feeling so hot. It does sound like blood work and X-rays are in order. Keep us posted. I'm sending cyber hugs to G.


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## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

I hope he has only a stomach bug.
About the hemangio, no this type of cancer progresses really fast. He had the surgery a year ago, no, does not mean he would have had a cancerous nodule in the spleen yet.
Hemangiosarcoma can show up in spleen, liver, heart and even in the skin from what I read. Toby had a couple of nodules in his spleen, one on the liver but the one that killed him was the actively bleeding tumor in his heart. 

I am keeping my fingers crossed that Guinness just has a stomach bug. Yes, let the vet know about the cats being sick.


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## Bob Dylan (Mar 31, 2009)

So sorry Guinness is not feeling well. I will keep him in my prayers.
I hope it is just some bug that has him upset. HUGS!


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

I remember with both Bear and Guinness we could see the enlarged spleen on an X-ray. And with Bear we could see the tumors in her lungs on X-ray also.
Can you see a heart tumor on X-ray? I don't know if my vets have an ultrasound machine-at least I've never had it used on any of my guys


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## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

No, the x-ray only showed an enlarged heart in Toby's case with fluid around the heart. They also did an ultrasound but the emergency vet told me, they just cannot see 360 degrees around the heart to see the tumor but it is there. They did several ultrasounds to be able to remove fluid from around the heart. 
Toby did not have any upset tummy troubles though, no vomiting. He did eat normally up until the first day in the emergency/speciality clinic. Once he came back home, I could only get canned food into him.

I did not mean to panic you, your vet did not seem too concerned, so I am also hoping for just a tummy bug. 
Good luck to Guinness.


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## SandyK (Mar 20, 2011)

Thoughts and prayers for Guinness. I hope he feels better real soon!!!


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

So this morning he was definitely hungry. I gave him about 1/2 of his normal food. He still ate really slow compared to normal and was getting obviously nauseous or something while eating-he started lip smacking and drooling even as he was trying to get more food.
His morning poop was very soft.
Maybe some improvement from yesterday but he still is feeling punky.

I was getting concerned yesterday about heart/lungs because he seemed to be breathing heavily. Not labored exactly but his ribcage was expanding more than normal. Although I do know when feeling sick or in pain it can effect things like respiration and pulse. Also it has been so hot here lately and no AC in the house so I didnt think much of it at first. His breathing seems much more normal today.

I will call the vet when they open and see what to do. I'm leaning towards getting the blood run just to make sure there were no big red flags.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Jennifer*

Jennifer

I don't want to scare you, but definitely take Guiness to the vet.
I think the vet might want to do a chest and stomach xray and also blood test.
Seeing the diaphragm move in and out, reminds me of my Smooch. 
She also didn't want to eat as much and did the lip smacking.
Smooch had only 10% of her lung function and was having trouble breathing. I couldn't tell -she wasn't gasping.
They thought Smooch had hemangiosarcoma or lymphoma.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Just catching up. I hope you get answers today. At his age I'm one of those dog moms who is very proactive and throws the gambit trying to chase down a diagnosis. I'll be thinking of you two today. 


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## Lennap (Jul 9, 2010)

Perhaps I missed it, but what are you feeding him? Maybe his normal food is too much for his tummy right now. Have you considered chicken and rice? Or rice prepared in chicken broth?


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## mainegirl (May 2, 2005)

have them check his teeth just incase
beth, moose and angel


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## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

I thought you had blood work done already? I am sorry if I missed that. 
Yes, definitely include a full blood work panel, might want to add a urinalysis for good measure. 
I hope Guinness will be his old self soon, good luck.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Karen519 said:


> Jennifer
> 
> I don't want to scare you, but definitely take Guiness to the vet.
> I think the vet might want to do a chest and stomach xray and also blood test.
> ...


I have seen both Guinness and one of my cats struggle to breathe. I could very well be that, but if so it wasn't as obvious. To me this looked more like what I do if I'm feeling nauseous to keep from vomiting, deep slow breaths.
They took blood yesterday when we were there but sent it to the lab as a "hold". So the lab shouldn't run it until they get the go ahead from us.
I just called the vet and none of the vets are in yet. I talked to one of the techs and am waiting for a call back from a vet.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Lennap said:


> Perhaps I missed it, but what are you feeding him? Maybe his normal food is too much for his tummy right now. Have you considered chicken and rice? Or rice prepared in chicken broth?
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


He is currently on Fromm Chicken ala veg. The bag is half gone, so not a new bag.
Yesterday he didn't want anything at all. This morning it seemed like he was hungry but was nauseous at the same time


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

mainegirl said:


> have them check his teeth just incase
> beth, moose and angel


They gave his mouth a thorough once over while we were there yesterday. It was the first thing I checked at home also.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

cgriffin said:


> I thought you had blood work done already? I am sorry if I missed that.
> Yes, definitely include a full blood work panel, might want to add a urinalysis for good measure.
> I hope Guinness will be his old self soon, good luck.


We took blood yesterday but sent it to the lab as a "hold" sample. They won't run it until we tell them to. Good idea about the urinalysis.

He did have bloodwork and urinalysis done about 1 month ago, which was normal, so it's just a matter of if something strange has come up.


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## KeaColorado (Jan 2, 2013)

I am just now seeing this, I'm thinking of you guys and hoping you get some answers soon.


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## Dexter12 (Feb 10, 2012)

Keeping Guinness in my thoughts. I hope that the vet can find the source of him stomach upset soon.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

So, I'm back at the vet. We are going to do chest and abdominal X-rays. We are going to do an in house istat for bloodwork (just CBC basically) and have the lab run the hold blood.

I think he definitely feels better than yesterday but still not great.

Unfortunately I'm not a super big fan of this vet. My clinic has 5 vets, the rest I love. This one is good, just poor bedside manner. Her first comment to me was "he's 13, how much do we want to explore this?" I told her diagnosis and treating are 2 different things, I just want to find out what is going on.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Since we didn't actually have an appointment we are waiting in one of the exam rooms. They are squeezing us in whenever there is a break.
So far x-rays are done, just waiting for the vet to look at them and come talk to me


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

You are so right to press for a diagnosis...that doesn't have an age limit. You NEED TO KNOW what it is. Then you can figure out how to deal with it. Totally absurd to not do that and just let a dog waste away because he's 13. He might need just some vitamins or a special diet. Ugh...I can see why you don't like her.


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## CStrong73 (Jun 11, 2012)

Penny's Mom said:


> You are so right to press for a diagnosis...that doesn't have an age limit. You NEED TO KNOW what it is. Then you can figure out how to deal with it. Totally absurd to not do that and just let a dog waste away because he's 13. He might need just some vitamins or a special diet. Ugh...I can see why you don't like her.


 
Exactly! At least know what you're dealing with so you can make an INFORMED decision.


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Agree with Penny's Mom, CS Strong and you! That vet isn't worth her salt if she doesn't want to pursue a diagnosis because of his age! 

Thinking of you both right now!


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

So, everything so far looks good.
Heart and lungs looked really good
Nothing strange in the abdomen either.
His i-stat all came out normal. PCV was 39. 1 month ago it was 40. I'll be curious to see what it was yesterday. But really no difference between 39& 40
No signs of anything wrong.
I was sent home with carafate, pepsid, & mirtazapine (anti-nausea & appetite stimulents)
I was also told to keep him on a bland diet through the weekend.
Still waiting for the full blood panel from the lab, should get results tomorrow
Right now we are leaning towards some sort of gastritis.
If he's not 100% by Tuesday (because of the holiday), then we look into more diagnositics.
Obviously if he gets worse we will head back to vet, either mine or ER vet.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Jennifer*

Jennifer

So glad the xrays were clear! That is wonderful news!


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

Thank goodness for good news... although now you're left wondering what in the world was going on... But I hope it's just an upset tummy.


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## Bob Dylan (Mar 31, 2009)

That report sounds great. Enjoy your Holiday! Thanks for the update!


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Relief! Plus I'm sending you wishes that he will recover completely over the weekend. Hopefully it's just a colitis/gastric episode. Thank you for updating!


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## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

Thanks for the update. I am glad that all looks good so far.
Keeping my fingers crossed for Guinness.


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## Lennap (Jul 9, 2010)

Dallas Gold said:


> Relief! Plus I'm sending you wishes that he will recover completely over the weekend. Hopefully it's just a colitis/gastric episode. Thank you for updating!


 
Double ditto! Praying all goes well this weekend.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Thanks everyone
The bloodwork came back today as well (it was sent yesterday but we didn't tell them to run it until today)
Also totally normal.
Hopefully it is just a case of gastritis! Maybe without a spleen it just hit him harder. I don't think in my 10 years of owning him he's had more than passing diarrhea once or twice? Definitely never turned down food! (other than the bleeding speen)


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Well Kenzie threw up twice in the middle of the night. Undigested food.
Her energy levels are good.
I guess I'll put her onto the bland diet as well.

They are on Fromm food. As far as I know there hasn't been any issues with Fromm. The bag is half empty. Just as a precaution I'm tempted to toss it and get something new. It could be some sort of bug also that they are passing around.
Any suggestions?
I'll call the vet when they open today to let them know what's going on.
I'll also keep an eye on Kenzie to make sure it is just a stomach issue. She's never been one to eat thing she shouldn't but I have been expanding her freedoms this last week.

On the bright side Guinness seems to be feeling a little better and ate all of his chicken and rice last night and seems hungry this morning!


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I'm beginning to wonder about Fromm. Penny had been on it for about a year and then she started with the soft poo. Then not eating. Then.... I don't know.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

The good news is Guinness definitely has his appetite back.
I just fed them their breakfast of boiled hamburger and rice. G gobbled his up and came looking for more! Mirtazapine/cerenia combo seems to be working!
Kenzie ate all of hers, a little slow but not too bad. Hopefully this is just a bug and it won't make her feel as punky as it did Guinness. She is only 1.5yrs vs his 13 yrs so she should be able to shake it off.


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## Bob Dylan (Mar 31, 2009)

Great news this morning! I am so glad they are both eating, especially beef and rice. My crew love beef and rice, give them Hugs!


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

Dinner was successful again!
More rice and boiled hamburger for both dogs.
No one got sick during the day and both had good appetites tonight!
Plus both had enough energy to have a good fence bark at a visiting dog next door.
G had a nice solid poop as well.
I will probably do a 1/2 & 1/2 bland/kibble for Kenzie tomorrow morning and then back to normal kibble for her. I want to keep Guinness on the bland for a bit longer. The vet suggested through the weekend.
I'm hopeful this is just a stomach bug that hit 13yr old Guinness harder than 1.5yr old Kenzie and hopefully it is behind us now!


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

It sure sounds like a bug that hit your pack! I'm glad there is improvement!


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## Belle's Mom (Jan 24, 2007)

I agree - sounds like a stomach bug. Hoping everyone continues to fell better over the long weekend.


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Thanks goodness. Love a hearty appetite and solid poop! jumping for joy here!


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## Doug (Jul 17, 2010)

A golden or lab that is off his or her food definitely is a worrying sign indeed as it is so rare but i am so pleased to hear that both of them are doing a lot better!!


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