# PenPen's trials and tribulations



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

thanks for starting this thread! It makes it so much easier to check in and see how Penny is doing.
A tiny correction...it's vitamin B12. 
I am hoping that the B12 does her some good. It's wonderful for Tiny.
Is there a reason that the holistic vet suggested chicken? A lot of dogs prefer white fish, and it's the best thing in the world for their livers. Dr. Jean Dodds has written about it, and has a liver diet that involves white fish, sweet potatoes, and veggies.
My Tiny won't touch sweet potatoes. Or white potatoes.


----------



## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

Enjoy your girl  Sounds like the dunes will be fun.

Sending good luck for the next vet exam.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I made the correction to B12. We don't know enough about this yet to question why chicken. She said chicken or turkey. 

I'm being helicopter mom...monitoring her every few minutes: she's panting a lot; she looks sad; she looks tired; she looks old. Then the neighbor comes over to visit with Penny's Dad on the driveway and she's up and barking, running out to greet him.

I tried to get her to follow me to the front bedroom to show her the big bed was available to her. She wouldn't come. What does that mean? So I go to her to encourage her. Play bow...big bark and off to play keep away.  Finally I got her collar and she followed that. Happily napping on the bed and watching the neighborhood out the window.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Off to a rough start today. Se woke me up to go out. I offered her some chicken, some toast, a few pieces of kibble but she turned away. It's so sad that she won't eat. I left her plate on the floor but she has no interest.

I'm going to call the vet first thing and get the ultra sound ordered. Our vet doesn't do it; we have to go somewhere else.

I really need to know what is going on inside. I hate to see her suffer like this...she seems to be unhappy and withdrawn. I think she's dying. And it breaks my heart.


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Penny*



Penny's Mom said:


> Off to a rough start today. Se woke me up to go out. I offered her some chicken, some toast, a few pieces of kibble but she turned away. It's so sad that she won't eat. I left her plate on the floor but she has no interest.
> 
> I'm going to call the vet first thing and get the ultra sound ordered. Our vet doesn't do it; we have to go somewhere else.
> 
> I really need to know what is going on inside. I hate to see her suffer like this...she seems to be unhappy and withdrawn. I think she's dying. And it breaks my heart.


I am praying hard for Penny and you!


----------



## Pixie (Jun 13, 2012)

I hope Penny is just going to a down phase and that soon she will be running up the hill again! I am sure mum will be there to give a push here and there 

Sending you good thoughts


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Praying for Penny and you all. I agree time for the ultrasound and finding out what's going on.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I finally got Penny to eat some cheese and some crackers with peanut butter. But she's fairly zoned out, on the bed in the front bedroom. No wag of the tail when I go pet here. She has an appointment for Friday morning at a full service hospital, complete diagnostic tools. If it's cancer, which I think it is, we will let her go to the bridge. This clinic is almost a satellite of Mich State U. We can discuss the enzymes and B12 is ultra sound doesn't show anything. 

We had decided years ago, that if it came to this, we would enjoy her. Let nature take its course and give her a peaceful end. It breaks my heart, can't stop crying. But it's hurts as much to see her suffer. She has always been such a delightful brat, a bright light, my heart. She deserves better than this.


----------



## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

You are so right, our faithful friends/kids deserve so much better. My heart is aching for you and your Penny, I know how you feel. 
Hugs to Penny.


----------



## CAROLINA MOM (May 12, 2009)

My thoughts and prayers are with you and sweet Penny.


----------



## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

I'm so sorry to hear she's not eating totally well. I've been there. Some things that worked for Tesia: tuna (she LOVED - it didn't love her as much, but maybe it wouldn't affect Penny the same way); liverwurst; wet dog food (Fromm Gold Duck was a fave); rice mixed with unsweetened yogurt... I can't think of others right now. I hope some of these help..


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

A friend gave me a can of Blue Buffalo salmon. She just ate about 1/3 cup of that. Turned her nose away from the tuna this morning. Usually she comes running like a cat when she hears the can opener. 

I'm going to try small meals, anything she will eat, every couple of hours. I don't want her empty and then try to stuff her.


----------



## Alaska7133 (May 26, 2011)

I had luck with chicken broth poured on food. I also had luck with Pedigree canned food. Sometimes if you hand feed it seems to warm them up to eating. Seemed like strong smelling food was interesting to them. I also found several very short walks a day helped, even if it's just to the mailbox and back. The good news is they live in the moment and enjoy everyday for what it is.

So sorry to read about Penny. My Penny passed in 2008 and I still miss her everyday. I hope that you enjoy your time and think only good thoughts.


----------



## Pixie (Jun 13, 2012)

Does miss Penny also needs uncle Danny to share some appetizing photos in here? I am pretty sure he would be happy to help 

I remember somedoby saying that chicken parmizanne was always a success no matter what!

Hope Penny has a better appetite soon


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Laughing. I remember the appetizing pictures. Almost made ME go off my diet. I hae some parm cheese. I'll try grating some oer her chicken. 

We had kind of a rough night. For the first time the frequency has changed. She had to go out 3 times between midnight and 6. Each time she had a poo (attempt at least) accompanied with a loud gas noise. Poor girl would look over her shoulder at me, as if to ask "What is happening, Mom" Pr maybe she thought I was making the noise.

Thankfully her panting and pacing wakes me up.


----------



## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

I'm sorry about Penny's current trials and tribulations and am glad you are getting the U/S done. 

It is very possible, with dogs that have digestive or pancreatic enzyme insufficieny (and your description of her symptoms gives me the non-expert impression she has one or more deficiencies there) that the various foods you are giving her are causing the increased gas and aggravating the soft stool/diarrhea issues. I speak solely from my experience with Toby. We must be extremely careful in what we feed him, including treats, because any new food can cause an episode that sends him sliding exactly in the manner you describe. We are giving him a prescription kibble that is working for him. 

Also, our Barkley went to a holistic acupuncture vet for his hip and allergy issues and those herbs, well, let me just say some of them caused major issues with him- especially gas! I can't even tell you which ones because the bottles were written in Chinese! He also turned his nose up on a few so we ended up stopping them. They were causing us more grief than benefitting him. 

Does your holistic vet do any targeted B12 injections? That might be a possibility for Penny. Toby's acupuncture vet does and since we started them 2 months ago his weight normalized, after years of being very underweight. She targets the areas on his body with injections that will benefit his digestive system, areas that I could never inject! I give him a regular cobalamin injection once a month and she gives that one once a month so he gets 2 injections monthly. 

Please keep us posted on what the U/S sounds and I hope the lymph node is resolved. Toby also had one of those deep in his abdomen, needle biopsied as reactive. We lived with it for 2 years always wondering in the back of our minds and eventually it resolved, about the time we got his digestive enzyme issues under control, only to find a splenetic nodule, which is a whole different story- it resolved in about 8 months.


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I'm so sorry that she's not doing well. I hope you get some good news on Friday.
It's so frustrating when they won't eat. One thing that has really helped with Tiny is going to 3 or 4 smaller meals per day, and not offering the same thing any 2 consecutive days, let alone 2 consecutive meals. 
Some of the things Tiny will usually eat are not the best thing for her, but they have to eat. She takes metronidazole every day (Penny should, too, if you're experimenting with foods) so at least her poops aren't too bad. 
Some of the things we've had with varying degrees of success:
String cheese, laughing cow cheese, cream cheese, squirt can cheese (right in her mouth!)
Tuna, canned salmon, canned sardines, baked fish of all kinds
Hot dogs, bologna, thin sliced deli meats
Roasted chicken or turkey
Burgers, pork chops, any form of red meat (surprisingly, among her least favorites)
Tomatoes, bananas, pieces of apples
Chicken in a biscuit crackers, goldfish crackers, nilla wafers
Natural balance rolled dog food
Fresh Pet refrigerated pet food
Canned cat food
Canned green tripe

Sending many prayers and hugs your way. I know how hard it is.


----------



## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Oh, and if your vet doesn't want to use Flagyl, we switched successfully to Tylan powder for stool firming. Toby's on a maintenance dose now, which for his weight is 1/8 tsp with each meal. Supposedly it is bitter and dogs don't like the taste, but we are lucky- he eats it on top of his kibble and Yogi licks the bowl of any residue if I don't pick it up fast enough. Tylan powder is typically used for chickens so it's an off label use for dogs, but Texas A&M is recommending it for some of the dogs with IBD issues that test through their lab.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I would love to stick with what the vet said to feed her. Have a fridge full of steamed chicken breast and sweet potatoes. She ate 3 meals and then quit. In all of my research I haven't come across any advice as to what to do when they refuse to eat.

Tonight I put out some chicken, some blue buffalo with some egg beaters. She took a couple of bites and walked away. I'm throwing out more food than she is eating. 

Today I hand feed some scrambled egg and cheese. About 5 bites and then she quit. Wouldn't even look at it. later one she did finish it up. She also ate some plain crackers. Gave her a marrow bone and she just looked at it. This from the dog who would threaten to attack if you even LOOKED at her marrow bone. I'll try some pumpkin tomorrow.

She hasn't had any more than a couple of drops of poo today...all her squats were stinky gas. No vomiting so I don't think there's a blockage. She wasn't as restless and didn't pant as much today. My guess is that she felt a bit better today.

Does anyone know if IBS resolves itself? Do flares just come and then just go?

She just refused the cracker/pb with the meds in it. That's a new one. I am so deparate to take care of her...she just won't let me. I feel so bad. Don't know if I should just let her starve or keep trying. She didn't eat more than a bite of dinner. I can actually feel her neck bones now. :-(((


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

keep trying. I, too, throw out more than Tiny will eat.
Do you have access to some mild white fish, like cod? For some reason Tiny will eat that when pretty much all else fails.
I'm sorry. It's so hard.


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Penny*



Penny's Mom said:


> Laughing. I remember the appetizing pictures. Almost made ME go off my diet. I hae some parm cheese. I'll try grating some oer her chicken.
> 
> We had kind of a rough night. For the first time the frequency has changed. She had to go out 3 times between midnight and 6. Each time she had a poo (attempt at least) accompanied with a loud gas noise. Poor girl would look over her shoulder at me, as if to ask "What is happening, Mom" Pr maybe she thought I was making the noise.
> 
> Thankfully her panting and pacing wakes me up.


Praying for Penny and you. It is so hard when they aren't feeling well and won't eat.


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Ibs*

I googled IBS in Dogs.
You asked if it can come and go:

Canine Inflammatory Bowel Disease IBD - Chronic Diarrhea and Vomiting in Your Dog

When things irritate the lining of your pet's intestine, they cause food to move through it faster. With time, this irritation causes the lining to thicken and become inflamed. Blood and tissue cells that normally fight bacteria and other invaders, accumulate within the lining of the inflamed intestines causing cramping, pain, colic, diarrhea and distress. These fragile intestines are more likely to bleed and they allow unhealthy intestinal organisms to proliferate and displace the healthy ones. These changes also make it harder for your pet to absorb nutrients from its food. When the beginning portions of the intestine are involved, the pet may also vomit or loose its appetite. When the final portions of the intestine are involved, the stool is loose, frequent, watery and sticky with mucus. Bright blood is often present when the lower intestine is involved (colitis).

*These problems can be occasional or continuous. When they are continuous, pets often loose weight. It is also common for dogs with this condition to eat or chew on unusual items (pica) and it can be difficult to decide if pica is the cause or result of the problem. *Flatulence is also a common problem and so is a dull hair coat and heavy shed. When the lower intestine or colon is inflamed, the pet may strain and defecate more frequent, mucous-covered, stools. 

Some types of IBD are genetic and are associated with certain breeds. The lymphocytic/plasmacytic form is one of these. It is most common in German Shepherd and Shar Pei dogs. Basenjis have their own form of the disease called immuno-proliferative IBD. Boxers suffer from a form called histiocytic ulcerative colitis while Irish setters have a wheat gluten-sensitive form of the disease.

The second most common form of IBD is Eosinophilic IBD. It tends to be more severe than the lymphocytic form, but it often gets better when diet changes are made. Eosinophils are blood cells involved in allergies - so food allergies are a suspected cause.


----------



## goldensrbest (Dec 20, 2007)

I hope you don't mind me asking, but is she drinking water?


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Drinking a normal amount of water.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

A quiet night. She didn't ask to go out at all. I'm worried that her quietness means something bad has happened inside her. Any yet if it had, wouldn't she be MORE restless, more indication of pain or infection? Or could it be that this episode is fading off on it's own. Still no appetite...turned down canned cat food this morning. Had a couple of bites of my scrambled eggs. She seemed to want to play...have me chase her but then she didn't. Penny is still "in there". Tomorrow can't come soon enough for me.


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Penny*

Praying for Penny and you.


----------



## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

I am so, so feeling your heartbreak right now. When Tesia was not eating, my whole day and thought process was about what could I try, what might she eat? If she ate, I had a good day. If she didn't, I was so sad.

For the meds - have you tried Pill Pockets? Tesia loved them for a long time (until she didn't). Hickory and chicken flavours were hits. Little Miss Shala goes NUTS for the chicken ones - didn't even notice they had UTI antibiotics in them.

Hand feeding - you are doing. I found that helped. Smooth foods that she could lick were helpful (that's where the Fromm Gold wet food was good - it is very smooth, and I would take the chill off in the micro).

My vet said, if she will eat Dr. Ballard's, give it to her. Both he (the oncologist) and my own vet said, don't worry about quality - if they'll eat the equivilent of McDonald's, it's better than not eating. 

There is also a food that is a transition from mother's milk to solid food. Can't remember the name, but any dog food store will have it. Small tins, very smooth and easy on tummies. Tesia ate that for a while, too. 

I had plates and containers full of foods in my fridge that I threw out. Definitely more than she ate, too. Chicken, ground beef, fish - all would be good for a meal or two - and then not. 

Sending positive thoughts for Penny..


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Sounds like we all go thru the same things. Last night I mixed her crumbled chicken with bread crumbs, egg and onion. Penny's Dad and I had chicken burgers. All the food I'm making is people safe until we give her some. 

I leave her food out for a couple of hours...this morning is cat food, wet, and scrambled eggs. If she doesn't eat some, I throw it out. Don't want it to spoil in the bowl. Also washing her bowl with very hot water between meals.

I think I'll try some of her kibble with chicken broth to make it 'lick-able". That can stay out longer.

We had a fairly large poo just now...still very pudding-like. I was beginning to wonder if anything more would EVER come out. So glad to see things are moving thru even if I don't like the end result. Funny how we are grateful for poo! 

She seems much more comfortable today. She even wagged her tail a bit when I looked at her. Makes my heart sing!


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

The biggest thing for Tiny seems to be hand feeding her from the kitchen table while we are eating. Is that something Penny might like?

edit to add...my dogs aren't allowed anywhere near the table while we are eating, so this is a BIG deal for her!


----------



## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Penny's Mom said:


> Sounds like we all go thru the same things. Last night I mixed her crumbled chicken with bread crumbs, egg and* onion*. Penny's Dad and I had chicken burgers. All the food I'm making is people safe until we give her some.
> 
> I leave her food out for a couple of hours...this morning is cat food, wet, and scrambled eggs. If she doesn't eat some, I throw it out. Don't want it to spoil in the bowl. Also washing her bowl with very hot water between meals.
> 
> ...


Onions? Oh nooooooo. Onions are dangerous for dogs:


> Each Layer Can Poison Your Pets
> Onions
> Many people love onions, and there are plenty of foods that we enjoy that contain them. As always, we must remember that what is great and tasty for us can be extremely harmful for our pets.
> 
> ...


source:Pets and Onions



> *If you suspect your pet has consumed some type of onion, call your veterinarian immediately.*


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Yes, onions are toxic to dogs. Hopefully she didn't have much. Try some canned tripe.... very good for the GI system and often something they'll eat when they aren't interested in anything else. We call it doggy crack in our house.


----------



## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

Copper never "went off his feed", so no advice there.

He did have both VS and a stroke and he couldn't "find the ground" with his front feet both times. VS caused a permanent head tilt, but he coped well.

I hope Penny's appointment goes well and you get more good time together.

My dang panic button is unfortunately on speed dial even now.


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Penny*

Hoping Penny is doing better.


----------



## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

Just found this thread, hope you guys are enjoying your time at the sand dunes today.

I am surprised at the amount of food the vet recommended. Her total of 12oz of chicken and one sweet potato would be a snack for Tucker, no surprise she is losing so much weight. Home cooking is about 70% water vs kibble at about 10% so a big volume difference.

Ask the vet about Mirtazapine, seriously. That simple little pill turns them into eating machines. She really needs to get the weight back on. Try the 5 minute oatmeal prepared and cooled to room temp for the diarrhea, that is what worked for Tucker when other foods would not.

Getting the food into her would help a whole lot with her energy. No food, no energy. Curing the diarrhea is the other big one for weight gain. Multiple small meals per day would help.

Just my 2 cents of course, what worked for us.

Wishing your girl well, I now how worried you must be.


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

thinking of you guys today and hoping for good news.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

NO CANCER!!! That's the good news. Xray showed lots of gas but no masses or tumors; no obstructions...just normal innerds.

Next they drew blood. One sample will be sent to A&M (their standard procedure in this, didn't have to ask for it) and another sample to check liver, kidney, pancreatic levels. Everything checked out within normal range, altho on the lower side for some. She showed low on calcium and 2 things...sorry don't remember those...but that was consistent with malnutrition. She attributed yesterday's off gait to low calcium. We are trying a 3 week course of Prednisone and she got a B12 injection. She didn't want to change multiple things so just the pred for now and see how she does, gradually reducing the dose over 3 weeks. She talked about b12 as an ongoing possibility for her.

Her diet is to be bland but more important to get her to eat. She ate some chicken when we got home. Turned down the rice. But funny that when I dropped a bit of rice on the kitchen floor she cleaned it up. Maybe I should just drop food from the cutting board. 

We're all so tired...but at least I don't have to fear that she is dying of cancer. And the pred should take care of the IBD. 

Regarding the onions: I mixed them in for Penny's dad and me. I made patties to use up the crumbled chicken. Sorry for the confusion.


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

YAY!!! The canned tripe is still a good one to get her eating and some good healthy cals in her. The pred should also help with appetite.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Where do I get canned tripe? Pet store?

And is it considered a bland food?


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Not at Petsmart/Co but if there are smaller boutique shops they would probably have it. It stinks to high heaven but is very good for their GI system. If I were you, I'd start out with just a dab on whatever you feed.


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Here's what I use when I can't find fresh Petkind Tripett | Original Formula Green Beef Tripe. Worse case, you can order on line at chewy.com or even at amazon. Remember this is GREEN tripe not the bleached kind you can find at the grocery... it is of no value. BUT... if you're really adventurous and have a slaughter house nearby you may be able to get fresh really cheap. You'd probably want them to grind it for you at least until she is better and might want a chewing adventure. ; )


----------



## goldensrbest (Dec 20, 2007)

I am truly happy for you,and penny, I sure thought it was cancer, great news!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Thanks. I'll have a look. We're pretty basic out here in the boonies. Maybe online.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

What would you recommend from this place? And is this a good supplier or a bad one?
Tripett Canned Dog Food


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

I've ordered from them a long time ago. I'd compare their shipping with chewy.com and amazon. I'd order the plain tripe (green can) ... not the ones with alot of other stuff


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Thanks. I've ordered from Chewy before. I'll go with them.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Got free shipping from Amazon.


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

wooooo hoooooo what great news! I hope the prednisone and the B12 will help her to feel better quickly. Both should be appetite stimulants.


----------



## CAROLINA MOM (May 12, 2009)

Yay! What wonderful words to hear, no cancer.

Hope Penny's results are good. 

My thoughts and prayers are with you and your girl.


----------



## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Keep us posted on the test results. I hope A&M runs the batches of tests soon so you have answers.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

hotel: only 1 injection for now. She wants the prednisone to be a trial on it's own. Not doing too many things at once; then not knowing which one worked.

Anne: She said the blood would go out Monday with results by the end of the week.

I managed to get some dinner in her. She is so goofy...wouldn't eat off a plate (baby food bananas) but would lick off my finger or a spoon. Wouldn't eat green beans, her favorite but would take them off a fork. Wouldn't touch the chicken/rice until I took the bowl to the cutting board. Then she was right by my side so I hand fed her. She has ALWAYS loved handouts from the cutting board. When I accidentally dropped some rice on the floor she cleaned it up. Then she ate from the bowl. 

She's eaten more in the last 60 minutes than she has in the last 3 days. It was a struggle to get the pred in...apparently peanut butter on crackers is not in favor anymore.

Hoping this is the start of her recovery. Another dog on the horse forum had the same thing. Got the pred and turned right around, compete recovery and back to normal food. Crossing fingers.


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Keep you eyes peeled... pred makes them want to eat everything in sight. I bet she'll eating well soon.


----------



## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

I hope the prednisone makes her feel goooooood!


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

She ate most of my scrambled eggs! Getting the pred in was a struggle. I finally pried her mouth open, shoved the peanut butter/banana ball in and held her chin up. She looked a bit offended and insulted but the pills went down. Yay!


----------



## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

I have just been catching up and am so happy to read these updates!! SO happy! What a huge relief there is no cancer. I know GI issues can be so hard. It sounds like the pred is helping already. Big hugs to you both!


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Yes, only 2 doses and she's cleaning up 'rejects' from various places: a couple of pieces of kibble I left on the floor in the foyer; a cracker I left on one of the beds.

I'm finally able to relax a little...enjoying sewing on a blouse I started a long time ago. Peaceful house today. PTL


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

welcome to my world of pill giving :doh:

Glad to hear she ate for you this morning!




Penny's Mom said:


> She ate most of my scrambled eggs! Getting the pred in was a struggle. I finally pried her mouth open, shoved the peanut butter/banana ball in and held her chin up. She looked a bit offended and insulted but the pills went down. Yay!


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

A dubious honor. 



hotel4dogs said:


> welcome to my world of pill giving :doh:


----------



## Lennap (Jul 9, 2010)

:--happy::--happy:Absolutely fabulous news! WOOHOO!:--happy::--happy:


----------



## PrincessDi (Jun 8, 2009)

Very glad to read that Penny is eating for you now, but I know how difficult it can be to get the pills into them. Keeping your beautiful Penny in our thoughts that the medicine does the trick to get her feeling better.


----------



## FAL guy (Jun 11, 2012)

Penny's symptoms are really very much like Red's when he developed Pancreatitis. It is a resut of too much fat in a dogs diet. We had no idea when Red went to visit his Grandmother (my mother) weekly she was feeding him nothing but 80/20 hamburger meat. She almost killed him.

Penny is such a beatiful dog with a great face. I am believing she is going to turn around and have many healthy years to share with you and your family.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I'm pretty sure pancreatitis has been ruled out by the blood work. She's had every test imaginable. lol And isn't fed fatty things. It's just the two of us so we know nobody slipped her anything. I appreciate your in put and SO GLAD Red is okay.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Now that Penny seems to be on the mend, is it reasonable to expect that she will return to an all kibble diet? She's quite enamored of chicken and the other 'people' food we've been giving her. 

This morning I put two eggs on her kibble...cooked eggs. She ate the eggs and some of the kibble. Tonight I will add chicken to the kibble. She's not eating more than 1/2 cup of kibble a day and it's only by accident that she gets some with a mouthful of something else.

She's eager for treats and anything from the cutting board.

I'm worried about her milking this for nothing BUT people food...which doesn't have the nutrition she needs.

She feels much better altho she seems a bit tired. But she spent a couple of hours at the barn with me and then loped to the car. She definitely feels better despite pudding poo yesterday...in the riding ring while I was riding. lol

Advice?


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Penny*



Penny's Mom said:


> Now that Penny seems to be on the mend, is it reasonable to expect that she will return to an all kibble diet? She's quite enamored of chicken and the other 'people' food we've been giving her.
> 
> This morning I put two eggs on her kibble...cooked eggs. She ate the eggs and some of the kibble. Tonight I will add chicken to the kibble. She's not eating more than 1/2 cup of kibble a day and it's only by accident that she gets some with a mouthful of something else.
> 
> ...


I would feed Penny anything she loves to eat!


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

She just polished off 1/2 chicken breast, some rice and peas, some green beans and some kibble along with it. Haven't seen any poo today. She may have done it at the barn this morning or this afternoon.


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Adding some of the tripe to her kibble may get her back mostly on kibble. However, I'm a strong believer that a little human food is good for them. Our crew routinely gets a little of the meat we have for dinner, fruits and veggies. Their base diet though is kibble and The Honest Kitchen with tripe or sardines for a topping.


----------



## coppers-mom (Jan 9, 2009)

"Offended and insulted"
I can just imagine the look you got, but sure am glad Penny is feeling better.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

The tripe is on it's way!


----------



## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

I had the same worries and wanted to get Tesia back eating kibble. But it was not to be - so I went with wet dog food, which she was better about. Sometimes I snuck in some kibble, too. But at least I knew she was getting balanced nutrition.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I'm probably in the same boat. I don't see her giving up the good stuff anytime soon. She ate her fill this morning so I picked up her bowl and washed it out. We're dealing with food that can spoil so I want to be careful about that. 

Tonight I'll give her the other half of the chicken breast and wet the kibble with warm water. I'm hoping to get back to "easy" but if not...will do what needs doing. She is getting more interested in what we're doing. Penny's Dad put his shoes on and she came out to see what exciting thing that would bring! So wonderful to have her involving herself again.


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Have you tried Natural Balance retriever rolls dog food? Tiny will often eat that, even when she won't eat much else. It's expensive, but, it is dog food and I agree with you about the proper nutrition.
If I had known Tiny would live this long after the diagnosis of liver failure, I would have been a lot more likely to insist she eat more dog food and less people food.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I didn't really realize the importance of the nutritional aspect of dog food.

Vet said that her off gaited walk was probably due to a calcium deficiency. I'm giving her cottage cheese with her kibble once a day.

btw, we had a 'better' poo this morning. Still soft but was able to pick it up...not as watery. I hang my hat on ANY progress!


----------



## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

Once you get the A&M labwork back you'll have a better idea of what to do and if Penny has IBD. IBD dogs require special care in their diets and people food is generally discouraged as causing more inflammtion and distress in their colons.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Anything will be worth it not to go thru this again!


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

A lot of people don't, and a lot of misinformation about what's an appropriate diet for dogs proliferates on the internet. 
Glad to hear she's on the mend!




Penny's Mom said:


> I didn't really realize the importance of the nutritional aspect of dog food.
> 
> Vet said that her off gaited walk was probably due to a calcium deficiency. I'm giving her cottage cheese with her kibble once a day.
> 
> btw, we had a 'better' poo this morning. Still soft but was able to pick it up...not as watery. I hang my hat on ANY progress!


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Generally speaking, how is tripe fed? As a total dog food? A topping? Half and half? She has started to eat some kibble when it's softened in water and with chicken or cottage cheese added. 

I left a scoop of dry in her bowl over night and there was some 'missing' this morning. She's always been a nighttime eater.


----------



## goldensrbest (Dec 20, 2007)

Fresh pet is also a good ,fresh pet food.


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

I use tripe as a topping. The canned tripe is a supplemental food... not a complete diet. However, I've read that many in Europe feed fresh tripe as a total diet. It is full of important enzymes and actually very good for dogs with sensitive GI systems.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Thanks. Haven't received it yet...any day now. She's doing pretty good with scrambled eggs in the morning and cottage cheese at night. Still pudding poo. :-( But she feels and acts tons better!


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

After a pretty scary start to the day, Penny ended on a high note. She actually asked for some supper and ate all of it. She's definitely hooked on the 'doggie crack'!

I'm sorry to be such a panicky mom. I comforted that I'm not alone when it comes to our Goldens.


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Yay Penny!!!!! So glad that she's doing better, and likes the tripe. Hope it helps settle her GI system and firm up those poos.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Good news! Better Poop!!! She's on the mend. She's eating well, loves her tripe top dressing. She's engaging with us again, saw some wag of the tail...in general coming back to her old self. 

We're leaving tomorrow for a week camping at the sand dunes. I will be off line for probably the whole time...limited wifi access and I don't have one of those phones. Looking forward to lots of walks on the beach, altho I'm told water temp is about 60 degrees. What a blessing that we have Our Penny not only still with us but healthy enough to go.

Grooming and bath today...she won't like that but camping is close quarters to share with a stinky dog! lol

Thank you all so much for your wisdom, your advice and suggestions, your sympathy and hand holding. All of that put together is why Penny got the help she needed and why she's doing so well. 

You all are a great bunch of FRIENDS of the Golden Retriever!!!! And their parents. ;-)

Still waiting on the tests results, Anne.


----------



## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

I am so glad to hear that Penny is eating and returning to her waggy and happy self 
Have fun on your camping trip


----------



## Goldens R Great (Aug 19, 2010)

I am so happy to read Penny is doing better! That is great news.

Have a wonderful vacation!


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

So glad to hear good Penny news. My super cautious self says to try to monitor her while camping and don't let her over-do. Whatever was bothering her, she is still in recovery mode.


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Anne*



Penny's Mom said:


> Good news! Better Poop!!! She's on the mend. She's eating well, loves her tripe top dressing. She's engaging with us again, saw some wag of the tail...in general coming back to her old self.
> 
> We're leaving tomorrow for a week camping at the sand dunes. I will be off line for probably the whole time...limited wifi access and I don't have one of those phones. Looking forward to lots of walks on the beach, altho I'm told water temp is about 60 degrees. What a blessing that we have Our Penny not only still with us but healthy enough to go.
> 
> ...


Anne: So glad to hear Penny is doing better and I hope you all have a great time.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

We'll definitely take it easy with her. Penny's dad will miss their early morning walks along Silver Lake and around the block. I think it will be limited to a short walk, dip in the lake and then rest.


----------



## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

Penny's Mom said:


> Good news! Better Poop!!! She's on the mend. She's eating well, loves her tripe top dressing. She's engaging with us again, saw some wag of the tail...in general coming back to her old self.


Happy for you!!  Enjoy your trip!


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Penny's Mom*

Penny's Mom

Have a wonderful trip with Penny!!


----------



## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

What a great update! Enjoy your camping trip together!


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

So glad that Penny is on the mend!! Hope you guys have a fantastic trip.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

She's had a really rough day. Started out with not wanting to go for a walk. We turned back, of course. She's also hesitant on the steps to the motor home. I had to lift her out this morning.

I think it's joint pain because she's been off her joint supplements for a few weeks. She doesn't want to eat or move. 

I'm having her joint supplements overnighted to start tomorrow. 

In the meantime, what kind of aspirin or aspirin substitute can I give her?

We're back to watching her breathe and waiting for her to stop breathing.


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Geez I'm sorry. 
Is she on prednisone right now? You can't give any NSAIDS with prednisone...


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Pennys Mom*

Pennys Mom

So sorry Penny is feeling badly. The only thing I can think of is to call her vet and tell them exactly what is going on and ask if there is anything she can take for pain.
In addition, if need be, see a vet or emergency animal hospital, wherever you are.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Results back from A & M....very low B vitamin. Going to local vet today for injection and refill on the pred. Stepping down that dose to 2 tabs a day. That will bring some relief to her. She feels too crappy to eat or move, altho Alpo :yuck: was a hit this morning.

She was VERY uncomfortable for about 7 hours after getting her pred dose last night. I sat up with her until after 2:00, she seemed to appreciate my hand on her paw and small drinks of water. She finally was able to fall asleep and didn't move for 3 hours. I turned on the light every once in a while to make sure she was still breathing. 

This morning she got out and back in the camper by herself..had a nice little piddle. Now back resting on the couch.


----------



## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

Continued healing thoughts and prayers for Penny.


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Penny*

Praying Penny feels better.

Be sure to tell us what local vet says.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

FINALLY!!! A million $$ poo...well, more like $1k poo. Firm! Almost took a picture of it.

She feels like crap, depleted, but it looks like the insides are starting to work again. One poo does not a cure make...but we are more hopeful.

I'm sure we wouldn't have made it this far without the collective prayers of our GRF family. Thank you all so much~


----------



## cgriffin (Nov 30, 2011)

I am glad to hear that Penny had a good morning, is feeling better and "yay poo", lol.


----------



## Brinkleythegolden (Jun 18, 2012)

Yay for a good poo--we all understand!


----------



## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

YAY POO!!!



Penny's Mom said:


> Results back from A & M....very low B vitamin. Going to local vet today for injection and refill on the pred. Stepping down that dose to 2 tabs a day. That will bring some relief to her. She feels too crappy to eat or move, altho Alpo :yuck: was a hit this morning.
> 
> .


Don't feel bad about the Alpo. When Tesia was sick, both my vets said, if she'll eat Dr. Ballard's, give it to her. It really becomes about calories. :doh:


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Sweet girl, that's what we decided too...if she'll eat road kill at this point, I'd go scrape it up for her!

She's still resting on the couch. I asked her twice about going outside. Put her collar on and leash and she just sat there reminding that I said she didn't have to go out until 4. She seems more comfortable in her skin today...the lower dose of pred is making a huge difference in that regard. 

I will make her go out once before bedtime, that's for sure. In the meantime, I'm sitting by her and knitting. We are old souls today!


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Going home tomorrow. This is torture for Penny: having to be carried out and assisted back in. She'll be more comfortable at home, fewer steps and easier ones. Not so scary in her weak condition. Plus, we can stop and get her b12 shot on the way; local vet couldn't do it...didn't have b12. 

I can watch her and knit at home...where she feels safer.


----------



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I hope and pray that the B12 will make as much difference for Penny as it does for Tiny. Tiny now gets .8 ml TWICE a week, and that in itself has given her a whole new lease on life. 
I think I posted previously, but if not, I got mine from www.vetdepot.com. You do need a prescription, you can order the syringes from them as well. I got over a year's supply for about $35 including shipping.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Thank you for the information. Penny did get an inj at the vet's a week ago last Friday. That may account for why she seemed better...well enough to make this trip.

Vet expects her to be on the inj for quite a while since her level barely registered on the low side of low...almost none at all. She's on the sofa bed...pulled out...and can barely move. Squirms about like a new born pup. And pants. She downed another meal of Alpo. I don't know about the quality but as far as I could see it was meat and meat by products (hate to think what THOSE are) but also contains the minerals and micro nutrients she needs so it's better than road kill. At least she's eating!


----------



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Penny*



Penny's Mom said:


> Thank you for the information. Penny did get an inj at the vet's a week ago last Friday. That may account for why she seemed better...well enough to make this trip.
> 
> Vet expects her to be on the inj for quite a while since her level barely registered on the low side of low...almost none at all. She's on the sofa bed...pulled out...and can barely move. Squirms about like a new born pup. And pants. She downed another meal of Alpo. I don't know about the quality but as far as I could see it was meat and meat by products (hate to think what THOSE are) but also contains the minerals and micro nutrients she needs so it's better than road kill. At least she's eating!


Glad Penny ate the Alpo and I'm sure she'll be happier at home, too.
How long a ride is it?


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

It's about 3 1/2 hours. The vet is 90 minutes from our house and a bit out of the way so that will extend the trip. But it will be worth it!

She will ride in comfort on the sofa bed. I think we can leave it flat...it's a couch by day...and still have room to get the slide in. Might have to put it up a little. It works by a power button that slides the seat part out and the back part down. It should be a very secure place for her to ride and still be able to shift her position.


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

I think you're right in that she'll be more comfortable at home. Hope the B12 shot helps. Ear rubs from us.


----------



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

pudding.  and now a distended abdomen. this isn't going well.


----------



## FAL guy (Jun 11, 2012)

Here's wishing Penny a nice firm poo!


----------



## PrincessDi (Jun 8, 2009)

Did you just notice that her abdomen was distended? Is this the first time that she has had it? How are her gums? Is it possible to get her to the veterinarian?


----------

