# THIS is the most indescribably horrible thing I've heard of ever



## Old Gold Mum2001 (Feb 25, 2007)

mylissyk said:


> I need a lawyer in NY, someone who can take on the SPCA director to get these poor dogs out. If you can stomach it, read all the way to the Feb. updates.
> 
> http://www.awca.net/SeeleyColliesJan.132008.htm


 
Isn't it!!!! Read that the other day and absolutely freaked  Tried calling, but all I get is a message to leave a message 

There aren't enough bad words in the english language to describe this 
B----, and her power ego


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

We seriously need to find out what governing body would have jurisdiction over this place and start hounding them to do something. The director needs to fired.


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## Old Gold Mum2001 (Feb 25, 2007)

mylissyk said:


> We seriously need to find out what governing body would have jurisdiction over this place and start hounding them to do something. The director needs to fired.


 
Yeah she does, and the sooner the better. and then stuffed in a crate to live in her own filth!!!

There must be someone in power over her! Need publicity!!!


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Unfortunately, there are even worse situations.

As a CCA member and Collie owners, Marie and I have been following the situation since the dogs were originally "rescued", if one can call their current conditions as having been rescued... There are concerns about the SPCA director, to be sure. It's almost as if she herself is a hoarder, legitimized by the auspices of the shelter. 
We have sent money and toys. It's heartbreaking, and every time I watch my Smooth, Jag, playing and growing strong and healthy, I think of the Smooths in that no-kill shelter, confined to crates for oh so long. Whenever I watch Ted, Marie's glorious and nearly 13 year old Rough, still romping and still looking for someone to throw his ancient old soft Frisbee for him, I think of the old gentleman #2 - not allowed the rehabilitation he so desperately deserved. It's beyond reconciling... and a hard truth to recognize when you know in your heart that these poor sweet dogs might have been better of had they been humanely euthanized.


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## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

That woman needs to be shot for letting those poor pups live thay way. she is supposed to help them not let them suffer anymore.


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

It might be a longshot, but have you thought about contacting PETA? They have attorneys that might just be willing to take on something like this.


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

WHY are they not released!!! I am horrified.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

LifeOfRiley said:


> It might be a longshot, but have you thought about contacting PETA? They have attorneys that might just be willing to take on something like this.


PETA would just go in and put them all to sleep. These dogs need out into foster homes and adopotions!


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## TheHooch (May 9, 2007)

Good grief there are idiots everywhere.


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

mylissyk said:


> PETA would just go in and put them all to sleep. These dogs need out into foster homes and adopotions!


I don't know how familiar you are with PETA, but they would would most certainly NOT go in and put them all to sleep. That's the last thing they would do. They're about saving lives, not killing.


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## Jackson'sMom (Oct 13, 2007)

You need publicity, and lots of it. A protet outside the shelter by concerned animal lovers is always a good draw for the media. And perhaps an attorney from the Animal Legal Defense Fund (http://www.aldf.org/) will help. Who would 'rescue' dogs confined 24/7 in crates, clean them up and put them back in crates? And decline offers of help? and food? That's just sick.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

LifeOfRiley said:


> I don't know how familiar you are with PETA, but they would would most certainly NOT go in and put them all to sleep. That's the last thing they would do. They're about saving lives, not killing.


 
Contacting PETA is not a good idea. It just gives them more ammunition for their stop all animal industry agenda, including no pets. They'd go back to the fact that a ""breeder" produced these animals and just look what happened..." and their attacks on responsible breeders would continue with a vengence. 
And actually, PETA _does _kill. I'd bet my last dime (and I'm almost there...) that that is _exactly _what they'd do.


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## Carraig (Jan 4, 2008)

LifeOfRiley said:


> It might be a longshot, but have you thought about contacting PETA? They have attorneys that might just be willing to take on something like this.


 
Would you like PETA to put them to sleep? That is exactly what they will do. Last year they euthanized 96% of the animals in their "care". And don't forget the debacle in NC or SC, I forget which, where two young, untrained PETA members went from vet to shelters, picking up animals and euthanizing them as soon as they got them in the van, then dumping their bodies on a river bank or in dumpsters. After they said they were going to good homes.

I dont' have the answer for this. But I do know PETA is not it.


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## lovealways_jami (Apr 17, 2007)

Im going to have to try to read that again. Im disabled when it comes to taking in things I read.. would anyone mind shortening the story a bit so I can understand?


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

From July 1998 through the end of 2003, *PETA killed* over 10000 dogs, cats, and other companion animals -- at its Norfolk, Virginia headquarters.
www.*peta**kills*animals.com/ - 17k - Cached - Similar pages
PETA's Lame Response
über Peta
Summary
Ad Campaigns
Shocking New Crime-Scene Photos
Shocking Crime-Scene Photos
News
Day 1
More results from petakillsanimals.com »
*http://www.petakillsanimals.com/article_detail.cfm?article=134*

One piece of kid-targeted *PETA* literature tells small children: “Your Mommy *Kills* Animals!” *PETA* brags that its messages reach over 2 million children every *...*
www.*peta**kills*animals.com/article_detail.cfm?article=134 - 9k - Cached - Similar pages


*PETA killed* 97.4 percent of the animals it took in. The organization filed its 2006 report this month, nine months after the VDACS deadline of March 31, *...*
sev.prnewswire.com/publishing-information-services/20080111/DC1129510012008-1.html - 11k - Cached - Similar pages
Jun 17, 2005 *...* *PETA* Norfolk Headquarters Responding to our website, *PETA* has claimed that most of the animals it *kills* are "broken beings" and that: "[W]e *...*
www.consumerfreedom.com/news_detail.cfm?headline=2833 - 27k - Cached - Similar pages
*http://www.consumerfreedom.com/pressRelease_detail.cfm/release/148 *

Mar 3, 2006 *...* According to the Virginia state veterinarian, *PETA killed* 1946 cats, dogs, and other pets last year, in addition to 141 wild animals. *...*
www.consumerfreedom.com/pressRelease_detail.cfm/release/148 - 22k - Cached - Similar pages

*Better dead than fed, PETA says*

This is not the first report that *PETA killed* animals it claimed to protect. In 1991, *PETA killed* 18 rabbits and 14 roosters it had previously "rescued" *...*
www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/06/23/EDG11DC9BK1.DTL - 54k - Cached - Similar pages


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

Well, I'm not going to get into an argument about PETA. I was trying to offer possible solutions here. In my book, they'd be a good one.
It's too bad that an organization which does so much good is so misunderstood. They can be a bit militant in some of their ideas, sure, but for the most part, they do an awful lot of good.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

PETA is a whole other story. Let's not hijack this thread.

We need to find a way to help these Collies. How do we contact the Animal Defense League lawyers?


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## Carraig (Jan 4, 2008)

PETA has a documented record of using the funds collected for animal welfare to pay the bail of people who have assaulted native fishermen, and bombed abortion clinics. They are considered a terrorist organization by the FBI. They are not the answer to this problem.

Has anyone contacted the local media. Even if you start with a small newspaper or t.v. station it will get the ball rolling.


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## lovealways_jami (Apr 17, 2007)

Are they available for rescue?


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## ShannonW (Jan 30, 2008)

Wow... that is the most horrible thing I've ever seen. That woman is crazy -- how has she not been forcefully removed after all this time? Those poor doggies...


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## lovealways_jami (Apr 17, 2007)

How many are currently awaiting adoption? Are they allowed to be out of state adoptions? Call me naive, but if the situation is so bad, why have they not been fostered by the Collie Rescue Group? Could we possibly start a funding group and have them taken out of the "original rescue" and placed into foster care? Im confused to why this organization paid for leashes, food, training, exercise, etc... but didnt adopt? Am I on the wrong page here as this sounds like the right solution to the problem.


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## lovealways_jami (Apr 17, 2007)

Im sorry, I cant understand all of this report. My mind sidetracks soooo fast while reading that I cant understand what Im reading. I think what this is saying is that these precious dogs were rescued and then are once again being mistreated in the rescue? Am I on the right page here... and they also refused help by the colllie support group?


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## LOVEisGOLDEN (Jan 4, 2008)

so sad, i can't imagine the frustration of the volunteers having to watch them deteriorate and not being able to do anything...


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

yes... the collie group would take them and foster them... but the SPCA bitch won't let them. That was my take.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

They are in a no kill shelter. The conditions are terrible _there. _The shelter director is unwilling to allow the AWCA (American Working Collie Association) to foster/adopt the dogs. Her reasoning is beyond comprehension...


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## Jackson'sMom (Oct 13, 2007)

*ALDF contact information:*

*National Headquarters* 
170 East Cotati Avenue 
Cotati, CA 94931
Phone: (707) 795-2533 
Fax: (707) 795-7280
General Inquiries: [email protected] 
Media Inquiries: [email protected]


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

mylissyk said:


> PETA is a whole other story. Let's not hijack this thread.
> 
> We need to find a way to help these Collies. How do we contact the Animal Defense League lawyers?


I have no intention of hijacking the thread, but fully believe that if anyone contacts PETA about the situation, it will be a HUGE mistake.

I also believe that before anyone from here does ANYthing, it should be run by the AWCA and the CCA, who have working on this case from the outset. Even with great intentions, it could compromise what they have and continue to do to help these dogs.


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## Carraig (Jan 4, 2008)

Yes! Someone contact them. I believe they're the ones who went to bat for the cats that were living feral near the airport.


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## cham (Feb 21, 2008)

Hmmmm, don't all non profits have a governance board who can remove the executive director? That is where I would start, with the board of directors, I would also get touch with any and all media outlets you can think of. The media was there for the first rescue, they are needed again for the second. The only way these poor dogs are going to be saved from this living hell, is to humiliate this hoarder, and force the issue. It will be ugly, but for the sake of the collies it needs to be done. 

Is there an NY SPCA that oversees the entire state? If so notify them. It's election year... notify any and all politicians in the area. On the local and state levels. Has the collie group been able to get pictures?

Good luck and keep us posted


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

http://www.poststar.com/articles/2008/01/17/news/latest/doc478fd19286019086433930.txt

Just for another perspective...

There is more going on with this situation than meets the eye.


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## Carraig (Jan 4, 2008)

That's interesting POG. But the question remains...why will the SPCA not allow breed groups to take these dogs and foster them in a way that would give the dogs more attention for their specific needs/problems? Are they holding on out of jealousy of the groups, because they think the groups have slandered them, because they have some idea the groups will not care for them properly?


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Carraig said:


> That's interesting POG. But the question remains...why will the SPCA not allow breed groups to take these dogs and foster them in a way that would give the dogs more attention for their specific needs/problems? Are they holding on out of jealousy of the groups, because they think the groups have slandered them, because they have some idea the groups will not care for them properly?


That is the crux of the issue. It's all very unclear. Depending on who you talk to the story is different. It's very frustrating.


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## cham (Feb 21, 2008)

Carraig said:


> That's interesting POG. But the question remains...why will the SPCA not allow breed groups to take these dogs and foster them in a way that would give the dogs more attention for their specific needs/problems? Are they holding on out of jealousy of the groups, because they think the groups have slandered them, because they have some idea the groups will not care for them properly?


That is my question, why wouldn't the SPCA allow the collie group to help? It is deplorable if food, was refused, and offers of help. It is a well known fact that no kill shelters never have enough money, volunteers, or resources, so the question that begs an answer is why is this happening? Why did it happen? 

The one thing I learned years ago is in volunteer work, never never turn down offers of help of any sort. You never know when you might need it.


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## Jackson'sMom (Oct 13, 2007)

I would think the SPCA would welcome the opportunity to turn the collies over to an experienced breed group for rehabilitation and adoption. At the very least that would free up kennels in the 'shelter' and put the financial burden of medical treatment, rehab, etc., on someone else. Something just doesn't sound right about this situation. Nowhere does it mention that the animals are being held as evidence for use in a criminal prosecution of the original hoarders, so why the refusal to let the rescue group take the dogs?


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

You would think... I have no idea what the whole story is. We sent money and toys, and I just hope they were used, although I wonder if they were... 

The Seeley Collie situation, as tragic as it is, in NOTHING compared to the Montana Collies. In late 2002 a tractor-trailer full of nearly 180 dogs and cats, mostly Collies, were discovered coming across the Canada-Montana border. An Alaskan couple were moving their kennel from Alaska to Arizona. The initial story can be read here:
http://dwb.adn.com/front/story/2090675p-2187678c.html

and the ensuing months can be read here:
http://www.awca.net/newsarch.htm

I don't know what is wrong with people.


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## Jackson'sMom (Oct 13, 2007)

For starters, the punishment meted out for such atrocious and large-scale cruelty is usually minimal. The old "they're just dogs" mentality still has hold over much of the country, particularly the legal system. DAs don't want to prosecute misdemeanor cases like animal cruelty, people complain about the "waste of tax dollars" spent on investigating and prosecuting cases, and the guilty parties often get a slap on the wrist after all is said and done. Maybe a small fine and they're forbidden to own dogs for a couple of years. Big deal. We need to put some teeth in animal protection laws as a start.


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## Sunshine Goldens (Oct 31, 2005)

What about contacting the ASPCA? I would say also the HSUS but I believe they too are not thought of highly by many on the forum...are there any agencies that would be of benefit? At the very least we could organize a letter-writing campaign.


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## ID_Hannah (Jun 8, 2006)

The excuse of holding on the dogs until they are completely healthy carries SO little weight for me. Every shelter I've ever worked with has adopters sign a general medical release & often a specific one if the dog is dx with certain illnesses. They're simply not going to be more healthy crated 22 hours a day. 

PG, I remember the Montana Collies well. Although, their care post-rescue was not even comparable to this situation. I was also involved with a rescue from a hoarder in eastern Oregon who had 550+ dogs in her small house and even smaller yard. Rescuers were told to expect 200 dogs. Once they'd filled up their 200 crates it looked like they hadn't taken any dogs out. 

Hoarding is such a sickening thing. And those Collies deserve better than staying in crates for 3+ months after they've been rescued.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

From what I was told there is a rescue who will take these dogs. This place will not let them go...I also know of someone else who would have pulled a few and they were refused, too. They took these dogs from a bad situation and put them into a situation that is worse. I don't get it. I would think if someone in the news got involved, this woman would be out! One does need to think before they react and be sure a rescue and foster homes are ready to take them in and provide the proper care they deserve.

Right now it's the Seely Collies that need help. What happened in the past is tragic, but maybe something can be done for the present problem.

There's always two sides to a story, but these dogs are caught in the middle. Wouldn't a rescue get them care? A nice investigative story might help.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

Lawyers are working with the ASPCA to see what they can do. It is being worked on. Just got word.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Kimm said:


> Lawyers are working with the ASPCA to see what they can do. It is being worked on. Just got word.


Excellent. Thanks, Kimm.


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## cham (Feb 21, 2008)

Kimm said:


> Lawyers are working with the ASPCA to see what they can do. It is being worked on. Just got word.


Wonderful news. Please keep us posted on the status of the Collies.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

Will do. When I hear something I will let you know.


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