# You won't believe this! We are still shocked!



## MilosMommy

Milo had an appointment with the hip surgeon today to get his bloodwork done for his hip replacement surgery, which will be January 25. 

Any way, as we were sitting in the waiting room a couple walked in with a Golden Retriever who was there for her 8 week check up appointment after having a hip replacement. We started talking to the couple and found out that her initial symptoms were the exact same as Milos. Then we found out that they were each 1 year old. The couple asked us where we got our Golden from and we told them from a place in Conowingo Maryland. As soon as those words came out of my mouth their eyes opened wide and she said Ds Golden Delights? We said yes! 

Turns out their Golden is from the same litter as Milo! They were siblings! Small world! Every one in the waiting room started listening and just couldn't believe our story. We were shocked! What are the odds that we would meet in those circumstances? Her name is Molly and she has severe hip dysplasia exactly like Milo and just had her right hip replaced just like Milo is getting done.

This couple had contacted the breeder months ago wanting their money back. The "breeder" said that she would give them back their money but she wanted the dog back and she would put it to sleep. (knowing that no one in their right mind would agree to this) They wanted their money back to put towards the $4600 that the hip costs. 

We stayed and talked for a while. We both agreed that the whole litter and any other puppies she has bred probably have the severe hip dysplasia. We are both contacting her just to tell her we ran into each other. She probably never thought that would happen. She assured them that she has never had a problem with her puppies. She is a disgusting person and should not be breeding dogs any longer.

Milo & Molly acted like they knew each other, maybe they remembered each others scent? We exchanged information so that we can get together once each dog is healed.

Milo has the green harness & Molly has the pink leash.


----------



## musicgirl

Wow small world. So sad that you had to meet under such circumstances. Hopefully the breeder will at least help you fund the surgeries. Hope it goes well!


----------



## Oaklys Dad

Small world indeed. Did you invite Molly's people to join GRF?


----------



## Penny & Maggie's Mom

So sorry you had to meet under these circumstances. Hopefully everyone in that waiting room learned an important lesson.


----------



## mygoldenboys

Wow, the chances of running into another dog from the same litter and then for them both to have the same problem at a similiar age! I would definatly contact the breeder and give them a piece of my mind! Im sorry poor Milo has to go through all of this. He's so cute! Maybe you can stay in contact with Molly and her owners.


----------



## FinnTastic

So sorry that has happened to all of you. Is there someway to get in touch with other people who are from the same litter. I believe people on here have also suggested putting there information on K-9 Data. That way people know that at least two dogs from that litter had severe hip dysplasia. I could be totally wrong on that though. I don't know how all of that works. I'm glad the two of you are able to get them the help they need. Hopefully, all the other pups are healthy, but if they aren't, I hope they have owners who are able to help them too.


----------



## janine

What a small world...how cool that Milo and Molly got to meet again. So sorry Milo has to have this surgery but I bet he will do well and be better than new in no time. 
And yes you need to tell Molly's family about GRF.


----------



## Maxs Mom

WOW.... small world. Don't know how that makes me feel. I have often wondered about Teddi's siblings, hoping she was the fluke. Hearing this makes me wonder. However it really is not surprising, with poorly bred dogs, it is not uncommon for several siblings to have an hip issue. If the breeder does their homework, clearances etc, the chances become more slim. 

However... I think it is AWESOME you met one of Milo's sibs, and their pup is doing well post op. Helps you see the light at the end of the tunnel. 

What's the scoop on Milo? You know I have been waiting. He has been in my thoughts often.


----------



## Maxs Mom

FinnTastic said:


> Is there someway to get in touch with other people who are from the same litter. I believe people on here have also suggested putting there information on K-9 Data. That way people know that at least two dogs from that litter had severe hip dysplasia.


No you can not find out others unless they are in something like K9 Data. In AKC you can track by the registration number but that just shows other dogs from the litter registered and their names. Trust me I have looked. 

I want the world to know about Teddi but the problem is, the people who would go to that breeder looking for a puppy would not know about K9 data, or OFA, just like I didn't. If they do know, they would walk away. I wished there was a way to stop them from breeding again. I sent a letter pleading with the side of the breeder who really truly was trying to do the right thing. I begged them to do clearances before breeding again. My letter was not replied to, I guess I didn't expect it. I hope they talked with their vet which was my request. Sigh... 

Teddi, Milo and Molly have found homes who love them and will care for them forever.


----------



## Karen519

*Milo's Mommy*

Milo's Mommy

What a small world.
Hope you got their phone number so Milo and his sister can keep in touch.


----------



## MilosMommy

Here is the email that I just sent to the "breeder"

We purchased a puppy from your December 2009 litter by Ranger and Sandy and named him Milo. At 6 months old he was diagnosed with SEVERE hip dysplasia. Our vet personally said that she had never seen hip dysplasia this bad in such a young puppy. He was born this way. We took him to the best hip surgeon that we could find and he also agreed that Milo was born this way and in order to maintain mobility he needed a total hip replacement as soon as he was old enough. He was then put on pain relievers because as it turns out he has lived his whole life dealing with this pain. I chose not to contact you about this because we thought that MAYBE it was a fluke that Milo had such severe hip dysplasia. Today we found out it was not a fluke. While at the hip surgeon we met a nice couple with a Golden Retriever who was there for her post hip replacement check up. We told them that we were there because our Golden Retriever also had hip dysplasia and would be getting his total hip replacement next week. We talked more about the dogs and realized how identical their symptoms had been and that they were the same age. They asked us where we got our dog from and when I said a place in Conowingo Maryland, their eyes opened wide and they jumped from their seats saying Ds Golden Delights? If you haven’t put all of this together yet, their dog is from the EXACT SAME LITTER AS MILO. And she was born with severe hip dysplasia as well. 

After doing much research we learned that any reputable breeder would have their dogs hips, eyes, elbows, and heart cleared before breeding them. Having these clearances would significantly reduce the possibility of genetic problems. Before we bought Milo we did not realize how important these clearances were, but now we are much more educated and realize we should have never bought a puppy from a back yard breeder like you.

For someone who claims that they have been breeding Golden Retrievers for 15 years, I feel as though you should be well aware of what it takes to produce a nice healthy puppy. However, you are breeding dogs without clearances and they are producing unhealthy puppies and you know it. You are selling these puppies to unsuspecting people just to make a profit. No decent person or reputable breeder would ever do this. Milo is probably one of the few lucky puppies that you have produced because he has owners that are willing to pay the $5,000.00 per hip to be replaced and to take care of him during his 4 month recovery period each time. Many of your other puppies with this problem have probably ended up in shelters or have been put to sleep because of the financial burden YOU have placed on their owners.

You should not continue breeding your uncleared dogs because you are doing nothing but hurting the breed. I would never recommend a back yard breeder like you to anyone.


----------



## MilosMommy

Maxs Mom said:


> What's the scoop on Milo? You know I have been waiting. He has been in my thoughts often.


Milo is doing well. He got all of his bloodwork done today for the surgery and his hip replacement will be Tuesday January 25. He will probably be able to come home that Friday. 

After seeing Molly at 8 weeks post op I feel much better about this surgery. She seemed perfectly fine and her owners said that every thing went really well with her surgery.


----------



## kateann1201

Who were the dam and sire?


----------



## FinnTastic

Does anyone think that the name of the thread should be the name of the breeder? That way when people are looking for a breeder in that area or researching specifically this breeder this page will pop up?


----------



## mylissyk

I hope Milo's surgery goes well. It is amazing how well they do after hip surgery, he will be better than before for sure. He is truly a lucky boy to have owners who are able and willing to give him the vet care he needs.

If he and his sire & dam are AKC registered, you should put him on K9 Data and report his hip displaysia, encourage Molly's owners to do that also. That way anyone who is looking for clearances before buying will see the report on this breeding pair and you will be helping others avoid what you are faced with.


----------



## Maxs Mom

Good Luck on your surgery Milo, I will think about you. Danielle, all will go fine. It is hard on you but you can do it. We worry so much about our fur kids. Please keep me (us) posted throughout the process, and if you need mental support, I am here. Been there... done that... 

Also let me know if your breeder responds... I am interested. Mine never did. 

You are a good dog mom!


----------



## goldensrbest

Yes, small world, something on that line, happened years ago with our red head jamie, we ran into two different people, at different times, that had her litter mates, they also had bad hips. It does get you, when things like that happen.


----------



## MilosMommy

I would be fine with the thread name being changed to Ds Golden Delights. Anything to help prevent someone else getting one of her puppies and going through this.

His parents are Ranger Danger Delight and Sandy Molly Delight.

I'm sure that she won't email me back, but at least I finally have peace of mind knowing that I told her what I have been dying to say to her, well not exactly what I wanted to say lol.


----------



## kateann1201

Hmmm they have "Dash & Blondie" as the latest breeding pair. No AKC reg name or number...no clearances on the female, and no way to verify the sires supposed clearances.


----------



## Cathy's Gunner

I'm glad Milo's sister is doing so well and praying that his surgery will be as good. I think it's cool that you ran into them so you could compare notes. Good for you to send out the letter to the breeder and shame on them.


----------



## MilosMommy

She didn't have Dash when we got Milo. 

Our original deposit was for a puppy from Blondie but it was a false pregnancy. That probably should have been when the light above my head went off and we got our money back and ran. But I didn't know.


----------



## Dallas Gold

FinnTastic said:


> Does anyone think that the name of the thread should be the name of the breeder? That way when people are looking for a breeder in that area or researching specifically this breeder this page will pop up?


I was thinking the exact same thing. 

I'll keep Milo in my prayers. It's cool you know of a sibling and plan to keep in contact, but I'm sorry you met at the hip surgeon's office. Hope it all goes well with the surgery!


----------



## GoldenJoyx'stwo

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥►Best wishes for a full recovery.


----------



## Bender

I would put the dogs on K9data, it won't hurt and if anything will let people know about the breeder (include her name on your dog's info as well - it will come up in a search that way). Shame on her!

I wonder if the news in your area is slow, would be an interesting news bite..... what are the odds?


----------



## MilosMommy

Can his information be entered in K9data if I never registered him with the AKC? Or do I have to do that first. Mollys owners never registered her either.


----------



## Bender

Yes, just leave that part blank, but be sure to include breeder's name and info of course. You can even put in the hip replacement surgery date and cost under honorifics if you want.


----------



## MilosMommy

ok I will do that right now. Thanks!


----------



## kateann1201

Um...did you know that the dam to your puppy was bred and whelped Milo's litter before she was even a year old...Poor momma dog =/


----------



## kateann1201

According to K9 data...look at the DOB next to the dam's name on the link. She was supposedly born Dec 27, 2008. So by Dec 2009 these people had a litter of pups from this dam ready to go. Link: Pedigree: Sandy Molly Delight


----------



## MilosMommy

I added Milo Ranger to K9data, hopefully I did it right.

I am aware that BOTH of his parents were under the age of 1. However I did not know at the time. Trust me, I feel horrible about it. But darn I should have mentioned that in my email to her! ugh I forgot about that!


----------



## C's Mom

I feel so sorry for Milo and Molly. I have to wonder if their other siblings have HD too.


----------



## kateann1201

Ok, I was under the understanding that AKC wouldn't register any litter born and whelped from a dog 1 and under. Am I wrong here? Someone please verify this for me. If that is the case, then the breeder doctored some paperwork, or AKC didn't catch it. Either way, if that's AKC's rule, I'd report the breeder to AKC.


----------



## nixietink

kateann1201 said:


> Ok, I was under the understanding that AKC wouldn't register any litter born and whelped from a dog 1 and under. Am I wrong here? Someone please verify this for me. If that is the case, then the breeder doctored some paperwork, or AKC didn't catch it. Either way, if that's AKC's rule, I'd report the breeder to AKC.


I googled it. Here is what it says on the AKC website:

"No dog or litter out of a dam under eight (8) months or over twelve (12) years of age at the time of mating, or by a sire under seven (7) months or over twelve (12) years of age at the time of mating, will be registered unless the application for registration shall be accompanied by an affidavit or evidence which shall prove the fact to the satisfaction of The American Kennel Club."


----------



## kateann1201

Am I the only one that finds that reprehensible? Thanks for the info Nix!


----------



## MilosMommy

They were both older than that.. barely, but they were. So other than registering him on K9data and putting that he has HD and never reccomending her to any one there is nothing that can be done right?


----------



## nixietink

kateann1201 said:


> Am I the only one that finds that reprehensible? Thanks for the info Nix!


I definitely find it horrible. Props to MilosMommy for sharing her story and spreading the word.

I think of Milo often. He reminds me so much of my Vito.


----------



## kateann1201

I agree Nix...Good cookies for Milo's Momma for sharing the truth and her story. Hopefully people who check the forum will know to stay the H3ll away from those gold-diggers.


----------



## Maxs Mom

I haven't added Teddi to K9 data. I have an extensive pedigree for her, not that it is worth the paper it is written on. I am tempted though if I do add her, to put her x-ray post THR up for her picture. 

Again, I know it doesn't hurt but will the people looking at these breeders see it? I mean if they are going there they probably don't know a thing about clearances and are as blind as I was buying Teddi. I know more now, but not then. 

Funny the names are pretty scary. Milos parents and Teddi's. Teddi's mom was Ruby Mae Rodger, and her dad was Ed Edd Eddy Rodger (or something like that), so maybe a clue should be if the dogs are not named properly.....RUN!!!!! :


----------



## RustysMom

Hello, I just want to say that I for one am very happy with my golden that I got from D's. I am very sadden to see one person on here bash this business. Since I received my golden 13 years ago, I have receommended D's to many of friends and they are very happy with their dogs. Did you ever hear the word "slander" ? People on this site are bashing a person and her business based on one person opinion w/o facts. Shame on all of you.


----------



## Bender

Maxs Mom said:


> I haven't added Teddi to K9 data. I have an extensive pedigree for her, not that it is worth the paper it is written on. I am tempted though if I do add her, to put her x-ray post THR up for her picture.
> 
> Again, I know it doesn't hurt but will the people looking at these breeders see it? I mean if they are going there they probably don't know a thing about clearances and are as blind as I was buying Teddi. I know more now, but not then.
> 
> Funny the names are pretty scary. Milos parents and Teddi's. Teddi's mom was Ruby Mae Rodger, and her dad was Ed Edd Eddy Rodger (or something like that), so maybe a clue should be if the dogs are not named properly.....RUN!!!!! :


It certainly won't hurt anything to have it up there, better than it not being there, right? I mean who knows, may not make a difference, but some breeders do list k9data pedigrees, so some may find their way there....


----------



## MilosMommy

I am not one person without facts. The fact is that her dogs hips, elbows, eyes, and heart are not cleared and she is breeding them. The fact is that she bred my dogs mother and father when they were both way too young to be bred. The fact is that she was contacted by the other owner about their dogs hip dysplasia from this set of parents and still bred them again.. how do I know that? My friend has a puppy born from the same parents 6 months after Milo was born. The fact is that she is a backyard breeder and is doing nothing to help the breed like her website claims. She is not producing "happy healthy puppies" she is producing unhealthy puppies that are living in pain.

I am glad that you had nothing wrong with your Golden. You got lucky. I did not.


----------



## kateann1201

That's not a real member. That's just the breeder trying to defend themselves in disguise...


----------



## MilosMommy

How ironic they joined in January 2011 and this is their first post.


----------



## kateann1201

Yep! They'll lurk here and toss in some nonsensical comments. They should be responding to their email instead, no? lol


----------



## MilosMommy

I know for a fact she had a dog named Rusty as well, he was supposed to be the father of our original litter that was a false pregnancy.

I would love a response to that email  and she will be getting another one if my friend finds out that her pup has HD too, which I'm sure he does coming from the same parents.


----------



## kateann1201

Rusty huh? She named him after his hip structure I suppose...


----------



## MilosMommy

kateann1201 said:


> Rusty huh? She named him after his hip structure I suppose...


lol that was a good laugh that I def needed tonight!


----------



## RustysMom

I assure you, I am not a breeder. I am a very happy past customer of D's and it is a shame you all bash someone w/o even knowing her. MiloMom even said she never contacted D's except today with the above email that she just posted. BHow would you like it if someone bashed your name on a forum that never talk to you or even know you like you all on this forum are doing? Again, shame on all of you!


----------



## bioteach

Wow! What an eye-opener. Milo is one lucky pup to have parents committed to his health and comfort. 

We bought Buckskin from a backyard breeder. The breeder only had a small newspaper ad and no guarantees - so we knew what we were getting into. We also ran into one of his litter mates and like our dog she had malformed ear canals resulting in a lifetime of ear pain despite aggressive treatment. We had actually considered having the ear canals closed surgically but he would have been rendered deaf by the procedure.

This time we sought out a breeder of merit and checked all of the clearances. Lesson learned!


----------



## kateann1201

LOL This breeder makes it easy to crack jokes


----------



## kateann1201

If people don't want to do clearances, then there isn't much you can do about it. But to charge 800 bucks for a puppy and claim that they're healthy and bla blah blah...Well, back it up then. And it's fraud to claim you have healthy pups when you don't - Rusty's mom. And to be informed of your progeny's health issues, but blow them off in the name of the Almighty dollar is shameful. So hop off the soapbox...


----------



## MilosMommy

Shame on me for stating the facts about this breeder and her dogs. Shame on me for trying to save people $600 for xrays and diagnoses, $4600 per hip replacement, and $75 every 3 weeks for pain medicine AND the $800 that I paid for Milo. Shame on me. What a bad person I must be.


----------



## Sally's Mom

MilosMom,
Ignore RustysMom... you are only giving the facts on your dog with known, verifiable issues. None of that is "slander" or is it "libel?" I'm glad you are trying to make his life more comfortable. Good luck for the future.


----------



## Sally's Mom

And I got on her website and I believe the current litter is out of an underage male.


----------



## Kmullen

RustysMom said:


> I assure you, I am not a breeder. I am a very happy past customer of D's and it is a shame you all bash someone w/o even knowing her. MiloMom even said she never contacted D's except today with the above email that she just posted. BHow would you like it if someone bashed your name on a forum that never talk to you or even know you like you all on this forum are doing? Again, shame on all of you!


So I must ask, how do you know that Milo's mom does not know the breeder??? Facts were stated...! I see you are on here to show us how much you love your dog. What litter is your pup from?

Then can you tell me, why this breeder is breeding dogs under 2 years old? Because that sounds responsible.....doesn't it?

Can you tell me, if you know him/her so well, what he/she does do to ensure that the puppies that are produced are SOOO HEALTHY?

How do you know if Milo's mom is lying? I guess she is lying and Milo and Milo's sister does not have HD and they are just making this all up?

There was no bashing. Should this person breed and ask $800 for a pup......Nope!! But will this person continue to breed unhealthy pups and make money off of them.....YEP!

It just stinks that people like you are not helping the breed at all! And we have dedicated breeders out there doing everything in there power to produce the healthiest puppies. SOOO SHAME ON YOU!


----------



## Sally's Mom

Milo's mom was one year old when he was born, if I did the math correctly.


----------



## kateann1201

Nope, Milo's mom was NOT even a year old. She was about a year old when the pups went to their "forever" homes. For arguements sake if the pups were 6-8 weeks old when they left the dam, plus the duration of the pregnancy...that gives a ball park figure of about 8 months old when she was bred.


----------



## MilosMommy

I should have sent this to the "breeder" because this is all the fact/proof I need that her puppies aren't healthy.

Milos hip xrays


----------



## Sally's Mom

Thos hip rads just sent shivers thru my body. You are doing the right thing for Milo. Have tried contacting the Better Business Bureau?


----------



## MilosMommy

Sally's Mom said:


> Thos hip rads just sent shivers thru my body. You are doing the right thing for Milo. Have tried contacting the Better Business Bureau?


I'm not exactly sure if they can do anything? MD doesn't have Puppy Lemon Laws.


----------



## Maxs Mom

Oh poor Milo....

To Rusty... You were lucky. When you got their dog, they were not "breeders" yet. They put two dogs together and you got very lucky. Heck so did I buying from BYB's for several years. Ignorance can be bliss. However it just takes one time, and you become a skeptic. 

If they have a website, and they are CLEARLY not breeding dogs of proper age, let alone clearances, then shame on them. Yes it is buyer beware, and that is the beauty of this thread. Warning them to be aware of this breeders' practices. 

Unfortunately these breeders will sell their pups. I am a bit surprised at the cost. At least I only paid $350 for Teddi. One thing I used to snub my nose at but now completely believe one needs... is a guarantee. No it is not worth much more than the paper it is written on, but a good breeder puts it on paper. Most will take back a pup if you don't want it or return "some" of your money if you want to keep it towards medical bills. I would NEVER give back a pup, once that pup is in my home it is in my heart. The fact that a good breeder will back you up is PRICELESS!!! 

Rusty, if you choose to go back to the same breeder for your next pup. You may no longer feel as you do if you get a pup who is going through what Milo, Molly and my Teddi did. It is a HORRIBLE experience to see a PUPPY in pain. Forget older dogs who get it, I am not discounting their plight AT ALL, but to see a puppy who can not run and have fun without pain is the most heartbreaking experience you can go through. Teddi had a year and a half before she was allowed to run pain free. It is no wonder she is a soft personality. She is a tough stoic dog though when it comes to pain. 

In my opinion.... this breeder should be reported. Just goes to show saying your dog has AKC papers doesn't mean a hill of beans either. It is the parentage behind the name.


----------



## CarolinaCasey

Ew, that is one of the nastiest hip radiographs I've ever seen. Poor Milo. I'm sorry that you had to find the other owners like this. Ds Golden Delights in Conowingo Maryland, be ashamed.

I'm happy to report that this thread comes up as the third search result for Ds Golden Delights in Conowingo Maryland. 
http://www.google.com/search?q=ds+g...7&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&ie=&oe=


----------



## MilosMommy

well good! Maybe I'll save someone the thousands of dollars that we are spending on a hip replacement, xrays, medicine, and therapy 

I sure wish someone would have stopped me.


----------



## Sweet Girl

Wow - just seeing this thread now. The story of your meeting up with Molly's owners is amazing in itself. Her HD is sad, but certainly interesting from a purely academic view.

I applaud your putting the info about the "breeder" here and on K9. Milo and Moly are lucky to be in homes where you are caring for them and can afford that care. Milo's x-rays made me gasp. I'll be looking forward to hearing what respinse you get from the "breeder." My guess is - you won't.

As for Rusty's Mom - I think you just got lucky. You probably got a pup early on in this "breeder's" career. If I were you, seeing what you are seeing here, the stories of Milo and Molly - the x-ray! - I'd be feeling lucky and thankful. But I certainly wouldn't be defending this so-called breeder, nor would I ever pay her money to continue breeding. If the "breeder" is so ethical, why isn't she paying for Molly and Milo's hip replacements?


----------



## LibertyME

Those films are shocking. Even a layman can see how bad your pups hips are...

If you haven't already....please send the xrays off to OFA.
It will 

A. give loads of credibility to this thread
B. the verified info will be public.
C. help expand the database therefore help the breed.


----------



## MilosMommy

I didn't know I could send them off to the OFA.. how would I go about doing that? Milos surgeon has our cd of xrays right now but I will def send them if it will do any good.

He will also be doing new xrays on the day of the surgery so I wonder if it has gotten any worse? These xrays are from when Milo was 8 months old I believe.


----------



## Bender

Wouldn't hurt to wait for those xrays, and tell the vet you want to send them to OFA too. They might send the surgical info along, who knows.... I still say go to the news, what the heck!


----------



## LibertyME

Its just a matter of getting a completed and signed OFA form <which (s)he should have available in his office>. You fill out your part of the form, write a check and send to OFA. 

Personally I would have him do Milos elbows at the same time while he is under ....the films for the additional xrays are not expensive (especially compared to the cost of the procedure!) and the check to OFA is not too bad either.


----------



## tanianault

Milo's Mom: I admire your strength in dealing with this sad and reprehensible situation, and I admire your courage in coming forward with this information - you will surely save someone else from your suffering, and maybe even save some future puppy's suffering.

Here's a link to the Hip and Elbow Displasia form from the OFA website:
http://www.offa.org/pdf/hdappbw.pdf

You can fill out the form online and then print it out and take it with you to your vet's office. The second page contains instructions on what's required from your vet by way of the films, etc. If you have any questions about the form or process you can phone their office: (573) 442-0418, Monday - Friday, 8:00 am - 4:30 pm CST.

Thinking good thoughts for you and Milo.

- Tania


----------



## goldensrbest

Milosmom, you are doing the right thing, i hope the next person, that thinks of getting a pup from this so called breeder, will see this, and stop, that is the only way, to stop these breeders.


----------



## Maxs Mom

Can you send pics to OFA without going through the three vet review steps? 

Heck I have pics of Teddi's hips post op could I send them? 

I don't know I would, water under the bridge in her case. Milo's hip was UGLY that is for sure. I don't remember if Teddi's bad hip was that bad. It was out of the socket what little socket there was. Her other side was just moderate. 

I wish we could somehow truly educate the the general public to do research before you shop. Hold breeders accountable. I have a dream if I win the lotto, I want to put together a not very nice DVD about the down sides of not spaying/neutering a dog, send them to veterinary hospitals all over the US, ask them to be given out to people who don't want to neuter who are the average joe type dog owner. Or the ones who say "what if we want to breed?" Perhaps some tough love into understanding the repercussions. 

To be honest I don't know breeders truly understand the heart ache an owner goes through when your dog has been diagnosed with HD. Or as I stated before to see a puppy in pain. If they get them back which I do think is rare, I am sure they put them down. Living with HD is hard on the owners. Danielle and Molly's mom and dad are learning the hard way. No OFA is not a guarantee doing all the homework in the world can produce an HD pup, however if you stack the deck in your favor, you have better odds. My surgeon noted that Teddi's non THR hip is getting significant arthritis. She is only 4. She has a lot of arthritis in her back from compensating her life. My pledge to Teddi is to keep her as happy and mobile as I can. It will take a lot as she ages.


----------



## Momx3

This is a crazy story. I have a good friend who bought their dog from a backyard breeder in Conowingo. I just checked and it wasn't from this breeder though. So far they have been lucky and the only problems I know they have had have been allergies and ear infections. I did find it weird that I was able to easily find three backyard golden breeders in that town though!

Did anyone notice on the Ds site that there are three glowing reviews from puppy owners that were all submitted two days ago and within 5 minutes of each other? Strange...


----------



## Dallas Gold

Milo's Mom, wow, those xrays are bad. HUGS to you as you prepare for surgery to help his pain.


----------



## LauraBella

I really liked the suggestion to "go to the news!" If you make the local feed in the area where the "breeder" is based, I bet a lot of owners will come forward with similar experiences, who thought they were alone. That, plus the negative publicity (verified and fact checked by the media) might actually shut them down.

Can the humane society step in and shut them down if they are breeding known-to-be-unhealthy dogs?


----------



## Bender

Not sure if the SPCA can do anything, but it wouldn't hurt to file a report anyway. Same with contacting any other vets in the area that do hip replacement surgery, to let them know about the breeder and give contact info for those that might be in the same boat. Not sure who is responsible for 'puppy lemon laws' but it might be worth it to find out and contact them too.


----------



## MittaBear

For some reason I can't see the x-ray but from the responses, it sounds bad. Poor Milo...good luck with surgery!

I can't believe you ran into his littermate at the vet and she has the same problems. I really hope anyone who considers this breeder sees all of this.


----------



## MilosMommy

Thanks for the form, I will send his xrays in when the vet is done with them.

Many people have told me to go to the news about her. I don't live in the same town, or county though and wouldn't even know where to start.

I also saw the 3 new comments on her page all saying how great her puppies were. I sent her comments about how great Milo was (before we knew about his HD) and somehow once he got HD, even though I never contacted her, they were taken off of her website. If she didn't take them off herself I would have made her because I would NEVER say anything good about her or her dogs now.

I have a friend who lives near her and she told me that her kennel sign outside of her house is down. 

Oh and she hasn't emailed me back either, big surprise.


----------



## MilosMommy

Maxs Mom said:


> Can you send pics to OFA without going through the three vet review steps?
> 
> Heck I have pics of Teddi's hips post op could I send them?
> 
> I don't know I would, water under the bridge in her case. Milo's hip was UGLY that is for sure. I don't remember if Teddi's bad hip was that bad. It was out of the socket what little socket there was. Her other side was just moderate.
> 
> I wish we could somehow truly educate the the general public to do research before you shop. Hold breeders accountable. I have a dream if I win the lotto, I want to put together a not very nice DVD about the down sides of not spaying/neutering a dog, send them to veterinary hospitals all over the US, ask them to be given out to people who don't want to neuter who are the average joe type dog owner. Or the ones who say "what if we want to breed?" Perhaps some tough love into understanding the repercussions.
> 
> To be honest I don't know breeders truly understand the heart ache an owner goes through when your dog has been diagnosed with HD. Or as I stated before to see a puppy in pain. If they get them back which I do think is rare, I am sure they put them down. Living with HD is hard on the owners. Danielle and Molly's mom and dad are learning the hard way. No OFA is not a guarantee doing all the homework in the world can produce an HD pup, however if you stack the deck in your favor, you have better odds. My surgeon noted that Teddi's non THR hip is getting significant arthritis. She is only 4. She has a lot of arthritis in her back from compensating her life. My pledge to Teddi is to keep her as happy and mobile as I can. It will take a lot as she ages.


Is there anything I can do to help prevent arthritis? Or maybe help so that he doesn't get it so young?


----------



## Sally's Mom

I love Dasuquin with MSM and fish oil.


----------



## Betty

*Molly and Milo*

Well, I couldn't have told the story any better than Danielle. I am Molly's Mom and we did meet Milo and his parents, Danielle and Andrew, in the waiting room. It was such a surprise to find a sibling right there with exactly the same problem as our Molly. His hips were just as bad and started to shows signs at 6 months, exactly like Molly.

We are very pleased her surgery went so well. She still has to be careful till it mends completely. She was confined to her crate and a small area in front of it for the 8 weeks following surgery. She was amazed as we let her walk through the house again. She was looking up at pictures and just taking it all in. It was great. And we took a couple brief walks, and we definitely have to go back to basic training. She's doing well, though. I agree 100% that D's Golden Delights is not a good place to buy a puppy. I tell everyone who is even thinking about a dog, not to go to her.


----------



## NJgoldengirl

I just read this entire post and saw those horrible hips on the radiograph! I feel so bad for you, but at least Milo has good parents (it could have been worse for him). Good luck with him.


----------



## concernedaboutfairness

*reply to milo's mom*

You must remember when you are talking about dsgoldendelights that a pup can get any problem that a child can get basically. Two very healthy parents can have a child that gets cancer in preschool years. You don't hate the spouse or all other relatives because of that. You accept the child as it is and love it. also remember that vets opinions can be wrong. In your picture milo looks beautiful and very happy. Enjoy him thoroughly. You should stop all this hatefull chatter on the computer and go take your lovely dog for a walk.


----------



## Braccarius

concernedaboutfairness said:


> You must remember when you are talking about dsgoldendelights that a pup can get any problem that a child can get basically. Two very healthy parents can have a child that gets cancer in preschool years. You don't hate the spouse or all other relatives because of that. You accept the child as it is and love it. also remember that vets opinions can be wrong. In your picture milo looks beautiful and very happy. Enjoy him thoroughly. You should stop all this hatefull chatter on the computer and go take your lovely dog for a walk.


A Breeder can produce a displaystic pup and injuries can be the cause of diplaysia, nobody denies that. When you find an outlier like that it is very disheartening. When a breeder produces dogs from uncleared parents, such as what Golden Delights has apparently been doing you are playing a game of chance. And, unfortunately one of our members lost. 

You do accept and love the dog... you're right. And Milo, I'm sure is going to live the best life, one that is envied. But, this breeder cost a loving, great, fantastic owner thousands of dollars... and in my opinion did something even worse... made her witness the suffering of an animal she loved. 

If you were concerned about fairness, I ask you if what happened to this owner was fair? Is it fair to misrepresent your breeding stock as certified only to find out that they are, in fact, not certified? Is it fair to charge the same amount as a reputable breeder who clears their stock at a substiantial expense? 

As for taking her dog for a walk.... she probably can't the displaysia is so bad.


----------



## Braccarius

Betty said:


> Well, I couldn't have told the story any better than Danielle. I am Molly's Mom and we did meet Milo and his parents, Danielle and Andrew, in the waiting room. It was such a surprise to find a sibling right there with exactly the same problem as our Molly. His hips were just as bad and started to shows signs at 6 months, exactly like Molly.
> 
> We are very pleased her surgery went so well. She still has to be careful till it mends completely. She was confined to her crate and a small area in front of it for the 8 weeks following surgery. She was amazed as we let her walk through the house again. She was looking up at pictures and just taking it all in. It was great. And we took a couple brief walks, and we definitely have to go back to basic training. She's doing well, though. I agree 100% that D's Golden Delights is not a good place to buy a puppy. I tell everyone who is even thinking about a dog, not to go to her.


Welcome to the forum, I hope you stick around and get to know us! A lot of people here have had HD dogs and surgury and they are really great at helping out! Its sad that you guys met this way, but at least now you have a HD Support Group if you need it ;-)


----------



## Blondie

Just read this thread. Without going into the bad breeder behavior I can say on a positive note that you are fortunate to have found each other and can feel comfortable building a golden friendship and support one another through your goldens. Reuniting siblings sounds so fun.


----------



## Lestorm

What a sad way to be reunited. After living on top of each other for 7-8 weeks Im certain that their scent is imprinted in their little brains. most of our pups that are reunited remember each other.....and me!!

I hope that you can get your money back to help toward the op. Did you have your dog insured?


----------



## LibertyME

RustysMom said:


> I assure you, I am not a breeder. I am a very happy past customer of D's and it is a shame you all bash someone w/o even knowing her. MiloMom even said she never contacted D's except today with the above email that she just posted. BHow would you like it if someone bashed your name on a forum that never talk to you or even know you like you all on this forum are doing? Again, shame on all of you!


No one is bashing her personally,., she may be lovely woman with a sweet family that love her...but her breeding program sucks.


----------



## LibertyME

Betty said:


> Well, I couldn't have told the story any better than Danielle. I am Molly's Mom and we did meet Milo and his parents, Danielle and Andrew, in the waiting room. It was such a surprise to find a sibling right there with exactly the same problem as our Molly. His hips were just as bad and started to shows signs at 6 months, exactly like Molly.
> 
> We are very pleased her surgery went so well. She still has to be careful till it mends completely. She was confined to her crate and a small area in front of it for the 8 weeks following surgery. She was amazed as we let her walk through the house again. She was looking up at pictures and just taking it all in. It was great. And we took a couple brief walks, and we definitely have to go back to basic training. She's doing well, though. I agree 100% that D's Golden Delights is not a good place to buy a puppy. I tell everyone who is even thinking about a dog, not to go to her.


Glad you are here Molly's Mom.
Not that you need one more thing to do...but would you consider submitting your dogs presurgical xrays to OFA so that the factual information is out there in a respected, public database?


----------



## Bender

concernedaboutfairness said:


> You must remember when you are talking about dsgoldendelights that a pup can get any problem that a child can get basically. Two very healthy parents can have a child that gets cancer in preschool years. You don't hate the spouse or all other relatives because of that. You accept the child as it is and love it. also remember that vets opinions can be wrong. In your picture milo looks beautiful and very happy. Enjoy him thoroughly. You should stop all this hatefull chatter on the computer and go take your lovely dog for a walk.


Even cancer is something an ETHICAL breeder would take into consideration and breed away from, by making sure that the grandparents of the dogs they breed are still alive and kicking into their older years whenever possible. 

For hips, there are tests that can be done to see what the parent's hips are like, and thus greatly reduce the chances of pups with poorly formed hips. 

The horrible part is this 'breeder' apparently is aware of health testing as she now has a male with clearances (maybe, no way to prove it considering the dogs don't have registered names or numbers on clearances - another 'trick' of poor breeders), but the female has no clearances mentioned. It's one thing to be ignorant of clearances outright (and in today's internet world that's a tough one, how could you NOT be aware of clearances in breeding dogs), but a totally different thing to be so cruel as to claim clearances on one dog (but give no way to prove it) and not the dog you breed it to. That to me is just short of animal abuse, and if it were up to me, the dogs would be removed, spayed and rehomed to responsible owners to prevent more sick dogs from being bred.

I am just glad these two owners are responsible enough to follow through with the surgery so their pups CAN live a long life - I wonder if they have littermates who won't be so lucky and get put to sleep. How is that being 'fair' to the breeder to pretend it never happened?


----------



## MilosMommy

concernedaboutfairness said:


> You must remember when you are talking about dsgoldendelights that a pup can get any problem that a child can get basically. Two very healthy parents can have a child that gets cancer in preschool years. You don't hate the spouse or all other relatives because of that. You accept the child as it is and love it. also remember that vets opinions can be wrong. In your picture milo looks beautiful and very happy. Enjoy him thoroughly. You should stop all this hatefull chatter on the computer and go take your lovely dog for a walk.


I would love to go take my beautiful boy for a walk but since he has been 6 months old walks have been cut out (doctors orders) because his horrible hips can't handle a walk, even on daily pain medicine, one walk around the block and he is limping for the rest of the day.

We went to 2 vets, both agree he has cripalling hip dysplasia, perhaps you missed my post with his xrays.

And I do love and accept my boy. I have NOTHING against him, hence the reason we are spending $4,600 on a new hip plus all of the money we have already spend on xrays & medicine. I want to keep him around for a while.

However, I have nothing nice to say about Ds Golden Delights as a breeder. She is doing nothing to help the breed by breeding dogs that were too young & uncleared.


----------



## CAGK71

MilosMommy said:


> I would love to go take my beautiful boy for a walk but since he has been 6 months old walks have been cut out (doctors orders) because his horrible hips can't handle a walk, even on daily pain medicine, one walk around the block and he is limping for the rest of the day.
> 
> We went to 2 vets, both agree he has cripalling hip dysplasia, perhaps you missed my post with his xrays.
> 
> And I do love and accept my boy. I have NOTHING against him, hence the reason we are spending $4,600 on a new hip plus all of the money we have already spend on xrays & medicine. I want to keep him around for a while.
> 
> However, I have nothing nice to say about Ds Golden Delights as a breeder. She is doing nothing to help the breed by breeding dogs that were too young & uncleared.


You tell 'em Danielle! I'm not an expert on breeding, etc but I would think that if you are going to breed dogs that you want to ensure that the parents are the healthiest dogs out there, not just because they have nice coats, etc. Just like arthritis (sp?), certain cancers in humans, it is all genetic and hereditary. If I was not able to get pregnant and is looking for a donor (egg or sperm), you want to make sure that the donor is healthy and has no underlying health issues that can be passed onto my child. Obviously there is never any quarantees but if the clearances were all there and still Milo had HD, then it wouldn't be such a hard pill to swallow. Knowing that the breeder intentionally mislead Danielle and Betty as well as countless other buyers is just criminal.

What are these 2 posters defending such a bad breeder? Her breeding practice is questionable and she should be banned from breeding until she understands the importances of getting clearances for her dogs and ensuring they are of age to begin breeding.


----------



## kateann1201

:doh: Milo's mom - it's ALWAYS a new member...AKA: The Breeder/Greeder. You know it is...she won't answer your emails, but she'll pop off on a forum anonymously. :slap:

To the breeder making fake accounts here to respond: Walk her dysplastic dog, REALLY?? :crazy: Why not address this in an email response to Milo's mom and rectify the situation YOU caused? You type the type, now walk the walk...:thanks:


----------



## MilosMommy

I'm sure it is her or one of her children/friends. How stupid do they think we are. 

And yea, telling me to walk my dog with severe HD was a punch in the heart. You try having a 6-12 month old puppy that can't run and chase a ball or go for a nice long walk with his owners in the fresh air. He spends his days inside looking out the window. Thanks.


----------



## Sally's Mom

Good job with Milo, Danielle. But it is also true (not in your case) that bad things CAN happen to good breeders. And I think everyone who breeds dogs needs to remember that. I can't wait to here about Milo's successful surgery and wonderful recovery. Best wishes.


----------



## jmamom

Just wanted to say hi, and give you a little support. Don't even waste your energy responding to the "new members" negative comments, it's not worth it. I'm glad you connected with Molly's parents, I'm sure seeing her doing so well must make you very hopeful for Milo. Best of luck with his surgery, and hugs from Josie!!!!


----------



## jweisman54

I just read this entire thread and was disheartened by the breeder. Shame on her for breeding dogs just for profit.
I hope Milo does well with his surgery. He sounds like he is a fighter and is his mom!


----------



## Sweet Girl

MilosMommy said:


> I'm sure it is her or one of her children/friends. How stupid do they think we are.
> 
> *And yea, telling me to walk my dog with severe HD was a punch in the heart. You try having a 6-12 month old puppy that can't run and chase a ball or go for a nice long walk with his owners in the fresh air. He spends his days inside looking out the window. Thanks*.


When I read that post from that person, I thought, oh, God, I hope Milo'sMummy doesn't see this! It was a totally ignorant and stupid thing to say to you - clearly this person has no clue what HD is.

I hope you're doing ok - and Milo, too. Nice to see Molly's owner has joined us. 

Don't let the mysterious new anonymous posters get ya down!


----------



## artbuc

I sent an email to Ds Golden Delight asking a few basic questions. No response. I assume she knew what I was doing. However, even if she did suspect something, she missed a good opportunity to tell her side. It is interesting to note that her website does not claim OFA certification. She claims CHIC certification which isn't certification at all, at least as it relates to HD (stud only, no claims made regarding the bitch). Does anyone know if the GR parent club requires OFA HD certification? If yes, results should be available to the public. Here is a response from OFA to my question about OFA vs. CHIC certification:

Start Quote:

CHIC does not provide hip dysplasia certification, OFA does.

CHIC is only a recognition that all health testing as recommended by the breed’s parent club has been completed, with all results registered, and accessible in the public domain.

Thanks.

Eddie Dziuk
Chief Operating Officer
Orthopedic Foundation for Animals
2300 E Nifong Blvd.
Columbia, MO 65201
Phone: (573) 442-0418 x222 Fax: (573) 875-5073
Email: [email protected]
Website: www.offa.org


End Quote

Trying to be fair to Ds Golden Delights, the fact that no health claims are made regarding the bitch should be a major warning flag.


----------



## Cathy's Gunner

Thank goodness for GRF to get the word out. I didn't realize that a comment I made about Gunner's breeder in a thread is there for anyone to read if you type in my breeders name. I just googled it and there it was... No wonder I haven't heard from him. You are doing a great job with Milo, Milo's mom and we all pray for a successful surgery and recovery.


----------



## amy22

I just read through this thread. I am so very sorry that Milo and Molly have this condition...but so thankful that they have wonderful families that are able to help them to get better.
Please keep us posted on Milos progress.
Welcome to the GRF Mollys Mom!


----------



## Bender

CHIC is more of a database of clearances - to be on there the dog has to have all the required ones done - not passed, but done. So a dysplastic dog with an OFA number could be on there.


----------



## busymomof4

*Trying to be neutral.*

Milo's Mom, I am sorry that your pup is hurting, but bashing the breeder is really not the best way to accomplish whatever it is you are out to accomplish. I know you are going to bash me for posting because this is my first ever post here, but I have a 2 year old pup from D's and googled the website to look into current pups. When I saw this post, it made my heart sink. There is so much I want to say to you and many others that posted on this thread, but I can't say it all b/c it would be very lengthy! Our pup Lulu is very healthy and is the sweetest pup. She is great with our 4 little ones. I know others who have pups from there and all of their pups are healthy as well. The funny thing about genetics is that sometimes a condition shows up, and other times it does not. It''s not that way only with dogs, but humans and other animals as well. Some parents know taht there is a chance that if they have a child together, that they "might" have something "wrong" with them. But those parents still go ahead and have children. The thing is, God places these children and furry children in our lives for a reason. Milo is lucky to have parents like you to take care of him and help him be happy. And the fact the you met another couple who has a pup with the same problem from the same litter is just that, "a miracle". God performs these awesome miracles, and puts the people in our lives that he thinks we need. That is why you crossed paths with Molly's parents. They are both lucky to have you. We are actually going to start the whole process of taking our other pup, a 7 year old rescue to the vet for the same thing, HD.
To watch them in pain is not pleasant, and I feel your pain for that. Looking at the great pictures that you have posted of your family, you look like you are a very nice person. I think maybe you just went about this all wrong. Bashing her and not trying to explain the situation to her rationally before posting this thread is, well, just plain mean. And to all the others that have just joined in on the bash without knowing her, think about how immature it really is. I am not bashing you all, it’s just that we aren’t a bunch of 7th grade girls here. I was really disheartened by quite a few of kateann1201’s posts. Stating that it is just too easy to bash this breeder is sad. And I am sure that upon looking back on that, you probably aren’t too proud of that one. But that isn’t the point of my post. Many of you are putting her down for breeding such young pups. If it were me, I wouldn’t, as I am sure most of you wouldn’t either. BUT, as many have mentioned, AKC states that they must be 8 months, and they were. If it was bad for the mom, at that age, then the AKC wouldn’t have approved that age. Plain and simple. You are just talking yourself in circles. There is so much more I would want to say, but I will go with just one more. My aunt and uncle have 2 goldens at this time. They also had one other who has since passed. They buy theirs from a top of the line breeder in the country. One of their current pups has severe hip problems. The breeder has probably the best breeding program I have ever seen. And yet they too have a pup with hip problems. You see, it is out of our control, no matter how much we try to control it. God has control, and that is where you need to start. Once you understand that, then it becomes easier to understand what direction you need to go in. Thanks for your time. And good luck Milo.

P.S. I noticed you too are from Maryland. We are too, and are very displeased with our vet. Since we are going to start this whole process, I would kindly ask where you take Milo. If it’s within a reasonable distance, I would love to try them. Ours is awful.


----------



## Sally's Mom

Busymomof4... where do I start??? I have said earlier in this thread that bad things happen to good breeders. You can do ALL of the clearances at ALL of the appropriate ages and still end up with CHD, ED, SAS, you name it. The point with this breeder is that the dogs were not old enough to have ALL of the age appropriate clearances when they were bred. And do not bring the AKC into it. they do not care about clearances, they care about parentage...

And most of us do have issues with breeding such "young pups". The girls that I have bred were way too young at under one year. 

And FYI most "top of the line" golden breeders do not sell "breeding stock" to just anyone. What is the kennel??

Anyone can breed a dog with health issues (because genetics are not tried and true), but it is how the breeder handles it that causes people on this forum to react. Danielle is doing her best for Milo and no one should question that.

No bitch under one year of age is ready to be bred....


----------



## fostermom

Oh my gosh, those x-rays are heartbreaking! But the good news is, he can live a full and happy life after surgery, just ask my Jasmine.

It's a shame that a "breeder" can even defend breeding an 8 month old puppy and then deny that they are producing (or rather just breeding to make money) displastic puppies. They should be ashamed of themselves for producing puppies/dogs that will be in horrible pain, some that have been sold to people who can't, or won't repair their hips. I guess the almighty dollar is all they can see. Karma will be a b****, that's all I can hope.


----------



## Sally's Mom

I put my heart and soul into my dogs, and my "belief system" has nothing to do with it.I am a member of the GRCA where having the appropriate clearances at the appropriate ages makes a difference. What you say makes me so angry because I find it so ignorant. I have no bone to pick with this breeder, and if I never breed another litter, it is no big deal financially. I have a day job that pays my bills and the dogs are my passion.


----------



## kateann1201

Oh here we gooooooo again. Hey "BusyMomof4" or whoever you claim to be: Your posts make no sense, and if you have a problem with my posts then address me directly. I'm so over these fake new members defending such a blatant disregard of the healthy practices of such an irresponsible (yeah I said it) greeder. You are no different than the other phonies posting here. Apparently it's too difficult for you to comprehend what good breeding practices are and thus defend them in length on this forum. Your post only goes to show how naive you are. If this "breeder" is so wonderful, why have they not replied to Milo's mom? Are they embarrassed, ashamed, or simply do not give a crud what kind of pups they produce - because hey - after they have the money - game over. Right?!?! How do you defend that? You can't. And your attempts are pitiful. 

When and if I buy another Golden, I will do my due dilligence on breeders, and I expect them to do the same to me. Any one not willing to back up their claims won't be worth my time. Obviously, you feel differently. Good luck to you and your dog...hopefully it won't happen to yours. And God help you if it does, because the "breeder" won't give a flying hoot.


----------



## LibertyME

BusyMomof4
The problem I have with comparing parents choosing to have a child even though there is some risk of a health problem and breeding dogs is that
A. As human beings we have choice, we choose our partner (with the obvious exceptions of rape), we choose to use birth control or not and we can even choose to end a pregnancy - Dogs dont have any say in their breeding, therefore it is up to the human beings to be responsible.
B. We dont breed and sell our offspring for profit....

I can not get my head around why it is such a big deal to spend approx $1000.00 (200 for hips and elbows, 200 for cardiac, 480 for eyes (over 12 year period) plus registration fees to get a few BASIC health clearances.

EVEN if the worst case happens and a breeding results in a pup with health issues.
A RESPONSIBLE breeder will want to know and add that info to the database so that if and when science can make some definitive links - there will be data there for them to work with.

If youre not part of the solution youre part of the problem!

AKC is a breed pedigree registry.
It is not their function to set the breed standards for each individual breed. 
That is the responsibility of the individual breed clubs - in the case of Golden Retrievers it is The Golden Retriever Club of America Golden Retriever Club of America - All About Goldens. 
The AKC may have a generic minimum standard, but their bare minimum does not address the individual health concerns of the MANY breeds in the registry.
Your point is irrelevant.

Like you, I beleive that God does indeed put people in our lives and has others cross our paths for a reason. I believe that MilosMommy was put here not only for her dog, but also for other puppy buyers to learn from her experience. My guess is that what they will learn by avoiding similar breeders will save them a ton of heartache


----------



## CarolinaCasey

LibertyME said:


> BusyMomof4
> The problem I have with comparing parents choosing to have a child even though there is some risk of a health problem and breeding dogs is that
> A. As human beings we have choice, we choose our partner (with the obvious exceptions of rape), we choose to use birth control or not and we can even choose to end a pregnancy - Dogs dont have any say in their breeding, therefore it is up to the human beings to be responsible.
> B. We dont breed and sell our offspring for profit....
> 
> I can not get my head around why it is such a big deal to spend approx $1000.00 (200 for hips and elbows, 200 for cardiac, 480 for eyes (over 12 year period) plus registration fees to get a few BASIC health clearances.
> 
> EVEN if the worst case happens and a breeding results in a pup with health issues.
> A RESPONSIBLE breeder will want to know and add that info to the database so that if and when science can make some definitive links - there will be data there for them to work with.
> 
> If youre not part of the solution youre part of the problem!
> 
> AKC is a breed pedigree registry.
> It is not their function to set the breed standards for each individual breed.
> That is the responsibility of the individual breed clubs - in the case of Golden Retrievers it is The Golden Retriever Club of America Golden Retriever Club of America - All About Goldens.
> The AKC may have a generic minimum standard, but their bare minimum does not address the individual health concerns of the MANY breeds in the registry.
> Your point is irrelevant.
> 
> Like you, I beleive that God does indeed put people in our lives and has others cross our paths for a reason. I believe that MilosMommy was put here not only for her dog, but also for other puppy buyers to learn from her experience. My guess is that what they will learn by avoiding similar breeders will save them a ton of heartache


Excellent post.

Mom of 4, you need to understand that the problem is that this breeder could have circumvented many of the problems and heartache of several families if they had taken the time to get clearances. These clearances help breeders to determine healthy breeding stock from unhealthy. Yes, genetics can throw you for a loop, but it is best to start with the best chances possible. You got lucky. Plain and simple.


----------



## iansgran

Is there any way the moderates can tell if these people who are supporting the breeder are one and the same? Do they come from the same email address for instance?
Also, you who are more tech savy than I, what can we do so that is someone googles this breeder they are also going to be lead to some of the posts here? When I googled ds golden delights about three down this thread did come up. Can we get it placed closer?


----------



## Champ

Wow so sorry to hear about your golden boy. Sounds like a terrible breeder. But Milo is very lucky to a wonderful family that will take great care of him through this.


----------



## MilosMommy

I will not continue to defend what I have said and why I have said it about Ds Golden Delights to new posters. There are facts & xrays to prove everything.

All I can say is that I whole heartedly wish that when I searched "Ds Golden Delights" a thread like this popped up because I would have NEVER gotten a puppy from her. (It would have saved us a TON of money and most importantly, a lot of heart ache. Going through this with Milo has emotionally drained me) I wish that I was as educated then as I am now. I wish someone would have warned me. I wish someone would have told me about clearances. I wish someone would have told me what the heck HD was. I wish someone told me how much a THR would cost. I wish someone would have told me that my life will be dedicated 100% to my pup after getting a THR for FOUR months.

So now if ONE person reads this and runs away from Ds, does their research, and finds a reputable breeder in MD then all of this is worth it.

Many people have said it & it's so true.. I'm sure not all of her puppies are as lucky as Milo & Molly and that breaks my heart.

ANY WAY, this is our last weekend to spend time with Milo before the surgery. He will spend the next 16 weeks recovering in his pen. No play time. No visitors. 

We intend to make the best out of the weekend. There is about an inch of snow outside from last night so he goes out periodically to play in it and then takes a nice long nap because it drains him completely. Next winter will be a different story though  

SO all of you who hate me for bashing Ds, please enjoy the next 4 months with your dogs because they wont be very enjoyable for us or Milo. Thanks.


----------



## janine

Ian'sgran said:


> Is there any way the moderates can tell if these people who are supporting the breeder are one and the same? Do they come from the same email address for instance?


I don't think they is any question they are the same person. 

Good luck Milo ... my thoughts are with you and I hope you have a good weekend. Keep us updated while Milo heals, we wish him the best.


----------



## busymomof4

Milo's Mommy,
I never said I hated you for bashing D's. And to those of you bashing on my post, I never claimed to know squat about breeding. What I do know is, that contacting the breeder with a calm, informative email, or calling her and rationally explaining to her that your poor baby boy has HD would have been a better way to go about things. Then she would know taht maybe it isn't a good idea to breed that mom adn dad because the gene pool from the 2 of them isn't good. I like to be informed when I am doing something wrong. But I only become aware of this, when someone takes the time to tell me so. She's really a great lady, and she does care about her pups. When you approach someone attitude, they are moore than likely going to put up a shield and go on the offensive. Try to work it out and talk to her peacefully, it works better than anger. So instead of bashing her, take the time to help her correct things that may be wrong. You are doing a great job of taking care of Milo. This is the first ever forum taht I have taken part in, and I probably won't be back on, b/c like my username says, I have 4 kids and don't have the time. My husband just gave me a talking to for wasting my time on here. But my heart led me to join this one. And for kateann and others who think I am the breeder in disguise, think what you want. I'm a 32 year old, stay at home, mom of 4, well 6 if you count the furry ones. I've realized that most of you are just going to bash whatever I say anyway, b/c that's what makes you happy. And that's disheartening. 
I looked through your threads and saw you take Milo to a place in Towson. Any chances you might give me the name. Like I said before, I could really use a good vet. Nittany is gonna need it. If not, good like over the next few months. And maybe just think about taking a different approach. You never know where it might get you. )


----------



## MilosMommy

Mollys owners contacted her months ago and she did not care, she said to give her the puppy back and she would give them the money back. Who in their right mind would do that? Maybe if she was a good breeder I would have cared enough to not get nasty in my email. But like I've said before, she's not.

We take Milo to CVRC in Towson. Dr. Weeren is Milos suregon.


----------



## BeauShel

We do check all new members and if they have the same address we will shut them down. 

LibertyME said it best on what breeders should do. 

Milo'sMommy I will keep Milo in my prayers for his surgery and hope it will not be as bad as they think. Please dont try to defend yourself to other people, we know you are doing the best for him and to help other people in the future. It is not bashing if it is the truth. This breeder did not follow the GRCA guidelines to be a responsible breeder, shame on them. They are hurting the breed and owners like MilosMommy and the couple that has Milo's sister. http://www.grca.org/pdf/all_about/codeofethics.pdf


----------



## mylissyk

Robbie had knee surgery twice, one right after the other with a total of four months crate rest, so I know it seems like forever, but it will pass quicker than you think.

So I hope that the time goes by quickly and when he is recovered you will thoroughly enjoy getting to let him play and run the way he was meant to. It is amazing how well dogs do after THR, and I am looking forward to hearing about all the fun you and Milo will have after this is all over.


----------



## crayola_sky

okay, ive gone back and read from start to finish.

1) milos mom, i am so sorry you and your pups sisters family are going through this. I am glad you found eachother, not only so that you have that support.. but that after all the surgerys and healing are over, your pups may create a cool bond again.
I have a king charles..and we randomly met his 'brother' (different years) up island once. it was a very cool moment, as both dogs seemd to 'sense' something.

2) i hope things go smoothly with the surgery and recovery, you are amazing people for being able to help your beautiful boy out like this. he is one lucky pup.

3)Good for you for bringing awareness to this breeder. I came upon this site from a google search of the breeder i am thinking of adopting from (not the same obviously im no where close to there) but people google searching the breeder will find this topic and you have helped people for sure.


----------



## kateann1201

busymomof4 said:


> _* And to those of you bashing on my post, I never claimed to know squat about breeding.*_


You sure had plenty of crazy theories in your first post. You may want to reread what you wrote.

[/QUOTE]_* Then she would know taht maybe it isn't a good idea to breed that mom adn dad because the gene pool from the 2 of them isn't good.*_ [/QUOTE]

Newsflash: You don't need to be the sharpest tool in the shed to know that breeding dogs at 7-8 months old is just plain wrong. And as you've read on this thread, clearances would have shown her breeding stock's "less than stellar" hips. But the breeder would have had to wait until the dog was mature to have them cleared.

[/QUOTE]* So instead of bashing her, take the time to help her correct things that may be wrong.*[/QUOTE]

So now it's the puppy buyers responsibility to teach this breeder how to breed dogs properly? Oh my...

[/QUOTE] _*I've realized that most of you are just going to bash whatever I say anyway, b/c that's what makes you happy.*_ [/QUOTE]

You call it "bashing" when someone calls you out on your nonsensical comments. Maybe I have tougher e-feelings than you. In any case, I don't sugar coat anything.


Although...I do feel special now that you've mentioned me twice in your posts :roflmao:


----------



## CAROLINA MOM

MilosMommy-I am so sorry for what you, Milo as well as his sister and her owners are going through. This is a very sad and unfortunate situation for all-it's obvious how much you love your boy and are willing to do whatever is needed to care for him.

As you said, some pups/dogs are not as fortunate maybe because their owners are not in the financial situation to provide the needed surgery and care.

I am a volunteer with one of the Golden Ret. Resuces here in NC-over the few years I have been with this group, they have taken in several goldens that needed hip surgery through Owner Surrenders because the owners could not afford to have it done. The Resuce took the dogs in, paid for the surgery, the dogs became healthy, were medically cleared, were adopted to wonderful homes and today are living a full active life. 

I feel something good always comes from a bad situation-in this case you have educated some people by bringing this to attention. 

I hope Milo's surgery goes well, wish him a speedy recovery.


----------



## Betty

*Molly's X rays*



LibertyME said:


> Glad you are here Molly's Mom.
> Not that you need one more thing to do...but would you consider submitting your dogs presurgical xrays to OFA so that the factual information is out there in a respected, public database?


Can you tell me more about this? I would be glad to do anything to help keep anyone else running into this heartbreak. Molly missed most of her puppyhood, not to mention the expense. thanks.


----------



## Betty

busymomof4 said:


> Milo's Mommy,
> I never said I hated you for bashing D's. And to those of you bashing on my post, I never claimed to know squat about breeding. What I do know is, that contacting the breeder with a calm, informative email, or calling her and rationally explaining to her that your poor baby boy has HD would have been a better way to go about things. Then she would know taht maybe it isn't a good idea to breed that mom adn dad because the gene pool from the 2 of them isn't good. I like to be informed when I am doing something wrong. But I only become aware of this, when someone takes the time to tell me so. She's really a great lady, and she does care about her pups. When you approach someone attitude, they are moore than likely going to put up a shield and go on the offensive. Try to work it out and talk to her peacefully, it works better than anger. So instead of bashing her, take the time to help her correct things that may be wrong. You are doing a great job of taking care of Milo. This is the first ever forum taht I have taken part in, and I probably won't be back on, b/c like my username says, I have 4 kids and don't have the time. My husband just gave me a talking to for wasting my time on here. But my heart led me to join this one. And for kateann and others who think I am the breeder in disguise, think what you want. I'm a 32 year old, stay at home, mom of 4, well 6 if you count the furry ones. I've realized that most of you are just going to bash whatever I say anyway, b/c that's what makes you happy. And that's disheartening.
> I looked through your threads and saw you take Milo to a place in Towson. Any chances you might give me the name. Like I said before, I could really use a good vet. Nittany is gonna need it. If not, good like over the next few months. And maybe just think about taking a different approach. You never know where it might get you. )


I would like to jump in here if I may. I am Molly's Mom - Milo's sibling. I contacted the breeder in an email and told her in a very calm manner what the Vet had told me about Molly's hip and that the breeder needs to know so she will stop breeding those dogs. I really thought that she didn't know. She first replied and said she would check it out. Then I got an email from her that seemed like she didn't even believe me although I had given her my vet's phone number to verify. She said she had checked and no one else seemed to have that problem. She said "bring back the puppy and I'll give you your money back". It was after this very blunt and nasty reply that I told her that I had done what the vet suggested and at least she knew that at least one of the pups was born deformed. This was when Molly was 6 months old. So, I did send a very calm reply as I thought that she would not know that there was a problem if I didn't tell her and others said that a reputable breeder would give the money back towards the medical bills. I rather suspect she would go broke if she did that.


----------



## mylissyk

Betty said:


> I would like to jump in here if I may. I am Molly's Mom - Milo's sibling. I contacted the breeder in an email and told her in a very calm manner what the Vet had told me about Molly's hip and that the breeder needs to know so she will stop breeding those dogs. I really thought that she didn't know. She first replied and said she would check it out. Then I got an email from her that seemed like she didn't even believe me although I had given her my vet's phone number to verify. She said she had checked and no one else seemed to have that problem. She said "bring back the puppy and I'll give you your money back". It was after this very blunt and nasty reply that I told her that I had done what the vet suggested and at least she knew that at least one of the pups was born deformed. This was when Molly was 6 months old. So, I did send a very calm reply as I thought that she would not know that there was a problem if I didn't tell her and others said that a reputable breeder would give the money back towards the medical bills. I rather suspect she would go broke if she did that.



I'm glad you joined the board Betty. I hope Molly's hip surgery gives her freedom to run and play like she should.


----------



## LibertyME

Betty said:


> Can you tell me more about this? I would be glad to do anything to help keep anyone else running into this heartbreak. Molly missed most of her puppyhood, not to mention the expense. thanks.


How old was your dog when his pre-surgery xrays were taken?

This is OFAs page on 'prelims' (evaluations on dogs under 24 months old

Orthopedic Foundation for Animals: Policies


----------



## Bender

busymomof4 - This 'breeder' does know about clearances, there's no hiding behind her pretending she didn't know what hip, elbow, heart and eye clearances are. It's on her website for her current breeding sire that he has 'all health clearances' done and lists them. However that dog was bred to a dog with NO clearances listed. Which says a lot. Sorry, she's a horrible breeder who hides behind cute pictures of puppies and claims to care about the breed. If she truly cared about the breed, she would not be breeding uncleared puppies and would be upfront with listing clearances on dogs she did breed, as well as the registered names of all of the dogs. And her contract wouldn't consist of giving a loved pet back to her to get a refund.


----------



## Handpants

Thank you, Danielle, for posting your story about Milo. I read the entire thread about Milo's breeder, and I learned a lot from reading the thread about what to look for. You may have saved me from some possible future heartache.

I hope Milo's surgery goes well (I think it was today!), and he will be out of pain and playing happily as soon as possible.


----------



## OutWest

Somehow I completely missed this thread and doing this on my phone it's hard to read all the replies. But, I am a public relations/media pro. If you haven't done so already you should tell this story to some reporters. If you want to PM me, I can give you some advice on how to do that. Tomorrow I'll read the rest of the thread. Hope Milo is doing OK.


----------



## momtoMax

Just read the last page...another surgery? God love you and your other half for constantly pouring money and heartache into Milo - you are such loving owners. Milo is so lucky to have found you. I'm sorry to read he needed another surgery.  PS. I only read the last page so

So mommyof4, if you are new here then you've a lot to learn about breeding and some of the very dirty handed things that are done. There are people on this board how have loved and cared for dogs like Milo who feel his constant pain in their hearts as their own. There are others who feel very strongly about how horrible a person must be to know that they animals they are bringing into the world face a lifetime of intense pain - innocent creatures - so you trying to suggest we just more love and understanding for morons and hateful horrible people who do this really isn't going to go over well. It's not about you, it's about your message - which by this time next year I assure you will have changed. 
Don't take it personally, I've ruffled a few feathers in my time here - I'm hardly posting now so I've been golden for a long time  Any hot feelings will stick to this thread, you'll find that if you post to other threads, it will not affect those or other's approach and friendliness to you. That's something else you have to learn to take in stride here - 2 people at odds on one thread yet laughing and friendly on others.


----------



## Mssjnnfer

I don't think there's another surgery, just a thread brought back to life (which is a good thing!) 

However, I do think today is Milo's one year anniversary of his surgery!! I bet he's having a blast playing in the snow this winter, like his mommy said last year!


----------



## MilosMommy

Hey guys! Yes we just passed Milos one year anniversary! He ended up having a total hip replacement, luxating patella surgery, and then one last knee surgery because the pens came loose and migrated from the first knee surgery! He is loving life.. but we got NO snow this year  he does enjoy the dog park though  and despite his silly way of running he has a blast! Thank you for caring so much about my boy! We would do anything possible for him!


----------



## MilosMommy

OutWest said:


> Somehow I completely missed this thread and doing this on my phone it's hard to read all the replies. But, I am a public relations/media pro. If you haven't done so already you should tell this story to some reporters. If you want to PM me, I can give you some advice on how to do that. Tomorrow I'll read the rest of the thread. Hope Milo is doing OK.


I haven't told our story to any media reporters, but it is quite an amazing crazy story of bad breeding at it's best.


----------



## MilosMommy

Handpants said:


> Thank you, Danielle, for posting your story about Milo. I read the entire thread about Milo's breeder, and I learned a lot from reading the thread about what to look for. You may have saved me from some possible future heartache.
> 
> I hope Milo's surgery goes well (I think it was today!), and he will be out of pain and playing happily as soon as possible.


You're welcome! That's why I share his story and what I've learned whenever I can


----------



## mikejp56

*New to forum-Terrible story*

Hi Danielle,
I have been a Maryland resident for the last 4 years, having relocated due to my job, from New Jersey.
We had a beautiful purebred Golden named Barney that we got from a reputable breeder while we lived in NJ. 6 Months after moving here he was diagnosed with advanced lymphoma. After a month of chemotherapy, he went into remission for 2 months, and then the lymphoma came roaring back. Within a week we had to do the only thing that was humane. It still hurts to talk about it.
Anyway we were thinking about getting a new member of our family; still and always a golden. D's Golden Delights came up on an internet search, and we thought, Wow, she is slow close to us.
However after spending about 3 hours reading this thread, needless to say we are steering clear of D's.
I sincerely hope that Milo and his sister are doing well and enjoying life to the fullest.
Thanks again for saving another family from falling prey to D's Golden Delights!
Regards,
Mike


----------



## Jodi

*D's Golden Delights*

Hello

Was doing a search on Google to see what I could find regarding the breeder, D's Golden Delights..
I bought a Golden (male) from her about 2 years ago.. We just found out last week that he has very bad hips and his left knee is worse. They put him on pain meds. I know two other dogs from the same little who also have very bad hips/knees..
I'm wondering if there is anyone else out there who bought from the same litter and if there is anything we can do?!?

I do remember the father was a big guy and the mother was very thin, and scared.

There has to be a way of stopping their bad breeding!

Not sure if we can put email address on here or not.. jodster77 at aol dot com


----------



## Debbie Jansen

I just encountered a 'responsible breeder'. I went to her house, saw the parents and one puppy. The breeder said the 'clearances' were on-line. Checked them out and the dam (the mom) had been given a 'fair' hip clearance at 9 months. I didn't see the 24 month hip check. CHecked with the OFA and they said there must be a 24 month check or the dog doesn't get clearance by the OFA organization. Called the breeder who said she only checked around 1 year, it wasn't necessary to check again since very little changed. Well, there's a reason the OFA requires the 24 month check. Since she was supposed to be a 'reputable breeder' I cancelled my order for one of her puppies. I thought it was sort of presumptuous and possibly arrogant not to play by the rules. I have had 4 goldens and while one was a rescue, the others all had the 2 year hip clearances by the OFA. I blame the breeder if she didn't have that check done, but as a purchaser you must be responsible and make sure you have the necessary clearances on the puppies parents. Hope your surgery goes OK. We did get an FHO on our rescue golden and she limped a little, but it helped her enough to live a great life (she walked, climbed mountains etc.) GOOD LUCK


----------



## Maggie'sVoice

I'm just seeing this thread since someone just posted today. I live about 30 min from Conwongo MD and D's Golden Delights was k known as far back as 2008 as a person who breeds very poor quality Goldens with known hip and health issues. They want nothing to do with anyone with health issues from their dogs and generally blames the owners for not taking care of the puppies correctly. I know if a could people going through this with them so not surprising to see this thread.


----------



## Handpants

Hello, everyone. I am just seeing this thread for the first time. I wanted to say to Milo's Mommy that when I was young, we got a golden from a friend of my brother's. The friend (who had bred the dogs) had kept one of the females in the litter as her pet. When the pups were about a year old, we made arrangements to have a play date with the doggie siblings. They seemed to know each other immediately and ran off to play like the best of friends! I also wondered if there was a scent that they recognized in each other.


----------



## Multiman

Maggie'sVoice said:


> I'm just seeing this thread since someone just posted today. I live about 30 min from Conwongo MD and D's Golden Delights was k known as far back as 2008 as a person who breeds very poor quality Goldens with known hip and health issues. They want nothing to do with anyone with health issues from their dogs and generally blames the owners for not taking care of the puppies correctly. I know if a could people going through this with them so not surprising to see this thread.


----------



## Multiman

Does anyone have any new positive or negative comments about D’s Golden Delights?


----------



## CAROLINA MOM

Multiman said:


> Does anyone have any new positive or negative comments about D’s Golden Delights?



Welcome, this thread is about D's Golden Delights. 
You may want to read through the 7 pages about the breeder and their pups.


----------



## dorfmac

Multiman said:


> Does anyone have any new positive or negative comments about D’s Golden Delights?


While my experience isn’t “new,” my Golden is over 12 and has been a fantastic companion with a great temperament and mentor dog. Seasonal allergies have been her only health concern, which isn’t uncommon.

Other health issues have been a torn ACL and a bout of diskospondylitis, a bacterial infection. Both of these are not tied to genetics, obviously, just bad luck.

At 12 she is starting to slow down, and certainly can’t keep up with our COVID-puppy, but she is still the best **** dog I could ever ask for.


----------

