# Stacking help and question about upcoming show



## CAROLINA MOM (May 12, 2009)

Bumping up


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## Tagrenine (Aug 20, 2019)

To help Felix I gently tug on his tail  I also find that he is better at standing when I’m in front of him versus on the side of him, but the tail is definitely my favorite tool for getting him to lean forward


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

livduse said:


> Ben has his second show coming up in about two weeks. Unfortunately, he’ll be the only Newf there, so will he automatically get BOB and compete in group? Also, what are some tips to help a dog lean forward into their stack? He’s still a work in progress and has a lot to mature, so I don’t want to embarrass us too much in front of the people who didn’t win BOB by default lol!


Someone can correct me if I'm wrong about this, but I seem to recall that in order to be awarded Best of Breed and move on to group competition, you have to defeat at least one other dog in your breed. You get zero points and cannot compete in group if you are the only entry.

I'm a little uncertain because this _never happens_ in Goldens, at least not in California because entries are always pretty large.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

DanaRuns said:


> Someone can correct me if I'm wrong about this, but I seem to recall that in order to be awarded Best of Breed and move on to group competition, you have to defeat at least one other dog in your breed. You get zero points and cannot compete in group if you are the only entry.
> 
> I'm a little uncertain because this _never happens_ in Goldens, at least not in California because entries are always pretty large.


Don't think this is true....

Low entry breeds win BOB as single entries all the time - and as BOB, they go on to group.

One of the shows recently - pretty sure the dog that won the sporting group (lagotto whatsit) was the only entry in her breed. Pretty sure she got BIS too.

Regarding how they get points with super low entries - I vaguely remember somebody with a sussex telling me that placements in group mattered. <= I'm not 100% sure if she was talking about CH points or GRCH points. Probably the latter.


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## LJack (Aug 10, 2012)

All BOB are eligible to show in group regardless of competition in the breed.
Yes, the class dog who is Winners and BOB can win points in group.
Here the the excerpt from the AKC rule book, Chapter 16...
SECTION 2. A dog which in its breed competition at a show shall have been placed Winners and which also shall have won its group class at the same show shall be awarded championship points figured at the highest point rating of any breed or recognized variety or height of any breed entered in the show and entitled to winners points in its group, or if it also shall have been designated Best in Show, shall be awarded championship points figured at the highest point rating of any breed or recognized variety or height of any breed entered and entitled to winners points in the show. The final points to be awarded under this section shall not be in addition to but inclusive of any points previously awarded the dog in its breed competition or under the provisions of this section.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Thanks Laura - the lady with the sussex said that her dog got majority of his points from group wins.


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## livduse (Dec 14, 2019)

Tagrenine said:


> To help Felix I gently tug on his tail  I also find that he is better at standing when I’m in front of him versus on the side of him, but the tail is definitely my favorite tool for getting him to lean forward


Oh, I never thought about this, I’ll give it a try. Thanks!


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## livduse (Dec 14, 2019)

Thanks everyone! I’m a tad bit confused about the points now. Can he earn Championship points in group? I thought that he could only get championship points in breed, is that correct?


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## LJack (Aug 10, 2012)

The short of it is yes, but only the group one winner. The full text from the AKC rule book is above.


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## LJack (Aug 10, 2012)

As an example, say a show has a single open dog Nederlandse Kooikerhondje entry and a huge Golden Retriever entry that will result in a 5 point major. Assuming the judge doesn’t withhold awards, the class dog Kooiker will be winners dog and best of breed but will not have earned any points due to lack of competition in his breed (he is the only one).

He will then advance to group competition. If he were to win the group (AKA Group One) by beating all the other Sporting dogs including the Golden, the Kooiker would be awarded a 5 point major because the Goldens had a 5 point major entry. That is a way some rare/low entry breeds hope and some times can pull points from group but is only for the Group One win and not any other group placement.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

You certainly will be awarded BOB and move on to group if you are the only entry in your breed, barring some grievous decision on the judge's part to disqualify or excuse your dog, which probably won't happen. I used to travel with a guy who showed the #1 Sealyham terrier in the country and I can assure you the grand majority of the time he was the only Sealy entered. BOB meant nothing to him, it was his ticket into the group, which he won many times!
If the Group First winner (Group One is the proper term for the Sporting group, if we're going to split hairs) is an unfinished dog, they will be awarded the highest number of points won by any breed in that group. As LJack said, if a single entry Newf wins the group, but Boxers held a 5 point major in their classes, the Newf would also win five points. 
Don't hold your breath on this, it's rare! LOL


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## DanaRuns (Sep 29, 2012)

I stand crrected, and appreciate the education.


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## livduse (Dec 14, 2019)

That makes sense. Thanks again everyone! He’s only 15 months old and isn’t even close to being fully mature. I’m also a brand new owner handler. I don’t expect to win anything in group, so we’ll use it as a good learning experience/practice. I’m hoping the next show we go to had at least a few newfs in attendance haha!


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Assuming you aren't kicked out by an unreasonable judge and your dog gets BOB sending you into group.... <= I have to say that because have heard about some judges who apparently were having a very bad day and withheld ribbons and awards....! 

Take a lot of pride and enjoy that run into the very big group ring.  Show your baby with pride and you never know what may happen.


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## GoldenGirlz (Nov 15, 2021)

Tagrenine said:


> To help Felix I gently tug on his tail  I also find that he is better at standing when I’m in front of him versus on the side of him, but the tail is definitely my favorite tool for getting him to lean forward


I have found that pressing on my pup's chest also works, but the tail tug seems more effective.


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