# A year old and still jumping and biting



## lynn1970

Maybe you shouldn't walk away when you ignore. Just stand still and make yourself boring. Or maybe you can distract him when he is doing it like going through all the commands that he knows.


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## JDK

lynn1970 said:


> Maybe you shouldn't walk away when you ignore. Just stand still and make yourself boring. Or maybe you can distract him when he is doing it like going through all the commands that he knows.


We've tried not walking away and just standing there stiff as can be with our arms crossed and not saying a word. The problem is, that doesn't stop him and he will continue to jump on you, pull on and rip your clothes, and bite your arms and/or feet. We can only stand there for so long and withstand so much pain and let him rip so many clothes before we have to take action and physically stop him. I wish it didn't have to be that way .

I run through the commands after telling him "no", but only do so once since I've been told a countless amount of times to never repeat my commands more than once since it will only teach the dog that he doesn't have to listen to me the first time. The only command I don't call out when he's doing it to other people in the house, such as my girlfriend or mother, is "come" cause I honestly don't have faith in him coming to me when he starts doing this. If I run through the commands and he doesn't listen, that's when I grab him by the collar and tell him in a loud, stern voice, "That's enough. Timeout", and lead him to his crate.

Let me also add that the behavior isn't continuous. It's sporadic. A few trainers have told me that it's probably due to boredom, but he's got hundreds of tennis balls, about 10 different bones and a half-dozen tug toys. He can't have soft toys cause he tears them apart. He play with him, walk him and do all we can to tire him out. Sometime it seems like the more tired he is, the more jumpy and nippy he gets, and the more you tell him not to do things and try and redirect his attention away from bad behavior, such as walking over and telling him to stop biting at the carpet or his bed, the more he comes after you, as if he's saying "Screw you. If I can't bite the carpet, I'm gonna bite you instead."


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## solinvictus

" If I run through the commands and he doesn't listen,"

People say all the time my dog knows his commands/cues. The dog understands the command during a quiet non distractive moment and does well. But once the dog gets over excited for whatever reason the dog doesn't listen. They have not built up enough repetition of the cue and behavior in very distracting over exciting situations.

We have to build up slowly in different situations our training in more and more distractive situations building on the dogs successes. At first you/we have to set these situations up and be in control of the situations for training for success. After lots of successful training then we can use them in non training situations.

At the very beginning we ask our dogs/pups can you sit or down in the kitchen with just me there.
Then can you sit or down with me and another family member.
Then we ask in another room such as the living room.
Then we move to the backyard, then front yard, then on the corner with more distractions, then the park.
For new people coming to the house we first set up training situations with people coming and going and coming and going with lots of repetition. Then when we are really sure the pup can do it when excited we will ask if we aren't sure we prevent the pup from acting inappropriately by crating/gating etc until we have had many successes in controled training.

Figure out when your dog is getting overly excited and for now prevent him from getting to that point by managing the situation.
Set up training scenerios that slowly build up and mimic those excited moments and practice them.

Dogs don't generalize so because the dog knows sit/down/stay when asked in one situation the dog may not really know/understand sit/down/stay when really over threshold of excitement. Any inconsistency will also break down or confuse the dogs ability to perform the wanted behaviors.

Sometimes we expect more from our dogs/pups when their bodies become mature we seem to think that their brains are just as mature. They still are puppy brains that need very consistent training. 
One of the things we as owners do is to start becoming lax in what we accept from oour dogs/pups because they seem to be listening so well and don't work on our training in more and more challenging settings and when they end up in that situation we expect more than they can give.

Don't be discouraged just re-evaluate both the pups skills and your own. Then just rebuild with training. Make it fun for the both of you.
I just think there is a miscommunication between you two. The pup doesn't think he has to perform the commands/cues during times he is over excited. He didn't have enough success in over excited controled situations for him to be able to successfully handle these occasions during uncontroled situations.

He isn't bored he just doesn't know any better.


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## vcm5

I don't have any great advice, but I would say that I would consider not using the crate as a timeout. You want the crate to be a relaxing, nice place that your dog chooses to go to and enjoys, not a punishment. Just my opinion!


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## Deb_Bayne

Bayne went through this stage at one year old too, he became so irritating that we constantly were giving him 'timeouts' in his crate. Once in a while now he'll get this way and I'll stand and say loudly, 'timeout' and he'll walk into his crate.... it takes everything in me not to laugh. I think one year of age is a transition from puppy to adult and they just don't want to grow up. Patient repetition is all you can do until he grows from that stage. Find a toy that will distract him, for example we have a ball that will stop Bayne in his tracks, he just has to have it. We only gave him that toy when he needed distraction.... Now I say 'ball' and he's off on a hunt.


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## solinvictus

Valerie is right. We shouldn't force a dog into the crate as punishment. This is another thing we should all work on. We should be able to ask our dogs/pups to go in the crate and they should comply no matter how excited they are. This is something to train for setting up lots of different crate games. We want the pup to think that the crate is a fun, safe place. 
Having a pup go into the crate as a time out doesn't have to be punishment. If we set them up to like the crate we can ask them to go to the crate and give them something to chew on in there so that they can calm down. With lots of reinforcement playing fun games with the crate, giving really good rewards in there over time asking to go to the crate, the dog will just feel good in the crate. 

Until you have a solid command that the dog will go in willingly when you ask,Instead of grabbing the pup and putting the pup into the crate. Make a game grab a toy or a greatly valued treat run to the crate calling your dog make it seem like the most fun game ever and throw in the treat or toy for the dog to get. Then give lots of praise and the chew toy or kong or bone.


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## Ljilly28

Try teaching a default down. Good things and attention comes to dogs who down-stay. Work on it with a hand signal in no conflict situations. Train it and train it until you can ask the dog down when he jumps or bites, behaviors incompatible with DOWN.


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## Charliethree

Work on building self control, dogs do not have it naturally, they have to learn it. Slowly build on the time he has to wait to eat his meals, teach 'leave it', and gradually increase the time before he receives his reward, teach stay - gradually building time, distance and distractions. Teach him 'door manners' - when he wants out, wait for him to sit - let him think about it and figure out that he needs to sit, as long as he is sitting you open the door slowly, if he gets up, you close it, and wait for him to sit (don't correct or remind him) when you open the door, and he must be still sitting, wait briefly and release him to go through, gradually build up the time before you release him, teach him 'find it'. Like you said, it is not that he is lacking physical exercise, but he could be lacking mental exercise, find ways to work his brain and make him think. My dogs are far more 'relaxed' after spending an hour in a training class and using their brains, than if they had been for a long walk.


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## baumgartml16

We had this same problem, totally random and annoying lol. Our trainer came out and observed and now things are much much better.

First of all don't play with him while sitting on the ground. It is most likely just over stimulation. You need to try to pin point when he is getting to the breaking point and try to stop play before that happens, pet him, calm him down and then resume playing once you are back to a place where he has self control again. 

When he does mouth you, say "ouch" with your deep voice, fold your arms and turn your back to him (don't walk away). He might still jump a few times but 9 times out of 10 he will eventually offer a sit. When he does this, praise, praise, praise!! Have a few treats in your pocket for this instance. 

You want to keep play time structured for now. Also if you see him getting to his "losing it" point start with some training before he can get there. Work on some basic commands to gain his focus back.

These things have worked SO well with Koda and she was quite the mouther.

If you want to play rough with him, add a cue word. My husband likes to play rough with her sometimes, I do not. So he says "Koda, wrestle" and she knows that means she gets to play with him in a different manner but she never does it to me anymore. And if she tries, I fold my arms and she quits. 

I felt like it was never going to end and now it has!  Good luck!


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## newport

Lola is two this month. She had a very bad habit out in the yard of jumping up on me( almost knocking me down!). She does it less now a year after owning her.... but if I am throwing the ball, sometimes she gets so excited she will run at me and jump on me still. I heard from one of those dog whispers on TV it is a sign that they own you or something..... and you should turn away from them each time. I am still working on that one at 2 years old. Lola does not bite.


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## Charliethree

newport said:


> Lola is two this month. She had a very bad habit out in the yard of jumping up on me( almost knocking me down!). She does it less now a year after owning her.... but if I am throwing the ball, sometimes she gets so excited she will run at me and jump on me still. I heard from one of those dog whispers on TV it is a sign that they own you or something..... and you should turn away from them each time. I am still working on that one at 2 years old. Lola does not bite.


It is hard to extinguish a behavior that was once reinforced, but it can be done with patience and persistence. Not in your case, or at least not your fault, but as puppies humans, tend to reinforce jumping up behavior by paying attention to the pup when she does it, rewarding her for doing it. I would suggest, when she jumps on you - game over- - end the game, turn away and say nothing, don't look at her, and go away, go inside and ignore her for 5 minutes, doesn't matter if she follows you or not, completely ignore her, then return to playtime (repeating the process as necessary) She will learn, in time, that jumping on you ends the funtime.

I wouldn't worry about the dog 'owning you', it is simply how she has learned to play, dogs often play by jumping on each other, she just needs to learn how to play more appropriately with people.


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## newport

Charliethree said:


> It is hard to extinguish a behavior that was once reinforced, but it can be done with patience and persistence. Not in your case, or at least not your fault, but as puppies humans, tend to reinforce jumping up behavior by paying attention to the pup when she does it, rewarding her for doing it. I would suggest, when she jumps on you - game over- - end the game, turn away and say nothing, don't look at her, and go away, go inside and ignore her for 5 minutes, doesn't matter if she follows you or not, completely ignore her, then return to playtime (repeating the process as necessary) She will learn, in time, that jumping on you ends the funtime.
> 
> I wouldn't worry about the dog 'owning you', it is simply how she has learned to play, dogs often play by jumping on each other, she just needs to learn how to play more appropriately with people.


Wow! really helpful advise!! Thank-you! I will do this next time she jumps on me and each time when ball throwing. Now that she is 70 plus pounds jumping on me is pretty dangerous for this almost 60 year old lady!:bowl:


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## JDK

All great advice, most of which we've already implemented with no success.




solinvictus said:


> " If I run through the commands and he doesn't listen,"
> 
> People say all the time my dog knows his commands/cues. The dog understands the command during a quiet non distractive moment and does well. But once the dog gets over excited for whatever reason the dog doesn't listen. They have not built up enough repetition of the cue and behavior in very distracting over exciting situations.
> 
> We have to build up slowly in different situations our training in more and more distractive situations building on the dogs successes. At first you/we have to set these situations up and be in control of the situations for training for success. After lots of successful training then we can use them in non training situations.
> 
> At the very beginning we ask our dogs/pups can you sit or down in the kitchen with just me there.
> Then can you sit or down with me and another family member.
> Then we ask in another room such as the living room.
> Then we move to the backyard, then front yard, then on the corner with more distractions, then the park.
> For new people coming to the house we first set up training situations with people coming and going and coming and going with lots of repetition. Then when we are really sure the pup can do it when excited we will ask if we aren't sure we prevent the pup from acting inappropriately by crating/gating etc until we have had many successes in controled training.
> 
> Figure out when your dog is getting overly excited and for now prevent him from getting to that point by managing the situation.
> Set up training scenerios that slowly build up and mimic those excited moments and practice them.
> 
> Dogs don't generalize so because the dog knows sit/down/stay when asked in one situation the dog may not really know/understand sit/down/stay when really over threshold of excitement. Any inconsistency will also break down or confuse the dogs ability to perform the wanted behaviors.
> 
> Sometimes we expect more from our dogs/pups when their bodies become mature we seem to think that their brains are just as mature. They still are puppy brains that need very consistent training.
> One of the things we as owners do is to start becoming lax in what we accept from oour dogs/pups because they seem to be listening so well and don't work on our training in more and more challenging settings and when they end up in that situation we expect more than they can give.
> 
> Don't be discouraged just re-evaluate both the pups skills and your own. Then just rebuild with training. Make it fun for the both of you.
> I just think there is a miscommunication between you two. The pup doesn't think he has to perform the commands/cues during times he is over excited. He didn't have enough success in over excited controled situations for him to be able to successfully handle these occasions during uncontroled situations.
> 
> He isn't bored he just doesn't know any better.


 I understand what you're saying and have tired to do so. Naturally, I started training JJ in the house where it was quite and his attention was all on me. When I felt he had his commands down, I moved his training outside where there were more sounds, smells and sights to distract him. After he conquered that, I started taking him downtown and to the park for training sessions, where there were people walking by, kids playing and screaming and yatta yatta yatta. He did and continues to do great in every situation, obeying me every step of the way. I usually mimic the people who walk around my town with the Guiding Eyes dogs.

One of the problems I'm having is pinpointing when he's about to get overly excited cause its not like he does it every time in certain situations. For example, my mother may walk in and out of the house 20 times and he'll just lay there and watch her 19 times, but on the 20th time he decides to get up and jump on her and bite her. Seeing as how he was fine the first 19 times, one would think he would be fine when she did it again, but that's not always the case. Sometimes he decides to take action, sometimes he doesn't, so it's really hard to figure out when he's about to let loose. And if my some odd chance I'm able to cut him off before the behavior, he'll direct his bad behavior towards me since I won't let him near the other person. I try my best to ignore him, but it's hard when you have a dog trying to bite you in the crotch. My natural reflexes kick in then and I tend to push him away in order to protect my privates haha

Question: If he starts jumping on me, my girlfriend, my mother or anybody else in the house, should I just tell him to "sit" and wait until he does so, even if he jumps 10 times before sitting, and than reward him with praise and treats? One of my trainers told me that I should never treat a dog after bad behavior and that if he doesn't sit the first time he shouldn't get treated cause he's going to think he got rewarded for jumping. I've been somewhat reluctant to reward him after hearing that. 



solinvictus said:


> Valerie is right. We shouldn't force a dog into the crate as punishment. This is another thing we should all work on. We should be able to ask our dogs/pups to go in the crate and they should comply no matter how excited they are. This is something to train for setting up lots of different crate games. We want the pup to think that the crate is a fun, safe place.
> Having a pup go into the crate as a time out doesn't have to be punishment. If we set them up to like the crate we can ask them to go to the crate and give them something to chew on in there so that they can calm down. With lots of reinforcement playing fun games with the crate, giving really good rewards in there over time asking to go to the crate, the dog will just feel good in the crate.
> 
> Until you have a solid command that the dog will go in willingly when you ask,Instead of grabbing the pup and putting the pup into the crate. Make a game grab a toy or a greatly valued treat run to the crate calling your dog make it seem like the most fun game ever and throw in the treat or toy for the dog to get. Then give lots of praise and the chew toy or kong or bone.


 Normally, JJ will go in his crate, or house as we call it, when he's told, running right in there and sitting down once he hears "JJ, in your house". We played crate games all the time when he was younger and still do so every so often. He just won't go in there on his own when he gets in these moods. It's like he has selective hearing and knows what's on the outside of the crate is better than what's on the inside. We've tired having people come over and getting him to go into the crate, but we've had no luck no matter how hard we try and how consistent we are. At this point, we've basically run out of neighbors who are willing to come over and help with the training since majority of them are tired of getting mauled and their clothes ripped. It doesn't matter if you throw a kong pull of treats in there or his favorite toy, he'll turn to glance at it and ignore it completely. I've even crawled into the crate myself a few times to try and entice him, which I might add isn't easy for somebody who's 6'8 to do lol. People are the most exciting thing to him, more so than any treat or toy. I've never heard a dog whimper so much when meeting people. He enjoys his crate and has no problem being in there. He hasn't whimpered once while in there since bringing him home (not even during timeouts) and usually puts himself in there when he's tired. Unless I put him in a closet or construct something in the house, I don't have another area for a timeout. 



Charliethree said:


> Work on building self control, dogs do not have it naturally, they have to learn it. Slowly build on the time he has to wait to eat his meals, teach 'leave it', and gradually increase the time before he receives his reward, teach stay - gradually building time, distance and distractions. Teach him 'door manners' - when he wants out, wait for him to sit - let him think about it and figure out that he needs to sit, as long as he is sitting you open the door slowly, if he gets up, you close it, and wait for him to sit (don't correct or remind him) when you open the door, and he must be still sitting, wait briefly and release him to go through, gradually build up the time before you release him, teach him 'find it'. Like you said, it is not that he is lacking physical exercise, but he could be lacking mental exercise, find ways to work his brain and make him think. My dogs are far more 'relaxed' after spending an hour in a training class and using their brains, than if they had been for a long walk.


Great suggestions, but I've already been doing much of what you said since the day I brought him home. I'm always making him think and working on his patience. He can hold a "sit" for a long time, whether it be in the house when we're alone or out on a walk where other people are walking by and distracting him. He never "just gets feed". When I feed him, I make him "sit". Once he sits, I put the bowl on the floor and tell him to "stay". He than must maintain eye contact with me for at least 2 minutes before I give him the "ok". To test him even more, I blurt out random words before saying "ok" to ensure he knows the meaning of "ok" and doesn't think any random word means he can just go. He knows "leave it" since it was one of the first things we had to work on with him since we have a cat that's not all that fond of him and ferrets he could eat in a matter of minutes. "Leave it" works with animals and random things he shouldn't have, but when it comes to people, leave it is like gibberish. He doesn't go out the front door until he waits and I give him the "ok". First, I make him sit before opening the door. Once he sits, I slowly open the door and tell him to "wait". I vary how long he must wait before I give him the "ok" and release him. I do this with him before entering and exiting any door, whether it be at home or out in public. I see every door/gate as an opportunity to train him and will sometimes go out of my way just to go through a random door we didn't have to go through in order to work on this. We've been working on "find it" for the past few months. We started with a muffin pan and tennis balls and hiding a treat under one of the tennis balls and making him find it. We than moved up to two muffin pans and now three, usually which I put in different parts of the house so he has to track down which muffin pan has the treat and which ball its under. He amazes me. He gets it on the first try every time, removing only one tennis ball to uncover the treat no matter how many muffin pans we use.


I'm not trying to say you guys haven't made good suggestions cause you have, so don't take what I say the wrong way. I know some people here can get their panties in a bunch when they think you're disagreeing with them. I'm just trying to explain what I've done and what I've been doing so that maybe somebody can tell me how to adjust things or how to do something differently. JJ will be starting with a personal, in-home trainer within the next two weeks so we're hoping that she'll be able to help us handle the situation by observing first hand what he's doing and what we're doing to stop it.

If I can, I'll see if I can set up a camera and record some of the behavior so you guys can see for yourself as well and maybe give me some tips based on what you see. It's just going to be a matter of having the camera recording at the right moment since you can't really determine when he's going to turn into a mental case.


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## JDK

Here's a situation that just occurred

My mother walks out of her bedroom and into the kitchen. JJ, who was minding his own business walking around the living room, bolts at her and starts jumping and pulling at her dress. She told him "no" and then "sit" and he continued to act up, jumping on her more and pulling on her skirt harder, this time ripping it. Sitting in the other room, I heard what was going on and went out the kitchen and told JJ "no" in a deep, loud voice, which caused him to turn towards me and jump at me and pull my shirt. At that point I said, "Ah Ah...JJ, sit", which made him jump on me again. When his feet touched the ground, he instantly popped back up at my mom and grabbed her skirt again, pulling on it like it was a tug toy. After about 40 seconds of him acting up like this and not listening to a single word, I was left with no option but to take him by the collar and tell him "that's enough...timeout". Mind you, now that my mother has been home since about 5pm and has had several interactions with JJ today where he could care less if she was there or not. This one time though, he decided to get a little frisky and act out. How am I suppose to see this coming when it's completely random?


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## Maddie'sMom2011

When Maddie acted this way, we'd put the gentle leader on her. It would calm her butt right down.


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## penparson

I don't think JJ's behavior is atypical of a young golden. I've had two, both males, that have gotten "wired" in the evening - i.e., they want to play when everyone else in the world wants to relax. Wake (20 mos.) will lounge around after dinner and then, at 8:30 or so, he turns into a wild man. Best thing I've found so far is to let him out in the yard and play fetch with him. Or, I'll go into another room and close the door. 
Dogs have their own timetables; every time I think about what a brat Wake is, I realize how far he's come since last summer. He's a sweetheart most of the time and his behavior has improved significantly. When he does misbehave, he usually follows the path of least resistance by annoying someone he can take advantage of. 
Good luck with JJ - things WILL get better.


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## JDK

Maddie'sMom2011 said:


> When Maddie acted this way, we'd put the gentle leader on her. It would calm her butt right down.


It was suggested by some friends on mine that I leave a short lead on him until he can fully be trusted not to randomly let loose, but I haven't done so since JJ would more than likely tear it apart no matter how many times I told him to "leave it". He annihilated a Easy Walk harness once before when the dog walker mistakenly left it on him. I was so thankfully the plastic buckles were still attached. I have once or twice before thrown the leash on him when he got this way, but that just turned his attention to me and had him jumping and biting me, and if I stood there and just ignored him and let him jump on me for a few minutes, he would eventually turn his attention to the leash.

The only improvement I've seen is that after a timeout he'll discontinue the behavior. In fact, sometimes he won't ever come out for a few minutes after I open the door for him and will instead just lay there. Once he does decide to come out, he usually runs up to the person and sits in front of them for tickles, as if he's saying sorry.


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## JDK

scenario number two for the night.

JJ randomly decides to start jumping on and biting my girlfriend while she watches TV. He didn't respond to "no" and "off" when she told him and continued to jump and bite her. I, on the other side of the room at the time, stood up to intervene and JJ failed to respond to my commands as well and started to jump and bite me, rather hard at that too. The both of us stood there with our arms crossed and our backs to him. Meanwhile, he's jumping at our backs, biting us in the ass and ripping our clothes (2nd shirt for me tonight). We continued to stand there nice and stiff, or as stiff as one can be when they're getting jumped on and bitten, and didn't make eye contact for a full 2 minutes and he continued to misbehave and didn't quit for not even a second. Seeing no sign of him stopping anytime soon and the both of us in enough pain at this point, I grab him by the collar and put him in his crate for a timeout.

What do I do here, stand there even longer and let him tear the clothes right off our backs and hope his attention turns to the shreds rather than the flesh? Suggestions are greatly needed.


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## Sally's Mom

I recently started working with my 5 y old, Mick, again. He is very exuberant and we have let him jump up on us. The first thing my OCTH trainer friend made me do last week was to teach him that the only time he will get affection is when he defaults to down. It took Mick less than five minutes to figure that out. Then it turns into me standing in front of him in the down and then gradually increase the distance. If he makes a mistake, we say,"eew, yuck" and turn our backs on him. It did not take him long to figure out that he gets attention when he lays down...

As far as time outs, my dogs got the kitchen, not the crate. And my guys got the minty breath spray when they got too bitey as pups(mostly with my children). My dogs in general are not that bitey as pups as there are plenty elder Goldens to teach them not to bite as well as others in this house that tolerate it, so it gets out of their system.


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## HamsterHuey

Have you considered using some harmless form of positive punishment like spraying water or bitter apple when he jumps and begins biting? It seems obvious that positive reinforcement and negative punishment (taking away attention, giving him time outs, etc) are not working by themselves. Perhaps a combination of harmless but effective positive punishment and positive reinforcement (when he is good and doesn't present the behavior you are complaining about) might help or is at least worth a shot. If that doesn't work, it really does sound like you would need to contact a very good animal behaviorist to help you guys address these issues. It does sound like you're trying to do everything "by the book" in terms of trying to address the problem at the moment.


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## JDK

Sally's Mom said:


> I recently started working with my 5 y old, Mick, again. He is very exuberant and we have let him jump up on us. The first thing my OCTH trainer friend made me do last week was to teach him that the only time he will get affection is when he defaults to down. It took Mick less than five minutes to figure that out. Then it turns into me standing in front of him in the down and then gradually increase the distance. If he makes a mistake, we say,"eew, yuck" and turn our backs on him. It did not take him long to figure out that he gets attention when he lays down...
> 
> As far as time outs, my dogs got the kitchen, not the crate. And my guys got the minty breath spray when they got too bitey as pups(mostly with my children). My dogs in general are not that bitey as pups as there are plenty elder Goldens to teach them not to bite as well as others in this house that tolerate it, so it gets out of their system.


JJ has a default sit. I rarely ever give him affection if he's standing. I wait until he sits and then start petting him. That's been something I and the rest of us have done since day 1. The same goes with food. He must sit before he gets a treat, and he knows that cause once he makes eye contact with you he'll plant his butt on the ground and wait for your attention or the treat you're about to give him. It's funny, every time we go to Petsmart or Petco, the people at the register will ask him if he wants a cookie, by the time they turn back around with the treat, JJ's already in a sit and patiently waiting for his cookie and the people go, "Well, you're already sitting, so I guess I'll shake your hand instead".


I once tried to setup a timeout area in the corner of the living room, using baby gates to set it up, and the first time I put him in there for a timeout he was over the gate and out. The second time, rather then going and sitting back down, I stood there with my back to him and every time he tried to get over the gate I would tell him "no". That didn't stop him and he eventually got out. The third time, since he wasn't listening to my no's, I decided that maybe I should push him back down and physically stop him from climbing the gate, so that's what I did and it basically only made him go after my hands and try and climb the gate more. I gave up on that timeout area after that. I would imagine if I would him in the kitchen, he'll do the same thing and will be over the gate in no time. 

Mind you, we have baby gates setup in the house blocking two rooms he can't go in and he doesn't even attempt to climb those. When I use the baby gates for a timeout area though, it's a totally different story and he'll do whatever possible to get over them. That's why I said before, unless I construct something in my house or use the bathroom, I'm out of ideas for a timeout area and have no option but his crate. The crate was my last option for a timeout area and one I really didn't want to use, but I was left with no choice after trying to block him with baby gates.

We've tried spraying him with water before and went out and bought like 10 water bottles to keep around the house, but that only made him come after us more, as if he thought that was part of playing. I'm scared to try anything else aside from water since, as you may recall, JJ had an eye problem. I'm scared I'm going to spray him in the eye with something that's going to irritate it more. Naturally I would try and aim for his mouth or nose, but when you have a bouncing dog, it's not that easy.


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## JDK

HamsterHuey said:


> Have you considered using some harmless form of positive punishment like spraying water or bitter apple when he jumps and begins biting? It seems obvious that positive reinforcement and negative punishment (taking away attention, giving him time outs, etc) are not working by themselves. Perhaps a combination of harmless but effective positive punishment and positive reinforcement (when he is good and doesn't present the behavior you are complaining about) might help or is at least worth a shot. If that doesn't work, it really does sound like you would need to contact a very good animal behaviorist to help you guys address these issues. It does sound like you're trying to do everything "by the book" in terms of trying to address the problem at the moment.


As I said to Sally's Mom, we've tried spraying him with water and it only made him more excited. I'm scared to try anything else like mouth spray or bitter apple cause JJ has somewhat of an eye issue and I'm scared I'm going to end up spraying him in the eye rather than the nose or mouth.

What do you mean by effective positive punishment? We're constantly praising JJ for his good behavior, so it's not like we're just punishing him when he's bad and not praising and reinforcing him when he's good. He's one of the most loved dogs I know. People are usually telling me all the time how crazy I am cause I'm so wrapped up in him. In fact, last night, after telling JJ for 10-15 minutes how handsome and beautiful he is and how he was being such a good boy, my girlfriend yells into the room and says, "Joe, uhhh, why don't you ever talk to me that way?" haha


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## BriGuy

Have you tried keeping a short lead on him in the house. Then when he gets all bitey, just calmly take the lead and bring him to a timeout spot where you attach the lead to something solid, like an eyebolt in your baseboard with a clip on it, or pinch the lead in a heavy door. Once you attach the lead, just walk away for a minute.

Before she was a year old, Cookie got into a habit where if we were talking on the phone or something, she'd come up and start grabbing at our clothes. Of course, yelling would just reinforce the habit, as she was seeking attention anyway. Using this method, if she'd bite our clothes, we'd just say "Oh, you want to go in timeout?" and lead her away. Our trainer called this the "dumb owner" game. 

It took about 3 days for this attention seeking behavior to drop dramatically.


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## JDK

BriGuy said:


> Have you tried keeping a short lead on him in the house. Then when he gets all bitey, just calmly take the lead and bring him to a timeout spot where you attach the lead to something solid, like an eyebolt in your baseboard with a clip on it, or pinch the lead in a heavy door. Once you attach the lead, just walk away for a minute.
> 
> Before she was a year old, Cookie got into a habit where if we were talking on the phone or something, she'd come up and start grabbing at our clothes. Of course, yelling would just reinforce the habit, as she was seeking attention anyway. Using this method, if she'd bite our clothes, we'd just say "Oh, you want to go in timeout?" and lead her away. Our trainer called this the "dumb owner" game.
> 
> It took about 3 days for this attention seeking behavior to drop dramatically.


No, I have not left a lead on him, mostly in fear that he would eat it. The reason I fear that is cause when he got out of hand a few times with my mom or girlfriend, I would put a leash on him so I had more control of his actions without having to physically touch him and get into a "shoving match" where he feels I'm challenging him and he needs to fight back, and after turning his attention to me and jumping on me and biting me and me just ignoring him, he turned his attention to the leash and tried his best to tear it apart. Here's the aftermath of one of the leashes that was used, and this was after about 30 seconds.


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## Sally's Mom

So use one of those horrible chain leashes and he cannot chew it. If my pup were that persistent, my time out would be fool proof....


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## lynn1970

Sally's Mom said:


> So use one of those horrible chain leashes and he cannot chew it. If my pup were that persistent, my time out would be fool proof....


We actually did use a chain leash for Rileah until she learned not to chew on the leash. Our trainer didn't like it but we were the one's dealing with it on a daily basis and it worked like a charm after just a few weeks.


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## Sally's Mom

I, personally do not use water to spray. I use the breath spray and my guys hate it. Witha water squirt bottle, you can add vinegar or lemon..


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## JDK

Sally's Mom said:


> So use one of those horrible chain leashes and he cannot chew it. If my pup were that persistent, my time out would be fool proof....


Is that safe to do though? I'm not looking to start replacing teeth as I'm already $10,000 in the hole due to medical bills over the 10 months I've had him. Are you suggesting that I leave a short chain leash on him or saying that I should only use it when he gets out of hand and needs to be put in timeout?

And yes, JJ is very persistent. He chewed a small hole in the rug when he was a puppy, which we've put a throw rug over. He knows its still there cause he won't stop trying to pull the throw rug up to get at the hole. He'll "leave it" when I tell him to, but will go right back to it after getting his reward, whether it be praise or a treat. Just to give you an idea how persistent he is, in the time it took to type this post, 2 minutes or whatever, I had to get up and tell him 11 times to leave the rug alone. Actually, make that 12 now. He doesn't give up. I've already told him 24 times today (since 4pm) to leave the rug alone, not including the most recent 12 times, and I will more than likely end up telling him another 30 or 40 times tonight. And that's a daily routine that's been going on for months now. He's probably been told close to 1,000 times total to leave the rug alone, no joke. 

Like I said, unless I construct a 4ft high cubicle in the corner of a room or throw him in the bathroom, I'm out of ideas for a timeout area that'll actually contain him. At one point we tried using an x-pen that we have for our ferrets, but he basically pushed the thing across the room and kept smashing his head into it. I took it down after that. It lasted maybe 2 days, if that. I considered bolting it to the wall to hold it in place, but I don't own the house and I don't think my landlord would be all that pleased if they found out I was bolting things into the wall (They get a little testy just when it comes to picture frame hooks).


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## JDK

Sally's Mom said:


> I, personally do not use water to spray. I use the breath spray and my guys hate it. Witha water squirt bottle, you can add vinegar or lemon..


And what do you do, try and spray it in their mouths and/or nose? Don't you worry about it getting into their eyes, or is that something not to be all that concerned about?


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## Sally's Mom

I use breath spray in the mouth and in the nose, if it is needed. My Mick, learned the lesson well and backs up when he sees the spray bottle.


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## JDK

I'll get some breath spray and see how it goes.

Here's another scenario for you that just went done. My girlfriend just got home after going straight out after work. She comes in and JJ automatically starts jumping on her and pulling at her dress. Standing beside him at the time, I told him "Ah ah, sit" and he did, which at that time I gave him a treat or two. As soon as the treat left my hand and entered his mouth, he was jumping on her again, so I told him again, "ah ah, sit", and he did, so I rewarded him again, and just like the first time, as soon as he had the treats in his mouth, his feet were off the ground and he was jumping on her again. We went through that same routine about 8 times until finally he didn't want to sit anymore and when I told him to do so, he instead started jumping at me and biting me, which at that point I took him by the collar and placed him in his crate for a timeout.


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## quilter

We've worked on many of the same things with Casper.

When people come to the house, Casper is either behind a gate in the kitchen or on leash. No matter how well Casper knows them. He gets pretty excited just seeing me after work every day. With anyone that doesn't live here he is even more excited. He has to sit to get pets. If he gets up, the visitor moves away and turns his/her back. He does not get the opportunity to jump all he wants. He's doing really well with this plan. We also don't give him treats for this. The reward is getting petted. The treats just up the excitement level, and that we don't need.

I've also gotten better about reading his body language. If his tail is up, he's looking right at me, and standing in front of me, he's thinking about jumping. If he's laying down straight (hard to describe), head on the ground, looking at me, he's not resting. He's stalking and preparing to leap.

Lately, I've been using his training to avoid those situations where his "play" is annoying. For example, he wants to bite at my shoelaces while I'm putting my shoes on. I could forever put my shoes on in another room. Instead, I tell him Back and Down and Wait, which has him on the ground a few feet away. Success! I can tell he hates having to watch, but, sorry. I am doing the same thing when I pick up the paper he chews up. He wants to grab it as I'm picking it up. I was able to tell him to back up and lay down. He hates having to watch, but I toss him a small treat every so often.

I used breath spray to get him to stop body slamming me. I'm not thrilled with it, but I had to balance the damage he could do knocking me over with hurting his psyche a bit. 

I'm reading Control Unleashed, The Puppy Program. The author doesn't like the "be a tree" thing at all. To paraphrase, the dog thinks people are acting weird when they do this and it makes the dog unsettled. We tried the tree thing with Casper and I think I lasted about two days. It's just ridiculous to allow the dog to jump on me as long as he wants. I leave the room, the yard, whatever. He gets a cool reception from me when I allow him back with me.


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## JDK

quilter said:


> We've worked on many of the same things with Casper.
> 
> When people come to the house, Casper is either behind a gate in the kitchen or on leash. No matter how well Casper knows them. He gets pretty excited just seeing me after work every day. With anyone that doesn't live here he is even more excited. He has to sit to get pets. If he gets up, the visitor moves away and turns his/her back. He does not get the opportunity to jump all he wants. He's doing really well with this plan. We also don't give him treats for this. The reward is getting petted. The treats just up the excitement level, and that we don't need.
> 
> I've also gotten better about reading his body language. If his tail is up, he's looking right at me, and standing in front of me, he's thinking about jumping. If he's laying down straight (hard to describe), head on the ground, looking at me, he's not resting. He's stalking and preparing to leap.
> 
> Lately, I've been using his training to avoid those situations where his "play" is annoying. For example, he wants to bite at my shoelaces while I'm putting my shoes on. I could forever put my shoes on in another room. Instead, I tell him Back and Down and Wait, which has him on the ground a few feet away. Success! I can tell he hates having to watch, but, sorry. I am doing the same thing when I pick up the paper he chews up. He wants to grab it as I'm picking it up. I was able to tell him to back up and lay down. He hates having to watch, but I toss him a small treat every so often.
> 
> I used breath spray to get him to stop body slamming me. I'm not thrilled with it, but I had to balance the damage he could do knocking me over with hurting his psyche a bit.
> 
> I'm reading Control Unleashed, The Puppy Program. The author doesn't like the "be a tree" thing at all. To paraphrase, the dog thinks people are acting weird when they do this and it makes the dog unsettled. We tried the tree thing with Casper and I think I lasted about two days. It's just ridiculous to allow the dog to jump on me as long as he wants. I leave the room, the yard, whatever. He gets a cool reception from me when I allow him back with me.


Personally speaking, I don't like the "be a tree" routine either, but since it was suggested by a few licensed trainers, I figured I would give it a try. I'm sure it works with some dogs, I just don't happen to have one haha.


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## JDK

3 shirts and a pair of shorts ripped today


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## inge

JDK said:


> 3 shirts and a pair of shorts ripped today


I do not have advice for you, I just want to let you know I follow your journey and I feel really sorry. It seems you are trying everything and then this, is so discouraging.


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## quilter

--- 3 shirts and a pair of shorts ripped today ---

Yikes! I think my dog would be on leash 24x7, but what a hassle that would be!

Just throwing another idea out. Could this be a scheduling kind of problem? Is he tired, hungry, or needs a potty break? Does it mostly happen in certain times or places?

One technique I have had success with is changing my habits. Based on my own personal theory that some of the misbehaviors are learned behaviors in a certain context. For example, Casper would slam me when I came back from the trash can after picking up poop. (I got some good suggestions from the list on that, thanks!) One thing that helped was to change where I was walking, even only slightly. Since it wasn't exactly the same, it wasn't the same game. He still watches me, but he doesn't run at me anymore.


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## Deb_Bayne

I also found that when Bayne was getting too rambunctious if I put my hands over my face he seemed to stop, I think it was the lack of attention he was getting from me, if he couldn't see my face then he was not getting attention and walked away. If I'm sitting and he puts his paws up on me, I gently say 'OFF' if I am upset and say 'OFF' he seems to get excited more so I have to be emotionless.


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## JDK

quilter said:


> --- 3 shirts and a pair of shorts ripped today ---
> 
> Yikes! I think my dog would be on leash 24x7, but what a hassle that would be!
> 
> Just throwing another idea out. Could this be a scheduling kind of problem? Is he tired, hungry, or needs a potty break? Does it mostly happen in certain times or places?
> 
> One technique I have had success with is changing my habits. Based on my own personal theory that some of the misbehaviors are learned behaviors in a certain context. For example, Casper would slam me when I came back from the trash can after picking up poop. (I got some good suggestions from the list on that, thanks!) One thing that helped was to change where I was walking, even only slightly. Since it wasn't exactly the same, it wasn't the same game. He still watches me, but he doesn't run at me anymore.


There appears to be no pattern to his madness. It's very unpredictable. For example, this morning. He was fine when I let him out of his crate. He walked over to my girlfriend, then to me and then to my mom and sat in front of all of us for attention. After we each petted him for a few minutes, we went about our business to get ready for work while he wondered around the house and chewed his bones on the living room floor, which is a normally routine during the work week. Everybody in the house probably crossed paths with him this morning about 20 times without a problem. Then suddenly, he randomly decided to take a different attitude with my mother and jumped on her and tugged on her shirt, ripping it in the process. There was nothing unusual going on that would of made him excited and my mom did nothing different that she didn't already do 20 times this morning. She was just standing in the kitchen at the counter, pouring a cup a coffee. He got up from chewing his bone in the living run and ran out in the kitchen to jump on and bite her, basically out of nowhere.

Having had enough of this behavior (he's probably ripped an estimate of 30 shirts, 5-6 shorts/pants and 5-6 dresses in his life), he'll be attached to my hip when I get home from work today and will lose the privilege of having free roam. I'll wrap a 6 foot leash around my waist and attach it to him.


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## HamsterHuey

JDK said:


> As I said to Sally's Mom, we've tried spraying him with water and it only made him more excited. I'm scared to try anything else like mouth spray or bitter apple cause JJ has somewhat of an eye issue and I'm scared I'm going to end up spraying him in the eye rather than the nose or mouth.
> 
> What do you mean by effective positive punishment? We're constantly praising JJ for his good behavior, so it's not like we're just punishing him when he's bad and not praising and reinforcing him when he's good. He's one of the most loved dogs I know. People are usually telling me all the time how crazy I am cause I'm so wrapped up in him. In fact, last night, after telling JJ for 10-15 minutes how handsome and beautiful he is and how he was being such a good boy, my girlfriend yells into the room and says, "Joe, uhhh, why don't you ever talk to me that way?" haha


JDK, sorry, I think you misunderstood what I meant. Positive punishment is a term that refers to adding something (positive) to the dog's environment that he/she dislikes so as to deter the behavior (Punishment and Your Dog). Typically, what is recommended is to use positive reinforcement and negative punishment (take away the reward from the dog, eg: turning our backs, time outs, etc.). You have obviously been trying a lot of those techniques without much luck, so I was suggesting a mild positive punishment approach such as a squirt gun, etc, that might perhaps work. If the squirt gun doesn't work for him, maybe something else will...like a can filled with pennies?

It's very obvious that you care a lot for your dog because a lot of people would not put up with having that many ripped clothes and that kind of behavior for so long while still exhibiting the patience that you and your gf/mom are showing. I wish you all the best and I do hope you are able to find a way to train your dog out of this behavior.


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## Tayla's Mom

I feel your pain, JDK. We have had a really rough patch with Tayla. She is now 7.5 months and she was some better for about a month and then wham, back to jumping and biting on walks. We went on vacation and I think being away from home really threw her off. She has started drooling excessively in her crate and on walks would randomly attack me jumping, biting and grabbing. No clothes torn, but lots of vibrant bruises and some broken skin. I’m keeping a list of things that may trigger her behavior and we will again meet with our trainer/behaviorist and I have a vet appointment in two weeks. Further training and possible medication additions are all that will keep her around as my husband would like her gone, but where? If she leaves us it’s a death sentence for her. She is so bad that I’m now a little afraid to walk her on my own. Now that we are home I’ll see how she does. Like with your girlfriend, Tayla has always been much worse with my husband in the house, but I get the worst on walks. If it’s fixable we will do what it takes. Just never thought I’d have a biting Golden. A wild rambunctious one, yes, but not one that I was at times afraid of.


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## quilter

I was reading some more of Control Unleashed, the Puppy Program, last night. I was reading chapters about Default Behaviors and Off-Switch Games. Excellent stuff! In one chapter, she was describing a dog that has a low-excitability threshold together with a low-frustration threshold. In the Off-Switch chapter, she talks about a retriever that is jumpy and bitey, calling her "the mouth without a brain," and how she and the owner worked out a solution. (Too long to recap.) The Off-Switch chapter talks about how to bring your dog to the edge of losing it, then getting him to settle. With practice, the dog learns to self-calm. There is also a chapter on "reading your dog" to help you identify his mood. We're going to add these to our training today. 

I was re-reading the default behavior chapters. When Casper sees people and dogs on our walk, he sits and watches them go by. Which is better than chasing them down! I've been trying to get him to walk quietly by. Now I realize that he is using is default behavior, Sit, to calm himself as they go by. Here I thought he was doing it just because I told him to.  I'm not going to push him to keep moving for a bit. I'm going to let him keep this behavior for now.


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## Tayla's Mom

I'll have to get that book. Tayla also sits to watch people go bye.


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## JDK

HamsterHuey said:


> JDK, sorry, I think you misunderstood what
> I meant. Positive punishment is a term that refers to adding something
> (positive) to the dog's environment that he/she dislikes so as to
> deter the behavior (Punishment and Your Dog). Typically, what is
> recommended is to use positive reinforcement and negative punishment
> (take away the reward from the dog, eg: turning our backs, time outs,
> etc.). You have obviously been trying a lot of those techniques
> without much luck, so I was suggesting a mild positive punishment
> approach such as a squirt gun, etc, that might perhaps work. If the
> squirt gun doesn't work for him, maybe something else will...like a
> can filled with pennies?
> 
> It's very obvious that you care a lot for your dog because a lot of
> people would not put up with having that many ripped clothes and that
> kind of behavior for so long while still exhibiting the patience that
> you and your gf/mom are showing. I wish you all the best and I do hope
> you are able to find a way to train your dog out of this
> behavior.


I get what you're saying now. Maybe I'll give the can full of pennies a try.

The only deterrent I've found so far is a shock collar. Let me first start off by saying that I would never recommend a shock collar to somebody. Why? Cause majority of the people who buy them only do so cause they don't want to put in the time and effort that it takes to properly train a dog and will jump right to the shock collar as a first resort rather than a last resort.

After talking with several people and heavily debating it for weeks, and reminding myself that I wasn't just jumping to the collar and had put in a lot of effort to improve his behavior otherwise, I went out and purchased a shock collar about a month ago. JJ's worn it maybe 8 times total. The first 2-3 times we just put it on him without shocking him, just so he would get use to it around his neck and wouldn't associate the "new collar" as a "bad collar" that was doing harm to him. Within the following days, the moment he acted out, I shocked him, which instantly caused him to stop and look around on the ground as if saying, "where the hell did that come from". I used it for a couple more days and shocked him maybe a dozen times total. It appeared that his behavior got better when the collar was on him. Even though I saw a small improvement with the shock collar, I still found it hard to use cause the taught of shocking my dog didn't sit well with me. So I took it off and put it in the drawer and didn't use it again. Long story short, he was acting real bad with my girlfriend a couple days ago when I wasn't home and was failing to listen to anything she said. Fed up with the behavior, she pulled the shock
collar out of the drawer and put it on him. The moment she put it on
him, he ran down the hall and just laid there and wouldn't go in the living room near my girlfriend. She didn't shock him or anything like that either from him to run away and go lay by himself. Now I'm asking myself, is he scared of the collar, and did he figure out that we're shocking him (I always tried to hide the collar so he didn't see I was doing it) and the bad behavior itself isn't doing it. After about an hour, she took the collar off, and shortly later I was home and things returned to normal later that night with him jumping and biting. Although the collar stopped the behavior and changed his attitude completely when she put it on him, I don't want him to be scared of us.

And, yes, you're right, I care about JJ a great deal and wouldn't trade him for the world, regardless of his behavior. I know there's a lot of people out there who would be at wits end with a dog like him right about now and would have no problem giving him up to a shelter, or worse, abusing him when he acts out, making matters much worse. I'm willing to do whatever I can to help him and his behavior issues, no matter how many clothes he rips or bruises he leaves. He's my life. Dogs always have been.


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## JDK

Tayla's Mom said:


> Just never thought I’d have a biting Golden. A wild rambunctious one, yes, but not one that I was at times afraid of.


I hear ya on that. I figured JJ would be wild and crazy and mouthy as a puppy like most Goldens, but I never expected it to carry on this long and happen this often :doh:


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## JDK

quilter said:


> I was reading some more of Control Unleashed, the Puppy Program, last night. I was reading chapters about Default Behaviors and Off-Switch Games. Excellent stuff! In one chapter, she was describing a dog that has a low-excitability threshold together with a low-frustration threshold. In the Off-Switch chapter, she talks about a retriever that is jumpy and bitey, calling her "the mouth without a brain," and how she and the owner worked out a solution. (Too long to recap.) The Off-Switch chapter talks about how to bring your dog to the edge of losing it, then getting him to settle. With practice, the dog learns to self-calm. There is also a chapter on "reading your dog" to help you identify his mood. We're going to add these to our training today.
> 
> I was re-reading the default behavior chapters. When Casper sees people and dogs on our walk, he sits and watches them go by. Which is better than chasing them down! I've been trying to get him to walk quietly by. Now I realize that he is using is default behavior, Sit, to calm himself as they go by. Here I thought he was doing it just because I told him to.  I'm not going to push him to keep moving for a bit. I'm going to let him keep this behavior for now.


It's funny you mention the Off-Switch and bringing your dog to the edge of losing it. For the past week or so, I've been dancing with JJ after work. I'm the first one home in the house. When I get home, I turn the radio up real loud and I dance around in the living room. I try and get JJ to the point where he's about to leap on me, which doesn't take much, then I quickly tell him "Ah Ah...Sit". We do this for about a half hour. My success rate is like 98% percent. It hasn't shown to help yet when he gets into these moods, but here's to hoping.


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## khrios

Geez, it sounds like you have tried just about everything. The one thing I did not see mentioned is a tie down. Many moons ago, I had a high-spirited pup. Simba, all muscle at 85 lbs. We used a tie-down with a leash inside the house. While we were watching TV, or cooking or eating dinner or expecting someone to come home or visit, Simba was on his tie down. We had tie-down hooks all over the house. He was always with us, just not free...As Simba matured, we did not need to do this anymore.

Good luck


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## JDK

Now, when attaching him to my hip by a leash, should I use his martingale collar so that it gets tighter the more he tries to pull away and he learns its better to stay by me, or should I use his regular snap collar?

Is there anything special I should be doing when I have him attached to me, other then praising him when he lays down? When he tries to pull away, should I just ignore him and let him pull, or should I stop him and make him lay near me and praise him when he does so? Obviously, I assume i'm gonna have to pull him around cause he's not always gonna wanna go where I want to go. Should I just go about my business like hes not there and just pull the dead weight behind me, or should I look at him and tell him "lets go" and make him willingly want to go? What's the best route to go about this?

I was going to give him a chance, but he jumped my mom when she got home, after sitting nicely in front of her for tickles. Obviously they weren't enough by his standards so he decided to leap on her and bite her hands when she stopped.


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## JDK

khrios said:


> Geez, it sounds like you have tried just about everything. The one thing I did not see mentioned is a tie down. Many moons ago, I had a high-spirited pup. Simba, all muscle at 85 lbs. We used a tie-down with a leash inside the house. While we were watching TV, or cooking or eating dinner or expecting someone to come home or visit, Simba was on his tie down. We had tie-down hooks all over the house. He was always with us, just not free...As Simba matured, we did not need to do this anymore.
> 
> Good luck


As of today, I'm the tie down 

He goes where I go and doesn't go near anybody unless I go with him.

I don't know if this is the right approach or not, since not being able to get near my girlfriend and mother when he wants to (even if he wants to behave or get an ice cube like my mom likes to give him) might end up just making him more wild when he gets off the leash and is able to approach them himself without me holding him back. I guess the hope is that being attached to me will build his patience and give me more control of his actions without having to grab his collar.


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## Charliethree

JDK said:


> Now, when attaching him to my hip by a leash, should I use his martingale collar so that it gets tighter the more he tries to pull away and he learns its better to stay by me, or should I use his regular snap collar?
> 
> Is there anything special I should be doing when I have him attached to me, other then praising him when he lays down? When he tries to pull away, should I just ignore him and let him pull, or should I stop him and make him lay near me and praise him when he does so? Obviously, I assume i'm gonna have to pull him around cause he's not always gonna wanna go where I want to go. Should I just go about my business like hes not there and just pull the dead weight behind me, or should I look at him and tell him "lets go" and make him willingly want to go? What's the best route to go about this?
> 
> I was going to give him a chance, but he jumped my mom when she got home, after sitting nicely in front of her for tickles. Obviously they weren't enough by his standards so he decided to leap on her and bite her hands when she stopped.


It is human nature to ignore the dog when they are behaving, as your earlier post described, he was fine staying calm and out of the way, while everyone was getting ready for work, everyone ignored him. When he got up and went after your mom - he got all kinds of attention.Make a habit of saying 'Thank you!' when he is being a good boy!! Praise and reward the behavior you do want, consistently, encourage him to stay with you when he is tethered to you. If he sits, P&R, if he lies down P&R, if someone can pet him without him trying to jump up, P&R. - let him know he is being a good boy! Work on greetings, when he is sitting, stand on the leash about halfway to prevent him from jumping, have someone approach and reward, as long as he sits, if he gets up - they move away. Practice people entering the room, he sits, stand on the leash, someone opens the door, if he gets up, they leave and close the door, repeat. 
Pay close attention to his body language and try to predict when he is going to try to jump up, and interrupt with your 'AhAh sit' and reward when he does!! When playing, frequently interrupt the play, put him onleash if need be and stand on it,and ignore him until he calms down and lays down, then resume the play.
There are a lot of things to work with/on, pick a starting point and work through each one, don't try to do too much at once. But be vigilant about preventing him from jumping up, keeping him tethered to you and keeping enough distance that should he try, he will not make contact with the person. Understand that he has a history of being rewarded for jumping up, he got your attention, and it is self rewarding, and he will likely go through an 'extinction burst' (he will be more persistent, and try harder to get to jump up out of frustration - it worked before why not now?) just when you think he has got it under control.


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## khrios

JDK said:


> As of today, I'm the tie down
> 
> He goes where I go and doesn't go near anybody unless I go with him.
> 
> I don't know if this is the right approach or not, since not being able to get near my girlfriend and mother when he wants to (even if he wants to behave or get an ice cube like my mom likes to give him) might end up just making him more wild when he gets off the leash and is able to approach them himself without me holding him back. I guess the hope is that being attached to me will build his patience and give me more control of his actions without having to grab his collar.


I like that. He has to learn impulse control... You will be his anchor.


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## JDK

Should I keep him tied to me at all times, even if he appears to be behaving or relaxed, or if nobody else is home or around besides me? Or should I use being tied to me as a time out and tie him to me whenever he gets out of control until he calms down?

Like right now, my mom is in her room which he can't get at, my girlfriend is laying down with a headache, and I'm sitting here with him by myself. Should I have him tied to me now? He doesn't normally act out when it's just him and I and usually just lays on the couch in front of the ac. He wants so badly to go over there now, but I have him tied to me so he's laying at my feet under the dining room table, trying every couple of minutes to go to the living room. Should I keep him leashed at all times to get or only put it on him when other people are around?


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## Charliethree

The purpose of tethering is to prevent him jumping up (a management tool) while you train the behavior you do want. I would keep him tethered to you most of the time, for a few days at least, even when you are alone, it will help to him understand that he needs to pay attention to you. If you let him loose, have him work for it, a few obedience commands, or just remaining calm for a few minutes.


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## khrios

I have seen tethering used in training a young pup. In that case, you tether as you go about doing whatever around the house. It helps the pup learn how to behave around the house. As time passes, you don't have to tether and the pup just knows to lay by your side as you do x, y or z. 

I would think it would take several weeks for JJ to learn the new rules...


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## Tucker's mommy

Hi, JDK - I just wanted to pipe in that I've written quite a few posts about our dog, Tucker, and some very similar behaviour problems we've been having since he was around six months old. He is now 14 months, and the jumping/biting at us while outside is finally starting to subside somewhat, but not all the way. We are having a cooler, rainier day today as opposed to the upper 90s we've had for a long time. He definitely notices the cooler weather and is RAMPED UP. Even biting at us inside the house today, which he rarely does. I just wanted to let you know - I think there are more of us out there than most realize who have this behaviour issue. We've tried two trainers at home, two out-of-home sessions, and a TON of work on our own. We've come to realize that he will always be a ramped up dog - for us the key has been trying to figure out the triggers and either avoid those situations or use them as serious training sessions to work on the problems as they arise. It's exhausting. I have three young kids. My hubby and I didn't think we'd still be struggling with Tucker at his age of almost 15 months. We're hoping he grows up at some point. 

I feel your pain. I need to get "Control Unleashed". I had to take a bread from training books for awhile. But I think it's time to jump in again! 

Our Tucker's issues are much more of an outside problem when he's running in our yard. We have a long line on him at all times to help maintain his control - it is now my life line. I depend on it. I know he's improving, because as soon as I take control of the line, he seems to realize he's gone too far and almost seems to sense a training session is coming! But it's exhausting!!! All I wanted was a dog I could run and play fetch with in the yard without worrying about causing us harm. I don't know if we'll ever be able to let our guard down all the way with him! Please keep us posted on your progress!

I need to add- we went through a period of trouble when walking him, too, where he would attack my arms while on-leash. He seems to have outgrown that. The problem is much more of an outside-running-free problem. He just gets so super excited when we're out - especially when my husband is in the cul de sac with the kids playing with balls, and Tucker is stuck on the other side within our invisible fence. 

Good luck, and please, keep sharing what works for you!


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## Nomes

hmmm...well, if it's any consolation, Casey is the same way. It's very sporadic...seems to happen most when i bring him in at night. he'll just literally go bonkers! jumping cavorting, snapping at the leash, (inadvertently getting me), it's such a nuisance! what has worked for me is having a word that means quit it. I use "enough". like when we're training, say practicing his heel, and i give him a break by saying "Free Casey!" Yaaay! we play for a few seconds and then i just stand up, totally change my attitude and say "enough" he gets the picture, we quit playing and we go back to work. I have been able to transfer it over to when he acts up. I stand tall, and say in a firm voice "enough!" and that seems to stop him. however if it's really bad, i will put him on his side/back and not let him get up until he has settled down and is respecting me.
As a last-ditch effort, you could also try a spray bottle? it didn't really work for Casey...only when it was a mild case of the crazies. I would just show him the spray bottle, spray him if he didn't stop snapping at the leash and anything/everything in general.
Good luck! let me know if you have any great ideas on how to handle this! :


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## Tucker's mommy

How old is Casey?


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## Nomes

10 months, 1 week and 6 days.


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## madeleine

*Has he now grown out of the biting and jumping - would love to know!*

Hi JDK
Just wanting to know if you Golden has grown out of this jump and bite thing as we are still experiencing it! Would love to hear the progress of your dog and how he is today...please let me know


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## griffinmama

Our 17 week old dog, Griffin, bites as he plays. I read your entire thread and all the comments and suggestions . I also would like to know if he has grown out of this behavior !! I love Griffin to pieces! He may just be acting like a puppy. He is consistent, not sporadic but likes to pull at our pant legs and bite our arms and hands. He is always smiling and having fun but it doesn't make it any easier for us!!!









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## Tucker's mommy

Hi there! I know this is an extremely old post, but I, too, would love to know how your pup is doing! I posted on here about a year and a half ago - and I can say with relief that our Tucker, now almost three years old, is much much better now - although he will always be high- energy. And we have learned over time how much freedom to give him and when to draw the line, which has been a huge part of the learning process for us. I sure hope you've seen improvement too! Happy Spring!


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## LMEILUTA

Hello, we have a 17 month old Golden Retreiver and all he does is bite my daughter when she tries to play with him. I dont know how to get him to stop. Other than the biting he is a really good dog. Some people tell me its because my daughter is at the same level size as him. Also,any suggestions on how to get them to stop digging in the yard? Our yard looks like a construction site with all the pot holes out there. LOL


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## deborahb

I also have a naughty 1 year old retriever who bites and jumps. When he does it in the house I have noticed its usually only when he needs to poop! He usually has to walk or run for a few minutes before he can actually do his duty.
When he hasn't been out long enough he tries to bite his leash off and nip at my hands so I don't take him home so I try to make sure he has a long enough walk/run/play. I think as one person mentioned, we expect more of them because they are older but they are still naughty puppies! ?❤
Good luck!


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## TCC

Hi.. my goldie Charlie will be a year old at Thanksgiving and sounds just like JJ. Has anyone heard about JJ over the years and if anything worked?


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## JulieCAinMA

Tucker's mommy said:


> Hi there! I know this is an extremely old post, but I, too, would love to know how your pup is doing! I posted on here about a year and a half ago - and I can say with relief that our Tucker, now almost three years old, is much much better now - although he will always be high- energy. And we have learned over time how much freedom to give him and when to draw the line, which has been a huge part of the learning process for us. I sure hope you've seen improvement too! Happy Spring!


i know your post is 6 years old, but if you see my question, I’d love to hear your response. When you got your dog, were you looking for high spiritedness? Did the breeder choose him for you? I ask because we are waiting for a pup from a litter that will soon be born. The breeder specifically asked questions regarding the temperament that we were looking for. After reading so many posts about wild dogs who bite, I’m feeling nervous.


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## Prism Goldens

Don't worry- this behavior is largely correspondent to how much training you invest. 
Put in a lot over time and get a reliable well-behaved dog. Remember it is usually two steps forward, one back.


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## nolefan

JulieCA said:


> ..... we are waiting for a pup from a litter that will soon be born..... After reading so many posts about wild dogs who bite, I’m feeling nervous.


I can't emphasize enough that what Prism posted matters : "....this behavior is largely correspondent to how much training you invest." If you haven't found a good place to attend obedience classes with your puppy, it's not too early to do so. You can do a google search for "dog training club" or "obedience Club" or contact your regional AKC club or Golden Retriever club (grca.org) and ask for assistance from GOlden people to get referrals. Clubs are terrific ways to get a good, affordable class. The members teach the classes and you can join and they are generally reduced in price. Plan on being enrolled in classes for the first year or two of owning your Golden, especially if you've never really trained a dog before. Attention to daily exercise and obedience will make your life with your new puppy much more enjoyable.


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## TCC

Not sure who is responding to who but I just posted a few days ago about JJs behavior. Our Charlie has similar behavior as to jumping and biting us. He has had training and still is training. Charlie has been being trained since he came home by us. He's also been to puppy and Obedience 1 and will attend Obedience 2 in January. He jumps and bits us like we are litter mates. It doesn't matter what we do or try he doesn't stop. This is my 3 goldie and never had one act like this. Covid-19 hit and we weren't able to socialize him. I believe this has alot to do with it but still can't get it corrected. I would love any suggestions. Thanks


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## cwag

A few times with Rukie I have just had to bolster my resolve that I am not going to tolerate this and I WILL make you stop. For the jumping we practiced a lot in puppy classes where we tied the dogs up and rotated approaching each dog with treats and only petting and rewarding when they were in a sit. I never let anyone approach him and pet unless he was in a sit. We also let the leash loop on the ground and stood on it so the dog can't jump up. We would turn our back to him any time he came for attention with jumping. Have you tried letting him drag a leash at all times and stepping on it to prevent the jumping? You may want to have a trainer come to your house and help with this since the longer it goes on, the harder it is to correct.


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## JulieCAinMA

Prism Goldens said:


> Don't worry- this behavior is largely correspondent to how much training you invest.
> Put in a lot over time and get a reliable well-behaved dog. Remember it is usually two steps forward, one back.


_*Thanks for the response. I went down the forum’s Behavior Issues rabbit hole the other night and all I can say is WOW! I believe we are working with a very reputable breeder located in northwest WA. We had a long chat and I feel confident that he will do his best to match us with a puppy AND THEN, like you said, it will be up to us to train/raise the puppy into a well behaved dog. We know, from raising 3 children who are now adults and upstanding world citizens, that training a puppy will take lots of time, effort and even some tears. We also know that the outcome is well worth the work!*_


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## JulieCAinMA

nolefan said:


> I can't emphasize enough that what Prism posted matters : "....this behavior is largely correspondent to how much training you invest." If you haven't found a good place to attend obedience classes with your puppy, it's not too early to do so. You can do a google search for "dog training club" or "obedience Club" or contact your regional AKC club or Golden Retriever club (grca.org) and ask for assistance from GOlden people to get referrals. Clubs are terrific ways to get a good, affordable class. The members teach the classes and you can join and they are generally reduced in price. Plan on being enrolled in classes for the first year or two of owning your Golden, especially if you've never really trained a dog before. Attention to daily exercise and obedience will make your life with your new puppy much more enjoyable.


*Thanks for your suggestions. I didn’t know about looking into clubs. I am trying to learn as much as I can before bringing a puppy home. I’d rather be proactive in training than reactive. *


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## nolefan

JulieCA said:


> *........... I am trying to learn as much as I can before bringing a puppy home. I’d rather be proactive in training than reactive. *


Super smart, a new puppy is like bringing home a new infant, if you're doing it right, you'll wonder what you ever did with all your free time 
Use the search feature at the top and look up old threads on good books and videos, websites etc. there are some really terrific resources available and having video to watch can be so helpful if you've never trained a dog before. We also have lots of threads on great things to buy to make managing a puppy easier, good toys etc. IT's a lot of fun to look through all the ideas people have. Also, can't remember if I suggested it but there is a wonderful facebook group called "Life of Rune" hosted by a lady who is an amazing human and terrific Golden trainer. She documents, with videos, the exercises and ideas she has been using to train her current pup to be a therapy dog. She is so supportive and you can back track through all her old videos, they are under the "Units" section and organized by age - you can also just scroll back to January 2020 to see the beginning posts. Kind of fun to see them.
Here's the link : Life with Rune








Life with Rune | Facebook


This group was created to use as a resource to show how to train and socialize a puppy so they grow into well-behaved dogs who are treasured family members. Since April 2020, I have documented the...




www.facebook.com




It's worth the time:








Life with Rune | Facebook


This group was created to use as a resource to show how to train and socialize a puppy so they grow into well-behaved dogs who are treasured family members. Since April 2020, I have documented the...




www.facebook.com


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## JulieCAinMA

nolefan said:


> Super smart, a new puppy is like bringing home a new infant, if you're doing it right, you'll wonder what you ever did with all your free time
> Use the search feature at the top and look up old threads on good books and videos, websites etc. there are some really terrific resources available and having video to watch can be so helpful if you've never trained a dog before. We also have lots of threads on great things to buy to make managing a puppy easier, good toys etc. IT's a lot of fun to look through all the ideas people have. Also, can't remember if I suggested it but there is a wonderful facebook group called "Life of Rune" hosted by a lady who is an amazing human and terrific Golden trainer. She documents, with videos, the exercises and ideas she has been using to train her current pup to be a therapy dog. She is so supportive and you can back track through all her old videos, they are under the "Units" section and organized by age - you can also just scroll back to January 2020 to see the beginning posts. Kind of fun to see them.
> Here's the link : Life with Rune
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Life with Rune | Facebook
> 
> 
> This group was created to use as a resource to show how to train and socialize a puppy so they grow into well-behaved dogs who are treasured family members. Since April 2020, I have documented the...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.facebook.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's worth the time:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Life with Rune | Facebook
> 
> 
> This group was created to use as a resource to show how to train and socialize a puppy so they grow into well-behaved dogs who are treasured family members. Since April 2020, I have documented the...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.facebook.com


*Thanks so much for sharing the Facebook page. I'll check it out!*


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## SRW

"Sit" is the first command a dog learns in basic obedience. Any dog that knows it can be instantly brought under control.
"High spirited" is just an excuse for poor training. Attend a retriever field trial, you will see dozens of "high spirited" dogs and none of them will be jumping on or biting people.
Time outs don't work (on kids or dogs).
Praise good behavior and reprimand bad behavior.
Maintain your standards for behavior 24/7.
It isn't rocket science.


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## JulieCAinMA

SRW said:


> "Sit" is the first command a dog learns in basic obedience. Any dog that knows it can be instantly brought under control.
> "High spirited" is just an excuse for poor training. Attend a retriever field trial, you will see dozens of "high spirited" dogs and none of them will be jumping on or biting people.
> Time outs don't work (on kids or dogs).
> Praise good behavior and reprimand bad behavior.
> Maintain your standards for behavior 24/7.
> It isn't rocket science.


_*Thanks for your response. I too thought training a dog couldn't possibly be rocket science and then I saw the hundreds, maybe thousands (??) of posts on the Behavior Issues forum. Being a novice dog-person (won't even be bringing home my puppy until March), I was freaked to say the least. 

As a parent of adult children and a newly retired teacher (elementary students and then a teacher-of-teachers in classroom management), I know that training your kids and your class is all about consistency, even when it would be easier ON YOU to look the other way. I can tell you that students are just waiting for that defining moment that tilts the leadership dynamic. They actually don't want the shift, but they have to test you. Once they are satisfied that you are the leader and will always be the leader everything settles into a calm environment of mutual respect, trust and safety. To achieve this relationship takes hard work and is minute by minute work for quite a while. I believe it is difficult for most people to sustain the consistency, or they don't understand that it's not just a, "say it once and it's learned behavior"... **maybe that's why the abundance of posts!?!?** 

Hopefully, I'm going into this with my eyes wide open and with an understanding that training will be my new full-time job (being retired during a pandemic dumps a ton of time in your lap) and until I actually get my puppy, I think I'll focus more on the training forums and less on the behavior issues forum. Like I said at the beginning, reading through some of those is enough to make you run the other way. 😂 *_


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## SRW

JulieCA said:


> I know that training your dog is all about consistency, even when it would be easier ON YOU to look the other way. I can tell you that dogs are just waiting for that defining moment that tilts the leadership dynamic. They actually don't want the shift, but they have to test you. Once they are satisfied that you are the leader and will always be the leader everything settles into a calm environment of mutual respect, trust and safety. To achieve this relationship takes hard work and is minute by minute work for quite a while. I believe it is difficult for most people to sustain the consistency, or they don't understand that it's not just a, "say it once and it's learned behavior"


Great summary of what it takes to train a dog!


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## Sam&Solar

baumgartml16 said:


> We had this same problem, totally random and annoying lol. Our trainer came out and observed and now things are much much better.
> 
> First of all don't play with him while sitting on the ground. It is most likely just over stimulation. You need to try to pin point when he is getting to the breaking point and try to stop play before that happens, pet him, calm him down and then resume playing once you are back to a place where he has self control again.
> 
> When he does mouth you, say "ouch" with your deep voice, fold your arms and turn your back to him (don't walk away). He might still jump a few times but 9 times out of 10 he will eventually offer a sit. When he does this, praise, praise, praise!! Have a few treats in your pocket for this instance.
> 
> You want to keep play time structured for now. Also if you see him getting to his "losing it" point start with some training before he can get there. Work on some basic commands to gain his focus back.
> 
> These things have worked SO well with Koda and she was quite the mouther.
> 
> If you want to play rough with him, add a cue word. My husband likes to play rough with her sometimes, I do not. So he says "Koda, wrestle" and she knows that means she gets to play with him in a different manner but she never does it to me anymore. And if she tries, I fold my arms and she quits.
> 
> I felt like it was never going to end and now it has!  Good luck!


Thank you for this. It's really helpful. Who was the trainer you used to help you please?


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## calliegoldengirl

Sam&Solar said:


> Thank you for this. It's really helpful. Who was the trainer you used to help you please?


We had the same exact issue and were recommended Adrienne Farricelli at Brain Training 4 Dogs. She's been a CPDT-KA certified dog trainer for 10 years and is the BEST. Her modules are super helpful and straightforward and honestly totally worth it in my opinion. Here's a link to her website: Brain Training 4 Dogs


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