# Opinion On This Boy



## Zafirah (Jun 9, 2007)

: I'd like an opinion on this boy. He was born 2/9/06. His name is Striking Jack Of Kona, but, we call him Jack or yaccabuck (dont ask): 
I've been wanting to get opinions on him forever. We plan on breeding him when he turns 2, but, could we put him up for stud say this summer at 1 1/2 or is that to early. I've also got a pic of him jumping that ill post. That is him jumping at 10 or 11 months, i dont know,but i think it was 10 months, no i thing it was 13 months hmm. :doh: I'm very forgetfull sometimes. Well, i will be getting some more tomorow(saturday) and will hopefully post them that night or sunday morning. The ones tomorow will be taking in the light and i will have better jumps as the jumping ishs course is set up at my grandparents house. Alright, well, onto the pics, sorry to keep you waiting: 

Heres the picture of him just standing, i realise hes not streched too and it might be hard to critique him.









Here him jumping, he can now jump of leash though and we have started jumping him from a laydown or sit, whatever he listens to, to teach him manners, although, he is pretty goofy


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## RickGibbs (Dec 16, 2005)

You shouldn't breed him before two years because you can't get his clearances until then.....and really, if someone is willing to breed with him without clearances, you should reconsider how reputable they would be as breeders....

What do you know about his pedigrees?


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## RickGibbs (Dec 16, 2005)

Oh...but in answer to your question regarding opinions....I think he looks amazing. I'm not an expert as far as show quality, etc, but he sure looks gorgeous...


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## Zafirah (Jun 9, 2007)

Omg duh, i tottaly forgot about his clearences. He has to get his hips checked and everything, he doesnt look skinny to you guys does he, becaus emy grandma keeps thinking hes to skinny, and im like omg, stop feeding him because shes trying to make him fatter. He weighs 66 pounds


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## GoldenBoys2 (May 28, 2007)

I don't think he looks too skinny at all. He looks great!!


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## time4goldens (Mar 13, 2006)

He is absolutely gorgeous.

I don't think he looks thin, but I would really need a picture of the belly area as that is where most Goldens can be measured with regard to the body fat.

Rick is totally correct about the clearances. No good vet will do xrays of hips and elbows prior to two years of age and that is just a guideline. Each golden differs a little with regard to growth rates. Eyes and cardio clearances should also be done.

Have you done any research on Orthopedic Foundation for Animals to see where his ancestors on both sides rated on hips and elbows? That might give you a good indication of what his might be.

Please require the same clearances of the bitch you choose to breed him with. I spend countless hours meeting stud dogs before breeding my dog. 

Good luck.


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

You shouldn't breed until he is at least 2 so that you can get his hip clearances, and he should also have eyes, elbow, heart, and thyroid clearances (some people will say not all of those are necessary but if you can do them, why not). 

It would be good to have him evaluated by someone knowledgeable in conformation to see whether he fits the breed standard (ideally a GRCA CCA evaluation). I know you probably just want a pet and not a show dog, but it's still important that he have a sound structure and look like a Golden. You can also look into some sort of competitive event or at the very least get a CGC to show that he's trainable and has a stable temperament.

Right now you can start doing research on his pedigree using K9DATA.COM Home Page and Orthopedic Foundation for Animals. Do you have a 5-generation pedigree for him? Do all of the dogs in the pedigree have hip clearances? Do the more recent generations also have eye clearances (even better if they have heart/elbows/thyroid too)?


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## Zafirah (Jun 9, 2007)

Yes, i do have a five- generation pedigree, and they all have hip clearences and his grandfather *i think* is a Champion. I'm going to start with local shows this summer.


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

Would you mind sending his pedigree to the site? Many folks here could evaluate it for you here


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## GoldenShamus (Feb 26, 2007)

There are so many things to think about when considering breeding. I wish more breeders would sell their dogs on a contract that doesn't allow for breeding. My golden was sold to me on a limited AKC registration (meaning that I could never register a litter) and I had to sign a contract stating I agreed to neuter him. For me, it's a huge sign of a good breeder. 

Please check out the thousands of golden retrievers sitting in rescue groups and shelters across the country hoping to get adopted so they aren't euthanized. It may help to change your mind. If not, please at the very minimum read this information:
*Breeding Your Golden Retriever*

Breeding is not for beginners. It is as hard to do well as it is easy to do. Until you can satisfy the requirements that the serious hobby breeder should meet, as presented in the section of this booklet entitled Choosing A Reputable Breeder, you will be doing the breed an injustice if you have a litter of puppies.
*CONSIDER YOUR MOTIVES*

If you think that:

HAVING PUPPIES WOULD BE FUN; it is also very time consuming and demanding. By four weeks of age a Golden litter of eight, twelve or possibly even fourteen puppies is active, dirty, noisy and potentially destructive. Illness or death of the dam or puppies can be expensive, emotional . . . and no fun at all.
IT WOULD BE EDUCATIONAL FOR THE CHILDREN; so would a litter of hamsters. Bitches do not whelp at your convenience, and the children are often in school or in bed at the time of delivery. Care of the pregnant bitch, and properly raising and socializing puppies, is work for a responsible adult.
IT WOULD HELP US GET BACK OUR INVESTMENT; you may find that the rate of return is very low. Stud fee, veterinary fees, advertising, and the daily care and feeding of a litter are very expensive. You may only be able to sell three or four puppies out of a litter of ten or twelve; even experienced breeders sometimes have difficulty selling puppies.
IT WOULD HELP FULFILL THE DOG'S NEEDS; you are anthropomorphizing. While the instinct for procreation is strong, the dog has no conscious knowledge of what it is missing, no regrets and no guilt feelings. Spaying or neutering will remove the instinct and the problems often associated with it, such as wandering and marking. Pregnancy not only contributes nothing to a bitch's health, but sometimes causes problems. A spayed bitch cannot be accidentally bred, and will not be subject to the uterine infections common in older, intact females.
IT WILL IMPROVE THE BITCH'S TEMPERAMENT IF SHE IS BRED; you are wrong. No animal whose temperament needs improving should be bred in the first place, since temperament is most often the result of hereditary factors. And while raising a litter will not only NOT make an improvement in the dam's temperament, it will also probably result in a litter of unsatisfactory puppies who have been imprinted by their unstable dam. There is also the possibility that the bitch will be an unsatisfactory mother, necessitating much more work on your part.
*CONSIDER YOUR RESOURCES*

Raising a litter is a demanding project. Do you:

HAVE THE FACILITIES FOR WHELPING AND RAISING A LITTER PROPERLY? You need a warm, quiet, secure area, easily cleaned, for properly confining and caring for a litter of eight, ten or twelve fast-growing puppies while they are with their mother, and a similar, larger area for use after weaning.
HAVE THE TIME TO DEVOTE TO THIS PROJECT? Time to take or send a bitch for breeding, sit up for hours during whelping, and hand-raise the litter if the bitch is unable to? Time to buy and prepare food, feed, and clean up four or five times daily? Time to go to the veterinarian for check-ups, inoculations, and with a sick dam or puppy? Time to scrub floors and pens, clean up feces and urine, and give medication? Time to individually socialize each puppy daily? Time to answer phone calls, talk with prospective buyers, and answer the same questions over and over again? Time for all the paperwork required, including typing accurate pedigrees, health records, care instructions, records of sales, and so on?
HAVE THE MONEY TO PUT INTO THE PROJECT? Can you afford to pay the stud fee, inoculations and veterinary care for the bitch and puppies, as well as other expenses? What if the bitch has problems that necessitate a caesarean section? What if the puppies die? What if the bitch dies, or cannot raise the puppies? Can you afford to feed and provide veterinary care for two or three four-month-old puppies that didn't sell? Can you afford to refund the purchase price on a puppy that proves to be unsound or unsuitable?
*CONSIDER YOUR DOG'S QUALITY*

Is your dog truly an outstanding representative of the breed? Pretty, friendly and smart is not nearly enough.

TEMPERAMENT. Your dog must be absolutely sound and stable, with a personality and disposition appropriate for the breed. Shyness, aggressiveness, gunshyness, lack of retrieving ability or trainability, and hyperactivity are all reasons not to breed, regardless of other problems.
BREED TYPE AND QUALITY. Your dog must be structurally and functionally sound, with conformation characteristics appropriate for the breed. An experienced, knowledgeable exhibitor/breeder can assist in the evaluation of your dog's adherence to the Breed Standard.
SOUNDNESS. Your dog should be tested free of certain genetic defects, as should the proposed mate. Knowledge of the status of parents, grandparents, siblings, etc. with regard to genetic testing is also desirable. HIPS should be properly X-rayed, and the X-rays submitted to the Orthopedic Foundation for Animals or PennHIP to be read as free of hip dysplasia. HEARTS should be examined by a board-certified cardiologist. EYES should be examined annually by a board-certified veterinary ophthalmologist and be free of hereditary cataracts, progressive retinal atrophy, and any other eye anomaly. ELBOWS should be properly X-rayed and the X-rays submitted to the Orthopedic Foundation for Animals or a board-certified veterinary radiologist, to be read as free of elbow dysplasia.

Any inheritable defects, including but not limited to retained testicles, overshot or undershot jaw, congenital heart defects, recurrent skin problems, thyroid deficiency, immunological problems, orthopedic problems and recurrent seizures or epilepsy occurring in either parent are all reasons not to breed, regardless of other qualities.
PEDIGREE. A four or five generation pedigree on the proposed litter should be read and interpreted by a person with extensive knowledge of the breed and of the dogs involved. Titles alone are no guarantee of genetic value.
HEALTH. A breeding animal must be fully mature, in the prime of health, and in lean muscular condition. All inoculations should be up to date, and the animal should be free of both internal and external parasites. Acquired problems such as narrow birth canal from previous injury, canine brucellosis, transmissible venereal tumor, anemia, any disease or infection of the reproductive organs, concurrent diseases of other organ systems, or any contagious diseases are all reasons not to breed.
*CONSIDERATIONS OF THE STUD DOG OWNER*

If you are thinking of using your male at stud, you are no less responsible for the quality of the litter than the owner of the brood bitch. You have the obligation of thoroughly screening every owner that inquires for stud service and the bitch to be bred; of traveling to and from the airport to pick up and return bitches sent in for breeding; of boarding and caring for bitches that are sent to you; of carrying out the breeding; of supplying pedigrees, photos, and examination reports; and of keeping meticulous records. This is all done as circumstances dictate, and not at your convenience; the weekend away you had planned may well be spent at home looking after a visiting bitch instead.
*CONSIDER THE CURRENT DOG POPULATION*

If, at this point, you are still considering breeding your dog, VISIT the dog pound, Humane Society or animal shelter in the city nearest you. Ask how many dogs are euthanized monthly, and how many euthanized in the last month were ​


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## GoldenShamus (Feb 26, 2007)

RickGibbs said:


> You shouldn't breed him before two years because you can't get his clearances until then.....and really, if someone is willing to breed with him without clearances, you should reconsider how reputable they would be as breeders....
> 
> What do you know about his pedigrees?


I couldn't agree more.

Health clearances are nothing to make light of. Golden Retrievers, thanks in part to lots of over breeding and careless breeding, are plagued with health problems. Hip dysplasia and cancer being huge issues, but among others as well.

I hope you decide not to breed, but if you do, what would you do if a pup was returned to you (as a pup or adult) because he/she had major health issues? Would you keep them and spend the 5,000 to fix each hip? Or would you euthanize him/her?

Breeding without health clearances upsets me a great deal, as you can probably tell, it really does become personal to me because I just love this breed so much.


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

I have NO problem if you breed him as long as you get the clearances. It's certainly better if his ancestors had them as well. He could be a great introduction to the breed for you. If you really do want to show him, attend a few shows and talk to some experienced folks. He is beautiful, but if he is not a pick show pup from a show bred litter, the chances he would be competitive are slim. My beloved girl is definitely not going to win any conformation shows- but we intend to show her in obedience. It looks like you already enjoy training your handsome fellow to jump  If you have your heart set on showing and breeding, your best bet might be to study, study, study and purchase a show quality foundation female from a reputable show kennel to start your journey.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

What do I know, but, he looks pretty good to me...


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

Zafirah said:


> Yes, i do have a five- generation pedigree, and they all have hip clearences and his grandfather *i think* is a Champion. I'm going to start with local shows this summer.


Can you put him on k9data.com?


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## HovawartMom (Aug 10, 2006)

I Find Him Gorgeous(but I'm Not A Breeder).


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

In terms of showing, a stacked photo is a start but more important are the things you can't see in a photo-muscling, movement, narrow in the rear? in the front? tail carriage, etc.

Have you been attending conformation classes sponsored by a local club with him? What does your instructor think?

Hip clearances are not the only clearances important to have through the generations. Eyes (done annually) and heart (done at least once but more breeders are doing it more than once) and elbows (fairly recent) are also important.

And having champions that are more than one or two generations back is meaningless in terms of being showable. Was he sold to you as a show potential puppy? Did others in his litter go to show homes? Were his parents shown?

I think the advice about having him evaluated by some local breeders is a good idea. They can tell you if he is showable or not, and if he is, they can help you with his faults, so you can identify them and try to minimize them in the ring.

ACC had the right idea, but it is usually easier to get a breeder to part with a show pick male than female  Seek out local show people, ask and learn, study study study and get a well bred dog or bitch to start out with.


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

I should have added-a CCA event would be a good start for you. These are non-competitive assessments of conformation done by experienced breeders/competitors and judges, both conformation and field.

More information can be found at The Golden Retriever Club of America

I have two girls who are not finished and probably won't be-one has just the worst head for conformation but a lovely lovely body and the other is very pretty but big for what is out there now. Both have been shown and have won their classes and even reserved but I still intend to try for CCA's on both of them.


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## GoldenShamus (Feb 26, 2007)

Tahnee GR said:


> In terms of showing, a stacked photo is a start but more important are the things you can't see in a photo-muscling, movement, narrow in the rear? in the front? tail carriage, etc.
> 
> Have you been attending conformation classes sponsored by a local club with him? What does your instructor think?
> 
> ...


Linda,

I'm so glad you saw this thread! Your knowledgeable is invaulauble.


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

While I know a bitch is more difficult to obtain, I certainly know some novices have done it. Heck, one whom I taught how to hold a show lead and how to groom when I was 16 managed to eventually finish her first Golden bitch (and believe me she was as clueless as a person can get) and breed her and is now a full fledged show person. She was even a snob to me and acted like she didn't know me at a show  LOL I told her I should have let her figure it out on her own way back when. As horrifically rude as I think she's become, she did a good job with her girl and bred her wisely. She has nice dogs and she was and is very responsible and I know the breeder (very big name) doesn't regret selling her that show bitch all those years ago.


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## Zafirah (Jun 9, 2007)

Alright, I finnaly uploaded his pedigree on K9data.com
Pedigree: STRIKING JACK OF KONA


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

Zafirah said:


> Yes, i do have a five- generation pedigree, and they all have hip clearences and his grandfather *i think* is a Champion. I'm going to start with local shows this summer.


Who told you they all have clearances? Look up the dogs in his pedigree on Orthopedic Foundation for Animals. One of his grandparents (Benjamin of Kickerville) had mild hip dysplasia, and none of his other parents or grandparents have health clearances


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## GoldenShamus (Feb 26, 2007)

katieanddusty said:


> Who told you they all have clearances? Look up the dogs in his pedigree on Orthopedic Foundation for Animals. One of his grandparents (Benjamin of Kickerville) had mild hip dysplasia, and none of his other parents or grandparents have health clearances


Katie, that's so great of you to take the time to look through the pedigree.

To the poster: do you have a contract where the breeder made these false claims? If you do, you should definitely report this to your local and national breed club as well as the AKC. It's nothing less than outrageous for a 'breeder' to make false claims about a dog's medical history.

I'm also interested to hear what experienced breeders on here think about this and what you would/wouldn't advise.


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## Zafirah (Jun 9, 2007)

But, doesn't the owner have to post there dog on that website in order for it to appear?


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## DelmarvaGold (Mar 7, 2006)

Zafirah said:


> But, doesn't the owner have to post there dog on that website in order for it to appear?


When you send in the hip films for OFA evaluation they are automatically entered into the databse IF they pass. The owner must give permission to OFA to enter NON passing grades. I personally wish that ALL breeders would give permission. I do and yes I have had dysplastic dogs and it's right there on OFA for the world to see. It's valuable information when researching pedigrees.

If your breeder just told you everyone passed...they most likely are not telling you the truth. Have you seen with your own eyes the certificates on the parents?

Your boys pedigree is basically a backyard pedigree. I personally would not be breeding him. Have him neutered and enjoy him as a wonderful loving companion.


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