# Heeling Stick or Sit Stick



## Poppy2 (Jun 23, 2015)

I often see people give a smack on the rump to their dog at the line for creeping or hovering their butt during training. Sit means sit, right?
Guess thats a sit stick.

I have seen others put the stick infront of the dogs chest at the line to stop creeping and hovering. Heel means heel, right?
Guess thats a heeling stick?


What method do you use and why?


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## Capt Jack (Dec 29, 2011)

I would never hit my dogs or threaten with a stick. Training is a long term( maybe lifetime) obligation and not taught by force but by love.


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## Poppy2 (Jun 23, 2015)

Capt Jack said:


> I would never hit my dogs or threaten with a stick. Training is a long term( maybe lifetime) obligation and not taught by force but by love.


Are you Capt. Jack from RTF?
If so, I think you may have had a stroke.


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## Chritty (Aug 17, 2014)

Poppy2 said:


> I often see people give a smack on the rump to their dog at the line for creeping or hovering their butt during training. Sit means sit, right?
> Guess thats a sit stick.
> 
> I have seen others put the stick infront of the dogs chest at the line to stop creeping and hovering. Heel means heel, right?
> ...



I am not involved in hunt or field. As such these are new training terms to me. 

What do you use and how do you apply it?


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## Poppy2 (Jun 23, 2015)

Ooommmggg!


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## Chritty (Aug 17, 2014)

Poppy2 said:


> Ooommmggg!



?????????????


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## Claudia M (Aug 8, 2012)

I have a heeling stick and have only used it for that - heeling. I have honestly never had to use it in the field. I am more conservative in training and have used a short handle leash in the field to reinforce the sit on the marks and on honor. Now we are working towards SH so I have been working on sit means sit until you hear your name; if you break a here followed by a sit nick sit is in order. Luckily I did not have to do many of those with either of my older girls. The puppy I am not concerned about steadiness, IMHO that can destroy their drive in the long run ( I have pretty much done that with Rose by requiring steadiness at the line).


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## Claudia M (Aug 8, 2012)

Poppy2, on the forum you will have a lot of people who have never trained in the field but would like to, people who will never train in the field and any method besides click and treat is obsolete and few who are still somewhat to very active in field training.
I am personally happy to see the people who have not trained in the field before come and read these posts. It's a good start!


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## Loisiana (Jul 29, 2009)

I use my heeling stick as a flirt pole


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## Alaska7133 (May 26, 2011)

My heeling stick I use on my husband when he misbehaves. Ok maybe not. But I'm terribly uncoordinated to use a heeling stick. Mine collects dust. I wish I hadn't wasted the money.


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## krazybronco2 (May 21, 2015)

creeping, head swinging, not wanting to work with the handler, potential for sticking on birds, the list can go on and on for what you can use a heeling stick for. 

and no that is not capt jack off RTF Glen has Labs not Goldens


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## Poppy2 (Jun 23, 2015)

So how did you correct for creeping?
Did you find it to be disobeying the sit command?

Or did you find it disobeying the heel command?

Did his or her butt move first (hover)?

Or does the dogs front feet move first?


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## krazybronco2 (May 21, 2015)

Poppy2 said:


> So how did you correct for creeping?
> Did you find it to be disobeying the sit command?
> 
> Or did you find it disobeying the heel command?
> ...


creeping is always breaking sit in my opinion. and same correction sit stick sit then heeled off line no chance to pick up a bird. but i correct for any movement at the line other than ears perking up. if you allow any kind of movement when you can correct expect to have a dog that will break at a test.


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## Poppy2 (Jun 23, 2015)

Ok, I can see that.

I wonder sometimes why I see guys put the stick infront of the dog. Do they have a chronic creeper that has happy feet that needs to be reminded where his front feet are?
Thats kinda why I ask about the butt or feet moving first. 

Think of a horse race, the horse is heeled to the gait. Locked in with a brace infront and inback of him. Bell ring, gait drops and the horse takes off like a bat out of hell.


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## Swampcollie (Sep 6, 2007)

Poppy2 said:


> I often see people give a smack on the rump to their dog at the line for creeping or hovering their butt during training. Sit means sit, right?
> Guess thats a sit stick.
> 
> I have seen others put the stick infront of the dogs chest at the line to stop creeping and hovering. Heel means heel, right?
> ...


A stick is a training aid not a training method.

It can be used in many ways for a multitude if issues. How it is used and why it is used depends a lot on the particular dog in question and the goals the handler has in mind at that moment in time.


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## goldlover68 (Jun 17, 2013)

I have a healing stick that I got over 20years ago when I first started learning to train. The trainer I worked with then used them for training, heel and sometimes sit. We never *hit* the pup! Dogs have a natural fear of anything like a stick being held by someone approaching them. When heeling the dog, by simply placing the stick in front of their feet, you can pull them back in line, without in physical contact. If they refuse to sit, you can simply bring the stick over their back and touch the butt...they will set....I suppose some 'stubborn' dogs may require more than being touched, but none of mine ever did.

For the last 3 dogs I have had, I never use the heeling stick....pinch collar works much better....and you can start them a bit younger. This pinch collar work also helps in the transition to an e collar for field work.


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## FTGoldens (Dec 20, 2012)

I, too, don't use the stick (whether "heeling" or "sit") for popping them on the rear or chest if they rise or move forward. I used to do that, but learned that the stick is much more useful for other things; my early mutts developed stick-anxiety and I could no longer use it for other things, so I changed. 
I will, however, use it to tap a dog on the rear if it head-swings ... literally, just a gentle tap when it swings off a mark, and "no - mark". Interestingly, pretty much 100% of the time, the dog will correct its gaze and look back at the mark that it was supposed to be watching.
The other "use" for my heeling stick is to give it to the dog once we finish a set-up, walk off line and get beyond the holding blind...the mutts will carry it to the truck as if it's a trophy. It's probably somehow a bad habit, but it makes them happy and seemingly unwary of the stick even when I'm holding it.
As an aside, I'm not an advocate of sending a dog on a mark that it swung off of just to teach it that it has to keep its eyes on the mark...doing so makes the dog look stupid, wastes time, and, in my mind, doesn't teach the dog anything. However, I know that lots of trainers will do just that, so they may be right....
FTGoldens


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## FTGoldens (Dec 20, 2012)

As for creeping, I'm starting to believe that the Hillmann "Traffic Cop" training, particularly for young dogs, will go a long way to keep a dog from creeping. If I had a creeper, even if an adult, I would try to use that method to reteach the dog to stay still. (Yes, I had a creeper before Traffic Cop came out...the worst thing about creeping is that the dog puts itself in a position such that the handler cannot do anything to help the dog while the marks are going down.)
FTGoldens


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