# A Surprise Pregnancy



## schleng (Feb 2, 2006)

Gee, what a shame. 
What do you mean "hiding at a neighbor's"?


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

*pics*

I aways enjoy a good visual...We have alot of woods around here and it looked like Angel had been swimming in the pond in his back yard(the sitter's nieghbor). Once we got the call of her location(we'd been searching a broader perimeter) she was easy to find. He said he'd been tossing her scrap's but thought she was one of the breeder's dogs(he called her). I never thought of looking so close to where she ran away from. I figured she was on her way home(about 5 mi.).


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## schleng (Feb 2, 2006)

What a pretty dog.
I am assuming you meant that at the end of the 3 weeks, she wound up in his yard and he called the breeder? Sorry for the confusion.


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

Well thank you for the comment and you are correct. She is five years old so I really didn't want to breed her again. This came as a total shock! She seems healthy and ok though. It doesn't seem too stressful on her. Angel follows me around EVERYWHERE--I call her my shadow. What has me really worried is that she swallowed a raw hide that she stole from our little dogs! It's been 2 days and she STILL hasn't passed it(unless she ate it again without me knowing)...


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## greg bell (May 24, 2005)

up to a period of time there is a pill that will abort it.... im curious as to exactly what a "prized" golden retriever is?.. a show champion???


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

Either his mother or father was a local AKC winner for something, I'm really not sure. I do know he is beautiful! But barely a year. She lets him run the fenced front yard. But, again, I'm not sure who the father is. I'm pretty sure it's too late too abort--this all happened nearly 2 months ago(which would mean we found out a week or 2 before she was due).


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> ...She is five years old so I really didn't want to breed her again. This came as a total shock!...


What comes as a total shock to me is that you didn't seem to know what to do to prevent this 'surprise' pregnancy... you say you "really didn't want to breed her again"... well then why didn't you get her spayed? I hope you do find wonderful homes for all the little pups to come.

I don't think I quite understand the situation... if the neighbor was just tossing her scraps from time to time, where was Angel actually living during those 3-weeks? and if the neighbor thought she was one of the breeder's dogs why didn't he call the breeder and tell her about it? ...after all I think 3-weeks is an extremely long span of time.

The rawhide... As long as she's still passing normal amounts of poops, I wouldn't be too worried about the raw hide... she probably has already passed it and you either didn't recognize it in its 'altered' form or simply missed it.


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

That stinks! :no: 

If your female and the "prized Golden Retriever Charlie" are both AKC registered, you should be able to determine the parentage using DNA profiling. http://www.akc.org/dna/multisire.cfm



> Any idea how we can tell how far along she is?


As you have previously insisted that you are a very responsible hobby breeder who has bred at least one litter, why don't you tell me?

I must say I am shocked that you didn't spay her since you "really didn't want to breed her again," and that a responsible breeder/owner of a "prized Golden Retriever" would allow a female in heat whose owners "really didn't want to breed her" to be "real buddy-buddy" with an intact male too young for health clearances. Especially when the quality of both dogs is dubious at best (as I said, the male is too young for health clearances, I don't know if your female has health clearances, and you haven't mentioned that either of them have distinguished themselves in competition).


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

lol! monomer, monomer, monomer...still responding in the same way...
"you didn't seem to know what to do to prevent this 'surprise' pregnancy... you say you "really didn't want to breed her again"... well then why didn't you get her spayed?"
my answer: 1st of all I am not stupid. In my first post I said "In our yard she never could've gotten pregnant." That is because it is completely fenced in! The breeder has her property sectioned off where the females get the run of the back of the property(includes woods and a swimming hole) and the males are kept separate(Charlie gets the front yard, Stone the left half, and some other one the right). It's that simple. If Angel hadn't missed us so badly, she wouldn't have darted out of the female area and found her way out of the yard. We had planned on getting her spayed this fall so we could put up an invisible fence for her to have the roam of the woods; otherwise what is the point in spaying a dog who is never around other dogs? You may not be from the country so you might not know. One last thing, YOU are the one who makes me want to leave this website! I want ENCOURAGEMENT!!! I do not come here to be corrected or put down. I know what happened was a mistake; I should've taken Angel with us when my father-in-law died and we had to rush out of town. Next time he dies I'll make sure I think of my dogs first!


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

now i remember why i LOVE dogs so such more than humans! i officially LEAVE this site!!!! I came here for support but all I get is this!!!!!!!! dont you think i felt bad enough without you guys badgering me?


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

You must realize that people on a forum only have what's written to go on. There are obvious questions to ask when someone is asking for advice or opinions... I am not afraid or ashamed to ask those questions... when something does not seem to make sense, I will 'call it', often very frankly and directly... this is how people learn more about a situation, others, and themselves. This is the way I've always been my whole life, logical and direct... some people hate those traits and others admire me for them. I'm too old to change and nor do I want to. 

And I am truly sorry for the loss of your father-in-law... and I do hope you find wonderful homes for all the pups.

Please take my words for what they are, there are no hidden meanings or innuendos.


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## davebeech (Feb 11, 2006)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> now i remember why i LOVE dogs so such more than humans! i officially LEAVE this site!!!! I came here for support but all I get is this!!!!!!!! dont you think i felt bad enough without you guys badgering me?


That's a shame you feel you have to leave the forum, I would like to have seen how the pups turn out. Best of luck and hope she has a beautiful healthy litter !!!!!


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## heidi_pooh (Feb 9, 2006)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> what is the point in spaying a dog who is never around other dogs?


If a dog is not going to be used for breeding then it is much healthier to have them fixed. My friend's cat started losing her fur. They took her to the vet and they said that she was stressed out due to sexual frustration. She got her fixed and the problem went away.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> now i remember why i LOVE dogs so such more than humans! i officially LEAVE this site!!!! I came here for support but all I get is this!!!!!!!! dont you think i felt bad enough without you guys badgering me?


You might consider getting a thicker skin. I just came from another forum that treated a prospective breeder so badly, I was almost sick. Monomer relayed an opinion but most of his post was trying to get to the bottom of your post which was confusing.

I'm still confused, but the point is that your dog is pregnant and I wonder what your plans are. Do you think the father is a Golden???? 

Can you afford the medical care involved? Are you prepared yet for delivery or are you still at that over-whelm stage before it all gets together.

I do wish you would stay. I can't promise you won't get a harsh opinion, but different points of view is what a forum is all about.


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## Samwise (May 15, 2006)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> Any idea how we can tell how far along she is? I expect her to whelp them any day now.


Assuming you haven't left the forum yet...

The only way you'll be able to tell is to have her vetted. Have you done that yet?

Other than that, I'm not really sure what you expected people's responses to be. Your OP raised valid questions that were asked and you chose to be defensive instead of answer them.

BTW - a fenced in yard is NOT a deterrent for a male when he smells a bitch in heat. It's barely a speedbump.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

Yeah, I had a male go through (a chain link) fence, not over it. But, no matter how careful you are, accidental breedings can occur. It would be too bad if they are not Golden puppies. For those of you who have not lived with a bitch in heat, I suggest you experience it before you make judgements. There are many reasons why an owner might elect to have a bitch spayed at some other time. my_lil_angels came here for support, and we gave her nothing but grief. Shame on all of us!


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

vrocco1 said:


> ...my_lil_angels came here for support, and we gave her nothing but grief. Shame on all of us!


What kind of support does not point out errors in thinking and lessons not learned?

Her comment to me, "still responding in the same way..." made me curious and I checked to see if we had 'met' before in another thread... sure enough almost exactly one year ago after breeding Angel. In that thread she showed a complete lack of understanding of even basic genetics and after a lengthy explanation still did not get it, and has intentions of more breeding... Well, now Angel is bred again... look at her mistakes in logic (Katie high-lighted quite a few of them) and still she doesn't get it.

If I made a mistake and then showed by my postings and responses that I didn't yet understand the real reasons for my mistake but instead blamed it on other things, I'd actually want some one to point out my real error in thinking... that to me is real support.


If Hitler talked about not meaning to have killed so many Jews and now realizing the problem with killing all the Jews would be that no one would be left to provide free labor to the state, and he is saying its too late almost all of them have been already gassed, and so now is asking for advice on what to do about the lack of free labor... what kind of support would you have offered him? I'm in no way equating my_lil_angels24 and her situation with Hitler's genocide on the Jews, I'm only responding to the remark that seems to imply that no support was given to her... is support always what someone wants to hear delivered in a nice way? No, I think Lucky's mom had it right... she needs thicker skin and an attitude that allows for admitting mistakes and accepting lessons learned.

EDIT: I do feel bad that she ran off in a huff... but I do NOT feel ashamed that I spoke up.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

Old Guy, I believe we should give everyone in this forum the benefit of the doubt. Often times, when people put things in writing, we misinterpret it, because we can neither see what is in their face, nor can we hear the inflection in their voice. 

Let’s face it, we may feel we are protecting innocent animals, but there is nothing we can do within the framework of this forum to protect those animals. All we can do is offend people, and they run off and do whatever they feel like doing anyway. I just make it a matter of practice, not to waste my breath. That way, at least we don’t hurt innocent humans.

If this person had turned to a breeder's forum for advice, they probably would have eaten her alive. Most times, this is a neutral place, where Golden Retriever lovers of all kinds can come for advice, without being eaten alive.

That is JMHO. I do understand where you are coming from also. I certainly hope I have not offended you. If I have, please accept my apology.

BTW... If anyone in this forum even pretents to understand genetics, then that is just what they are doing, pretending. Genetics is something that only our creator understands.


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## ID_Hannah (Jun 8, 2006)

*Oops puppies*

It is unfortunate that your dog is having an unplanned litter. It is also frustrating that you've been chased away from the forum. The people here are well meaning, even when they do come on strong. I don't believe one of us here are perfect, but when we are not in your shoes there are many pieces of your story there left open... and people were just addressing them in the way they feel is appropriate. 

If you're still reading the board at all.... 

I'd like to look at this in what's-done-is-done perspective. Obviously, you've had a litter of puppies before, so be prepared for them. Take care of them with the top-notch care no matter who the parent is... although I don't doubt you would. Get them their shots, worming, & health checks before sending them off to their new homes. I've done rescue for many years with dogs and I'd REALLY love to see you get them all spayed/neutered BEFORE sending them off to their new homes. Especially if they are mixes, but preferably either way. 

Because the sire could be just about any dog in the neighborhood, I don't think you can ethically AKC register puppies unless you get DNA testing done on every pup (because there can be multiple sires), so you might as well spay/neuter them because if they were bred by their new homes it would be in a non-responsible, breed-bettering way. 

I do know that spaying and neutering possibly 8+ puppies would be expensive. But since they are not yet born if you get on the ball and call rescue organizations/humane societies/spay & neuter campaigns in your area you can find help to get them all (and probably mom) fixed once they reach 8 weeks. With my kitten I found a group having a low cost spay/neuter clinic... I offered to volunteer for the event and they spayed her for free. 

Oh, you might be thinking about just having a spay/neuter contract. Just an anecdotal story to think about. I used to work at a humane society. Kittens are $50 to adopt. This includes their spay, shots, worming, microchip. When kittens are under 2 lbs they cannot be fixed at the time of their adoption and the new owners had to leave an additional $25 check as a deposit and sign an additional spay/neuter contract. In a few weeks they'd come back, we'd spay the cat for FREE, and give them back their $25. How hard is that?? They had 60 days to get the cat in for the spay. Then we'd give them three warning calls over 2 weeks... I'd cash 50% of those checks. And guess what? The next spring we'd find OUR microchips in dozens of teenage new mommy cats with litters of babies. Now ALL kittens are spayed/neutered before they leave. U-2 lbs have to be fostered until they make weight. 

Best of luck with your pups. I, for one, would love to hear how everything comes out with them. You seem to be a shutter-bug... and I certainly am a sucker for puppy pictures. But if you don't feel comfortable returning to the forum, I do understand.


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

vrocco1 said:


> Old Guy, I believe we should give everyone in this forum the benefit of the doubt. Often times, when people put things in writing, we misinterpret it, because we can neither see what is in their face, nor can we hear the inflection in their voice.


I agree absolutely... that's why asking questions and giving answers to further explanation is so important (its called dialog)... and why running away doesn't work. In my one post, I made a logical observation using her own words (so there was no question of doubt... thus no needing a 'benefit' of one), I asked several questions to help me understand exactly what the situation was, and finally I offered some advice on her rawhide concern. But it was the question of "why didn't she get Angel spayed, if she didn't plan to ever breed her again?" that she focused her whole response on... and it was obvious that that one question of mine is what ticked her off... (personally my best guess is it was probably her own guilt over something she'd not yet explained). You've got to admit, there were at least a dozen different responses possible but she chose to take the offense and then run off... it was her choice to do, nobody backed her into a corner... go back and re-read the thread if you must... she left the forum before my second posting even. I'm still confuse about what even happened at the breeder's or neighbor's or where ever Angel hid-out for 3-weeks, that would cause her to believe there were only 2 possible choices for the sire... not to mention the litter could actually have more than one sire. The discussion never got past the "Why didn't you get her spayed?" question.


vrocco1 said:


> Let’s face it, we may feel we are protecting innocent animals, but there is nothing we can do within the framework of this forum to protect those animals. All we can do is offend people, and they run off and do whatever they feel like doing anyway. I just make it a matter of practice, not to waste my breath. That way, at least we don’t hurt innocent humans.


Another way to view it is, if you don't speak up when you see there's a problem then its viewed as whatever is being done is correct and you've agreed... is that really a better way? What if I tell you about how I'm going to drown a litter of pups but I'd like opinions on the most humane method? ...are you telling me you'd not waste your breath for fear of hurting an innocent human?


vrocco1 said:


> ...Most times, this is a neutral place, where Golden Retriever lovers of all kinds can come for advice, without being eaten alive.


Precisely, but let me add that the advice should be open and honest and so sometimes neutral just doesn't work. And remember the only advice (if you could call a question, advice) I gave was... you should have spayed your dog if you (REALLY) didn't intend on breeding her again. If that's being eaten alive, then what is this forum for anyway? complementing people on their dog pics?


vrocco1 said:


> That is JMHO. I do understand where you are coming from also. I certainly hope I have not offended you. If I have, please accept my apology.


No apologies are even necessary, you never assaulted my character or lied so I see nothing for me to be offended by... people should be allowed to speak their minds... I respect that.


vrocco1 said:


> BTW... If anyone in this forum even pretents to understand genetics, then that is just what they are doing, pretending. Genetics is something that only our creator understands.


There is no subject that anyone completely understands if you go delve deep enough into it but there are levels of understanding... and if one can predict the outcome of a particular pairing (even if its the length of a bean pod) or create a new designer flower (like the Shasta Daisy) then it is a science and capable of being understood and explained... there's no pretense involved. The understanding of genetics has gone as far as detecting disease causing genes and cloning of plants and animals... evidently humans do understand a lot about genetics and so I believe responsible breeders should make every effort to understand it and apply it in their breeding programs ...I mean don't you?


If I must say I did anything wrong it was my choice of wording in my first posting... I decided to be 'clever' and use as much of her own words as possible... in retrospect it was a dumb thing to do because upon a re-reading, it does sound a little harsh and I know I'm experienced enough to have re-worded it to soften the 'advice'. To that I plead guilty but as to the content of what I said I still don't feel I need to be ashamed of it.


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## RickGibbs (Dec 16, 2005)

It's unfortunate that anyone, especially someone who's been a member here for over a year, would decide to leave because of the comments of a couple members.

I believe this is just another one of those HOT topics that gets some people posting their passionate views. I just think that if someone were to say something that hurt my feelings, I'd just let it go. There's just too many enjoyable people on this site to let one or two run me off.

Hopefully, she'll reconsider and come back.


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

RickGibbs said:


> It's unfortunate that anyone, especially someone who's been a member here for over a year, would decide to leave because of the comments of a couple members...


Well the same could have been said when Shane et al, exited this forum a couple of months ago...

I've participated on many forums over the years and you will always lose some of the sensitive ones due to hurt feelings...

Again, Lucky's mom has it right... if you want to participate on Internet forums you need to have some thicker skin... not only will you have more fun but you will learn more about others and yourself as well.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

monomer said:


> evidently humans do understand a lot about genetics and so I believe responsible breeders should make every effort to understand it and apply it in their breeding programs ...I mean don't you?


One last thing, and then I am going to let this go. On the level that most breeders understand genetics, it mostly amounts only to wishful thinking. Sometimes, no matter how much you research pedigrees, when you mix two dogs you simply don't get the results you desire. That is the level where as I said earlier, only our creator understands. This comes from the fact that there are so many proteins on the DNA chain that they can be arranged in an almost infinite order, and the results simply are not predictable. 

The folks that created the Shasta daisy or even those who are doing medical research such as the production of new human hormones through recumbent DNA research have an advantage. They did not have to worry with creating intelligent life, so they can repeat and experiment without loss. They repeat until they get the results they desire without the worry of how many cancers or how many tumors they produce along the way. Those of us involved in breeding doggies don't have that advantage. We make educated guesses, but that remains all we are doing, guessing.


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## Samwise (May 15, 2006)

I certainly wasn't trying to be rude but I really wish she hadn't left the forum. I really wanted to know if the dog had been vetted. It seems to me that if you suspected your dog was pregnant, you'd take her to the vet who could tell you if she is and approximately how far along. Seems logical. Her OP was confusing and misleading and raised a lot of questions and she never really answered them before she left. That was the one that I should've asked before she left.

Do you think the pictures of the pregnant dog were from this breeding or the previous one?

I feel like I'm beating a dead horse.


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## mblondetoo (Jan 9, 2006)

Recently I got a bit beat up for asking a question in another forum that I guess I should have known the answer too the way they responded. I didn't appreciate the comments that were then made as the thread progressed. It certainly doesn't make you feel very good when you just ask for info not a lecture on the reasons of being.

All this started as a simple question. Sure there are a lot of unanswered things going on and I have my opinions but why does it turn so ugly so fast? I get tired of reading how people judge others so quickly. Sometimes I'd rather see something like "Oh I see your dog was gone for 3 weeks and that was 2 months ago but she looks really pregnant so maybe you better take her to the vet!"

I would have liked to see how this turned out....


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

Okay to give an example of an incident that occurred over on JohnWa's website a couple of years ago... it should still be there or at least in his archives. A woman new to the forum posted a picture of her new Golden Retriever puppy and ask what everyone thought about it. The responses she got were glowing, everyone was welcoming her and saying what a beautiful puppy she had, etc. When I looked at the picture I thought it was a joke... this dog had fur missing on about half of his body and his belly was extremely distended and the neck and head very small... he did not look well at all... I thought he may have been close to death. I was so confused by all the 'beautiful' and 'cute' responses that I couldn't decide if this were a joke or not... so I held off giving any response for a few hours. Finally I couldn't take it anymore... I studied the photo carefully (it was grainy) and decided to take the approach that it was not a joke. I told the woman her puppy did not look well at all and suggested she take him to the vet immediately. She then explained how she lived in South America (Brazil I think, can't remember without going back and checking) and vet visits were very expensive there. I told her I thought her puppy had a very advanced case of worms and should see a vet for a worming. She again told me how expensive the deworming medicine was, so I ask for her address so I could send some deworming medicine (from Wal-Mart) to her... I had already purchased the deworming medicine. She replied back a day later saying that she took him to the vet and the vet gave him some medicine... and then never posted again. So, was it a joke? did I save a puppy's life due to honest intervention? I never will know for sure but at least I gave an honest answer... she could have immediately became offended that I thought her puppy look terribly sick and gone off in a huff... these are the risks you take when you are honest... but if I manage to save puppy's life it was worth the gamble of pi$$ing someone off. Be honest, what would any of you have done?


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

Truth is, between last year's breeding and this years ACCIDENTAL breeding ALOT has happened. 1st of all, I got pregnant myself so I hope that explains the hormones. Second, my father-in-law died and MY father had a heart attack. After last years' breeding that I got so much grief about I did plan on spaying Angel. But one thing happened then another and I never got around to it. Luckily I'm not personally due until after the pups are 8 weeks. A new baby and 8+ pups would be too much to handle. I am close friends with the vet and she days that Angel is 100% pregnant and due any day now. Angel is UTD with all vetting and the pups will be too. They will be very well taken care of and I will screen buyers very carefully just as I did last time. Thanks for your responses. I'm sorry if I did something wrong and I'm especially sorry for my poor attitude. I will keep you posted on her status and since I am not God and can't change the past, I guess I will live and learn. She WILL be spayed as soon as the pups are gone! Any other questions please feel free to ask. Sorry if I made things confusing.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> Truth is, between last year's breeding and this years ACCIDENTAL breeding ALOT has happened. 1st of all, I got pregnant myself so I hope that explains the hormones. Second, my father-in-law died and MY father had a heart attack. After last years' breeding that I got so much grief about I did plan on spaying Angel. But one thing happened then another and I never got around to it. Luckily I'm not personally due until after the pups are 8 weeks. A new baby and 8+ pups would be too much to handle. I am close friends with the vet and she days that Angel is 100% pregnant and due any day now. Angel is UTD with all vetting and the pups will be too. They will be very well taken care of and I will screen buyers very carefully just as I did last time. Thanks for your responses. I'm sorry if I did something wrong and I'm especially sorry for my poor attitude. I will keep you posted on her status and since I am not God and can't change the past, I guess I will live and learn. She WILL be spayed as soon as the pups are gone! Any other questions please feel free to ask. Sorry if I made things confusing.


Yea!!!!!! Your back!!! I'm very happy!!! Please do keep us posted. And congratulations to you!!!
Cyndi


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

mblondetoo said:


> ...why does it turn so ugly so fast? I get tired of reading how people judge others so quickly...


Realize this... it always takes two to make an ugly.

With every posting and every response there are usually dozens of possible ways and individual can react to it... you have little choice in how the other person will respond to anything said. You can try to couch it in "honey-laced" wordings, bending over backwards trying to avoid offending anyone but at what point does it then become a lie? ...and I don't know where people keep getting this 'judgment' or 'benefit of the doubt' thing from... please, please, please go back and actually re-read the whole thread to the point where she ran off in a huff. There were no accusations actually made... errors of logic were pointed out taken from her own words... and if she had taken that with a proper attitude it would have constituted advice for the future... Remember this woman had a whole year (two estrus cycles) to get her dog spayed as she'd claimed Angel was not going to be bred again (a year ago in her first thread).

Cheeze... If I were that sensitive I could say something like this... "I come here trying to help someone and now everyone is picking on me, I didn't join this forum to be treated this way... I'm now going to officially leave and I'm never coming back again!" ...come on, give me a break here. Remember: it takes two to make an ugly.

Go back an actually re-read the thread... where exactly was this 'moral sin' committed?

I believe this horse has been totally beaten to death... anyone who wants to can come by and kick the body around but I'm pretty sure its not going stir.


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> Truth is, between last year's breeding and this years ACCIDENTAL breeding ALOT has happened. 1st of all, I got pregnant myself so I hope that explains the hormones. Second, my father-in-law died and MY father had a heart attack. After last years' breeding that I got so much grief about I did plan on spaying Angel. But one thing happened then another and I never got around to it. Luckily I'm not personally due until after the pups are 8 weeks. A new baby and 8+ pups would be too much to handle. I am close friends with the vet and she days that Angel is 100% pregnant and due any day now. Angel is UTD with all vetting and the pups will be too. They will be very well taken care of and I will screen buyers very carefully just as I did last time. Thanks for your responses. I'm sorry if I did something wrong and I'm especially sorry for my poor attitude. I will keep you posted on her status and since I am not God and can't change the past, I guess I will live and learn. She WILL be spayed as soon as the pups are gone! Any other questions please feel free to ask. Sorry if I made things confusing.


Just now saw this...

I am knocked-out impressed you came back and I promise I will do my best to not badger you. I was wrong in the way I expressed my thoughts and for that I offer you my apologies... whether you accept them or not is entirely up to you. Since we seem to have incompatable styles of communication, I will promise also to stay clear of your threads.

It is nice you came back though...


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

Okay....no need to apologize, I was in the wrong....now lets move past it. It is indeed the PAST! So please help me as I welcome this litter. 

And please, monomer, reconsider staying clear of my threads. I will just stay offline when I feel an emotional swing coming!


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## sashac (Mar 13, 2006)

I don't know anything about breeding or genetics or even puppies, really. I'm just wondering - is this what "backyard breeding" is? These sorts of accidental litters? Because I've been told now plenty of times that Charlie is probably the result of both backyard breeding and poor upbringing/socialization (also likely due to the owner not being able to manage a big litter and giving the puppies away indiscriminately) and that SUCKS! He's got so many issues, and I have no idea how many homes he's changed in his lifetime because of them. That's just sad. I guess things happen and it's difficult to make sure you do everything right all the time, but I wish these things didn't happen. 

I guess the same goes for humans too - plenty of people out there not ready or equipped to have kids who have them anyway.

(EDIT) Ok, I'm not saying anything about anyone or about any situation...just got me thinking....like i said, i know very little about all this.


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> Okay....no need to apologize, I was in the wrong....now lets move past it. It is indeed the PAST! So please help me as I welcome this litter.
> 
> And please, monomer, reconsider staying clear of my threads. I will just stay offline when I feel an emotional swing coming!


You know after just those few words... everything falls into place for me. I think I understand a lot more of what happened to the whole thread. I really was too harsh and I will try to be more constructive in the future. Thanks...

Sashac... backyard breeder has no real standard definition it can mean a lot of things... if you start a thread on it I'm sure you're going to get at least a dozen different ideas. Try it...


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

I'm glad you're back and I'm really glad you're going to get her spayed. Will you be able to get some people to help you with the puppies? With all the stress and being pregnant yourself, you might not feel at all up to staying up all night with a dog in labor and taking care of puppies. At least if you had some people "on call," you could give them puppy-watching duty while you rested.

Do look into getting a DNA kit from the AKC. Did the breeder tell you if there were any other intact male Goldens there?


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## goldenstaples (Apr 3, 2006)

Yeah!!! I am so glad you came back, I felt so bad! Congratualtions!! Do you have any other kids? Sounds like you are dealing with a lot of stress but remember the trials in life also bring triumphs. I am anxious to hear about the puppies. What state are you in?


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## mainegirl (May 2, 2005)

mi lil angel,
no matter who the father, I'm sure the puppies will be beautiful. I know that you will take care in finding them homes, and if they are pure golden you will feel a small weight off your shoulders. I hope that you post pictures of the babies. There's nothing better than a puppy, no matter whether planned or unplanned. I know that so many hairless children are not planned, but we do tend to get a little over the top when our furry children are not planned. 
Maybe they were planned by God? Who knows, maybe one of them will be a great therapy or guide dog, or just the best pet that a child can know. How can we condemn an innocent puppy.
Please let me know if there is anything that I can do to help, pm me if you need to, I just lost my mother this morning so I know what that does to you.

please please please if you need to talk or help, let me know
beth, moose and sandy


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

*puppies are arriving!*

I will do my best to go back and answer all questions in the previous posts, I just wanted to say that Angel is having her babies!!! So far we have 1 girl, 1 boy, then 2 more girls, then a boy= 5 puppies! The females: 2 are medium gold and one is reddish gold; the males: both ultra light gold. All is fine so far! Keep us in your pawyers! Look up my_lil_angels24 in photos under puppies and you will be able to view the pics as I post(haven't posted any yet).


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

Focus on the babies and then POST SOME PICS


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## davebeech (Feb 11, 2006)

great stuff !! can't wait to see em, gonna have yer hands full now though.


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

All are fine, nursing and sleeping...7 puppies total(still keeping our eyes out just in case): 4 girls, 3 boys.


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

*pics*

I haven't been able to upload any pics under photos so I'm trying them as an attachment...what do you think? Golden retriever? or Golden retriever/husky mix?


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

Yay, congratulations! Hope they continue to be uneventful puppies 

They all appear to be within the acceptable color range for Goldens, so I can't tell. You probably won't be able to tell by looking at them for a while. 

Did you look into the DNA thing? Being able to register the puppies with AKC would be a big help in finding responsible homes for them, and it takes 6 to 8 weeks to process the DNA profiles, so you might want to send it in pretty soon.


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## PJD001 (Jul 28, 2006)

*Congrats.*

Congratulations on what seems to be a beautiful litter and a safe whelping. They all look gorgeous no matter what the breed! I hope they all go to great homes:wavey:


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

Well I looked up images of newborn huskies....and saw a total of one. Looked up images of newborn Goldens and saw two zillion but not a lot of close ups. I'd imagine if it there was husky we'd see at least a little variation of color beyond the gold.

It will be interesting to see how they develop. It looks like you have your hands full with some sweet babies. And another on the way!


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## davebeech (Feb 11, 2006)

Yeh, Congratulations !!!!!! and they all look just GRrrrrrreat !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Scrubs (Jun 20, 2006)

Having huskies in the past also being a major fan of Huskies. My guess is Golden I don't see any similarities towards Huskies but time will tell. Congrats though cute looking pups you have there.


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## sashac (Mar 13, 2006)

absolutely adorable!!!! congratulations! you must have one tired mama on your hands!


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

*more pics*

Angel's being a GREAT mom!


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## jessme7 (May 29, 2006)

CONGRATS! awsome pics! keep em comming


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## Buffy & Abby's Mom (Nov 27, 2005)

Congratulations on the puppies! They are precious. I hope you're able to find loving homes for all of them. My two are golden mixes (golden/chow and golden/great pyrenees) and I wouldn't trade either one of them for a pure bred. They are still pure gold in my mind and very well loved.

BTW - your puppy's bodies seem kind of long to me for pure bred golden. But I'm very much a novice so I probably shouldn't put my 2 cents in. But they are beautiful!!


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## ghosthost (Aug 4, 2006)

congratulations! they must be cutes


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

*more pics*

I can't help but take tons of pics...


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## goldenstaples (Apr 3, 2006)

Oh so cute! I have never seen newborn Goldens before, I always thought it would be fun to be able to have a litter like that!


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

I just uploaded pics in the gallery of LAST YEARS LITTER. You can search for them with "my_lil_angels24" + "2005". I figured it would be kind of neat to compare the 2 litters as this year's puppies grow.


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

Can anyone come up with any sample adoption applications? I did this last time and people thought it was kind of wierd, but I really thought it was best to thoroughly screen prospective puppy owners. I do have help with the puppies(from friends and family) and some puppies may be going to them as well Please e-mail samples to me at [email protected]


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## PJD001 (Jul 28, 2006)

I had a look at your 2005 pics! what beautiful photos! Would love to see the photos of the new litter as they grow too! keep them coming!


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

*1 week pics*

Here are some pics of the pups at 7 days--their noses have finally turned black and they should open their eyes sometime this next week!


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## Brandy's Mom (Oct 5, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> Can anyone come up with any sample adoption applications? I did this last time and people thought it was kind of wierd, but I really thought it was best to thoroughly screen prospective puppy owners. I do have help with the puppies(from friends and family) and some puppies may be going to them as well Please e-mail samples to me at [email protected]


The golden rescue Web sites have some great questions to use for screening. But I know you'll also need some puppy=specific questions.


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

thanks for the info, ill check it out...few more pics...


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## monomer (Apr 21, 2005)

To an uneducated eye (mine) they all look like little Golden Retriever "piggies" (that's what my wife and I call all newborn puppies... 'cause they all seem to more resemble a little pigglet than a dog). I guess you won't really know until they get a little older (like week 4 or 5, after the eyes and ears are fully opened, they are waddling around and their tails are up and wagging. Have you started advertising yet? or are you going to wait to be sure they all will look like Golden Retrievers first?


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

She is a beautiful girl, and she's going to go any day... since you have whelped a litter before, I think it will be fine. Since she's done it before, five is not too old. Let's hope Charlie is the daddy! Placing crossbred pups is a huge hassle.

If they're Goldens, then you can register them w/the AKC assuming both parents are, per Katie's advice. Where are you located?


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

They do look pure. Consider that the light one could have the other sire, and the others could be pure Goldens... a litter can have multiple sires, though each puppy can have only one.


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## 3 goldens (Sep 30, 2005)

They are beautiful. I just adore puppies and it has been almost 7 years since I got my last puppies, Hunter and KayCee.


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## VeronicaLovesHerGoldens (May 27, 2005)

They are too cute!!! The mom looks like she's doing a wonderful job with them. And so are you!!! Congratulations on the puppies and your upcoming little bambino and good luck finding homes for them. I bet you won't have a hard time with that at all!!
P.S. They look like Goldens to me!!


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## Scarecrow's Mom (Aug 7, 2006)

PS you have a private message.

I adore the puppies.

~Emily


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## goldenfrodo (Sep 1, 2005)

Just read all this. I'm glad you came back. The puppies are lovely. They look like Goldens to me, but its too early to tell.

I've not been around for a while as I lost another of my girls to cancer, Lizzie died a couple of months ago and then a few weeks ago, Peggy joined her at the Bridge.

I hope things dont go in'threes' as the saying goes.


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

*ALMOST 3 weeks!*

Individual pics of the puppies at one day shy of 3 weeks will be posted in the gallery shortly. Girls(red)-Hayden, Harley, Hannah, and Holly; Boys(blue)-Blake, Jackson, and Sunny...do they look like little golden retrievers?


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## Jason Jaber (Dec 30, 2005)

ohhh they are so cute! They look pure golden to me.


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## Jason Jaber (Dec 30, 2005)

SOrry, I forgot to add this but dont huskies have ears that point up, and sometimes have 2 different colored eyes? The coloring definately looks golden to me tho...


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## RickGibbs (Dec 16, 2005)

I agree.....they look VERY golden to me.....


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

I've tried multiple times to upload them but my computer just won't let me so here they are....


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

here are more pics of individual pups....


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

here are the last three that i took yesterday:


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## Baileysmom (Aug 5, 2006)

They are darling and sure look like goldens to me!


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

They all have their own names and you can keep track of what name goes to what dog??? Whoa, you are good.

They look so Golden, and so cute.


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## Kindell (Feb 7, 2006)

Adorable! Look like goldens to me... I pick that one!!!!  But at the moment Holly is my favorite... I love dark girls


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## a_and_b2004 (Jan 8, 2006)

cute, cute, and more cute!!!!!


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## sashac (Mar 13, 2006)

oooh i think hayden and harley are the CUTEST!!!! They really do look like golden pups - Blake is so fair lol!


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## ID_Hannah (Jun 8, 2006)

*Ahhh!*

The puppies are too cute! They are growing up sooo fast. I think I like Hannah the best, but it could just be that I'm partial to the name


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

Harley and Hayden are my favorites!!!(I know I shouldn't pick favs but it's really hard!) When you see them day in and day out you see the differences in them...such as, of course Blake in super light, then Jackson is a tad darker, and Sunny is the darkest boy. Then Hannah is smaller than the rest, and Holly is darker than the rest, and Harley and Hayden nearly look like twins except Harley is slightly bigger. They are playing with each other now and walking around REALLY good. They have TEETH too!! I'll start them on wet puppy food sometime next week since they've already figured out how to lap water.


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## RickGibbs (Dec 16, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> Harley and Hayden are my favorites!!!(I know I shouldn't pick favs but it's really hard!) When you see them day in and day out you see the differences in them...such as, of course Blake in super light, then Jackson is a tad darker, and Sunny is the darkest boy. Then Hannah is smaller than the rest, and Holly is darker than the rest, and Harley and Hayden nearly look like twins except Harley is slightly bigger. They are playing with each other now and walking around REALLY good. They have TEETH too!! I'll start them on wet puppy food sometime next week since they've already figured out how to lap water.


I could never be a breeder.....I'd end up keeping all of them...


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

Are you keeping one? Definitely GRs.


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

no, but oh how I wish I could!!!


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

Just thought I'd let everyone know that ALL the males have homes with our co-workers!!!


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## RickGibbs (Dec 16, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> Just thought I'd let everyone know that ALL the males have homes with our co-workers!!!


Well, that sure didn't take long.....


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

And now two females have homes with friends!!! Only 2 females to go!!!


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## RickGibbs (Dec 16, 2005)

my_lil_angels24 said:


> And now two females have homes with friends!!! Only 2 females to go!!!


And how old are they now?


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## Scarecrow's Mom (Aug 7, 2006)

Lil Angels, you have a pm.

~Emily


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

4 weeks today..................


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

angels babies are 4 weeks today


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## Baileysmom (Aug 5, 2006)

Wow -- time sure flies! I'll bet they are a lot of fun. Do you have owners for any of them yet?


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## mblondetoo (Jan 9, 2006)

I can't believe it's been 4 weeks! Do you have any pictures???


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

I will try to upload some pics real soon. My home computer is currently down. ALL puppies have homes!!!, plus a few people on stand-by in case someone changes their mind.


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## my_lil_angels24 (Jun 14, 2005)

I put a couple pics in the gallery. Search for them using thses words: "my_lil_angels24 4 weeks"


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