# Elbow dysplasia but no symptoms



## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Bear15*

Bear

Hoping someone on here can reply.

I tried googling Canine Elbow Dysplasia with no symptoms.
Check out this link:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...nine+Elbow+Dysplasia+with+no+symptoms&spell=1

And be sure to look at the first topic, too!
http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=2+2084&aid=431
www.HillsPet.com/Mobility Help Your Dog Walk More Easily In As Few As 21 Days. Get Coupon Here!
Search ResultsElbow Dysplasia in Dogs and Puppies
However, there are other conditions that can affect the front leg of a young dog that will mimic the signs of elbow dysplasia very closely. ...
www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=2+2084&aid=431 - Cached - Similar


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## Florabora22 (Nov 30, 2008)

Oh wow, Bear is SO handsome!

I'm sorry to hear about this diagnosis, I know how hard it is to have to make this decision with such a young dog. I have no experience with elbow dysplasia so I can't help you, but I know there are members on here who will see this post and eventually chime in.


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## z&mom (Oct 7, 2006)

Bear is adorable! Such a sweet face! I hope you will find some answers here. I am curious as to why an xray was done when there are no signs of pain or stiffness.


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## Bear15 (Apr 15, 2009)

*Thank you for your reply!*

I will check those websites out. Thank you! We had x-rays done because he had hurt his leg when we left him at a kennel for a weekend when we went away. We brought him right to the vet when we returned and they said he had a sprain but noticed he also had elbow dysplasia. They compared his xrays to ones taken when he was a pup because he had panosteitis (growing pains) and said it had progressed from then and so they recommended the surgery. I just hope he's going to be okay, he is such a great, great dog- very sweet.


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## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

My girl has ED. If you don't have any symptoms I certainly would not do surgery. Just "my" opinion. I have heard from those I know who have dogs that are ED (one belongs to a vet) this is not a one time surgery. So put off any surgery you can. 

I am managing Teddi's elbows, with weight management, controlled exercise, nothing excessive, she is on joint supplements, MSM, wild salmon oil and monthly adequan injections. She was limping when we started her management. Knock on wood not much since.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

I think it depends on the type of ED. If it is Fragmented Coronoid Process, then arthroscopic surgery is the best option to prevent ongoing damage to the healthy bone. My dog Tango has bilateral ED, and the surgery made a revolutionary positive difference for her.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

I think in this case, you have to trust the recommendation of the orthopedic specialist. If the radiograph indicated that damage is almost certain to occur soon, it would be better to repair the joint before the damage is done.

I agree with the common sense urge that says "if it ain't broke," but given the way certain kinds of ED work, as Ljilly said, this may be a case where doing it early improves the end outcomes.

Why not get a second opinion from a different orthopedist?


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## Taps (Jan 28, 2008)

Our 4 year old was dx'd with ED at age 3 and they wanted to do surgery on both elbows. He also had pano as a pup. The Vet indicated that even with the surgery the arthritis was already there and we couldn't expect more than about 40% improvement so I didn't want to put him through all that. Instead he is on Dasuquin with MSM and he hasn't limped at all for a year. If I think he has had a particularly hard exercise day I give him a Rimydal when he goes to bed but so far I am happy with my decision.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

I agree that after a certain age, the point of surgery is limited bc too much damage is done. However, preventing the damage is best.


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## rappwizard (May 27, 2009)

I agree with Tippykayak that if you can get a second opinion from another orthopedic vet specialist, that it would be worth it. When my second golden was a pup, she had a habit of pacing (that stayed with her pretty much her entire life). My general vet took x-rays, and sat me and my husband down with an orthopedic vet and said she needed hip surgery (this was at 6 months old) that she was dysplastic (both hips).

We went home where I was practically hysterical--but we collected ourselves enough to make a second appointment with what many believe is the best orthopedic vet in South Florida--and spoke to our breeder, who also believed in this vet. Long story short, this vet felt there was nothing wrong, and at the age of 2 years, our golden OFA'd with a Good rating--she cleared. No hip dysplasia.

As a matter of fact, if you purchased your pup from a breeder, perhaps your breeder could recommend an ortho vet for the second opinion? Your breeder, I think, would want to know what is going on. I know ours did. Good luck.


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## LibertyME (Jan 6, 2007)

Loving the idea of a second opinion....you have the luxury of time because your dog is pain-free....
Yes a second opinion is going to cost some $$ but in comparison to surgery...its minor...and the benefit of clearing away any doubt will be priceless.


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## Bear15 (Apr 15, 2009)

Hello,
Thank you for your advice. Our Bear is from Twin Beau D Goldens and I noticed you had listed them on your reply (down the bottom) - do you think I should consult with Nancy Dellaire at Twin Beau D and ask her what she thinks? We just don't know what to do?


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## suemarc (Jun 24, 2010)

I'm so sorry to hear about Bear. I have 1 year old golden from Twin Beau d who has ED. He had surgery 9 weeks ago for a fractured coronoid process. I'm curious as to who Bear's parents are. Did you ever get in touch with Nancy about this?

I hope Bear is doing well


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Get a second opinion. 

My thought here is that with elbow dysplasia - it almost always causes noticable stiffness and limping. Because dogs naturally put most of their weight on their front legs. When it first 'happens', your young dog might suddenly be unable to take more than 5 steps without stopping to rest his elbows (sitting way back and raising the feet off the ground to take weight off the joints). It happens when they are under a year old and generally evens out by the time they are 2+. Then after that they might have bad days or bad weeks or bad months and you forget what a normal "bony" (or non-swollen) elbow feels like. 

My previous golden had horrific elbows that probably should have been operated on when he was younger. It never cleared up, but he and we learned to live with it and make the most out of life. 

I guess what I'm saying is get a second opinion and see if this other person feels surgery is absolutely necessary. It can't hurt.


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## IowaGold (Nov 3, 2009)

I didn't respond to this initially because it hit too close to home. My 11 month old just had arthroscopic surgery on both elbows for FMCP this past Tuesday. I didn't think she had any symptoms either. She wasn't stiff or lame that I could see (and I'm a vet and a performance dog person, so I flatter myself to think I could see limping that a "regular" owner might not). She even got her WC and two JH legs in the days prior to the surgery. I was REALLY torn up about whether to do the surgery or not. The orthopedic surgeon said to do it (he was able to elict pain pretty easily in especially the right elbow). I ended up taking his advise because I need my girl to be as sound as possible for as long as possible. 

For the surgery she was shaved from her shoulders to her ankles. For scrubbing, she had her feet tied to a hook in the ceiling. As she laying there naked and with her feet in the air, I got a really good look at her front end. Her right shoulder was/is smaller than the left. This tells me that even though I didn't see it, she has been favoring the right leg for quite some time. I'm so glad I did the surgery and am very glad I saw the muscle difference.


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## NewToGoldens (Feb 5, 2009)

If it's FMCP or OCD in the elbow, then taking care of it arthroscopically is minimally invasive and can increase the chance of staving off arthritis.

Elbow dysplasia can present in different ways as someone mentioned. Doesn't necessarily have to be a limp on that leg.

From my understanding from our orthopedic surgeon, after my 18 month old just having arthroscopic surgery on an elbow and a TPO, both on the same side, elbows they can't do as much about except to clean up the joint whereas hips they have more options.

BTW, we did 2 consults and had the same diagnosis and plan of action from both ortho surgeons. Our homeopathic chiro vet concurred (and she tends to be conservative, avoids surgery and she is a surgeon).

The elbow recovery was 2 weeks and only pain mgmt. The TPO on the hip was a different story but we are now through that and are rehabbing.

Good luck! Like IowaGold, this is close to home for me as well.

Please do keep us posted as to your pup!


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## FunnyAboutMoney (Apr 20, 2011)

I'm a newcomer here, just being in the market for a golden pup, and I see this is an old thread. But just in case someone else comes along looking for information on alleged dysplasia in an asymptomatic dog: _Please be careful!_

Not all veterinarians can be trusted. If a vet tells you your dog needs surgery when the animal shows no sign of discomfort, get another opinion, preferably from one who specializes in the care of large dogs. And get it from a vet who does not know the one who wants to do the surgery.

I had a magnificent German shepherd, who lived to a ripe and happy old age. With the agreement of her breeder, when she got to be about a year old I considered whether we should breed her sometime in the future, and so had her hips X-rayed. The vet I went to, who had been recommended by a friend who took her cat there, told me the dog had severe dysplasia and needed to have both hips replaced.

Well, of course I couldn't afford any such thing. When I reported this to the breeder, he asked me to return her, intending to put her down and offering to replace her with another 8-week-old pup. No doubt you understand what is involved in bringing up a powerful, intelligent dog to the age of a year, and the emotional attachment you have to a companion dog. Before I took her back to the breeder, I decided to take her to a vet who had purchased the practice of my former vet, who years before had cared for a doberman pinscher that occupied part of my past life. This former vet was renowned for his expertise with large dogs, and I figured anyone who'd buy his practice at least would know something about issues that afflict large working dogs.

He looked at the X-rays and said they were so poor there was no way he could assess the condition of the dog's hips from those images. He brought out a set of X-rays made for another client's OFA certification and showed me how they compared; it was easy to see that my dog had not been positioned correctly for the X-rays and that parts of the images were blurry. So, he made a new set of X-rays.

Based on these, he felt the dog was not dysplastic. However, he wanted to send the images to the OFA for evaluation, to confirm his opinion. When we heard back from the OFA, the opinion was that she had a very mild degree of dysplasia. 

He thought she would be OK with no treatment and should experience no pain until she reached old age, when she could be expected to develop arthritis. That prediction was exactly right: she was just fine until the last year or two of her life, when she developed a number of ailments including widespread arthritis throughout her frame. This was a very high-drive dog who was so active the breeder described her as "a rocket."


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## Montana's Mommy (Mar 10, 2009)

God I went through this August 2010. Levi still can't get to crazy without starting to limp for a couple hours. I hope it can go totally away.

*Fragmented Medial Coronoid Process (FMCP)​*​ ​*W h at is a Fragmented Medical Coronoid Process?​*A fragmented medial coronoid process (FMCP) is a developmental abnormality
in w h ich a piece of bone (th e medial coronoid process of th e u lna) is eith er
malformed or h as separated from th e u lna and is floating free in th e elbow joint.
T h is typically resu lts from a poor fit betw een th e major components th at mak es
u p th e elbow joint (u lna troch lear notch , h u meral troch lea, and radial h ead). As a
resu lt, th e cartilage of th e elbow is irritated leading to th e development of
inflammation, pain, and stiffness eventu ally resu lting in arth ritis. More
degenerative ch anges in th e cartilage w ill occu r over month s to years w ith
continu ed abnormal fit betw een joint components and continu ed irritation by a
free fragment. T h is condition is commonly seen in large breed dogs and very
often both elbow s are affected. T h e first signs of forelimb lameness tend to occu r
in pu ppies th at are five to seven month s of age. T h e lameness is u su ally more
severe after periods of h eavy activity or periods of prolonged rest.​*D iagnosis​*D u ring ph ysical ex am th e most common findings are forelimb lameness, elbow
sw elling, and pain on manipu lation of th e elbow s. X -rays often sh ow arth ritic
ch anges and in some cases th e fragment can be seen. X -rays are also u sefu l to
h elp eliminate oth er cau ses of elbow pain and to q u antify th e degree of arth ritic
ch ange if already present. Advanced imaging su ch as CT , MR I, or arth roscopy
can also aid in th e diagnosis of FMCP.​*T reatment​*S u rgical intervention is recommended early in th e disease process to decrease
th e progression of osteoarth ritis and increases patients. long-term q u ality of life.
T h e procedu re consists of open su rgical and/or arth roscopic ex amination of th e
joint follow ed by removal of th e fragmented coronoid process and removal of
damaged cartilage. A padded bandage is applied to th e operated limb after
su rgery to minimiz e sw elling and discomfort. Controlled activity is req u ired for ~ 4 -
6 w eek s post-op. Medical management of FMCP consists of anti-inflammatory
medications, controlled activity, and ph ysical th erapy inclu ding w eigh t
management. L ong-term prognosis is dependent on th e amou nt of elbow arth ritis
prior to su rgery and th e degree of poor joint component fit. If th e condition is
corrected early, th e prognosis is generally good. If su rgery is not performed u ntil
after significant arth ritic ch anges h ave occu rred, th e prognosis is poorer. E ven
w h en su rgically corrected early, dogs w ill develop some degree of osteoarth ritis.
T h ese dogs may req u ire anti-inflammatory medications and ph ysical th erapy
later in life. U ntreated osteoarth ritis w ill progressively w orsen and cau se a
decreased joint range of motion and increased lameness over time.​ 

 
 ​*F
*


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

Hip dysplasia cannot be compared to elbow dysplasia... the dog bears the majority of its' weight on the front end, so apparent minor pain issues in front are actually more significant.


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## FunnyAboutMoney (Apr 20, 2011)

*Elbow vs hip dysplasia*

Yes, that's entirely true. My point was that when a vet delivers a dire diagnosis, one should get a second opinion.


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