# Best breeder of English Cream Goldens!



## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

The link you included went to your blog, not Stonebridge Golden Retrievers.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Is this the Stoneledge you're referring too?


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## Melissa C (Nov 6, 2011)

*Stoneledge Golden Retrievers*

I am considering getting an English Golden Retriever and have been looking at a lot of web sites and talking to a lot of breeders. One breeder told me that the lady at Stoneledge is refusing to do DNA testing for ichthyosis which sends up a red flag for me. I was under the impression that ichthyosis can be really bad, is more common in English goldens and can show up at an older age, so do any of you think it is important that the parents have been tested even though the DNA tests are not reqauired by GRCA?


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## kwhit (Apr 7, 2008)

Melissa C said:


> ...refusing to do DNA testing for ichthyosis which sends up a red flag for me. I was under the impression that ichthyosis can be really bad, is more common in English goldens...


Wow...I just saw this and looked it up...I had never heard of ichthyosis before and lo and behold..._Chance has this_!!! I've been asking vets forever about why his skin has so many grey flakes in it and no matter what I do they _never go away_! Geez...it's good to know what it is, now I'll just have to do my usual research, (i.e. hours and hours ) on it. 

His coat looks exactly like the picture in this article, only Chance's flaking is 10x worse :

http://www.rvc.ac.uk/CIC/documents/icthyosis_000.pdf


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## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

I dont know about the condition or but make sure you see all the clearances and that they are up to date. Dylan is Canadian and she is going by the Canadian regulations for his prelims for his hips and elbows which he can get at less than two years of age. So dont let throw you. You can look at the GRCA and GRCC websites. 
Here Choosing a Breeder | The Golden Retriever Club of Canada
Golden Retriever Club of America - The GRCA Club


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

We have client who is struggling with a "white" golden who has ichthyosis. They are trying baths 3x a week and some essential oils, but it is rough.


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

I think that morally anyone who breeds dogs from the "English" lines should test not just for icthyosis, but PRA.


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## Shalva (Jul 16, 2008)

responsible breeders do and are testing for icthyosis and PRA of both the US and UK types.... 

I always love when people come here and the first words are " the best ".... well first anyone marketing as English Cream would not be in my list of "best" 
secondly you could go to the guy down the street and the reality is that we all love our dogs regardless of the breeder they come from so that is no real test of breeding quality if you love your dog or are happy with your dog... 

I am not sure that I believe that English dogs have a higher rate of icthyosis (or however the heck you spell that) but it is certainly there and should be tested for .... as well as pra, hips, eyes, heart and elbows... you know the basics 

I personally know of many breeders of English style dogs who I would consider reputable... is one of them the best... who knows...


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Being a great Golden breeder and breeding for a particular color extreme are mutually incompatible. Therefore I submit that "Best breeder of English Cream Goldens" is _prima facie_ fallacious.


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## willandhudson (Nov 15, 2011)

*Best English Cream Retrievers*

Thanks everyone for your responses. I'm new to the forum so hope I'm posting correctly. 

Just so everyone knows, the breeder from Stoneledge never refers to herself as the 'best english cream breeder'. I gave her that title because we're so in love with our dog and we think she is fantastic.

I was also concerned about all the clearances. Until recently she didn't have them updated from this country. ALL of them were done right before I picked up my pup. As a matter of fact (and maybe they all do this) I was given a beautiful binder with photo's of pup, parents, lineage, all health clearances and necessary documentation. I was very impressed.

I don't know about the skin issue but I will make sure to watch Hudson as he grows up. For those of you with dogs that do have it, try a mixture of a gentle carrier oil (like almond) mixed with several drops of Taminu oil. Taminu is an oil for skin ailments. It is amazing. It doesn't smell wonderful but it works.

Sorry the link went to my blog. For any of you who want the link to Stoneledge, here it is:

http://www.simplesite.com/stoneledge/

Best,

Hudson's Mom


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## Conquerergold (Dec 12, 2007)

Shalva said:


> I am not sure that I believe that English dogs have a higher rate of icthyosis (or however the heck you spell that) but it is certainly there and should be tested for .... as well as pra, hips, eyes, heart and elbows... you know the basics.


I would have to agree. I have both 'styles' of Golden here, 'English' and 'American', I tested four dogs for ichthyosis, the only dog to come back as a carrier is American.

There are also two forms of testable PRA, prcd-PRA and PRA1. There is also a yet unidentified third type.

Cheers
Rob


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## willandhudson (Nov 15, 2011)

Melissa,

Hi. I was concerned about all the health clearances to. I got everything from Stoneledge. She was waiting for some clearances to be complete in this country. I have everything and the breeder, Louise, gave us a beautiful binder, with every health report, in order, and very organized. She was great. One thing I found while speaking with other breeders, which I didn't care for, is they would say not so nice things about other breeders. This is why I like this forum. It's real people who aren't in the business. One woman told me that if I didn't get a dog from her, my puppy would probably be get cancer! because she was the only one that knew how to raise dog's. Anyway ask away. I love Stoneledge. Our pup is now 10 weeks and he is the absolute best. We will be getting our second from Stoneledge as well! Good luck. By the way, Louise, is one breeder that you can ask anything to. So if you have concerns, email her and ask her. She's wonderful. Best,


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

Sally's Mom said:


> I think that morally anyone who breeds dogs from the "English" lines should test not just for icthyosis, but PRA.



I believe you will see more and more breeders, especially those with strong European pedigrees doing these test. Both are relatively new tests and more and more breeders are doing them.


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## Tahnee GR (Aug 26, 2006)

I also believe that those with Swedish lines have an obligation to make sure their dogs, and/or their ancestors, have been tested for the gene for sensory ataxic neuropathy, or are not from the affected lines. There is a DNA test for it, so should be relatively easy to eliminate. Obviously, if ancestors have tested clear, there is no need to worry. It is my understanding that this mutation has been traced back to one bitch from the 1970's.


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## Miley (Nov 2, 2010)

Willandhuson, please post pictures... we all LOVE puppies


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## Deb_Bayne (Mar 18, 2011)

willandhudson said:


> Melissa,
> 
> One thing I found while speaking with other breeders, which I didn't care for, is they would say not so nice things about other breeders.


I'm the same way, I don't respond favourably to criticisms of others, including politics (which is why I didn't even vote last time). 

I can see the advantage in the English Creme (white) goldens as you won't see the sugar face so early in age as I've seen in goldens as young as 4 years.


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## golden_eclipse (Apr 1, 2011)

I think generally you will find that a reputable breeder will be more than happy to point you in the direction of another reputable breeder; as most reputable breeders have WAY more people wanting a puppy than they can supply puppies to. But you will also find that they are going to give an honest opinion about a breeder they know to not be reputable, please don't mistake this for bad talking or bashing, as they do this out of the goodness of the breed and you. They don't want the continued breeding of dogs that pass on health problems or cause puppy owners to fork over thousands in vet bills. It is a very important difference that puppy buyers should really distinguish between. Of course there are bad breeders that produce far too many puppies and our trying to sell poor quality puppies for a lot of money, that will bash anyone just to sell a puppy. That is something completely different.


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## golden_eclipse (Apr 1, 2011)

Deb_Bayne said:


> I'm the same way, I don't respond favourably to criticisms of others, including politics (which is why I didn't even vote last time).
> 
> I can see the advantage in the English Creme (white) goldens as you won't see the sugar face so early in age as I've seen in goldens as young as 4 years.


Breeding for color will never be favorable for the breed. Dalmations for example are scored 25/100 just on the shape/color of their spots, but most dalmations are deaf or have hearing problems from birth....just an example, Dalmations are also "non-sporting" so they really are not bred for a distinct purpose as goldens are, so its more acceptable for them. Our goldens are hunting dogs, the color of their coat will not affect their ability to be a hunting companion, thus it should not be a part of any decision when breeding two dogs.


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## Angelina (Aug 11, 2011)

I just wanted to say welcome to the forum and congratulations on your new pup! It seems your announcement has turned into a breeding / requirement post instead of a congratulatory post! I hope you will post pictures of your new puppy soon and let us know how puppyhood goes! Kimberly


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## kwhit (Apr 7, 2008)

Deb_Bayne said:


> I can see the advantage in the English Creme (white) goldens as you won't see the sugar face so early in age as I've seen in goldens as young as 4 years.


Funny, that's the one thing I'll miss with Chance. I loved that about Savanah...


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## TanglewoodGoldens (Mar 11, 2008)

Congratulations on your new puppy Hudson! I bet he is a beautiful boy!
Just to clarify - the testing for Ick and PRA-1 (for english type) and PRA-cd are relatively new tests. Most of the reputable breeders I know are just starting to begin testing for it in their breeding stock. Please be patient with all of us - testing is expensive and most are waiting for when Optigen hosts another set of "discount days". So far I have tested 4 of my dogs with the remaining 4 set to be tested in Jan during those days. 
Ick has varying degrees of manifesting - and it is not limited to just the english golden. I know many American breeders are seeing it in their pedigrees now also.


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## willandhudson (Nov 15, 2011)

Hi, Thanks for all the responses. I am so bad with knowing how to work this forum. I would love to post a photo but don't know how. Hudson is the cutest! I swear I can't even walk him because everyone stops. He looks like a stuffed animal come to life. He's getting bigger every week (of course!) and I'm convinced he is half polar bear. The best thing is when he wakes up and see's me for the first time - he is definitely smiling and the tail is just going a mile a minute. When I figure out how to post photos I will do so. Thanks. Best,


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## willandhudson (Nov 15, 2011)

Hi,

I think I looked at your site too and the litter dates just didn't match our needs. You have beautiful dogs. I agree, breeders want all the testing done (probably even more so) than the future owners. Cheers to healthy pups!


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## andreagoldengate (Dec 13, 2011)

Hello

There is no cure for this genetic disorder. There are few dogs who are non-carriers in the States, English or American; but I know Mary Buffie of Goldfeather Run tests for this and everything else. She also owns Center for Canines. I am sure you could Google to find her. She lives in Minnesota and is a highly ethical breeder! There are some breeders down south who test too, but Mary has a non-carrier stud dog. My friend bought a pup from her and she spends a lot of time with her new puppy owners helping them with anything they need. I will be contacting her for a pup next year.


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## andreagoldengate (Dec 13, 2011)

..........


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

andreagoldengate said:


> Hello
> 
> There is no cure for this genetic disorder. There are few dogs who are non-carriers in the States, English or American;



What genetic disorder are you referring to?

Thanks


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

andreagoldengate said:


> Hello
> 
> There is no cure for this genetic disorder. There are few dogs who are non-carriers in the States, English or American; but I know Mary Buffie of Goldfeather Run tests for this and everything else. She also owns Center for Canines. I am sure you could Google to find her. She lives in Minnesota and is a highly ethical breeder! There are some breeders down south who test too, but Mary has a non-carrier stud dog. My friend bought a pup from her and she spends a lot of time with her new puppy owners helping them with anything they need. I will be contacting her for a pup next year.


 
If you are talking Ichthy there are quite a few dogs among the limited number who have been tested so far who are clear. The GoldenDNA site shows 35/63reported dogs so far as having tested clear. That is over 50%. Ichthyosis Breeders all over the continent and in Europe are in the process of testing for the disorder which in most cases does not have severe manifestation. I know one of the dogs listed as affected in the database and you would not know by looking at her--her owner was surprised when she came back as genetically affected. The breeder you mention is not going above and beyond compared to what reputable breeders are doing. As well, the key is to use the test results to breed intelligently to avoid producing affecteds--eliminating all carriers from the gene pool could have quite dramatic unintended consequences through a narrowing of options and a concentration of other genes.


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