# ? 4 Field Breeders



## glddog04 (Sep 19, 2009)

Good morning!
I have a question for any breeders of field dogs out there. I have my first field dog, Hula. Most of the rest of my dogs are a mix of conformation and obedience lines. My plans in purchasing Hula included (hopefully) adding her to my small breeding program. At 11 months she is definitely undershot. Would this preclude you from breeding her? In all other respects she is working well for me, other than bieng not as confident as I had hoped!
glddog04


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

How undershot are we talking here? 
Another very important question is -- does this run in her line? Questions her breeder and owner of sire can and should answer.
I believe it was Shurmark's Split Decision that had a bad bite, that certainly didn't affect his career in the field or as a sire. (don't quote me here but I believe this is the case)
However -- he was truly outstanding and breeders could overlook this major conformational flaw. 
Is your dog absolutely spectacular in all other areas that this can be overcome? As a significant fault, a dog with a bad bite would need to really bring something else to the table to overcome that and contribute to the breed.
This is a fault that DOES affect the dog both in everyday life (dogs with bad bites can have trouble eating) and in his job as a retriever (picking up and holding birds). Granted the bite would have to be terrible, but if you let THIS bad bite slide, how much worse does the next one have to be that you say "enough"?
Things to think about.


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## DNL2448 (Feb 13, 2009)

My personal opinion is that I would not breed a dog with a bad bite. Bites are important as stated by K9-Design and to breed a bite problem would eventually cause problems down the line. 

What are you seeing that your dog is lacking confidence? That, too is a very important trait in field dogs. They need to "go boldly" into whatever is presented to them to fetch a bird. A dog that lacks confidence will need a lot of work though it can be done. Of course she is only 11 months old, it may just be a faze she is going through.

I would wait and ask your question again after she has had all of her clearances then maybe the answers will be made for you.


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## glddog04 (Sep 19, 2009)

Dad has "reverse sizzors bite" according to Sharon Bolton who assesed him. I've never heard this before!!? Is this like a tight undershot? I woudn't concider Hula's bite terrible, it sounds alot like dads, having basicly reverse on the insisors. I am certainly aware it is a disquallifying fact. I don't think she is going to be another Sprint <VBG> ( her grandfather on paternal side!)But she is working well for me in obedience, has a great temperment and nice looking.I question her confidece only when meeting new dogs when she rolls on her back. In all other respects I would call her cautious, but not fearful. She certainly has no trouble carrying a bird! 

glddog04


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

glddog04 said:


> Dad has "reverse sizzors bite" according to Sharon Bolton who assesed him. I've never heard this before!!? Is this like a tight undershot? I woudn't concider Hula's bite terrible, it sounds alot like dads, having basicly reverse on the insisors. I am certainly aware it is a disquallifying fact. I don't think she is going to be another Sprint <VBG> ( her grandfather on paternal side!)But she is working well for me in obedience, has a great temperment and nice looking.I question her confidece only when meeting new dogs when she rolls on her back. In all other respects I would call her cautious, but not fearful. She certainly has no trouble carrying a bird!
> 
> glddog04


Well this is a telling post! This clearly IS a problem in her line. If you breed her you have to be prepared for more of this problem. Do you want to do that?
I guess your dilemma is, how much of a problem is this for you? How much do you value the golden retriever standard? 
Personally I would not freak out if someone bred a dog with a bad bite but again, that dog better be real special in other accounts.
I would hold on to her and evaluate when she is older.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

This is a reverse scissors bite -- basically a very slight underbite. A "regular" scissors bite is very slightly overshot so this makes sense.


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## Swampcollie (Sep 6, 2007)

glddog04 said:


> Good morning!
> 
> At 11 months she is definitely undershot. Would this preclude you from breeding her?


I would wait and see how her bite looks at age two. Field bred's mature very slowly and it's very likely she's still growing. 

If she ends up with an undershot bite I would not use her in a breeding program.


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

I'm not a breeder, but I wouldn't. There's just too many goldens out there to go to. My Storee dog is out of a conformation bitch and a field dog with his CH (Push). Her main 'fault' is lack of bone and coat, but she's got angles, a nice head and oodles of drive and talent. 

Lana


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## glddog04 (Sep 19, 2009)

K9-Design said:


> This is a reverse scissors bite -- basically a very slight underbite. A "regular" scissors bite is very slightly overshot so this makes sense.


 Thanks now I know what a reverse scissors bite looks like!


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