# Finn's Obedience Training



## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

I'm attempting to train my golden, Finn, to compete in Obedience. I'll keep a log of his progress here.
I'd like to run him in both Obedience and Rally. I'll probably end up doing Rally first, but I don't want to run it like sloppy obedience, I'd like to run it like I'm at an Obedience trial. 



He has started offering a sit in heel position as a behavior which is exciting! Sometimes if he doesn't understand what I'm asking he will run through tricks and I'm happy that he is now offering on his own.
For positions- I have been using a makeshift position box and he is doing well with kick-back standing. He will tuck his sits maybe 50% of the time (I only reward the tucked ones) and he will do a front first or whole body down maybe 50% of the time (ditto, I only reward the correct ones). I didn't know I was going to do Obedience with him when I got him, so I taught him down from the sit position, which means I have some un teaching to do. Heeling is a mixed bag- he understands parts of it. I am trying to mix foundation exercises recommended by one friend with the work recommended by another friend, and I think we're doing ok. I need to remember to always step forward with the left foot when heeling. For fronts, I have been using what I think is called the funnel method? He knows to look at my face but I'm not sure how to get a chin rest. We are working on solidifying straight fronts and his front command.

Unfortunately I don't have any pictures at the moment, because they're all on my phone, and I am having issues with it.

I'll be taking him to obedience class once he can work in a class setting- his manners are improving drastically and I am hoping that I could take a class in May.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

You’re doing a phenomenal job with him. Keep up the good work!


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

FinnTheFloof said:


> . I didn't know I was going to do Obedience with him when I got him, so I taught him down from the sit position, which means I have some un teaching to do.


Why would this be a problem?

If you are doing regular obedience with him, he would be going "down" from the sit position.

It will be different for command discrimination where he will need to go down from a stand, however - you have time to train that and it's a different exercise anyway.


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

Megora said:


> Why would this be a problem?
> 
> If you are doing regular obedience with him, he would be going "down" from the sit position.
> 
> It will be different for command discrimination where he will need to go down from a stand, however - you have time to train that and it's a different exercise anyway.


Because he learned to 'down' by putting his butt down then his front, instead of his front first. He can change from any of the positions to the next but he doesn't always tuck sit or front first down


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

FinnTheFloof said:


> Because he learned to 'down' by putting his butt down then his front, instead of his front first. He can change from any of the positions to the next but he doesn't always tuck sit or front first down


The tuck sit matters for halts in heeling because the rock-back sit could put him out of position, but most dogs tuck sit from motion instinctively because it’s more efficient. I don’t think a rock-back sit is points off in command discrimination unless it’s when you’re still beside him. The sphinx/fold-back down really only matters because it helps with the mechanics of the drop on recall. It’s not points off in command discrimination or signals if he doesn’t go down elbows first.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Even DOR have seen plenty of dogs do the sit-down vs the immediate down. 

It matters for position changes because for A exhibitors - the positions are Stand-down-sit. Your dog needs to be able to go down from a standing position + with you a distance away. <= It's not an issue for novice level where there is only one down command (sits and downs). And you can put him into a down from a sit.


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

What does DOR mean? 
I can put him in any position from any position and his stays are great, I'm still pretty new to this stuff
I need to work on building distance. He can sit or down from a distance but when I ask him to stand he comes to me


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Megora said:


> Even DOR have seen plenty of dogs do the sit-down vs the immediate down.
> 
> It matters for position changes because for A exhibitors - the positions are Stand-down-sit. Your dog needs to be able to go down from a standing position + with you a distance away. <= It's not an issue for novice level where there is only one down command (sits and downs). And you can put him into a down from a sit.


Well you know I’m working on this exact thing right now… lol but I’m just saying that it’s not points off for the dog’s butt to hit slightly before the elbows as long he doesn’t do a full sit and then down. And as long as he doesn’t creep forward.

The sphinx on the DOR makes it faster, but really it’s the dog’s response time to the command that matters, not the mechanics of the down.

Honestly, @FinnTheFloof I would work on these techniques, but be patient and don’t push it too hard. It will take time to reteach the mechanics of the commands and build up muscle memory.

In the grand scheme of things, tuck-up sits, fold-back downs, and kick-back stands matter a lot more for OTCH competitors who are going for wins in classes where everyone scores 197+ than for basically anyone else.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

FinnTheFloof said:


> What does DOR mean?
> I can put him in any position from any position and his stays are great, I'm still pretty new to this stuff
> I need to work on building distance. He can sit or down from a distance but when I ask him to stand he comes to me


DOR = Drop on Recall


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Drop on recall.



ArkansasGold said:


> In the grand scheme of things, tuck-up sits, fold-back downs, and kick-back stands matter a lot more for OTCH competitors who are going for wins in classes where everyone scores 197+ than for basically anyone else.



Sometimes you pick where you lose points too.... 

With Jovi, I pretty much know he will lose 1/2 a point on the recall finish because I've allowed him to nose my hand when he comes around to sit in heel position. And part of me has no idea how to fix that.... and the other part of me has basically decided that while losing a 1/2 point is a big pain, at least we are not losing 3 points from him not finishing correctly. 

W/r to command discrimination and getting that sit from the down.... I basically don't care if there's creeping, as long as I get that dang sit from 30 feet away.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Megora said:


> Sometimes you pick where you lose points too....
> 
> W/r to command discrimination and getting that sit from the down.... I basically don't care if there's creeping, as long as I get that dang sit from 30 feet away.


SAME


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

ArkansasGold said:


> Well you know I’m working on this exact thing right now… lol but I’m just saying that it’s not points off for the dog’s butt to hit slightly before the elbows as long he doesn’t do a full sit and then down. And as long as he doesn’t creep forward.
> 
> The sphinx on the DOR makes it faster, but really it’s the dog’s response time to the command that matters, not the mechanics of the down.
> 
> ...


Thank you!


How does a dog get an OTCH? Obviously not relevant to me but I'm interested because idk


Megora said:


> Drop on recall.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh god, finishes scare me, I have no idea how I'm going to teach them


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

With regards to his heeling, at the moment I have his training tug in my sweatshirt pocket and pop his head up with the collar if he looks away from my face, so I'm not luring- before I had the toy under my arm and he would jump too much for it and lag behind to try to get it. I'm probably doing stuff 100% wrong but I'm trying my best. 
*







*
terrible picture but that's kinda what we've got
I have one of him after I put the toy in my pocket, which turned out better, but my phone is out of action at the moment
He was pacing in this because we were moving too slow 
I know that I'm twisting a lot more than I should be as well but I am sort of fixing that, like I said I have another picture where we look better (less twisted, actually trotting) but I don't have it right now


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

I haven't attempted any of the hard stuff like DOR or finishes or turning when heeling, I've just been working on fronts, heeling in a straight line and positions


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

The short of it re:getting an OTCH is that you have to win and get placements in Open and Utility to get points toward the OTCH. You need 100 total points, but for some wild reason, they’ve never adjusted the points scale like they do for conformation - even though the concept came from conformation… To make up for that sort of, they recently (2 or 3 years ago?) decided that anyone with a 197+ that doesn’t get OTCH points from placements can get 1 point.

Finishes are super easy to teach, don’t overthink it! Just lure right finishes a few times and the dog will understand what you want. I used Matt Twitty’s method to teach a left finish. It’s still a lure, but it plays to the dog’s instincts and helps them be right. Eevee picked it up after like 2 reps.


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

Should I start using a specific leash and collar for obedience? I have a set of a flat collar and matching 6 foot leash that I don't use for anything else- should I introduce it now sas the obedience gear?


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

I train with a prong collar but it doesn't stay up as high as I'd like because I think he's between sizes, if I take a link off he acts uncomfortable but it sits lower than I'd like with the link on


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

FinnTheFloof said:


> Should I start using a specific leash and collar for obedience? I have a set of a flat collar and matching 6 foot leash that I don't use for anything else- should I introduce it now sas the obedience gear?


I do, and I would put the buckle collar on with the prong every time you train. It will help you transition off the prong later. 

FWIW, I stopped using a prong with Eevee. She responds to corrections just fine without it. 

Also, I think you should really focus on him understanding what heel position means before you start trying to make it fancy. You could have the fanciest heeling ever, but if he's out of position, it won't matter.


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

ArkansasGold said:


> I do, and I would put the buckle collar on with the prong every time you train. It will help you transition off the prong later.
> 
> FWIW, I stopped using a prong with Eevee. She responds to corrections just fine without it.
> 
> Also, I think you should really focus on him understanding what heel position means before you start trying to make it fancy. You could have the fanciest heeling ever, but if he's out of position, it won't matter.


Will do!
I will be fading the prong eventually, I'm just not sure when I'll know it's time to start fading it


FinnTheFloof said:


> *
> View attachment 891153
> *
> terrible picture but that's kinda what we've got


Is he in position in this picture?


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Yes. He needs to understand that he should always be in that spot when actively heeling. No matter how fast or how slow or which direction you're going, he should essentially be glued to your hip, even if that means he needs to go slightly faster than you (right turns/about turns/F8) or slightly slower (left turns). For most Goldens, the handler needs to walk fast. Like REALLY fast to make it easier for the dog to hold position for longer periods and to keep them from pacing.


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

ArkansasGold said:


> Yes. He needs to understand that he should always be in that spot when actively heeling. No matter how fast or how slow or which direction you're going, he should essentially be glued to your hip, even if that means he needs to go slightly faster than you (right turns/about turns/F8) or slightly slower (left turns). For most Goldens, the handler needs to walk fast. Like REALLY fast to make it easier for the dog to hold position for longer periods and to keep them from pacing.


I am moving faster now so that he doesn't pace- my good photo is on my phone
He was falling OOP when I had the toy under my arm because he would fall back to jump for it


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

ArkansasGold said:


> For most Goldens, the handler needs to walk fast. Like REALLY fast to make it easier for the dog to hold position for longer periods and to keep them from pacing.


It doesn't really matter though if the dog trots or paces. I know of dogs who are in the obedience hall of fame after getting a cazillion OTCH points and reigning at the top..... who couldn't trot to save their life.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Megora said:


> It doesn't really matter though if the dog trots or paces. I know of dogs who are in the obedience hall of fame after getting a cazillion OTCH points and reigning at the top..... who couldn't trot to save their life.


True... It just doesn't look pretty.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

ArkansasGold said:


> True... It just doesn't look pretty.


It's like heads up heeling which actually there was a squaffle about a few years ago (actually there's a nonstop squaffle about it, but the one I'm thinking about happened a few years ago). It's people who were getting quite angry about judges nicking them for forging or bumps with the heads up heeling. 

I actually saw this happen with a friend at a trial. I watched her dog compete and was convinced the dog was working on a high 197+ score and was so thrilled for the team.... and then the scores were announced and she scored in the 180's because the judge was taking points off every single time her dog appeared (to the judge) to be forged out of position.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

ArkansasGold said:


> Finishes are super easy to teach, don’t overthink it! Just lure right finishes a few times and the dog will understand what you want. I used Matt Twitty’s method to teach a left finish. It’s still a lure, but it plays to the dog’s instincts and helps them be right. Eevee picked it up after like 2 reps.


What is this method?


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Megora said:


> It's like heads up heeling which actually there was a squaffle about a few years ago (actually there's a nonstop squaffle about it, but the one I'm thinking about happened a few years ago). It's people who were getting quite angry about judges nicking them for forging or bumps with the heads up heeling.
> 
> I actually saw this happen with a friend at a trial. I watched her dog compete and was convinced the dog was working on a high 197+ score and was so thrilled for the team.... and then the scores were announced and she scored in the 180's because the judge was taking points off every single time her dog appeared (to the judge) to be forged out of position.


Then there are judges on the flip side who are so mesmerized by the fanciness of it all that they miss all of the crowding, bumping, crabbing, etc. I thought I wanted fancy heeling out of Eevee, but I decided it wasn't worth the effort to make her be super fancy. She does drive from the rear most of the time, she just doesn't get super lifty (new word?) about it.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Megora said:


> What is this method?


Go a couple minutes in - and keep in mind that the video is backwards - and you can see how he does it. It's hard to explain with words. Heeling Step 1 & 2:... - Start to Finish Dog Training

ETA: It helps if the dog has some semblance of rear end awareness. Some Goldens seem to think their rear is attached to a different dog.


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

ArkansasGold said:


> Go a couple minutes in - and keep in mind that the video is backwards - and you can see how he does it. It's hard to explain with words. Heeling Step 1 & 2:... - Start to Finish Dog Training
> 
> ETA: It helps if the dog has some semblance of rear end awareness. Some Goldens seem to think their rear is attached to a different dog.


Finn is convinced that he only has two legs and they are attached to his shoulders. We have made 0 progress on pivots 
he can back up on command which I guess is a start? Maybe I"ll try having him back through a ladder


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

Megora said:


> It's like heads up heeling which actually there was a squaffle about a few years ago (actually there's a nonstop squaffle about it, but the one I'm thinking about happened a few years ago). It's people who were getting quite angry about judges nicking them for forging or bumps with the heads up heeling.


Could you expand on basically all of that? Sorry I don't really know what stuff goes on or the differences between styles or methods.


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## pawsnpaca (Nov 11, 2014)

Teaching your dog a finish is a piece of cake. For all my dogs I started by luring them into position (follow the cookie). Don't be afraid to take a step back to help them if needed. I faded the cookie pretty quickly to just a hand cue once the dog understood what I wanted. Then it was just a matter of fading the step back, and then refining the final position to make sure they were straight and where I wanted them to be in relation to my leg (using some sort of low platform helps).

As far as a collar... FWIW I do 98% of my Rally and Obedience training in my (fenced) back yard without a leash or a collar. Most of the exercises are taught in the middle of fetch sessions (asking for a behavior before I'll throw the ball) or in brief training sessions (as in less than a minute, maybe in my kitchen or after a fetch session) using treats. I only use a leash and collar in formal classes, or once the behaviors are solid and I just need to make sure the dog will do them with a leash attached. I've found that "leash handling" is one of the bigger challenges for me personally (ie., what do do with the leash while also giving hand signals or refining a behavior) and I'd rather not confuse my dog as to what I'm asking by fumbling with a leash while also trying to use the correct hand signals, etc. I also find that if someone is used to using a leash to control their dog or deliver corrections, they become better handlers if they are forced to figure out how to get the behavior if they can't drag their dog to get him to do what they want.

Fenzi has some awesome classes to teach a happy, engaged, precise heel. Here's a link to some of their self-study classes, but almost every "semester" they offer other with a "live" instructor and it only costs about $60 per class to audit. Fenzi Dog Sports Academy - Self-Study


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

pawsnpaca said:


> Teaching your dog a finish is a piece of cake. For all my dogs I started by luring them into position (follow the cookie). Don't be afraid to take a step back to help them if needed. I faded the cookie pretty quickly to just a hand cue once the dog understood what I wanted. Then it was just a matter of fading the step back, and then refining the final position to make sure they were straight and where I wanted them to be in relation to my leg (using some sort of low platform helps).
> 
> As far as a collar... FWIW I do 98% of my Rally and Obedience training in my (fenced) back yard without a leash or a collar. Most of the exercises are taught in the middle of fetch sessions (asking for a behavior before I'll throw the ball) or in brief training sessions (as in less than a minute, maybe in my kitchen or after a fetch session) using treats. I only use a leash and collar in formal classes, or once the behaviors are solid and I just need to make sure the dog will do them with a leash attached. I've found that "leash handling" is one of the bigger challenges for me personally (ie., what do do with the leash while also giving hand signals or refining a behavior) and I'd rather not confuse my dog as to what I'm asking by fumbling with a leash while also trying to use the correct hand signals, etc. I also find that if someone is used to using a leash to control their dog or deliver corrections, they become better handlers if they are forced to figure out how to get the behavior if they can't drag their dog to get him to do what they want.
> 
> Fenzi has some awesome classes to teach a happy, engaged, precise heel. Here's a link to some of their self-study classes, but almost every "semester" they offer other with a "live" instructor and it only costs about $60 per class to audit. Fenzi Dog Sports Academy - Self-Study


I don't have a fenced yard and Finn already has an unfortunate habit of running to his friend's house (right next to ours- there used to be another puppy there and my parents would bring him over to play. The dog has since moved away but he still runs over) and he won't recall. I'd be worried that it would become a habit to run off during OB training. Although, that may be different with his tug involved- he would run around the world for that thing. I would try to fade the collar and leash out but I don't want to lure his head up because I worry about issues fading the lure. 

I love Fenzi! I was looking at this:
Fenzi Dog Sports Academy - WW296: April 3 - Heeling Building Blocks


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## pawsnpaca (Nov 11, 2014)

I get it... definitely there are challenges when you don't have access to a safely fenced area! Do you have any room in your house that's big enough to practice in? If not, maybe you can put him on a long line or tie the leash to your waist, but I know that may cause more problems than it's worth!

I have this course in my library but haven't had a chance to really work the exercises yet: Fenzi Dog Sports Academy - RA540: Joy of Heeling - Rock it like a Freestyler! 

There are lots of great options at Fenzi though, and what I love is the focus on making heeling FUN instead of boring (I definitely have to work on that!).


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

If it helps.... 

This video shows beginning steps to teaching both finishes - as I've been taught. 

There's other ways of teaching from the very simple lure which I think you can see in the video shared by Maegan above, to teaching exaggerated flip finishes (pop up with treats), etc... 

Basics though - you want to get the dog up and moving to either side on verbal command or hand signal, you want them to go far enough back to come up straight and perfect heel position. That's it. 

Pivots - people work on footwork without dogs. Right pivot, you first turn with the right foot which is the dogs cue that the pivot is happening, and then turn your body/foot/and the dog and bring your feet together. 

Left pivot - I show what huge pain that is to work on off leash with a dog that's either early on in his training of the pivot or has not done it in a while. Most of us put the dog on leash and bring the leash around behind us and as we take a step back and to the left with our left foot - we are cuing the dog with a little tug of the leash with our right hand. This trains the dog to back and turn his butt behind you for the left pivot. 

I generally train off leash at home. If treats come out, my dogs know they are training. 

But to answer your question, I use a choke chain and 2 foot leather lead for obedience training. Which is a different collar and lead than I'd use for conformation. Which is a different collar and leash than I'd use just walking the dogs.

Walking the dogs, they have a regular buckle collar and 6 foot rope lead (and get to walk 6 feet ahead of me). 

Will remove video after a while (because I still look sick - am recovering from bronchitis).


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## pawsnpaca (Nov 11, 2014)

I train finishes just like Megora does (thanks to her for posting the video - it's always so nice to be able to SEE what we're talking about).

For the left pivot... that one can definitely be a challenge and I was trying to remember how I train it, since my dogs have always had great left pivots (so much of how I train is instinctive it's sometimes hard to stop and really think about how I achieved the end product!). I THINK I train it by first making sure the left side finish command is very solid, and then I give the same signal/command a split second before I pivot left. It's sloppy at first, but I'm always amazed how quickly the dog figures it out! In fact, my dog Guinness was so good at it that we risked losing points in Rally because he almost "scooted" into position - pivoting on his butt rather than standing and moving into position - but it sure was flashy! 😁 My command for a left pivot eventually changes to "get in," but by that point the dog is usually working more off my hand signal and body language than the verbal so it's easy to make the change.


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

Megora said:


> If it helps....
> 
> This video shows beginning steps to teaching both finishes - as I've been taught.
> 
> ...


Nice video. Thank you! What command are you saying for your right finish? Just wondering.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

You can use a cone to do pivots around.

Likewise something you are heeling around like a box or a chair. Many higher up trainers use broad jumps turned on the side and set up to form a right angle that they work their way around.

Pivots are turning in place. Before you can do that very cleanly with the left pivots esp, the dog has to learn how to maneuver his rear end and get back when turning. They do it naturally when maneuvering around objects.

But left pivots - I generally use a leash behind me to guide the dog - especially since my little idiot is very spin happy when I put my hand to the side of his face.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

diane0905 said:


> Nice video. Thank you! What command are you saying for your right finish? Just wondering.


Right is "by me" or "by".


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## FinnTheFloof (Jun 27, 2021)

Sorry- I meant pivots like having a dog rotate around an upside down water bowl, do people not actually do those?


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## pawsnpaca (Nov 11, 2014)

FinnTheFloof said:


> Sorry- I meant pivots like having a dog rotate around an upside down water bowl, do people not actually do those?


I’m working on that now, especially with Castor who seems to have no clue that he can control his own back legs.😆

My instructor uses a long dowel to gently tap the dog on the hip or foot to get him to move a foot in the right direction…


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

FinnTheFloof said:


> Sorry- I meant pivots like having a dog rotate around an upside down water bowl, do people not actually do those?


Look up Celeste Meade and "brick work".

Taught my dogs' dad how to do it.... and never used it for obedience as he had a very good "get in" before I taught it. 

Have zero interest in using it with my current two, because I basically hated training it with their dad.  When you do not own a BC, this is a stupid exercise.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

I use “around” for a right finish and “with me” for a left finish. Other people use “by me” or “find heel”. I like Matt’s simple method for the left finish because it doesn’t require flailing your arm to the side and I think I get better position out of Eevee than I did out of Rocket. You don’t get bonus points for the dog jumping into heel position. Lol I didn’t get the chance to watch your video, Kate, but I’m sure it’s great.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Oh - I put it back for a little while longer then. LOL. 

I use the hand signal vs a verbal because it basically tells my dog which way to go and hopefully sends them back deep enough so they are in correct heel position when they show up on the left side. 

With Matt's video I was cringing a little at his methods at getting his dog to stop pacing. I know people who do the hop or pop up to get out of the pace, but setting the dog's head forward and moving him FORWARD with a big step always worked better and made more sense? At least with dogs who are pacing because they are all jumbly with the legs.


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

Megora said:


> Oh - I put it back for a little while longer then. LOL.
> 
> I use the hand signal vs a verbal because it basically tells my dog which way to go and hopefully sends them back deep enough so they are in correct heel position when they show up on the left side.
> 
> With Matt's video I was cringing a little at his methods at getting his dog to stop pacing. I know people who do the hop or pop up to get out of the pace, but setting the dog's head forward and moving him FORWARD with a big step always worked better and made more sense? At least with dogs who are pacing because they are all jumbly with the legs.


The “trotting on a cookie” part he separates completely from heel position until many steps later. I decided not to do that part - I did try it, but with a 2.5 year old (at the time) it didn’t make much sense. I did like the simple cookie flip to get them to do a left finish and it was super easy to turn into a signal. I prefer to use a signal over a verbal for that as well.


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## aesthetic (Apr 23, 2015)

I am not an obedience person and don’t have any pressing obedience goals, but I do have a lot of fun teaching finishes. I make my life hard cause I like to shape it LOL. I looooved Kaizer’s- it was so pretty and clean. Eden’s is a work in progress. 



FinnTheFloof said:


> Sorry- I meant pivots like having a dog rotate around an upside down water bowl, do people not actually do those?


I do!! I do a lot of bowl work like that. It’s how I start teaching my pivot into heel, I want my dogs to learn to move their hind end without moving their front feet. I also use the bowl to teach my dogs to back up (gives a destination so the back up is straight), and I taught Kaizer to differentiate between his hind legs using a bowl (he could lift each back leg like he was marking on cue).


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## ArkansasGold (Dec 7, 2017)

A lot of people do bowl work! Or a stone. Or a box. I’ve even seen a book used before.
@Megora , I watched it! I do pretty much the same things as you, minus the left finish. I’ve been working on making Eevee back her way around me to get the concept of left turns/pivots. It’s a bit overkill, but it makes her think about it.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Hi! Sorry I haven't read the whole thread but I would whole heartedly recommend the Top Dog puppy obedience DVDs from Linda Brennan & Betsy Scapppicio. I know I am butchering the spelling of Betsy's surname. Anyways it's a step-by-step follow along program for competition obedience for at-home trainers like yourself. Do some googling and find it!


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