# What do you do for a punishment



## MyJaxson (Jan 5, 2010)

Jaxson has been turning worse lately...

He has been lunging while growling for my face, if i put my arm up his bites that HARD.. it hurts, he has broken skin a few times now. He wont let go with any command, I have to pry open his jaw... and this makes him bite harder. He is not posessive over his toys or bones, I can take them or play in his food without issue.

He also, after doing great with potty training has started to pee in what is his primary living space right in front of us... he even did it on his bed. 

Also, when he is playing with his chew toys, he will bring them over where I am sitting, drop them off my foot and then bite my foot like its his bone... then looks at me like OPPS i thought it was my toy.


What I have tried...


I have tried to redirect and play with him but he stops playing with his toys and bites me, or wont play at all.

I have tried time outs, but we can do 6 time outs of 30 sec each in a row and he still comes out and cont to bite or be bad.

I have tried walks, fetch (which he wont do at all... I dont think he understands it yet)

I have tried spraying my hands with that apple stuff, but as soon as its dry he is back to biting.

I tried the leash in the house to hold him down, but he wont give in and it looks like it hurts after a while.

What else can I do... I hate to see him so Violent to me and lunging at my face.

FYI he is 3 months


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## Oaklys Dad (Dec 28, 2005)

You may have tried it but a LOUD OUCH when the pup bites can work with time. It is the language his littermates and parents used with him. It does take some time. Puppy biting is a normal phase and it will pass (I promise) Hang tough. If you do a search here you will soon find out we have all been there.


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## Nicole74 (May 30, 2009)

I would start with "NILIF", Nothing in life is free. Make him work for everything. Food, petting, playing. I would also hand feed your pup until he views you as his pack leader. I've never had this problem with Bailey, so I don't know what I would do.

It looks like you need to teach him "no bite". I never allow any contact on the skin or the cats, ever. I taught this to Bailey when she was 8 weeks old. I had to be consistant, but eventually she got it.


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

A good class, loads of patience and probably a longer time out so he really has time to settle down. Thirty seconds likely isn't enough time to really settle down.


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## MyJaxson (Jan 5, 2010)

Oaklys Dad said:


> You may have tried it but a LOUD OUCH when the pup bites can work with time. It is the language his littermates and parents used with him. It does take some time. Puppy biting is a normal phase and it will pass (I promise) Hang tough. If you do a search here you will soon find out we have all been there.


I have screamed and ouched till my hearts content.. he looks at me like whatever... But thanks for the response.. I know it will get better


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## MyJaxson (Jan 5, 2010)

Nicole74 said:


> I would start with "NILIF", Nothing in life is free. Make him work for everything. Food, petting, playing. I would also hand feed your pup until he views you as his pack leader. I've never had this problem with Bailey, so I don't know what I would do.
> 
> It looks like you need to teach him "no bite". I never allow any contact on the skin or the cats, ever. I taught this to Bailey when she was 8 weeks old. I had to be consistant, but eventually she got it.


I will try to hand feed him and make him work for it... I use his supper on monday nights at puppy class... and he does great there... 

What do you mean no skin contact.. did you wear gloves? I try not to allow him to grab skin, but he has ripped all my pants that I own... and its winter so I am in long sleeves here.


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## MyJaxson (Jan 5, 2010)

FlyingQuizini said:


> A good class, loads of patience and probably a longer time out so he really has time to settle down. Thirty seconds likely isn't enough time to really settle down.


 
I was thinking 30 sec was short, but this is what the trainer said because they dont have the memory after 30sec of why they were in there, but i think he knows....


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## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

What you might do is get some of the bitter apple and put it on your hand. I know it might hurt you but let him get a good taste of it and after a couple of times, he will probably stop. The bitter apple helped us alot with his biting and chewing on things he shouldnt be chewing.


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## Mssjnnfer (Aug 9, 2009)

MyJaxson said:


> I tried the leash in the house to hold him down, but he wont give in and it looks like it hurts after a while.


What do you mean by this?


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## mdoats (Jun 7, 2007)

A couple of thoughts...

You need to remember that it takes months to train a pup, not days. I know you are very frustrated because you just posted about this a couple of days ago. Understand that it's going to take a while. There isn't a magic trick to training a pup. It takes time and consistency. 

You do need to figure out what works for your dog, but it sounds like you may be doing too many different things. You pup may just be confused. If he gets a different reaction whenever he misbehaves, he has no idea what the consequence of his action will be.

No skin means every time he puts his teeth on your skin, you turn your back on him, cross your arms and stop playing. He will continue to try to engage you in play. KEEP ignoring him. Don't react. If he moves around to your front, keep turning so that he gets your back and no eye contact from you. He will try to nip your feet. He might bark at you, etc. You need to be consistent and not engage him. As soon as he settles down, you can pet him.

The time out shouldn't be a set time. It should be however long it takes for the pup to calm down. He only comes out of the time out when he's calm. If he's still pacing around, or barking, or if he's agitated, he stays in a time out. Once he lays down and is calm, give him another minute and then let him out. He will learn that calm behavior gets what he wants... which is interaction with you.

But again, none of this is magic. You may have to do these things over and over and over again before your pup gets the message.

Just remember, you're in it for the long haul!! And when you're frustrated, keep coming back here. It's a great place to help you through all of the difficulties of training a puppy. There were many days I posted here when Rookie was driving me nuts. And we made it through puppyhood. You will too.


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## mdoats (Jun 7, 2007)

Oh... one more thing. It's not punishment for bad behavior. It's training!


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

MyJaxson said:


> I was thinking 30 sec was short, but this is what the trainer said because they dont have the memory after 30sec of why they were in there, but i think he knows....


At his age, I don't think it's so much about "think about why you're in there" as it as using it as a cooling off period so he can calm down, you can get a break, and when he comes out, he's calmer and hopefully in a better head space and can be more receptive to what you're asking for.


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## Spencer (Nov 10, 2009)

FlyingQuizini said:


> At his age, I don't think it's so much about "think about why you're in there" as it as using it as a cooling off period so he can calm down, you can get a break, and when he comes out, he's calmer and hopefully in a better head space and can be more receptive to what you're asking for.


I second this.

Also, we've had similar problems, and I really believe that many of the times our pup was over tired and over stimulated. Making the timeout longer turned into a nap, and he comes out much calmer.

I've found that on the days Barney naps a lot he behaves pretty well. On the days that he gets lets sleep for one reason or another, he turns into a monster again.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

MDoats gave you an excellent post. Try not to interpret the pup's biting as "violent" in any way or take it personally. Most pups go through this. It is normal, though intensely annoying. Try to take a benevolent attitude and see him as a pesty puppy who will grow out of this stage with a little help. I understand how aggravating those needle teeth can be, and I have a 12 week old puppy here too. Do you have a long rope toy you can walk with? Then , he can pull on that instead of your clothes/skin. I agree with the person who said to Yip and then ignore the pup for a frozen second. I really like teaching KISS KISS to pups. Copley knows this one and it is so useful. Put some peanut butter or spray cheese on your finger and let the pup lick it; when he licks, praise him and tell him KISS. Soon enough, when he's bitey, you can tell him No Bite, Kiss, kiss, and he will gentle his approach. Also, work with him on taking treats very kindly and politely bc it teaches him what you expect from his mouth control. So far, he just knows the rules his littermates and mom enforced


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

Great advice so far.

When he does bite, you can slip his lips over his teeth and then open his mouth. It works very well because they're not as likely to want to bite on their lips. I've done this many times and usually the dogs figure out quickly that me putting my hand on their muzzle is a cue to open up or stop biting.

I would bring this up at puppy class, ask the teacher for help too, they may have a better idea of what your pup is like. I just did a private lesson with two dogs, the one I was there for actually wasn't too bad, just needed some direction and a firmer correction for jumping up (little dog) and the other dog actually needed some work on quite a few things, even though they said she was 'perfect'.

Lana


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## Muddypaws (Apr 20, 2009)

I would get him enrolled into a good puppy/basic obedience class asap. He needs to learn never to put his mouth on people. A good instructor will be able to evaluate him and help you train him.


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## Luci (May 26, 2009)

Muddypaws said:


> I would get him enrolled into a good puppy/basic obedience class asap. He needs to learn never to put his mouth on people. A good instructor will be able to evaluate him and help you train him.


I believe he already is. 

What's worked for us is saying ouch REALLY loud, in a growl-y voice. Now that she's a bit bigger we can tell when she's starting to spiral out of control and get really mouthy. We've managed to teach her "gentle" and we can say this to her and she'll generally calm back down. I think we taught gentle by teaching her to gently take treats from our hands. 

Time outs are also good for you! They keep you from getting frustrated with the little piranha. The few times we've given Lucy time outs, they've lasted as long as it takes for ME to calm down.


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## Loisiana (Jul 29, 2009)

I'm actually not a fan of time outs. While it gives them a chance to calm down, I don't find them all that effective at teaching them exactly what behavior was wrong. What I do for this type of situation is firmly hold the offending body part for a few seconds. So if a dog were to scratch me with their paw, I would firmly hold that paw for a few seconds. If they're biting, I would firmly hold the muzzle for a few seconds. The point is not to hurt them, you should not be holding them hard enough to cause pain. The purpose is to draw their attention to what part of the body is misbehaving. I find this works great for barking too.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

Loisiana said:


> I'm actually not a fan of time outs. While it gives them a chance to calm down, I don't find them all that effective at teaching them exactly what behavior was wrong. What I do for this type of situation is firmly hold the offending body part for a few seconds. So if a dog were to scratch me with their paw, I would firmly hold that paw for a few seconds. If they're biting, I would firmly hold the muzzle for a few seconds. The point is not to hurt them, you should not be holding them hard enough to cause pain. The purpose is to draw their attention to what part of the body is misbehaving. I find this works great for barking too.


With Lucky all that was useless at 3 months. Each puppy is different (which is why we have so many different techniques).

I think Lucky was very immature mentally at 3 months and time out was effective to help him calm down. He was so reactive....I don't even think he knew he was biting half the time.

By the time he was 4 months he seemed to gain enough control to grasp some past training. The best type of training for him at this stage was positive....we did lots of bite inhibition training using treats. He learned "off" and "no bite" and "gentle" that way and did pretty good listening and following commands once he actually knew the commands and what I wanted.


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## MyJaxson (Jan 5, 2010)

Mssjnnfer said:


> What do you mean by this?


 I was told to keep a short leash on him when he was in the house and to step on it when he jumps up.. I did this but he still gave a leaping jump and because he was on a leash it jarred him back down


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## MyJaxson (Jan 5, 2010)

mdoats said:


> A couple of thoughts...
> 
> You need to remember that it takes months to train a pup, not days. I know you are very frustrated because you just posted about this a couple of days ago. Understand that it's going to take a while. There isn't a magic trick to training a pup. It takes time and consistency.
> 
> ...


 
Thanks, I hope I am a survivor


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## weedrea (Mar 29, 2009)

I'd second the suggestion to teach him "gentle". You're story sounds just like my pup...."gentle" really worked with him. (I used to have bite marks up and down my arms, now he's just so gentle with me)


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## lgnutah (Feb 26, 2007)

I didn't have the troubles you are describing, so can't be a lot of help, but if Brooks and I are playing around and he happens to bite me, I make a yelp like a dog would make, then make a bunch of puppy-like whines and show him the place that he hurt, until he licks the place he bit. It seems like it makes sense to him.


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## GoldenJoy (Jul 30, 2009)

Like one of the other replies here, we found that increasingly "bratty" behavior almost always meant that Joy was overtired. She would never, at 3 months, lie down on her own. We had to throw kibble into her crate, and then when she was in there, she would CRASH!

Baby gates and the crate saved our sanity during that time - use 'em!  I remember thinking, "But I want my dog to be with me! I don't want to walk away every time she bites/jumps/etc." However, 7 months later, we have a calm, lovable pup who lies down beside me and acts like the dog I always wanted!!!!!


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## Lisa_and_Willow. (Dec 18, 2007)

Yelping or saying 'ouch' to Willow when she was a bratty pup only made her worse. Any noise I made or holding her muzzle would make her crazy with excitment and she would get worse. I used time-outs for Willow because once she had got that mouthy and wild she couldn't calm herself down. 

With Diesel his mouthy phase was very short but turning my back on him worked well.


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## Ranger (Nov 11, 2009)

Ranger hadn't learned "bite inhibition" when I got him, thanks to an unsocialized beginning of being chained up and by himself til he was rescued. So I had a 9 month old with adult teeth wanting to nip me. Luckily he was usually calm and the nips/bites only happened when he was really excited or playing. You could tell he had NO idea why biting people was a bad idea; he'd never been taught that so I had to teach that before i could reprimand the action.

I used a few different techniques: I made sure he was out on long walks so he never got to the point where he was so crazy he started biting. If he did nip when playing, I immediately left the backyard and left him out there for a few minutes until he was calm. Then went out and re-engaged him in play. Repeat, repeat, repeat. Since his number one motivation is playtime and it's boring when you're by yourself, he quickly learned that nipping = me leaving = no more playtime.

Once he was better with nipping, even at his wildest playtime moments, I started getting him used to my fingers in his mouth when we were relaxing. He'd yawn, I'd stick some fingers in there and he'd move his mouth away and I'd praise. I repeated this most evenings for a few weeks and now he just calmly opens his mouth and shifts his head. 

The only times he nips now is when we haven't gone for a walk in a few days. Some dogs get destructive when that happens, he gets bitey. At this stage, he knows it's wrong so I will reprimand him with a sharp "no" and a tap under the jaw (I know some people won't agree with that, but i am not hitting him under the jaw, just tapping the offending body part). I only correct him now that he knows it's wrong. I think I would have made him fearful if I'd been "punishing" him when he first did it as he didn't know it was wrong.

Hope that helps!


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## Griffyn'sMom (Mar 22, 2007)

Oh yikes! I so remember that stage. Hang in there and try every suggestion folks have told you - one or two will work but every puppy is different. 

Griff shredded a few pieces of clothing with the jumping up and hanging thing. Oh I sooo don't miss that! 

I can tell you that once they loose those puppy teeth (within the next month) they get quite a bit better. Until they're gone they are furry pihranas!

Patience, patience, take deep breaths and if you find yourself loosing it, take a break from puppy by gating him away from you for a bit. Sometimes they are over tired and get crazy then too.


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## MyJaxson (Jan 5, 2010)

Update... I have started to use the kisses in almost everything we do..Evertime he comes over and licks me I say kisses for mommy.. and when he starts to bite me I say no bite, kisses for mommy and he has calmed a lot and most of the time with start to lick... if he doesnt i walk away.. sometimes i get peanut butter rub it allover my hands and say kisses for mommy... then PRAISE him for licking me not biting. 

I have noticed that he becomes over bearing at 8pm, so we have started to say ok bed time.. he goes ins without issue and sleeps through the night till we get up. 

Thank you everyone for your advice it all has been great and helped me (and many others I am sure) get through the OH MY WHAT TO DO stage.

Mommy likes her kisses


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