# Personality Based Training



## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Personality Based Training.....I wanted to get your feedback on this since my book coming out in 4 months focuses on this. We have all heard so many different training techniques. While many are very good techniques, what I have found is that because all dogs are different, not all techniques work with all dogs. You need to identify your dog's personality and train your dog accordingly. This is why my book is called _"What Color is Your Dog?"_ My publisher is Bow Tie Press- Kennel Club Books (Dog & Cat Fancy)

Your dog is one of 5 colors... RED.. ORANGE.. YELLOW.. GREEN.. BLUE...

I am really excited about this book, and I will be on the road starting in March to November for a 90 city book tour. 

I wanted to share with your this personality based training method in this thread. I hope you all had a great holiday!!


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

For over 25 years, my training programs have always considered that dogs are individuals, and that what works well for one dog may not work for another. All of my colleagues have always subscribed to this philosophy. It is common sense.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Now I want to know what color my dog is! How can I find out or do I have to wait until your book is published? I'll definitely be reading it.

Question ... can color change with maturity and age?


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Jo Ellen said:


> Now I want to know what color my dog is! How can I find out or do I have to wait until your book is published? I'll definitely be reading it.
> 
> Question ... can color change with maturity and age?


OK.. Here is the color chart... You can see that YELLOW is right in the middle.. MELLOW YELLOW.. 

Right next to that is ORANGE... the HIGH STRUNG DOG.... then on the outer edge is the OFF THE WALL .. RED DOG. 

On the other side we have the GREEN.. THE APPREHENSIVE DOG...and on the outer edge we have the BLUE DOG... THE EXTREMELY TIMID AND SHY DOG.

The whole point is you would never train a BLUE DOG like a RED DOG. The tools you use...your mannerisms.. for example.. the way you talk, touch, move, reward, or correct your dog are sometimes as different as night as day with an EXTREMELY RED and EXTREMELY BLUE. 

*The greatest part is as your REDS and ORANGES begin to develop control and get trained, or GREENS and BLUES begin to develop that trust, they will begin to change colors and move toward the center of the color spectrum. *

So what color is *your* dog?


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## AndyFarmer (Jul 9, 2007)

Which way is *black??!!* Ha ha just kidding! 
Libby would be blue/green (a bit shy but comes around eventually)
Beamer would be yellow-ish (sweet, sweet, sweet)
Hudson would be yellow/orange (high energy AND lovey)


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## GRZ (Dec 4, 2008)

Do the colors apply to puppies as well?


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I think Daisy is slightly to the right of mellow yellow, with a tinge of orange. And the only reason I give her the tinge is because I haven't trained her to be the best she can be :curtain:


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## GRZ (Dec 4, 2008)

Without a doubt Ziggy would be yellow/orange. When he's pooped-out he's pure yellow!

edit: wait I take back the yellow/orange. Maybe he's more yellow/green leaning more towards yellow. A little green only because he's still a learning puppy. Still pure yellow when tired.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I wonder if Joel would color our dogs the same as we do


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## GRZ (Dec 4, 2008)

LOL! That's true Jo Ellen. I suppossed we could be a *bit* biased.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

Lucky is mainly yellow but can tend toward the green.
But as a puppy.....he was the red, red with chunks of green thrown in.


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## Joanne & Asia (Jul 23, 2007)

I am looking forward to the book. I would say Asia is yellow overall. The only time I see the green and maybe a hint of blue is around some dogs she doesn't know. No orange or red in her for sure!


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Jo Ellen said:


> I think Daisy is slightly to the right of mellow yellow, with a tinge of orange. And the only reason I give her the tinge is because I haven't trained her to be the best she can be :curtain:



If your dog is MELLOW YELLOW.....lucky you!!!


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

Hootie is Mellow Yellow.... Abbie is orange red..all the way.... Maggie...for the most part is yellow-orange... and Cruiser...is yellow with some orange and red when hes playing with Abbie.


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

GRZ said:


> Do the colors apply to puppies as well?


They do.. there is whole chapter on identifying a puppy's color.... Again, just like the adult dogs, a puppy can change colors as well..


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## TinaMarie143 (Dec 11, 2008)

I couldnt tell you what color my dog is then.. he is a little of both.. all depends on if you have a ball in your hand or not... he can be shy.. timid at times.. mellow yellow also.. plus high strung when you have a ball..


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

My Goldens are gold and my Collie is sable and white. 
I tend not to appreciate gimmicks. Dogs might be different "colors" in different situations.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

I'm relieved to say, all 7 goldens past and present are in the yellow. . . Phew. Finn and Raleigh are super active outdoors, and Acadia was super-relaxed, but all are mellow,responsive, and sane.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

I agree with you Laura. Selka is always mellow yellow.
But Gunner is mostly yellow, he can be high energy(orange) but not hyper.
And he also can be anxious (green)as in storms or situations that stress him.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

Ah well, I can relate to the colors. Dogs do have a base line for their personality. I grew up with a dog that remained bright red til he died at about 11 or 12. He could have used some training...could have got him closer to that yellow area...but we were pretty ignorant at hte time. 

I had a past dog that is a good fit in the yellow orange area. He was a well-behaved, well-adjusted fellow. And one that was more in the blue/green. Had some real issues with him.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Gold. All 3 of mine. Hence the name, Golden Retriever.
(sorry, couldn't resist)





JoelSilverman said:


> So what color is *your* dog?


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I see absolutely nothing gimmicky about generalizing certain personality characteristics and associating them with colors. We do this with humans too .... have you heard of _What Color is My Parachute_?


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I hope this doesn't sound critical, but isn't that rather a "blinding flash of the obvious", especially to anyone who has owned more than one dog?




JoelSilverman said:


> Personality Based Training.....While many are very good techniques, what I have found is that because all dogs are different, not all techniques work with all dogs. You need to identify your dog's personality and train your dog accordingly.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I can see how it would be useful for new and inexperienced dog owners, or just people who enjoy their dogs but don't hang out on forums like we do.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

hotel4dogs said:


> I hope this doesn't sound critical, but isn't that rather a "blinding flash of the obvious", especially to anyone who has owned more than one dog?


Training should be commonsense and non-complicated. In my opinion, anything that isn't "obvious" shouldn't be in a training book.

I think that by breaking down the personalities and outlining different methods of training that might work best for different personalities is a great idea.

The point is that dogs are different and different dogs might need different methods. This makes sense because trainers on the opposite end of the spectrum are making money.


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

I agree Cyndi...None of my 4 trained the same.... Different methods for each one of them.


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## Abbydabbydo (Jan 31, 2007)

Abby is the total spectrum, depending on the situation. She responds to training if she feels like it, but she usually doesn't. But she is a good dog, shy and silly sometimes, but if the situation is one she is unsure of, she'll get in your face for sure.

Finn is my white dog, the squirell eater, the shadow. He adjusts to any situation and training methods. (with a sly haha, maybe I'll get a treat)

I guess my point would be, as was hinted at earlier, they change as they age, but they can exhibit many different personalities.

The one thing my dogs do best is they have a great recall. Makes it easy to take them to places where they can be off leash. That is the one thing I insist upon.

I am of course a yellow, or I would train them better . 

Laura, why don't you just ignore Joel's threads, you obviously disagree with his ideas, but we like them and would like to hear more from him.


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

JoelSilverman said:


> OK.. Here is the color chart... You can see that YELLOW is right in the middle.. MELLOW YELLOW..
> 
> Right next to that is ORANGE... the HIGH STRUNG DOG.... then on the outer edge is the OFF THE WALL .. RED DOG.
> 
> ...


Interesting theory Joel - obviously I haven't read the book and I know what you posted here you have over-simplified for response purposes. I think there are more dimensions to dog personality, training aptitude and overall behavior. My dogs according to your scale would probably bounce wildly between Yellow and Flaming red. My young dog without a job to do would be a red - he has a lot of training, gets a lot of exercise everyday which makes him act like a yellow. However, if he does not get exercise and mental stimulation for a day or two he's going to be back in the red. No amount of training is going to make a red dog yellow - you may get a red dog to act yellow but only because the dog has been managed to that point. I know a lot of OTCH/MACH dogs - typically herding breeds - who from the outside would be yellows - yet in their homes or training centers they are orbiting the room constantly - big circles around and around and around. Are they reds? The owner calls them to heel, they stop orbiting - now they are yellows?

How do various levels of drive fit into your theory? A dog with a very high pack drive might not have any training but because of his nature he might be a yellow. A dog with high prey drive? What about a dog with very low pack drive - is that a green? A Blue? 

Some dogs are never capable of becoming yellows - isn't that the nature of individuals?

Erica


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## EvanG (Apr 26, 2008)

JoelSilverman said:


> Personality Based Training.....I wanted to get your feedback on this since my book coming out in 4 months focuses on this. We have all heard so many different training techniques. While many are very good techniques, what I have found is that because all dogs are different, not all techniques work with all dogs.


Joel,

By "techniques", are you referring to specific drills/exercises, or to the general application of them? While I certainly do believe that some techniques have been proven more or less effective, I believe the overall results have at least as much to do with how they're applied. That goes to what I perceive as your notion of "Personality Based Training".

I have a system of sequential development for retrievers. This system consists of a set of drills and exercises for essential skill acquisition that are arranged in a standard order that progresses in a prescribed sequence; one leading to the next, and so on.

But, while each dog goes through the same series of drills for skill acquisition, those techniques are applied individually according to their personalities on a dog-by-dog basis. Is this on track with your premise?


JoelSilverman said:


> You need to identify your dog's personality and train your dog accordingly.


So, do you believe that the actual technique, drill or exercise should be uniquely created for each dog, or do you follow a pattern of development, tailoring the application of them to the dog's personality?

EvanG


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

I'm spending the afternoon with a Mellow Yellow (Daisy) and a GSP (definitely DARK orange LOL). I can definitely see how color-based training concepts can be useful. I wouldn't have a clue what to do with this GSP though he's smart as a whip! 

I like the concept and I can't wait to read the book, and to hear more from you on this, Joel.


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

MurphyTeller said:


> Interesting theory Joel - obviously I haven't read the book and I know what you posted here you have over-simplified for response purposes. I think there are more dimensions to dog personality, training aptitude and overall behavior. My dogs according to your scale would probably bounce wildly between Yellow and Flaming red. My young dog without a job to do would be a red - he has a lot of training, gets a lot of exercise everyday which makes him act like a yellow. However, if he does not get exercise and mental stimulation for a day or two he's going to be back in the red. No amount of training is going to make a red dog yellow - you may get a red dog to act yellow but only because the dog has been managed to that point. I know a lot of OTCH/MACH dogs - typically herding breeds - who from the outside would be yellows - yet in their homes or training centers they are orbiting the room constantly - big circles around and around and around. Are they reds? The owner calls them to heel, they stop orbiting - now they are yellows?
> 
> How do various levels of drive fit into your theory? A dog with a very high pack drive might not have any training but because of his nature he might be a yellow. A dog with high prey drive? What about a dog with very low pack drive - is that a green? A Blue?
> 
> ...


Given the fact that I have sold over a half a million dog training videos over the last 20 years, and my show has been airing for 10 years on Animal Planet.... all using this style.... I hardly think of my technique as a _theory_. But I asked for your feedback, and appreciate it.

The idea is to get your dog to move *toward* the center of the spectrum. No one said that all dogs will become YELLOW. As a matter of fact, an EXTREMELY RED Jack Russell may never be a YELLOW.. but could go ORANGE which can be a good thing.

In the book I will go into accessing the dog's color, but this will help you. Here is an example. Some people might think of a Border Collie that does agility as an ORANGE DOG, because of the prey drive and high energy. However, many Border Collies are GREEN. Many have a soft and somewhat apprehensive side which makes them GREEN. 

I wrote this in an earlier post. _The whole point of this style of training is that you would never train a BLUE DOG like a RED DOG. The tools you use...your mannerisms.. for example.. *the way you talk, touch, move, reward, or correct your dog are sometimes as different as night as day *with an EXTREMELY RED and EXTREMELY BLUE. _Border Collies are great examples.


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Jo Ellen said:


> I see absolutely nothing gimmicky about generalizing certain personality characteristics and associating them with colors. We do this with humans too .... have you heard of _What Color is My Parachute_?


That's where my publisher came up with the name..


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Abbydabbydo said:


> .
> 
> Laura, why don't you just ignore Joel's threads, you obviously disagree with his ideas, but we like them and would like to hear more from him.


Actually, I don't disagree with much of it. But it is nothing new, and something that good trainers have been practicing for many, many years, without coining phrases and presenting the ideas as innovative and new. My opinion should not have any effect on you hearing what he, or any other trainer, has to say, but I entitled to is and have the right to voice it.


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

EvanG said:


> Joel,
> 
> By "techniques", are you referring to specific drills/exercises, or to the general application of them? While I certainly do believe that some techniques have been proven more or less effective, I believe the overall results have at least as much to do with how they're applied. That goes to what I perceive as your notion of "Personality Based Training".
> 
> ...



Evan... The techniques are more about your mannerisms.. and the tools you use. It's not about drills or exercises. 

You would probably not talk to the Red Dog in the same voice as a Blue Dog. Because treats might elevate the Red Dog's personality even more, you might use only a tactile reward with a Red Dog, but primarily treats with a Green Dog. The way you pet a Blue Dog might be totally different than the way you pet a Blue Dog. The way you correct the Red Dog might be with the use of a chain collar, yet you will most likely not be using a chain collar on the Green Dog. 

I hope this helps.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

I don't think there is anything wrong with writing and selling a book. Unless of course he beat you to it! LOL I personally don't feel Joel is coining phrases or saying his methods are anything new. A person should read, read, read. Take from it what works and toss what doesn't. One doesn't have to agree with everything...


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Pointgold said:


> Actually, I don't disagree with much of it. But it is nothing new, and something that good trainers have been practicing for many, many years, without coining phrases and presenting the ideas as innovative and new.


"There is nothing new under the sun." So let's just quit writing books and holding workshops or seminars? Do you honestly not see the value in bringing old ideas to the table with a fresh perspective and continuing the dialogue?

Maybe good trainers have been using these methods for a long time ... have they written books? Have you? Knowledge and expertise is useless unless it's shared and readily available.


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## Scubasteve198 (Jun 9, 2008)

What color would I be. Tucker didn't need as much training as I did. We spent more time training me than Tucker. Do you have colors for people? I would be yellow/green. Tucker would be yellow/orange.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

My doggies are all mellow yellow IMHO. LOL Can't wait to see the new book Joel! I, for one, am a big fan!


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

vrocco1 said:


> My doggies are all mellow yellow IMHO. LOL Can't wait to see the new book Joel! I, for one, am a big fan!


Does that include all 21 puppies Vern?


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## Merlins mom (Jun 20, 2007)

Overall, Merlin is a mellow yellow, but he has his orange moments. I think by the time he hits 4-5 he'll be really mellow!


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Scubasteve198 said:


> What color would I be. Tucker didn't need as much training as I did. We spent more time training me than Tucker. Do you have colors for people? I would be yellow/green. Tucker would be yellow/orange.


That's a really fascinating concept! I would love to have a GSD someday but not sure at all that I'm the right person to own one. I think I would be yellow/green too, probably more green than yellow though. Not sure that's the right color for a GSD :


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

I think we often train from our own perspectives...doing what WE feel comfortable with, and forget about what might work best for the dog. This book could help people open up their options and focus more on what would bring best results.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Kimm said:


> I don't think there is anything wrong with writing and selling a book. Unless of course he beat you to it! LOL I personally don't feel Joel is coining phrases or saying his methods are anything new. A person should read, read, read. Take from it what works and toss what doesn't. One doesn't have to agree with everything...


I have no interest in writing a book, and prefer to work hands on with clients and their dogs, and have been happily and successfully doing so for over 25 years. 
Wanna write a book? Go for it. And one _doesn't_ have to agree with everything, but one _does_ have the right to voice their opinion.

The colors of dog training, interestingly, has been on the website for the Academy of Canine Behavior in Bothell, WA, for some time... and is copyrighted by Colleen McDaniel, owner. The concept won 1st place in 1997 in the OffLead National Writing Competition.

http://www.aocb.com/colors_full_version.htm

Here is the full pdf:
http://www.aocb.com/Image File/Colors Of Dog Training -Full.pdf

http://www.dailypuppy.com/articles/...sonality/c8fb542a-d7e0-6a5b-b622-5a5c9c85c809

http://dobermanheroes.blogspot.com/2008/04/what-color-is-my-dogs-parachute.html


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

This topic could be a very useful and interesting discussion about dog training. I'd hate to see it turn into something negative, for whatever reason, and eventually perhaps have to be closed.

Maybe we could make an effort to keep our focus and not get sidetracked. I'll do my part


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

The concept is already copyrighted. Mr. Silverman might want to look into that.


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## amy22 (May 11, 2008)

Pointgold, why dont you let us enjoy this thread.....although you are right, you are entitled to voice your opinion, but just because you are entitled does not mean you have to. I enjoy Mr Silverman's threads and if you dont, maybe you should just skip them as stated earlier. This is such a nice friendly site, Im not sure why you want to sound off like you do...Maybe you dont mean to sound like you do..but I think the tone of your posts are not what this forum is all about.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

amy22 said:


> Pointgold, why dont you let us enjoy this thread.....although you are right, you are entitled to voice your opinion, but just because you are entitled does not mean you have to. I enjoy Mr Silverman's threads and if you dont, maybe you should just skip them as stated earlier. This is such a nice friendly site, Im not sure why you want to sound off like you do...Maybe you dont mean to sound like you do..but I think the tone of your posts are not what this forum is all about.


 
As I have stated, I do not disagree with the concept of all dogs being individuals, and have based my own training classes on exactly that. I have not participated in any of his threads for some time. 
Perhaps Mr. Silverman doesn't know that The Colors of Dog Training is copyrighted, and will want to look into it further.


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Pointgold said:


> As I have stated, I do not disagree with the concept of all dogs being individuals, and have based my own training classes on exactly that. I have not participated in any of his threads for some time.
> Perhaps Mr. Silverman doesn't know that The Colors of Dog Training is copyrighted, and will want to look into it further.


You know, I really wasn't going to respond to your nonsense, but I will just so we can hopefully move on and all have some fun here.

1. The first thing is do you think that my publisher who is one of the largest publishers of pet books did not know that?
2. If you bothered to read my definitions of colors (which I am sure you didn't) you would see that my definitions are much different.
3. My book is called _What Color is Your Dog?_ not _"Colors of Dog Training" _
What is copyrighted is the name _"Colors of Dog Training" and their definitions.
_4.We have a 170 page book, and from what we see that looks like a two or three page document.
5. By the way, did you read that document? That is a huge difference from our book (from what I have so far mentioned in this thread). It is similar in ways, but it talks about the trainer also being in RED... etc.. and things like adding a color to the dog to make it another color. Mine is nothing like that.
6. Our book goes into specific detail about the way you reward, correct, talk, touch, and act around your dog. That is what our book is all about. There is nothing like that in this document.
7. We go very deep into the changing of colors as well. 

As far as differences in the definitions:


BLUE - Calm. Quiet. Relaxed.* (Mine is Shy and Timid)*

GREEN - Focused. Calm. Watchful. Alert._*(Mine is Apprehensive and afraid)*_

YELLOW - Focused, positive energy. Sunny. Happy. Excited.*(Mine is Mellow)*

ORANGE - Distracted. Out of control energy. *(Mine is out of control)*

RED - Negative energy. Fear. Aggression. *(Mine is "off the wall")*
I hope we can move on..


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## GRZ (Dec 4, 2008)

I think any book that helps the human realize that their own behaviors and body language has a HUGE part in the behavior and response of their dog is good. I know this is a whole other topic, but I am one who truly believes that there aren't any "bad dogs."

I will be interested in this book. You have an audience here Joel, for sure.


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

This is common sense that all good dog trainers and most other logical people are familiar with, and I don't like using the "red" gimmick/label to justify physical corrections when it has been proven over and over that dogs of any "color" can be trained without them. I wonder if you reversed it and called aggressive dogs "blue" would their owners be as supportive of the physical corrections you recommend?


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## GRZ (Dec 4, 2008)

I re-read the thread. I must have missed the recommendations?


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

Yeah, me too. I never saw Joel ever recommend physical corrections. I have seen him recommend corrections (not physical), but I know some trainers don't even support that.

That may work with one dog (no corrections), but I don't believe it will work with every dog. Of course, I've only owned dogs for around forty years, so what the heck do I know?


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## FranH (May 8, 2005)

Pointgold...

You may want to read this ....

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ31.html


Copyrighting is a complex issue and assumptions should not be made without knowledge.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

FranH said:


> Pointgold...
> 
> You may want to read this ....
> 
> ...


I do not claim to know the fine points of copyrighting by any stretch of the imagination. 
Mr. Silverman's concept may be just different enough from The Colors of Dog Training for there not to be any problems. The developer of that concept, and author of that literature would be better able to decide if it is an issue for her or not. The title, the use of the color spectrum and same colors, etc are so close that if Mr. Silverman and his publisher had not been aware of it before, but are now and believe it to be no problem, then that's great.
Good luck with the project.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

Pointgold said:


> The concept is already copyrighted. Mr. Silverman might want to look into that.


Hi Laura, 

I don't "think" "concepts" can be copyrighted, although the title of the book can be an issue. A fact checker should have been used if the title is an issue. I haven't red the links. I'm off for some tests and quite frankly, I'm not thinking about books at the moment.

You certainly have the ability to write a book if you'd like. You are smart, informative, upfront, and very well written. You should think about it.:uhoh:

I just read the link. I don't see where this person has written a book on the topic. Is there a book that has been copyrighted by her?


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Pointgold said:


> I do not claim to know the fine points of copyrighting by any stretch of the imagination.
> Mr. Silverman's concept may be just different enough from The Colors of Dog Training for there not to be any problems. The developer of that concept, and author of that literature would be better able to decide if it is an issue for her or not. The title, the use of the color spectrum and same colors, etc are so close that if Mr. Silverman and his publisher had not been aware of it before, but are now and believe it to be no problem, then that's great.
> *Good luck with the project.*




And we all REALLY believe you sincerely mean that.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

JoelSilverman said:


> [/i][/b]
> 
> And we all REALLY believe you sincerely mean that.


You're very welcome. What I am very sincere about is what is going to benefit dogs and their owners, so, if your book does, that's great.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

katieanddusty said:


> This is common sense that all good dog trainers and most other logical people are familiar with, and I don't like using the "red" gimmick/label to justify physical corrections when it has been proven over and over that dogs of any "color" can be trained without them. I wonder if you reversed it and called aggressive dogs "blue" would their owners be as supportive of the physical corrections you recommend?


It might have been my comment that brought yours on, as in the past I stated that physical corrections can be an option. I don't think I've seen Joel advocating what I believe though.

What I meant from my post was it is helpful to draw ourselves away from "us" because our natural reaction to a situation may seem "right" but actually may not be.

For instance when a dog is showing fear during a thunderstorm, its natural for people to react by comforting the dog. But in this instance what is natural and seems right is in fact creating more of a problem.


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## dogwalker81 (Jan 16, 2008)

So many dogs at the shelter because people have no idea how to correct problems. It would seem that they would be more willing to buy a book rather than hire a trainer (a lot less expensive). This color concept sounds like a great idea. We also use color coding at the shelter for the dogs personality to help the adopter make the appropriate choices. I am looking forward to the book and agree that anything that can help owners to keep their pets is a good thing!


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

I didn't take it to mean that red dogs should be punished. Those of us who know about dogs find it to me common sense, but many regular folks do not. They have heard something works, and so they'll try it on any dog, or completely misunderstand the dog's behavior. Punishing a dog afraid of thunder, or who has separation anxiety, is the WORST possible thing a person can do- it will make both fears infinitely worse. Comforting isn't the way either... but so many people come home, see something chewed or clawed and punish the dog. People do NOT know this stuff- just because WE do doesn't mean everyone does. Any book that can help is a good thing IMO


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## EvanG (Apr 26, 2008)

JoelSilverman said:


> Evan... The techniques are more about your mannerisms.. and the tools you use. It's not about drills or exercises.
> 
> You would probably not talk to the Red Dog in the same voice as a Blue Dog. Because treats might elevate the Red Dog's personality even more, you might use only a tactile reward with a Red Dog, but primarily treats with a Green Dog. The way you pet a Blue Dog might be totally different than the way you pet a Blue Dog. The way you correct the Red Dog might be with the use of a chain collar, yet you will most likely not be using a chain collar on the Green Dog.
> 
> I hope this helps.


Thanks, Joel. Yes, I think that is on track with my question. This isn't so much about techniques as application on an individual basis. And I agree that individually tailored application should be an identifying characteristic of any good trainer, regardless of method.

As I refer to "Method", I mean any of the well established systems (_Smartwork, Total Retriever, Carr,_ etc.) that are best known for how they progress from stage to stage, skill to skill, and the drills and exercises they espouse. In my material I make a special effort to convey to the viewer/reader that the effectiveness of any method hinges upon the quality of application, and reading each dog.

Good luck with your new project.

EvanG


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

AquaClaraCanines said:


> I didn't take it to mean that red dogs should be punished. Those of us who know about dogs find it to me common sense, but many regular folks do not. They have heard something works, and so they'll try it on any dog, or completely misunderstand the dog's behavior. Punishing a dog afraid of thunder, or who has separation anxiety, is the WORST possible thing a person can do- it will make both fears infinitely worse. Comforting isn't the way either... but so many people come home, see something chewed or clawed and punish the dog. People do NOT know this stuff- just because WE do doesn't mean everyone does. Any book that can help is a good thing IMO


Thank you!! And the people that I market to are the ones that do not see this as common sense. That really is the main point to the book. It is about understanding dogs behavior, and that all dogs are different, and some need that extra care and nurturing, while others are OK. (The sep. anxiety and thunder are excellent examples). You are so right in that so many people that have that Green or Blue Dog need to know that those cooler dogs punish themselves. I talk about it in the book. They do something wrong or have a fear, they punish themselves and shake. Those are the dogs especially that need that nurturing and that extra care. Thank you for your feedback!


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

I like the concept and I think it could be very useful for many people, especially first-time dog owners. Of course the different personality types and the need to tailor your training to an individual dog is going to seem obvious to those of us who have had dogs for years. I think many people who are new to dog ownership pick up a book by a well-known, reputable trainer and think that it's automatically going to work for them. I think this could go a long way in eliminating a lot of frustration for them and their dog. 
The only concern I would have (and I'll have to wait until I read the book to form an opinion) would be if this book makes it simple enough for the average person to correctly identify their dog's personality type. I mean, someone who's having a hard time with basic training could get into trouble and make a problem worse if they incorrectly "pigeon hole" their dog.


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

LifeOfRiley said:


> I like the concept and I think it could be very useful for many people, especially first-time dog owners. Of course the different personality types and the need to tailor your training to an individual dog is going to seem obvious to those of us who have had dogs for years. I think many people who are new to dog ownership pick up a book by a well-known, reputable trainer and think that it's automatically going to work for them. I think this could go a long way in eliminating a lot of frustration for them and their dog.
> The only concern I would have (and I'll have to wait until I read the book to form an opinion) would be if this book makes it simple enough for the average person to correctly identify their dog's personality type. I mean, someone who's having a hard time with basic training could get into trouble and make a problem worse if they incorrectly "pigeon hole" their dog.


Very true. I think what you will find when you read the book is that there are a lot of similarities in the training techniques of the cooler colored dogs like the Blues and Greens. And at the same time, there are a lot of similarities in techniques between the warmer colored dogs like the Oranges and Reds as well. I think that even for the new pet owner, I have made it is pretty easy to figure out if their dog is certainly Green or Blue.. or Orange or Red. 

Again if your dog is Yellow, that just made your training a lot easier. The techniques that are used are a little from the Orange and a little From the Green.


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

JoelSilverman said:


> I think that even for the new pet owner, I have made it is pretty easy to figure out if their dog is certainly Green or Blue.. or Orange or Red.
> 
> Again if your dog is Yellow, that just made your training a lot easier. The techniques that are used are a little from the Orange and a little From the Green.


I think it sounds good. I was actually going to edit my post to say that, in all fairness, I think new dog owners could probably get into _more_ trouble with a "one size fits all" approach. For instance, had I used Cesar Millan's techniques with either one of my current dogs, I would have completely ruined them. (My GSD, especially, would be a total mess.) So any approach that highlights the fact that not all methods are advisable with all dogs is great! 

My dogs? Yellow? Ha -I should be so lucky! Gunner is orange with a capital "O" and Riley is definitely green.


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

Once again I'm getting silly regarding a serious topic. Why do people think that the "For Dummies" series does so well. I may be mistaken, but I think even the "Dummies" books are published by many different people. Can you imagine having to have/or gather all that knowledge to have written every one of those books. Your head would explode!

Maybe you thought I was joking. But I had Sparky for 17 years and really didn't need to train her. She picked up cues on her own and was a great dog. However, when we brought Shadow into our lives, it was a few basic training tips from Joel's show that had Shadow "sit" "down" and "rolling over" within 3 days of him living with us. I then took him to A training facility and learned a bit more.


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## bwoz (Jul 12, 2007)

Mr. Silvermann, so glad to see you on this forum. I remember watching an episode of yours about a golden that was very enthusiastic when greeting. Congratulations on your book, and I'd say that my Banner was a yellow 99% of the time. When he greets people, he was off of your color chart! I agree that you have to treat each dog as an individual and what works for one, doesn't for another. I enjoyed your killer whale photos on your site. The trainer we use developed her methods after meeting a head trainer at Sea World. So those pictures were pretty neat to see! I look forward to learning more, welcome!


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

I did the same thing Kimm. I trained Selka as a young puppy (before he could start Puppy Kindergarten) watching Joel and Uncle Mattie!


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

I remember he asked in another thread how much someone can learn in such a short period of time. Well, I learned enough to think I had a pretty darn smart pup on my hands. Granted, Shadow was a pretty easy pup IMHO, but he was pretty darn reliable with the basics in a few short days. I could have read it in a book, or by listening to someone else, but in our case I didn't. 

The other important thing to remember is the size of the audience. If I learned a few basics by watching, how many others did, too? I'm sure there are a number of pet owners who cannot afford training. They can afford to feed their dog. Take their dogs to the Vet. Maybe even afford a Pet Emergency. It's nice when the television is on and someone is there is giving you tips. When you see the basics take shape so easily, it inspires some to take training to another level. It did in my case. Also, I never saw an episode where I was asked to do anything but be kind to my dog.

Granted, this is a book, but I wish you well with it Joel.


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Kimm said:


> Once again I'm getting silly regarding a serious topic. Why do people think that the "For Dummies" series does so well. I may be mistaken, but I think even the "Dummies" books are published by many different people. Can you imagine having to have/or gather all that knowledge to have written every one of those books. Your head would explode!
> 
> Maybe you thought I was joking. But I had Sparky for 17 years and really didn't need to train her. She picked up cues on her own and was a great dog. However, when we brought Shadow into our lives, it was a few basic training tips from Joel's show that had Shadow "sit" "down" and "rolling over" within 3 days of him living with us. I then took him to A training facility and learned a bit more.


Hi Kimm,

Thanks a lot by the way for the kind words. I think one of the reasons that the Dummies books have done so well is because no matter who the author is, the brand is always _putting the author on the reader's level_, and most importantly, keeping it simple. I really think that is their brand. 

One of the things that I have always focused on in my videos,TV series, and now these 9 books, is trying to get down to the level of the viewer or reader, and let them know I am just like them. I am simply sharing some things with them about dog training that I have learned along the way. 

This is why you won't see a lot technical language in my books as well. I try to use words the reader can understand. I think that is a characteristic of the Dummies books too.


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

I will say that having a dog that is mellow doesnt always mean there easy to train...My mellow dog is hardest and the longest to train out the 4. He is sooooooooo laid back and really doesnt want to be bothered.


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Maggies mom said:


> I will say that having a dog that is mellow doesnt always mean there easy to train...My mellow dog is hardest and the longest to train out the 4. He is sooooooooo laid back and really doesnt want to be bothered.


You know.... now that you say that I can see that happening with a small percentage of really Mellow Yellow dogs. My suggestion would be to move toward the Green Dog by adding some different types of motivation and fun.


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## Wilson's REAL Mom (Nov 10, 2006)

Maggies mom said:


> I will say that having a dog that is mellow doesnt always mean there easy to train...My mellow dog is hardest and the longest to train out the 4. He is sooooooooo laid back and really doesnt want to be bothered.


Ain't that the truth! I often say that Shelby could get by without much training, just because she's such a naturally sweet, mellow dog. Good thing, too, because it takes so much longer to teach her anything. "I'm a princess, and I think I'll go over here and let my nails dry."


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## bwoz (Jul 12, 2007)

Maggies mom said:


> I will say that having a dog that is mellow doesnt always mean there easy to train...My mellow dog is hardest and the longest to train out the 4. He is sooooooooo laid back and really doesnt want to be bothered.


My boys mellow, but not that mellow! : I guess that just goes to show it really does depend on the individual. I'm excited to try the heeling method that Joel has on his website, hoping it will be another way that I can show Banner just what it is I want. He's not bad when there are no distractions, but if there are people around, look out. He thinks everyone should pet him!


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

Wilson's REAL Mom said:


> Ain't that the truth! I often say that Shelby could get by without much training, just because she's such a naturally sweet, mellow dog. Good thing, too, because it takes so much longer to teach her anything. "I'm a princess, and I think I'll go over here and let my nails dry."


Hootie took almost 2 months to learn down...and he would look at me like.... um you want me to do what????? he goes strong for about 10 mins then hes done... in training class we would down him and in less than 2 mins he was snoring. when hes done ..hes done....


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

JoelSilverman said:


> Hi Kimm,
> 
> Thanks a lot by the way for the kind words. I think one of the reasons that the Dummies books have done so well is because no matter who the author is, the brand is always _putting the author on the reader's level_, and most importantly, keeping it simple. I really think that is their brand.
> 
> ...


Bingo!


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## AndyFarmer (Jul 9, 2007)

Maggies mom said:


> Hootie took almost 2 months to learn down...and he would look at me like.... um you want me to do what????? he goes strong for about 10 mins then hes done... in training class we would down him and in less than 2 mins he was snoring. when hes done ..hes done....


ROFL!!! I was waiting for you to share this story...hilarious!!! TOTAL couch-potato!


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

AndyFarmer said:


> ROFL!!! I was waiting for you to share this story...hilarious!!! TOTAL couch-potato!


Oh you need to come see Hootie Pootie... he is getting even more laided back..like an old man. Maybe the magic number is 4


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## AndyFarmer (Jul 9, 2007)

Awwww my Hoots!!!!! Love him. What do you mean the magic number is 4?


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

AndyFarmer said:


> Awwww my Hoots!!!!! Love him. What do you mean the magic number is 4?


They say they calm down by 3 or 4.... he is even spending more time lounging and snoring.


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## AndyFarmer (Jul 9, 2007)

Maggies mom said:


> They say they calm down by 3 or 4.... he is even spending more time lounging and snoring.


Well, I think you need to buy him a rocking chair then! LOL THAT would be a great picture :


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## JoelSilverman (Oct 21, 2008)

Here is the cover of the book


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## amy22 (May 11, 2008)

I like the cover!


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