# Heeling Methods - Heads Up



## FosterGolden

What heeling methods have you used to teach your dog what they call "heads up heeling"? 


I'm not concerned with prancy feet. If my dog has prancy feet while heeling with his head up, then great, and if not, that's OK, too. I just want the dog to have a very obvious focal point that is NOT my face or my left hand.


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## hotel4dogs

This isn't what you asked, but I'm feeling cranky tonight. Obedience is directly derived from field events. A dog heeling in the field with its head up would be worthless. They're supposed to be looking out. I hate the trend to heads up heeling in the obedience ring. The only thing worse is prancy feet.
Ok I'm done. Flame away.


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## Megora

If it helps, this is my ideal. 

May be called "heads up heeling" by some (including me), but this is not the same thing as the really unnatural cranked head positions that some out there are doing with dogs. I don't like to see the dogs bent over backwards with their butts dragging on the ground.

How to "train" this gets complicated, because a good CHUNK of what I had with that dog was what he naturally offered right from the time he was a puppy. 

If I start walking and he comes running at my side with his head up and heeling close to me - that's what I want + that what I praise and reward and reinforce. 

With Jacks that was pretty easy.

Bertie was HARD because he was always forging and jumping up a little and I over used treats to keep him in the game. And that put excess focus on my hand use too. 

My Jovi is a lot like Jacks. Not a forgey dog and I'm not having to lead him by the nose with food to motivate focus. Flaring is an issue, but I'll take that since he naturally wants to stay at my side with his head up similar to Jacks. To fix the flaring, we are going to be working a lot of hallway-heeling in the next month, but it's more doable than trying to work with a dog who is less glued in to me. 

With all 3 dogs, I used the same first method of teaching heeling. That's using the left hand to target where their faces need to be. That's teaching the heel position. Where the hand is placed targets how high I want their heads. And always rewarding from that spot.

And with Jovi what I hope to do differently with him than I did with Bertie - hopefully getting the hand up across the middle a lot sooner (as soon as I see he's automatically maintaining a spot at my left side) and reinforce/rewarding when he offers the same heel position with my hand being down in his face. I'm starting to do this a little. Every once in a while I'll do a "choose to heel" thing where I take speed walking away from the dogs with my hand over my stomach and typically his cute little face shows up at my left hip for me to go nuts rewarding and praising. 

So basically, I'm saying I DO use the "binding" and or "finger target" for initially training heel position. Then over time the focal point becomes the side of my body (shoulders down). In the video below - you can see where my bad habits come from while training new pups. While training heeling, I put a lot of emphasis on my shoulder/arm. It's not just my hand. And all that has to be toned all the way down. Right now I look like a teapot out there LOL.





 <= Do turn sound off. My birds are loud.


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## puddles everywhere

I have always started with focus 1st, then when you begin healing they look up at you and tune out whatever else is going on. But with Sipsy it turns out she couldn't hold position and look up at me while she walked. So we started over and focused more on the body position of heel and discouraged looking up at me. She's pretty good at heel position but her head is looking straight forward. 
In the past I have positioned my hand on my tummy and the bent elbow was a subtle cue to heel... but sips can't see this so I just let my arm hang naturally as we walk and she pays no attention to my hands. But then I would spit goodies at her when she was sitting in the correct position for fronts and stops so there was no reason to look at my hands. As long as you are working together as a team I don't think they care where the head is positioned. Good luck!


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## FosterGolden

hotel4dogs said:


> This isn't what you asked, but I'm feeling cranky tonight. Obedience is directly derived from field events. A dog heeling in the field with its head up would be worthless. They're supposed to be looking out. I hate the trend to heads up heeling in the obedience ring. The only thing worse is prancy feet.
> Ok I'm done. Flame away.



I am not looking for IPO style heeling with the butt on the ground and unnatural movement. I agree that a dog heeling in the field has his head forward, but I'm not sure how a dog can offer precision in this position? How do you get a clean left turn with a dog looking out? And, in the field, the dog is looking out because he's splitting his focus on the handler and the field. In obedience, I do not want my dog splitting his focus and attention.


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## FosterGolden

puddles everywhere said:


> I have always started with focus 1st, then when you begin healing they look up at you and tune out whatever else is going on. But with Sipsy it turns out she couldn't hold position and look up at me while she walked. So we started over and focused more on the body position of heel and discouraged looking up at me. She's pretty good at heel position but her head is looking straight forward.
> In the past I have positioned my hand on my tummy and the bent elbow was a subtle cue to heel... but sips can't see this so I just let my arm hang naturally as we walk and she pays no attention to my hands. But then I would spit goodies at her when she was sitting in the correct position for fronts and stops so there was no reason to look at my hands. As long as you are working together as a team I don't think they care where the head is positioned. Good luck!



I don't care what "they" think, I just want my dog to be focused.  I find that a focus point provides clarity to the dog. Spitting food at them can create an attraction to your face, which causes wrapping, forging, and really rough left turns.


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## Megora

FosterGolden said:


> I am not looking for IPO style heeling with the butt on the ground and unnatural movement. I agree that a dog heeling in the field has his head forward, but I'm not sure how a dog can offer precision in this position? How do you get a clean left turn with a dog looking out? And, in the field, the dog is looking out because he's splitting his focus on the handler and the field. In obedience, I do not want my dog splitting his focus and attention.


Was gonna say that if you think about there being 5 primary AKC sports -

1. Tracking
2. Conformation
3. Field
4. Agility
5. Obedience

^^^^ The fact is that 4 out of 5, it would not be practically for the dog to be offering complete focus. And of those 4 sports, you could make the point that while you want good connection between the handler and the dog, you never really want the dog looking up at the handler. 

Obedience is the one sport where if the dog is a fraction out of place (forging, lagging, flaring, crowding) - you have judges nicking points. Some judges out there (and hey, they happen to be the younger judges who will be around for a while) have very happy pencils and will nick a point every time your dog is out of position. 

I also don't completely believe obedience stems from field and needs to reflect the same practices and disciplines in that sport. I think in many cases what is commonly true around us is there's cross over from trainers/dogs from field to obedience (and the other way). :smile2: But as to the purpose and layout of the sport, maybe I'm wrong, but it was a poodle lady who started obedience. In her case she wanted to show case the abilities (intelligence, trainability, and athleticism) of her dogs and prove that they were more than just looks.


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## Megora

FosterGolden said:


> I don't care what "they" think, I just want my dog to be focused.  I find that a focus point provides clarity to the dog. Spitting food at them can create an attraction to your face, which causes wrapping, forging, and really rough left turns.


I completely agree with this. 

For heel position all rewards come from my hip. Or my left pocket (as was the case with Jacks).

I use bait in my mouth for recalls or exercises where I ABSOLUTELY want my dog watching my face. So working attention from front position (which will go into signals and other long distance direction exercises), I am either putting the food in my mouth or "pretending" it's coming from my mouth before rewarding with my pup.


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## hotel4dogs

A good heeling dog knows EXACTLY where the handler is in relationship to him, without looking at the handler at all. I understand where you're coming from, though, with the split attention.




FosterGolden said:


> I am not looking for IPO style heeling with the butt on the ground and unnatural movement. I agree that a dog heeling in the field has his head forward, but I'm not sure how a dog can offer precision in this position? How do you get a clean left turn with a dog looking out? And, in the field, the dog is looking out because he's splitting his focus on the handler and the field. In obedience, I do not want my dog splitting his focus and attention.


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## K9-Design

I train with Bridget Carlsen who is the Queen of Heeling in the sport today. Heck she's the reigning queen of obedience, period. 
I got really nice heeling with Fisher pre-Bridget but mainly because he liked to follow food around and my obedience trainer with him was a stickler for attention, and had goldens so knew how they thought. Fisher was a nice heeler. 

With the Bridget stuff there is way more to it than prancing or a head position or whatever. In fact head position and body position, feet, rear, etc are not even the major part of it. The dog falls in and develops muscle memory based on what he is most comfortable with. There are some requirements though:
1 - YOU MUST TROT ALWAYS WHILE HEELING. No walking or pacing. This includes during the slow pace.
2 - LOOKING AWAY IS A SIN. Even flicking eyes away in an advanced dog warrants a correction. MOST people out there plugging away at obedience are woefully inconsistent at correcting and encouraging their dogs to never look away, and they never ever get a dog who pays attention 100% of the time during heeling. The dog quickly learns it gets a lot of leeway.
3 - Handler with left hand at waist means we are heeling. You shouldn't have to be told. See #2.
4 - Initially in teaching heeling, the handler does all the work. When the dog is proficient in heeling THE DOG does the work, the handler doesn't have to handle very much at all. 

I have never taught a focal point. Initially while teaching heel position the dog needs to stay glued to food but once the food goes away they just naturally look up at my face, because goldens are very social and like to make eye contact with mommy. I am very cognizant of where my dog receives his reward (food or toy) during heeling. 99.9% of the time it is from behind me. I would NEVER EVER spit food or give food from my mouth. If you want a wrapping dog who puts his head down, do that. The only time I really ever reward from my right hand with the dog coming around in front of me is for right turns or about turns. 

There are a LOT of other moving parts in the Bridget way of teaching heeling but those are some important ones that anyone can apply regardless of their training method. 

I can appreciate that many many dogs title and achieve high scores and impressive accomplishments having been trained to not look at the handler. Good on them. I think it's boring as hell. I want my dogs to look like a million bucks in obedience and that means a whole lotta engagement with the handler. 

Slater (also a Master Hunter/HRCH):


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## FosterGolden

K9-Design said:


> I train with Bridget Carlsen who is the Queen of Heeling in the sport today. Heck she's the reigning queen of obedience, period.
> I got really nice heeling with Fisher pre-Bridget but mainly because he liked to follow food around and my obedience trainer with him was a stickler for attention, and had goldens so knew how they thought. Fisher was a nice heeler.
> 
> With the Bridget stuff there is way more to it than prancing or a head position or whatever. In fact head position and body position, feet, rear, etc are not even the major part of it. The dog falls in and develops muscle memory based on what he is most comfortable with. There are some requirements though:
> 1 - YOU MUST TROT ALWAYS WHILE HEELING. No walking or pacing. This includes during the slow pace.
> 2 - LOOKING AWAY IS A SIN. Even flicking eyes away in an advanced dog warrants a correction. MOST people out there plugging away at obedience are woefully inconsistent at correcting and encouraging their dogs to never look away, and they never ever get a dog who pays attention 100% of the time during heeling. The dog quickly learns it gets a lot of leeway.
> 3 - Handler with left hand at waist means we are heeling. You shouldn't have to be told. See #2.
> 4 - Initially in teaching heeling, the handler does all the work. When the dog is proficient in heeling THE DOG does the work, the handler doesn't have to handle very much at all.
> 
> I have never taught a focal point. Initially while teaching heel position the dog needs to stay glued to food but once the food goes away they just naturally look up at my face, because goldens are very social and like to make eye contact with mommy. I am very cognizant of where my dog receives his reward (food or toy) during heeling. 99.9% of the time it is from behind me. I would NEVER EVER spit food or give food from my mouth. If you want a wrapping dog who puts his head down, do that. The only time I really ever reward from my right hand with the dog coming around in front of me is for right turns or about turns.
> 
> There are a LOT of other moving parts in the Bridget way of teaching heeling but those are some important ones that anyone can apply regardless of their training method.
> 
> I can appreciate that many many dogs title and achieve high scores and impressive accomplishments having been trained to not look at the handler. Good on them. I think it's boring as hell. I want my dogs to look like a million bucks in obedience and that means a whole lotta engagement with the handler.
> 
> Slater (also a Master Hunter/HRCH):



I've always been curious about how she teaches. So, no focal point? Interesting. I know she uses IPO as a basis, as does Janice Gunn. I've seen her drive work. 


I am aware of all of the moving pieces (I mean, I don't know exactly what they are, but I know there is a lot to it, more than feet and heads) and am looking for a program so that I can teach my next dog clearly. I pieced together things I liked with my current dog, which has not resulted in what I want. Local trainers just don't teach the kind of heeling I am looking for.


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## Megora

> 2 - LOOKING AWAY IS A SIN. Even flicking eyes away in an advanced dog warrants a correction. MOST people out there plugging away at obedience are woefully inconsistent at correcting and encouraging their dogs to never look away, and they never ever get a dog who pays attention 100% of the time during heeling. The dog quickly learns it gets a lot of leeway.


^^^^ This is what I did with Bertie. Stinks because by the time I switched gears to train with somebody who was telling me what *I* was doing wrong a lot of those "go ahead and heel with head down and forward" habits stuck. And this was a dog who when we went for his CD habitually lost stupid points because he'd start his left turns on the judge's call vs staying with me. The goof was a prime candidate for doing a novice pattern completely by himself. ! 

All that want to avoid doing with Jojo. LOL.


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## K9-Design

FosterGolden said:


> I've always been curious about how she teaches. So, no focal point? Interesting. I know she uses IPO as a basis, as does Janice Gunn. I've seen her drive work.


I think Bridget does teach a focal point for tiny dogs, because they can't possibly look up at your face. But no, neither of my super good Bridget-style heeling dogs have been taught a focal point. I can look away and look straight forward while heeling not even looking at the dog and they still look up at my face. It's not eye contact necessarily. It's their job to look at me and not look away and that's that. 

Janice Gunn professes to be force/correction free so I'm not sure how IPO falls into that. Yes Bridget borrows heavily from IPO, and she has been enormously successful in IPO as well with her Mal. I went to a Janice Gunn seminar when Slater was a year old and at that time she was using the armband stick with the cheese. Slater refused to follow food or stick on food so that was a bust! Before I found Bridget Slater would slink around like a creepy border collie during heeling. 



> I am aware of all of the moving pieces (I mean, I don't know exactly what they are, but I know there is a lot to it, more than feet and heads) and am looking for a program so that I can teach my next dog clearly. I pieced together things I liked with my current dog, which has not resulted in what I want. Local trainers just don't teach the kind of heeling I am looking for.


There is a lot more to it, there are layers and layers of Bridget methods that go into it. And really I feel like I'm about 8 years behind where she is now. But I GOT THE MESSAGE on teaching heeling and feel like I'm good at getting a lot of drive and focus. I failed miserably with Slater in keeping him off my leg though. He thinks putting in a lot of effort for heeling is pushing me all over the ring. I show him in black pants to hide the drool. I've let him do it, so my bad. Bally I was more conscientious about not letting that happen, and he's not a touchy feely dog so he doesn't get dinged for bumping nearly as much  Slater would fit right in at IPO 

Do you know Kathy Klein with Jimi?


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## FosterGolden

K9-Design said:


> I think Bridget does teach a focal point for tiny dogs, because they can't possibly look up at your face. But no, neither of my super good Bridget-style heeling dogs have been taught a focal point. I can look away and look straight forward while heeling not even looking at the dog and they still look up at my face. It's not eye contact necessarily. It's their job to look at me and not look away and that's that.
> 
> Janice Gunn professes to be force/correction free so I'm not sure how IPO falls into that. Yes Bridget borrows heavily from IPO, and she has been enormously successful in IPO as well with her Mal. I went to a Janice Gunn seminar when Slater was a year old and at that time she was using the armband stick with the cheese. Slater refused to follow food or stick on food so that was a bust! Before I found Bridget Slater would slink around like a creepy border collie during heeling.
> 
> There is a lot more to it, there are layers and layers of Bridget methods that go into it. And really I feel like I'm about 8 years behind where she is now. But I GOT THE MESSAGE on teaching heeling and feel like I'm good at getting a lot of drive and focus. I failed miserably with Slater in keeping him off my leg though. He thinks putting in a lot of effort for heeling is pushing me all over the ring. I show him in black pants to hide the drool. I've let him do it, so my bad. Bally I was more conscientious about not letting that happen, and he's not a touchy feely dog so he doesn't get dinged for bumping nearly as much  Slater would fit right in at IPO
> 
> Do you know Kathy Klein with Jimi?



Interesting. I feel like most dogs would need that focal point, or at least non-Goldens (I have Labradors). 


Lots of force-free IPO folks out there these days, at least to teach heeling (not sure about the rest). Kamal Fernandez, Forrest Mickey, Shade Whitesel... The first and last both teach with Fenzi. Forrest, not sure what's he's doing these days, but at one point he was teaching force-free IPO heeling. There are a couple others I'm aware of up in WA, but don't remember their names; I don't think they are quite as well-known anyway. 


I do not know Kathy Klein.


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## AmberSunrise

K9-Design said:


> Do you know Kathy Klein with Jimi?


Jimi is from my Towhee's breeding. 2 incredible lines with amazing parents (Towhee has had limited training & showing and is a natural heads up heeling and driven worker, Titan's achievements speak for his & Michelle's talents).

That said, I do know Kathy works with other handlers and she may be worth searching out if you are looking for awesome heeling & performance.


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## AmberSunrise

hotel4dogs said:


> This isn't what you asked, but I'm feeling cranky tonight. Obedience is directly derived from field events. A dog heeling in the field with its head up would be worthless. They're supposed to be looking out. I hate the trend to heads up heeling in the obedience ring. The only thing worse is prancy feet.
> Ok I'm done. Flame away.


I tend to agree, although most of my dogs end up choosing a more relaxed style of heads up heeling, perhaps a 45 degree rather than level or cranked. Not the cranked look as I would break heeling to actively discourage that to teach my dogs that is not what I want.

If my dog chooses a more level headset that too is fine by me...

You need to decide on the look you prefer and allowing for your dog's structure & comfort, train to that by when you do & do not reward. Dogs have really good peripheral vision LOL

Good luck and have fun 

ETA: FDSA has heads up covered in Precision heeling (pocket hand) which you can adjust to where you wish the head to be.


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## FosterGolden

Sunrise said:


> ETA: FDSA has heads up covered in Precision heeling (pocket hand) which you can adjust to where you wish the head to be.



Big FDSA fan and they are super popular and well-regarded where I train. However, the pocket hand method has resulted in dogs focusing on hands in my part of the world (with experienced trainers as well) so I'm not sure if it's the method or if we are missing something. I know that Janice Gunn explains her process, step by step with the stick and cheese, and seems to work for a lot of dogs. Just a lot of "stuff" to juggle.


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## AmberSunrise

Ahh, I can see where that could happen.

I fade pocket hand very quickly and only use it as a reminder when needed.


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## Megora

This is Janice Gunn...

And based on what I'm seeing here, she's using her left arm (not just the hand, but going up the arm) as a focal point. One of the ladies I train with wants something fairly similar with her dogs - but more extended. She walks faster, her dogs are not trotting in place.

Main thing that's similar or the same to how I've been told to work my dogs is corporate play + teach rear awareness.

She's taking an online class from one of the breeders of your dog and there's a LOT of emphasis on rear awareness. From what my trainer says, it's because labs especially need to learn how to use their back ends, especially on turns.


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## K9-Design

The end-goal of the cheese-on-stick is to eventually have it attached to the armband and then just reward from food tucked behind the armband to eventually the armband being the focal point. Which OK I like that, at least the point is you always have an armband in the ring. Seriously Slater WOULD NOT look at food so I scrapped this pretty quick. He was not food motivated at all to begin with. Now he's my best eater LOL


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## Vhuynh2

My obedience trainer had us try the armband method as well and Molly would not focus on it either. However she may have already gotten used to looking at my face by then. That contraption is sitting somewhere collecting dust.


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## Titan1

K9-Design said:


> I think Bridget does teach a focal point for tiny dogs, because they can't possibly look up at your face. But no, neither of my super good Bridget-style heeling dogs have been taught a focal point. I can look away and look straight forward while heeling not even looking at the dog and they still look up at my face. It's not eye contact necessarily. It's their job to look at me and not look away and that's that.
> 
> Janice Gunn professes to be force/correction free so I'm not sure how IPO falls into that. Yes Bridget borrows heavily from IPO, and she has been enormously successful in IPO as well with her Mal. I went to a Janice Gunn seminar when Slater was a year old and at that time she was using the armband stick with the cheese. Slater refused to follow food or stick on food so that was a bust! Before I found Bridget Slater would slink around like a creepy border collie during heeling.
> 
> 
> 
> There is a lot more to it, there are layers and layers of Bridget methods that go into it. And really I feel like I'm about 8 years behind where she is now. But I GOT THE MESSAGE on teaching heeling and feel like I'm good at getting a lot of drive and focus. I failed miserably with Slater in keeping him off my leg though. He thinks putting in a lot of effort for heeling is pushing me all over the ring. I show him in black pants to hide the drool. I've let him do it, so my bad. Bally I was more conscientious about not letting that happen, and he's not a touchy feely dog so he doesn't get dinged for bumping nearly as much  Slater would fit right in at IPO
> 
> Do you know Kathy Klein with Jimi?


I might have seen them a time or two..lol


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## JDandBigAm

K9-Design said:


> I train with Bridget Carlsen who is the Queen of Heeling in the sport today. Heck she's the reigning queen of obedience, period.
> I got really nice heeling with Fisher pre-Bridget but mainly because he liked to follow food around and my obedience trainer with him was a stickler for attention, and had goldens so knew how they thought. Fisher was a nice heeler.
> 
> With the Bridget stuff there is way more to it than prancing or a head position or whatever. In fact head position and body position, feet, rear, etc are not even the major part of it. The dog falls in and develops muscle memory based on what he is most comfortable with. There are some requirements though:
> 1 - YOU MUST TROT ALWAYS WHILE HEELING. No walking or pacing. This includes during the slow pace.
> 2 - LOOKING AWAY IS A SIN. Even flicking eyes away in an advanced dog warrants a correction. MOST people out there plugging away at obedience are woefully inconsistent at correcting and encouraging their dogs to never look away, and they never ever get a dog who pays attention 100% of the time during heeling. The dog quickly learns it gets a lot of leeway.
> 3 - Handler with left hand at waist means we are heeling. You shouldn't have to be told. See #2.
> 4 - Initially in teaching heeling, the handler does all the work. When the dog is proficient in heeling THE DOG does the work, the handler doesn't have to handle very much at all.
> 
> I have never taught a focal point. Initially while teaching heel position the dog needs to stay glued to food but once the food goes away they just naturally look up at my face, because goldens are very social and like to make eye contact with mommy. I am very cognizant of where my dog receives his reward (food or toy) during heeling. 99.9% of the time it is from behind me. I would NEVER EVER spit food or give food from my mouth. If you want a wrapping dog who puts his head down, do that. The only time I really ever reward from my right hand with the dog coming around in front of me is for right turns or about turns.
> 
> There are a LOT of other moving parts in the Bridget way of teaching heeling but those are some important ones that anyone can apply regardless of their training method.
> 
> I can appreciate that many many dogs title and achieve high scores and impressive accomplishments having been trained to not look at the handler. Good on them. I think it's boring as hell. I want my dogs to look like a million bucks in obedience and that means a whole lotta engagement with the handler.
> 
> Slater (also a Master Hunter/HRCH):


Do you train with her via video training?


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## K9-Design

JDandBigAm said:


> Do you train with her via video training?


I have not done video lessons with Bridget. I've attended a number of seminars, have done private lessons and some workshops. Main thing is one of my best friends is her right-hand-man so I can talk to second-in-charge every day about dog training


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## puddles everywhere

If anyone ever gets the chance to attend one of her seminars by all means do so. It is so worth the dollars and can get a ton of info. just auditing. You have to be open to a totally new approach to training and watched so many people attending struggling with the concept of rewarding effort vs. task completion. Well it's really awesome to watch her work.


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## my4goldens

puddles everywhere said:


> If anyone ever gets the chance to attend one of her seminars by all means do so. It is so worth the dollars and can get a ton of info. just auditing. You have to be open to a totally new approach to training and watched so many people attending struggling with the concept of rewarding effort vs. task completion. Well it's really awesome to watch her work.


Our club hosted Bridget's seminars twice. I loved it. And I love watching her work. She was at our Obedience trial last weekend. It's amazing the connection she has with her dogs.


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## Jerry N Connie Walker

hotel4dogs said:


> This isn't what you asked, but I'm feeling cranky tonight. Obedience is directly derived from field events. A dog heeling in the field with its head up would be worthless. They're supposed to be looking out. I hate the trend to heads up heeling in the obedience ring. The only thing worse is prancy feet.
> Ok I'm done. Flame away.


 have you ever had a dog in obedience heel with heads up and (prancey feet?). It’s easy to hate something that in all likely Hood would be out of your realm of possibility.


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## Jerry N Connie Walker

K9-Design said:


> I train with Bridget Carlsen who is the Queen of Heeling in the sport today. Heck she's the reigning queen of obedience, period.
> I got really nice heeling with Fisher pre-Bridget but mainly because he liked to follow food around and my obedience trainer with him was a stickler for attention, and had goldens so knew how they thought. Fisher was a nice heeler.
> 
> With the Bridget stuff there is way more to it than prancing or a head position or whatever. In fact head position and body position, feet, rear, etc are not even the major part of it. The dog falls in and develops muscle memory based on what he is most comfortable with. There are some requirements though:
> 1 - YOU MUST TROT ALWAYS WHILE HEELING. No walking or pacing. This includes during the slow pace.
> 2 - LOOKING AWAY IS A SIN. Even flicking eyes away in an advanced dog warrants a correction. MOST people out there plugging away at obedience are woefully inconsistent at correcting and encouraging their dogs to never look away, and they never ever get a dog who pays attention 100% of the time during heeling. The dog quickly learns it gets a lot of leeway.
> 3 - Handler with left hand at waist means we are heeling. You shouldn't have to be told. See #2.
> 4 - Initially in teaching heeling, the handler does all the work. When the dog is proficient in heeling THE DOG does the work, the handler doesn't have to handle very much at all.
> 
> I have never taught a focal point. Initially while teaching heel position the dog needs to stay glued to food but once the food goes away they just naturally look up at my face, because goldens are very social and like to make eye contact with mommy. I am very cognizant of where my dog receives his reward (food or toy) during heeling. 99.9% of the time it is from behind me. I would NEVER EVER spit food or give food from my mouth. If you want a wrapping dog who puts his head down, do that. The only time I really ever reward from my right hand with the dog coming around in front of me is for right turns or about turns.
> 
> There are a LOT of other moving parts in the Bridget way of teaching heeling but those are some important ones that anyone can apply regardless of their training method.
> 
> I can appreciate that many many dogs title and achieve high scores and impressive accomplishments having been trained to not look at the handler. Good on them. I think it's boring as hell. I want my dogs to look like a million bucks in obedience and that means a whole lotta engagement with the handler.
> 
> Slater (also a Master Hunter/HRCH):


Go Anney Go!:grin2:


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## DevWind

K9-Design said:


> The end-goal of the cheese-on-stick is to eventually have it attached to the armband and then just reward from food tucked behind the armband to eventually the armband being the focal point. Which OK I like that, at least the point is you always have an armband in the ring. Seriously Slater WOULD NOT look at food so I scrapped this pretty quick. He was not food motivated at all to begin with. Now he's my best eater LOL


I’ve tried the armband thing. Didn’t work for mine either. Winx is not a heads up heeler. I’m just happy she stays with me now. She’s one CDX leg away from agility. Pilot does have a nice heads up heel but it still needs a little fine tuning. We’ll be back at it once he’s back to feeling normal. Especially if it ever stops raining here!


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## DevWind

Pilot’s heads up heel. He was around 15 months then. He had won a fairly large novice B class that day. We lost it for a while when his teenage brain kicked in and he’s almost got it back. Dang.....I need to find shows with photography. Screen shots from cell phone videos kinda suck.


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## DevWind

Pilot’s heads up heel. He was around 15 months then. He had won a fairly large novice B class that day. We lost it for a while when his teenage brain kicked in and he’s almost got it back. Dang.....I need to find shows with photography. Screen shots from cell phone videos kinda suck.


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## ArkansasGold

This has been a really great discussion. I used to train with a Bridget disciple in Houston and I learned SO much from her - but we were training for Rally, not Obedience. Bridget herself actually came to one of our training classes when she was in town, but I didn't realize it was her until later. 

Heeling is my biggest struggle and I would so LOVE to take a Bridget seminar.


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## DevWind

ArkansasGold said:


> This has been a really great discussion. I used to train with a Bridget disciple in Houston and I learned SO much from her - but we were training for Rally, not Obedience. Bridget herself actually came to one of our training classes when she was in town, but I didn't realize it was her until later.
> 
> Heeling is my biggest struggle and I would so LOVE to take a Bridget seminar.





I saw Bridget at NOC when it was in Ohio. She did very well. I've never had the opportunity to go to one of her seminars. I'm going to a Matthew Twitty seminar this weekend. One whole day is dedicated to heeling.


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## Megora

Revisiting this thread as it's come up again, wondering if people realize there is more than one "ideal picture" for heads up heeling. 

This video here - is Bridget.






And while this is "ideal" for a lot of people in the obedience world, I think there's a little too much hanging back by the dog. And more extreme style that I've seen - it's not that pretty to look at. 

Compare to the two runs in this video - and these are heads up heeling styles that I prefer. The GSP was a dog who I watched in classes and matches and trials and had me wanting a dog who had that ease of movement and control. <= And actually, I still am unsure if most people would say if this qualifies as heads up heeling simply because you don't have that extreme bend backwards by the dog.

And the golden is similar to Bridget's in heeling style, but not as extreme a bend. Some of that (I think) is him being shorter bodied prob.






My personal ideal heeling style - and what I am getting from my puppy is something between the two. I have a little guy who has very nice focus. He watches nonstop. And bringing his head up, you can him prancing. His first conformation show when he was 6 months old, he heeled all heads up and prancing out there. We had somebody who is also an obedience judge judging us and she was smiling big time to see him do all that. LOL. 

But with my pup - I don't want anything extreme with him. I want a picture more like the GSP, though with more of golden retriever style LOL. And I'm getting it. Stylewise, he's very much like Jacks now (first video I posted). Otherwise, the types of things I'm working on with him is making sure he knows he has a rear - meaning, I want clean and pretty turns and circles in obedience and no flaring out. 

When people say that they don't do heads up heeling or don't want to do it - I think they are referring to more of that extreme style where the dogs look like they are squatting a little behind and bent over backwards.


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## AmberSunrise

I tend to agree with Megora.

I prefer the smooth movement and lovely teamwork I see with the GSP. The level back and lack of wasted motion while heeling is my ideal.

But, and this is a huge but, it is a matter of personal preference  so bottom line is video you & your dog heeling, review the video(s) and decide how you wish to present your dog.


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## Jerry N Connie Walker

Sunrise said:


> I tend to agree with Megora.
> 
> I prefer the smooth movement and lovely teamwork I see with the GSP. The level back and lack of wasted motion while heeling is my ideal.
> 
> But, and this is a huge but, it is a matter of personal preference  so bottom line is video you & your dog heeling, review the video(s) and decide how you wish to present your dog.


No I would never want that much focus, attention precision and animation, said no one who ever had it. I can understand why some would discount that type of work, for most it would be reserved for dreams and not even a remote possibility.


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## Megora

Jerry N Connie Walker said:


> No I would never want that much focus, attention precision and animation, said no one who ever had it. I can understand why some would discount that type of work, for most it would be reserved for dreams and not even a remote possibility.


Jerry and Connie Walker (assuming this is 2 people posting here)... 

You forgot to mention the squatty butts on some of the dogs who are doing the IPO style obedience. 

All of us want focus, attention, precision, and engagement from our dogs. If you watched the 2nd video I posted here - you can view all of that there. 

Do not assume that people who do not like the extreme styles... are instead preferring dogs looking at the ground and lagging, etc. We DO want our dogs to look nice. 

You root for Anney's dogs, right? I've seen her share videos of her dogs in obedience and they are gorgeous movers. Most of us want to get that with our dogs and a lot of us do (on good days anyway).


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## Jerry N Connie Walker

Megora said:


> Jerry and Connie Walker (assuming this is 2 people posting here)...
> 
> You forgot to mention the squatty butts on some of the dogs who are doing the IPO style obedience.
> 
> All of us want focus, attention, precision, and engagement from our dogs. If you watched the 2nd video I posted here - you can view all of that there.
> 
> Do not assume that people who do not like the extreme styles... are instead preferring dogs looking at the ground and lagging, etc. We DO want our dogs to look nice.
> 
> You root for Anney's dogs, right? I've seen her share videos of her dogs in obedience and they are gorgeous movers. Most of us want to get that with our dogs and a lot of us do (on good days anyway).


 no Offence meant I am just stating the obvious that I have never see anyone have that kind of want to in their dog and try to change it. 



 Would she be better and would it take more training to make her drop her head and pace on the slow?


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## Megora

Jerry N Connie Walker said:


> Would she be better and would it take more training to make her drop her head and pace on the slow?


???? Those are two separate things. 

Personally speaking, I don't want my dogs pacing ever. But it's not the worst thing in the world if the dog is not losing points and attention is there. It's just an ugly gait. Sometimes it happens because the dog is lazy or sometimes there's other reasons. But if a dog is pacing, does not mean that dog will lose points. One of the top dogs I know (and I mean nationally top dog) - she paces all the time. And I've talked to people whose dogs pace and they reached points where they don't give a darn if the dogs are getting high scores and are reliably and quick and efficient at everything else. 

That said, I do know of people who work like your dog (lovely worker btw) who have lost points because of bumping and forging. One of my friends took her boy into the ring and did a truly beautiful run with him. Just heads up, beautiful movement, engagement, etc.... I thought it was going to be a 198 or 199 score? Ended up being 194, which wasn't a bad score to begin with but did not reflect the run. Spoke to her afterwards and heard the judge was nicking her left and right for bumping and forging. 

Dogs dropping their heads - believe me, that's the HARDEST THING TO TRAIN away. And once your dog has figured out that he doesn't need to keep his head up - he doesn't. <= And I think some people have decided that it's not worth pulling their hair out over. :laugh: Btw, my definition of dropping the head is when the dog is looking forward or away. Head angle is something people split hairs over, but whatever you do - most of us want our dogs focused on us. I'm ok if their focal point is my hip because that's keeping them in heel position and no chance of wrapping around. That said, I do like a straight line from my dog's face to mine where I'm looking down where he needs to be. Stuff like that.


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## AmberSunrise

I clearly stated it was a personal preference.

It is not discounting the work that goes into that style to not want it in your own dogs, so perhaps you should be less offensive in your response.



Jerry N Connie Walker said:


> No I would never want that much focus, attention precision and animation, said no one who ever had it. I can understand why some would discount that type of work, for most it would be reserved for dreams and not even a remote possibility.


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## Jerry N Connie Walker

Sunrise said:


> I clearly stated it was a personal preference.
> 
> It is not discounting the work that goes into that style to not want it in your own dogs, so perhaps you should be less offensive in your response.


. Don’t be so sensitive and everything won’t appear offensive


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## Jerry N Connie Walker

Megora said:


> Revisiting this thread as it's come up again, wondering if people realize there is more than one "ideal picture" for heads up heeling.
> 
> This video here - is Bridget.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And while this is "ideal" for a lot of people in the obedience world, I think there's a little too much hanging back by the dog. And more extreme style that I've seen - it's not that pretty to look at.
> 
> Compare to the two runs in this video - and these are heads up heeling styles that I prefer. The GSP was a dog who I watched in classes and matches and trials and had me wanting a dog who had that ease of movement and control. <= And actually, I still am unsure if most people would say if this qualifies as heads up heeling simply because you don't have that extreme bend backwards by the dog.
> 
> And the golden is similar to Bridget's in heeling style, but not as extreme a bend. Some of that (I think) is him being shorter bodied prob.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My personal ideal heeling style - and what I am getting from my puppy is something between the two. I have a little guy who has very nice focus. He watches nonstop. And bringing his head up, you can him prancing. His first conformation show when he was 6 months old, he heeled all heads up and prancing out there. We had somebody who is also an obedience judge judging us and she was smiling big time to see him do all that. LOL.
> 
> But with my pup - I don't want anything extreme with him. I want a picture more like the GSP, though with more of golden retriever style LOL. And I'm getting it. Stylewise, he's very much like Jacks now (first video I posted). Otherwise, the types of things I'm working on with him is making sure he knows he has a rear - meaning, I want clean and pretty turns and circles in obedience and no flaring out.
> 
> When people say that they don't do heads up heeling or don't want to do it - I think they are referring to more of that extreme style where the dogs look like they are squatting a little behind and bent over backwards.


. 

I see you have stories of the negatives of a attentive animated dog heeling with his/her head up. Bumping /forging is not exclusive to a style of heeling. I am not downing anyone’s preference for their style as the most boring dog in the world, I mean watching paint dry boring, can score high. To me that is boring to watch. The problem I have is many like yourself and others fluff off animation and the difficulty it takes to have a dog trot through a prolonged slow and back to normal. It’s not pretty, I don’t want nothing to extreme, it’s not natural, etc. as if you have the option of choosing it at will but decided not to because you don’t like it. The most likely scenario is most have no idea how to train for it how to get it,and how to maintain it. You seem to be in this category or maybe I’m wrong do you have video of you and your dog and a heeling routine maintaining a prolonged trot through a slow and back to normal? If so I would love to see it?


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## Megora

Jerry N Connie Walker said:


> .
> 
> I see you have stories of the negatives of a attentive animated dog heeling with his/her head up. Bumping /forging is not exclusive to a style of heeling. I am not downing anyone’s preference for their style as the most boring dog in the world, I mean watching paint dry boring, can score high. To me that is boring to watch. The problem I have is many like yourself and others fluff off animation and the difficulty it takes to have a dog trot through a prolonged slow and back to normal. It’s not pretty, I don’t want nothing to extreme, it’s not natural, etc. as if you have the option of choosing it at will but decided not to because you don’t like it. The most likely scenario is most have no idea how to train for it how to get it,and how to maintain it. You seem to be in this category or maybe I’m wrong do you have video of you and your dog and a heeling routine maintaining a prolonged trot through a slow and back to normal? If so I would love to see it?


Dear Jerry N Connie (is that one person after all?), I do not have a prolonged video of heeling my pup now. I wish I did - and maybe I'll ask the lady I train with if she could video us. My pup has a lovely trotting heel and I frankly LOVE what I get with him. He makes me love heelwork again. Types of things which make me excited is not having to work that hard to keep my dog's attention and keep him with me. And yes, he trots nonstop - it's a natural thing for him. As I said before, sometimes it isn't for various reasons. 

The first two obedience matches I did with him - I was kinda in tears over how showy and nice he was out there. No excess motivation work on my part. He was a total showboat - made me very proud. It's what I had with my Jacks and I thought that was all gone when I lost him last fall. 

With Bertie - his best/strongest points are "doing things" - like jumps, retrieves, articles, etc... plus him being very mentally sound as far as being around big crowds and noise. Heeling is tough because it's boring for him. I can motivate him into higher gear, but it's a lot of work and I'll be honest a year or so ago I mentally reached a point where I have accepted that he's not like Jacks. So needless to say, when my pup started showing signs of being like Jacks - made me SO HAPPY. LOL.

The way I train for it would be back when he was a puppy, I started shaping what I wanted. The person I train with used a variety of training methods from Bridget to the guy in video I posted to a variety of other people in the sport. But a mix, so it's not the extreme bent back and squatty butt style. I love watching her dogs work and the biggest reason why I train with her - is because I wanted to learn from her. 

Regardless, do not assume there's just one way of training heads up heeling. And what I said in my previous post is people have different opinions of what's "heads up heeling" or what they prefer along those lines. 

And please don't assume stupid things about people who you have chosen to disagree with. :laugh: 

I find that there are people in obedience who like to think everything is black and white. And it's not. Lots of people in the sport have a variety of takes on everything, big tool boxes, and different ideals. Sit ringside many hours watching people work, and you will see that too. Biggest problem with obedience people sometimes is they watch themselves and sometimes they watch their friends, but skip everyone else. I actually think that's one of the biggest problems in the sport. I'll never forget being at a trial with my Jacks years ago and ABSOLUTELY having all the top people in obedience watching us, but that was primarily because my dog was putting in a nearly 200 performance. By the time we got to stays, we'd only lost 1/2 a point because of a shifting foot on stand for exam. There were people stuck waiting and watching because a HIT for them/a friend was at stake....But I'm going off on a tangent. 

I DO KNOW of people griping about heads up heeling. And it's everything heads up for them - not just the extreme displays. And yes, I do agree with you - some of these people are those who have dogs who will walk like hound dogs no matter what. Maintaining focus for more than a couple steps is very hard. So these people adapt to what their dogs offer. As long as their dog maintains heel position, it's fine. <= Some people out there KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THEY DID WRONG IN TRAINING (LOL), but others rather than accept that their training methods were inefficient, will instead charge that everyone else is doing it wrong. <= Believe me, I've seen those posts on FB. I don't believe anyone here is among that company.


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## AmberSunrise

Wow -- that is some response. 

You come onboard and immediately start attacking any method of heeling other than your style as boring, like watching paint dry, saying others simply do not have the capacity to train their dogs and then hide behind my reaction as being too sensitive? 

Basically you should not have any problem with how other dogs heel -- it is not your business, not your concern. Look in the mirror or video to see where your points are being lost. 

If you are bored watching other teams heel, don't watch. You do you, and let others do themselves.

ETA: your style is not unique and there are several masters using this style and indeed have created your style. Emulate their footwork, setup style and various other factors that make them such a pleasure to watch -- they are true professionals. Their smooth handling between exercises, their focus on their dogs and presentation -- these are what makes thie performances such a pleasure to watch.





Jerry N Connie Walker said:


> . Don’t be so sensitive and everything won’t appear offensive
> .......
> .....
> 
> I am not downing anyone’s preference for their style as the most boring dog in the world, I mean watching paint dry boring, can score high. To me that is boring to watch. The problem I have is many like yourself and others fluff off animation and the difficulty it takes to have a dog trot through a prolonged slow and back to normal. It’s not pretty, I don’t want nothing to extreme, it’s not natural, etc. as if you have the option of choosing it at will but decided not to because you don’t like it.


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## Jerry N Connie Walker

ETA: your style is not unique and there are several masters using this style and indeed have created your style. Emulate their footwork, setup style and various other factors that make them such a pleasure to watch -- they are true professionals. Their smooth handling between exercises, their focus on their dogs and presentation -- these are what makes thie performances such a pleasure to watch

I don't have to emulate anyone. I created my own style no classes and no excuses. I posted a video proving I can do it and with a nontraditional breed to boot. Then there is you from the peanut gallery. Not wise to give advice about a skill you don't process. Kind of like myself attempting to give you advice about agility. Sure I could throw some names around In a attempt to look intelligent but kind of silly because I have minimal knowledge on the subject.


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## Megora

@Sunrise - I'm laughing over here. That's all you gotta do is just laugh when the crazies pop out of the woodwork.


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## gdgli

Just a gentle reminder, there are topics that lead to heated discussion. There are several opinions on any subject. We can learn from debate but we must remember to keep it respectful and maybe tone down some of our responses. 



So why not ease up and remember to be respectful?


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## AmberSunrise

Megora said:


> @Sunrise - I'm laughing over here. That's all you gotta do is just laugh when the crazies pop out of the woodwork.


LOL

Yes you are right, thank you for the reminder. 


To the Jerry n Connie Walker team/person ... As an FYI, I am primarily an obedience person and while I have never gone after an OTCh (I simply don't care enough about fronts & finishes) my dogs do have HITs and HCs. This with multiple dogs playing in multiple sports and limited showing. I have been showing in obedience since the 1980s so generally know a little something about obedience, which does require a mentor and videotaping to excel. This is actually helpful advise and is offered as such.


Yes, I do agility, yes I do rally and have even tried my hand with hunt tests (definitely not my sport but I promised my Faelan's breeder and I keep my word), but I keep coming back to obedience. I currently train and show 5 dogs, work full time, am a home owner etc. I choose my mentors carefully, I video, I submit videos for review etc. I work with mentors in person and online. And ... this is with 2 of my girls being intact and having litters  That takes some creativity since with 3 males, I do not house my co-owned girls here when in season, in whelp or raising their puppies, so they can essentially lose months at a time from training and showing.


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## Megora

^^^^ And Sharon is doing something that a lot of us (speaking for myself) find VERY VERY VERY difficult! That's training and competing with multiple-multiple dogs. And not just stalling in training, but she's putting titles on her dogs.  

With me, I'm going nuts trying to polish and set in stone the difficult areas standing between my Bert and a CDX - namely drops and position changes. That's difficult when you have a second dog who is screaming holy murder over being left out - and he comes flying out of nowhere to do his best drops and position changes directly in front of his dad and kinda messing everything up.... :|


Heeling - as I said, I have people who I watch + have a good idea what I want when working with my dogs. There's that familiar sight picture and feel which is just right - and when you get it without any overt motivating, it's the best thing.  So that's heeling. Position changes on the other hand - yikes. 

Watching Mr-Mrs-Walker's video - that was the area where I was SO ENVIOUS. >.< Very clean position changes. No points lost there. Forget heeling - that's such a huge deal! Not just for open, but utility too!

I wish that person were not so rude about whatever point he was trying to make, because he had such a clean working dog. It's along the lines that I would probably be sitting there ringside and smiling to see that dog work. And not just sitting or standing there glazing over (which yeah happens sometimes too - it's happened _inside _the conformation ring too to my embarrassment)....

Quite honestly, when people are obnoxious - it's easier to dismiss what they accomplish with their dogs. I don't think that's fair to the dogs - especially when they are clearly very nice working dogs like in the video. 

GSP's - there's at least 2-3 trainers around here who I really enjoy watching, including the person in the video I posted (who is tops in everything in the breed - CH/OTCH/MACH/MH, etc). It's a decent obedience breed. They will do everything for their owners - I've seen it.


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## ArkansasGold

Since I originally posted on this thread to learn, I’d like for it get back on the training heeling topic. 

This week I started heavily rewarding attention/eye contact during short heeling spurts and just being stationary. Any look away is verbally corrected. The goal is to establish the “looking away is a sin” rule but also keep him wanting to look at me. (I mean he’s a Golden momma’s boy, so...) Rewards come from behind to keep the sits straight. I am so horrible about accidentally rewarding/causing crooked sits. 

I think Rocket needs to learn that he can look at me and not run into anything and that where we are going is need-to-know information. And he does not need to know. Lol I like the results I’ve gotten so far. He offers a nice happy gait that I like with his tail swishing from side to side showing off his beautiful tail feathers and white pantaloons. ?


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## Ljilly28

I am one who likes the Denise Fenzi method. I am not ambitious in obedience, but I do enjoy it and my dogs excel in heads up heeling. Over the years , I have done 11 CDs with my own and clients dogs, and countless Rally titles to RAE. It should feel like ballroom dancing; it should feel connected. I like Janice Gunn also on heeling and admire Bridget C's work. In my area, I object deeply to the Puppy Purse device , and how it affects the dog's mechanics and spirit. The more punishment / correction used to train a puppy in my opinion, the less skilled the trainer .


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## AmberSunrise

ArkansasGold said:


> Since I originally posted on this thread to learn, I’d like for it get back on the training heeling topic.
> 
> This week I started heavily rewarding attention/eye contact during short heeling spurts and just being stationary. Any look away is verbally corrected. The goal is to establish the “looking away is a sin” rule but also keep him wanting to look at me. (I mean he’s a Golden momma’s boy, so...) Rewards come from behind to keep the sits straight. I am so horrible about accidentally rewarding/causing crooked sits.
> 
> I think Rocket needs to learn that he can look at me and not run into anything and that where we are going is need-to-know information. And he does not need to know. Lol I like the results I’ve gotten so far. He offers a nice happy gait that I like with his tail swishing from side to side showing off his beautiful tail feathers and white pantaloons. ?



I do not verbally correct until much further in training  I actually use a reset mostly, where I stop interacting or even disengage completely if my dog looks away. Sometimes stepping back to really drive home the point that looking away results in my disengaging too, I might even step back and turn my back. They look away and they have forfeited their treat or game for that segment. If it goes on long enough (more than a few seconds) they are brought back inside, or crated if I am at a rental, and another dog takes their turn - I simply won't work a disengaged dog  



Once my dog starts engaging on his or her own 80-90% of the time, a verbal is introduced -- 'oops, what were you thinking?, where were you etc I also use this weird facial thing where my face kind of forms a horrified expression while my hands go up to my cheeks and I gasp -- I never really planned this but my friends all know I will indeed do this LOL 



Dogs have very good peripheral vision, so he does know where he is going -- but with goldens their noses can get them in trouble LOL As Rocket learns your consistent handling cues (the eye movement for upcoming turns, changes of paces, the slight shoulder and hip cues going into a turn etc) he will start becoming more and more attentive -- I personally love to frequently break out to a diversion while heeling as well so he never knows what I'll do next -- a spin, a circle, a high nose boop, a jump in heel position for a shoulder high treat, a send to a jump or cone (in my case I also use sends to teeters, weave poles etc). I sometimes also toss a ball as we are exiting an about turn with a release -- this also becomes a proof as they become advanced since if I toss a ball and don't release they are expected to maintain heel position until released - and they might not be released.


Have fun with heeling, it truly is the dance of obedience 




ETA: I did not read the entire thread to see if you are among the 'have to' or 'want to' group of dog trainers. The tips listed above are from my 'want to' perspective and I honestly rarely have a leash on my dogs while training. If you are among the 'have to' group the above games and such might not be applicable or fit into your training style. But in either case, you build head position slowly and then drive to maintain head & heel position. 



Some areas to pay close attention to are your body mechanics -- practice without your dog. Can you walk a straight line? Is your Figure 8 shaped like 2 ice cream cones? Are your about turns smooth with no discernible pause? Are your transitions smooth? Do you maintain a smooth cadence (metronomes help with this -- a good starting cadence would be 132 to 134) If any of these factors are not smooth & practiced your dog may drop his head as he tries to figure out what is next -- does he continue or does he stop. Does he maintain his pace or need to speed up or down. Sounds silly I know, but I cannot tell you haw many hours I have practiced and how many sessions my trainers have spent working me without a dog -- one even has me put a small toy at the end of a small leash in heel position and start heeling -- the toy cannot swing or I need to stop and we evaluate what part of my movement is twitchy -- my hands, my footsteps? and then we start again. Another trainer had me walk in fields, drop a quarter, return and then need to go back and get that quarter -- this talk me how to navigate in a straight line by choosing 2 distant objects to line up to. We are at least half of our dogs issues when it comes to heeling in a smooth & beautiful way  If your dog is unclear of what is expected, that head will drop.


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## ArkansasGold

Thank you Sharon and Jill! I don’t consider him to be at the beginning of his training, we have been working on this for a few years now. However, that 5 QQQ weekend back in April did some damage I think. It was too much and there was one set of nested courses that had so many sits that we couldn’t get in a rhythm and he just disconnected. And by disconnected I mean that our scores were low 90s instead of high 90s. So I’m trying to step back and get the attention that I had before then. I definitely will not do that many runs in one weekend again. It was grueling for both of us. 

The reason I’m trying out the verbal correction (it’s just “uh uh” when he looks away) is because he responds well to that type of communication. He gets many many more rewards than corrections, but it’s just a thing I’m testing. I also do play games like you suggested Sharon - and the spins are actual signs in Master anyway - just to make it more fun for him. I mix it up between tugging/retrieving and food for rewards. I think I’m sorta in both camps if that’s possible. ETA: I rarely train with a leash either, so I can I’m more of a “want to” person. 

Right now, I’m less worried about a perfect sustained heel than I am about getting the attention back since Rally requires absolute attention all the time to get those high scores in Master, but I like to see more of an Obedience heel in Rally anyway. There are some teams that look absolutely beautiful out there seamlessly going through the courses as one (my former trainers in Houston were like that) and I would like us to consistently look like that. 

As for the footwork, I’d like to think my years playing multiple sports has given me good footwork, but that is definitely something to look at when troubleshooting. I know I often walk too slow during actual runs and I primarily work on my own footwork during run throughs. I have to adjust my stride length sometimes and make approach adjustments to certain signs, etc. 

Anyway, I really really appreciate your thoughtful responses. I’m always up for adding new tools to the toolbox.


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