# More hunt test rule questions



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I'm re-reading the rule book (mine is a bit old, but I think these are still current rules) and I have a couple of questions.

Under "Serious Handler Faults" which justify elimination from the stake, it says,
"...Talking to the Working Dog
The handler must remain silent from the time the handler signals for the first bird to be thrown until the judges release the dog..."

What about in the situation of a controlled break? Are you allowed to say "heel" or "here" without being eliminated? 


Secondly, it says,
"...Carrying exposed training equipment (except whistle)..."

What about a duck call that's on your lanyard? Does that need to be removed prior to the test?

Thanks!!!


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## Swampcollie (Sep 6, 2007)

In AKC Tests you won't need the call.

If the dog starts to go and you have to stop him yell "SIT". The judges will tell you to re-heel your dog if it's necessary. You can create some confusion with the judges about your intentions if you yell "HEEL" rather than sit. Some judges may take that as you're picking up the dog.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

You are allowed a controlled break in senior. I would not think the judges could "guess" your intentions based on a word you use to control your dog -- personally I would purposefully NOT use the word SIT if my dog tried to break as his name starts with an S -- I would say here. I shouldn't be judged on what word I use. Having said that do not assume a controlled break is a freebee in senior -- don't give the judges more to judge


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

ok, so I interpret this to mean that even though I can be eliminated for speaking to the dog, there's an exclusion to that rule for a controlled break?


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

In senior, yes. If you speak to them at all from the time you signal you are ready until the judge releases you it will be considered a controlled break, even if the dog doesn't move a muscle. While it won't get you immediately dropped in senior it will significantly impact your trainability score.


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## Swampcollie (Sep 6, 2007)

K9-Design said:


> In senior, yes. If you speak to them at all from the time you signal you are ready until the judge releases you it will be considered a controlled break, even if the dog doesn't move a muscle. While it won't get you immediately dropped in senior it will significantly impact your trainability score.


Well, not exactly. 

The intent if the rule is you're not supposed to speak after you've signaled your ready and a single word or whistle on a controlled break may cost you some points. On the other hand if you start carrying on a conversation with the dog on the line in Senior after you've signaled you're ready, you're likely going to be dropped even if the dog didn't so much as twitch.


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

Only exclusion is if the dog breaks and you say Sit and reheel your dog. Talking to the dog after signaling for the bird around here will get you dropped. That is not a controlled break. In my opinion it is a violation of the rules
Visible training aids is a leash for example visible to the dog and more importantly the judges.


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

As everyone else has said, the no talking rule is intended to stop incessant chattter on the line when the dog is supposed to be marking, so that the dog actually has to mark and the handler cannot be helping them pick out the birds by calling them around or giving cues like "Good, right there". A quick command to keep movement a controlled break is allowed--so long as the dog is quickly and quietly brought under control. But the dog does need to respond quickly, without intimidation from the handler, and if it happens on honour, it must not interfere with the working dog. One of my friends had to go all the way to a CKC hearing because she and her co-judge dropped a dog in JUNIOR whose idiot owner had decided to show off and run off lead. The dog broke on a water mark and was over halfway to the pond with said idiot hollering "NO! HERE!" very loudly and repeatedly. He seemed to think that because he eventually got the dog back it was a controlled break. The onsite committee agreed with the judges when he filed a complaint there, and moron still wasted her time filing with the CKC and making them all go to a hearing. Where he also lost.

Duck call is fine. And if I am judging, or some of the MI folks I know, you may well be asked to use one. Generally if you are going to need one it will be stated in the handlers briefing. Even if you don't and it is on your lanyard you are not going to be punished for having it. As Radarsdad stated, what we don't want to see is your leash, or anything that looks like an ecollar transmitter, or heeling stick, etc.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Thanks Shelly. Sorry for all these stupid questions, but I don't want my dog to be dropped for a really dumb error on my part!


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