# Help me understand this odd new snarl behavior...



## tine434 (Nov 24, 2013)

So, I post this video to show you Red's new face he likes to make. It started as every once in a while, but now he does it more often. The first year I had him I never seen him make this face. Ok, this video he is giving signs... Turning his body to the side, avoiding, etc. Cut and dry that he is uncomfortable right? Not exactly.... He does this when he hasn't seen us in a while and we call him, tail wagging so hard he can barely keep still, he will run at us with this face. He loves my nieces who come around and when he first sees them he does this face as he's trying to get them to love on him. In those cases there are no other distress signals, his body language screams excited. So while in this case I would say it is a warning sign maybe, in those cases surely it would not be cause he is obvioisly happy. Think of your pup greeting you at the door with their typical crazy excoted self, but that face. He also does the face at certain smells. You know the vet ear solution? If he smells it he makes the face. This is a mint teeth spray I have, as you see at the end of the video he licks it, he actually LOVES the stuff. I spray my hand and he wants to lick it, and often he will stick his tongue out and lick at the spray too. So what is this behavior? What does it mean? And why does he do it in different cases like that? Any ideas?

July 22, 2015: https://youtu.be/HhSXdyt7hY8


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## tine434 (Nov 24, 2013)

P.S. my only guess is maybe just he does that to any high stimulation? Good or not good...?


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## Anon-2130948gsoni (Apr 12, 2014)

It looks like he's conflicted...like there's something he really wants but thinks he's not supposed to go after?


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

That doesn't look like anything worrisome. Chloe does that when you tell her no and she talks back. Always when she is plying or when your playing and she starts to jump up and bite your arms and you tell her off. She is younger at almost seven months.


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

Noreaster said:


> It looks like he's conflicted...like there's something he really wants but thinks he's not supposed to go after?


This is actually why Chloe does it. My parents will tell her off when she jumps up on me and starts biting. She then will sit down on my lap and look at them and bark a couple times with that snarl. It's nothing vicious. It's actually kind of funny. Usually they will then grab her collar and tell her off.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

He's smiling. It's usually excitement related, or an appeasement expression. Not an aggressive expression.


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## goldy1 (Aug 5, 2012)

tine434 said:


> So, I post this video to show you Red's new face he likes to make. It started as every once in a while, but now he does it more often. ..... ... ... ... . So what is this behavior? What does it mean? And why does he do it in different cases like that? Any ideas?
> 
> July 22, 2015: https://youtu.be/HhSXdyt7hY8


I agree with Noreaster - definitely conflicted at some level. Red either dislikes or is uncomfortable with something about the situation. Your video was a great idea. Could be he likes the taste bit not the smell. Or likes the smell but not the spray. Or it could be that his love of pleasing you conflicts with something he thinks is about to happen. You can see he has that sweet Golden desire to do what is asked. Even his tail wag is a little nervous in the video. Like when people have a nervous laugh vs. a hearty carefree laugh. 
You mentioned the mint. Could be it has something like the effect catnip (in the mint family) has on cats - but in a milder form. 
If you can jot down each time he exhibits this behavior, you may see a pattern which will give you a clue.

Realizing you needed to trigger the behavior in order to make the video, I would normally try to redirect Red's attention if he starts to do this. Either by putting the triggering item out of sight or ignoring Red until his excitement level goes down. High excitement isn't such a good thing. You've probably seen the T-shirts that say "its all fun and games until somebody ends up in a cone". 

Very interesting - I hope others weigh in on this!


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## tine434 (Nov 24, 2013)

goldy1 said:


> I agree with Noreaster - definitely conflicted at some level. Red either dislikes or is uncomfortable with something about the situation. Your video was a great idea. Could be he likes the taste bit not the smell. Or likes the smell but not the spray. Or it could be that his love of pleasing you conflicts with something he thinks is about to happen. You can see he has that sweet Golden desire to do what is asked. Even his tail wag is a little nervous in the video. Like when people have a nervous laugh vs. a hearty carefree laugh.
> You mentioned the mint. Could be it has something like the effect catnip (in the mint family) has on cats - but in a milder form.
> If you can jot down each time he exhibits this behavior, you may see a pattern which will give you a clue.
> 
> ...


See, I could have caught this same reaction (although without any hesitation or nervousness) on video without pulling out the spray, but we had all been home for a while. Which I will admit, he doesn't do it EVERYTIME he sees us, buy I'd say a good bit of the time. Especially if we call him to us after he's been waiting or wanting us to pet him (they don't immediately get attention when I walk in cause they're WAY too hyper they'll jump and go crazy lol.

Thanks for all the opinions... It really has had me perplexed cause I see it both when he seems hesitant and when he seems completely happy.

We call it his smile cause originally it started when he was happy to see us, but I know sometimes it is when he is more nervous or unsure because now he does it those times also.


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## tine434 (Nov 24, 2013)

P.S. another situation is when kids come over. I have very well behaved nieces and nephews. We teach them not to touch animals when they eat, being gentle, not to crowd an animal, let the animal approach you, etc. They will sit on the couch and I will let Red and Rem out of their beds. Rem runs up like a wild man with excitement lol. Red will do his face (as seen in the video), wag his tail, and trot to them. Once he arrives, face still in tact, he will sit and ask for his chest rubs. He will sit for HOURS. He will go and lay his head in their lap and fall to sleep with their pets. He really loves them, and loves sleeping in their lap or just sitting for pets. He will walk up and check on them periodically when they're here. But again, that face, at first the kids were scared to death of him because of it. And he does it the first time he sees them every time they visit almost. 

I know most people have said they don't think it is anything worrisome. Just wanted to throw that situation out there. Since its dealing with kids it's always had me a little more worried than if he does it to me


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## Anon-2130948gsoni (Apr 12, 2014)

It could definitely be a submissive or appeasement grin...particularly when first greeting you or the children. My Aussie looks like a lunatic when we first let her out of her crate...but the key is that her whole body is wiggling from side to side, even though all her teeth are showing!


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## tine434 (Nov 24, 2013)

Noreaster said:


> It could definitely be a submissive or appeasement grin...particularly when first greeting you or the children. My Aussie looks like a lunatic when we first let her out of her crate...but the key is that her whole body is wiggling from side to side, even though all her teeth are showing!


Hmmm, that is interesting.... Any idea or guess why it would have started recently (past few months) but not prior?


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## Anon-2130948gsoni (Apr 12, 2014)

Lots of change in your world..and you really haven't had him that long. I would suspect that now that everything has settled down you have more time and energy to devote to their training and setting boundaries and as the three dogs spend more time together, their roles evolve.

And maybe it works? Goldens are genius at figuring out whatever behavior gets them the most attention!


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## fostermom (Sep 6, 2007)

I would have said it was a smile, too, at first. But then I see the freezing and staring, which isn't an appeasement behavior. I agree with conflicted.


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## Rundlemtn (Jan 16, 2015)

This reminds me a lot of the dalmatian smile. Google it. It can look quite ferocious, but its well known among this breed. I don't think it is quite as common with golden retrievers, but some do it too. Found this video on youtube of a golden retriever smiling https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOGk-u_Lx9Q


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## Jessie'sGirl (Aug 30, 2010)

It looks similar to something Jess does when he not sure what I'm going to do. He does this funny little lip curl thing, only no teeth are showing. For instance, after our morning walk I often sit outside and read the paper. Jess will only stay outside for a few minutes if no one is out with him or he can't see me in the kitchen. Sometimes I'm inside getting something and he's doing that, it's almost like he's thinking" I wonder if she's coming out".


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## tine434 (Nov 24, 2013)

I like reading everyone's opinions on it.... Thanks. I kinda agree with the.... You'd think it's a smile but when he also does it along with the warning signals it's like hmmm..... I'm not sure what to DO about it if anything


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## Katduf (Mar 10, 2013)

Mine both make this face. Stormy does it when she sees birds that are very close. They both do it to initiate a high energy game with each other. Both instances are excitement related, and bursts of energy also follow the making of the faces.


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## tine434 (Nov 24, 2013)

Katduf said:


> Mine both make this face. Stormy does it when she sees birds that are very close. They both do it to initiate a high energy game with each other. Both instances are excitement related, and bursts of energy also follow the making of the faces.


Yup, Red does it when he is excited also.... Either with something he doesn't like so much (or is unsure of) or with the cases like when we arrive home. Both typically involve something stimulating him. Oddly enough, I've never seen him do it when playing with Rem, but he doesn't initiate play with Rem as much anymore so that may be some of the reason


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Reply*

Tine: He sure is a beautiful boy! I would be careful and not let him lick that mint spray. There very well might be something in it that is toxic to dogs.

Our Smooch used to and our Tucker does make this face occasionally, and I always assumed it's a BAD SMILE. I always thought they are trying to be coy and playful! It looks from your video, that he doesn't like whatever is in that bottle!


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

I would say it is conflicted and appeasement behavior combined and personally would address it. Not because I think it is a bad behavior or will lead to anything nasty, but because your dog looks very uncomfortable to me. The spray bottle also looks to be causing him angst - he may lick your hand in an appeasement gesture.

How to address it?

First get rid of that spray bottle - he is reacting strongly to it! And has no escape route since you are calling him back.

I would start by not facing him directly (full face). This can be a very intimidating stance to dogs. Call him in and offer food or a toy he does love without making eye contact and simply giving it to him.

Teach him to play with balls, tugs, and move towards body play.

Maybe give him a chewy or a toy that he can carry around when he is approaching you.


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## tine434 (Nov 24, 2013)

Sunrise said:


> I would say it is conflicted and appeasement behavior combined and personally would address it. Not because I think it is a bad behavior or will lead to anything nasty, but because your dog looks very uncomfortable to me. The spray bottle also looks to be causing him angst - he may lick your hand in an appeasement gesture.
> 
> How to address it?
> 
> ...


I want to just reiterate.... I only used this spray bottle to show the face we have seen in other situations. It is not something used regularly. I would not use this with Red as it makes him uncomfortable, it was simply to show the face we see often. And I was calling him only to get a better shot of his face as the camera was moving. I just noticed he reacted to the bottle and it was a good time to film so I could show and ask questions.

Also, he does love to play with toys. He used to ALWAYS have a toy when he greeted me but with two dogs, the other would always want to steal his toy and I had to remove toys from around the home and only use play time. But he did use to love bringing us toys when we got home.

As far as approaching us.... He has no issue at all approaching us and is not hesitant to approach any person at all. When he makes the face at those times his whole body is wagging with joy, no hesitation. The hesitation seen in this video he only made with this bottle and when he smells certain things.


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## Tricia (Jul 30, 2013)

Interesting to see the video and hear the comments. This is the face that Charlie shows to only one person. She loves this person and they only have to say to her, smile, and she produces this expression.


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