# Struggling beyond frustrated



## JayBen (Aug 30, 2012)

At 4 months old you can't expect the world out of him. They do bite and behave like a squirrel on a leash. How are you correcting him when he's biting you? Have you tried yelping like a puppy would do? How much exercise is he getting daily? 
Our Lucy was very independent. She wasn't a velcro dog at all. She's a year old now. I feel training together has really helped with her being so independent. She is much more attached to me new. As far as the dog climbing on you though like your saying...I wouldn't think much of it. Don't give up on your dog.


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## Tayla's Mom (Apr 20, 2012)

You have the clone of my Tayla. None of our Golden friends beloved us when we told them how she was. They just assumed we didn't know what normal puppy behavior was like. Until I showed them one day the bruises and bites that came from walking her. You can read my prior posts fro April of last year until November. At a week before her first birthday she just stopped. There are many on here with similar experiences. Please make sure you use a trainer that uses only positive reinforcement. It is the only way to go, believe me.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Couple thoughts here... and because you are expecting a baby before this pup is fully mature, it's important that you sort out whether you have the time, patience, and love for this pup to get through the next 12-15 months that it takes for him to settle down and mature. 

From what you describe, this pup is not enraged. He a normal golden retriever puppy - who probably is more dog than you expected before you brought him home and has been developing some bad manners along the way. 

One of these days I'm going to get around to running the video camera while my two boys are play-fighting. Golden retrievers are a physical rough-tumble-wrestling-mouthing-noisy breed when it comes to playing. Sometimes they have to be interrupted to prevent either dog accidentally hurting the other. 

Going to classes with these dogs for the first 12 months of their lives - is the best thing for them. Or rather you. Because it does keep you training them and getting them out and working with a trainer on basic obedience.... during the time when they are maturing and developing attitudes on life. 

The bad thing about attending classes is of course they are super stimulated by going for car rides, going someplace EXCITING, seeing other people and other dogs - that's when you get the pulling, jumping, barking, and clowning around. 

And all the more so when they are bored - you get the tantrums and/or them grabbing the leash and playing tug with you or grabbing your clothes or the teacher's clothes and trying to play tug games. 

Cuddling is also one of those things.... sometimes you get cuddly puppies who want to be held and touched. Other times you get puppies who view cuddling as being grabbed and imprisoned. 

Choke collars and other training related collars - I'm not a fan of putting those things on puppies who are still pulling and clowning around. I think it ruins these tools. I've had this opinion since we were out walking with our dogs and a neighbor was walking their rarely walked Rottweiler on a choke chain. And the dog pulled so hard that she broke the chain. I think that misuse of the collar not only causes injuries to these dogs' necks, but it also makes them even stronger when it comes to pulling. Because their necks are toughening up and they are used to the "pain" of pulling. 

Through dog classes now = I'm seeing dogs pulling on prongs, just like I used to see them pulling on choke chains. That is where injuries come from and it's all a shame, because these collars are great tools when it comes to working with a dog who has a concept of what you are asking them to do. 

Going out in public - I would not feel embarrassed at all, providing that you are not taking your pup right up so they jump on and bite other people. If you have a dog pulling and jumping around in public, this time - while they are puppies - you have a good built in excuse. 

I normally warn everyone who wants to meet my dogs that the pup is in training and still learning his manners. That warning makes them a bit more cautious about hyping the dogs up, and they don't mind me reaching in and keeping a hold on the pup's collar. 

All of that said - I definitely think that while your dog is still young, you need to look into this with a clear mindset. Goldens are a great breed - but they are energetic gremlins as puppies. They need training, socialization, lots of hard work on your part... and patience.

ETA - and should add both of my guys are the sweetest things ever. But they are mouthy. The first 2 years of Jacks' life, I constantly had bruises on my legs and arms from him. And Bertie will just try doing his "love bites" (they do this mouthing thing to each other and to you, and it's basically a show of affection according to dogs) and I get bruises from those. >.< They learn control as they grow up and as you are persistent in training.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

You have a perfectly normal Golden Retriever puppy. He is a baby and needs more time to learn what you expect from him. It takes work, and time and them maturing to get that perfect family dog you are looking for.

When he acts like a idiot on a walk squeak a toy or shake a bag or treats, give him a reason to stand up and walk like a real dog. If you can find a safe enclosed place to do it, try just dropping the leash and walking away from him. You can also try teaching him to walk nicely by putting peanut butter on a long handled spoon and let him lick it while you walk. 

But ultimately, you just need to be patient and stay in training.


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

All of what Megora said should be taken to heart. 
And consider this - right now the puppy is young enough that he could be rehomed without too much trauma. You have a baby coming in 5 months - are you going to have the time to devote to the baby and to this puppy, who will still be very much a puppy then? 
I know it's not a popular thing to say here, but I think sometimes it's in the best interests of everyone, dog and person, to say "I can't do this. I admit it."


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## Sheldon (Feb 27, 2013)

My Sheldon is 9 months now and he also plays the same games. I too grew up around friends and family that had Goldens and they never acted like Sheldon does. For months he acted so aloof and would sit on me if I laid down on the floor or nip at the back of my neck!! He still is very distant, but over just the past few weeks he now comes to me and sits between my legs while I'm in my recliner and likes a quick hug and some petting......the whole time his eyes are somewhat shut and he leans into me. His recall has gotten better over what seemed like a couple weeks. I guess it just takes some time with some of them.


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## elly (Nov 21, 2010)

Hi, he sounds like my Chester. Chester is now three and the sweetest boy. He can be headstrong and stubborn but he is nothing like the devil puppy we once had. Training training training and consistency from everyone in the house. Everyone comments on how calm he is for his age and although he wasn't a cuddle monster in his early days, he's now the biggest in your face smooch lap dog you can find  
You have a long journey ahead but it does pay off, it's all that puppyhood entails and demands and with a new baby in the future, it won't be easy but it will pay off. Whatever you decide, I wish you well in your decision and if you keep him, I hope you will post here for any advice and help you may need.


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## splashdash (Aug 5, 2013)

I run field goldens that are very high energy. By your description, if this were my dog, I would suspect that it was not getting sufficient exercise. Individual dogs vary, and it doesn't mean you want to run them into the ground either. Also you and they will both be happier if they have a job & the job can be obedience! Properly rewarded and reinforced, goldens excel at obedience, but need to be taught, and standards have to be kept.


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## Always51 (Feb 19, 2012)

That was the description of Napoleon to a T!!...you sure you hadn't seen him around? lol however, at 2 he is a lovely boy...We had to have a trainer in and that helped enormously...
Having a new baby with an untrained dog I think you'll find it pretty hard....but I wish you all the best..and as they say on here...This too shall pass....


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## jägers_mom_jypsy&sunni2 (Jul 26, 2013)

Exactly what im going through shes 12 weeks and I cry everyday cause im so frustrated grew up with this breed and now that I have one its so different she doesnt give kisses doesnt want to be held rubbed anythinh. She bites bites bites and barks like a mad dog and dumps all her water out on the carpet. Its so frustrating I would really do so thinking and really talk out what is best for your growing family.


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## Gwen_Dandridge (Jul 14, 2012)

I agree with those that suggest lots (and lots) more exercise. But, here is another suggestion (of top of that). 

Feed him his dinner by hand, kibble by kibble for the next two weeks. Toss a piece away from you a little bit and reward and praise when he returns to you. See if this makes a change in his (and your) perception.


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

So picture this - you're a baby and suddenly you're taken away from everything you know by people who seem to expect you to do things that you really don't know how to do, and they keep making noises at you that you don't understand, and they get all frustrated and angry - which you can sense - but you don't know what they actually want. 

THEN they say you're not a good dog because you don't know how to figure this out! 
They're babies, people! They don't come out of the womb all potty trained and knowing how to speak English!


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## olliversmom (Mar 13, 2013)

Olliver was a handful of a pup when we brought him home at 8.5 weeks. Good and sweet but a handful. I was used to a very mellow Pup for 11 years. 
He is now 3 months older. We have figured out what makes him tick, he has figured out how to work within the guidelines we set (for a puppy) and all is so much better.

Lower your expectations. This is a baby! Things will get better. 
I have had dogs all my life. They are all different, and most turn out, in the end, as good as the time you devote to their training. 
But it takes that time.
And I was willing and committed to put in the work and time with patience and love.


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

When we got Max, I had no clue about puppies. I had never had a puppy, or a dog, as an adult, and I had no idea what to expect. But I read books, and I joined this forum and I learned. I talked to people who knew more than me, I figured it out as I went along, I asked tons of questions, but never once did I think Max was a problem, or that I had gotten a defective puppy, or that he was untrainable. We're STILL in training classes, because I need them! He doesn't speak English, he doesn't always do what I want, but it's not because he's stubborn, or willful or anything else - he's spoiled rotten, but that's not his fault, it's mine. He gives me this look that says to me, "I have no idea what you want right now." And then he gives me another when he DOES know and when we've figured it out together.

I'm just a little impatient with people who see adult Goldens and judge puppies by that standard.


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## Kylie's Mom (Jun 23, 2013)

All of us that have puppies are going through some of the smae things you are experiencing with your new puppy. Training will help all three of you become a great family. Your puppy is probably as frustrated as you are, because everything he does isn't the right thing. Snuggling may come later, after your puppy is trained to be a "good dog".
I hope you and your husband can come to grips with getting the training that your puppy so desperately needs. Your dog will be so worth the time you invest in training him.


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## quilter (Sep 12, 2011)

Can you make the walking easier on him? For example, you could switch to a Gentle Leader, Wonder Walker, or Halti. Those would make walking less "work" for the two of you. I read an article (I think in Whole Dog Journal) that dogs can become leash reactive in that they hate the leash/collar. Also, at four months, the walks should not be too long. Maybe 20 minutes. 

Do what you can to keep him from practicing this behavior. Every time he does it, he's just getting better at it. I know others say they outgrow it, but you never know. If you can figure out the triggers or read his body language it will get easier. For example, if I take a left turn and bump my dog, he thinks it's a game. So I've taught him a left turn command, Turning. Works great. Just have to be smarter than the dog. 

You can teach the puppy to be more cuddly using calm=release, Calm = Release | mysmartpuppy.com. I've been doing this for two years with my dog and it's practically his default behavior.


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## Katduf (Mar 10, 2013)

My pup is also 4 months old. She's a crazy pony on the leash. But it's the age, it's a puppy. Everything is new and exciting now. My other golden was a terror and failed puppy class. I persisted in constant training and also had personal sessions with a trainer. He's now 1.5 years and walks great on leash. In the local area everyone knows him and greets him by name. He's definitely not perfect, but he's a beautiful guy. If you are consistent, kind and patient, you will have your dog of your dreams. It doesn't happen overnight, but remember to celebrate even the smallest of victories. If you are there for your puppy, your puppy will be there for you. 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Our Angel Penny was just a monster at that age. And excitable! She went to obedience classes and did very well when we were practicing but then didn't know how to apply it to everyday life...she was a monster. 

But she was a golden in the making...it took a long time for her to make the transition; 2 years. But she steadily improved over those two years into a fabulous, obedient, beautiful Golden Retriever.

When her Dad would take her out for a walk she was pulling and leaping, jumping and biting. About half way thru she would settle down and walk nicely with him. I often wondered, as they walked along the main street of our town, how many people drove by and saw this beautiful Golden behaving so nicely and decided then and there THIS IS THE DOG FOR ME! Completely unaware of the nonsense that had gone on just 20 minutes earlier. What a shock it must have been when they got THEIR puppy home! At this age, they are baby dogs. You have to TEACH them to be Golden Retrievers.

I agree that this might not be the best time for you to have a puppy. Rehoming might be the best option for all of you. If you really want a Golden, check with your local Golden Retriever rescue. There are many, too many, older Goldens waiting for forever homes and they come without the challenges of a puppy.

Best wishes to you and your new family.
QUOTE=laprincessa;3195842]So picture this - you're a baby and suddenly you're taken away from everything you know by people who seem to expect you to do things that you really don't know how to do, and they keep making noises at you that you don't understand, and they get all frustrated and angry - which you can sense - but you don't know what they actually want. 

THEN they say you're not a good dog because you don't know how to figure this out! 
They're babies, people! They don't come out of the womb all potty trained and knowing how to speak English![/QUOTE]


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## ellisda1 (Jul 24, 2013)

There are lots of trainers, lots of different approaches to getting to where you want to be. I read an interesting book the other day - don't know how it's received in the real dog behavior world, but it made sense to me, and might be worth a read. The book was "The Dog Listener" by Jan Fennell. Approach requires consistency, calm attitude, and some leadership skills on your part. I figure you have nothing to loose... Good luck!


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

Puppies do not automatically know how to live in our world with our rules. Many puppies are crated long hours and then expected to cuddle and play nice. This normally does not happen. It takes training, commitment and patience. In almost all cases, you get the dog that you deserve (exceptions being those rare dogs that are wired wrong).

So, your puppy is young enough at this stage to be rehomed without trauma so if you truly don't want the pup, return him or rehome him so he can be loved and patiently schooled in all he needs to know.

BTW: my first golden King was very similar. I did not give up on him and he became an ambassador for the breed and the sport of obedience, but it was not an easy road and it took a lot of work. You may not have the luxury of spending the required time with a baby on the way.

ETA: I have been referred to as the person who takes the returned and rejected into my home. In a way I have an unfair bias to posts like yours since I have 3 incredible returns/leftovers (Faelan was a 'leftover', Towhee & Brady were both returns) in my home as I type this and a 4th who came to me at 11 weeks over 12 years ago (Casey from a PetStore). 



staygoldenmyfriend said:


> We have a 4 month golden whom we had since about 8 weeks of age. He is nothing from what I expected a golden to be. I am a dog groomer and have grown up around golden retrievers and he his personality just does not fit the breed. Yes he is good natured and is good with people and other dogs. But when it comes to my husband and I he just does not respect us at all. On leash walks he will throw major tantrums trying to jump up and tear the leash out of our hands, growl, bite, crocodile roll on the ground. Its beyond frustrating and embaressing when we are in public. Its to the point he is ripping holes in our clothes and giving us superficial cuts with his razor sharp puppy teeth. We are currently seeing a trainer he is enrolled in a puppy class and by far out of the other lab, pitbull and golden puppies he is the worst behaved. He actually bit a huge hole in the trainers shirt as well. His behavior on leash walks does not seem normal especially for his breed. These tantrums on walks can last from five to fifteen minutes of pure growling and trying to bite which is made worse when we try to correct him. As soon as we pull back on the leash or tell him no he becomes even more enraged. We use a choke collar suggested by the trainer but in my opinion it does nothing but piss him off even further.
> 
> I waited so long for this dog and I feel like he doesn't like, love or respect either of us. Even at night when I try to cuddle him when hes tired he will try to walk over me and step on me almost like hes trying to be the tallest and biggest. I feel like everything is a power trip with him. Im sad to say I really don't like his personality. I was prepared for leash pulling, wall biting, regular puppy stuff but not this. He acts more like a cat then anything. Hes independent, not interested in cuddling, bites and growls when he doesn't get his way.
> 
> Feeling like I got the worst dog in the world. Anyone go through this? Any suggestions? Early neuter maybe? Im to the point where if this doesn't change I might give him up. Im also four months pregnant and this is not the type of dog I want around a baby but am willing to tough it out a little longer.


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## olliversmom (Mar 13, 2013)

This is the epitome of "Puppy" to me:
I teach Olliver his commands on and off thru the day, little sessions here and there.
He has been learning quite a few new things lately: down, up, lie still, go to the mat, stay, wait, etc etc.
So yesterday I say, "Ok Ollie lets do some stuff. And I stand in front of him and give him the sit hand motion and just decide to hold the stare a little. And LOL, for a minute the poor little fella, lie down, stood up, looked at me, went thru about 12 motions before I said a word. 
It was sweet and comical at the same time. They are so smart and want to please us so badly, but they are just babies and don't know exactly what is right and wrong every minute of the day.
I have always made it a point to laugh at and with my puppies. Really enjoy their silliness. Sure they can be frustrating and worrisome at times, but my goodness, life is meant to be enjoyed with laughter. And if you cant find laughter with a puppy, then where can you find it?


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## jacksilas (May 26, 2013)

A gentle leader at about 4 months has made walking a dream. And it took only a few days for him to accept it. His trainer said it is not cheating, but a 'whatever works' situation. I hope it isn't forever, but for now. . . . 
And as he enters the teenage months, whew, it is a good thing because he needs a LOT of exercise.

On another note, I hope it all works out for you and this is just a phase. BUT if it continues not to work out, give yourself permission to make that re-homing decision. 

I am the person who adopted a pup (at 14 weeks) that another family couldn't cope with. It was their circumstances as opposed to his behaviour as he is, overall, a pretty great pup. We spend a lot of time and money (on sitters and daycare) to make it so. . . 
Anyway, these people are good people. Great people. They just made a mistake.
And their mistake was our great gain.
We are great for him and he us.
They were heart broken but realistic. And relieved. 
We just have more time for him.
We send updates and pictures.
They, however, would have to kill me to get him back no matter how great he turns out.
Just saying. . . . 

Good luck and go for whatever is best for your family and your pup.


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## Chaya (Aug 18, 2012)

There has been a lot of good advice here by GRF members. Here are my 2-cents:

1. Consider using an easy-walk harness( [ame]http://www.amazon.com/PetSafe-Easy-Harness-Small-Medium/dp/B001TRF3SC/ref=sr_1_1?s=pet-supplies&ie=UTF8&qid=1376653182&sr=1-1&keywords=easy+walk+harness[/ame]). A choke collar can sometimes make an energetic puppy behave more badly because he is stressed out from the neck pain/pressure without really understand why the pain is there. 

2. Play "drop it" games a few times a day. Here is a good video that teaches both this command and prevents future resource guarding issues: 



 Once your pup understands "drop it", when he steals the leash from you on walks, say "drop it" instead of trying to pull the leash from his mouth. This way, you don't accidentally start a game of tug-o-war (which is exactly what his thinks it is when you try to take the leash from his mouth!)

3. Cuddling will take time. I know TV commercials and the media portray puppies to be little bundles of love, but in reality, even though puppies see you as their protector and "mom", it really takes a few months before they actually "love" you. Just like human relationships, strong bonds take time and hard work. Many puppies are too busy to cuddle unless it's on their terms, but most will enjoy it as they grow older and settle down. 

I don't see him standing on you as "asserting" himself. It seems just more like how he tries to express his desire for contact with you. My girls love to push against us with their giant rough paws, and walk on/around us. They only do it because they are comfortable with us being in their space, and enjoy physical contact with us. Of course, if this bothers you, when he stands on you, lure him off and to your side with a treat, put him in a "down", and treat again. Over time (lots of time) he will understand that is the preferred position when he wants to touch you. This also teaches him to be in a calm state when he is around you, which will help once your baby arrives.

4. This is a game that we play with our dogs a few times a week to help with stopping bratty behavior quickly, either indoors or outdoors. Make sure your pup fully understands the "sit" command before you start: have puppy on leash, and yummy treats in your pocket. Do 30 seconds of *all-out crazy play*. The crazier the better, and get down and dirty with puppy! After 30 seconds quickly stand up like a tree, look straight down at him, and say "sit" in a deep, *calm *voice. The first couple of times, puppy might be confused why you suddenly stopped playing, and you may have to lure him into a sit. Once puppy sits, lavish with treats calmly. Repeat at least 2 more cycles of crazy play and sudden sits. The more quickly he sits, the more treats he gets! This will teach your puppy to quickly calm down from a hyped up mental state. The best part is, this is all a fun game to him that he associates with you, so it will also increase your bond.

Hope these tips help!


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## Chaya (Aug 18, 2012)

One last thing, about his biting and sharp teeth: he is going through a major teething phase right now, and this is probably the worst time for biting for a puppy. Try to keep one of his toys within reach at all times, and the second he starts biting you or others, say "eh-uh" in a sharp but *calm *tone, then redirect him to his toy and praise him when he chews his toy instead. If he drops the toy to try to bite you, put the toy back in his mouth again and praise him. If he comes back again and again to tries to bite you, you need to leave him (shut yourself in the bathroom for 10 seconds), and he will learn that if he wants to play with you, his teeth can *only* go on his toys. This is an all or nothing game: _any_ contact that he makes with his teeth on you or your clothes is not allowed. 

Over time, you will be able to predict when he is about to start biting mouthing (usually, when he is over excited or over tired) and per-emptively stick a toy in his mouth. Eventually, he will learn to find a toy himself when he feels the urge to bite.

One game we play with our girls is tug-of-war with a small toy. This is a great game to practice the "drop it" command too. Hold part of the toy in your hand, and offer it to him to play tug by saying something like "take". At first, he will be SO excited that he will chomp down on the toy and probably your hand too. The second you feel teeth on your skin, say eh-uh and stop play immediately. Offer the toy to him again, and this time if you see him coming too fast or carelessly again, withdraw the toy a little from his reach, saying "geeentle", and do this repeatedly until he only grabs the toy and not your hand. Reward with a great game of tug. After about 30 seconds, say "drop it". Praise, rinse, and repeat.


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## Baggio (Oct 18, 2013)

*It's okay!*

Well, puppies are rambunctious at that age, so I think you might just have to be patient with the results of the training with your dog trainer. 

On an unrelated but not irrelevant note, I used to have the same frustrations with Lucky when he was a pup - he didn’t have any of these behaviour issues, but he just outright refused to pee in his crate and he ended up stinking up the apartment with his pee and poo (didn’t help that the floorboards were wooden). 

It took us a lot of time, and a whole bunch of methods, but eventually the message got across to him. A tip we came across that was particularly helpful (probably sounds stupid that I didn’t think of this) was to take him, CONSISTENTLY, over the course of about 2 - 3 weeks, to his designated peeing spot after meals. 

After a while, he got what we wanted, and on top of that, we were sure to reward him with a treat after he peed correctly in his spot. 

I linked to one resource on my website here that helped us quite a bit if you’re interested, you can check it out here: Dog Training Kingdom | Overcome your dog training frustrations.... 

Also, a bit of personal experience I’d like to share is to stay away from negative reinforcement - it almost always makes the behaviour worse and worsens your relationship with your dog. 

Instead, go on the pre-emptive strike, and try and figure out where the real problem is and tackle it at the root level. And, instead, when he gets it right, use positive reinforcement. 

Clicker training might be really useful in this case, which I highly recommend. 

Also, teaching him basic commands like bark and heel might really help. 

And don’t expect too much - you’ve only been together for two months, well, 5, I suppose at the time I’m positing this, so don’t give up! I’m sure the good nature of GR’s will shine through when he grows a bit older!


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