# Michigan Breeder Help



## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I'd look into Asoro goldens.


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## Enzos_Mom (Apr 8, 2010)

I have also heard wonderful things about Asoro. Also, how far are you willing to drive? We have a lot of very knowledgeable people on the forums that could point you in the right direction better than I, but some of the breeders they recommend might not be super close. 

I'm also from SE Michigan - I'm in Farmington Hills. =)


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## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

I don't know a lot of MI breeders though I too am in southeast MI (Livonia). I do recognize a lot of names on the list you made. I am a member of Marshbanks Golden Retriever club and I know quite a few people there breed. The clubs are a good place to get started, and just talk to people. Do your research, know what you want and stick to your guns. K9 data is a good place to get information on dogs. 

I am sorry you had issues with our dearly departed, I do understand it makes the puppy search much harder. I have a product of a BYB at home I do understand. I went out of state for my pup, but I am specifically looking for a performance dog and a lot of the breeders around MI focus on the show variety of dog. Nice dogs not saying anything about that, I just fell in love with the sire and dam of my puppy. I go to MO to pick her up in Nov. 

There are quite a few Michiganders on this site. I am sure you will get a lot of information.


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## Cathy's Gunner (Dec 4, 2008)

The only one I recognize is Meadowpond. They are really good but I see they won't have one ready at the time you wish. 

Stay away from mycascadegoldens from Bob McAdow if someone from Fort Detroit mentions them. He is on their board. He over breeds his dogs and has way to many dogs at his home. I learned all this after I put a deposit down on my puppy. I love my boy but feel so bad at how many litters his mom has had....

Gunner and I are from Allen Park. Welcome and good luck!


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## Selli-Belle (Jan 28, 2009)

When you call the puppy referral people at Fort Detroit, they will give you information about puppies from breeders who are members of the FDGRC and have informed the puppy referral person about the litter. Usually this happens when the litter is on the ground or at least the pregnancy is confirmed. Since you are looking for a puppy in late fall, many breeders have not notified the puppy referral person about the litter. In addition, if the breeder has a waiting list, or does not believe they will have any problem selling the puppies, they may not list their litter with the puppy referral person.

After a quick look at the breeders that you listed, they all seem to be reputable hobby breeders. Clinton Oaks slants slightly toward a performance puppy and while Asoros has Meadowpond blood, they are more show lines. The others seem to be show lines which will give you a dog with more hair and a bit less energy.

When you talk to the breeders about specific litters, be sure to get copies of the parents clearances before you make any commitment. 

If I were you, I would visit the breeders, meet the parents and relatives and see which ones steal your heart.


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## cmor (Oct 1, 2010)

Thank you all for your comments so far, you have been helpful. We just heard back from another breeder on our list (Mihran), and they won't have anything for several months. Right now we are leaning towards Asoro, but we still are awaiting some information, and we have some more thinking to do. We continue to welcome your comments.
Thanks again.


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## DianaM (Feb 18, 2010)

Our Gracie is from Gazebo. We love them! Did you actually talk to her? Last time I talked to her, she had planned to breed in January. The names you are interested in seem to be the big names in the area. I think you would be good with either. My husband's aunt had two dogs from Clinton Oaks and seemed to like them.


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## cmor (Oct 1, 2010)

Diana--yes we did speak with Dianne of Gazebo, but she has nothing until April.


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## eeneymeanymineymo (Oct 5, 2009)

Might try Phyllis Cox, Sunwind Goldens. Not sure if she has a litter right now but worth the inquiry. Here is her litter page:
Sunwind Golden Retrievers - Previous Litters

She may know of others who do have litters in the Michigan area.
Good luck!


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## Cathy's Gunner (Dec 4, 2008)

*Here's another one to check out.*

Dillon's Outstanding Goldens - Home


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## MidasMom (Jun 2, 2010)

I have a friend who has a Asoro pup and he is fabulous! Absolutely beautiful and wonderful sweet personality. Asoro does all health checks too. I also wanted to get an Asoro pup, but the time just wasnt right. I have a Chien D'Or golden. She is in Farmington Hills. She also does all health checks and has a written guarantee as most reputable breeders will. Not sure why on her website it says most cleared on elbows. When I asked about her breeding stock she said ALL were cleared, maybe a typo. My pup, Graham, is 14 weeks old today and is an absolute joy. Best bet is to visit all the breeders your interested in and go from there. Happy hunting!


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## Enzos_Mom (Apr 8, 2010)

My dad's golden, Kaine, has some Chien D'Or dogs in his pedigree. He's an amazing dog with the best temperament. I tried finding a picture of him to post, but he's just a blur in all of them that I've taken - he and Enzo get a little crazy when they get together. lol


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## MidasMom (Jun 2, 2010)

OMG, I would love to see a picture if you are able to get one. Too funny, the ones I take of Graham are also mostly blurs too. They love themselves some crazy time. My Midas is half Chien D'Or and also has just the best temperament. Mellow, playful, snuggly, just all around amazing dogs.


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## Enzos_Mom (Apr 8, 2010)

Found some! This is Kaine. =) I don't know how far back in his pedigree the Chien D'Or is. I only looked at it once at my dad's. I'll have to take another look next time I'm over there and see which dogs are in there. Maybe they're related!


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## Selli-Belle (Jan 28, 2009)

cathyjobray said:


> Dillon's Outstanding Goldens - Home


Cathy Jo,

I am sure Gunnar is a wonderful boy, but I see some red flags with Dillon's Outstanding Golden. For one, the charge MUCH more for "European" pups than for American pups. Two, for at least one of their breeding females, they have a practitioner heart clearance, rather than a specialist clearance (and distance to travel to a specialist for them is about 1/2 hour to MSU). Third is that they plan to breed a male Parker, who will be less than two years old at the time of breeding.

And just something I see as odd, they claim to have "European" goldens as distinct from "English" goldens with "European" being the more pure or better dog.



Dillon's Outstanding Goldens said:


> It is also important to know that there is also what is known as "English Type".European bred puppies are bred from 100% European bloodlines giving you the true European standard. English Type puppies are bred from an English combination of bloodlines producing puppies that look similar to the European Goldens but may or may not have all of the characteristics of a Full European bred Golden.





In fact, the English (or more accurately, the British) standard was the first one written in the very early 20th century. The American standard was based on the British Standard as are the standards in the rest of Europe. If there is a more "pure" or "correct" Golden standard, it would be the British one. Anyway, one of their "European" (Marley) dogs is from Australia and all her lines come a few generations back from Britain. What is up with that?


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

cathyjobray said:


> Dillon's Outstanding Goldens - Home


 
Um, not so much...


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

cmor, please contact me @ [email protected]

Thanks.


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## Cathy's Gunner (Dec 4, 2008)

Gunner* isn't *from Dillon's. Someone had suggested it to me when I was checking out breeders. I was just offering another place for them to check out. Thanks for your input on them.


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## cmor (Oct 1, 2010)

Thanks everyone for the feedback! We have decided to go with Clinton Oaks.


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## DianaM (Feb 18, 2010)

Congrats! When do you expect to bring your puppy home?


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## Braccarius (Sep 8, 2008)

I work at the border in Sault Ontario and I get to see a multitude of Golden's coming over the border from Michigan. In all honesty, I don't think I could buy from Northern Mich. due to the sheer number of pups it seems to have. These dogs are ranging from 200 - 400 dollars and though indicated as purebred I've seen obvious variations that could never come from a pure golden (pointy ears?)

As always, research research research!!! The best breeders care and take an active interest in their dogs!


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Braccarius said:


> I work at the border in Sault Ontario and I get to see a multitude of Golden's coming over the border from Michigan. In all honesty, I don't think I could buy from Northern Mich. due to the sheer number of pups it seems to have. These dogs are ranging from 200 - 400 dollars and though indicated as purebred I've seen obvious variations that could never come from a pure golden (pointy ears?)
> 
> As always, research research research!!! The best breeders care and take an active interest in their dogs!


Out of curiousity, are you referring to dogs bred in the Upper Peninsula, specifically? Or, Northern Lower?


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## Braccarius (Sep 8, 2008)

They are all upper peninsula. Honestly, of the dogs crossing I've yet to see one from what I would consider reputable breeding. Not saying there isn't... but the people here in Ontario are crossing specifically for deals the "why pay a grand for a dog in Ontario when I can buy one for 400 dollars in Michigan" type people. Its very difficult to see. 

I've seen pointy ears, under 6 weeks, 200 dollars for a purebred and heard everything under the sun about why they were so cheap. My assumption is that there's a mill somewhere near my crossing that is cranking out dogs and giving them to brokers to move.


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## Braccarius (Sep 8, 2008)

Either that or I'm being lied too.... which isn't too uncommon LOL. I can see it now "Hunny, tell that idiot at the border we have a purebred golden instead of the Nova Scotia Duck Toller we picked up. Who cares if his ears are pointier he probably never graduated grade school anyway"

THAT Being said however, I have seen a few German Shep's that came across from a breeder up here that were unbelievably cute and the worlds chubbiest bulldog puppy (most expensive dog I've seen yet)


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I'm sure there are more likely to be BYBs in rural areas.... I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that they are all from actual puppy mills. Or I hope not.


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## Braccarius (Sep 8, 2008)

Megora said:


> I'm sure there are more likely to be BYBs in rural areas.... I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that they are all from actual puppy mills. Or I hope not.


Do BYB's bother to register now? Holy smokes


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Braccarius said:


> Do BYB's bother to register now? Holy smokes


Well... yes? 

Our first golden came from a nice farm out in the middle of nowhere. Nice big family. The thing was they had the breeding self-sufficient mentality. You got chickens, bred them, sold the chicks. Same thing with sheep, cows, horses, and dogs. 

So every spring they would have puppies to sell. They had dogs who came from good field lines (Topbrass). Our boy was born and spent his first few weeks under the front steps of the house. That's where his mom dug a nest and chose to keep her puppies. 

They were all outdoor dogs and never permitted inside the house, and in that area... and these people grew up with dogs who were kept the same way. And they just didn't see anything wrong with keeping dogs that way. 

Our guy was sold to us ($250) with full registration. We could have bred him if we wanted. :


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## Selli-Belle (Jan 28, 2009)

Braccarius said:


> Either that or I'm being lied too.... which isn't too uncommon LOL. I can see it now "Hunny, tell that idiot at the border we have a purebred golden instead of the Nova Scotia Duck Toller we picked up. Who cares if his ears are pointier he probably never graduated grade school anyway"


Just out of interest, is there any reason why they would say Golden rather than a NSDTR?


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Braccarius said:


> They are all upper peninsula. Honestly, of the dogs crossing I've yet to see one from what I would consider reputable breeding. Not saying there isn't... but the people here in Ontario are crossing specifically for deals the "why pay a grand for a dog in Ontario when I can buy one for 400 dollars in Michigan" type people. Its very difficult to see.
> 
> I've seen pointy ears, under 6 weeks, 200 dollars for a purebred and heard everything under the sun about why they were so cheap. My assumption is that there's a mill somewhere near my crossing that is cranking out dogs and giving them to brokers to move.


 
Thanks. Because I am in the Northern Lower, and there are some very nice dogs produced here. There are also some nice enough dogs in the UP. It's likely that you just are not seeing them because they aren't crossing. I suspect that someone is pumping out cheap purebreds near the border and making quick cash on them - stupid on the part of BOTH the seller and the buyer, and too bad for the breed.


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## Braccarius (Sep 8, 2008)

A poorly bred golden up here is worth less than a NSDTR.... and I'm just being silly pretending that people are smuggling dogs under my nose ;-) To be honest, with the amount Canadians are being taxed and the introduction to HST in my area....... well... lets just leave it at that.


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## Braccarius (Sep 8, 2008)

Pointgold said:


> Thanks. Because I am in the Northern Lower, and there are some very nice dogs produced here. There are also some nice enough dogs in the UP. It's likely that you just are not seeing them because they aren't crossing. I suspect that someone is pumping out cheap purebreds near the border and making quick cash on them - stupid on the part of BOTH the seller and the buyer, and too bad for the breed.


I've not had the pleasure of getting one of your dogs at our border yet. I am always on the lookout for cute cuddly goldens and I make it a habit to ask where the dog is from. To be honest, I can't even recall a time a person named a kennel when I've encountered a golden.... most times its "just a guy" or "just some lady". And again, I am 100% certain there are GREAT breeders over the border... but the demographic of people who are buying dogs in the US in my area are people looking for deals.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Braccarius said:


> I've not had the pleasure of getting one of your dogs at our border yet. I am always on the lookout for cute cuddly goldens and I make it a habit to ask where the dog is from. To be honest, I can't even recall a time a person named a kennel when I've encountered a golden.... most times its "just a guy" or "just some lady". And again, I am 100% certain there are GREAT breeders over the border... but the demographic of people who are buying dogs in the US in my area are people looking for deals.


I've not sold any puppies to Canada. A few years ago, a Canadian breeder bred one of her bitches to one of my champion males.


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## Selli-Belle (Jan 28, 2009)

Oh, so they have to pay a tax on the purchase price of the dog when they enter Canada?


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## Braccarius (Sep 8, 2008)

Selli-Belle said:


> Oh, so they have to pay a tax on the purchase price of the dog when they enter Canada?


Unbelievable as it is..... even though the animal is American purchased in America... Canadians have to pay 13% of anything they buy in the US unless gone for a prescribed amount of time.


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## sameli102 (Aug 23, 2009)

I would more than trust any advice from Pointgold, and if she has a pup or knows of one I would go with it in a heartbeat.


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## cmor (Oct 1, 2010)

Ok...this thread has clearly gone in a different direction than I intended... In response to DianaM: we bring him home after Thanksgiving. We are very excited.


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## Melh2os (Nov 27, 2010)

The puppy referral contacts at FDGRC gave me the names of two current available litters in the area but I can't find much online about either one - maybe someone else has heard of them?  Kathy Cox and Sue Osterland were the breeder names.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Melh2os said:


> The puppy referral contacts at FDGRC gave me the names of two current available litters in the area but I can't find much online about either one - maybe someone else has heard of them? Kathy Cox and Sue Osterland were the breeder names.


I'm not sure about Sue Osterland, but I've seen Kathy Cox at shows and fun matches. Her goldens are WONDERFUL. I love how she works with them.  I think she has an eight year old (I think) that she's still showing in utility. That dog does not look like he's eight.


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## Selli-Belle (Jan 28, 2009)

Kathy is my bud and my obedience coach! Plus, her Chase is Selli's half brother and they have the same issues in obedience. Her other dogs are also Selli's cousins. However, I am not sure if she is actually having a litter. Her girl Jamie (otch) was bred to Jeep (mach 5) in October, but when I saw her last two weeks ago she was sure that Jamie had miscarried. If the litter is a go it will be a WONDERFUL litter, and I mean WONDERFUL. The pups will be incredibly smart and sweet, but they will need an active family given their performance background. I would take one in a second if I was in the market for pup.


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## MillysMom (Nov 5, 2008)

Pointgold helped me get my puppy, and Hush is incredible. She is by Pointgold's dog Crew (CH Nitelite's Who's On Deck), and the smartest, cutest little thing going and is an incredible example of the breed.

I would trust Pointgold's opinion 100% on finding a breeder, pedigrees, health, and basically everything to do with a Golden Retriever. I am so lucky to have stumbled upon the GRF, and met Laura. Long before I was on the list for one of her puppies, she spent hours and hours and hours helping me weed through breeders and determine exactly what it was I was looking for.


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## Melh2os (Nov 27, 2010)

Thanks for the feedback on Kathy, guys! I will call her. Active is not a problem - I have 6 and 3 year old girls who are like energizer bunnies on a caffeine OD  We definitely are looking for a pet only - no plans to show. But I know it will be a very well loved pet!!


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## Melh2os (Nov 27, 2010)

Sam - Where is Enzo from?


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## Enzos_Mom (Apr 8, 2010)

Enzo is NOT from a "breeder" that I would recommend. She was using her female as basically a puppy factory. I didn't find out about that until after I got him. I'm really glad that she no longer has his mother. She said she gave her to a family that didn't have other dogs so that she could get more attention. The downside is that she kept a female from Enzo's litter, so I'm really hoping that she's not the next puppy factory. =( I didn't know a lot about what to look for in a breeder before I got him, but I won't make that mistake in the future. You should try contacting DianaM. She's from West Bloomfield and has a list of breeders that she was in contact with when she was searching for her Gracie. Also, like MillysMom said, Pointgold is a reputable breeder in Michigan, but I believe she's more up north. I'm sure she'd have someone that she could recommend in the area.


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## Melh2os (Nov 27, 2010)

Cool, thanks! I will definitely start with the referral names from the FDGRC puppy referral folks, but want to have a few others that I can reach out to who may not have a litter available right this second but possibly in the next few months. Would love to welcome a new puppy while I am currently not working and have time to devote to the early months!! Just left a 12 year career in PR and took my nursing boards today after getting a second degree in nursing....so I am relishing actually being HOME for once in my life!!


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## D Traines (Jan 31, 2013)

Hi there I was wondering how you made out getting a dog. We are currently looking at getting a dog from Asoro's and wanted to know if you went with them and if so can you give me feedback on your experience.


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## sunset (Mar 10, 2013)

I would also like to know about Asoro's. We are thinking about getting a puppy from there. They seem like a reputable breeder to me. Do you think they look like a good breeder to purchase a puppy from? Has anyone gotten a puppy from there?


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## cmor (Oct 1, 2010)

We did not end up with Asoro. We went with Clinton Oaks, where Gina Vesco-Fox breeds Goldens, Cocker Spaniels, and Vizslas. She also has a daycare/boarding facility called Shores Kennels. We were happy with the process, have used her boarding facilities a few times, and have found Gina to be helpful anytime we have needed her. We originally signed up for a Golden from one of her litters in October 2010, but we ended up switching gears at the last minute and taking a 4 1/2 month old Vizsla that Gina kept for breeding, but ultimately did not have anyone to breed him with. He will be 3 years old in June--he is amazing and we love him to pieces.


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## cmor (Oct 1, 2010)

By the way, I just saw on Facebook that she (Clinton Oaks) currently has a female Golden from a 3/14 litter available, and will not have another litter until late 2013.


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## Millie'sMom (Sep 7, 2012)

Does Clinton Oaks do all 4 core clearances? There are no AKC registered names or numbers to independently verify clearances on OFA. There is no mention of elbows on their website. It does not appear they compete with their dogs. I would prefer any puppy I was purchasing to be raised in the house and not in the kennel.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I believe that a lot of Gina's puppies wind up in competition type homes because of her association with Cherie Berger... so of course clearances are very important.  

Kennel raised or home raised - it depends on the care given to the puppies and the experience of the breeder.


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## Whisker2193 (Oct 28, 2015)

We have a puppy from Clinton Oaks. She was diagnosed at 6 months with bilateral hip dysplasia. She's has the first of two reconstructive surgeries (triple pelvic osteology) at $3500...per hip. Ouch. For both of us. When I told Gina at Clinton Oaks her response was that she would never pay that kind of money to fix a dog. She also said she never had a puppy diagnosed with bilateral hip dysplasia after what she characterized as hundreds of puppies (although she did admit to three with unilateral hip dysplasia). Although she makes no guarantee in the contract for hip dysplasia, I had hoped for her to refund at least some. Of the $1600 fee. She flat out refused. Buyer beware.


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