# He's eating my house!!!



## doglvn_blonde_girl (May 3, 2005)

Can anyone tell me what to do about my golden, Dodger? His behavior is horrible! He has eaten the wood siding off the side of my house, he has chewed the phone line so many times the phone company guy knows Dodger's name, he digs enormous holes in the backyard, he digs holes under the fence, through the fence and constantly jumps on everyone! He is a one year old male; he isn't neutered; he bounces off the wall as if he's on some kind of crack. He is very sweet and I would never get rid of him. I play with him everyday; there are other dogs outside to play with and he has *tons *of toys outside: chewies, kongs, bones, squeakers, ropes, but his favorite thing to eat is wood. I don't know what to do--people don't like to come over anymore. When he digs out he goes to the neighbors yards and brings home shoes, backpacks, baseball bats, you name it. He tears up anything and everything in his path. He is out of control and will not mind at all, I can't hold his attention even for 10 seconds. Will neutering help? Help?


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## timberwolfe (Apr 15, 2005)

You've had him for the whole time? The other dogs are yours or visiting dogs? You mention you play everyday with him, but how much and for how long?

The behaviour you describe sounds like a couple of things.

One is a lack of training. Has he gone to class or home trained at all?

Another sounds like boredom. 

Goldens are smart dogs and left on their own they will invent ways to amuse themselves. They are also social dogs who crave human interaction. If he lives mostly outside while you and your family are indoors, he won't be happy.

Your only solution is to start Basic Obedience and train that boy not to jump on people, and how to listen to Sit, Stay and Come. Once you have those perfected you can teach him tons of other things, but he needs basic manners. If he is an outdoor dog, is there any way he can spend time inside? If he is already indoors, then forget I mentioned it.

Neutering alone won't solve your problem. If you can't control your dog and keep him contained, then he should be neutered. But I wouldn't use neutering as a cure for bad behaviour, it won't work.


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## Joe (Apr 9, 2005)

In my opinion he just needs more attention. I know you said there is lot of toys and some other dogs... Maybe it just isn't enough.
Plus he is only 1 year old, so expect another 2-3 years of him doing this, unless you make him tired or trained enough not to do that.
He is probably little hyperactive and too bored. 
Joe


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## Boogity (Apr 23, 2005)

Hi doglvn blonde girl and welcome to the forums. I hope you will stay for a long time and tell us more about Dodger.

I would have to agree with Timberwolf. I think your dog needs training as soon as possible. Training would not only give your dog direction but also would give you the tools to do the directing. It also sounds to me like you are a little panic stricken right now (I would be, too) and training may serve to calm you and Dodger and get both of you on the right track to a long and happy relationship.

Please be aware that this behavoir has been allowed to go on for an entire year so corrective measures may require some real assertiveness on your part and maybe even some harsh correction. Dodger seems to think that he's the boss and he probably likes it that way.

Please keep us up to date on any progress.

I almost forgot - you started your post by telling us that he's eating your house. There is a product in the pet stores called Bitter Apple. Dogs hate this stuff. If you would like to try it please don't over do it. Start out by putting a tiny little drop on your finger and rub it on Doger's tongue. He will shake his head and display extreem displeasure with it. Don't worry, it will not harm him and it does not last very long. Now that his senses are tuned to the taste of Bitter Apple you can lightly apply this stuff to anything that you want him to stay away from. Shoes, furniture, clothing, and even your house. Give it a try. But don't think this is a substitute for immediate obediance training.


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## Deborah's Gold (May 6, 2005)

I thoroughly agree. Obedience training for you and Dodger immediately.
I would also suggest neutering him as soon as possible as well. I do believe there is a real myth that neutering is the real answer to high energy dogs; but it is certainly a good idea health wise and to contain the tetosterone.

Is he involved in agility or flyball? These are amazing owner/dog tools to redirect the energy.

You know what "they" say; I tired dog is a good dog.


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## Boogity (Apr 23, 2005)

Deborah's Gold said:


> You know what "they" say; I tired dog is a good dog.


I've never heard that one but it sure is a good one.

I don't think I know what Flyball is. Can you explain?


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## Deborah's Gold (May 6, 2005)

Flyball is relay with dog teams; they go over short hurdles to the end take the tennis ball and return to the handler "at record speed"....Teams compete...
Bordie Collies are noted to excell in this sport...


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## shaneamber (Apr 20, 2005)

Your Golden is confused on who is the boss.You need to establish your alpha position so he knows who is in charge.Then he will listen and be eager to obey.
My father taught me this trick (which I have used several times with GREAT success),You MUST be serious through out this action or your Golden will think you are playing.
Grab him,flop him over on his back and bite his throat.Not too hard,we don't want blood.Hold him down and continue your bite until he surrenders.When he has stopped moving and has given up,let go and help him up.Lavish him with praise and lots of love.
You will see an immediate change for the better.Just a stern look or vocal tone will be all the discipline you will need.He will train up very easy and will be a wonderful companion.
Shane


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## Krugcrawford (May 23, 2005)

I agree with shaneamber - i think you have some leadership issues and perhaps even separation anxiety. Although my boy was not as destructive as Dodger, an animal behavioral therapist (at great expense!) gave that diagnosis. I highly recommend a book for you, The Dog Listener by Jan Fennel. I think it will help you understand what is going on in Dodger's mind.


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## Golden Mom (Apr 22, 2005)

flop him over on his back and bite his throat.[/QUOTE said:


> That's what Coffee and Brandy do to each other all the time. And I know it's for dominance. I'd never been told that. It's great to know.


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## timberwolfe (Apr 15, 2005)

It's called the Alpha Roll and is not a method I would use to gain the Alpha position. I've heard the pros and cons of the Alpha Roll and decided that my training method has no need for it. I've heard that it can create more problems than it solves, depending on the dog.


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## Bonni (Apr 12, 2005)

Can you elaborate on what kind of problems it can cause? Daisy has become quite the biter and she doesn't seem to understand No or Ouch or any of that stuff. We've started with the same basic method described as the "alpha roll" (or is it Role?!?!) and although we're progressing slowly, it does seem to be working. It's the only way we've been able to calm her down.

However, if we're doing something to harm her in any way, I will stop immediately. So, I'm wondering what kind of problems it can cause.

Thanks for your expertise! 
Bonni


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## timberwolfe (Apr 15, 2005)

Role, yes you are right.

The main reason I am against it that I practice Clicker Training which uses no forced methods at all.

As far as harming the dog using the Alpha Role, I believe one issue is that it is a very dominant posture to use for training, and depending why your dog is biting, it may be an overkill method which could cause socializing/fear issues. I know there were other issues against it but I researched that almost 3 years ago and can't recall what those issues were.

Now I'm curious again so maybe I will go back to my books and see if I can find out more.

I will say that curing the nipping problem in Golden pups requires a lot of patience, consitancy and time. It isn't solved in a week.


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## Barry (May 23, 2005)

If puppy bites, there are various responses. 
Say NO and roll the dog onto its back and hold it down for a minute or two. 
Another alternative is to grab the two corners of the mouth and squeeze slightly. 
That way it is impossible for the puppy to bite, and they hate that. 
Be firm. never let him/her bite and be patient. 
They'll grow out of it over time ... give it time ... It's called puppy hell. 
You've still got a year or two of frustrations ahead before you get that dream pet you've always wanted.


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## Bonni (Apr 12, 2005)

I know it's a long road. I knew that going into this. I don't want to completely inhibit the behaviours because I know that they are natural and important for her development. I do, however, want to be able to control my dog. It's hard for me to let her be around kids, which is too bad.

I do realize that this problem won't be solved in a week. We're looking at months, at best. The thing is that she's not really biting. She's nipping and playing, but sometimes it gets out of control. She is actually a very sweet dog 90% of the time. I can tell that she's not trying to hurt us. She's just being a puppy. It can get frustrating though, when you say No or Ouch the 100th time and she still isn't getting it.

So, thank you for your feedback. We will cope with this, just like every other dog owner out there!

Happy trails,
Bonni


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## timberwolfe (Apr 15, 2005)

What you describe Bonni sounds like every other Golden Pup out there, which I'm sure you know. I'm glad you know it is an ongoing training issue. Some people see Goldens when mature and think "What a beautiful dog" and don't realize the amount of work and problems Golden Puppies are. You are right, it could take months.

I hear and read of so many training methods and it is such a personal choice.

I too found that just yelling OUCH didn't work. That was when I started to take him into a room (a controlled environment) and start playing with him, and when he started the nipping I would do the OUCH, stand up, turn my back to him, and stop playing. Wait 20 seconds or so and then go back to playing. Keep repeating. If it gets really bad then I would leave the room. Biting equals no play. 

When outside or in Living Area of the house and he nips, I would do the OUCH, and turn my back. They hate to be ignored. If it continues then in extreme cases I would give the pup a time out. Put him in his room with no toys and leave him for a few minutes.

When I do continue playing after ignoring him, I would give him toys he is supposed to chew and praise him when he is being good.


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## Golden Mom (Apr 22, 2005)

I've never had children, and therefore, have never had to deal with children and "time outs," but I understand the theory behind them and think it's a great idea.

I get SUCH a kick out of hearing someone say they give their dog a time out. It only reinforces for me that dogs are so much like children....

On another subject: How do you stop an adult Golden from CONSTANTLY putting his paw up and trying to grab your hand. It's either that or he puts his foot right smack dab on my chest (I'm a woman, and that can be embarassing, and his aim is 100 percent accurate bilaterally). When he's up on the bed with us, if he comes up to lay down next to (read: on top of) me, he constantly fidgets with his paw slapping me in the face, grabbing my arm, trying to lick my hand or fingers. It's very irritating. He will not understand NO or LIE DOWN. He is very, very willful.


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## mojosmum (May 20, 2005)

If I'm not mistaken, I feel he's being dominant with you. Time to get him off the bed and back on the floor. No furniture or anything. Only pat when you initiate it, not when they want and always be the alpha with him. That means "everything under your terms, not his".
Please correct me if I'm wrong.


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## shaneamber (Apr 20, 2005)

I wouldn't use the Alpha roll over bite on every dog.Most Goldens only need to be corrected with a sharp NO and ignoring them for a short time.
I should have made myself clearer,my wife and I mainly take the dogs that nobody wants.Dogs with problems that are difficult to over come.We've had the problems range from biting,chewing,EATING furniture,afraid of beatings.Dogs with scars from people carving their initials and the nazi cross into their flesh.Scars on their privates from cigarettes,ribs and bones sticking out from neglect.
We've had to put down some,but we've never lost a Golden because it wasn't trainable.
Some Goldens have to be shown who is in charge.Notice I said to let him(mostly males) up and shower him with praise and love.You have to get their attention first before you can take the first steps to a happy companion.
This method is for dogs who need to be shown their position in the pack and that it is a good position to be in.
We do not train Goldens for anything else but to be good family members.
Everyone has a different way of handling their dogs and that is fine.You must find the way that works for you and your dogs.
We would probably use a different method if we got the dogs as pups,but we only get them after the damage has been done and we do our best to give them the life they deserve.
When we get a dog,we promise it that it will never be hit,hungry or without love for the rest of it's life.
That's a promise we never go back on.
Shane


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## timberwolfe (Apr 15, 2005)

That is a great thing you do Shaneamber. You are to be congratulated. 

You must have to be a strong person to not be overwhelmed by the cruelty that some people are capable of. I know just reading some of the stories of cruelty to animals makes me wish I could turn around and inflict the same treatment to the person responsible. 

And you are right. Dealing with Dog Rescue is totally different that a fresh palet that is a puppies mind. While there are methods that work using redirection and positive only methods, the occasional Alpha Roll (yes it is roll, like roll over, I was mistaken yesterday) certainly won't harm the majority of dogs, and the main goal is to prepare the dog for placement into a family environment.


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## mojosmum (May 20, 2005)

Shaneamber - the world needs more heros like you and your wife. Thank goodness there's people like you to help these lost souls. 
Your bio says you're retired. Did you do this in your everyday job life? I just wondered where you've gotten all the experience?


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## goldencity (May 26, 2005)

Oh dear, you and dodger are having a bad time!
I suggest you find a good trainer right away, your vet will probably be able to recommend one, and then spend lots of time with your dog.
It sounds to me like he thinks hes the boss and that he can ignore you as you are further down the pecking order of the pack. You need to adress this now while he is young and before he decides to assert his authority.
A couple of things you can do to help are;
1/ Try the rolling over and pinning down trick already descibed, I dont think you have to "bite" him, just pin him down till he stops struggling. If you watch pups playing this is how they sort out who is boss.
2/ "His toys" they arn't his toys, they are your toys that he is allowed to play with. When he is watching you, pick them all up and put them were he can see them but dont let him get them. Then you choose a toy and "play" with it your self. Then you can let him join in the game. Finally, you choose when to end the game not him. That way you are in charge, your the boss.
3/ Never let him go thro' a door first or let him lay in a doorway so you have to step over him. If he is laying in the way, make HIM move. If you want to go thro, a door you go thro first. You can do this as a training exercise. Put him on his lead and go up to the door. If he pushes forwards when you open the door, close it quickly. Try again. When he takes a small step backwards,or waits for you go through the door and reward him.
4/ Spend more time with him, more long walks. He could be just bored and full of beans. At least youll get fit!


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## shaneamber (Apr 20, 2005)

Thank you timberwolf and Mojosmum.A lot of what I learned came from my Dad and his family.Animals were treated differently back then,but my Dad used the kindness and love method instead of the beating with a stick method.

He taught me that humans can control their life,but animals are at our mercy and that we need to treat all animals as gifts from God.From the wonderful Majesty of the Eagle to the love of a dog they all deserve to be treated with respect.
Rescuing Dogs is a hobby(what a hobby!),I grew up in construction work,but my adult career was spent fixing cars.
I learned the hard way it seems sometimes,but common sense and advice from family,Friends and Vets has helped us help Goldens.
We love all dogs and help as many as we can,when ever we can.
We are not alone,many,many fine people work very hard to help dogs,Goldens in particular.We like to stay in the background and do our thing without fanfare.
Here's to all those in rescue work,without them a LOT of wonderful animals would be gone.
Shane
PS ADOPT A SENIOR GOLDEN,somebody has to.


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## Bonni (Apr 12, 2005)

*Kudos to you!*

You are a good soul. I can only imagine working with these dogs and how much time and patience it must require. I truly admire you and anyone else who works with these dogs. It's like taking in foster children, but without the government stipend. 

You should be very proud of what you have chosen as a hobby. You are humbling! 

Thanks,
Bonni


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## Karbean (Jun 11, 2005)

*Establishing the Pack Pecking Order*

Thanks to Shaneamber for sharing the "bite 'em on the throat" story. It's something I did to both of my rescues and my wife thought I had lost my mind. I made sure she read your post! People need to remember to think like a dog....I love my two hooligans like my children but they aren't people and no matter how much we try to give them "human" qualities, they are doing "dog" things. Once we invite them into our "pack" and insist they assume their place at the back of the pack, life is much eaiser, they're happier, we're happier.


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