# Raw Feeding Problems?



## westy258 (Jul 1, 2009)

Hi everyone! I have done tons of reading on the pros and cons of raw feeding, but I'm really interested in any experiences anyone can share. Has anyone had issues with salmonella, etc, as the result of raw-feeding your Golden? I would appreciate any and all opinions!


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## sabby (Apr 23, 2009)

Search function is your friend...


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

I feed raw, and work for a kennel that specializes in raw (we sell it, feed it to boarding dogs etc...) and have never found any issue with bacteria from doing so. I have two kids, one who had a lot of health issues as a baby, no problem with him, and my second is fine too, no issues with the dogs/bacteria. 

Now I don't let the kids feed the dogs, or handle the raw food/bones, and the dogs either eat in their crates or outside, away from the kids. I don't allow the dogs to eat bones in the house, and the cat if she's getting raw has to eat in her crate as well. Common sense IMHO. I've read about people finding chicken wings/chunks of meat buried in their couches (they were looking for where the smell was coming from...) or kids grabbing a raw chicken bone and playing with it - I would imagine most of the 'issues' stem from things like that going on.

Lana


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## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

bumping up. Missmarstar feeds her guys raw.


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

I feed both mine a raw diet. Never any issues with them having any sort of bacterial infection from the raw meat, nor any person in my household even though both my fiance and I handle the raw meat often (me, daily). 

I make sure to sanitize any surfaces the meat is on.. feed one dog in the backyard and he usually munches in the grass, the other dog eats inside either on an xlarge cutting board that gets immediately washed, or a towel that goes into the washer immediately after, or a plastic shower curtain that goes into a tub full of bleach. Usually if I've got a load of towels to be washed already or need to bleach the shower curtain, that's when I'll use those haha Kill two birds! 

Hand are washed if I touch the meat immediately after, and when I am separating and bagging cases of meat that I buy in bulk, I use disposable rubber gloves.

My dogs have done extremely well on a raw diet, and even though I have a serious squeamishness about touching raw meat, I do what's necessary to keep them happy and healthy... just use common sense when handling raw meat and take the necessary measures to keep the surfaces sanitized afterwords and you should be fine.


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## westy258 (Jul 1, 2009)

Thanks for the feedback!


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

I once got a puppy from a breeder who had weaned him to raw (BARF), and the dog immediately came down with severe GI issues including giardia a day or two after we picked him up. I read that salmonella could irritate the large intestine and make opportunistic infections more likely, so I've always wondered if the severity of the dog's sickness was influenced by the raw diet the breeder had him on. Just food (pun intended) for thought.


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

Just like different kibble brands, I'm sure the raw diet doesn't work for every dog. Good to see the other side of the coin and make the decision for yourself and what you're comfortable with. Had my dog not had the allergy issues he did, I doubt I would have ever made the switch to raw.


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## judegirl (Aug 14, 2009)

I have fed raw for years. I have a male almost 3yrs. who comes from generations of raw fed dogs. He was weaned from Mom right to raw and he's muscular and healthy and gorgeous. I can't say that I'm even all that careful about it, just second nature to me I guess. We are talking about animals who can eat "road kill" and go on their merry way. Of course this is tongue and cheek, but their intestines are much shorter than ours and don't hold things in long enough for salmonella etc. Mine have eaten meat that I would consider "gone off", strickly by accident but suffered no evils from it. I did a lot of research and feel I'm giving them a wonderfully balanced over time diet. We don't eat a balanced diet EVERY day let's face it. So balance over time is OK for dogs. As long as they get what they require over time it works great.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

judegirl said:


> their intestines are much shorter than ours and don't hold things in long enough for salmonella etc.


This isn't really an argument against raw diets in general, but dogs absolutely can get salmonella infections as well as e-coli. Most people tend to have a positive experience with raw and their dogs don't experience it, but salmonella or e-coli poisonings and intestinal infections can absolutely occur in dogs. Their shorter small intestine does not protect them entirely.

The reality is that salmonella is in small enough quantities in most raw meat that dog (and human) immune systems can handle it pretty easily. In an immunocompromised dog, or with an improperly handled piece of meat, the risks become much greater.

In households with young children or others with potentially weak immune systems, be aware that dogs on raw food can transmit small amounts of e-coli and salmonella in their saliva. Again, it's a very unlikely problem, but it's certainly theoretically possible. By the same token, _any_ dog's feces can carry e-coli or occasionally salmonella, and dogs do step in it or clean themselves and end up with those bacteria in their mouths occasionally anyway.


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## Goldilocks (Jun 3, 2007)

I feed Pippa a raw and homemade diet and she's never had an illness due to the raw food. Neither have I. I can honestly say she is healthier when on raw food then she is on kibble. It's a commitment to feed raw though. I love the convenience of kibble.


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## mybuddy (Mar 2, 2007)

Buddy eats raw and works very well for him. He ate commercial for the first couple of years of his life and really didnt agree with him. He had a lot of issues with ears, eyes, skin etc. After making the switch, I noticed a huge difference. 

The *only* issue I have had with raw feeding is that later on, ( 6 years old) he started throwing up his meals, mostly because he was not chewing the bones enough..he would gobble them whole. It became an issue, not because of the mess because I really dont mind da buddy mess, it was more about the concern that he was not getting his food. So, I started grinding his meat in a meat grinder, freezing the portions and then adding the rest to the mixture, vegies, fruit , supplements etc. This is perfect for him.
To get the jaw action, he has 1-2 marrow bones per week ( raw ).

He is happy...I am happy.. oh, so happy!


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## judegirl (Aug 14, 2009)

Absolutely, which is why my dogs can't "kiss" my twin grandbabies, as the dogs enjoy the toilet, mud puddles, occassionally feces, othe dogs butts etc etc. It's amazing they survive all this let alone "raw food".


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## judegirl (Aug 14, 2009)

I feed my dogs brisket bones which has nothing left over as they can munch the whole thing. I only give them these 2-3 time per week, but oh do they love them !


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## Garfield (Apr 7, 2009)

This post is no way meant to pooh-pooh raw diets (actually know people who swear by them), but recently read a joint piece by my state's department on communicable disease and veterinary association (to which a certified nutritionist was a contributor and the info was based on scientific studies and data) which (in short) disclosed the following pertaining to your inquiry:

Dogs can (and have) contract food poisoning from bacteria raw diets 
Said bacteria is present/shed in dog feces for more than a week after eating said diet
Freezing does not kill most of such bacteria
Even extensive sanitation techniques does not rid the bacteria
Interestingly raw meet diets are banned at the nearest emergency/teaching veterinary hospital

Additionally mentioned as a potential risk was that the bones in said diets can cause teeth breakage, choking and/or intestinal blockage/perforation
Both commercial and homemade raw diets where found to have serious nutritional imbalances (particularly calcium deficienies)
Dogs that were feed these diets were found to have elevated BUN, creatinine and hematocrit levels*

(*article did state more research was needed to know the longterm effects of such imbalances and frequency of such bacterial/eating maladies).


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## judegirl (Aug 14, 2009)

Another wonderful advantage to raw feeding is the small stools, and after a short while they turn white a poof they are gone !!! Which is probably why we don't run into stools in the wild all the time as the wild animals don't cook their food either !!!!


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

arguing the pros and cons of feeding raw diets is like arguing politics or religion. A lot of people seem to feel as strongly for/against as they do about who is president. 
That said, I've seen the research you refer to, and more, and it's pretty heavily against feeding raw food. There is also a huge amount of scientific data that shows that raw food has absolutely no advantage over cooked, if one chooses to feed a homemade diet. I believe the exact wording was that people who claim that raw food has an advantage are "rewriting elementary physiology without having studied it".
But to each their own. Whatever your dog does best on, and you feel best about feeding, is what you should feed.




Garfield said:


> This post is no way meant to pooh-pooh raw diets (actually know people who swear by them), but recently read a joint piece by my state's department on communicable disease and veterinary association (to which a certified nutritionist was a contributor and the info was based on scientific studies and data) which (in short) disclosed the following pertaining to your inquiry:
> 
> Dogs can (and have) contract food poisoning from bacteria raw diets
> Said bacteria is present/shed in dog feces for more than a week after eating said diet
> ...


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

judegirl said:


> Another wonderful advantage to raw feeding is the small stools, and after a short while they turn white a poof they are gone !!! Which is probably why we don't run into stools in the wild all the time as the wild animals don't cook their food either !!!!


Out of curiosity, what do you give your guys for heartworm/parasites? I know that antiparasitic meds slow down the decomposition of feces.


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## judegirl (Aug 14, 2009)

Nothing. Touch wood, they've tested clear X 12 yrs.


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## mybuddy (Mar 2, 2007)

For heartworm, Buddy gets heartguard monthly and takes worm meds every 3 months or so. It depends on how active he is outdoors. I dont really worry about him getting worms from his diet though. Never had a problem with that.

Raw feeding as one poster said, can be debated for decades..much like politics . I think whatever works for you is the best thing you can do for your dog...if it is commercial...perfect. If it is raw...perfect. The most important thing is that your fur babies are happy and healthy!


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

judegirl said:


> Nothing. Touch wood, they've tested clear X 12 yrs.


Then the absence of anti-parasitic chemicals in the feces are probably the reason they decompose so fast, more so than the raw diet.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

mybuddy said:


> For heartworm, Buddy gets heartguard monthly and takes worm meds every 3 months or so. It depends on how active he is outdoors. I dont really worry about him getting worms from his diet though. Never had a problem with that.


Oh - I didn't mean to suggest that raw diets were more dangerous in terms of heartworms or anything. Heartworms are transmitted by mosquito, generally, not diet. I was just wondering if the earlier poster who claimed that raw diet feces decomposed faster gave heartworm meds or not, because I know that those meds slow down feces decomposition.


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## mybuddy (Mar 2, 2007)

Oh I see what you mean now. I thought it was a strange question ( the way I was interpreting it ) as I do know that heartworm comes from mosquitos.

I have always given heartworm meds even when Buddy was on a commercial diet and when he was eating commercial, his stools were SOOO much bigger, moister, and he went much more frequently.

It is so awesome that we have options that best suit our babies needs. Life is good


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## missmarstar (Jul 22, 2007)

tippykayak said:


> Oh - I didn't mean to suggest that raw diets were more dangerous in terms of heartworms or anything. Heartworms are transmitted by mosquito, generally, not diet. I was just wondering if the earlier poster who claimed that raw diet feces decomposed faster gave heartworm meds or not, because I know that those meds slow down feces decomposition.



I have the same experience with my dog's poops (lol funny statement).. they are very tiny, and very hard, though not hard as in my dogs are straining to go, just very firm. We affectionately call them poop pebbles in my house LOL

They are a greyish color usually with a little brown/green/whatever, and after a few days usually turn white and almost chalklike and then disintegrate. I rarely if ever pick up poop in the backyard.. usually leave it and let the gardener lawnmow them over into the ground, or they just disappear on their own lol 

My dogs are on Sentinel for heartworms (and other parasitic worms) monthly.


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## judegirl (Aug 14, 2009)

Most of my friends feed Raw AND do treat for heartworm etc. but experience the same break down in their dogs stool. Not sure if you can completely attribute it to the use of chemicals. I'm just happy with the positive outcome I have with raw feeding in general. Took a 15 yr.old in for a complete check and the Vet said she checked out like a dog 10 yrs. younger. That's all I care about really.


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## mybuddy (Mar 2, 2007)

judegirl said:


> Most of my friends feed Raw AND do treat for heartworm etc. but experience the same break down in their dogs stool. Not sure if you can completely attribute it to the use of chemicals. I'm just happy with the positive outcome I have with raw feeding in general. Took a 15 yr.old in for a complete check and the Vet said she checked out like a dog 10 yrs. younger. That's all I care about really.


 
WOW..that's awesome!!!! 15 years old...WOW..


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

judegirl said:


> Most of my friends feed Raw AND do treat for heartworm etc. but experience the same break down in their dogs stool. Not sure if you can completely attribute it to the use of chemicals. I'm just happy with the positive outcome I have with raw feeding in general. Took a 15 yr.old in for a complete check and the Vet said she checked out like a dog 10 yrs. younger. That's all I care about really.


Sure. There are lots of reasons that a raw diet poo would break down faster that have nothing to do with the meds. They do have an influence, though, so it's part of the equation.


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## nbloch64 (Feb 12, 2008)

I feed raw to my two dogs and it is incredible. They are lean and healthy. Their teeth are so white, stools are less frequent and smaller and they love their food. Their coats are amazingly soft and shiny too. I fed my dogs kibble in the past and I will never go back to it now. I have more control over what I can feed them and provide them with variety. They both have stainless steel bowls (I clean them after every meal) that they eat out of and normally they are fed in the house. If they are eating edible bones with their meal or tripe, I make them go outside because they tend to drop them outside of the bowl as they are eating. I only wear gloves when handling tripe because it smells so awful, but they sure do love it! If they eat something that is too big for the bowl such as a whole fish or another whole prey, I give it to them outside and let them go wherever they want to eat it (within the confines of my backyard).

I bought a freezer for their meat and am having a great time myself finding sources for their meat, organs and tripe. I look forward to all their feedings now because they are so excited and I see all the wonderful health benefits to a species appropriate diet. I have experienced no issues with salmonella or any type of infection.

Raw is not for everyone, but I think it definitely worth a try for anyone willing. My border collie mix never used to need her hair trimmed between her pads and since I have had her on raw, her hair grows between her pads and both dogs shed less and don't have that 'dog smell'. I also supplement with anchovy/sardine oil and salmon oil.

There are always going to be people for and against raw. Do your research and give it a shot. I feel very confident I am providing my dogs the best possible diet on raw and never did on kibble. I was constantly worried about recalls and how the kibble was being manufactured. I don't like the idea of someone else controlling what goes into my dogs and although I don't have my own farm to provide their meat sources, I can control who I purchase from and there is no manufacturing process involved.

From the research I have done on raw diets, it appears as though most raw fed dogs go into the vet far less often (assuming they don't have a pre-existing condition or disease) and therefore you may find vets who don't agree with a raw diet because it means less money for them. I am also on a minimal vaccine plan with my dogs because the species appropriate diet enables their system to be strong and ward off illnesses. If you think of our own bodies, when we take care of ourselves with a good overall diet and exercise, we normally stay away from the doctors office! We also don't go in for booster shots after we reach a certain point out of childhood. Just something for thought. 

We all want the best for our dogs and we do the best we can to provide that because they depend on us. It is just a matter of determining what the best is for your dog.


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

Been feeding raw for 12 years. Over that time I have had 2-3 dogs all on a raw diet. No issues other than my old girl at 11 years old "appeared" to have a problem handling it. I say "appeared" as at this time I think the diet was not an issue but at 13 + years of age she is doing well with I am now feeding (cooked) and I do not want to chance upsetting her system but switching her back to raw.


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

A couple of side notes. Some of the worst salmonella out breaks in the US over the last decade have been related to produce (cantelopes, strawberries) not poultry and seafood, although not as severe, has caused the most cases of salmonella. 

And although I do not know the numbers I have heard of many more cases of bloat, many fatal, caused by kibble than I have of salmonella or choking problems in raw fed dogs. 

My suggestion to ANYONE thinking of feeding raw is you MUST do your own research. Measure all the pros and cons and then decide what is best for you and your DOG. Then you can never question it later. No method/food is perfect for every dog but you can only do what you feel is best for your dog. And that goes with everything pertaining to your dog. Vaccinations, training, heartworm protection, lawn and garden care, how much and what type excercise you allow your young pup, the list goes on.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

nbloch64 said:


> From the research I have done on raw diets, it appears as though most raw fed dogs go into the vet far less often (assuming they don't have a pre-existing condition or disease) and therefore you may find vets who don't agree with a raw diet because it means less money for them.


Can you provide some sources on the stats that raw-fed dogs go to the vet less? I'm very surprised to hear that. Also, my vet would be pretty insulted by the suggestion that she's against raw feeding because it means less business for her.


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## nbloch64 (Feb 12, 2008)

I don't know if there have been format studies done on this topic. I indicated, from my research that it appears as though raw fed go to the vet less. I didn't mean to state it as a fact, but in hearing and reading from posts first hand from many raw feeders out there, those dogs are not frequenting the vet clinics. I personally take my dogs to a vet that is a raw advocate and has some knowledge about homeopathy. She still has a business to run, but she does support minimal vaccinations and is not trying to push other diets on my dogs, which I have experienced first hand by multiple vets. Just like any industry, there are good and bad ones out there. Some have an agenda and some are in it because they truly care about their patients and want to help us to provide the best possible care for our animals. We experience this in everything though - take the good with the bad and make the best decision with the information you have.

I also think there may be more of a tendency for raw feeders to gravitate more toward minimal vaccinations because of the species appropriate diet and its effects on supporting a healthy immune system. If you look at bordatella vaccinations, for example, many dogs can still contract it when vaccinated. How is this possible? It is due to the strains evolving, similar to viruses that affect humans such as the flu. We don't go out and get heavily vaccinated against all possible flu strains because we know it is impossible to vaccinate against them all, it isn't healthy to put that many toxins into our systems and if we maintain a healthy lifestyle, including exercise, good sleeping habits and healthy nutrition, we have a great chance of protecting ourselves naturally. When we let our systems be compromised, there is more of a chance of infection. This is also the case for taking too many antibiotics because we don't allow our system to develop a healthy defense mechanism on its own and therefore can become more susceptible to infection. I apologize for the departure from the raw diet, but I do believe proper nutrition and habits are linked to a healthy immune system. We all want the best for our animals - I am not trying to start a fight or tell people that feeding kibble is bad for their dogs. We need to help each other, learn and be open so we can create the best environment possible for ourselves and our beloved companions.


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## judegirl (Aug 14, 2009)

Since feeding raw my dogs are NEVER at the Vet. I have lost two dogs to bloat while on kibble yrs. ago but not since the raw diet. Ears are always healthy, breath is great,coats are amazing, energy is high, and the overall cost feeding raw is lower for me. Kibble is fine, I fed it for yrs. But my dogs are just better in every way on raw. I also have not had fleas in yrs. No "statistics" would change my mind when I have all the proof I need under my own roof. But I certainly agree that one has to follow what one is comfortable with. This is just an information sharing forum....right ?


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## Garfield (Apr 7, 2009)

AmbikaGR said:


> And although I do not know the numbers I have heard of many more cases of bloat, many fatal, caused by kibble than I have of salmonella or choking problems in raw fed dogs.


In fairness, given that a much higher percentage of the population currently feed commericial (and a poor one at that) v. raw, and that bloat can be attributed to other factors than just diet, that's to be expected. Also to the premise of the thread, grinding bones in raw feed can reduce risk of teeth/digestive complications if that is a concern.




> Been feeding raw for 12 years. Over that time I have had 2-3 dogs all on a raw diet. No issues other than my old girl at 11 years old "appeared" to have a problem handling it. I say "appeared" as at this time I think the diet was not an issue but at 13 + years of age she is doing well with I am now feeding (cooked) and I do not want to chance upsetting her system but switching her back to raw.


I'm looking at homecooked diet as an alternative to kibble and am looking for some testimony from anyone who has feed this type of diet successfully for a period of time (as it sounds you've done a couple years now). If you don't mind me asking, do you prepare the entire meal for your girl or use some an Honest Kitchen type product?


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

AmbikaGR said:


> And although I do not know the numbers I have heard of many more cases of bloat, many fatal, caused by kibble than I have of salmonella or choking problems in raw fed dogs.


I'm surprised to hear kibble cited as a cause of bloat. I thought it was usually an issue of air getting trapped in the stomach, not food matter.


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## Garfield (Apr 7, 2009)

judegirl said:


> Most of my friends feed Raw AND do treat for heartworm etc. but experience the same break down in their dogs stool. Not sure if you can completely attribute it to the use of chemicals. I'm just happy with the positive outcome I have with raw feeding in general. Took a 15 yr.old in for a complete check and the Vet said she checked out like a dog 10 yrs. younger. That's all I care about really.


Fabulous! Can I ask as one contemplating a switch to raw, has she been on a raw diet her entire life (if not, for how long)? Is regular bloodwork run on her and, if so, are all her levels within "normal" parameters?


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

tippykayak said:


> I'm surprised to hear kibble cited as a cause of bloat. I thought it was usually an issue of air getting trapped in the stomach, not food matter.


While I think the belief is a dog must have a predisposition to GDV (bloat) the food is definite contributing factor in my opinion. 

A 1991 study done by Perdue U. Veternarian School
http://www.vet.purdue.edu/epi/dietrisk.htm

A 2004 Perdue study
http://www.jaaha.org/cgi/content/abstract/42/1/28

A 2008 study also by Perdue did not vary greatly from the 1991 study. What was different is if you read the "Study Recommendations" at the end of the article states "The inclusion of human foods in a primarily dry dog food diet was associated with a 59 percent decreased risk of GDV while inclusion of canned pet foods was associated with a 28 percent decreased risk. When feeding dry food, also include foods with sufficient amounts of meats and meat meals, for example: beef, lamb, poultry, and fish. Feed a food with larger particles, and include larger pieces of meat to the diet."
http://www.sullyworld.co.uk/newforum/index.php?/topic/17806-new-purdue-bloat-study/


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

AmbikaGR said:


> While I think the belief is a dog must have a predisposition to GDV (bloat) the food is definite contributing factor in my opinion.
> 
> A 1991 study done by Perdue U. Veternarian School
> http://www.vet.purdue.edu/epi/dietrisk.htm
> ...


Hey Hank - thanks for the links. I'm interested in this because I've heard anecdotal reports of dogs with GDV having consumed lots of kibble before the event. I'm confused, though, that these studies are very small (one is just 11 dogs!) and appear to repeat information verbatim, so I'm a little concerned that it's maybe the same article getting reposted?

I'd love to see more comprehensive data on the issue. I can certainly believe that kibble, if gulped, leads to more air getting pulled into the stomach and thus a greater risk of GDV for predisposed dogs. Wet foods, like a raw diet, would carry lower risk. But so would a cooked wet diet.


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

Garfield said:


> In fairness, given that a much higher percentage of the population currently feed commericial (and a poor one at that) v. raw, and that bloat can be attributed to other factors than just diet, that's to be expected. Also to the premise of the thread, grinding bones in raw feed can reduce risk of teeth/digestive complications if that is a concern.


Absolutely! And not really! 
While I agree that bloat can be attributed to other contributing factors and the vast majority of dogs are fed a kibble based diet I do believe that a much higher percentage are fed a better quality one than even 10 years ago. Perdue found that bloat cases increased 1500% (fifteen hundred) in the 30 year period between 1964-1994. In fact in one of the Perdue studies (1997) they stated 
"This increase is unlikely to reflect changing diagnostic criteria or disease recognition. The increasing frequency of GDV starting about 1969 affected most of the large and giant dog breeds. Therefore, it is unlikely to be caused by genetic factors. However, this apparent epidemic of GDV coulld be explined by introduction of one or more novel enviromental factors such as a new ingredient in dry foods or a change in manufacturing processes."




Garfield said:


> I'm looking at homecooked diet as an alternative to kibble and am looking for some testimony from anyone who has feed this type of diet successfully for a period of time (as it sounds you've done a couple years now). If you don't mind me asking, do you prepare the entire meal for your girl or use some an Honest Kitchen type product?


Actually I would not recommend the diet I am feeding to my 13+ y/o to a younger dog. It is simply a diet, cooked boneless meat, that I can get her to eat without forcing and one that she is "maintaining" on. At her age and overall physical condition I know she is on the "downside" of years and it is much more important to me that she be happy, confortable and not starving herself. We go back to the vet this week to do blood work to ensure what I am doing is in her best interest and well being.


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

tippykayak said:


> Hey Hank - thanks for the links. I'm interested in this because I've heard anecdotal reports of dogs with GDV having consumed lots of kibble before the event. I'm confused, though, that these studies are very small (one is just 11 dogs!) and appear to repeat information verbatim, so I'm a little concerned that it's maybe the same article getting reposted?
> 
> I'd love to see more comprehensive data on the issue. I can certainly believe that kibble, if gulped, leads to more air getting pulled into the stomach and thus a greater risk of GDV for predisposed dogs. Wet foods, like a raw diet, would carry lower risk. But so would a cooked wet diet.


 
Though Perdue has published and done more research on this subject than an other organization that I am aware of there are many who woulld agree that much of the info appears to be repprinted almost verbatum study after study. The 2008 study as far as I am aware has not yet been published in it's entirety, just an abstract. And if you read most of the acceppted "causes" for bloat it is still a very misunderstood problem. Research indicates that a "wet" diet may be better in avoiding bloat, but wetting a dry food before feeding is a MAJOR contributing factor. 

The other thing that intriques me about the studies at Perdue and other Veternarian schools is that most of them get serious funding from the commercial pet food companies. And for them to come out and state that

"The inclusion of human foods in a primarily dry dog food diet was associated with a 59 percent decreased risk of GDV" 

is a rather bold and financially risky move. While not a true swipe at commercial food it is a jab.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

AmbikaGR said:


> Though Perdue has published and done more research on this subject than an other organization that I am aware of there are many who woulld agree that much of the info appears to be repprinted almost verbatum study after study. The 2008 study as far as I am aware has not yet been published in it's entirety, just an abstract. And if you read most of the acceppted "causes" for bloat it is still a very misunderstood problem. Research indicates that a "wet" diet may be better in avoiding bloat, but wetting a dry food before feeding is a MAJOR contributing factor.
> 
> The other thing that intriques me about the studies at Perdue and other Veternarian schools is that most of them get serious funding from the commercial pet food companies. And for them to come out and state that
> 
> ...


Yeah - I think that moistening dry food must contribute to air gulping because it discourages chewing. That would explain why smaller particle size also seemed to be a factor. A truly wet diet might be gulped a bit more, but wouldn't allow for as much air.

It's important to note that agitation is a key factor, both when food is involved with GDV and when it isn't.


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## judegirl (Aug 14, 2009)

Garfield said:


> Fabulous! Can I ask as one contemplating a switch to raw, has she been on a raw diet her entire life (if not, for how long)? Is regular bloodwork run on her and, if so, are all her levels within "normal" parameters?


I switched her to raw when she was 6 yrs. old. She had just survived surgery for bloat. She had blood work X 2 after that, all which was normal and lived to 15 yrs. But unfortunately I lost her this summer. I have a 2 1/2 yr. old male who comes from several generations of raw fed. He knows no other food. He was weaned straight to raw and his Mom and Grandmother were all fed raw. His Mom after his litter fed a litter of 13 pups with no problem and she was raw fed of course throughout. I don't tend to Vet my dogs that much as their energy and overall health is great. I think a home "cooked" meal is probably OK but does break down a lot of the goodness in raw food. I can't provide statistics, as I don't care about them. There is such a radical change in my dogs since raw feeding that it is enough for me. I am also surrounded by many raw feeding friends which helped to instill confidence in my starting raw feeding.


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## Golden101 (Mar 29, 2008)

I don't feed raw, however, I do give Sammy a raw steak/beef once a day, and have never had any problem with him getting sick. Many feed raw, and swear on there dog's improvements. I liked the idea of feeding raw, the principles behind it are sound for the most part.


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## Popebendgoldens (May 16, 2008)

Here are some resources if you want to feed a raw diet. www.rawmeatybones.com by Dr Tom Lonsdale, www.rawlearning.com age GREAT source for anyone thinking of starting to feed raw or for those who are just starting out. There are also many yahoo groups on raw feeding.

Once you have started to feed raw a great yahoo group to find raw meat is http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CarnivoreFeed-Supplier/.


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## Salt n Pepper (Sep 3, 2009)

Are you all feeding prey model raw diets or some other type such as barf?


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## Salt n Pepper (Sep 3, 2009)

Oop's. Sorry for the double post.


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