# Brand new to this!



## LEH28 (Jul 22, 2012)

Hello!

I am getting my first golden retriever in 3 weeks. He will be 3 months old when I bring him home and want to be well-versed by then in the right nutrients for his age/breed/etc. However, I feel a little overwhelmed. 

The top three I am considering are Orijen, Acana, and Blue Buffalo. But, I am reading about issues with loose stools, excess weight gain, etc. depending on the brand and bag [ie chicken-based, fish-based, etc]. Cost is somewhat concerning, so I was looking more to the second two. 

Any thoughts? I am willing to looking at other options, too. I think he is on a cheaper puppy chow currently.

Thanks!


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## Max's Dad (Apr 23, 2012)

Our experience. Max was on Purina Puppy Chow from the breeder. We briefly switched to Science Diet, but it did not agree with him. We switched to Eukanuba Large Breed Puppy, which he stayed on until about 16-17 months. He did very well on it.

His first adult food was Kirkland (Costco) chicken/rice.

Max has been on Acana Wild Prairie for about two months--he is two years old now. He is doing very well on the Acana. The Acana product is a little more expensive than the Eukanuba.


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## WasChampionFan (Mar 31, 2012)

LEH28 said:


> Hello!
> 
> I am getting my first golden retriever in 3 weeks. He will be 3 months old when I bring him home and want to be well-versed by then in the right nutrients for his age/breed/etc. However, I feel a little overwhelmed.
> 
> ...


I can't comment on Blue Buffalo other than I find it amazing a company like that has so many formulas made in so many places.

The other two are internet love toys with generally very poor results, very poor quality control, dubious ingredient claims and suspicions of forum stooges. The cost of these two are more than excessive and the company has no expertise in nutrition that I can see. When the company was sold, they kept it quiet and the website still had the old CEO for months after.

I would recommend Dr. Tim's, Annamaet, Precise (the standard foods), Nutrisource (non-grain free), Victor, Eukanuba, Pro Plan, Bil-Jac and Enhance.

The business of feeding dogs has turned into making you believe feeding it like a baby is a good idea, of course at a high price.

Don't use a food unless the company has a strong foundation in competition even if your dog will just be a pet.

You will find the best examples of any breed eat simple chicken and rice kibbles. The other thing is don't get trapped into ingredient phobias because they are generally baseless but it is amazing how they continue, especially grains and allergies.


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

I suggest you keep your puppy on whatever the breeder is feeding for at least a month or so, just to allow him to settle in. Then if you still want to switch his food be sure to do it gradually. 

I've been feeding my Tucker Purina Pro Plan with excellent results. It's a high quality tried and true product at a decent price. I gave him puppy food for a year, and recently switched him to all life stages. I probably won't change him except for medical necessity. 

You'll find many theories of dog nutrition on here and many preferences for food brands. One of the nice things about having a dog these days is that there are quite a few decent foods available, although sorting thru them all can be daunting. 

It's good that you're researching al this ahead of time. Be sure to come back and share some pictures.


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

WasChampionFan said:


> I can't comment on Blue Buffalo other than I find it amazing a company like that has so many formulas made in so many places.
> 
> *The other two are internet love toys with generally very poor results, very poor quality control, dubious ingredient claims and suspicions of forum stooges. The cost of these two are more than excessive and the company has no expertise in nutrition that I can see.* When the company was sold, they kept it quiet and the website still had the old CEO for months after.


Can you please provide your sources for these generalizations? And cite the scientific research please. I'm very interested to see.


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## skeller (Mar 5, 2008)

WasChampionFan said:


> I can't comment on Blue Buffalo other than I find it amazing a company like that has so many formulas made in so many places.
> 
> The other two are internet love toys with generally very poor results, very poor quality control, dubious ingredient claims and suspicions of forum stooges. The cost of these two are more than excessive and the company has no expertise in nutrition that I can see. When the company was sold, they kept it quiet and the website still had the old CEO for months after.
> 
> ...


 I am currently using Annamaet Option, and it's been great. Benny's coat is so full and shiny. The dogs love it. My only concern is the price, and the fact that I have to order it on line. Do you think any of the other foods mentionned would be as good, but at a lower price, and more easily available.


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## sswope4 (Jul 9, 2012)

I do know Diamond products....blue buffalo and canidae have been recalled many times in the past six years for salmonella.....my vet recommend royal canin, iams, or science diet. My pup, Isabel is seven weeks old and I switched her from purina puppy to royal canin large breed puppy food. She loves it!! I water it down for her to soften it.


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## artbuc (Apr 12, 2009)

Rocky has been on Orijen 6Fish for a couple years and has done extremely well on it. His vet was highly complimentary on his last visit. I am about to make a change primarily to get to a USA based food but will not hesitate to go back to 6Fish. I am concerned about management changes at Champion just as some Natura feeders are concernd about the P&G takeover. I am also concerned about tensions between the plant and local residents who complain about odors. Perhaps the odor issue has been resolved? I have not researched it lately.


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## CarolinaCasey (Jun 1, 2007)

What is the breeder feeding? I would feed what the breeder has been feeding for the first 2-3 weeks, maybe longer. There is a lot of stress in bringing a new puppy home. You don't want to compound that by changing his diet so soon. 

From your list, I would choose Acana. I'm feeding Fromm and Earthborn and am happy with the results. You don't need to break the bank to find a quality food. There are a variety of good foods to choose from out there are a multitude of price points. I would caution the use of Blue Buffalo-- everyone I know that has tried it never got firm stool for their pets. It is very rich and in my experience seems to give a lot of GI distress to puppies and adult dogs.


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## Swampcollie (Sep 6, 2007)

WasChampionFan said:


> I would recommend Dr. Tim's, Annamaet, Precise (the standard foods), Nutrisource (non-grain free), Victor, Eukanuba, Pro Plan, Bil-Jac and Enhance.


I pretty much concur with these options. 

Most of them produce good foods at reasonable prices. We've been feeding Euk for a very long time with good results. Others have fed Pro Plan for decades with solid proven results. 

You don't have to pay two or three dollars a pound to get proper nutrition for your dog or puppy.


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## Jige (Mar 17, 2011)

There are so many choices for dog food it is minding boggling. If I were you I would read the ingredients of the food you are thinking about see how they compare then find out how readily available they are for you and the price make sure that you will always have the funds for what you want and then make your choice. 
I do think that you should take it slow in switching your dog over to the food you wish to feed.


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## vcm5 (Apr 20, 2011)

I am also feeding Fromm and I LOVE it!


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## LEH28 (Jul 22, 2012)

*thank you!*

Thanks for the thoughts. I was also concerned about the changes in ownership and recalls of various brands. I will definitely be slow to switch- thanks for that reminder. Fromm seems to be a brand that has mostly positive reviews and experiences as far as what I have seen on the forum in previous threads and also elsewhere online. It is also available locally here in Nashville so I will go price it and see how compares with other online options. 

I am still up for other ideas, I have time to look and evaluate, especially since I won't be changing his diet for a little bit.


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## WasChampionFan (Mar 31, 2012)

skeller said:


> I am currently using Annamaet Option, and it's been great. Benny's coat is so full and shiny. The dogs love it. My only concern is the price, and the fact that I have to order it on line. Do you think any of the other foods mentionned would be as good, but at a lower price, and more easily available.


You can get it locally just ask a few of your local stores to call the distributor Sport N' Life in Stamford and order it. It will probably be $50 - $55 for the 40lb bag. There are stores in Queens that carry it as well.

I would not order Annamaet on line. Dr. Tim's though is very well priced on PetFlow.


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## WasChampionFan (Mar 31, 2012)

Swampcollie said:


> I pretty much concur with these options.
> 
> Most of them produce good foods at reasonable prices. We've been feeding Euk for a very long time with good results. Others have fed Pro Plan for decades with solid proven results.
> 
> You don't have to pay two or three dollars a pound to get proper nutrition for your dog or puppy.


Pro Plan is the weakest of the ones I posted because of the liberal use of corn gluten and wheat and rather high price tag. Eukanuba just raised prices so the value proposition is less but the Premium Performance are great foods. The shredded foods are horrible in my opinion.

Pro Plan makes great stools because of the corn gluten. It is like cement.

The biggest rip offs are the foods from Petcurean, these are just repackaged Nutram foods.

Fromm is ok but Classics is the best line, the others are just more money for the same product.


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

WasChampionFan said:


> Pro Plan is the weakest of the ones I posted because of the liberal use of corn gluten and wheat and rather high price tag. Eukanuba just raised prices so the value proposition is less but the Premium Performance are great foods. The shredded foods are horrible in my opinion.
> 
> Pro Plan makes great stools because of the corn gluten. It is like cement.
> 
> ...


Can you share your research with us? How do you back up your statements?


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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

WasChampionFan said:


> I can't comment on Blue Buffalo other than I find it amazing a company like that has so many formulas made in so many places.
> 
> *The other two are internet love toys with generally very poor results, very poor quality control, dubious ingredient claims and suspicions of forum stooges. The cost of these two are more than excessive and the company has no expertise in nutrition that I can see. When the company was sold, they kept it quiet and the website still had the old CEO for months after.*
> 
> ...


 
What a crock! I have fed the 'other two' to six dogs, and numerous (over 60) foster dogs, for four and a half years, that is four and a half years of 'research' with no issues what so ever. The foster dogs improved from skinny, boney bodies and dull coats to healthy, happy well fed dogs in just a few weeks. My dogs have all done extremely well on both the Orijen and the Acana they are happy healthy, energetic, look good and feel good and do back flips for it. Before switching to Orijen/Acana my dogs were suffering from recurring ear infections, uti's, hot spots, dull coats since switching all of those problems have disappeared, if it were truly a 'crap' food, the changes I have seen would not have happened.
On the surface it may seem expensive but when you look at the quantity and quality of the food needed fed to keep a dog healthy - less than 2 cups/day for my 70 lb adult golden, with an average active lifestyle it is extremely 'cost effective'. The food I was using before required feeding 3 to 4 1/2 cups/day to supply the nutritional needs for that dog so I was going through a bag of food twice as fast and my dogs had health issues on it, so it actually cost me more (long run) to feed the 'lower priced' food.
The bottom line is food choice for your dog is not just about price, it is about the long term health benefits of feeding the dog what works for them. Sometimes you have to try a few brands to see what really does work well as each dog is different, but Acana and Orijen have done wonders for my dogs and I would highly recommend to anyone to give it a try.


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## artbuc (Apr 12, 2009)

Charlietree, do you live close to Morinville? Do you think Champion will eventually have to relocate away from town?


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## MikaTallulah (Jul 19, 2006)

Feed what works best for you and your pet 

I feed mine all FROMM's Chicken a la Veg and Honest Kitchen Force as a topper.

My Yorkies got chunky on both Wellness and Blue Buffalo but no GI issues. The Yorkies could eat any kibble and not have GI issues- Terriers for ya  Buddy, Golden, could not tolerate them well and neither could my previous golden, Lucky.

In my experience Goldens have sensitive tummies. They are a very sensitive breed 

Lucky ate Proplan his entire life and lived to be almost 13- He never slowed down. Bug for personal reasons I will NEVER feed it again. The company does not work for me anymore. They own Waggin Train and Canyon Creek- The Jerky treats are making dogs sick & killing some. I lost my beloved Zoey to them.

Buddy did well on it (large slightly soft but always formed poops) but since switching him to FROMM his poops are great- Much smaller and not that smelly.

Welcome to the group


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

OutWest said:


> Can you share your research with us? How do you back up your statements?


I tried asking for research earlier. Funnily enough, my post was ignored. I'm not sure why. The poster MUST have research to make such claims.


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

Sweet Girl said:


> I tried asking for research earlier. Funnily enough, my post was ignored. I'm not sure why. The poster MUST have research to make such claims.


I asked before, too, and was ignored. Hmmmmm...:uhoh:


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## WasChampionFan (Mar 31, 2012)

Research on what??? If you are not aware of the things I mentioned then you need to open your eyes.

The story about how they buy fish by-products that used to be thrown away is absolutely precious. The company even boasted that it used to pay to dispose them.

Google that plus Griffin Industries.


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## Max's Dad (Apr 23, 2012)

RE Champion Pet Foods. All I can find is that they have had some issues with odors from their plant, which they are addressing. I have also found that odors coming from pet food manufacturing facilities is a common problem for the pet food industry. 

Max has been eating Acana Wild Prairie for a couple of months, with no problems. His coat looks better, his stools look good, and he has plenty of energy.


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## Max's Dad (Apr 23, 2012)

WasChampionFan said:


> Research on what??? If you are not aware of the things I mentioned then you need to open your eyes.
> 
> The story about how they buy fish by-products that used to be thrown away is absolutely precious. The company even boasted that it used to pay to dispose them.
> 
> Google that plus Griffin Industries.


My eyes are open.

The product you are referring to is minced fish by-products that are extracted during the filleting process. Prior to providing this product to Champion, the company, Freshwater Fish, had no option but to discard this product. They provided the product to Champion for testing. Turns out the by-product could be used in dog food. Just because the by-product cannot be used for humans, does not mean it cannot be processed for use in pet food. The minced fish by-product likely was used to make fish meal. 

So what if the product used to be thrown away? A viable use was found for the product. Dog food is loaded with by-products, from fish, beef, lamb, chicken, and other animals. 

I Googled Griffin Industries but found no smoking gun about pet food.

For some reason, you have some sort of grudge against Champion Pet Foods. I saw that you post in at least two other dog forums. I have never seen you post about any dogs you might own on our forum. I do not know what your motives are or why you choose to monitor our forum about dog food. I do, however, find your negative comments misleading, at best.

Here is the link to the newsletter about the Champion use of the fish by-product, for those who are interested. 
http://www.freshwaterfish.com/system/files/L2PNewsletter%20Winter%202011.pdf


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## WasChampionFan (Mar 31, 2012)

Griffin Industries in Alabama has been a supplier of chicken meal to the company, so much for "regional Canadian ingredients". If you look there is a letter from Bonnie confirming that chicken meal from the USA is used. On public record documents Griffin listed as a supplier.

As for the fish, well again I think it is pretty misleading if you advertise "fresh never frozen" and it turns out to be the same quality product that is sold for hog feed. They make it sound like an old man with a lovely white beard gets in a little boat to bring fish back to the plant. 

There have been many recalls, including using a mad cow positive animal in a food it was making for a chain store, there was a fish bone recall and when you look at the freedom of information documents that a women in Australia was able to get, you get a much clearer picture of the issue. There were also significant quality issues when the pork formula was first sold. I know a guy that almost lost a dog. Why is Reinhard Muhlenfeld still shown as the CEO?

Every company is entitled to market, but what this company does is beyond marketing. 

I only care because lots of nice people get sucked into spending money on this food.


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## MikaTallulah (Jul 19, 2006)

LEH28 said:


> Thanks for the thoughts. I was also concerned about the changes in ownership and recalls of various brands. I will definitely be slow to switch- thanks for that reminder. Fromm seems to be a brand that has mostly positive reviews and experiences as far as what I have seen on the forum in previous threads and also elsewhere online. It is also available locally here in Nashville so I will go price it and see how compares with other online options.
> 
> I am still up for other ideas, I have time to look and evaluate, especially since I won't be changing his diet for a little bit.


FROMM has been making pet food since WW2 and never had a recall.
History - Fromm Family Foods


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## LEH28 (Jul 22, 2012)

I did decide to try Fromm first. I think I will try the Duck/Sweet Potato ALS rather than LPB based on what I've read so far. I can get it locally at a holistic shop in Nashville which is also a plus. I am still a little unsure of some ingredients in the Fromm LPB. I noticed low-ash lamb was an ingredient and I was under the assumption that ash is bad... though I have also been reading there are some minerals in ash that are not so bad for dogs... again, so many opinions and contradictory information is out there. I am glad to know you guys are around to bounce ideas off and gain wisdom from experiences of other golden retriever owners!


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## Blondie (Oct 10, 2009)

Duck and Sweet potatoe is a very good option. That is the first Fromm that Maggie started on before any of the others.


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## Rigby1017 (Jul 23, 2012)

Hi there!

We have a 6 month old so we are very familiar with regulating a diet for a pup.... We started Rigby on Canidae All Stages Adult food (our breeder recommended NOT utilizing puppy food at all)..... We had him on that for a while until a recall prompted us to change foods altogether. We now have him on Purina Propet Selects Turkey & Barley Adult Food.... We were told to be mindful of corn as many goldens are allergic.

After we were able to get him situated after the Canidae change, he is doing great. Good stools, and solid weight gain without being overweight.... He loves his food and is a happy happy pup!!!

Good luck!!!

- Debra


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## Golden&Yorkie (Mar 11, 2012)

Skipper is on Orijen 6 fish and the adult formula. We switch between the two. We've never had an issue. We also have never had an issue with weight gain or loose stools. With that being said, every dog is different and may do better in a different food. Best of luck in your search. 

Also, I think everyone will have both positive and negative things to say about every food. You need to find what works best for you.


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