# What's the deal with vets and Hills?



## Bonni (Apr 12, 2005)

So, I've figured out that vets probably get a kickback from Hills brand every time they sell their food, but WHY?

Daisy has just been diagnosed with colitis so the vet put her on Hills Prescription W/D which is formulated for a whole bunch of GI issues, colitis being one of them. She likes it and is eating it but I've noticed two major issues..

1. She poops 3 times per walk now, whereas on the Fromm Salmon food we were feeding her before, she had 2 poops a day, MAYBE. I know there is an increase in fibre in this food, but it just seems weird. Not to be gross, but her poop also smells like vitamins (guess that's better than the normal smell, but still...not quite right).

2. The first ingredients in this food are corn and corn by-products. There is no major protein source until the 4th or 5th ingredient and then it's chicken by-products. I am not sure if I'm comfortable with this.

So, I've decided to make the switch to Eagle Pack, since they have a formula that would be suitable for her condition. I still wonder what the deal is between vets and Hills brand. How can a vet push a product that they know is substandard? Makes me scratch my head. Do they have a choice? Will the local vet association revoke their license if they don't push this brand? Hmmm...it all seems very curious to me. 

Any input is appreciated. 
Bonni


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## GoldenJoyx'stwo (Feb 25, 2007)

My Vet doesn't like the fact he has to carry Hill's prescription diets. They take up too much space that can be used for something more productive. The kickback is very small and not worth the time or the money. 

My cats are on C/D for UTI's. Might not be great ingredients, but it sure keeps the UTI's from coming back.

Interesting article. Don't know how reliable a source it is.
Vet Recommended Dog Foods


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## moverking (Feb 26, 2007)

Ohhhh, I went through this when Loocie was diagnosed with hip dysplasia after a knee injury. She had been on Nutro LB, the vet was adamant that Science diet J/D was the way to go to prevent further degeneration. I noted corn as the first ingredient and was very skeptical. I left her on it for 3 months. Her coat was awful, skin greasy, she did NOT like the taste, and she pooped like an elephant. No change in hips.
So I educated myself and learned LOADS from the forum....I'll never use Science diet again. 
Now we're on Canidae (but also had good results going back on the Nutro) with cosequin DS as a joint supp, and Wellactin for Omega 3's. Their coats, skin, poops are GReat, and no further hip probs.
I'd say research, and toss the Science Diet. Dogs are carnivores, not cows


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## Goldilocks (Jun 3, 2007)

I know a young man who has been a veterinarian for just over 1 year now. He got a dog as a graduation gift and guess what the dog eats....Science Diet! When I see him in a couple weeks I am going to ask him why he choose Science Diet for his dog and just sort of ask if he could recommend something for my GR as her skin is very dry.... just to see what I am told. I believe that certain companies promote their products to the vet schools, the kids graduate as vets, are familiar with certain foods and treats and that's what they stick with. I remember him coming home at Christmas time every year with buckets of Iams biscuits and cat treats given to him free at the vet school by the companies. He would bring them over for our pets. The buckets of Science Diet I have seen in his garage are not the typical type you could buy at PetSmart so it must be given free by the companies or something.


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## Thor's Mom (Feb 25, 2007)

One reason vets recommend the foods an educated consumer wouldn't buy is that they're not given a lot of educational time on foods and ingredients. The other main reason is the financial incentives they get from stocking and selling it. If your vet thinks your pet needs a special type of food (i.e., sensitive stomach, weight loss, low protein, etc.) check several brands and see which one makes the best sense for your pet. For the most part food is not a vet's area of expertise.


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## TheHooch (May 9, 2007)

The kick back isd extremely small to the vet but it is huge to the vet schools. I haven't been to a college football staduim yet that had a vet school that didn't have Hills throughout the staduim.

Hooch


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

These companies do huge amounts of research on these types of special conditions and the nutritional needs for them. I think that is why they have the trust and confidence of vets. 

I don't think Science Diet has the highest quality protein source or ingredients, but if Lucky had a special health condition and my vet recomended a certain Science formula meant for that condition I would have trust in it.

Otherwise I choose foods that I deem more premium.

I like this page as it gives a summary of some of the work that goes into these special food. Some of the "premium" companies don't do this type of thing and don't have the expertise.

Dog Owner's Guide: Iams Nutrition Symposium


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## moverking (Feb 26, 2007)

The on-going research is *extremely important*...and was a large part of my vet's argument for Science Diet. But _my_ dogs didn't do well on it, and I don't like corn as a 1st ingredient. Truly, this is my opinion, and there will be many arguments for and against it. And I always learn something new .

And, IMHO, I don't think the vet schools teach enough on nutrition.


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

moverking said:


> The on-going research is *extremely important*...and was a large part of my vet's argument for Science Diet. But _my_ dogs didn't do well on it, and I don't like corn as a 1st ingredient. Truly, this is my opinion, and there will be many arguments for and against it. And I always learn something new .
> 
> And, IMHO, I don't think the vet schools teach enough on nutrition.


Gosh, I agree that you need to decide whats best for your dog based on what you know and what you feel comfortable with. No one source should be..."god" so to speak. And if Lucky had effects that seemed detrimental, I'd change too.


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## KatzNK9 (Feb 27, 2007)

I used c/d & a/d for cats but under duress. My new vet has TVs in the waiting room & each exam room that is all advertising for Hills. He must get a bigger cutback than most. Chaps my @ss.


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## moverking (Feb 26, 2007)

Lucky's mom said:


> Gosh, I agree that you need to decide whats best for your dog based on what you know and what you feel comfortable with. No one source should be..."god" so to speak. And if Lucky had effects that seemed detrimental, I'd change too.


Oh, I wasn't upset...just sharing. 
There's so much to learn.....and so many recalls to stay on top of, almost ready to feed raw


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## Dog (Sep 26, 2006)

Yep when we first got Amber she was on Hills Science Plan!!! It is not a good quality food, but it is flogged by vets who are on commission (that includes ours to my dismay!!). However when it comes to food I have never asked my vet for advice once I saw what is on his shelves!!!


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## Lucky's mom (Nov 4, 2005)

moverking said:


> Oh, I wasn't upset...just sharing.
> There's so much to learn.....and so many recalls to stay on top of, almost ready to feed raw


Ha ha well I wasn't sure. You know how food subjects go and I wasn't sure how I came across.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

My vet uses Purina brand prescription food. I thought that was interesting.


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Well, at the risk of being flogged, I sometimes feed Daisy Science Diet prescription diet dog food to help manage her weight -- which is very critical with her ACL injury/recovery. It's an ongoing struggle, she gains weight so easily. I like to feed her raw and I do supplement because I think food she really enjoys is good for her spirit, but once in awhile we do the SD regimen .... and it works.

:hide:


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## BeauShel (May 20, 2007)

I have to say I am very lucky. My vet doesnt push the dog food on me. He did give me the Purina ED after Beau's bloat surgery but once Beau was well, he didnt keep pushing it on me. He just wanted a good quality venison food for his stomach issues. So he must not be the norm.


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## TheHooch (May 9, 2007)

I see there is one good vet in Texas and Florida. LOL

Hooch


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

My cat was on Science Diet because he almost died about 11 years ago from urinary tract problems. I was told he would always be prone to them. After a couple months, I just put him on a higher quality pet store cat food, and never had another problem. He is now 16 years old.


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## TheHooch (May 9, 2007)

Wow 16 years old.

Hooch


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

TheHooch said:


> I see there is one good vet in Texas and Florida. LOL
> 
> Hooch


At least she thinks for herself. The ingredients in the Purina prescription diets are not any better than SD though. Why do they always have whole ground corn as the first ingredient?


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## Dog (Sep 26, 2006)

Incidentally I stopped Hills because Amber started eating her poos!!! Apparently when you feed food like Hills the poop smell so good that the pups go for it!! They think it is yummm :uhoh::yuck::uhoh:


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## gold4me (Mar 12, 2006)

The Hills Prescription diets(some of them) contain BHT BHA and even ethoxiquin. Very bad!


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## Bonni (Apr 12, 2005)

Thanks for everyone's feedback. I have put Daisy back on her regular holisitc brand and everything is fine now. Poops are back to normal, thank heavens.

I told my vet that I've put her back on and he didn't really comment. Hey...my dog, my choice. 

Thanks again for the feedback.

Hope everyone is dong well.

Bonni


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## GoldenShamus (Feb 26, 2007)

Reps from a variety of dog companies visit veterinary hospitals (same way pharmaceutical reps visit doctor's offices, hence all of the free samples of products they have). Vet offices get a kickback for selling and promoting their products.

I have never found my vet to push ANY products on us, but when I told her what duck food I was feeding, I was pleased that she didn't try to promote the duck formula they sell at the office.


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