# Torn between breeds: GR vs BMD



## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

So I know the answer I'll probably get being this is a Golden Retriever forum, but I set out to adopt a dog. Originally, a Golden Retriever because I just love the breed so much and my sister has two that I adore so I wanted to get one of my own. However as I was researching dogs in general I came across Bernese Mountain Dogs and instantly fell in love with their look, and from my reading they have amazing personalities. Both breeds seem sort of similar in temperament. I've had a lot of problems finding a Golden breeder, even a couple who got back to me and told me I'd be a good home, stopped returning my emails for some reason. However I found a good breeder of Bernese Mountain Dogs who has pups available now. Pic of puppies below

HOWEVER, she also just bred her two goldens together because her father wanted a new dog so she happens to have a few golden puppies as well. The sire, she used to show until he cut his mouth on an underground pipe, he only had his prelims done, but he's 10 now. No problems. The dam has hips, elbow, and eyes, no heart though, but she's healthy too. Her mom lived to be 15. Photos below are of Macy at 1.5 years, and River at 2 years(he's now 10)

Price isn't a total factor, but her BMD pups are 2500 which is inline with all the GR breeders I've seen. Her GR pups are only 1000 since she just did a one off breeding for her dad. 

Just wondering if anyone had experience with both breed?

Other considerations: 
I live in an apartment. About 1100 sq ft. The complex has a large dog run in the back though. Also there's several parks nearby.

I'm not the most active person which is one reason I liked the Berners, there a bit less active. I will be ramping it up obviously with a new dog no matter what, and am excited to go for walks with them and take them places, but I don't really hike.

I live in Los Angeles, it doesn't get too hot here except in the summer, but it's not exactly the BMD's natural habitat, however there are very large clubs in both SoCal and NorCal so I know they can do well here. My apartment has AC.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Golden retrievers are healthier.....

Lot of cancer problems with BMD's + temperament issues + joint problems.


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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

Golden.....


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

Megora said:


> Golden retrievers are healthier.....
> 
> Lot of cancer problems with BMD's + temperament issues + joint problems.


Lots of Cancer with Goldens too.

Read nothing about temperament issues with BMD's. And joint issues are problems with both breeds which is why going with a good breeder for both is important.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

wsaunders1014 said:


> Lots of Cancer with Goldens too.
> 
> Read nothing about temperament issues with BMD's. And joint issues are problems with both breeds which is why going with a good breeder for both is important.


The cancer stuff with goldens is more frequently on the back end of their lives when they are old dogs.

Cancer stuff with BMD's is unfortunately by age 8, and before.

And joint issues are a problem as well - not just because of genetics, but their size too.

This is with even very good breeders who love the breed. 

And temperament problems are there. Most that I've seen have problems with temperament.

They are kinda stuck between a rock and a hard place because the breeding pool is very small unlike with breeds like golden retrievers.


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## rabernet (Feb 24, 2015)

I love Berners too - but their life expectancy is shorter than goldens. Also - since you are in an apartment, you may want to check the weight limitations with your management.


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## jwemt81 (Aug 20, 2008)

For what it's worth, my cousins had a BMD and he only lived to be 7-1/2. Nothing but health issue after health issue, and he was from a very reputable breeder. Cancer is common in both breeds, but Goldens do typically have a longer lifespan. BMDs are also much more prone to cardiac issues and heat stroke.


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## Rundlemtn (Jan 16, 2015)

I also love BMD's! But, I opted for a golden and will continue to opt for a golden for 4 reasons: 1) golden retrievers live longer [typically], 2) they shed less, 3) they do not tend to bark as much, and 4) they are more of a love everyone dog, rather than just love you. 

BMD's are beautiful for sure. But, they are no golden. And fyi, I raised my girl in a 650 sq. ft. apartment. She just needed to get her daily exercise. Even now with my much larger house, she just stays with me in whatever room I am in, until she gets out for her exercise. 

Best of luck with your decision!


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## ArchersMom (May 22, 2013)

I wouldn't expect a Bernese to be as great with small children or strangers, just as a generalization. But they are friendly and a well bred dog should have a stable temperament. Being a larger dog with a heavier coat, expect even more hair and a shorter lifespan. I really like BMD's too but they are very different than Goldens. I'd say go with whichever dog you really want.


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

Bernese mountain dogs usually only live to be about 8 yo. They are beautiful.


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## Cpc1972 (Feb 23, 2015)

My neighbor at our old house had to have a BMD puppy pur down because of HD. I do not know if they could of fixed him or they just opted to PTS instead of fixing him. Also don’t know how bad he was.


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## CoopersMom16 (Dec 29, 2016)

My cousin has had several BMDs. She just loves them. They all seemed to have good temperaments as far as I know. But all of them died of cancer by age 8 or 9. They also were surprisingly active when healthy for a very large dog.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

My breeder says her BMD's live to be about 10 to 11.


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## Simbadoo'smom (Dec 15, 2017)

Golden's rule!! Absolutely love them! Can't live without one!


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## Nate83 (Jul 13, 2017)

Three things,
First; whatever you gut is telling go with it, your gut feeling is 99% right. Second; do a pros and cons list. Third; think of everything you are going to get with both breeds. I made a ad-hawk purchase and ill be 100% honest i regretted not doing my homework like i did with Athena but if it wasn't for Angel i would not have meet Robin (Prism) who opened my eyes to a whole world of things to do. Just my two cents


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## TheZ's (Jun 13, 2011)

Well bred Berners are supposed to have a friendly, easy going personality. They're nice looking and their fans love them. On the down side, they're considerably larger than a Golden and their average life span is definitely shorter than the average for Goldens. They have a very heavy coat and I don't think they like the heat. We had a neighbor who had one and it spent it's days during the summer laying under a bush in front of their house. I understand that they were originally bred to serve as carting dogs, i.e. to pull a loaded cart. We have one in our current rally class. I believe he's over 100lbs., very handsome, generally well behaved and attentive to his owner, not particularly interested in other dogs or people. I think his owner (who's owned a number of Berners) said they shed a lot.

eta: My recollection is hearing that the average life expectancy was about 7-8 yrs. So I would want to verify claims that a breeder's dogs were living to 10-11 yrs.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

It's just her word, but average means that some dogs must live longer.


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## Vika the Golden ! (Jun 18, 2017)

I am half Swiss and have seen a lot of them in Switzerland. My dad's best friend had one. There are a lot of problems with this breed of dog. I remember him getting double hip replacement surgery at 16 months old, when he became about 5 he started having cardiac problems. At the age of 7 he got cancer and died. What I want to point out is the fact that he was purchased from the best breeder in Switzerland. I would get a golden and that's mainly because of the smaller size and because they shed a lot less !

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## ScottyUSN (Jul 18, 2011)

I had the same issue with Golden and Leonberger. My solution was to get both 

That said. The Berner's life expectancy is shorter than the GR, for that reason only "if" I had to pick one, it would be the GR.


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## rabernet (Feb 24, 2015)

It sounds like your mind is already made up, since you keep countering what people are telling you about Berners. Not sure if that's because you have your heart set on them, or because there are puppies on the ground and you can have a puppy sooner though? 

I would be very suspect of a breeder who claims her dogs live longer than the average.


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## Sweet Girl (Jun 10, 2010)

I think the breed is lovely. Way too much fur for me - and just too big for me (though I don't think the size of your house would matter). 

There are several in my neighbourhood - I have yet to see one that wasn't limping or hopping funny due to hip issues. :frown2:


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## Pytheis (Mar 17, 2016)

I love BMDs too, but I will never own one. I couldn't handle the short life span and the health issues. They are an extremely expensive breed between finding a good breeder, the cost of tons of food, and in general, a lot of health issues. You will have to be very careful. I also, and this is completely my opinion, do not like the sound of this breeder. She bred an entire litter of puppies just because her dad wanted a puppy? And the parent dogs aren't even fully health tested? That does not sound reputable to me, and I would be wary of all the claims she is making health and lifespan wise.

Like another member said, it sounds like you have already decided in your heart what you want to get. Go with that! We would love to see pictures when you bring your pup home, no matter what breed. 

Also:
http://www.yourpurebredpuppy.com/reviews/bernesemountaindogs.html
http://www.yourpurebredpuppy.com/reviews/goldenretrievers.html


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## murphy1 (Jun 21, 2012)

The life expectancy is 7 to 8 years. After owning a mastiff and loosing him at less than 6 1/2, I'd say stick with the Golden and not set yourself up for the heartbreak I experienced.


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## BrianO (Apr 7, 2016)

I love BMDs. A well bred BMD is a great choice. I found GRs to be more predictable and longer lived. A BMD would suffer in my Midwest home in the summer. Quite happy with having a GR and admiring BMDs from afar.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

rabernet said:


> It sounds like your mind is already made up, since you keep countering what people are telling you about Berners. Not sure if that's because you have your heart set on them, or because there are puppies on the ground and you can have a puppy sooner though?
> 
> I would be very suspect of a breeder who claims her dogs live longer than the average.


I know, I am very torn still, but every time I see a Bernese puppy I swoon. Of course no puppy stays a puppy. I am in an odd position of the breeder happening to have both puppies ready. So I could get either which is what makes the decision a little tougher. If she didn't have Goldens, I'd get the Berner just because I can get it now as opposed to waiting for a few months for a Golden.

She is a breeder of merit with Berners, and has been breeding for thirty years so she has a long line and a lot of history to go off of. But you're right to be skeptic.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

Pytheis said:


> I love BMDs too, but I will never own one. I couldn't handle the short life span and the health issues. They are an extremely expensive breed between finding a good breeder, the cost of tons of food, and in general, a lot of health issues. You will have to be very careful. I also, and this is completely my opinion, do not like the sound of this breeder. She bred an entire litter of puppies just because her dad wanted a puppy? And the parent dogs aren't even fully health tested? That does not sound reputable to me, and I would be wary of all the claims she is making health and lifespan wise.
> 
> Like another member said, it sounds like you have already decided in your heart what you want to get. Go with that! We would love to see pictures when you bring your pup home, no matter what breed.
> 
> ...


Thanks I've viewed both dogs on that site, it's a very good list of pros and cons.

I've been told to be skeptical of breeders who breed more than one type of dog, but it sort of makes sense to me. She's a breeder of dogs, and has a male and female GR. Why not do a one off breeding? I guess the sire just has his prelims. She said after he got injured she stopped showing and didn't care to follow up since she wasn't planning on breeding or showing. His mom lived to 15 and had no issues, and from what she said almost all his ancestors had BISS CH and some HoF. So even though it may not be the most responsible breeding in the world, theres a high chance that the puppies are going to be healthy compared to say a backyard breeder. Also she has priced the puppies very frugally at only 1000. There are breeders with zero info on their lines who are charging 3000 in my area, so sounds like shes just trying to get rid of them and recoup the cost of whelping them.


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## Pytheis (Mar 17, 2016)

wsaunders1014 said:


> I've been told to be skeptical of breeders who breed more than one type of dog, but it sort of makes sense to me. She's a breeder of dogs, and has a male and female GR. Why not do a one off breeding? I guess the sire just has his prelims. She said after he got injured she stopped showing and didn't care to follow up since she wasn't planning on breeding or showing. His mom lived to 15 and had no issues, and from what she said almost all his ancestors had BISS CH and some HoF. So even though it may not be the most responsible breeding in the world, theres a high chance that the puppies are going to be healthy compared to say a backyard breeder. Also she has priced the puppies very frugally at only 1000. There are breeders with zero info on their lines who are charging 3000 in my area, so sounds like shes just trying to get rid of them and recoup the cost of whelping them.


I'm glad you've done some research on her! If you're confident in her breedings, I would go for it. I may have missed it or forgotten what you said, but what do you plan to do with your dog? Do you live in a hot climate?


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> I guess the sire just has his prelims. She said after he got injured she stopped showing and didn't care to follow up since she wasn't planning on breeding or showing.


Well, quite obviously a breeding happened.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

Pytheis said:


> I'm glad you've done some research on her! If you're confident in her breedings, I would go for it. I may have missed it or forgotten what you said, but what do you plan to do with your dog? Do you live in a hot climate?


Sort of. I live in Los Angeles, which stays in the 70's most of the year, however it does get hot during the summer. All the breeders I've spoken too say as long as you're watchful it's not an issue. Limit exercise to cooler morning and evening periods, Make sure you have water and shade if you're outside during a hot day. The local club is pretty large and there's also a large club in Arizona so it can work. Though it is a concern.

I'd like to potentially get into Obedience or Agility, but for now just looking for a companion.


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## Goldens&Friesians (May 31, 2014)

I don't know a whole lot about Berners, but I can tell you what I do know. I work as a groomer and have groomed a couple of them. Two of them have sketchy temperaments, but their structure is weird too, so I suspect bad breeding. One I groomed since he was a puppy. He has had trouble standing up from the first time I groomed him. I initially thought it was just because he was a puppy and the grooming thing was new for him. But as he got to more like a year old, he had trouble getting up if he'd been lying down. By a year old, he limped all the time, and I had to help him stand up if he's lying down. He's a sweet dog and very mellow, somewhat stubborn, but maybe because he hurts. Unfortunately, his owners have allowed him to become very obese which makes his joint problems worse and makes him nearly impossible to groom since he has trouble standing that long. That said, I charge a little more to groom him since it takes so long and is so hard-I charge $130 to groom him. Normal Berner price is in the $90 range. I'm in the midwest where prices are usually a bit lower than the coasts, so expect to have to pay $100 or more for grooming depending on where you live. They have much more hair than a golden and are much more involved to keep brushed out, just fyi. I charge about $50-60 for a golden groom, just for comparison. As a large dog, everything will be more expensive from flea and heart worm prevention to food, just another thing to keep in mind. I think if you can find a good breeder, Berners seem to be a good option if you want a less active dog. They are not goldens though, they are kinda indifferent to people other than "their person" whereas a golden will want everyone to be his friend.


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## Our3dogs (Apr 3, 2008)

Both have they good points. It is all about what you are looking for. Obviously the BMD is going to be much larger. My nephew has a 6 year old female who is about 115 pounds. Males of course can be larger. Elsie is very good with his 3 year old twins. Just recently had a TPLO surgery. As everyone has mentioned, generally they have a shorter life span. I had read something once to the affect for BMDs: 3 years a young dog, 3 years a good dog, 3 years an old dog. Some will live a couple of years longer. If you go into it knowing these things, then you just have to make your decision. Best of luck to you.


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## Mary Schaleen (Jul 24, 2017)

OK....I'm a bit late to this discussion, but we've had both.
We got our Berner first and he was a great dog! We got him from a very good breeder in New York who, unfortunately, has retired. In his prime, he weighed 120. Dusty was wonderful with our kids, he learned very quickly, was easy to housebreak, got along with other dog and cats, only barked when warranted. He had the best temperament and was a joy to our family. Shedding about the same as our golden, he didn't eat much more, and he was perfectly happy to lounge around the house with us and always up for his walks, as well.
He died peacefully at almost 13, with virtually no health problems in his past. Actually, just before he died, he was written up as the 7th oldest Berner in the United States. My daughter got another BMD after Dusty died, and Shadow lived to 11.
That said, Dusty was a while ago, before Berners became so popular, were featured on dog food bags, in Nordie ads, and so on. I'm a firm believer that the more popular dogs become, the worse off the breed is. From what I read, BMD life expectancy has gone way down and there are lines with a lot of temperament problems--mostly extreme shyness, I think. 
Our golden, Cooper, died at just 8 from cancer. He too, came from a very good breeder and was a wonderful dog, smart and loving. He and our Berner pretty much had the same temperament and we miss him still. 
I think the Bernese breed has gone far downhill since Dusty and even though Cooper died at 8, the average life expectancy for goldens is now longer than BMD life expectancy.
As far as choosing between them--go with your heart.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

Mary Schaleen said:


> OK....I'm a bit late to this discussion, but we've had both.
> We got our Berner first and he was a great dog! We got him from a very good breeder in New York who, unfortunately, has retired. In his prime, he weighed 120. Dusty was wonderful with our kids,
> I think the Bernese breed has gone far downhill since Dusty and even though Cooper died at 8, the average life expectancy for goldens is now longer than BMD life expectancy.
> As far as choosing between them--go with your heart.


Thanks for the input. Yes, I've read numerous things about the life span steadily getting worse due to inbreeding, an issue that affects Golden Retrievers as well. Read an interesting article: http://www.instituteofcaninebiology.org/blog/the-genetic-status-of-the-bernese-mountain-dogl It states, "On average, any two individual Bernese Mountain Dogs are more closely related than full siblings." That's crazy.

Also I came across the Bernese Mountain Dog Vitality Project, it's a group of breeders and veterinarians that are intending to outcross to other breeds to revitalize the breed and hopefully increase longevity. I've reached out, and I might be in consideration for one the pups.


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## Mary Schaleen (Jul 24, 2017)

That would be great, and you would be helping the breed as well 
Good luck


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## Nate83 (Jul 13, 2017)

I would highly recommend you like thru k9data for golden retrievers the site tells u things like the age of the grandparents and parents reason for death, as well as OFA and DNA tests the dog did. I would disagree with you on the inbreeding, reputable breeders will know the inbreeding coefficient and determine if the breeding is a healthy one.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

Nate83 said:


> I would highly recommend you like thru k9data for golden retrievers the site tells u things like the age of the grandparents and parents reason for death, as well as OFA and DNA tests the dog did. I would disagree with you on the inbreeding, reputable breeders will know the inbreeding coefficient and determine if the breeding is a healthy one.


I have and will. But reputable breeders often line breed to preserve specific traits by breeding siblings, or breeding Father x Daughter, or Mother x Son. Here's a thread from this very forum: http://www.goldenretrieverforum.com...ion/45450-linebreeding-inbreeding-common.html 

Generally all purebreds have some inbreeding that's how the breed gets locked. But i wonder if it's the best thing for the dog. It seems to be slowly killing some breeds, like the Bernese. Even the Golden Retriever's lifespan has gotten worse. https://breedingbusiness.com/study-golden-retriever-lifespan-shortening/


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## Nate83 (Jul 13, 2017)

No a reputable breeder will not breed a sister to a brother or father, if they do they are not reputable. Ever heard of the hapsburg chin? If someone is telling you it is normal or ok to breed a sibling with there parents or with there siblings they are dead wrong and need to be educated. Inbreeding is a problem yes but no so much from purposeful inbreeding but from the fact that the foundation line where inbred and there was a already small gene pool. I could do a weeks worth of research and get info on BM but I will not, like I said before go with your gut. I personally love German shepherds but after getting a golden retriever I am now in love with them as well. If you have done your homework and your gut is telling you to go one way go that way. Also take into consideration of home insurances, training ease and overall health.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

wsaunders1014 said:


> Also I came across the Bernese Mountain Dog Vitality Project, it's a group of breeders and veterinarians that are intending to outcross to other breeds to revitalize the breed and hopefully increase longevity. I've reached out, and I might be in consideration for one the pups.


Interesting.... 

I'll try to remember this next Mon training class. One of the other people attending the class is very active (like on the committee) for the local club here in MI and she's somebody who has had it rough trying to get the breed healthier. She's lost 3-5 year olds. and this is a very responsible breeder who is very active on the health front. 

I've asked her in the past if there is any way they could outcross similar to how other breed have in the past (and takes a very long time to get the outcrosses lines back and able to be registered in the AKC) and she said "no" at the time. 

Per her - I believe one of the breeds they've looked at outcrossing to (because this was done in the past when rescuing the breed from extinction) was the Newfoundlands, but newfs have their own health problems (heart issues) so this was something they were not very eager to get into. 

I'm curious if she knows anything about this project. 

It's concerning from the vitality project thing that they suggest they've used a breed from the sporting group. Sure hope it isn't goldens....

*Talk to any good breeder about breeding too close and you're gonna get an earful about this being the cause of many problems in the breed. One of the ladies who I listen to the most will not even breed "cousins" because she sees that as getting too close, even though that's "acceptable" to some people.


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## djg2121 (Nov 22, 2015)

If you like the look of BMDs, you might also look at Greater Swiss Mountain Dogs. They are similar in size to BMDs (males can be over 150 lbs) have the same coloration, and are similar in temperament to BMDs. But they have shorter, more manageable coats and reportedly have longer lifespans too (11 year avg). Like BMDs, SMDs are big dogs and males can be 150lbs plus.

I prefer the temperament and size of Goldens, but BMDs and SMDs are very nice too.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

Megora said:


> It's concerning from the vitality project thing that they suggest they've used a breed from the sporting group. Sure hope it isn't goldens....


I'm not sure what the first cross was, but B litter was with a mix: Half Golden, Quarter lab, Quarter irish setter.

Also, I know that they DO NOT have the approval of the national club, though individual members do support the initiative. Outcrossing is very controversial I guess, seems silly though. They're just trying to help.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

wsaunders1014 said:


> . Outcrossing is very controversial I guess, seems silly though. They're just trying to help.


It's controversial, because when you are trying to fix on thing - you can create another problem including producing dogs who have other traits bred into them than what was supposed to be there for the original purpose of the breed (working breed, draft dogs, etc), they have to breed true for several generations without odd mixed looking dogs popping out from time to time, and then you do not want to diversify the health issues while trying to solve one of them. 

Breeding BMD's back to Newfs would have been the easiest route because Newfs already are somewhere behind the genetic workings of the BMD breed. They were used to bring the breed out of extinction originally. But Newfs have their own problems with bad hearts. 

The other thing is you are counting on AKC letting the product back into the breed as far as being registered as purebred. All the more questionable if you have secrecy behind what people are breeding to and if they are doing mixed breedings every time vs trying to breed true for generations. This in of itself is not different than the doodles out there, where they have difficulties in keeping the dogs breeding true for generations, so they are constantly reintroducing a retriever or a poodle back to what they breed, if they are not actually breeding a retriever to a poodle for mixed puppies every time. 

Biggest criticism of doodles is primarily that you can't pick up a pedigree for most labradoodles and not see a lab or a poodle mixed in there consistently. And then there's the bigger mess where you have no control over whether people will only breed 5-10 generation labradoodles with no mixing with other breeds. Right now, there is big business in just breeding anything, selling a pitch to puppy people, and not putting too much thought or concern into long terms. Everything is short term.

Long term issues that somebody might face who introduce X breed into the mix just one time (one mixed breeding, and breeding true for generations) is the breed club rejecting the results on the basis that they do not believe the results are consistently purebred. 

It becomes even more concerning if the people doing the breeding are not actively involved with their reputations on the line with the breeds. 

It's easier for new breeders or random other breeders to do things like this because for one thing, they've shown they can sell the puppies. And then they don't have too much expense going into what they breed (no championships on the parent dogs) and then there no criticism if they continue to mix the breeds generation after generation. 

As well, AKC has shown unreliability when it comes to letting the product back into the registry.

I think dalmations introduced one champion GSP to what they were breed to solve a pretty bad health problem in the breed. I think the results were mixed (last thing I remember having explained to me by a dal person). You had only a couple dogs allowed back into the registry after 5 generations. And then there are other dogs who are approach 20 generations after the fact who are still trying to get back into AKC. And that was after only 1 mixed breeding (to a single CH GSP, one time) to solve a known problem in the breed back in the 80's.


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## Nate83 (Jul 13, 2017)

Dalmatian-Pointer Backcross Project is what i believe you are talking about.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

I'm not too concerned with getting back into the AKC myself as I'm not a breeder, I only care about the health, and in that regard they are at least very conscientious. They are keeping meticulous records of every puppy and every litter. They are only breeding pairs once. I believe the A litter was a purebred BMD with another purebred "Sporting Group" dog. I doubt they'd use a GR since they have a lot of issues as well. The reason I trust them too is they are not some schlubs. The breeder of the B litter has an extensive show record, even going to Westminster with her Berner. Also they are only selling their puppies for $650 so there's no sense of breeding for profit. In fact, I had a two hour conversation yesterday with the breeder, it was the most extensive interview I've ever had in my life lol. They are definitely very particular in who gets to take one of their dogs home.


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## golfgal (Dec 31, 2013)

We're around BMD's a lot, pure breds as well as the intentional and unintentional crosses. Activity levels might be similar with BMD til about 9mths and then they usually drop significantly. My friend's BMD would wait til Murphy ran himself out, hang back and then join in again. Quite funny to watch. 

Neighbour deliberately got a Golden BMD cross due to the shortened life of their own BMD's. I couldn't do it if it was only 8 years, average or not. Granted I just did 18mths so who knows right. Don't recall Buddy's weight but he's definitely bigger than Murphy who is 64lbs and a slow ambling walk is what he does. He'll play for a about 10 minutes and then he's done. Granted when it's pouring rain and miserable, a lower energy level is very appealing. They are gorgeous but think about what level of activity you want in your life with your dog. Just my two cents.


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## wsaunders1014 (Dec 15, 2017)

So I made the decision. It was REALLY TOUGH. I flip flopped multiple times, my roommate got annoyed, the breeder got annoyed albeit gracefully. Weird fact, we have the same birthday!! So it must be fate that we found each other. Ended up getting a Golden. No regrets about my choice but I do know I’d be as happy with the Bernese. It wasn’t a no to the breed, just a not yet. Some random pics, I unfortunately was too busy playing to take too many good ones. The solo one is my little buddy named “Ser Davos”


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## zeyadeen (May 10, 2017)

congratulation, and welcome Ser Davos the cutest ever  wishing you all the best


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## Nate83 (Jul 13, 2017)

Congrats, now your life is over Ha Ha Ha. Pup is cutie.


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