# I am ready to give Archie away



## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Take a deep breath and let it out slowly! This is all normal puppy antics. Reminds me of Penny at the same age. 

What kind of advice did your instructor give you for working with him at home? Was it positive reinforcement? I used to work with Penny 3 or 4 times a day, about 10 minutes each time. She was a handfull too. Also, I had to use really good treats...bits of hotdog or cheese. She wouldn't mind for Cherrios.

Are you walking him enough or vigorous playing outside? Puppies have so much energy. I used to take Penny out to play ball 3 times a day and that just made her bearable enough to do the obedience practice. 

If you do decide that you just can't go on with Archie, please contact a rescue group; don't give him away. We can help you find a rescue or transport if another forum member wants him. But, really, there's a wonderful, loving and loyal Golden wrapped up in that furball. If you are patient YOU will have the Golden of your dreams.


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## Cathy's Gunner (Dec 4, 2008)

He sounds like a typical puppy. You need to be patient and get him back into the puppy class. I remember wondering when things were going to get better with Gunner too. They try our patience but all of a sudden they will out grow the wildness and calm down. I'm sorry your puppy makes you cry but I think you need to give him more time and maybe possibly a private training session to give you some suggestions. I hope you will keep trying....it's all worth it.


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## LibertyME (Jan 6, 2007)

What Penny's Mom and Cathy's Gunner said .... again and again and again!!!
What you're going through is really typical....you're reaction is common....
What you need is a really supportive and encouraging trainer to help you through.
Is there anyway you can get someone to come and spend a couple hours with you in your home?


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I remember telling Penny A LOT, over and over again, that if I wasn't so stubborn and determined she'd have been given to rescue a llllloooonnnnggg time ago. All that energy turned into the most amazing dog! 

You can come here everyday if you want. We will listen, advise, commisserate, what ever you need to help you thru this.


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## SheetsSM (Jan 17, 2008)

I'd also look for a new instructor who will help you the groundwork for success.


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## Pammie (Jan 22, 2011)

Hang in there! It will bet better, not right away, but it will.

Bryley made me cry many times during the 4-7 month old period. I can not remember the _why_ of it all even now. I think it was the biting that felt aggressive but I knew it was when he was over stimulated and highly excited. I think I also cried out of exhaustion. Really. Puppy raising is not for sissies!!!!

Did you speak to your trainer before pulling them from class? I am sure they have had other challenging pups. I had my trainer come to the house for a little one on one and reassurance when Bryley went thru a phase. It helped. 

I so hope you can find a way for you and Archie to stay a family.

But mostly remember that Archie is not "awful" but that his behavior is!


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## Kmullen (Feb 17, 2010)

Felt this was were the below picture needed to be. We all go through it...some worse than others! But, I had to post this picture below! To tell you, I know what you are going through!! This is my NAUGHTY Cannon. Sometimes he can be full of himself (nicely put). Luckily I had my phone in my hand and took a quick shot becuase I could not believe he was actually standing ON TOP of my DINING TABLE!!! :bowl: Never had a dog do that!! I was not a proud mama! Luckily, he has not done that since :curtain:.


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

I used to tell Max I was gonna take him to the little store on the corner and have him made into Maxburgers. And he wasn't near as nuts as some I've heard about! Hang in there, it seriously DOES get better. (And Max made me cry many times just from frustration and exhaustion and yeah, those body slams are so much fun, too!)


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## sadiegold (Nov 3, 2010)

This could have been my post almost one year ago, but wow does time and some growing change things drastically! We did complete puppy and then intermediate classes which helped some, but really just each week gets a tiny bit easier then when you add a bunch of weeks up together there is improvement, just dont cry too often (I had two really bad breakdowns)!


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## sam (May 21, 2005)

Sounds like he is in the "terrible twos" of puppyhood! To echo what the others have said, a supportive trainer (using positive reinforcement/clicker training), tons of exercise, and someone to give you some actual relief so that you can walk away and catch your breath! I tell you, ever since my boy learned what a clicker represented, I can sotp him in his tracks.

Keep us posted. Are you in southern WI? I wish I could help in person!!!


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Penny had a neat trick during her first summer, 6-9 months old. As I walked to the garden a couple hundred feet from the house, she'd come running up behind me and body slam me at the back of the knees. Man o man, I was on the ground before I knew what hit me. THEN, she come around to my face and start lunging at me. Oh my word, I thought she was a diabolical monster. I knew she was just playing and not aggressive but that is not acceptable. After a couple of those, I always kept an eye on her and would turn to face her with the halt signal and a "whoa, dog" command. She out grew that too!



laprincessa said:


> I used to tell Max I was gonna take him to the little store on the corner and have him made into Maxburgers. And he wasn't near as nuts as some I've heard about! Hang in there, it seriously DOES get better. (And Max made me cry many times just from frustration and exhaustion and yeah, those body slams are so much fun, too!)


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## Jige (Mar 17, 2011)

Getting upset and frustrated doesnt help either dogs pick on that and then they act out even more. Remain calm and just walk away when he is doing something you dont like. Once you are no longer giveing him attention he will stop ( much like a child). Also how much exercise is he getting in a day. BaWaaJige needs alot of exercising. Always remember a tired puppy is a happy family.


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## goldenbrowneyes (Nov 10, 2010)

Just want to ad support, it does get better. Like Penny's Mom said the forum is here to help you and support you. I promise it does get better.


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## Loisiana (Jul 29, 2009)

kfayard said:


> Felt this was were the below picture needed to be. We all go through it...some worse than others! But, I had to post this picture below! To tell you, I know what you are going through!! This is my NAUGHTY Cannon. Sometimes he can be full of himself (nicely put). Luckily I had my phone in my hand and took a quick shot becuase I could not believe he was actually standing ON TOP of my DINING TABLE!!! :bowl: Never had a dog do that!! I was not a proud mama! Luckily, he has not done that since :curtain:.


Looks pretty normal to me LOL.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

Witcheeyone said:


> Archie is 4 1/2 mos old and he is truly the most awful puppy. I am so stresed out that i am seriously thinking of giving him away. He is such a loving puppy, but his wildness outweighs this. He does not listen ( he learned sit and down at 9'weeks.) But trying to get him to do any commands is nearly impossible. He walked on a leash up until a month ago. Now he constantly tugs. Makes walking a dreaded activity. I correct him over and over...still the same thing He jumps, bites and runs around the house like a mad man and chews EVERYTHING. He runs across the room and body slams me , then climbs on my head. I have lost my patience and i am ready to give up. I withdrew him from puppy class because his behavior was so bad. I do crate him, but never as punishment. Ive never had a puppy this awful. He is getting older and my fear is that he is going to be like thiis forever .I keep thinking things will get better, but they are only getting worse. I feel so bad that a PUPPY makes me cry. I need the dog whisperer!!!!


I copy pasted your post, printed it, and fully intend to stick it in a frame and hang it somewhere very obvious in my room. That way, whenever I think about bringing another puppy home, I'll immediately be brought back to my senses. 

Seriously though... 

The running around like mad man = zoomies. I think they are hilarious and love watching them. I prefer they happen outside where the dogs won't slip or bang into anything, but it sometimes happens in the house. 

The tugging on leash... our Sammy went through the same thing. He needed daily walks or he would bark constantly in the house. But then nobody wanted to walk him because he would drag our arms out of the sockets. We'd take him, but fight over who had to actually hold the leash. >.< 

That said, he was in obedience classes from the time he was 12 weeks old or so and never missed a session though, so there was a lot of controlled walking training that the instructor at class worked with us on. I want to say it was a couple years before he suddenly was a nice dog in public. It takes time.


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## Thalie (Jan 20, 2008)

While Archie sounds like a lot of puppies his age and is still just a growing baby, you clearly are very upset and, while I am no trainer, I would like to offer a few suggestions. We only raised two pups, did lots of things wrong, corrected the way we did things as we went, got nipped, jumped on, had the dog on the table, had the dog bite a hole thru a wall but everybody, dogs and people alike, learned and we ended up with a pretty good household.

I would advise going back to a puppy class because those are there as much for the owner (if not more) as for the puppy. It also sounds that Archie is given way too much freedom if he can run around so fast and hard that he bodyslams you (how on earth does he get onto your head ?). Contain him more at all times; have him drag a short leash so you can stop him and lead him to where you want him without having to put your hands on him.

Start with what he knows, sit and down and have him do either one before anything good happens to him -pets, treats, walk, etc. Be very systematic and consistent in what you allow or do not allow and what you ask from him in order for him to get what he wants or enjoy. Google NILIF (Nothing is Free in Life) for a more extended explanation about this kind of process.
I never did crate time-outs but I did outside all alone time-outs (I have a secure fenced backyard). There was nothing that Flem disliked more than to be out there all by herself at that age; those time-outs were short, she was supervised but they could be repeated as needed. You could also set up a puppy pen so that you have a contained place to plop him in which is not his crate when he is going into brainless mode.

Speaking of walks, I would fit him with an Easy Walk harness (the kind that tightens in the front) and leash him with a very light chain leash so that biting the leash will not be rewarding and pulling will be discouraged.

You and Archie can do this. He is not a bad dog, just a very young one starting to feel his oats. You are not a bad owner, just one that needs some support and direction.


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

General V said:


> Getting upset and frustrated doesnt help either dogs pick on that and then they act out even more. Remain calm and just walk away when he is doing something you dont like. Once you are no longer giveing him attention he will stop ( much like a child). Also how much exercise is he getting in a day. BaWaaJige needs alot of exercising. Always remember a tired puppy is a happy family.


Oh, please - getting upset and frustrated is normal, no one is calm all the time!


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## SeaMonster (Jul 4, 2011)

The only way I can live with Gracie, is by putting her in her place. See my thread on leash biting. It also helps communicate who the boss is. Once you establish that, life gets much easier and quick!


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## aerolor (May 27, 2011)

I can only echo what others have said - Archie is perfectly normal. He is full of the joys of life and if you can only "go with him" you could have so much fun. Taking on a pup is such a great experience and I wouldn't expect or want any pup I had to be any different, particularly with the retriever breeds - they all seem to get so much out of life. It will get better and from what I have experienced with dogs I have had the naughty ones are usually bright and grow into fine and responsive companions. 
I had a flatcoated retriever who took me from crying to laughing in the same breath. There was never a dull moment with him and I always said I could take him anywhere twice - the second time to apologise. He caused me no end of embarrassment, but was so much fun - there was never such a naughty, lively pup as him. He knew every trick in the book and it was quite a challenge trying to keep one step ahead of him; but that dog grew into the most wonderful noble creature anyone could wish to know and everyne loved him. His temperament and tolerance was impecable. He was the best dog I ever had. 
It sounds as if Archie has a lot of character and I hope you can look and laugh at him instead of crying with frustration. A lot of what he is doing he will grow out of in time and much of it is just experimenting on his part - not important longer term. I always think part of the reason we have dogs is so that we can take life less seriously - maybe they make us a bit younger and lighter in spirit - I don't know.


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## elly (Nov 21, 2010)

I am so sorry you feel this way, I remember Chester being so awful as a young pup and now hes the apple of my eye. Oh yes he can still try my patience and I think they all can, but I cannot believe hes the same puppy as the one I used to dread coming downstairs to sometimes. You HAVE to stay consistant with him and know hes only doing what hes doing because he can, once you establish with him that he cant he wont, honestly, I realised it was our fault not his, he simply did what he could because we werent training him enough and in the correct way. There was also a diet element for Chester in that he was feeling bad in himself so was an angry pup and once we changed his diet he was happier as his tum was and skin was more settled but he wasnt better trained, that had to be down to us.
Come back here and moan and groan and vent all you like, ..we are here! We may all even end up smiling about our naughty pups once wensee the funny side of them and our reactions!


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

I have written many responses and not posted 

A few questions if you don't mind.

How much time and how often do you exercise Archie? How often do you let him zoom outside in a safe environment?

How much and how often do you put aside time to train Archie? What is his success rate? If it is less than 80%, you are asking too much and need to step back in your training. 

When you say you correct him, what does this mean? And after a correction, do you show Archie how to be right? This applies whether you use Me=alpha, or reward based trained. After any correction, a void is created that you can either step into and show the correct behavior or you can let it be and wonder why your corrections result in a dog unsure of how to be right.

Have you tried systems such as Control Unleashed, Nothing in Life is Free etc?

And now for the really tough questions.
What did you expect of a puppy? 
What are you looking for in an adult dog? 
Will a golden retriever truly suit your lifestyle? 
Almost everyone who has marvelous relationships with their goldens makes sure the dogs are kept both physically and mentally stimulated - heck my 11 year old still has daily hikes and training - the standard calls for active and powerful dogs - yes they have an off switch but only if they spend enough time on.


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## perdie (Oct 30, 2008)

I totally agree with what many are saying - he's a normal pup giving you the run-around. My Jamie is now 3 and Ive gotta tell you he has had me shouting, crying and exhausted many a time BUT it really does get better and I wouldnt be without him now. He's sworn me off puppies for life though lol
What you are experiencing is tough I know, nobody will condemn you for feeling that way - I remember feeling so overwhelmed with my crazy pup i just had to lock myself in my bedroom to escape his 'affections' lol (which mostly meant him climbing all over me, claws in the most painful places,tail slapping me in the face,hefty paws straight in my kidneys...you get the picture). I felt bad for feeling annoyed with him, afterall everyone said what a cute sweet boy he was - I wanted to say dont believe it, its all an act, he's an inconsiderate,ego maniac monster!!!
If you decide to keep him:
go back to puppy class(theyve seen pups before&know what theyre like,if they dont then find another class)
maybe if you can afford it get a dog walker(even once a week might be helpful), most of all DONT TAKE IT PERSONALLY, your pup will give anyone a hard time not just you, truly! 
Where we live when we first got Jamie they all thought he was cute but when he got to 5 months he'd grown into a big lad but still had those terrible puppy behaviours&the people who had fussed over him actually avoided us on the field. I later discovered some had been rather snotty saying unkind things about us not 'controlling' him but their expectations of what really is a baby were far too high-would you expect a 5 month old human baby to suddenly do as its told??
Keep your poker face,remove yourself if you're getting upset and remeber it really does get better-just not right away. Good luck (((hugs)))


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## perdie (Oct 30, 2008)

Id like to add by echoing what Sunrise is saying, exercising these energetic dogs physically&mentally is essential (although sometimes draining for owners initially!).
Try a Kong or Stagbar when you need some peace, we use daycare 3 afternoons a week if you have a good one in your area go have a look. Maybe invite a friend over who has a dog also so they can play together(to give you a break&help him learn how to behave too!lol)
I hope for the best for you&Archie, you're not alone


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## Deb_Bayne (Mar 18, 2011)

OH, how many times I was going to give Bayne away, it was so frustrating dealing with all his energy and not listening to me. Now that he is almost 1 year he is so much better, sure we still have moments but it's not that 24/7 moments like a few short months ago. 

Last night I was sitting watching tv and I wanted Bayne to settle down and put him in the down position. He was resisting and wouldn't listen to me while I was sitting, so I stood up, he laid down, I sat down, he stood up, I stood up, he laid down, this went on for about 7 or 8 tries before I just couldn't stand up anymore I was laughing so darn hard. He finally laid down and settled.


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

Sounds like his variation of 'whack-a-mole', only without the whack! I always ended up laughing so hard, I just couldn't be mad! 

This journey with Penny, my first wild child and quite a shock, has been amazing. She has taught me so much more about being a human AND being a dog that I would ever have learned on my own. She has taught me more than I have taught her!


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## solinvictus (Oct 23, 2008)

"Oh, please - getting upset and frustrated is normal, no one is calm all the time!"

Yes it is normal to get upset and frustrated but what General V said is so true. The more upset, frustrated and stressed you (generic you) get the more stressed and hyped up the pup gets, the more the pup acts up. When an owner feels frustrated and stressed it is best to put the puppy in a safe play area and both have a time out.


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## sameli102 (Aug 23, 2009)

Please get a trainer because if you give up and do give him away he is liable to irritate a new home also and just end up getting passed from home to home until someone takes him to a shelter.


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## Cathy's Gunner (Dec 4, 2008)

Hoping to hear from the OP today to see how they are doing. A lot of good advise given here.....


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

solinvictus said:


> "Oh, please - getting upset and frustrated is normal, no one is calm all the time!"
> 
> Yes it is normal to get upset and frustrated but what General V said is so true. The more upset, frustrated and stressed you (generic you) get the more stressed and hyped up the pup gets, the more the pup acts up. When an owner feels frustrated and stressed it is best to put the puppy in a safe play area and both have a time out.



Very true, but I've learned that the best way to get me more upset is to tell me to just calm down. It's far more helpful to realize that yes, you're going to get upset and frustrated, but it's normal so just take a step back and give you and the puppy some space and start over.

Max is four and I still have to do that sometimes, but having someone tell me I should always be calm around him would only serve to make me feel even more of a failure than I already do at those moments. 

That's all I was trying to say.


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## ShutterbugMom (Sep 20, 2011)

I feel your pain because Scout is driving me insane too. We got him in September from a shelter and he was estimated to be about 12 months old. I cannot take 15 minutes alone or he will chew something up. I came upstairs to put away clothes for 10 minutes and in that time he had my 10 year old crying, chewed up 2 Christmas ornaments (we intentionally put dough "dog safe" ornaments on the tree), and chewed through his brand new gentle leader we bought this morning, because he chewed through his old one yesterday. I am looking here for advice because I don't know if I just don't have enough patience or what. This is not how I intended life with a dog to be. If I sit down in the evenings to watch TV he climbs all over me. He cannot go outside in the fenced in backyard alone without crying, barking and jumping on the door. (Basically, I need him to go outside if I mop or vacuum because he tries to bite the mop or vacuum cleaner.) I hope you can find a solution for Archie and pass along the information. He was not crate trained when we got him, and so far we have not been able to convince him that it is an okay place to be. I do know that I will *never* get another dog. Well, gotta go because I hear the kids crying again.


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## perdie (Oct 30, 2008)

Oh dear  Shutterbugmom Can you afford a behaviourist? Does the shelter not offer any kind of support?
I think the issues you are having with your dog are a bit more complex, compounded by the fact you don't know his history.
Would you be willing to challenge one problem at a time? Sounds like his confidence is low and as a result he is suffering anxiety. Would you consider a DAP or herbal remedy to reduce his anxiety whilst you retrain him?
Does he go to any classes?
How often is he exercised?
Just throwing a few thoughts out there!


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## boomers_dawn (Sep 20, 2009)

Lots of good advice here.

When Gladys was driving me insane and I thought she was trying to kill me, our dog skool teecher told me to put her on a schedule. He said puppies need a schedule and structure, just like babies and little kids. 
He suggested an hour in / an hour out of the crate. Even if I'm at work several hours and she has to sleep in the crate, still follow that schedule when I'm home. 

It saved my sanity! Also continue with the exercise and training. Both are crucial.

If you truly can't stand him and want to give him away, I guess that would be better than making him live with someone who hates him. Although, try to differentiate if that is really true vs. just having a hard time getting through "puppy hell" as I call it.

It is a lot of hard work and committment but the rewards after the work is done - priceless.


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## baumgartml16 (Jun 19, 2011)

This sounds normal to me. I have an 8 month old and have a had about 1-2 breakdowns since we had her. Just gotta keep pushing through. Lots of good advice here on this thread!!

Where in WI are you?


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I just wanted to emphasize that if you ABSOLUTELY CAN'T manage Archie, please PLEASE let us know so we can help you make arrangements with a rescue. It's fast and that way you'll know he is safe.

Sometimes, it's just not a good match. :no:


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

I think that anyone who has issues with their dog's behavior need to put in place things that have already been suggested. You need to take the puppy/dog to class. I find with my busiest dogs that exercising their brains makes them outstanding housepets. And if your dog climbs on you when you are sitting down, I am going to sound like a jerk, here, but you can train that out of the dog... It is harder with young kids and young dogs as one stimulates the other. Again, training and exercise can help. Even my calmest golden was stimulated by my kids running around when the kids were younger. I have raised nine goldens with 2 children. It can be done. But I have always taken obedience classes with them.


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## Debles (Sep 6, 2007)

Sally's Mom said:


> I think that anyone who has issues with their dog's behavior need to put in place things that has already been suggested. You need to take the puppy/dog to class. I find with my busiest dogs that exercising their brains makes them outstanding housepets. And if your dog climbs on you when you are sitting down, I am going to sound like a jerk, here, but you can train that out of the dog... It is harder with young kids and young dogs as one stimulates the other. Again, training and exercise can help. Even my calmest golden was stimulated by my kids running around when the kids were younger. I have raised nine goldens with 2 children. It can be done. But I have always taken obedience classes with them.



I agree, raised 6 goldens of different temperaments with three kids


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## LibertyME (Jan 6, 2007)

OMG I could have written this about Lexi 11 years ago...she was destructive and had no manners...it took me months to come to like her...she has been the one dog that has taught me the most...she is now in the sunset of life and I cant imagine life without her....with a trainer to help and encourage you you can get through this...


ShutterbugMom said:


> I feel your pain because Scout is driving me insane too. We got him in September from a shelter and he was estimated to be about 12 months old. I cannot take 15 minutes alone or he will chew something up. I came upstairs to put away clothes for 10 minutes and in that time he had my 10 year old crying, chewed up 2 Christmas ornaments (we intentionally put dough "dog safe" ornaments on the tree), and chewed through his brand new gentle leader we bought this morning, because he chewed through his old one yesterday. I am looking here for advice because I don't know if I just don't have enough patience or what. This is not how I intended life with a dog to be. If I sit down in the evenings to watch TV he climbs all over me. He cannot go outside in the fenced in backyard alone without crying, barking and jumping on the door. (Basically, I need him to go outside if I mop or vacuum because he tries to bite the mop or vacuum cleaner.) I hope you can find a solution for Archie and pass along the information. He was not crate trained when we got him, and so far we have not been able to convince him that it is an okay place to be. I do know that I will *never* get another dog. Well, gotta go because I hear the kids crying again.


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## GoldenOwner12 (Jun 18, 2008)

Hi when I got Shelley my golden at 14 weeks old there were times I was really frustrated and angry. Couple of times I got that angry ended up putting advertisements to give her away but once I calmed down and thought long and hard I removed the advertisements. I'm so glad I did cause Shelley has turned out to be a great dog. Took a while eg 2 years cause of the way she was brought up by the breeder. Every dog is different my male Einstein I never really had to teach I just say sit he would sit, He is the type of dog that already knew what to do and what not to do. Einstein never dug holes or was a destructive dog he is very calm/placid and is what I would call a couch potatoe. Shelley on the other end is totally diferent I had to teach her and she can be destructive. She isn't what I would call a couch potatoe she requires her exercise.


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## Witcheeyone (Oct 19, 2011)

Ok, so i just spent the last hour typing a post. With a little help from a certain puppy, i lost the post. I want to start off by thanking each and everyone for your advice. Ive come to realize that i am the problem not Archie. Our last golden, william wallace, RIP 
8-6-11 was the exact opposite of Archie. He was the most wonderful dog from the day we brought him home until the day he went to puppy heaven. This is why i am struggling so much with Archie. I know i cant compare the two, but i never expected this. I heard back from the trainer and Archie is going back to puppy school next tues. Apparently she doesnt think he needs private training because this is what she suggested. i am Archies primary caregiver. My husband is on the road 3 weeks in a row and home 1 week. We have a 21 yr old college student at home, but shes almost non existent. Lol. I thoughtni would give everyone a vision of my day. I work full time and come home around 12:30 every day and I Feed him and play ball for a while. Ive given up on taking him on walks. We have a large yard, 1 acre, so he is outside alot. he is never left in his kennel for more than 4 1/2 hrs at a time, other than sleeping in it overnight. When i get home from work, its straight outside and then dinner time. I play ball with him again for about 20 min. To be honest, the past few weeks, i have given up. I dont have thr energy anymore. Just last night, i had another melt down. I was laying on the bed crying and he hopped up on the bed and buried his face in my arms. Totally melted my heart. But the minute i left the bedroom, he was the devil again I do not give him free roam of the house either. 
He never out of my sight. I know what i need to do, but i am afraid i am out of patience. 
know i need to walk him and i want to, but it is such a chore with him jumping, tugging 
ans chewing the leash. I dont understand because he has walked on the leash perfectly since about 9 weeks old. I wish i could send him to puppy day care. Its just so expensive! He does love other dogs and children. When he starts to bit, i gently clise his mouth with my hand and say, "no bite" until he settles down. The second i let go, hes back to biting. When i ignore him, thats when he starts climbing on my body, eventually 
Making his way to my head. I have to admit, i thought it was cute and funny at first. I still praise him when he goes potty or poop outside. I am sorry that i am talking in circles, but i feel so much better after reading everyones posts and even typing this is making me feel better. Tomorrow is a new day. I truly love Archie and i dont evennthink i could give him away. Thanks for letting me vent and i really appreciate everyones advice and thought. I kniw that i am not alone....its just so hard because like i said earlier our last golden william was an angel. Thanks again....Robib


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## hubbub (Jun 28, 2011)

Just catching this thread, but I wanted to let you know that nearly every time we went to our puppy classes, I either had blood running down my arm/leg or my shirt had been ripped by "someone's" puppy teeth between the car and the building. :doh: 

One of the most important things I learned in class was that the time to (for lack of a better term) "train away" the crazy biting was to "bait" her into biting when she wasn't super excited and in a frenzy already - - essentially, set her up to succeed, not fail. 

I would make a "yip" noise when she mouthed me and she learned to do it gently. The final proof of how important this was for us was a few years later when I was putting drops from a new prescription in her eyes. After one drop, she turned and began gently mouthing my arm - it was so strange, I peeled back the label on the bottle and realized they had given me ear drops instead of eye drops and the drops I had been given had alcohol in them! Thankfully, I only had used 1 drop! 

I was so proud of my girl.  Thankfully her eye was ok, but I didn't see the technician ever again. 

Puppies are work and they grow so fast we forget they are babies for a couple of years. Some friends have a 80 lb 18 month old lab who is a tank. She wouldn't hurt a fly, but I know their patience is tested every moment of the day - - their other lab is so laid back, easy going, unfazed - you name it! Another friend's 50 lb golden wraps over her head/shoulders on the chair every morning for coffee, so you're not the only one with a golden hat! 

Good luck as you move forward - maybe start another thread to document Archie's progress as some won't read the whole thread and will still be thinking you're planning to rehome Archie - I've found this forum to be a great source of support.


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## BajaOklahoma (Sep 27, 2009)

I'm sorry you withdrew from puppy class - this is exactly why you need Archie to be there. We started Banker as soon as he was oll enough to get his rabies vaccine.

Some weeks he was the brat, some weeks he was the star. He loved Kathy, our instructor. He obviously recognized her leadership as he performed better for her than me. She loved to use him as her demo dog. We continued all the way through Advanced. Somehow, Banker managed to get his CGC - not that you would always believe it.

And remember, class is at least 50% teaching you how to train Archie, not just training him.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

Witcheeyone said:


> Ok, so i just spent the last hour typing a post. With a little help from a certain puppy, i lost the post. I want to start off by thanking each and everyone for your advice. Ive come to realize that i am the problem not Archie. Our last golden, william wallace, RIP
> 8-6-11 was the exact opposite of Archie. He was the most wonderful dog from the day we brought him home until the day he went to puppy heaven. This is why i am struggling so much with Archie. I know i cant compare the two, but i never expected this. I heard back from the trainer and Archie is going back to puppy school next tues. Apparently she doesnt think he needs private training because this is what she suggested. i am Archies primary caregiver. My husband is on the road 3 weeks in a row and home 1 week. We have a 21 yr old college student at home, but shes almost non existent. Lol. I thoughtni would give everyone a vision of my day. I work full time and come home around 12:30 every day and I Feed him and play ball for a while. Ive given up on taking him on walks. We have a large yard, 1 acre, so he is outside alot. he is never left in his kennel for more than 4 1/2 hrs at a time, other than sleeping in it overnight. When i get home from work, its straight outside and then dinner time. I play ball with him again for about 20 min. To be honest, the past few weeks, i have given up. I dont have thr energy anymore. Just last night, i had another melt down. I was laying on the bed crying and he hopped up on the bed and buried his face in my arms. Totally melted my heart. But the minute i left the bedroom, he was the devil again I do not give him free roam of the house either.
> He never out of my sight. I know what i need to do, but i am afraid i am out of patience.
> know i need to walk him and i want to, but it is such a chore with him jumping, tugging
> ...


I know the puppy phase seems overwhelming, don't give up. Going back to class is the best thing you can do for yourself maybe more so than him. Teaching you how to teach him. And take a look around at the other puppies, I bet there are others that are being wild and unruly, it will help you to see other owners struggling!

I would suggest for the mouthing, rather than grab his muzzle, have lots of toys within reach and literally put one in his mouth when puts teeth on skin. Or teach him to kiss instead. Put peanut butter on your hand and let him lick it off, say "good kiss" while he's licking. Practice that and the idea is to eventually tell him "Kiss" when he's biting and he will lick instead.

Also, crate him when you need some peace, and don't worry about him spending a little extra time in his crate, it won't hurt him but it might save your sanity.

Deep breath, it will all be ok, you really can do this, and he really will learn and become better behaved as he gets older.


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## Casey and Samson's Mom (Sep 24, 2011)

My heart goes out to you. Archie sounds like a sweetheart...an energetic and very intelligent sweetheart! I won't tell you he is a normal puppy...some are challenging like him, and some are easier (I tend to like the challenging ones because they become the best obedience dogs, believe it or not...they look for challenges themselves and excel when given them!!) Puppies are all different. They do not stay puppies forever, though. You will have great "war stories" when he is grown, settled and a wonderful pet. If you do not give up on him, he will be. I truly believe the "bad" dogs are the ones that have been given up on. 
Here is an idea for an easier time walking Archie. Both of my boys were determined tuggers and towers as puppies. I discovered a harness called the Easy Walk harness. It is worn on the body, not the head and a relatively gentle yet very effective correction when they try to tow you down the street. It has a sliding piece called a martingale on the front (it fastens so that the leash attaches to the front of the chest, not top of the back). It gently pulls them sideways if they try to tug. Dogs dislike this and stop the action very quickly. If they don't (and my Sam has tested this a few times), and pull too hard, it flips them over onto their side, which they really don't like. I walk two dogs for a total of two hours per day and would never leave my yard without an easy walk on both of them. No, I don't work for the company, but the harnesses work for me. definitely worth a try with Archie. Here in canada, independent pet stores have them; in the states, try smaller stores before the chains, and they will also help to make sure it is fitted well. good luck with your boy. This site is a wonderful resource and support...visit it when you are feeling down. We have all been there. Liz


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## laprincessa (Mar 24, 2008)

I'm so happy to read your post, and so glad you're getting back into classes. Please realize that you're going to still have moments of frustration and feel like throwing up your hands in despair. What works for me is to just stop, take a breath, tell Max that we need to start over, and then continue whatever we were doing. I need that moment to remind myself that he doesn't understand what I want and I need to find a different way to show him. It works - most of the time! 

Good luck with Archie!


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## Mom of Maizie (Nov 11, 2011)

*I know how you feel!!!*

Hi,
I was so glad to hear someone else put it into words, what you feel about your Archie's behavior. I've been at the end of my rope myself at times with the "zoomies" ending in a body slam and the biting so much my hands and arms were a wreck with sore places. 
My Maizie is our first golden and actually our first puppy inside the house. I can honestly say I didn't know what I was in for! 
Anyway, she is almost 5 months old and she is doing better week by week. I was about to drop out of puppy class, she was so wild, but others here in the forums convinced me to continue and I'm glad I did already. She's still wild, but the instructors are very helpful and encouraging and find something good in what Maizie and I do together, so it helps to make me feel better. Lots of good tips in class, from the instructor, her volunteer helpers, and others. 
The other thing is the Easy Walk Halter has helped greatly with her pulling when we walk. There's days I put it on her to go even out to potty because it makes it that much easier. 
The clicker method of training has helped us and I suggest lots of treats for everything she does right. 
I've also noticed at puppy class that Maizie pays closer attention to me the more she learns the commands, like it helps her to focus her attention and calm some. We taught her to catch miniature marshmallows and she will calm right down and sit for a few of those tossed to her. 
Again, I'm grateful to hear that I'm not alone and love the good encouragement.
Looking forward to when she's a little more settled,
Mom of Maizie


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## Elisabeth Kazup (Aug 23, 2008)

I could have written the same exact thing. Our first Golden was so calm, so quiet, so polite. She never bit us EVER, never wanted to be on furniture, never barked. I thought ALL Goldens were like that. She was perfect, pretty healthy and lived til she was 14 1/2. I never thought any of that was exceptional. So, a few years after she died I thought a puppy would be fun, I was ready for another Golden. I held her in my arms as we left the nursery at the kennel, the kennel owner saying something about 'once they get past the biting'. I nodded and I remember thinking "Whaaaa?" OMG, was I in for a shock!!!!!

I didn't know if Penny was the aberration or if Polly had been. But I knew, even with my dog and horse experience that I was in way over my head. In physical therapy TWICE before she was 6 months old for having my arm janked out of my shoulder, so many bruises and bites scars...I lost count. We got into puppy class as quick as we could. I got her an invisible fence so she couldn't yank me anymore. I was 'running' as fast as I could to keep up with this monster puppy who seemed to be able to outsmart me at every turn. I remember Penny's Dad walking down the hall with her firmly attached to his pant's leg...like a fluffy dust mop.

It all paid off and now I love her cheeky atittude, her sense of humor. She turned all of that into being the most amazing dog!! I know it's hard...I threatened her with rescue almost every day. lol

Hang in there, cry when you need to, come here whenever you need to vent. You'll be so glad you did!



Witcheeyone said:


> Ok, so i just spent the last hour typing a post. With a little help from a certain puppy, i lost the post. I want to start off by thanking each and everyone for your advice. Ive come to realize that i am the problem not Archie. Our last golden, william wallace, RIP
> 8-6-11 was the exact opposite of Archie. He was the most wonderful dog from the day we brought him home until the day he went to puppy heaven. This is why i am struggling so much with Archie. I know i cant compare the two, but i never expected this. I heard back from the trainer and Archie is going back to puppy school next tues. Apparently she doesnt think he needs private training because this is what she suggested. i am Archies primary caregiver. My husband is on the road 3 weeks in a row and home 1 week. We have a 21 yr old college student at home, but shes almost non existent. Lol. I thoughtni would give everyone a vision of my day. I work full time and come home around 12:30 every day and I Feed him and play ball for a while. Ive given up on taking him on walks. We have a large yard, 1 acre, so he is outside alot. he is never left in his kennel for more than 4 1/2 hrs at a time, other than sleeping in it overnight. When i get home from work, its straight outside and then dinner time. I play ball with him again for about 20 min. To be honest, the past few weeks, i have given up. I dont have thr energy anymore. Just last night, i had another melt down. I was laying on the bed crying and he hopped up on the bed and buried his face in my arms. Totally melted my heart. But the minute i left the bedroom, he was the devil again I do not give him free roam of the house either.
> He never out of my sight. I know what i need to do, but i am afraid i am out of patience.
> know i need to walk him and i want to, but it is such a chore with him jumping, tugging
> ...


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## Belle's Mom (Jan 24, 2007)

I have been following your posts and I understand completely also. If you look at my first posts when I joined here (and many peoples first posts) you will see a lot of the same issues.....biting, leashing pulling when they were once so good, etc.

Belle is now 5 years old and when DH and I read my first posts here we are able to laugh as Belle was a crazy biting puppy. 

We were just talking the other day about when she would launch herself off the sofa and latch onto the back of my PJs and hang there holding on with her mouth because she thought it was hilarious...I did not at the time and neither did my shredded PJs....but now we do think it is hilarious. Some of the behavior we were able to correct and some of it she flat grew out of. We thought we had a monster then, but now we laugh looking back at her puppy behavior and you will get to that point also..... It probably does not feel like it right now - It did not to me 5 years ago either - but you will get there. The laughter is coming it just takes some time.


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## vbud88 (Mar 8, 2011)

it does get better the tears i can with bolo, he was so naughty, but hes lovely now, this is him at a year


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