# Reasonable expectations for a newbie....



## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Question, what makes you think the dog might be better suited to conformation??


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## moverking (Feb 26, 2007)

My meager 2 cents worth....I'd much rather have a dog with solid obedience skills and the desire/ability for agility (or flyball, or field work) in place of *OR* along with knock 'em dead conformation. 
You can do agility in your own back yard.


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

since the pup isn't born yet this is all pretty theoretical but both the mom and dad come from pretty strong show lines.


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## TheHooch (May 9, 2007)

Just personally I would persue the obedience and or agility end of the sport. If you have the time to put into training.


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

thanks hootch
I think I'll start with housebreaking and move on from there.
Maybe ill start my kids on obedience.
Sit.
Stay.
Do your homework.
Hope you're feeling better and go alabama!


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## arcane (Sep 18, 2007)

If you are looking for a conformation prospect you must let the breeder know this as there is so much more to take into account when choosing a "show" puppy....the cost is generally higher as more is covered in a warranty. I don't want my pet quality pups in the show ring as that may not be the best pup to showcase my kennel or breeding program.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

not to try to dash your hopes, but arcane is absolutely right, you have to let the breeder know you want a "show quality" puppy if you plan to conformation show. If you look at a huge percentage of golden pedigrees, you'll see they "come from strong show lines". Ask everyone on here how many CH are in their dogs' backgrounds, and you might be very surprised. Honestly it doesn't mean a whole lot.
The breeder will pick a "show prospect". Supposedly only about 1 out of 100 show prospects will ever be successful in the show ring, and by that I mean CH. To go on as a special is another thing entirely.
You might want to pick up the book "show me", which is very well written, and get some background on conformation showing. For example, to get a CH on your dog, you will need 15 points including 2 majors. Here in IL, you have to defeat 23 other dogs to get a 3 point major (AKC). It's much easier to CH a dog in UKC or CKC. And unless you've been breeding and/or showing goldens for many years, if you plan to get an AKC championship on a golden you'd also better hire yourself a professional handler. 
Not to say that showing your dog isn't fun, I've been dabbling in it with the Tito Monster (in UKC) and it's a hoot. But I don't expect to AKC CH him, since I don't plan to breed him. It's really not worth the 25K investment, or more, to put a CH on him just to say he has one.
Meanwhile, we rack up the obedience titles. The nice thing about obedience is that any dog can do it if you have the patience to work with him/her. Conformation isn't like that at all. That's why obedience (and agility) are what I enjoy most with my goldens, it's about the partnership between you and your dog.
Another thing you will probably find is that many excellent breeders won't sell outstanding show prospects, especially bitches, to novice owners. They want their best puppies to go to homes that have proven that they can show them off to the best advantage.
Do you have what it takes to have a CH golden? Are you willing to spend hours and hours grooming? Put the dog on a treadmill if he's a little weak in the rear hocks? Make him sleep outside to develop his coat? Learn to do your own grooming, or pay about $100 every couple of weeks to have it done? Keep him from "breaking his hair" playing with other dogs? I'm not willing to do any of that, so I'll probably never have a CH golden even though I have a CH quality dog....
I'm not trying to be gloom and doom here, just presenting the "other side of showing" dogs.
I'd love some of the people with those gorgeous CH dogs on this forum to jump in and tell what it takes to select, train, and show a CH golden. I have the utmost respect for those people since I've recently learned how much is involved in it!!!


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

okay, you convinced me. 
I think I'll see if I can get the AKC to couch sitting as a formal event.
Or just stop thinking about it altogether

allen


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

bowl licking should be right up there too as an event!


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## goldengirls550 (Jun 12, 2008)

hotel4dogs said:


> not to try to dash your hopes, but arcane is absolutely right, you have to let the breeder know you want a "show quality" puppy if you plan to conformation show. If you look at a huge percentage of golden pedigrees, you'll see they "come from strong show lines". Ask everyone on here how many CH are in their dogs' backgrounds, and you might be very surprised. Honestly it doesn't mean a whole lot.
> The breeder will pick a "show prospect". Supposedly only about 1 out of 100 show prospects will ever be successful in the show ring, and by that I mean CH. To go on as a special is another thing entirely.
> You might want to pick up the book "show me", which is very well written, and get some background on conformation showing. For example, to get a CH on your dog, you will need 15 points including 2 majors. Here in IL, you have to defeat 23 other dogs to get a 3 point major (AKC). It's much easier to CH a dog in UKC or CKC. And unless you've been breeding and/or showing goldens for many years, if you plan to get an AKC championship on a golden you'd also better hire yourself a professional handler.
> Not to say that showing your dog isn't fun, I've been dabbling in it with the Tito Monster (in UKC) and it's a hoot. But I don't expect to AKC CH him, since I don't plan to breed him. It's really not worth the 25K investment, or more, to put a CH on him just to say he has one.
> ...


Hotel4dogs, that was a very informative post. Thank you for your honesty about showing in breed. The golden ring is extremely competive and is very difficult for the novice handler. You have to go in there with a flexible (maybe wrong choice of words but my brain is off lol) mind and not get too emotional. I am considering getting a show puppy and have done countless hours of research pouring over books, the internet, talking to exhibitors, breeders, friends, etc.... It is exhausting and there have been times I have truly doubted my decision. For now, I am still looking but I totally agree that you must put you WHOLE HEART into showing the dog if you so choose.

Right now I've got my juniors dog (a bit petite... still needs to fill out  and she also does obedience and will be ready for agility early next year. My other dog does obedience and rally. There are lots of other ways you can compete with your puppy that aren't as restrictive towards breed type (though you may want to consider obedience or agility lines or performance lines if you want to increase the likelihood that you will get a puppy that will excell in these sports).

Because I am an extremely competitive and driven individual, I will most likely be showing dogs for the rest of my life. I plan to go all the way in obedience and agility and want a breed dog as well who can also hold his own in other rings.

Good luck with your puppy!
Emily and the golden girlies: Aubrie and Layla


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

Hi Allen
Well I will go the opposite direction of the "nay sayers" 
First you would be surprised by the number of "the one that got away" stories top breeders can tell you about. The old "ugly duckling" type of thing. Does it happen often, no but it sure does on occassion.
And never let anyone dash your "hopes". 
If you have any hope of showing in conformation yes talk to the breeder. Not only may they send a "prospect" your way but you can not show in confo0rmation on a "Limited Registration". Some breeders will have a let's wait and see position on whether to grant "Full Registraion" which is how I purchased Keeper. 
All this said it is *VERY *difficult for a novice to accomplish much in the conformation ring. You truly have a better chance of your Novice A obedience dog getting an OTCh than you do finishing your first "show" dog on yoour own. You need a very good mentor, skin as thick as the hide of a rhino and an excellent dog. Again it does happen but not very often. Your best bet if you choose to proceed this if your breeder does not fit the mentor bill, is join a local club and find someone willing to help you.

GOOD LUCK with the pup in whatever you decide to do.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

I know I am just kennel help here, but it is fairly common to accomplish great things in the conformation ring, provided you manage your bank account with a very *LARGE *shovel.


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

vrocco1 said:


> I know I am just kennel help here, but it is fairly common to accomplish great things in the conformation ring, provided you manage your bank account with a very *LARGE *shovel.


I thought that Large shovel was for used for scooping up things?????


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

Maggies mom said:


> I thought that Large shovel was for used for scooping up things?????


LOL We have a different shovel for that! But, it is just as big.


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## molmotta (May 22, 2005)

hotel4dogs said:


> Do you have what it takes to have a CH golden? Are you willing to spend hours and hours grooming? Put the dog on a treadmill if he's a little weak in the rear hocks? Make him sleep outside to develop his coat? Learn to do your own grooming, or pay about $100 every couple of weeks to have it done? Keep him from "breaking his hair" playing with other dogs?


Gee... you really make it sound as if people who show their dogs do not allow their dogs to have fun... :


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

molmotta said:


> Gee... you really make it sound as if people who show their dogs do not allow their dogs to have fun... :


Believe me, there are dogs that LOVE to be groomed, and really, really enjoy themselves in the conformation ring. Some doggies are just natural born show-offs.


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

vrocco1 said:


> Believe me, there are dogs that LOVE to be groomed, and really, really enjoy themselves in the conformation ring. Some doggies are just natural born show-offs.


My Keeper has been one of those most of her life. I think for some it is just being with their human that makes them happy. She would leap up on the grooming table whenever I brought it out and would stand there for as long as I would allow her to, her tail always wagging non-stop. It did not matter if I was trimming ears, clipping nails she LOVED it. Lately she is not as enthusiastic about it but she is now over 12.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

My dogs love the ring. They love being groomed. They love being roadworked and excercised. Thy love the show atmosphere. It's important to note that it is what YOU make of it for them. I might spend a couple of hours getting a dog ready for the ring, and as they are on the table or on their way to the ring, a spectator will ask "Can I pet your dog?" My reply? "PLEASE, do!" I don't freak out that his hair will get mussed up - I can recomb it. In between shows, my dogs are out in the field, rolling in mud, play fighting with each other, going to classes, playing with an obscene number of toys, and NOT being kept under glass. They do get bathed weekly. (And usually 10 minutes later look like they need a bath :doh Good coat is good coat, and while I do things to help prevent excessive breakage, I will not prevent them from being dogs, enjoying life to do so. I will say that most of my friends who show their dogs are the same way. It's not as horrible for the dogs to be show dogs as some would have you believe.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I am sooo glad to hear from some of you who treat your show dogs the way you do, and your dogs are loving it. It has NOT been my experience with people in my area. It's refreshing to know that you are out there and doing it right! I have boarded show dogs (not necessarily goldens) and never cease to be horrified by the list of requirements that usually comes in with the dogs....no playing with other dogs....not allowed outside if it's wet....not allowed outside except in the shade if the sun is out so the coat colors don't fade....I could go on and on and on....


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

hotel4dogs said:


> I am sooo glad to hear from some of you who treat your show dogs the way you do, and your dogs are loving it. It has NOT been my experience with people in my area. It's refreshing to know that you are out there and doing it right! I have boarded show dogs (not necessarily goldens) and never cease to be horrified by the list of requirements that usually comes in with the dogs....no playing with other dogs....not allowed outside if it's wet....not allowed outside except in the shade if the sun is out so the coat colors don't fade....I could go on and on and on....


When Gini was alive, we had Boot Camp (my place - training, some reasonable expectations of being well behaved, and grooming) and we had Frat Camp (THEIR place - NO rules, heathen-like activity encouraged, and all the time swimming in Lake Michigan or Portage Lake, storming through the swamp, and rolling in doG knows what in the woods. I tried, but couldn't, to be mad at her - the amount of work cleaning them up when they came back to Boot Camp was _enormous! _But, they had SO much fun, were so loved, so spoiled, and honestly were in great muscle all the time, that I just dealt with it. When people used to ask her what we did for coats, her standard answer was her signature big, booming laugh, and "Alewives". Newbies wondered if it was some sort of coat product that they could by from one of the vendors. The look on their faces when I told them that they rolled in dead fish on the Lake MI shore was priceless. 
Gini taught me patience and tolerance - because it did all come out in the wash.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

OMG, I love it! Fish oil in it's purest form! 
It really pleases me to know that not all "show people" are like the ones that I've been encountering. It makes me so sad to see someone at my conformation class with a gorgeous 6 month golden bitch that's not allowed to play with any other dogs (her own dogs included)because she might break some hairs, does treadmill time every day instead of being out playing ball in the gorgeous fall weather, and has to sleep outside so she'll get a thick coat.


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

Have you discussed your plans with your breeder? Be aware that a lot of breeders won't sell their conformation pick puppy to someone who hasn't done conformation before - lots of people change their mind once they see how much it costs to campaign a dog - it ain't cheap - and it's not always fair.

Obedience and agility trials can be great fun - and there's a better sense of fairness I think: typically a qualifying score is a qualifying score regardless of the judge, if you have a great day you leave with a leg - not always true with the breed ring - your dog can be ON and you get dumped by a dog of less quality with a really good handler. Obedience and agility (flyball and hunting too) take quite a bit of time investment to train - but they can be really rewarding too. The breed ring can be rewarding too - but in a different way I think.

Do you have obedience/agility club in your area? Do you have some one who can help you get your feet wet in training? Have you been to a dog show to see what its like? Check out events on the akc website for trials near you and go watch - introduce yourself to competitors (but not as they're getting ready to go in the ring) and ask questions. Your breeder should be a resource here too...

Also know that once you get hooked it's a downhill spiral (giggle) - it starts with a weekend here and a weekend there - then pretty soon you're figuring out which weekends you're going to be home and how long you have to grocery shop for because things don't get done on trial weekends anymore 

Best of luck!
Erica


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

hotel4dogs said:


> OMG, I love it! Fish oil in it's purest form!
> It really pleases me to know that not all "show people" are like the ones that I've been encountering. It makes me so sad to see someone at my conformation class with a gorgeous 6 month golden bitch that's not allowed to play with any other dogs (her own dogs included)because she might break some hairs, does treadmill time every day instead of being out playing ball in the gorgeous fall weather, and has to sleep outside so she'll get a thick coat.


That person sounds like either a rank novice who thinks she knows what to do with a show dog, or an idiot. At 6 months old, treadmilling her can cause irreparable damage. And she is missing out on valuable socialization. As for the coat of a 6 month old puppy, it's all going to DISAPPEAR ANYWAY, so she's wasting her time with that.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

That person is not a rank novice, but a total idiot, I'm with you 100% on that one.


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## Pure Gold (Feb 27, 2007)

Pointgold said:


> My dogs love the ring. They love being groomed. They love being roadworked and excercised. Thy love the show atmosphere. It's important to note that it is what YOU make of it for them. I might spend a couple of hours getting a dog ready for the ring, and as they are on the table or on their way to the ring, a spectator will ask "Can I pet your dog?" My reply? "PLEASE, do!" I don't freak out that his hair will get mussed up - I can recomb it. In between shows, my dogs are out in the field, rolling in mud, play fighting with each other, going to classes, playing with an obscene number of toys, and NOT being kept under glass. They do get bathed weekly. (And usually 10 minutes later look like they need a bath :doh Good coat is good coat, and while I do things to help prevent excessive breakage, I will not prevent them from being dogs, enjoying life to do so. I will say that most of my friends who show their dogs are the same way. It's not as horrible for the dogs to be show dogs as some would have you believe.


I love this response!

I have been in conformation for 5 years now (so, I'm still pretty new at it).
I must say that I've found it to be a rewarding and also a great bonding experience for me and my Goldens. 

I live in South Florida...keep my dogs outside for a better coat??!! That sounds utterly ridiculous; as well as cruel (Goldens love being with their humans above all else:smooch. Don't allow them to play, because it may damage the coat??!! Good grief, I've never heard such a thing. The Golden's coat is supposed to be tough enough to jump into the water or go through thick brush to hunt game. 

The Golden is a versatile dog that should be able to 'do it all'...and most importantly to do what it was bred to do. 

At any rate, I think enjoying your puppy and giving it lots of love & attention should be the priority focus (which it sounds like it is for you). 
If you happen to get a pup that might do well in conformation or any other venue, go for it! 

For what it's worth, my first Champion was sold to me as a 'pet quality'!


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

Pure Gold said:


> For what it's worth, my first Champion was sold to me as a 'pet quality'!


This always reminds me of Ch. Asterling's Sunbeam Tiger, SDHF.I first saw him when I was showing Lyric at the Iam's Tournament of Champions (which she won Sporting Dog Puppy of the Year ) I KNEW that he was going to be the dog that I bred her to. He was sweet, silly, and moved like I cannot describe. He was rather straight in the front, but Lyric would fix that, I was sure. Anyway, I learned that Mary Burke had sold him as a pet to Barbara Berend in WI. Barb and her husband took him back to be boarded with Mary when he was around two, I think, when they went to Europe. Mary took one look at him and asked if she could show him while he was with her. They said "sure". He finished in a weekend. Berend's came home to a champion, with a haircut that they hated. They loved his fuzzy ear, and whiskers, and shaggy coat. But, he was a champion and they thought that was sorta cool. Four years later, he was boarded again, and again, went out to shows, as a special. He ended up with Ken and Virginia Murray, earned his Show Dog Hall of Fame title, and was Best Veteran at the National 3 years in a row. I did breed Lyric to him which produced my first home-bred champion, Nitelite's High Top Tennies, CD, CGC, TDI. Tiger, while a wonderful showdog, was a pet, first and foremost. Sold as a pet. You just never know!


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## Pure Gold (Feb 27, 2007)

Awesome story! Thanks for sharing it...proves the 'point': very well...ya just never know!!!


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

Okay guys, you convinced me!
I'm in it to win it. Cancel the Golden Retriever. I'm getting a cool little white dog like this one and a spiffy red jacket like this guy.
The dog seems, um, just as excited as his handler!!
Westminster, here I come!!









*Ch. BISS Just Glad to See You, call name Woody*


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

avincent52 said:


> *Ch. BISS Just Glad to See You, call name Woody*


 
What a GREAT name. Reminds me of that old Mae West line
"Is that a gun in your pocket or are you just glad to see me!"

Will have to go on my all time fovorites list.


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

AmbikaGR said:


> What a GREAT name. Reminds me of that old Mae West line
> "Is that a gun in your pocket or are you just glad to see me!"
> 
> Will have to go on my all time fovorites list.


Mine, too! Next to "Most Happy Skirt Lifter", a Golden who's kennel name I cannot for the life of me remember...


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

> Mine, too! Next to "Most Happy Skirt Lifter", a Golden who's kennel name I cannot for the life of me remember...


Um, speaking of skirt lifting, I stumbled upon the photo beow ("What Not To Wear: Dog Show Edition") on the newbie dog show blog.
Don't say I didn't warn you. 

On second thought, maybe I'll find something else to do with the puppy...
Cow pie retrieving? 
Pre-school agility (whoever knocks over the most little kids wins...)
_Dis_-obedience. 

http://dogshownewbie.blogspot.com/2008/05/what-not-to-wear-dog-show-edition.html


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## Angel_Kody (Feb 27, 2007)

avincent52 said:


> Um, speaking of skirt lifting, I stumbled upon this photo on the newbie dog show blog.
> Don't say I didn't warn you.
> 
> On second thought, maybe I'll find something else to do with the puppy...
> ...


 
OMG!!! Too funny!!

PS...I had the same thoughts as you when I got Jester and even had a brief (very brief) discussion with Sharon about it. She did not discourage me but expressed a lot of the same things the experts here already have. Later I found out that Jester is terrfied of agility equipment and that Rally is fun for the dog but really hard for the handler...all that sign reading :doh: geez...do I know how to make my dog look bad! :no:


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

Well, I'd say start with just basic obedience, obviously, but with a good enough instructor that their methods won't hold you back later on if you decide to compete in either obedience or agility (basically meaning an instructor who uses positive methods, so your dog always has a positive association with working with you, doesn't hate to lie down like Dusty did when we started agility, etc). 

A clueless owner with a bad instructor, very low expectations for any sport (although you can still end up okay if you eventually recognize that your instructor is bad and find a better one). A clueless owner with a good instructor that keeps the dog motivated and helps the owner become less clueless, you could do very well in agility as long as you keep the dog in good condition (and I imagine obedience would be the same).


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

avincent52 said:


> Um, speaking of skirt lifting, I stumbled upon the photo beow ("What Not To Wear: Dog Show Edition") on the newbie dog show blog.
> Don't say I didn't warn you.
> 
> On second thought, maybe I'll find something else to do with the puppy...
> ...


 
Yup. That's bad. Incredibly, I have actually seen _worse. :doh: _In the case of the lady handling the Boston, her skirt was too short to BE lifted by our old Golden friend! Definately a crime of fashion, let alone dog show fashion!


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

Wait I've got it...

Announcing the first annual Westminster Swimsuit Competition....

50 dogs
50 super models
50 isty bitsy teeny weeny bikinis










Now, _that's _conformation.


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## DUSTYRD2 (Feb 28, 2007)

Pure Gold said:


> For what it's worth, my first Champion was sold to me as a 'pet quality'!


And so was Dusty sold to us a "pet quality" because he had a slight curl in the end of his tail. He went on to be............ well you know the rest. LOL
You just never know so go for it.


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

avincent52 said:


> Wait I've got it...
> 
> Announcing the first annual Westminster Swimsuit Competition....
> 
> ...


Hooch
You up for some judging???
It's conformation for both the dogs and the handlers, and we all know that a hands-on assessment is most definitely required.

Allen


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## Thor0918 (Feb 28, 2008)

avincent52 said:


> Hooch
> You up for some judging???
> It's conformation for both the dogs and the handlers, and we all know that a hands-on assessment is most definitely required.
> 
> Allen


Oh my this thread has definately gone to the dogs.:bowl:


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

avincent52 said:


> Hooch
> You up for some judging???
> It's conformation for both the dogs and the handlers, and we all know that a hands-on assessment is most definitely required.
> 
> Allen


Yeah. But don't forget, you must examine _both_ sexes.


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## moverking (Feb 26, 2007)

Pointgold said:


> Yeah. But don't forget, you must examine _both_ sexes.


Hahaha, touche!


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

Pointgold said:


> My dogs love the ring. They love being groomed. They love being roadworked and excercised. Thy love the show atmosphere. It's important to note that it is what YOU make of it for them. I might spend a couple of hours getting a dog ready for the ring, and as they are on the table or on their way to the ring, a spectator will ask "Can I pet your dog?" My reply? "PLEASE, do!" I don't freak out that his hair will get mussed up - I can recomb it. In between shows, my dogs are out in the field, rolling in mud, play fighting with each other, going to classes, playing with an obscene number of toys, and NOT being kept under glass. They do get bathed weekly. (And usually 10 minutes later look like they need a bath :doh Good coat is good coat, and while I do things to help prevent excessive breakage, I will not prevent them from being dogs, enjoying life to do so. I will say that most of my friends who show their dogs are the same way. It's not as horrible for the dogs to be show dogs as some would have you believe.


At the Nationals I actually had a breeder come up to me and ask me to play with the six month old puppy she was handling. It wasn't her dog, but she was trying to socialize it for another breeder. She was also trying to figure out what scenarios and people the puppy was afraid of, because she had some issues that needed to be taken care of.


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

> Yeah. But don't forget, you must examine both sexes.


Laura, 
Maybe you and Hooch can work as a team.
I think George Clooney has a dog.


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## vrocco1 (Feb 25, 2006)

avincent52 said:


> I think George Clooney has a dog.



Nah! That's just Hooch!


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## Pure Gold (Feb 27, 2007)

This thread has taken on a whole new meaning...:woot2:too funny!


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## arcane (Sep 18, 2007)

avincent52 said:


> Laura,
> Maybe you and Hooch can work as a team.
> I think George Clooney has a dog.


OH! I'll volunteer to judge that class :smooch::curtain:


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

Whoever judges this category might want rubber gloves and hand sanitizer


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## Angel_Kody (Feb 27, 2007)

I went to the gsgrc point show earlier this month to watch. It is not far from where I live and I like to go and see all the beautiful goldens in one place! If you want to get an idea of the golden show dog world first hand you should go some time. It's interesting....

I was standing by a tent with Jester just watching and listening to what was going on around me. A handler (woman) looked down at Jester, cocked her head to one side, looked up at me and said "Bitch?" My dumb-founded response that inevitably revealed my spectator only status was..."Huh?...Excuse me? Oh...nooooo...(ha-ha) he's a boy dog!" She walked away and I whispered to Jester..."Don't worry buddy...Mommy doesn't think you look like a girl!" :


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

arcane said:


> OH! I'll volunteer to judge that class :smooch::curtain:


That assignment is all yours... (personally, I think he'd _prefer _either Hooch or avincent judge him :uhoh

Now, a little of this:


















or even a little









I'm happy to judge!


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

Pointgold said:


> That assignment is all yours... (personally, I think he'd _prefer _either Hooch or avincent judge him :uhoh
> 
> Now, a little of this:
> 
> ...


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

FWIW, Tom Cruise did okay for a gay guy. 












Katie Holmes reminds me of my wife when she was that age. And my wife has only gotten better with age. Katie not so much.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I'm lost??? Your wife was gay when she was that age??? Now she's gotten better???


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

No, when she was 25, my wife looked a lot like Katie Holmes (who is married to Tom Cruise, who had been widely rumored to be gay, much more so than Mr. Clooney.)

For that matter, my wife still looks a lot like Katie Holmes (only smarter, her marriage to me notwithstanding.)

Say what you want about me and my wife, but watch what you say about my good friend Hootch!!


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## Thor0918 (Feb 28, 2008)

avincent52 said:


> No, when she was 25, my wife looked a lot like Katie Holmes (who is married to Tom Cruise, who had been widely rumored to be gay, much more so than Mr. Clooney.)
> 
> For that matter, my wife still looks a lot like Katie Holmes (only smarter, her marriage to me notwithstanding.)
> 
> Say what you want about me and my wife, but watch what you say about my good friend Hootch!!


 I think you're giving Hooch a run for the money in the humor department! Hey Hooch do you hear that?


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## Thor0918 (Feb 28, 2008)

My next question is do you look like Tom Cruise???


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

hotel4dogs said:


> I'm lost??? Your wife was gay when she was that age??? Now she's gotten better???


*GREAT QUESTION!!*
I was going to ask if his wife was better with Allen being gay.:curtain:


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

> My next question is do you look like Tom Cruise???


I've been told I smell like him.


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## molmotta (May 22, 2005)

Just want to add that I love all the responses from Vrocco, Pointgold, Puregold & Ambikagr. I was rather afraid when I read some of the responses earlier that the impression of showdogs is such a sad life. 

If such is to be the life of a show dog, then I will rather stop showing, because my Dyna is always running crazily after a tennis ball, wrestling with her brother, and out in the sun. But yet, she is a natural born show-off... :doh:


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## Thor0918 (Feb 28, 2008)

avincent52 said:


> I've been told I smell like him.


Well now, that's sayin sumpin


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## Pointgold (Jun 6, 2007)

molmotta said:


> Just want to add that I love all the responses from Vrocco, Pointgold, Puregold & Ambikagr. I was rather afraid when I read some of the responses earlier that the impression of showdogs is such a sad life.
> 
> If such is to be the life of a show dog, then I will rather stop showing, because my Dyna is always running crazily after a tennis ball, wrestling with her brother, and out in the sun. But yet, she is a natural born show-off... :doh:


Once my Lyric had been retired from the ring (other than going to Specialties as a Veteran), she was mortified when she didn't get to go when I left for a show. As I would pack the van, she'd get herself into any open crate, or at least IN the van, and wait for me. She LOVED showing. And National Specialties were always her birthday party, she was sure that EVERYone there was there for her. Her "fans" would come to see her and bring her gifts. She did love it. And she NEVER forgot anyone that she loved. I was watching Westminster on television one year that I did not attend, and we were at "dog" friends who had a big screen tv. Lyric was laying at my feet. Annie Rogers-Clark was judging, and they adored each other. Annie was mic'd, and made one of her signature noises, and then spoke to the exhibitor. Lyric jumped up and free-stacked heself in front of the tv when she heard it! Thankfully, Annie and Lyric got a chance to visit at the National in Cleveland - I will never forget her telling Lyric - "we are both grand old ladies who've had special lives, aren't we? "


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## Thor0918 (Feb 28, 2008)

Now that's a great story!


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## molmotta (May 22, 2005)

Pointgold said:


> Once my Lyric had been retired from the ring (other than going to Specialties as a Veteran), she was mortified when she didn't get to go when I left for a show. As I would pack the van, she'd get herself into any open crate, or at least IN the van, and wait for me.


That's just too adorable!!! Did she show you the "finger" when you told her she cant come along? :


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## Gwen (Aug 9, 2007)

vrocco1 said:


> Believe me, there are dogs that LOVE to be groomed, and really, really enjoy themselves in the conformation ring. Some doggies are just natural born show-offs.


Nygel is one of those dogs - when he goes into the show ring, he turns into a peacock!!!!! As well, he just LOVES to be groomed!!!! Many time, I'll sit on the floor with him & brush him & he enjoys it like he's in seventh heaven.

Now, Oliver on the other hand, hates people watching him - he's a wallflower. When I was trialling him, the more people that watched the lower his scores were - if there was a large crowd, he would shut right down. He loves to go to shows/trials with us but just keep him out of the ring! 

What did I do differently with each dog - absolutely NOTHING!!!!! 

As far as special treatment for my "show" dog, nothing! He eats the same food, he plays the same, he goes for walks off lead, he swims, he plays in mud, he goes for car/boat rides, he goes camping, he plays with kids & gets petted by kids regularly when we're out & about, both of the boys sleep in our bedroom (although Nyg prefers to be curled up around the toilet in the ensuite (on ceramic tiles that are much cooler than carpet)...in other words, they're normal dogs!

Do, I let people pet my dog at shows - most definitely. The only time I say "No" is when we're entering the ring and I tell them they can pet after we get out of the ring.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I just came back from a UKC conformation show, 2 shows in one day which is typical for UKC, and I have to laugh at allen's comment about obedience and agility being more active! Yikes, I'm exhausted! I thought if the judge said "take them around the ring twice together" one more time I was going to BELT her! Whew, this conformation stuff is hard work.


".... think the dog is likely to be better suited to conformation, but I'm also intrigued by the more active disciplines like obedience and agility.

And what are reasonable expectations for a pretty nice dog and a clueless owner with a busy schedule?

thanks in advance

allen....."


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## avincent52 (Jul 23, 2008)

Yet another reason to stay on the couch. 
FWIW, my neighbors are tired too. They ran the New York City Marathon yesterday. My knees hurt just thinking about it. 

Congrats to you and the dogs on the good showing.
best
Allen


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## molmotta (May 22, 2005)

hotel4dogs said:


> I thought if the judge said "take them around the ring twice together" one more time I was going to BELT her!


  

I once heard a judge say, "All gundogs are athletes. Take them around the ring one more time!!" 

Then I heard one of the handers muttering, "But the handlers are NOT!!"

ROTFL!!!


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Yes, we were grumbling that they need a "senior" class. For the handlers, not the dogs. 
Take them around TWICE more....
Take them around TWICE more....


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## goldengirls550 (Jun 12, 2008)

molmotta said:


> I once heard a judge say, "All gundogs are athletes. Take them around the ring one more time!!"
> 
> Then I heard one of the handers muttering, "But the handlers are NOT!!"
> 
> ROTFL!!!


LOL. Love that comment. If only we could train our goldens well enough to eliminate the handler portion of showing...


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