# Allergic dog...help me choose?



## NuttinButGoldens (Jan 10, 2009)

California Natural is what I would use for any dog with Allergies.


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

The great dane lady has some great articles about systemic yeast. She is a canine nutritionist and former university professor. www.greatdanelady.com She recommends NZymes among other things. We started on them when we first got our rescue springer who had severe autoimmune problems. Really did help... and I still use with all of our crew. 
If you wanted to take a different route than traditional kibble, you could try The Honest Kitchen, a dehydrated raw food. There are several varieties and many allergic dogs do very well on it. www.thehonestkitchen.com


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Here is an article on systemic yeast. http://www.greatdanelady.com/articles/systemic_yeast_mini_course.htm


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## buck1s (Jun 23, 2009)

Thanks for the replies. I've looked at the CN formula, but want to get Atticus away from potatoes for a little while at the same time I get him a new meat protein. I'm still keeping it as an option of none of the others works.

The great dane lady's site has a lot of info on it. Thanks. My skepticism meter goes up when I get a hard sell on expensive supplements for yeast problems though. I'm going to try to tackle it myself through changing his diet, adding probiotics, and washing him frequently. 

The HK dehydrated food is probably not the direction I'm looking to go now, but what an interesting option. Based on the kibbles I listed, do you have any experience or opinions. I've searched the forum extensively, but haven't found much of anything re:Canine Caviar. Eagle Pack seems to be highly thought of, but the chicken fat ingredient bothers me. 

Really, thanks for any further thoughts.

Chris


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

I've used Eagle Pack Holistic line (duck) and our crew did well. Now, our springer and aussie are on the Fromm 4 star food ( again the duck). www.frommfamily.com All of their 4 star foods are for all stages.... pup thru senior. Oh, and they are designed for sensitive tummies and allergies.


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## artbuc (Apr 12, 2009)

buck1s said:


> Thanks for the replies. I've looked at the CN formula, but want to get Atticus away from potatoes for a little while at the same time I get him a new meat protein. I'm still keeping it as an option of none of the others works.
> 
> The great dane lady's site has a lot of info on it. Thanks. My skepticism meter goes up when I get a hard sell on expensive supplements for yeast problems though. I'm going to try to tackle it myself through changing his diet, adding probiotics, and washing him frequently.
> 
> ...


Rocky is on Natural Balance Sweet Potato & Fish. It has helped his allergic symptoms tremendously. I am looking for another food to develop a rotation and get away from potatoes for a while, just like Chris. Rocky seems to be quite allergic to oats, chicken, lamb and beef so I don't have many options. Previous owner said he did well on venison and was feeding him Nutro Venison & Br Rice.

The Canine Caviar Venison & Split Pea looks like a good option to try but it is not easy to find. I have been communicating with Canine Caviar via email. They have been helpful in finding the nearest store but could not answer any technical questions about their formula. They referred me to their local sales rep which seemed odd. I think they are a small start-up company with minimal staff.

In any event, I echo Chris' question: anyone out there have experience or info re Canine Caviar? Thanks.


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

I had Gunner on the Eagle Pack Holistic Select for a while. (The anchovy, sardine and salmon formula.) He did "okay" on it - I did notice some improvement - but we still had problems.
His biggest problem had always been yeast in the ears. I was cleaning them three times a week and they were still horrible.

I switched him to grain-free (Wellness Core) and the improvement has been remarkable. I'm cleaning his ears maybe once every two weeks or so now and half the time they don't even really need it.
Core does have potatoes in it, though, so I don't know if you want to go that route. 
Personally, I wouldn't change his protein source and eliminate potatoes at the same time. I'd do one or the other and see what happens.


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## Garfield (Apr 7, 2009)

Chris,

Was a panel for food allergies run on Atticus and, if so, did it reveal anything?


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

Also, as has been discussed several times here..... make sure a complete thyroid panel was done (sent out). Even many vets don't realize that a reading of "low normal" is actually LOW in goldens and needs treatment. Dr Jean Dodds is the leading expert in canine hematology/ endocrinology....... if the reading was low normal, you might want a consult with her. She's very good about phone consults and would work with your vet. You can google her or her co., Hemopet.


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## buck1s (Jun 23, 2009)

I did go ahead an buy the Canine Caviar Venison and Split Pea online, so that will be his first test of a new food in a few years. I'll report back how he does on it. The boy is an eating machine though. It won't be because he doesn't like the taste 

Yes, Atticus had full thyroid panel done, but I will need to see his records to see what the actual results were. Vet, whom I trust very much (wish I got that good healthcare), said results were normal. I know that I need more details now, however. 

Yes, allergy tests too. Just environmental allergans, no food. There were a variety of weeds that he is allergic to, as well as dust mites. Whose house doesn't have dust. That seems like a hard one to overcome even though we're trying. 

I'm still perplexed as to why he isn't biting his feet as he's done before when having an allergic reaction. I'm also surprised that these events started in the fall/winter as opposed to spring/summer. I guess that's why I'm leaning towards yeast infection, and we're trying everything else anyway. We've got to get something to work.

Thanks everyone. 

Chris


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## Garfield (Apr 7, 2009)

Thanks for the info, Chris. One other note for if the food change alone doesn't provide quick relief - try supplementing with Omega acids (i.e. Krill oil or something of the like) as your boy may need sufficiently more than Iam's (or even the new food) provides for. Overall supplements to improve skin and coat condition such as Nupro, Wholistic Pet and Missing Link may speed things along too. Good luck!


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## redheadsnotwarheads (Dec 27, 2008)

Oh wow, something I actually can contribute to!

Aries has been battling with the EXACT issues you are struggling with now.. the only thing that has worked with his constant yeasty ears and itchy skin has been to bathe him in a very mild oatmeal bath every month to keep the dead skin off, along with cleaning his ears every other day with listerine. We noticed the most immediate change however, when we switched him to Taste of the Wild Pacific Stream grain-free dog foodand started giving him probiotics every day. 

We just recently decided the grains could be a contributing factor, they certainly were! The little black dots all over his tummy, inner thighs has cleared up completely and he has stopped scratching.


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## buck1s (Jun 23, 2009)

That's great! Aries must be a happier dog. I can't wait to get Atticus on a grain free diet. What brand of probiotics are you using? I researched what I use personally very thoroughly but I'm not sure it's appropriate for dogs. It is just various strains of acidophilus (sp?) and bifidus, therefore, I'm pretty sure it's safe. However, I'm curious to know what others use. I'd love to find one I can put in his water so that I can time it for use away from his food. Maybe that's not as important for dogs as it is humans.

Thanks again.

Chris


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## artbuc (Apr 12, 2009)

buck1s said:


> I did go ahead an buy the Canine Caviar Venison and Split Pea online, so that will be his first test of a new food in a few years. I'll report back how he does on it. The boy is an eating machine though. It won't be because he doesn't like the taste
> 
> Yes, Atticus had full thyroid panel done, but I will need to see his records to see what the actual results were. Vet, whom I trust very much (wish I got that good healthcare), said results were normal. I know that I need more details now, however.
> 
> ...


Chris, I have been doing some reading re Sweet Potatoes and find that they are a nutritional powerhouse. Now I am not so sure I want to move away from them. Why did you decide on CC Venison vs Natural Balance Sweet Potato and Venison? I know you said you wanted to get away from potatoes - do you have specific reasons or just want to change things up? 

Also, where did you get the CC on-line? izzyshealthyfood.com, petfooddirect.com or somewhere else? Thanks. The more I read about CC, the more I am inclined to give it a try too.


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## buck1s (Jun 23, 2009)

I agree with you about sweet potatoes. However, if Atticus is battling a yeast problem internally (which we don't know for sure), I want to get him away from high GI carbs for a while. There's no reason he couldn't go back and try potatoes if his skin problems clear up, but carbs just stoke yeast production. The other reason I'm switching foods is that his current food's first ingredient is potatoes. That just can't be ideal for a dog.

I bought CC online from thehungrypuppy.com. One reason I chose THP was that it ships from NJ and I live in VA. CC's distribution is not wide by any means, and I have backup plans if they can't make it as a business. As far as the product goes, I'm impressed by the construction.

Chris


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## artbuc (Apr 12, 2009)

buck1s said:


> I agree with you about sweet potatoes. However, if Atticus is battling a yeast problem internally (which we don't know for sure), I want to get him away from high GI carbs for a while. There's no reason he couldn't go back and try potatoes if his skin problems clear up, but carbs just stoke yeast production. The other reason I'm switching foods is that his current food's first ingredient is potatoes. That just can't be ideal for a dog.
> 
> I bought CC online from thehungrypuppy.com. One reason I chose THP was that it ships from NJ and I live in VA. CC's distribution is not wide by any means, and I have backup plans if they can't make it as a business. As far as the product goes, I'm impressed by the construction.
> 
> Chris


I think you and I are on exactly the same page. CC has been around for about 13 years, but it isn't clear it they will make it long term. My nephew is a deer hunter and always has a freezer full of venison. My back-up plan will be NB Sweet Potato & Venison supplemented with "real" venison. I will adjust it to keep the calories the same but make it richer in meat protein.
The only concern I have with CC Ven & SP is the herbs. I don't know if my dog will tolerate them plus I wonder if they really have therapeutic amounts? Sweet potatoes are fairly close to split peas as far as GI goes, but I share your concern about too many carbs, regardless of GI.


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## buck1s (Jun 23, 2009)

A little thread necromancy here, but I just wanted to update on Atticus and how he's doing with Canine Caviar Venison and Split Pea. He's been eating it for nearly a month, along with probiotics at two of his three daily meals. First of all, Atticus is a food hound. Doesn't matter what, he wolfs it down. So I was not surprised when we gave him his first meal with CC, that he cleaned it up quickly. However, I was surprised when he went back two times after walking away to lick his bowl. That was cool.

The next thing we noticed right away was that he went from pooping 1x or 2x per day to 3x per day. Big monsters, pardon the expression  They are solid so I'm not worried right now. 

Lastly, and most positively so far, his ears have not exploded and look really good. We think his belly is starting to grow hair again, too. However, it's been very little time and he is on allergy shots once a month as well. Hard to pin down anything, but the food seems to be a success so far.

Thanks everyone.

Chris


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## Penny & Maggie's Mom (Oct 4, 2007)

As for probiotics, many here use the Dogzymes digestive enhancer (www.naturesfarmacy.com) . It has high levels of probiotics and enzymes and is a very stable base so has a long shelf life with no refrigeration. It is also very economical. The 2 lb tub lasts our 4 about 5 months. I learned about if from Pointgold, and have seen it at some of the dog shows too.


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## beemis (Jul 17, 2009)

I'm sure you already know you need a limited ingredient food. My golden also has food allergies. I put him on Natural Balance Fish & Sweet Potato. I also wanted to add more protein, and since he was doing well on fish & sweet potato, I added more fish (cooked). Enough to equal 1/3, or less, of his daily calorie requirements.You can also contact someone who can help you formulate a balanced diet for your dog and work through the allergy issues. This would probably be cheaper in the long run since you will save on vet bills and also save money buying different foods as you are searching for the perfect food for your dog. Plus your dog would be alot happier.
Good Luck


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## buck1s (Jun 23, 2009)

beemis said:


> I'm sure you already know you need a limited ingredient food. My golden also has food allergies. I put him on Natural Balance Fish & Sweet Potato. I also wanted to add more protein, and since he was doing well on fish & sweet potato, I added more fish (cooked). Enough to equal 1/3, or less, of his daily calorie requirements.You can also contact someone who can help you formulate a balanced diet for your dog and work through the allergy issues. This would probably be cheaper in the long run since you will save on vet bills and also save money buying different foods as you are searching for the perfect food for your dog. Plus your dog would be alot happier.
> Good Luck


I'll have to politely disagree with you, beemis.

First of all, I'm attacking his allergy problems from all fronts. It started with immunotherapy (because we know he's allergic to things other than food) and is continuing with a diet change. Personally, I don't think he had an allergy to his prior food, I just wanted a better food. When I mentioned success in my last post, I was referring to the fact that the new food didn't make things worse. That's fantastic because it's a better food and now I can keep Atticus on it.

I suspect that Atticus has/had a problem with yeast (systemically). The only way I could address that concern is diet change (higher protein, grain-free food and probiotics). If I was wrong, no harm done since he's getting the best I can find in any event. 

P.S. My dog probably can't be any happier. I've been working hard for 6 years to make sure that's the case.


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## artbuc (Apr 12, 2009)

buck1s said:


> A little thread necromancy here, but I just wanted to update on Atticus and how he's doing with Canine Caviar Venison and Split Pea. He's been eating it for nearly a month, along with probiotics at two of his three daily meals. First of all, Atticus is a food hound. Doesn't matter what, he wolfs it down. So I was not surprised when we gave him his first meal with CC, that he cleaned it up quickly. However, I was surprised when he went back two times after walking away to lick his bowl. That was cool.
> 
> The next thing we noticed right away was that he went from pooping 1x or 2x per day to 3x per day. Big monsters, pardon the expression  They are solid so I'm not worried right now.
> 
> ...


Glad to hear that Chris! I tried NB SP and Venison as a potential precursor to CC Venison & SP. Rocky's previous owner said he did well on venison. After 3 days of feeding a 50/50 blend, Rocky started itching/biting so we can scratch venison off the list. I have been introducing NV Instinct Rabbit formula which is grain free, high protein, low carb using rabbit and salmon. He is doing well although I wouldn't expect him to start scratching/biting for another day or two so it is really too early to tell. Are you going to eventually try the NV Instinct Turkey & Duck?


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## buck1s (Jun 23, 2009)

Only if I have to, artbuc. NV Turkey and Duck (maybe Rabbit) is my backup. So far so good, but I'll keep you posted. Good luck with Rocky.


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

I would go with a raw diet, and feed either a select group of proteins, or just one, for a month, and see how things go. If that works then you could add in more proteins and see if you can figure out which ones he doesn't do well on. In any case you'd be feeding one ingredient, rather than a mix of things. He could be allergic to an additive, or preservative in the kibble. 

We have done this at work for many clients who have the same story, expensive vet bills, tried all the kibble and dog is still not doing well. In almost every case they improve within a month and are fine, then the owners can start to try different proteins. The main thing is to find a raw diet that doesn't have added items (some ground will add flax, egg, etc. to the mix, avoid those ones and go for 'whole ground' instead) and stick with it, make sure he's not getting anything else of course.

If you want to look at kibbles, I would check out www.dogfoodanalysis.com, great site for reading labels without a sales clerk hovering.

Good luck with your boy!

Lana


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## Hiker (Mar 29, 2009)

NuttinButGoldens said:


> California Natural is what I would use for any dog with Allergies.


I can't say enough about the CN Lamb Meal & Rice. If you are concerned about potatoes, there are none. I tried numerous foods before this one; it cleared up my Lab's digestive problems (frequent vomiting and loose stools) and I've been able to control both dogs' ear issues. I think the probiotics are also good advice, I use "Jarrow Petdophilus". 

Good luck in whatever you decide. Allergy issues are a real pain, for you and your dog.


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## nbloch64 (Feb 12, 2008)

I second the raw diet if you have been experiencing a lot of difficulty in finding a kibble that does not relieve your boy's symptoms. Jedi has had allergy issues since he was brought home and the raw diet has done wonders for him. The part I like most is that I have more control over what is going into his body now because I can choose where I purchase the meat from. I supplement with Icelandpure salmon oil and sardine and anchovy oil. I also purchased micro-tek shampoo, which I have yet to use (just came today), but I have been reading good things about it. I saw a huge difference in coat, teeth, ears and stools within a week of switching to raw.

I went through tons of different kibbles, including grain free as well as THK, but nothing has been as great as the raw diet. The dogs seem more satisfied and they are becoming more lean and gorgeous by the day.

Good luck with him!


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## aug0211 (Jul 30, 2009)

There seems to be a lot of good info in here on raw diets for allergy dogs  I have an allergy dog myself (starting a perscription Kangaroo + Oat diet tonight!), and have been struggling with food.

So far, the foods he has been on include:
Purina Puppy Chow Large Breed Puppy Formula - came from breeder on this
Solid Gold WolfKing (bison)
Natural Balance LID Potato + Duck
Eagle Pack Holistic Select Duck Meal + Oatmeal

I am considering trying to feed raw, after this Kangaroo food trial - but I cannot find any specific info on what to do. Which raw diets are known to be effective, and where do I go about buying theme? What are their prices likes in comparison to premium kibble? I normally feed 50 dollars for a 30 lb bag of kibble, and now I am paying 88 dollars for a 30 lb bag of the perscription kangaroo kibble.

Can anyone point me in the direction to find a good raw diet that is convenient (I share a house with 5 other people, so I would love something that I can fit in my freezer for a long period of time), and affordable? I can afford up to $50 or so for 30 lbs of food... but if I have to go more expensive, I can...

I appreciate any insight/tips you guys can give me to try to get my allergy boy switched over to a raw diet eventually!

Thanks!


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## artbuc (Apr 12, 2009)

aug0211 said:


> There seems to be a lot of good info in here on raw diets for allergy dogs  I have an allergy dog myself (starting a perscription Kangaroo + Oat diet tonight!), and have been struggling with food.
> 
> So far, the foods he has been on include:
> Purina Puppy Chow Large Breed Puppy Formula - came from breeder on this
> ...


Iams Response KO drove Rocky insane! Pretty sure it was the oats. Solid Gold and EP both have oatmeal which could be part of your problem. I wouldn't give up on kibble yet. Duck is so close to chicken that if chicken was a problem, which it commonly is, duck may not be much better. I would try NB Sweet Potato and Fish or NV Instinct Rabbit Formula, both grain free. Rocky did great on NB SP&F and is doing great on NV Rabbit which has much higher protein with 90+% coming from rabbit and salmon. remember it could take several weeks to start seeing improvement and several months to become symptom free. ARe you supplementing with fish oil? How much EPA/DHA per day? Again, could take 2-3 months to see full benefit of Omega 3's.


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## Maggies mom (Jan 6, 2006)

Has your vet said anything about Atopica? Cruiser had been battling yeast in his ears, we didnt go raw, but changed foods and nothing changed, figure it was enviromental and tho atopica is expensive it has worked like a charm. NO more head shaking, ear infections, scratching.etc.


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## aug0211 (Jul 30, 2009)

artbuc said:


> Iams Response KO drove Rocky insane! Pretty sure it was the oats. Solid Gold and EP both have oatmeal which could be part of your problem. I wouldn't give up on kibble yet. Duck is so close to chicken that if chicken was a problem, which it commonly is, duck may not be much better. I would try NB Sweet Potato and Fish or NV Instinct Rabbit Formula, both grain free. Rocky did great on NB SP&F and is doing great on NV Rabbit which has much higher protein with 90+% coming from rabbit and salmon. remember it could take several weeks to start seeing improvement and several months to become symptom free. ARe you supplementing with fish oil? How much EPA/DHA per day? Again, could take 2-3 months to see full benefit of Omega 3's.


Thanks for the response! I hope I'm not thread-jacking! If this is, let me know and I'll make my own thread  I just though the topic pretty much fit my problem exactly, so I thought I'd keep from making another post (plus I'm new around here, so I was nervous )

Anyway, I had bear on the NB sweet potato and duck formula, but I wonder if that was too close to chicken... I will write that suggestion down (sweet potato + fish), as well as the NV instinct rabbit! I don't think I've used rabbit before, but I could be wrong. And for some reason, I feel like I gave salmon at one point or another, but from the foods I listed above, I don't see it in there... unless maybe the solid gold had bison + salmon, that's possible. Either way, I appreciate your great advice and I'll write that all down! Was yours allergic to oats then you think? I don't really think mine is, simply because he's been having these issues before there were any oats in his diet. Not sure though...

I always try to wait at least a full month to see ANY improvement at all... on this kangaroo diet, I'm doing 2 full months. I am supplementing with fish oil; I'm using the DVM 3V Caps (Liquid) Skin Formula. I was giving 3 pumps daily (for a 66 lb dog), but I have cut back to 1 pump daily to slowly build it up (soft stools when I went straight to 3 pumps). Thanks!




Maggies mom said:


> Has your vet said anything about Atopica? Cruiser had been battling yeast in his ears, we didnt go raw, but changed foods and nothing changed, figure it was enviromental and tho atopica is expensive it has worked like a charm. NO more head shaking, ear infections, scratching.etc.


I did have one vet mention atopica - although this vet (I'm no longer seeing him) said it as if atopica was the condition, and not a treatment. From reading your post, it seems as if you're saying it's a treatment option. Could you give me more info? Thanks!


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