# Questions...



## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

I have a few questions that have popped into my head and I need your help!

So I want to start trialing Maddie in agility in July, I'm thinking about like middle of July to the end of it. I'm sad that summer is almost over and I haven't had a dog show yet! But I have some that are coming up! =]

Okay so my question(s) are:

If I'm going for preferred Novice, is there a time limit that I have to be out of there after she gets both Standard and Jumpers titles?? And when they say you've completed a title...does that mean you've completed 2 titles technically, once you've gotten you're Jumpers and Standard titles??

Okay...and this is a dumb question as well but I can't wait any longer!

I ordered Maddie a new dumbbell from J&J, and I had to custom order it. We visited with our trainer, she said ACK! to our dumbbell that we have now because it was too low to the ground and not high enough off of it for her to grab it. Anyways, I'm just wondering if anybody has ordered from there, and it says 4-6 weeks on on their website...but does it really take THAT long?? I mean I have to start training her for getting it closer to the ground...and she's starting to understand the whole dumbbell thing. Anybody know how long it takes?? I can't wait any longer!

Thanks!
-Caryn


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

Once you have your NAP and NJP, you can stay in Nov. B. as long as you'd like -- until you feel you're ready for Open. Once you have a leg in Open, you can't go back to Novice. The Standard and Jumpers titles are separate. You don't have to finish both before moving up to Open. For example, you might finish your Nov. Standard title before your Nov. Jumpers title, so you decide to move up to Open in Standard, but you still have to stay in Nov. in Jumpers until you complete that title.

Re: dumbbells. The last custom one I ordered took about 4 weeks to arrive.


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

Right - remember there's also regular agility as well as preferred. You can finish your preferred novice titles and then go into regular - or vice versa. I don't know what she'd jump in regular classes but in preferred the A/B classes don't apply. There's something really special about running in Novice A - but it depends on what you've trained for (height-wise). With my latest agility dog I started him in preferred (20") and finished those titles with some bumper legs, then went back and put him in regular novice and finished those titles. I wanted to really get out and proof weave entries before moving him up to regular open. I won't run him in preferred again (or move to open preferred) because I like the idea of being able to put him back into novice if there's something we need to work on...

The other thing is that I'm not sure how quickly agility trials in your area fill and close but as an example the July show in my area is July 24-26th and is already full (400 runs) and closes on Friday...Most trials in New England (even two ring 660 run trials) fill with opening day mail - so you might have to look further out than July. To give you an idea, opening day for a trial in Massachusetts the first weekend in September was last Wednesday...

Erica


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

FlyingQuizini said:


> Once you have your NAP and NJP, you can stay in Nov. B. as long as you'd like -- until you feel you're ready for Open. Once you have a leg in Open, you can't go back to Novice. The Standard and Jumpers titles are separate. You don't have to finish both before moving up to Open. For example, you might finish your Nov. Standard title before your Nov. Jumpers title, so you decide to move up to Open in Standard, but you still have to stay in Nov. in Jumpers until you complete that title.
> 
> Re: dumbbells. The last custom one I ordered took about 4 weeks to arrive.


Okay thanks! I think I get it now! So...once you complete both titles...does that count as two titles? And you can get 2 title ribbons if they give those out at the trial?? 

Edit: After Erica's post it made me think about this....Maddie is in preferred and will be jumping 20", can I still put her back in preferred Novice?? Or do I have to bump her back up to regular agility classes?? 

4 WEEKS!?!?!?!? AHHHH I can't wait that long...did you order it from J&J?? i ordered some other stuff with it...and got it the next day at around 11:30 AM! It was really cool! =] Anyway I can speed up the customization?? lol....=\


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

MaddieMagoo said:


> I ordered Maddie a new dumbbell from J&J, and I had to custom order it. We visited with our trainer, she said ACK! to our dumbbell that we have now because it was too low to the ground and not high enough off of it for her to grab it. Anyways, I'm just wondering if anybody has ordered from there, and it says 4-6 weeks on on their website...but does it really take THAT long?? I mean I have to start training her for getting it closer to the ground...and she's starting to understand the whole dumbbell thing. Anybody know how long it takes?? I can't wait any longer!
> 
> Thanks!
> -Caryn


I don't have any experience with J&J custom dumbbells - We have Max 200 dumbbells and while Murphy went through 5-6 sizes before we found one he consistently liked they had enough sizes that we were able to get a semi-custom DB within 3-4 business days.

Maybe best to call J&J and ask for a status - has the order actually been sent to the manufacturer?

Erica


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

I have no idea exactly,Erica! I was dumb enough not to put my email on the shipping address and I would've gotten one saying that my leash and toy was on it's way. But they aren't open until Monday...and with the fourth...who knows. I emailed them on Friday but they didn't respond, so maybe this week they will. I just need it to get cracking on dumbbell work...ahh!


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Oh yeah..I forgot to say that our agility trials around here usually don't fill up...there's at least 200 that sign up....or maybe less. So nothing to worry about, I'll get in! =]


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## hawtee (Nov 1, 2006)

MaddieMagoo said:


> Okay thanks! I think I get it now! So...once you complete both titles...does that count as two titles? And you can get 2 title ribbons if they give those out at the trial??
> =\


Yes that would be 2 titles your NAP and your NJP also yes to 2 title ribbons


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Ahhhh okay I got it! But let's say I want to polish a few things before I go into open, like handling skills...etc. Do I have to go to regular agility?? Or can I just stay in preferred??


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## hawtee (Nov 1, 2006)

You can stay in novice the rest of your life if you wanted to lol..just remember if you do decide to go to open and accidently get a leg in say standard, you must remain there in standard, you cannot go back but you would till be able to do jumpers novice because you have no open leg in this class..


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## hawtee (Nov 1, 2006)

Just re-read the question lol.. no you do not have to go to the regular class, you can stay in preferred as long as you want.


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

hawtee said:


> Just re-read the question lol.. no you do not have to go to the regular class, you can stay in preferred as long as you want.


Agility is not like obedience in that respect...you can stay in Novice B/preferred forever. You can stay in Open forever....You can flip-flop (on different weekends) between Excellent B and Novice Preferred - if you wanted to...
Erica


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Ahhhh okay!!! I think I got it now! Thanks for the answers guys!

Now about the dumbbell...do you think if I called/emailed them, do you think I could ask if they could ask the manufacturer to speed up the making of the dumbbell?? Because I'd like it, like NOW!!!!!!!!! lol....


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

MaddieMagoo said:


> Ahhhh okay!!! I think I got it now! Thanks for the answers guys!
> 
> Now about the dumbbell...do you think if I called/emailed them, do you think I could ask if they could ask the manufacturer to speed up the making of the dumbbell?? Because I'd like it, like NOW!!!!!!!!! lol....


They probably won't be able to speed it up - but you'd have the option of canceling and re-ordering from somewhere else if it hasn't been sent to the manufacturer yet...do you remember what size you have? Can you find that size on the max 200 site in stock?
Eirca


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

I am probably just going to add to the confusion but here goes.
You need to think as Standard, Jumpers, Preferred Standard and Preferred Jumpers all as separate classes(titles) and they have no baring on one another - absolutely none! And I give an example. You can start in preferred novice A standard and preferred novice A jumpers. Get your title in preferred novice jumpers and go on to preferred open jumpers while still staying in preferred standard but need to move to the B class. You can get your preferred open jumpers and move on to preferred excellent A jumpers and still be in preferred novice standard. Say you feel you went on to excellent preferred jumpers too soon. You could go back to novice B jumpers regular and still be in novice B preferred standard. 
In all the classes you can compete as long as you want after getting your title in that same class till you get a leg in the next level. But again preferred classes have no baring on regular classes when it comes to this rule. The only thing that will need to change is in novice and excellent. Once you get a tiltle in any agility class you can no longer show in Novice A and must move to the B class. And in Excellent, once you get your Excellent title you also have to move to the B class. There are no A and B classes in the Open class.


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## hawtee (Nov 1, 2006)

AmbikaGR said:


> Say you feel you went on to excellent preferred jumpers too soon. You could go back to novice B jumpers regular and still be in novice B preferred standard.
> .


What Hank says pretty well sums it up except remember the dog must be entered only in Preferred or Reg. classes, with no crossover being allowed at the same set of trials.


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

AmbikaGR said:


> I am probably just going to add to the confusion but here goes.
> You need to think as Standard, Jumpers, Preferred Standard and Preferred Jumpers all as separate classes(titles) and they have no baring on one another - absolutely none! And I give an example. You can start in preferred novice A standard and preferred novice A jumpers. Get your title in preferred novice jumpers and go on to preferred open jumpers while still staying in preferred standard but need to move to the B class. .


Ahh, but Hank - there isn't a novice A preferred...If you complete one novice title from the A class you need to move to the B class for any trial that has not yet closed...With preferred it doesn't matter - no A class.

Novice A
Novice B
Novice Preferred


Then of course it gets confusing because in excellent there is an excellent A preferred...

So if you finish your novice preferred title (either jumpers or standard) you *can not *go back to regular Novice A. Best I can say is to download (or order - 1st copy is still free) the agility rules and regulations and learn them - best to know the rules of the game.

Erica


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

MurphyTeller said:


> Ahh, but Hank - there isn't a novice A preferred...If you complete one novice title from the A class you need to move to the B class for any trial that has not yet closed...With preferred it doesn't matter - no A class.


 
See, I knew I would confuse myself. Erica is of course correct.


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

Yeah, you can stay in Novice Preferred for as long as you want until you get a Q in Open (but if you ever decide to do regular Novice, and you have any titles in Preferred, you have to enter Novice B).

Good luck and have fun!


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Ahhh...okay its starting to click again!!

So I'm going to enter her in Novice Preferred Jumpers and Standard on that weekend. Maddie REALLY LOVES Jumpers courses. So...then I can move up to Open Jumpers (still preferred), and still have a few legs towards our Novice Standard title. So lets say that the Standard title takes longer and then I complete it sometime or another. I can only do Open Jumpers and maybe get to Excellent Jumpers but I can still be in Novice Standard...or Open Standard?? I think I have this down! lol. 

But lets say I want more practice BEFORE moving on up to excellent...or open. I'd have to go back to regular novice (not preferred),and go in the B class....am I correct on this one??

Erica: As far as the dumbbell....we had to go make up our time that I missed for 4H last night, and even she said the dumbbell was too small. So I told her we ordered one through J & J and it was custom made...and lets say it does take 4 weeks. But she gave us one that is plastic and is about the right size...so it'll be a temporary dumbbell. I'll look at Max200 and see what they have!


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## hawtee (Nov 1, 2006)

Caryn,
I think you are getting it lol..A good example would be Lilli. She was in EX A Standard before we got our first Novice Jumpers leg lol..
Yes when you get you P Novice title when you move to the regular classes you start in Novice B.


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Okay I think I have it now!!! lol. Thanks guys for all your help! Now it's just to be patient and wait for my dumbbell to come in! =]


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Okay! So J&J emailed me back and the lady says that the custom ones DO take about 3-4 weeks. I have learned that after today I don't need the dumbbell for awhile...as we need to go back and see what Maddie actually knows...lol.

She said they send them out to Bob Janek....no idea who that is. Anybody know?? 

Thanks!


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## AmbikaGR (Dec 31, 2007)

MaddieMagoo said:


> Okay! So J&J emailed me back and the lady says that the custom ones DO take about 3-4 weeks. I have learned that after today I don't need the dumbbell for awhile...as we need to go back and see what Maddie actually knows...lol.
> 
> She said they send them out to Bob Janek....no idea who that is. Anybody know??
> 
> Thanks!


 
He's the guy J&J sends their custom dumbbell orders out to!


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Haha...I know that now! lol. Thanks Hank!  I found his website and also found that he does Scent Articles as well...and they come in different colors!! sweet! =]


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## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

I run my dog preferred. I like that division, less border collies LOL I chose to run preferred as my dog started later in life, is my first dog (lots of mistakes) and she is very big lots of dog landing off the jumps. Whatever your reason, preferred is a fun and great place to play.

You do get individual titles for standard and jumpers BUT ribbons only if the club is giving them out. Some clubs do not offer title ribbons. We went to the big UKC National show, my friend finished her title and the club did not have title ribbons :doh: BOY am I glad I finished my UACH the show before! One AKC club last summer did not have title ribbons, but when I asked they were surprised how many people wanted them. So they announced at trial "A" that they would have title ribbons at their next trial a couple months in the future and everyone who earned a title at trial A could pick them up at trial "B". You bet I did!!!!!


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Well thanks for the advice!!! I just have a question, for anyone out there, can you get your MACH by staying the preferred classes? And if not..why do they have that rule?? 

And the only reason why I have Maddie in preferred is because I don't think she can jump 24", because she is that tall...but I need to measure her at class one night. 

I think it should be a requirement that the club should have a title ribbon for any dog with a new title that weekend. But I guess AKC won't listen to me! I mean you DO work hard for that title...why not get something that says congratulations, other than a piece of paper in the mail?


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

MaddieMagoo said:


> Well thanks for the advice!!! I just have a question, for anyone out there, can you get your MACH by staying the preferred classes? And if not..why do they have that rule??
> 
> And the only reason why I have Maddie in preferred is because I don't think she can jump 24", because she is that tall...but I need to measure her at class one night.
> 
> I think it should be a requirement that the club should have a title ribbon for any dog with a new title that weekend. But I guess AKC won't listen to me! I mean you DO work hard for that title...why not get something that says congratulations, other than a piece of paper in the mail?


You cannot MACH from the preferred class. A MACH is 750 speed points and 20 double Q's. The preferred classes get an additional 5 seconds on course time. A MACH point is essentially one for each second under SCT on qualifying runs - with multipliers for 1st place (2x) and 2nd place (1.5x).

Within the last couple of years AKC has introduced a PAX, it's a suffix title (MACH is a prefix title) and is for 20 QQ's out of excellent preferred - no speed points (again the whole preferred getting more time and such)...

Title ribbons are pretty common in the Northeast - but only in agility. I can count on one finger how many obedience/rally/breed clubs do title ribbons (LOL - just my club). I think it's silly not to - it's a $3 ribbon that makes people happy...In obedience I think we hand out maybe 10 title ribbons every year during our two day obedience/rally trial...We actually have different ribbons for CD, CDX,, UD, RE, RAE, etc - it's special.

Erica


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## MurphyTeller (Sep 28, 2008)

MaddieMagoo said:


> And the only reason why I have Maddie in preferred is because I don't think she can jump 24", because she is that tall...but I need to measure her at class one night.


It depends on the dog. Murphy is 24.5" and Teller is 23.5" - both jump 24". Neither have had any problem with the higher jump height - but both also have very correct jumping styles and have been taught to respect the bars...Without knowing where Maddie measures I think you're putting yourself at a disadvantage - don't enter a trial and be surprised!!! You want to be 99.999% sure where she's going to measure (and for AKC that's either above 22" or not).

Erica


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## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

Belle is currently working on her PAX (3QQ - 17 to go) No we don't need the speed points (phew  Belle is 27", she can EASILY jump 24" but to me whether she gets a MACH or PAX is no big deal, it is still an accomplishment. We are also hoping to go to AKC Nationals in 2010 as they are allowing preferred dogs to qualify for the first time. To me 24" is a big jump for ANY dog. I used to show horses if you porportionately think about the jump to dog, jump to horse ratio, you are asking the dogs to jump Grand Prix everytime out. Grand Prix horses have a shorter career because of the wear and tear on their bodies, and I see the same thing with 24" dogs that are running. Just my opinion.

I am thinking with our next dog, starting in preferred and getting the dog acclimated in the ring etc, and if all is good, then switch to regular. Sure we would have to start over at novice but so what? If the dog is confident and capable you should move through the early divisions quickly again. We always start horses lower and wait for their confidence to come out at shows why not dogs? Then if a dog needs to move back down as it ages you can start back where you left off. Just a thought of what I might do.


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Yeah I agree with you 100%!!! Maddie is (from what I measured today), 22.5 inches...or thereabouts. Our instructor got 24" but I don't see her being that tall. So I don't know really! lol!

But yes....I put Maddie in preferred because of the 24" jump height..if she had to do that, but also because I don't want her doing anything that could possible affect her hips down the road. I think she has HD, but I'm not sure on that either. If we go for our PAX, so be it! But I think I'd like to get her Novice titles this summer and then shoot for some Open agility in the summer as well...and into the fall. 

By the way...for those folks who get snow in the winter, how do you train at home?? MY mom and I were talking one day and we thought about keeping a jump in the house and putting it in the living room when we wanted to work on jumping...but we have limited spacing in there. So we also have a front porch that could serve for that purpose as well...but it's hard to do turns in that spacing as well, and the garage is concrete so NO to that! Any suggestions? I think keeping her active during the winter will help as well. Thanks!


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## paula bedard (Feb 5, 2008)

Hi Caryn, I don't have a clue about agility. I just wanted to say "HI" since you're not around as much...Hope you and Maddie conquer the Agility/Obedience world!


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

I think you're making the right choice for Maddie doing Preferred. If you really like agility and want to continue you can still go for the PAX, but if you just do Novice and Open you're putting a lot less stress on her body in the meantime, so it's a win-win. Dusty is 23.5" and jumped 24 but he was in great shape, a really efficient jumper, hardly ever did more than two weekends in a row, and I moved him down to Preferred as soon as he finished his MACH. Boo is right at 22" (probably a little over but he's scared of wickets) and for a while I jumped him at 24" just to turn his brain on a little more, but usually he jumps 20.

In general though I don't see a problem with starting out at full height. I do know a lot of dogs who have had problems because they measure into 20" and their handlers are making them run every weekend at 24 or even 26, especially when the dogs are also overjumping and/or crashing jumps all the time. But that's a lot different from athletic dogs who actually measure into 24, jump efficiently, get a break from trials ever so often, and retire before problems pop up. There's an interesting comparison of dogs and horses in Chris Zink's book _Jumping from A to Z_ (not many people really use it anymore but a while ago it was THE book to train jumping so you might know someone who has it). Lots of anatomical reasons why dogs are much more suited for jumping than horses, can jump higher, turn tighter, etc.


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## sammydog (Aug 23, 2008)

Maxs Mom said:


> I used to show horses if you porportionately think about the jump to dog, jump to horse ratio, you are asking the dogs to jump Grand Prix everytime out. Grand Prix horses have a shorter career because of the wear and tear on their bodies, and I see the same thing with 24" dogs that are running. Just my opinion.


Dogs are not horses... While a lot of information we have comes from studies of horse structure, they are still two very different animals. A dog has a far superior jumping ability. Dogs have more limb angulation, allowing them to take greater strides relative to body length. They also have a much more flexible spine than a horse, which really helps with jumping and turning. Many dogs can easily take a jump over twice their height at the withers… Something a horse cannot even come close to….


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

Just curious... if you think she has HD... why are you training/showing, etc. w/o knowing for sure? Seems to me you'd want to know for sure what you were up against to as not to potentially hurt her and/or to know her limitations and what you might be able to do to help prevent or minimize future problems (supplements, etc.)

Had you had her hips x-rayed? Maybe you already told the story and I missed it...???


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## sammydog (Aug 23, 2008)

If Maddie is 22.5 there is still a chance you can get her measured in under 22" (which would put you in the 20" class) Take her to a trial and see if you can get a practice measurement…

We have been measuring Mira for awhile now, and she would measure anywhere from 21.75-22.25" so you bet I have been talking to everyone I could about how to get her to relax and stand shorter. Some people run their dogs around to tire them out. I have seen that work, but not with Mira! Mira would stand even taller! What I did this weekend for her first measurement, was lay her down next to the measuring table and let her relax, and massaged her shoulders. When the judge came she stood very relaxed on the table and measured in at 21.5"!!! Woo hoo, so for now she is jumping in the 20" class.

Otherwise there is NOTHING wrong with starting or even staying in the Preferred class!


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Steph: No we have not gotten her hips x-rayed, my mom feels that they dont need to be and that it's "too much money"...ugh. I've been telling her that we should get them...but whatever I guess...*rolls eyes*

I think I can honestly get Maddie to get at 22 inches....or maybe shorter...but that all depends on if I'm actually measuring her correctly..haha! It's not a goal of mine to get a MACH on her. But I guess things come unexpectedly...lol.


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

Where I work x-rays are $60 for the first take and $50 for each additional take. It's not like you're going to breed her and need to know whether her hips are fair or good, you just need to know whether they're really bad. And I don't know how much custom dumbbells from J&J cost, but I'm betting they along with the other fancy obedience stuff you've talked about are more than $60.

If you feel that there's a substantial likelihood of hip problems, and you insist on doing agility without checking, I'd be trying to jump her as low as you possibly can. So that would mean trying to get her to measure under 22" and then entering 16" Preferred. And also, don't even enter a trial until she's at the perfect weight. I seem to remember her having a little bit of weight issues, don't know if it's been addressed already, but if there's a decent possibility of hip problems then it's extra-super-important.


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

katieanddusty said:


> Where I work x-rays are $60 for the first take and $50 for each additional take. It's not like you're going to breed her and need to know whether her hips are fair or good, you just need to know whether they're really bad. And I don't know how much custom dumbbells from J&J cost, but I'm betting they along with the other fancy obedience stuff you've talked about are more than $60.
> 
> If you feel that there's a substantial likelihood of hip problems, and you insist on doing agility without checking, I'd be trying to jump her as low as you possibly can. So that would mean trying to get her to measure under 22" and then entering 16" Preferred. And also, don't even enter a trial until she's at the perfect weight. I seem to remember her having a little bit of weight issues, don't know if it's been addressed already, but if there's a decent possibility of hip problems then it's extra-super-important.


Ditto on the getting and keeping her lean. And yeah, regular x-rays are way less than sending out to OFA. Like Katie said, you just need to know if there's anything significant going on. 

When's your birthday? Tell your family that for your birthday, you'd like them to contribute to the X-Ray Maddie Fund! (And yeah... having just ordered one... I know that a custom J&J dumbbell comes out to about $35 by the time you add shipping!)


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

I have tried convincing my mom about this...but she just won't budge. She's a stubborn woman who is a penny pincher...but yet likes to go out and buy things for the home....=/. Yes you need a home to live in but I think our house is still standing....it doesn't need any more fixing up. She thinks that doing this would be a waste of money....blah,blah, blah.

Maddie has lost that winter weight and is getting 3/4 cup of food with a cup of green beans (she normally gets a cup and a half of food),2 times a day. She is also on a supplement for her joints....with Glucosamine...and something else..with a C. I have been looking into the Trixsyn supplement that is printed on the back of the Clean Run agility magazine.

I know you guys are trying to help me, but it's really hard when my mom doesn't know if she'll have her job for the next school year...she's really worried about that. And even with this economy...I don't have a job because it's summer and I have applied, their summer help came back..so I'm next in line.

My birthday is in August...but I already have dog things that I need. And I think I asked for a x ray of Maddie 2 years ago...but I think she said no....


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## gabbys mom (Apr 23, 2008)

When I was a kid, there were always projects that my parents were willing to pay for that I could do to earn money- outside the scope of regular chores. You know, like organize the basement storage room, haul mulch for my dad for a weekend, etc. 

I would suggest that or trying the b-day thing again. Because HD is not something to be messed with. Frankly, I really don't think people should start any full height contact work or jump work until you have clear x-rays. 

Believe me, if you think x-rays are expensive, I just paid out 2500 for a left hip surgery, and the right hip surgery is coming up. It's much better to be careful and avoid trialing/serious agility work until you have the a-ok.


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Hm...well good idea..but my mom won't agree with it. In fact...I did just get $10 from my Grandma for helping her around the house, and getting ready for this weekend...family stuff.lol. 

The only thing with the birthday is that my mom only spends about $150 as it is. But she may spend about 10-20 more.

The only thing..is that she's not showing signs of pain...she hasn't whimpered or changed her stride length..or refused a jump. The one mistake I did do was when we first started class back in the Spring, I started her cold turkey...and she was sore...my mistake but I did everything I could to get her better. I learned that she needs to be streched out and I did some massaging when she was sore. We talked to the vet and she just said that we should strech her out and do that sort of stuff.


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## gabbys mom (Apr 23, 2008)

Hmm, Gabby's OFA's cost me 150 and she had to be sedated and have multiple shots/views- and we don't go to a cheap clinic. I bet you could get it for much cheaper than that, though I would call ahead to find out


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Okay...thanks! I remember asking the vet one time...but it was a lot cheaper than that...I think?? I know of a few clinics who might have it cheaper..who knows! lol.


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## katieanddusty (Feb 9, 2006)

I understand about having "frugal" parents who don't necessarily share your concern for the dog, but ... it's not like you're 5 years old and your mother won't give you a Barbie for your birthday, so "oh well I asked and mom won't pay for it" doesn't really cut it. I would hope that if you truly suspected that Maddie had hip problems, you wouldn't be treating it like the little kid with a Barbie (you'd either be getting x-rays to rule that out or not doing any agility). 

But the more I hear about it, it sounds like you might just be paranoid. You've always been mentioning that she might have bad hips (since before you started class in the spring), but I never caught why you think that. I haven't done x-rays on either of my dogs - they've never showed any signs of trouble, their parents and most of the other dogs in their pedigree have clearances, I train in short sessions and don't compete much, etc. Dusty was a little sore at night after his last trial, but he was fine in the morning and that helped me decide to retire him anyways. If I ever got any inkling that they had bad hips I would have them at the vet getting x-rays the next day, but until then, I'm not losing any sleep over it.

$150 for the birthday plus $10 for helping Grandma would be enough for three x-rays where I work, and that's in California where basically everything is more expensive than anywhere else.


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## MaddieMagoo (Aug 14, 2007)

Yeah...I'm glad that you know what I mean by the parents being that way. And yeah...I am sort of paranoid. I remember talking to Linda about it and she just said that keeping the weight off of Maddie and giving her the supplements are fine. She said that it's good to see me concerned...but Maddie has never showed that she is in any sort of pain....I think just streching her out and making sure she is healthy is what's going to help us. 

The only reason why I thought she had hip problems is because she has the biggest waddle ever! I know all Goldens have a waddle in their walk...but it's not like she has showed me she's in pain....

Hopefully in the near future we'll get them X rayed...when I think it's necessary...to stop agility.


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