# food aggression



## foreveramber (Feb 25, 2007)

jake growls at anyone who touches his ears or feet when hes eating. when he has a treat or stick, he prances around with his tail up and has a very dominant look on his face. what is the best way to correct this. i am worried i will mess it up and he will become aggressive. 

right now, i just pet him and talk nicely to him when hes eating, even when hes growling at me. its not really a deep snarl either, its more of a play growl, doesnt sound too mean until i start getting my hand closer to whatever it is hes protecting, i notice that his body does tense up before he starts growling, like maybe hes warning me.

(jake is 6 months old)


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

What if he could only eat from your hand? What would happen if he was eating out of your hand while you're petting him?


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## Oaklys Dad (Dec 28, 2005)

Oakly did that too as a young pup. I sat on the floor and hand fed him for about a month and that seemed to fix things. I still make him sit and wait for my release before he eats. I have heard of people going as far as putting all their puppies food in a training bag and having them work for every morsel of food. At Jakes age he is probably just testing his limits with you. All you have to do is SET them. Trust me, he will still love you:


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## foreveramber (Feb 25, 2007)

Jo Ellen said:


> What if he could only eat from your hand? What would happen if he was eating out of your hand while you're petting him?


 
if im holding the bowl, he doesnt make a peep. if its in my hand, hes very gentle. what do i do to correct him? do i tell him "no?" bad dog..? or do i just ignore it? if i yell at him, or speak in a harsher tone, wouldnt he feel more threatened??


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

Well that would NEVER fly in this house...

I would stop that crap NOW................... do you have a trainer or have you taken any classes? I do not like giving advice about aggression. It's too risky. I know what I would do, but I will not suggest it to anyone else. Paranoid? LOL 

I am glad the hand feeding works... that is a step!


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## Jo Ellen (Feb 25, 2007)

Personally I wouldn't yell at a dog that's growling at you. You might find yourself locked in a battle of wills ... and unless you know exactly how to handle it, you might not win. That's risky. 

What I would do is start feeding him from your hand, all the time. No food dish. And pet him while you're feeding him. Get him used to you being near him when he's eating, and touching him while he's eating.

Sometimes it's better to change a behavior rather than correct it, know what I mean? 

Try this for about a month and then reintroduce the dish.

Another idea, practice trading treats. Give him one treat, take it away while introducing another one. Go back and forth a couple of times and do this several times a day. 

Basically he's guarding his food. That's common in dogs, some dogs more than others. Until you're completely comfortable that he's okay in this regard, I would make a hard and fast rule that children never disturb him while he's eating or chewing on something.

And, don't get too wigged out. Alot of dogs that have food guarding issues never develop into aggressive dogs.

:wave:


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

I agree- learn how to handle it, or have professional help- do not attempt a haphazard correction. Gone wrong, you could have dog bite.

I allow food guarding (but not fighting) among my DOGS, but NOT with humans.


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## Alpenglunen (Apr 4, 2007)

Underlying dominance issues outside of food may exist as well. Good advice here so far, in my opinion. Controlling the food is a good idea, but I think you should go a little further in establishing that type of behavior as never acceptable towards you or other family members. However, I don't think it's a good practice to pet an eating dog or play with the food bowl while they're eating either.

A good daily walk combined with consistent boundaries and limitations, life on your terms, and leadership in more aspects of daily behavior will likely change that behavior in the long term. If you are at all hesitant with your movements or actions around food, they will take advantage of your weakness and become insistent in claiming it.


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

Violence begets violence. I don't use "corrections" when dealing with aggression.

Best advise is to work with a trainer experienced in reward-based methods.

Hand feeding is a good idea, as is lots of trading with high value treats in exchange for what he has. When you do the trading game, trade back and forth several times. Trade for a treat and then give back the item he was guarding. (Ask for a sit first.) Repeat. Repeat again. Then pick up the item and put it away. Just don't trade once and put the item away or else he'll start to think that the offer of a trade means his "prize" will go away.

For what it's worth, prancing with his head high, etc. is not dominance. He's just trophying his prize.

If he guards bones, I wouldn't let him have the bone w/o you being attached to the other end so that you're sharing. (Assuming he'll chew the other end w/o growling at you in the process.) Share - then trade. Share - then trade.

Again - working with a trainer is a great idea. And most important, don't try and fix this by being bigger/stronger/meaner, etc. He has a mouthful of teeth and won't be afraid to use them. That's what he's telling you with the growl. 

-S


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

Yeah, I think the key here is to make your pup more relaxed around food and you being near him...I absolutely hate the obsession some people have with constantly taking food away from pups to show who is 'Alpha'...I mean how on earth is that supposed to help matters, if anything all that would do is create a serious problem...mum near me=food snatched away. I actually think it is rather importrant to just leave dogs alone while they are eating for the main part and the times you have to go and take something away wont be seen as threatening because it isnt ingrained into the dog that you steal their food! I can only tell you what works for me and I can genuinely say I have never ever had a single growl from either of my dogs, even as pushy puppies with raw knuckle bones. And even my Harry that is a very highly strung, food obsessed dog has never and I doubt will ever growl at me around his bones. As an example when they have raw bones I put a big sheet down on the living room floor and of course just to be annoying they always end up dragging the bones off the sheet onto the carpet so I have to go and pick them up and move their bones back on maybe 5 times whilst they are busy chewing (they seem to work their way over to the edges)...both are completely relaxed about this and don't bat an eyelid. You need to be seen as a good thing when you approach him while he is eating...if he is tucking into ordinary kibble, just walk up to him and feed him some chicken or something maybe at first just tossing it into the area ....and then just let him get back to his dinner. Keep doing this...I also like the idea of swapping food...if he is chewing a bone only pick it up if you have something else to offer him...I truely believe the softly softly approach is the way to go about this...just think about it from his point of view....he has been given his dinner that he is probably quite hungry for and is throughly enjoying yet he has a person hovering around and putting their hands near him which is making him feel nervous...so he gives a warning. If the action you take is then to get rough, shout loudly, try and 'show him whos boss' then he is either going to feel like he needs to protect his food MORE or learn that growling is a very bad thing so maybe he should skip that part next time and just go for the bite straight away....

He is growling for a reason so you need to respect his warning and work on how to make him feel he doesnt need to give a warning...may take longer but you are getting to the root of the problem. I would not tolerate this behaviour either and would work bloody hard with my dog to make sure he no longer saw me as a threat around food. There is no good going into a battle of wills about this as you could lose!


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## Alpenglunen (Apr 4, 2007)

There is a difference between violence and pack leadership. Dogs are not human, don't think rationally, and don't understand diplomacy or negotiation in rational human terms. They react and understand a pack heirarchy, which surrounds food and sex. The issues are about discipline, leadership, and energy. Head up is not dominance, but tail up certainly can be, and a growl absolutely is a dominant behavior. Dogs understand the world in those terms, it's how they communicate. Taking away food just to be doing is not a good idea, especially if the dog thinks it's his only chance at getting a meal. Eventually they will fight for it. It's the other issues of respect as a pack leader that are of concern and where I would work on first and leave the dog alone while eating.


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

Alpenglunen said:


> There is a difference between violence and pack leadership. Dogs are not human, don't think rationally, and don't understand diplomacy or negotiation in rational human terms.


and I would never think that a dog would understand negotiation in human terms, but the dog either feels threatened or doesnt...if he feels anxious that you will take the food away then he will growl, simple as that. It is working on NOT having him feel anxious around you and food that needs to be addressed. Being more assertive in other areas wont make him less likely to want to guard his food.

All things surrounding food and pack heirarchy I agree are important between dogs but I do not believe go as far as between human/dog relationships...you end up being 'leader' by default as you are in control of every single resource, but I dont believe a dog involves humans in their pack heirarchy.


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

Well, I touch my dogs when they eat all the time, every day, and they are not the least bit upset by it. Almost all of my training is positive based, and, for example, in their lifetimes Rigby (age 10 years) and Starlite (just 13 months) have NEVER once growled at me... or even tensed up when I touch their food. That is a bond of trust and positive training.

Keira, on the other hand, has growled at me and I did correct her. I simply *do not allow that, period* under any circumstances. I feel she needed that reminder, and it worked. She is now as docile as a lamb over her raw food (she never growled over kibble or other less valuable food).

That said, I am an experienced dog handler. I am confident and sure of myself and ran little risk of being bitten by her. In the circumstances, I was willing to get bit to prove my point, but she didn't even consider challenging me further. The minute my hand was on her scruff she spit the food out and turned into a puddle. She was trying her luck- testing her theory, but she didn't push it. I gave the food right back and tried again- I was greeted with hand licks and a sheepish tail wag. I left her alone to eat her leg quarter.

I have tested her every day since and she doesn't tense up or anything.

I think the majority of training in this (and all) situations should be positive and prevention based. I don't handle this dog a lot (she's supposed to be Courtney's dog), and she's the first dog I've ever had from a puppy that has ever growled at me. Now I am paying closer attention to how she is handled, to make sure there are no other issues- and I don't think there are.


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## Alpenglunen (Apr 4, 2007)

They're less likely to growl with taking of the food, than they are with touch while eating. The touch while eating can be taken as a challenge for the food, but not control of it. If fed at the right time and if the relationship is consistent, that may be less of an issue.


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

*You end up being 'leader' by default as you are in control of every single resource.*

Yes! Exactly! THAT is the act of being a good pack leader. The pack leader controls the resources. Period. No screaming. No hitting. No jerking on a choke chain. Just lots of bossy control!

-S


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

Emma&Tilly said:


> You need to be seen as a good thing when you approach him while he is eating...if he is tucking into ordinary kibble, just walk up to him and feed him some chicken or something maybe at first just tossing it into the area ....and then just let him get back to his dinner. Keep doing this...I also like the idea of swapping food...if he is chewing a bone only pick it up if you have something else to offer him...I truely believe the softly softly approach is the way to go about this...just think about it from his point of view....he has been given his dinner that he is probably quite hungry for and is throughly enjoying yet he has a person hovering around and putting their hands near him which is making him feel nervous...so he gives a warning. If the action you take is then to get rough, shout loudly, try and 'show him whos boss' then he is either going to feel like he needs to protect his food MORE or learn that growling is a very bad thing so maybe he should skip that part next time and just go for the bite straight away....



That is excellent, excellent advice! 

I, too, HATE when people start sticking their hand in the pup's bowl to "show him who's boss". Or worse, when a pup growls, they take away the bowl. Oh sure - just confirm to the pup that you are a threat around the bowl!

Teaching that your presence near the bowl is a good thing is a wonderful way to handle it. I'll even use three food bowls sometimes for big time guarders ('cuz they can't guard all three at once). Then I can approach one bowl while they scarf out of the other and drop a chunk of chicken in one of the bowls.

I'm not sure with the pup in question on this thread though, if he's growling on the approach or just during petting while eating? Either way, approaching with chicken may help change his emotional state around the food bowl. He's probably come to learn that a human near the food bowl, while no big deal on it's own (assuming he's not growling on the approach), predicts that the human will touch him while eating. 

-S


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## AquaClaraCanines (Mar 5, 2006)

Well I DID correct my pup for growing at me, but I didn't take her food, technically- I nailed her, then I let her go back to eating... when I touched it again and she didn't growl, I told her she was wonderful and left her alone.

But as I mentioned, I pet, talk to, and praise my dogs while eating all the time, and never take their food. If I do take the food (for example I have taken a bowl from my Whippet bc I realized I forgot to put his suppliment in or something) he doesn't panic. He looks at me expectantly bc he knows something else is going in


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## HovawartMom (Aug 10, 2006)

Without using any brutality,I would have a can filled up with stones,ready and when he growls,drop it to make a loud noise.It worked for me.


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## Emma&Tilly (May 15, 2005)

AquaClaraCanines said:


> he doesn't panic. He looks at me expectantly bc he knows something else is going in


That pretty much sums up exactly what you would want! A dog that is glad you move/pick up their bowl because they think they are getting more goodies!


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

AquaClaraCanines said:


> Well I DID correct my pup for growing at me, but I didn't take her food, technically- I nailed her, then I let her go back to eating... when I touched it again and she didn't growl, I told her she was wonderful and left her alone.


Yes, but you did it the FIRST time she ever growled, you knew what you were doing and you committed yourself to the exercise. That's the difference. If a pup gets a significant enough correction (and that's significant enough in their mind, not ours!) the very first time he exeriments with aggression, it is likely he won't try it again. If he's successful (using aggression to get his way) even just one time.... then corrections will usually make it worse in the long run.

I pet my dogs and talk to them while they eat, too. I even walk up to them, say their name (which is a cue to look at me, so that makes them stop eating and look up), ask them to sit, hand them a treat and release them to go back to eating.

I teach all my puppy owners to walk past the pup's bowl while he's eating and drop a wonderful treat (better than what's in the bowl) in the floor by the dog. I want the pups to learn from an early age that human near me while I eat = good stuff!

-S


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