# Hunt and Field Training Plans for the week of April 15-22



## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Yes getting up at the crack of dawn tomorrow for our hunt test. Have another one on a week from today (Saturday). Whee! Hope it is nice out. Resisting the urge to train today despite the big brown eyes staring at me and the nose nuzzling me all morning. Don't want to jinx it.


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## DNL2448 (Feb 13, 2009)

Good luck and have a blast, Lisa!!!


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## gdgli (Aug 24, 2011)

I am attending the Hunt Test Judge's Seminar on the 21st. Unfortunately, I will have to miss the training session/singles stake the next day because I have my last Winter League Trap Shoot.


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## hollyk (Feb 21, 2009)

Lisa and Scout, can't wait to hear all about your pass tomorrow. 
Dog to the line!


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Good luck Lisa and Scout! I know you will do a great job!


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

Fingers crossed all went well Lisa!

It is a rain-day here today, so taking one more day off. Babies are thriving, so I should be able to get out with Bonnie and Breeze this week. Bonnie is going a bit stir-crazy!

On the good news front, my club heald its health clinic this weekend and Breeze, Winter and Desi all passed their re-CERFs yesterday, and Bonnie passed her first one and cleared heart as well. Butch's brother Tanner came to the clinic to get his clearances and was eye and heart clear and his hip and elbow xrays looked great--now we just wait for OFA's verdict. Another friend came with his Bart daughter and everything was good with her as well!! Some years the clinic is like being on tenterhooks--and ends up with people in tears!

Here are the babies--well-fed with fat little tummies! Oh yes, and the Princess--it is Juniper's 10th birthday today.


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## hollyk (Feb 21, 2009)

Desi looks like she has this Mom thing down pat. 
Happy Birthday to the Princess.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Well she did great on the land series. I was a little worried that she would get side-tracked by the moving decoys as she has never seen moving ones before. (Someone jokingly said it was not fair to use them since we all can't afford to buy them). When we got the line though the first bird did not land in the right spot and the judges called a no-go. Scout was a crazy nut wanting to go and the judge said, "I am going to recommend...no wait, I am going to mandate that you wait five more dogs before running again judging by her behavior." I assume that meant Scout was so excited she was not going to forget that wrong landing right away. She did great though with both marks. Pinned them and delivered them cleanly to hand. The second mark was in an ouchie field for many of the dogs. Poor Scout picked up a goat head but I was very proud of her for persevering by hobbling back on three legs carrying a big duck.

Water came and she stalled at the shore enough that I delivered a verbal 'go fetch' to drive her across. The one judge told me that she would let me pick up the last bird, but they might need to talk about passing me for that one. So when Scout stalled again at the shore I drove her back again with a 'go fetch' and we failed for handling on two marks. Bummer. I was given the advice that next time I might try sending her on go fetch instead of her name if I needed that to drive her (will use that this Saturday if needed, ultimately she's getting water forced next month now that I have a pro to help me). I wish I would have thought of that for the second mark might have made a difference...oh well. Sadly the only other golden there failed on water as well 










It was cute someone stopped to tell me he could tell she was all girl. Never really specified what made him think that other than of how she held herself and how proud she was to get her duck.










I am very happy for my friends who titled this weekend. A flattie with a JH and a labbie with his SH.


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

My .02
She would be a very wet dog this week. As much water as I could possibly give her. Building as much confidence as I could. Make that water a happy place!


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

Yes--I would not be doing the waterforce work this week if she is in a test this coming weekend. It could make some of her other work fall off. If she is at all possessive about her birds, I would do some jealousy drills. If she does not go immediately when sent, another dog gets her bird. just have a steady dog sitting on standby.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Oh no I wasn't meaning this week for water force...I said next month (May) when the tests are done. I know we need to do it and I wish I would have had the courage to do it last year but I had friends scare me from the idea.

As far as birds....I don't know what to say about them. Had some issues with her picking up ducks initially that are resolved but she still doesn't have the drive for them that she has for bumpers. Of course I say that, but at the same time I was surprised when she tried to snatch the live flyer back today after I took it from her. She likes bumpers more so we could train the jealousy drill on that. Would probably work great she hates having to watch other dogs do water marks.


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## Jige (Mar 17, 2011)

Not going to make it to hunt training again this monday. 3hr drive round trip and I was there twice this weekend alot of gass $$ that I really dont have. We are going to go to a field do some walk the line. My sister is working on doubles with her lab Prada she is going for seasoned HRC and JH title. She is also working on whistle stops and back and overs.

I am working on marks getting his recall more solid doing water marks. I need to find a couple of new places where he could cheat so I work on that if need be. I plan on entering our fist HRC test on June 23rd.
I need to get some ducks. He picks up fresh killed ducks just fine he doesnt like them when they start to get gross kind of chewed stinky.


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

> when she tried to snatch the live flyer back today after I took it from her.


I know what the tells *ME*

The reason she likes bumpers more is she is not getting enough birds. This week would be lots of water and birds.


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

My training this week. Handling in water and marks.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Geez Lisa, I'm sorry but it was great experience for you guys. Hoping you do better next Saturday. I like the judge's idea of sending her on what Dan calls "The F Word".


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

*The boy today*

Faelan today during the 1st series of training. His flier needed several shots, then Faelan gave it the death shake and still needed to wait for a chance to pick it up by the body.

This was the first time he was heeled to the line and had no restraint to hold him steady --- good boy 






 
A few of the factors were roads, wind, bitches in season and sudden heat.


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## hollyk (Feb 21, 2009)

You and Scout will have better luck next week Lisa. Wishing you good weather for training in the coming week.


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## hollyk (Feb 21, 2009)

Sharon, 
That sure looks like a Junior land series pass to me. Good Boy Faelan!


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

I am going to play the devils advocate. There are several things that are going to come and bite you. 
1. His butt needs to be back against the holding blind.
2. He does not leave that holding blind until you tell him to.
3. You are there to run your dog not socialize.
4. You should be receiving that dog inline for the next mark not talking to your training partner or the judges. You should be focusing on setting him up for the next mark.
5. That is not a Junior land series. There are not going to be white coats in the field. That gunner should have been behind a holding blind. If you are training for UKC and AKC hunt tests the gunners should be hidden execept for the flyer.


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

Thanks 

Until Faelan has finished his UDX (or beyond), I am retraining him to deliver to front position - he still wants to swing into heel so when I begin serious training for SH & MH, I do not feel he will have issues. But for obedience, swing to heel automatically costs me 5 points each occurrence - kind of hurts his score since there are several deliveries in Open and Utility when he delivers something  

Should he know the difference? Sure, but I'd rather concentrate on other things LOL




Radarsdad said:


> I am going to play the devils advocate. There are several things that are going to come and bite you.
> 1. His butt needs to be back against the holding blind.
> 2. He does not leave that holding blind until you tell him to.
> 3. You are there to run your dog not socialize.
> ...


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## gdgli (Aug 24, 2011)

I think that we will have the opportunity to train water this week. We may be entering WCX at this summer's LIGRC WC/WCX test.

Our season of working the continental style shoots gave us the opportunity to work on steadiness. This is not a problem. 

We are also looking forward to continuing her work on handling. I spent Saturday making my lining stakes. They are nice and white at this point. 

We did some lining drills through cover. We will be working on this some more for the week. She is actually doing quite well.


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

Sunrise said:


> Thanks
> 
> Until Faelan has finished his UDX (or beyond), I am retraining him to deliver to front position - he still wants to swing into heel so when I begin serious training for SH & MH, I do not feel he will have issues. But for obedience, swing to heel automatically costs me 5 points each occurrence - kind of hurts his score since there are several deliveries in Open and Utility when he delivers something
> 
> Should he know the difference? Sure, but I'd rather concentrate on other things LOL


Makes sense to me. 5 POINTS WOW!!
I front sit before blinds. Like I said, just playing devil's advocate. You have to use what works for you!


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Radarsdad said:


> I am going to play the devils advocate. There are several things that are going to come and bite you.
> 1. His butt needs to be back against the holding blind.
> 2. He does not leave that holding blind until you tell him to.
> 3. You are there to run your dog not socialize.
> ...


Great post. The dog did a nice job on the marks though! This was more of a WC-style setup although with just singles, as there were whitecoats and no factors on the marks. I agree with all points above.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Sunrise said:


> Thanks
> 
> Until Faelan has finished his UDX (or beyond), I am retraining him to deliver to front position - he still wants to swing into heel so when I begin serious training for SH & MH, I do not feel he will have issues. But for obedience, swing to heel automatically costs me 5 points each occurrence - kind of hurts his score since there are several deliveries in Open and Utility when he delivers something
> 
> Should he know the difference? Sure, but I'd rather concentrate on other things LOL


Yes BUT ---- on BOTH the marks on the video you did have him deliver to "Front" but both were terribly crooked fronts. So are you going to train him to deliver in the "area of a front" or an actual real front? Because frankly I think you are doing more harm to your obedience fronts by letting him front crooked in the field than having him deliver to heel in the field. And why sit around and nitpick and make him do perfect fronts in the field? A totally unnecessary time waster. Coming directly to heel in the field is proper because they are then focused on the next mark, it's just good handling. The only time I've seen a pro or otherwise accomplished trainer in the field accept a front delivery is if the dog has a problem sticking on birds and for some reason is more likely to release it from a front (or if it's the last bird and they just want to grab it and go, or in a drill setting for a front cast). 
One of my pet peeves with new field trainers is all of this carry-over stuff from the obedience ring. I.e. sending the dog on "take it," front finishes, "get in" instead of "heel," etc. Yeah the dog doesn't care and the rulebook doesn't care but well, it makes you look like a newbie or that you'd just rather be in the obedience ring. My opinion only, and it probably stinks! LOL


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## KathyG (Nov 21, 2011)

Radarsdad said:


> I am going to play the devils advocate. There are several things that are going to come and bite you.
> 1. His butt needs to be back against the holding blind.
> 2. He does not leave that holding blind until you tell him to.
> 3. You are there to run your dog not socialize.
> ...


What is the significance of #1?

Kathy


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

KathyG said:


> What is the significance of #1?
> 
> Kathy


The dog needs to focused on you. They need to be watching you and not the noise and the test. It is a control issue, they are not on their own and you are in charge. They are nervous and excited enough about going to line which they know they are about to do. They need your guidance and you have to have a tool to let them know you are in control. Which gives them confidence. Best explanation I can give but it works.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

and they are a lot less likely to try to crawl under the blind if their butt is to the blind


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

Got out for a short session tonight--we are having a massive windstorm--to the degree of power outages and traffic lights being blown off thier poles!

Did a review of the back pile and first over piles with Bonnie after our whelping layoff, and did three big blinds with Breeze--one with an obstacle en route and two with a goalpost gap she had to take. It was too darned windy to do marks--winders wuld have been blowing over!


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

Angle back drills today. Angle backs in water tomorrow.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Ok guys feeling a little frustrated here.

Went out to train on Monday with a friend to see if we could duplicate and hopefully temporarily fix the water problem we had at the test. She seemed to be doing great up to the test, and then on the water marks she gets in wading water and sits and splashes around until I give a 'go fetch' command and then she's fine. Anyway, she did the same thing on Monday. Got in a few yards just up to chest height and puttered around *unless* I tell her to go fetch then she drives through and is fine. Once she's in swimming water she's committed and will follow through.

Anyway, we tried some jealousy drills which didn't really work for her. If she didn't go right away we sent my friend's dog to get it. So then we tried having me throw as the gunner as Pete has said in the past that you can get dog to do longer marks and push harder than ordinary when the owner is the one out in the field. Boom--no problem no hesitation. Problem was when she got the bumper she was quite confused and just wanted to bring it to me (gunner) and not my friend. Since I am the only one that has ever ran her, that was a little understandable. Other problem...I am not going to be the gunner on Saturday. Then I tried sending her alone on go fetch...didn't work either.

So--knowing my dog I wanted to try pairing a nick with go fetch. She's got basic land handling, she's been ftp even though not force to water yet, and she certainly knows to drive back on back*nick*back. So, we tested it on land by throwing a fun bumper and following with a fetch*nick send. I knew exactly what setting to put it at--just enough she'd notice, but not enough to confuse/stop her. She did great. Threw a fun bumper on water and repeated. Did great. Then did a longer water mark this time with a gunner. Great--drove through the nick and did not pause at the shore. Did a couple more, some with nicks and some without, and ended with a happy fun bumper. It was a little improvement, but I still left Monday feeling like we might have to scratch Saturday depending on what happens the rest of the week.

So, trained again at a different pond and zero issues this time. I don't know what the deal this--but she had no reserve about diving in. I did send on fetch and a few of the marks sent on fetch*nick and some just fetch. We're going to train again tomorrow.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

I am frustrated, too....but for a different reason. I simply don't have time to train this poor dog. We trained at Dan's last Wednesday, then I was out of town Thursday-late last night. Today I had 2 "can't miss" meetings, and he had an agility lesson. He just ate, so we can't head out now.
Tomorrow it's supposed to rain all day. If not, we head to Dan's. Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday I have to work. Work for me means 5:00 a.m. until 9:00 p.m., so there's not really any time in there to train. My husband will be out of town, so no help from him. My sister from TX will be in town for the weekend, so I can't even slip away for a little while at lunch/dinner time. 
That's the way it goes here. If he's ever going to get his SH, I think he will have to do it by himself.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Nothing but quick drills this week. I OD'd on training last week as we trained Wednesday, Thursday, Friday then the local HRC test on Saturday & Sunday. BURNOUT! For me, not the dogs! LOL 
Slater passed Seasoned both days, which admittedly was easier than senior but with the added distraction of the gun (which I consider just that -- a distraction to dog handling), which I've only trained with Slater once, it was a challenge. Saturday he did PERFECT on the land series, one whistled the blind. Saturday water was SCREWY -- in HRC you shoot a shot AT the blind -- which is ridiculous -- and that was the first thing in the water series, and when I sent Slater for the blind I could tell he was confused and sure enough he did a stutter step and started to re-heel himself. Not knowing the rule in HRC I blew the whistle with him a foot in front of me and casted him back. He went right in the water but that was weird. Then on the water marks the MEMORY bird was literally 10 yards in front of you, a big fat splash. Well splash + gun = wet golden -- he totally broke but I called him back as they were launching the go bird, which he did not see. I managed to get the live shell ejected, hang the gun up, and then sent him for the short bird, lined him up to the longer "go bird" and sent him with BACK -- he launched into the water and swam right to it, obviously he either caught a piece of it in the air or otherwise just knew where it was, I didn't have to handle. WHEW! 
Sunday's I was nervous again because of the controlled break but seriously -- Slater again was nearly perfect on land, and this time on the water blind, which was the first thing in the water series, I sat him behind the gun stand, walked forward, shot the gun, hung it up then told him to heel-dead bird-back and he had no problems. Not sure if the rules specify you must have the dog at heel before you shoot the blind -- but it worked much better to not involve the dog in it! The water marks made me nervous as the go bird was a bird coming AT you landing about 10 yards away -- SPLASH -- but Slater was very good and kept his furry butt planted. Two ribbons!
Harvin and my friend's golden Campbell also got their first two Started passes.
Fun weekend! Tired! Yesterday and today I just did 2 tiered wagon wheel with Slater to work on alignment.


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

Good job guys. I personally don't think UKC tests reward good dog work. If they sit with tips and tricks they will probably pass. I don't think it rewards the dog for making good decisions. Much more rewarding watching a dog make the right decision on a long mark and or blind. Probably catch some flak for this but.....


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

We decided to put Scout back in the same pond where she was puddling around at the shore. First mark went and the second I saw her even think about stopping I told her fetch*nick and she kept going. Second time she started pausing again so I increased the nick a hair and she kept going. Moved to a different spot on the pond for a third and fourth mark and she drove right into the water both times without getting a nick or fetch command. I hope that means she got the message.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Radarsdad said:


> Good job guys. I personally don't think UKC tests reward good dog work. If they sit with tips and tricks they will probably pass. I don't think it rewards the dog for making good decisions.  Much more rewarding watching a dog make the right decision on a long mark and or blind. Probably catch some flak for this but.....


I am right there with ya and totally agree.
When I did Seasoned with Fisher and now Slater I feel it wasn't too big of a difference from senior but Finished is a whole nuther thing. I honestly feel they reward dogs who get lucky and not so much a precision trained dog. I've seen some nice, reasonable Finished tests but the ones I did with Fisher were RIDICULOUS and the biggest problem I had was Fisher not SEEING the marks!!!!! Well hide them in some trees or coming out of deep cover with no noise makers and surprise surprise the dog doesn't see it. It is less about markings and good blinds, it's about knowing how to run the game and get lucky. And the whole not letting dog's hunt -- train with UKC guys any length of time and they won't let the dog hunt on a mark, handle handle handle. Yeesh. Oh well I did have a good time this weekend and brought home ribbons so can't complain about that


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## KathyG (Nov 21, 2011)

Interesting HRC comments. Personally, I like the venue although it does seem to be more of a 'good all boy club'. Having said that, I just sent in my entry for the spring Grand and have our first test this weekend.

The skill the dog and handler need at the finished level is to move with the gun and look out to the field. This has been difficult for me and my dog since neither of us are hunters and I'm still uncomfortable with the gun. However, you can speak quietly to your dog so a heel command comes in handy. The other thing is the blinds are usually hot which is a good reason not to let your dog get involved in a big hunt. And they are usually right in line with a mark so if they over run you are forced to handle. This is all by design, of course.

My dog gets way more amped up for HRC than AKC and that's a factor also. I've seen a lot of very good dog work at the Finished level.

Kathy


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## hollyk (Feb 21, 2009)

KathyG said:


> Interesting HRC comments. Personally, I like the venue although it does seem to be more of a 'good all boy club'. Having said that, I just sent in my entry for the spring Grand and have our first test this weekend.
> 
> The skill the dog and handler need at the finished level is to move with the gun and look out to the field. This has been difficult for me and my dog since neither of us are hunters and I'm still uncomfortable with the gun. However, you can speak quietly to your dog so a heel command comes in handy. The other thing is the blinds are usually hot which is a good reason not to let your dog get involved in a big hunt. And they are usually right in line with a mark so if they over run you are forced to handle. This is all by design, of course.
> 
> ...


Well, I'm probably too new at this to comment about the dog work, but without my HRC club we would not playing this game. For over a year I was mentored through the club which basically got us thru the Started/Junior level. It was only as we started to do Senior work that I decided to work with a Pro. 
There is a bunch of us that day train with my Pro, some only do AKC, some HRC, some both. The Pro runs both and there is more and more cross over every year. 
Steadiness at the line is a must for me in HRC. I'm new to the gun and I have to think about what I'm doing, so Winter must sit quietly by my side and wait for me to get settled. The gun helped me see just how much I was managing her at the line. 
Last year we had a Grand judge at our August Hunt test and the Finished Level water was set in a channel of water with small islands. The test was short and tight and the blind was hot. I thought it showed who was really marking those birds. I have it drawn out in my training book and I would like to give it a try in a couple of years.

Anyway, my HRC club's test is this week-end too. Winter is going to be test dog for Started one day and Seasoned the next. I need to do more water blind work, and show her more doubles before we start our offical run at the Seasoned/Senior titles, hopefully later this summer.

Kathy, Good Luck at The Grand! Have you been before?


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Interesting comments about HRC, especially about handling on marks. Dan, who runs only HRC, threatens to jam the whistle down my throat if he EVER catches me handling on a mark (in training).


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Good luck this weekend Kathy! Some of my favorite people (Dan) and some of my not-so-favorite people (you know who) will be running there this weekend. 
Can't wait to hear how you did!


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## KathyG (Nov 21, 2011)

Certainly would NOT handle in training on any routine basis. Not unusual to grab a chair and sit back and see if the dog can solve their problem.

Actually this happened just yesterday and one of the dogs was mine. My youngest dog is turning into a very good blind dog. What makes him so good is not only his willingness to give up control and be handled, but the fact that he really carries his lines.

So he is being sent for #2 of a triple, seems to lock on (trainer was running him) but from behind I can see that he is really lined up left. Gets sent, and sure enough carries the line way left. I chastise trainer 

He is supposed to be getting in water after a long entry, but his line carries him left of the bank into nowhere land. He is not avoiding, just staying on his line. We sit and wait and sure enough, eventually he gets in the water from the backside and finds his mark.

Quite frankly, had I been running the dog my first thought would have been I sent him bad and I should re heel and re send. But if I didn't react quick enough to that thought, my second thought, when he got to the backside of the pond, would have been to handle. Either one would have been bad for the dog as he wouldn't learn anything.

Fortunately, I wasn't handling. On the repeat, the trainer took more time on the alignment and the dog stepped on the mark. We all learned something.

Conclusion. Be patient and let the dogs solve their problems when you can. Big difference between training and testing.



Kathy


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

hotel4dogs said:


> Good luck this weekend Kathy! Some of my favorite people (Dan) and some of my not-so-favorite people (you know who) will be running there this weekend.
> Can't wait to hear how you did!


Oh Barb don't tell me that even friendly old YOU have frenemies! What has this dog world come to! LOL just teasing you

Would have liked to go up to Coastal Empire HRC in Savannah this weekend but funds do not allow.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

ha ha ha, he's one of those people that to know him is to dislike him!



K9-Design said:


> Oh Barb don't tell me that even friendly old YOU have frenemies! What has this dog world come to! LOL just teasing you
> 
> Would have liked to go up to Coastal Empire HRC in Savannah this weekend but funds do not allow.


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## KathyG (Nov 21, 2011)

Frenemies........I'm stealing that one. Too perfect!

At Barb, I scratched Saturday as I got a chance to train with a group..a rare occurrence.

Kathy


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

hotel4dogs said:


> ha ha ha, he's one of those people that to know him is to dislike him!


Ah yes, I know the type!


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## my4goldens (Jan 21, 2009)

hotel4dogs said:


> ha ha ha, he's one of those people that to know him is to dislike him!


He's not the guy that was there the day you had the training session at your place, is he? if it is, then I understand fully what you mean.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

HAHAHAHAHA yep! You mean the guy who wanted to know what was WRONG with the birds we had gotten (after we went thru the trouble of obtaining 18 live pheasants!) because HIS dog didn't want to pick it up, although none of the other dogs had an issue (including Tugg!) ?? Yep, that's the guy!




my4goldens said:


> He's not the guy that was there the day you had the training session at your place, is he? if it is, then I understand fully what you mean.


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## my4goldens (Jan 21, 2009)

hotel4dogs said:


> HAHAHAHAHA yep! You mean the guy who wanted to know what was WRONG with the birds we had gotten (after we went thru the trouble of obtaining 18 live pheasants!) because HIS dog didn't want to pick it up, although none of the other dogs had an issue (including Tugg!) ?? Yep, that's the guy!


Thats what I thought. I felt sorry for his dog that day.


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

hotel4dogs said:


> Interesting comments about HRC, especially about handling on marks. Dan, who runs only HRC, threatens to jam the whistle down my throat if he EVER catches me handling on a mark (in training).


I will handle on a mark in training in a heart beat. How else are you going teach a dog to fight factors and cheating etc. Depends on what your are trying to teach. We set up marks where we know we are going to have to handle to teach a concept.


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

my4goldens said:


> Thats what I thought. I felt sorry for his dog that day.


Feel sorry for the dog too. Gunner loves fresh birds. If the dog won't pick them up it's not the birds. Fill in the blank.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

I was going to go run blinds at the Santa Fe Comm. College field (huge field probably 20 acres of overflow parking) but.....got lazy, went to the church and actually did...brace yourselves....obedience! Strut strut strut, front front, get in and all that jazz. Both dogs were like WHOOOOOOO -- what izz this????? FUN! HOTDOGS!


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## KathyG (Nov 21, 2011)

Radarsdad said:


> I will handle on a mark in training in a heart beat. How else are you going teach a dog to fight factors and cheating etc. Depends on what your are trying to teach. We set up marks where we know we are going to have to handle to teach a concept.


Different training styles. We teach the dogs to go where sent, ignoring factors. They would be helped in the field if they were going to switch or were totally lost. Usually, if they get themselves in trouble, they need to get themselves out of trouble.

That's what's so nice with dog training, there is more than one way to get the to the end.

Kathy


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

KathyG said:


> Different training styles. We teach the dogs to go where sent, ignoring factors. They would be helped in the field if they were going to switch or were totally lost. Usually, if they get themselves in trouble, they need to get themselves out of trouble.
> 
> That's what's so nice with dog training, there is more than one way to get the to the end.
> 
> Kathy


How do get them out of trouble?? If you you throw a bird to pull them which by the way I agree with. But there are times when you have to handle to teach the mark. Such as teaching a difficult mark and the dog gives up is about to leave the area of the fall, or they made the decision to take land rather than water. There is a a risk of teaching the gunner and if they don't get it "gunner will help me to the mark if I lollygag around here long enough that gunner will throw me another one". IF you don't correct for giving into factors and going and getting the bird what are you teaching? Point is, you need to use both. Read your dog.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Yay we got our second pass today! All our hard work focusing on water this week paid off. Scout did great. The first mark was a little tricky because it was off to the side of a road and there were white decoys up a ways and on the road with more decoys to the side. Scout had a nice straight line and was not sucked on the road but did hunt a little on the first mark, but not much. Second mark was pretty simple and short...although it landed just before some water and a few dogs took a swim first before coming back or before getting the bird. I was worried Scout would be one of them, but she wasn't.

And as it turns out the water marks this week were much longer than last week (and probably harder too). She had to cover some ground in really thick cover before entering the water and the bird landed in some thick cover on the other side of the pond. Judge said she was the only one to take a straight line and go right through the thick cat tails at the far end of the pond. The second water mark and we get...a no bird again. It sucked. But the nice part was that when we came back for it she pinned it...and got a 10 on marking for that bird. Go Scout. We did get hit for slow water entries, but she did go and didn't stop. Pete says she will probably always have slow water entries even after water force. Anyway, I'm really happy with the pass.


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## AmberSunrise (Apr 1, 2009)

GoldenSail said:


> Yay we got our second pass today!


Yay  Congratulations!!


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## sterregold (Dec 9, 2009)

Got Bonnie running hard to the pile and stopping and casting to both left and right piles on her new t-field yesterday. 

Breeze got three big blinds that were progressively more into a crosswind, and then some standalone marks. Rainy and crappy today. Hoping it is nicer tomorrow so we can get out.

Puppies are getting FAT! All are over 2lbs now. They are vocal!! I am blaming the dad for that, his litter was apparently very talkative...


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Congrats Lisa and Scout!!!!


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## KathyG (Nov 21, 2011)

Radarsdad said:


> How do get them out of trouble?? If you you throw a bird to pull them which by the way I agree with. But there are times when you have to handle to teach the mark. Such as teaching a difficult mark and the dog gives up is about to leave the area of the fall, or they made the decision to take land rather than water. There is a a risk of teaching the gunner and if they don't get it "gunner will help me to the mark if I lollygag around here long enough that gunner will throw me another one". IF you don't correct for giving into factors and going and getting the bird what are you teaching? Point is, you need to use both. Read your dog.


Today was a triple. Very windy. One station threw mom and pop marks. Memory bird to the right, middle bird to the left, second station throws toward middle mark as go bird. Dog picks up one and is sent for outside right hand bird. Takes a good line, but being a golden ( just running senior) with a great nose, the wind is blowing the scent from the gunners chair. Dog gets caught up. Hunts short for quite awhile. Starts to drift towards middle bird. Is stopped with a no-no. Right arm out, told to fetch it up. Dog takes the cast over and is 30 yards away from mark when he winds it and completes the test. So, I guess he was handled..sort of. Repeats the test and is able to ignore the scent and stay focused on his marks. I think the dog learned his lesson.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Way to go Lisa and Scout!!!!


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## Radarsdad (Apr 18, 2011)

KathyG said:


> Today was a triple. Very windy. One station threw mom and pop marks. Memory bird to the right, middle bird to the left, second station throws toward middle mark as go bird. Dog picks up one and is sent for outside right hand bird. Takes a good line, but being a golden ( just running senior) with a great nose, the wind is blowing the scent from the gunners chair. Dog gets caught up. Hunts short for quite awhile. Starts to drift towards middle bird. Is stopped with a no-no. Right arm out, told to fetch it up. Dog takes the cast over and is 30 yards away from mark when he winds it and completes the test. So, I guess he was handled..sort of. Repeats the test and is able to ignore the scent and stay focused on his marks. I think the dog learned his lesson.


You handled him on a mark and the dog learned the lesson. Would have used whistle first to sit then no-no. Then cast. Good job to both of you.


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## KathyG (Nov 21, 2011)

hotel4dogs said:


> Good luck this weekend Kathy! Some of my favorite people (Dan) and some of my not-so-favorite people (you know who) will be running there this weekend.
> Can't wait to hear how you did!


You know who got his HRCH.

Kathy's score -- one win, one loss. My good dog running Finished (HRCH GCH MH UD MX MXJ), front footed 6 marks, lined the land blind but lost his manners on the water. Honor dog broke and it was the closest I've ever come to a dog fight at a test. When handler yelled, NO HERE at his dog, my dog stopped and turned only to find a big lab in his face ( my dog is 18 inches). There was growling by both but they separated quickly.

Re heeled and sent and he stepped on the marks, but he was over the top with excitement/cockiness and very naughty at the line from that point on. No pink slip for him. I knew the one judge was a real stickler for obedience.

However, on a whim, I had entered my young dog in Seasoned after I arrived and a friend talked me into it. I reminded her, and myself, that the dog had never been shot over. 

First series he was a little concerned about the gun but had good dog work anyway. By the time we got to water, he didn't even seem to notice and passed his first test.

So, both dogs got lots of birds and were very happy. The good/bad dog worked wagon wheels last night. Tonight is agility class and I think I'm going to make him honor the other dogs working.

Kathy


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

Sounds like you had a good weekend, Kathy!


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## hollyk (Feb 21, 2009)

Woohoo, Lisa and Scout!


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