# Gentle Leader



## RedDogs (Jan 30, 2010)

I haven't heard of an injury, even in situations where they have been used improperly (on a longline, owners jerking, dog lunging). Though dogs do have very very sensitive faces.

I would recommend you find someone who is adept at using the product to show you how. You shouldn't have to use more than very light pressure to turn him if he is pulling, and you should be very cautious that the leash clip is always hanging straight down while you are walking.

I'm glad you feel safer and will be able to do more/better walks!


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> Have any of you heard of any bad effects caused by using a gentle leader?


I kinda think that there are three...

1. People who don't know what a gentle leader is and only get a passing glance at your dog, think you are a bad owner because you have a muzzle on a golden. It does look ugly. 

2. If you put it on your dog a lot, it leaves ridge lines on your dog's nose. 

3. It can turn into a crutch, or your dog walks so nice with a GL you stop trying to get him to walk nice on a regular collar.


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

RedDogs said:


> I haven't heard of an injury, even in situations where they have been used improperly (on a longline, owners jerking, dog lunging). Though dogs do have very very sensitive faces.
> 
> I would recommend you find someone who is adept at using the product to show you how. You shouldn't have to use more than very light pressure to turn him if he is pulling, and you should be very cautious that the leash clip is always hanging straight down while you are walking.
> 
> I'm glad you feel safer and will be able to do more/better walks!


It came with a training DVD. I watched it and made sure the nose piece was as loose as they recommended. He didn't pull at all on it. If he walked to the end of the leash, he stopped pretty quickly if he felt the most gentle of tugs.

I noticed I was able to hold the lease handle using only two fingers resting gently on it.



Megora said:


> I kinda think that there are three...
> 
> 1. People who don't know what a gentle leader is and only get a passing glance at your dog, think you are a bad owner because you have a muzzle on a golden. It does look ugly.
> 
> ...


I thought about #1 and decided I shouldn't worry about what people think. I do admit, the first time I saw one I thought it was a muzzle.

Permanent ridge lines? 

As for it being a crutch, I don't want to end up on crutches. lol Just teasing. 

The other option I thought I could try is the Cesar Milan Illusion Collar. Have any of you tried it?







It's a tad pricey, but it eliminates the nose strap. Edit: I just noticed it says not to use on dogs under one year old.

Thank y'all! It's difficult to decide what to do. It was getting to the point where I did not want to walk Luke because it felt like a dangerous situation for both of us.

I have a friend who recently broke her collar bone all the way across when her lab bolted after something. I'm a small person, but pretty strong as I worked out at a power lifting gym for years. Nonetheless, it's a miserable experience to be pulled the entire time when we're out for a walk. Plus, I fully expect Luke to fall over and faint. When he pulls hard, it goes beyond panting. He makes some pretty loud "I can't breathe" noises.


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

I have successfully walked 4 of my dogs together with gentle leaders! I love them.


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

Sally's Mom said:


> I have successfully walked 4 of my dogs together with gentle leaders! I love them.


I bet Sally's Mom! I think it would be a must for more than one large dog who pulls. We're eventually going to get another Golden and it may be the only way I can get two down to the beach on my own.


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## Adriennelane (Feb 13, 2008)

They have videos on how to fit the Gentle Leader on their webpage. Gentle Leader Product Description - Premier Pet


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> Permanent ridge lines?


I don't think so.... more like the "ring around the collar" that dogs who wear regular collars get. <- I'm assuming there are ways to avoid the ring around the nose just like with regular collars.

^ I keep my guy naked except when he's going for a walk or a ride in the car and I keep the collars loose. 

That said... I do definitely understand how uncomfortable it can be to walk a tugboat of a dog.... <- Our Sammy was the dog that nobody wanted to walk because he slayed arms. He did learn to walk nice after a few months of dog classes....

This doesn't apply to your situation because your dog has already learned to drag you around, but definitely - teaching your dog to walk on a loose lead as early as possible and practicing in your yard, following through with praise when he settles down... that does give you a nice dog from puppyhood onward. You do need to work on it every day.


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## jackie_hubert (Jun 2, 2010)

We use a head collar as do almost all the April puppies and all of us have been doing a lot of loose leash training to little avail. That group has seen it's fair share of injuries due to lunging dogs - split knees, teeth through lips, sprained fingers, falling on ice...

my big con- when cosmo meets people or dogs and feels the head collar holding him back he begins to panic and pulls back trying to back out of the collar. This has led to another dog biting him. I take the head halter of now before letting him greet another dog.


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## Rebroland (May 20, 2010)

The gentle leader doesn't work for Sully.. However, my friend has a gentle leader and swears by it.. We use a no pull harness and again.. miracles  lol.


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## RKA (Sep 20, 2010)

I use it for Chili and I'll second the ridge lines and it becoming a crutch. We go to a training class with him once a week and he's pretty good around the other dogs, but every now and again another dog will pass in close proximity and if we're not working on a command and he's bored, he'll rush over to play. That causes the strap to rub around the bridge of his nose as the leash tightens. Sometimes he'll fight it a little with a tug back, and within 2-3 seconds all the drama is over. By the end of the class I can see it's taken some hair out, bent other hair to cause a little line. On our regular walks though...he walks nicely and it doesn't exacerbate the problem. 

As far as being a crutch, our goal is eventually to get to a point where we can walk with a regular leash, so we continue that training. However he is big, our dog walkers and my wife are not, and frankly even if they were, as you pointed out, sometimes it's just not fun. Further, I hate the harm he can sometimes do to himself on a regular leash. If your dog is driving you nuts and you just need to walk in peace, give it a try.


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## 2dollys (Jan 24, 2011)

*illusion collar*

We have an illusion collar from Cesar. I don't recommend it, it isn't worth the high price. All it does is put a soft "choke" style lead high up on the neck behind the ears. I have tried the head harnesses and an easy walk harness and like both better. The dogs seem much happier on the easy walk, although it is possible to pull a little on it. The head harnesses do look like muzzles (kind of) and our older girl (who has tried the head harnesses) doesn't like them on her face, although they are very effective to stop pulling.

Have you tried the new gentle leader with the padding on the nose strap? Mine are the old style and I wonder if the newer ones would be less uncomfortable and leave less of a line.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Diane*

Diane

I am so happy this is working for Luke and you! He will enjoy his walk so much more and so WILL YOU!! I don't see a downside!!


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

Adriennelane said:


> They have videos on how to fit the Gentle Leader on their webpage. Gentle Leader Product Description - Premier Pet


Thank you! The product came with a training video also and I watched it before trying to put the gentle leader on Luke. It's pretty easy to get on and I think I have its tightness on the neck strap and looseness on the nose strap set right.



Megora said:


> I don't think so.... more like the "ring around the collar" that dogs who wear regular collars get. <- I'm assuming there are ways to avoid the ring around the nose just like with regular collars.
> 
> ^ I keep my guy naked except when he's going for a walk or a ride in the car and I keep the collars loose.
> 
> ...


I prefer Luke without a collar in the house and in the yard. Believe me, Luke has been through puppy kindergarten, had a private trainer come to the house for 12 weeks and has been worked with a lot. He just did not seem to want to learn to walk on a lead without pulling.

Now, if I put him in the yard with no leash he will heel right beside me with ease. The trainer said he learned heel really young and was so good at it. He sits when I stop, he sits, he lays, he shakes hands, he rolls onto his back when I say bang, bang.

I play with him at the beach off leash all the time and he listens to my commands.

I suppose he may have been a sled dog in another life. Once the leash goes on, it's time to pull. :



jackie_hubert said:


> We use a head collar as do almost all the April puppies and all of us have been doing a lot of loose leash training to little avail. That group has seen it's fair share of injuries due to lunging dogs - split knees, teeth through lips, sprained fingers, falling on ice...
> 
> my big con- when cosmo meets people or dogs and feels the head collar holding him back he begins to panic and pulls back trying to back out of the collar. This has led to another dog biting him. I take the head halter of now before letting him greet another dog.


Thanks Jackie! Luke's a June dog, so not far behind in age. Luke got me one time in the back yard chasing a rabbit. He took off after it and it had snowed (rarity here) recently and was slushy. He took off and brought me down to my knees. For some reason I didn't let go of the leash and he turned me around and I was flat on my back. By then, I was laughing and quite muddy. I'm very thankful I didn't break something.

Luke has walked up to neighborhood dogs twice today while we've been walking and so far so good. He hasn't come upon an aggressive dog yet while wearing this collar, but in the past Luke has seemed oblivious when another dog is being aggressive. One was lunging and biting at him and Luke just stands there or tries to play. I hope he doesn't learn the hard way there are aggressive dogs out in the world.



Rebroland said:


> The gentle leader doesn't work for Sully.. However, my friend has a gentle leader and swears by it.. We use a no pull harness and again.. miracles  lol.


I'm glad you like the harness. I didn't know there was such a thing until you said it, so I googled. That looks pretty cool too. At least that way there is nothing across the dog's nose. What brand is yours? Any negatives?



RKA said:


> I use it for Chili and I'll second the ridge lines and it becoming a crutch. We go to a training class with him once a week and he's pretty good around the other dogs, but every now and again another dog will pass in close proximity and if we're not working on a command and he's bored, he'll rush over to play. That causes the strap to rub around the bridge of his nose as the leash tightens. Sometimes he'll fight it a little with a tug back, and within 2-3 seconds all the drama is over. By the end of the class I can see it's taken some hair out, bent other hair to cause a little line. On our regular walks though...he walks nicely and it doesn't exacerbate the problem.
> 
> As far as being a crutch, our goal is eventually to get to a point where we can walk with a regular leash, so we continue that training. However he is big, our dog walkers and my wife are not, and frankly even if they were, as you pointed out, sometimes it's just not fun. Further, I hate the harm he can sometimes do to himself on a regular leash. If your dog is driving you nuts and you just need to walk in peace, give it a try.


Thank you. The walks have been much more peaceful. I was more in fear of Luke breaking away and getting hit by a car than anything. He tended to pull towards cars and, luckily, the two times he broke his leash completely he didn't get hurt.

I've seen the line on Luke's nose right when I take it off. He likes me to turn on the hose when we return from a walk and loves ducking his head in and out of the water to drink. Getting his nose all wet seems to make the line go away.



2dollys said:


> We have an illusion collar from Cesar. I don't recommend it, it isn't worth the high price. All it does is put a soft "choke" style lead high up on the neck behind the ears. I have tried the head harnesses and an easy walk harness and like both better. The dogs seem much happier on the easy walk, although it is possible to pull a little on it. The head harnesses do look like muzzles (kind of) and our older girl (who has tried the head harnesses) doesn't like them on her face, although they are very effective to stop pulling.
> 
> Have you tried the new gentle leader with the padding on the nose strap? Mine are the old style and I wonder if the newer ones would be less uncomfortable and leave less of a line.


Thanks! That's good to know. I just bought the gentle leader today, so I haven't tried the padded version. I noticed on our second walk today, Luke didn't try to pull much at all. He may have walked to the end of the leash about three times, but the minute it slightly pulls on his nose, he slows down.

I was able to hold his leash with two fingers. It was wonderful.



Karen519 said:


> Diane
> 
> I am so happy this is working for Luke and you! He will enjoy his walk so much more and so WILL YOU!! I don't see a downside!!


Thank you Karen! It feels so good to walk without getting a sore neck. I was tensing up so much holding the leash while he was tugging away.

He seemed perfectly happy on our second walk. He had his mouth wide open in a pretty smile as usual. Plus, he seems to be panting MUCH less and breathing easier on our walks. I think he was choking himself to death. :

Thanks so much for all of your responses everyone!


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## iansgran (May 29, 2010)

The Gentle Leader is a godsend to me because I am old and have bad knees and a excited 60lb guy. I could not control him in all situations without it.


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## Jamm (Mar 28, 2010)

Gentle leader is amazing!!! I have tried just about every 'no pull' collar/harness out there, and nothing worked with him. I even bought a prong and he pulled with that on! I have taken a week to get him used to it, giving him half his meal with me sitting and putting it on, giving him kibble, taking it off and then making him put his nose through the muzzle piece to get the kibble. I have had the best walks with him the past two weeks. Amazing weather plus a pup that doesn't pull = 3 hour walks!  I can't wait for this summer so we can go just about everywhere! I have noticed that right when I take it off Joey has a little bit of a mark from it in his fur but i just brush it away with my finger. Joey is kept naked unless we are going out.


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## jweisman54 (May 22, 2010)

Izzy uses a Gentle Leader also and it is so much better for me and her. If she starts to pull a gentle tug reminds her that she can't. I have bad hands and cannot afford not to use it.


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## jackie_hubert (Jun 2, 2010)

diane0905 said:


> Luke has walked up to neighborhood dogs twice today while we've been walking and so far so good. He hasn't come upon an aggressive dog yet while wearing this collar, but in the past Luke has seemed oblivious when another dog is being aggressive. One was lunging and biting at him and Luke just stands there or tries to play. I hope he doesn't learn the hard way there are aggressive dogs out in the world.


I don't expect all dogs will act like Cosmo when meeting another dog but I could see it happen. The dog that bit him when he was wearing his halti was a reactive dog - thanks lady for telling me he is fine with dogs when I asked ): 

Cosmo is exactly the same way as Luke in that he does not read aggressive dogs very well, or at least chooses not to listen. He got bit by another dog when he wouldn't go away when said dog was clearly resource guarding a mud puddle.


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

You can pad the nose strap yourself if you want. Just use some moleskin. Dr. Scholl has a self-stick kind.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> I suppose he may have been a sled dog in another life. Once the leash goes on, it's time to pull.


But what do you do differently on leash vs off leash? 

Are you still practicing on leash walking on a collar and leash with him every day in your yard and maybe the street in front of your home? Are you using the same treats, toys, physical and vocal cues you use when your dog is off leash? 

^ I'm just being snoopy. 

I didn't mean to sound too critical about the GL and I realize that people are using it as a training collar. Where I twitch is when people use it as the goal instead of a tool to get to the goal. If you are using the GL and then switching back to a regular collar after the dog has settled down, then that's part of training.


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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

I 'resorted' to using a gentle leader on my big guy Milo this winter. He is generally not bad about pulling on leash but sometimes when he decides he is going left - he goes left and there is no stopping him!! so for my own safety I used the gentle leader. He fussed a little, slid around in the snow, partly for enjoyment and partly to try to get it off. But it made my walks safer, and he GOT walked without causing me injury - which has happened in the past. I would reward him for walking with a loose leash and it has helped him to learn he can not get away with pulling me thru the snowbank and his leash walking on a flat collar has improved as well - still working on the pulling but it is not nearly as bad. It does help and it does not necessarily need to be permanent!


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

diane0905 said:


> I feel like it is the safer option for both of us.


To me, this is the most important thing. I think it's better to use a "crutch" and be safe, than not to use one and wish you had.

I walk Riley on a Halti (same basic concept as the Gentle Leader) and I love it. He can be pretty dog-reactive and with the Halti, I don't have to worry about him going after another dog and pulling me off my feet, or getting away from me.

I think, too, if a head collar is used properly it can actually be more of a training tool than a crutch. It makes it so much easier to get the behavior you want and then you reinforce from there.

As far as the strap marks - I haven't had a problem with them. He's worn his Halti on each and every walk for several months now, and it's not leaving any noticeable marks. I see a strap mark immediately after taking the Halti off, but I just pet his nose and sort of fluff the hair a little bit and the mark goes away.


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## RedDogs (Jan 30, 2010)

I'm not sure where the "crutch" term started or why it's used so frequently (...seriously, 10+ years I've head that thrown around in reference to this stuff.... it's kinda just become a term that's used!).

With most of my students that use a head halter or a front clip harness, it's going to be for the life of the dog. If it's safe to do just collar walking, that's what we do. But often times we have big rambunctious dogs and small/older/health challenges for the owners.... and I cannot risk the human getting injured. Training isn't 100%, there's always that little chance.... One should NOT feel horrible about using this for the life of the dog if there are safety issues involved. You should be able to walk your dog, give him exercise, have that interaction without being afraid of injury. 

Some of the kids I work with say that I'm too safety conscious.... but that's okay!


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

The difference between a training tool and a crutch is if you are unable to get the same good behavior without the training tool. 

It's a bit like wearing chaps while riding. If you've ever worn them, they are like heaven on earth. Because you don't need to use your leg muscles so much in order to stay on the horse. In schooling this is great because it allows the students to put more focus on their upper body, posture, and reining. The problem that does crop up with some students who always wear the chaps is it weakens their leg muscles and they feel like they can't stay on the horse without them. <- That is a crutch.

I never said (or didn't mean) that it's a BAD thing to use a tool permanently, even as a crutch, if it works. But if the person hopes to teach their dog to walk on a regular collar, they still need to train on a regular collar. Using a head collar doesn't teach a dog to walk on a regular collar. Or something like that. I ramble.


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## MyBuddy22 (Oct 29, 2010)

I will not try and walk Bauer without the Gentle Leader. It is NOT a muzzle at all... and I think its more safe than if he was not on it, because he pulls cutting off his air flow from his collar choking him. GENTLE LEADER FTW. I am a fan.


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## amy22 (May 11, 2008)

I use the Easy Walk harness for Holly and I have the Sens-ible harness for Misty..with both the leash hooks to the chest part. Its so great walking them with these harnesses. Misty used to pull so bad, not with the harness and I just started Holly out with the Easy Walk. I love to walk my dogs and these harnesses are great!


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## LifeOfRiley (Nov 2, 2007)

RedDogs said:


> I'm not sure where the "crutch" term started or why it's used so frequently (...seriously, 10+ years I've head that thrown around in reference to this stuff.... it's kinda just become a term that's used!).


I only use the word "crutch" because I've seen people give up on training, altogether, once they discover the Halti/Gentle Leader/harness, etc. I don't, _personally_, see them as a substitute for training, but I know people who would never feel comfortable walking their dog without a head collar, no matter how much training they would do. So in that sense, I do see it as a crutch, but it's not necessarily a _bad_ thing. No one should have to feel uncomfortable or nervous walking their dog. And my philosophy is always 'better safe than sorry.'

I don't know if I'll ever walk Riley again without his Halti. I'd like to. That's my goal. But as long as I think there's the slightest chance of him reacting and going after another dog, I won't take the risk.


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

Megora said:


> But what do you do differently on leash vs off leash?
> 
> Are you still practicing on leash walking on a collar and leash with him every day in your yard and maybe the street in front of your home? Are you using the same treats, toys, physical and vocal cues you use when your dog is off leash?
> 
> ...


Yes, I do the same things on and off leash. He knows when he is on and off leash. I get tickled at him really. I imagine he prefers to be off leash and gets persnickety about the leash. As far as every day -- no. We did every day for about five months. I generally train him a few times a week now. 

One thing I will say for sweet little Luke -- he will sit there like an absolute good boy and let me easily hook up his leash, gentle leader or car harness. He's about as good in a car as I could ask and we make regular three hour trips to an island off the coast of South Carolina.

I imagine Luke will end up settling down and walking well on a leash when he is a tad older and not as energetic. Probably at about five years old or so.  If you're asking if I change the leash on a walk when he settles down, well no. We just bought the gentle leader and he's getting used to it quickly. It makes walking safer and more enjoyable for both of us.

When Luke has broken his leash he could have easily been hit by a car. My husband and I went out for a two mile walk with him the other day. The next time my husband took him out in front of the house that day is when he popped/broke his leash. Luckily, he just did it trying to get to the neighbors' dogs to play. If he had done that as a car went by, it would have had more dire consequences. I'm more worried about him getting hit by a car than anything and I can't allow that to happen. Plus, I rather like having teeth and unbroken bones. :


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> When Luke has broken his leash he could have easily been hit by a car. My husband and I went out for a two mile walk with him the other day. The next time my husband took him out in front of the house that day is when he popped/broke his leash. Luckily, he just did it trying to get to the neighbors' dogs to play. If he had done that as a car went by, it would have had more dire consequences. I'm more worried about him getting hit by a car than anything and I can't allow that to happen. Plus, I rather like having teeth and unbroken bones.


This is off topic, but I think that's why my old instructor would start off every puppy class session with a retractable leash in hand and horror stories about using them for training. <- And actually, it wasn't until I started reading some posts here on GRF that I read anything positive about using them. 

You are not the first person to have those lines snap on you and they are not made to give the owner any type of control over their dogs. Not the same way that a nice thick leather leash anyway.


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

Megora said:


> This is off topic, but I think that's why my old instructor would start off every puppy class session with a retractable leash in hand and horror stories about using them for training. <- And actually, it wasn't until I started reading some posts here on GRF that I read anything positive about using them.
> 
> You are not the first person to have those lines snap on you and they are not made to give the owner any type of control over their dogs. Not the same way that a nice thick leather leash anyway.


Yeah, those leashes have been evicted. You would think one that says it's for a 120lb dog would hold a 65lb dog, but they don't. I never used those for training though. I used them for walks and our training sessions were on a six foot leash.

We took another walk today and I think he's adjusting well to his gentle leader.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I'm just glad I had a thick leather leash on my evening walk today...  

The was a huge hawk bird thing in someone's yard near the road. I thought it was a turkey vulture, but it had a hawk head and beak. And it was totally shredding an opposum. !!! 

I'm not sure if Jacks wanted the great big hawk that was as tall as him thing or the shredded opposom, but yep, he was pulling at the end of the leash and quivering.


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## C's Mom (Dec 7, 2009)

Loving the halti over here. I make sure the muzzle isn't too tight and that the collar is loose enough to slip two fingers through and then I push it up behind near C's ears. Give it a good check every now and again because it will become loose over time.

When C used to play with dogs off leash the halti came off immediately. I also stopped him from playing with a dog whose owner did not want to take the gentle leader off her dog when they were playing - sorry, I'm just not willing to take any chances in case of injury for either dog.

I find that after really good exercise time I can walk C home without the halti no problem but we worked up to this.


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

Update:

I know some people say the Gentle Leader is not a "teaching" tool, but I'm having nice results so far.

I used the Gentle Leader for two days with Luke, over a total of four walks. He didn't hate it, but he didn't love it either. He would occasionally paw at it. Today, just out of curiosity, I took him out on his regular leash for a mile long walk. Luke only tried to pull two times -- and that has never happened. Luke generally pulls 90% of a walk. Each time he did, I just came to a stop and didn't say a word to him and waiting until he returned to my side and we would start walking again. I praised him a lot on the walk and gave him treats when we returned from the walk.

I know he probably isn't completely cured of pulling, but if he starts pulling a lot again -- I will re-introduce him to the Gentle Leader.

I honestly think he made a connection and realized I was not happy with the pulling. I think he has known I'm not happy with the pulling, but now there is a negative consequence that results when he does.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

That is absolutely awesome - and using the tool properly.


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## justpenny (Nov 6, 2010)

I love the gentle lead also!! It's a know brainer for the dog and me too


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

I've been really happy today to be able to walk him on his regular leash. I'm hoping we won't have to utilize the gentle leader too often, but if he starts pulling badly again we will revisit it temporarily. I know he's made the connection.


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## julliams (Oct 27, 2010)

When Zali goes to daycare they use the gentle leader on her. I am not a big fan of the marks it leaves on her face and I can see that she doesn't really like the feel of it on her face. But I can understand that when my neighbour is walking 4 dogs at a time, the gentle leader is her best friend. I think it's good for Zali to learn to walk wearing one but I can see she is not all that fond of it.

But then again, sometimes something is good for us but we don't like it all that much. I think if it works, it works.


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

I haven't had to use the gentle leader again, so far. Luke is not pulling. I'm thinking of it as the miracle leader.  

As for the marks, I just felt like those were like the marks a sock leaves on my ankle at times -- just an impression, that goes away.


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## KaMu (May 17, 2010)

jackie_hubert said:


> I don't expect all dogs will act like Cosmo when meeting another dog but I could see it happen. The dog that bit him when he was wearing his halti was a reactive dog - thanks lady for telling me he is fine with dogs when I asked ):
> 
> Cosmo is exactly the same way as Luke in that he does not read aggressive dogs very well, or at least chooses not to listen. He got bit by another dog when he wouldn't go away when said dog was clearly resource guarding a mud puddle.



Jackie, as I have said in other post Roxy is around but not close to dog reactive dogs in both our rally class and the obedience class. In rally I cant use the head collar. However during this other class it is allowed. I used it for the first time this week and everyone was amazed at how Roxy seemed like a different dog, no pulling at all! Which makes our training easier. 

You raised a good point about being on the Head collar and meeting other dog aggressive dogs. Id worry about some kind of neck injury (Than again, I worry about alot of things)) ........I think you can attach the halti to a regular flat collar loop as well. Anyway, I don't have to worry about Roxy lunging at a dog aggressive dog because she is a wimp like her owner  She cant get to my side fast enough when shes scared

*** Mud puddles are worth fighting over in the Golden world


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## rachelh2000 (Aug 23, 2010)

We bought Trinity an Easy Walk harness and tried it out today - what a change!! It gives me so much more control and I don't have to exert every bit of strength in my body just to stop her from pulling. I chose this harness over the gentle leader because I didn't like how it went on the face, but that's just my personal opinion without experience with one haha.


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## amy22 (May 11, 2008)

I know...isnt the Easy Walk GREAT?!!


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## Dallas Gold (Dec 22, 2007)

rachelh2000 said:


> We bought Trinity an Easy Walk harness and tried it out today - what a change!! It gives me so much more control and I don't have to exert every bit of strength in my body just to stop her from pulling. I chose this harness over the gentle leader because I didn't like how it went on the face, but that's just my personal opinion without experience with one haha.


We switched from Gentle Leaders to Easy Walk Harnesses because of the marks the Gentle Leader leaves on the faces. They took months to disappear too! The Easy Walk harness is great, especially because Toby now tends to walk slightly behind us and doesn't try to pull us to the next county. During the transition I did leave the Gentle Leader on the face, just not leashed up, because of the deterrent impression. As soon as the Easy Walk harness was mastered by both of us, the Gentle Leader came off.


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## diane0905 (Aug 20, 2010)

The vet told me not to use a harness on Luke because that is putting a strap around the strongest part of his body. I don't know that he was talking about the Easy Walk harness, however. 

I made the mistake of coming to the beach for a week without the Gentle Leader. :doh: Luke was doing fine at home, but gets so excited here because there are so many distractions -- alligators, deer, raccoons, bobcats, marsh rats, etc. All the smells make him a little bit of crazy. 

I'm not a big fan of putting something over Luke's nose, but I really don't want him to be hit by a car either. I suppose this is all a learning process over time. 

Have any of you used *Cesar Milan's Illusion collar*? It looks very interesting and avoids the nose correction. 

I know some people think Cesar is too harsh and some seem to love him. I read his book and got tickled at him telling me to put on rollerblades to walk Luke. I think NOT!  I also didn't agree with his thoughts about dogs not really understanding what we're saying to them. I fully feel both of my dogs understand what I am saying. I do like a lot of what Cesar says though.

A good balance would be to read Dean Koontz' "A Big Little Life" right after reading one of Milan's books. lol Koontz goes to the other end of the spectrum and thinks his dog is reincarnated and psychic. :--big_grin: Seriously, that's a good book if any of you are looking for something sweet to read and are totally in love with Goldens.


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## RKA (Sep 20, 2010)

The standard harness your vet is referring to is entirely different from the easy walk harness. He's right about the standard harness.


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## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

I am NOT a fan of the gentle leader. I have never used it but based on "how" it works I would never put it on my dog. Sure they stop pulling I think it hurts. I am a glasses wearer, when I bump the side of my glasses and they in turn bump my nose it is painful. The nose is sensitive. 

Mother nature made dogs with more fur and flesh around their necks to protect them from predators. I believe in collars. Oh the "gentle leader" premise in the horse world is called a "war bridle". Interesting how the worlds gave them different names. 

I have not had much luck with harnesses but there are a LOT more people using them now and so I think that means they have great luck with them. The only harness I have is for biking my dogs. I didn't want to be attached to their throat if they started to pull, the bike and I weigh a bit more. 

Teddi is a MAJOR pull dog. I always shake my head a dog with bad hips and elbows can pull like a freight train. If she had good joints I would try her in weight pulling. We trained her in a pinch collar, which we revisit from time to time, she walks nicely now in her slip collar. When we put her swimming collar on HANG ON!!! She knows. LOL


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## jweisman54 (May 22, 2010)

I started using the Easy Walk Harness when Izzy was 4 months old and we used it for several months. She was still able to pull since she is extremely head strong. I could not continue to use it since I have arthritis in both hands and have had surgery on one so far. I brought her to the vet one day and all the techs including the vet all said to me that I need to TRY the Gentle Leader. Her trainer also suggested using it, since she was pulling with the harness. I tried it and it has been my savior. Izzy will be 1 tomorrow and she is walking very well on the GL, no pulling and my hands are in tact! Would I recommend the GL............absolutely Yes. does it put a mark on my dog's face, yes but when she comes in the house and I rub her face, it is gone. I bought the GL that has a backing on the nose strap. I believe it is like a felt that is stitched on. 
Just a note * I also use the Halti on her as well which is the same principal as the GL.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

diane0905 said:


> ...Have any of you used *Cesar Milan's Illusion collar*? It looks very interesting and avoids the nose correction. ....


The illusion collar is nothing more than a choke collar, with the rest of apparatus made to keep it positioned at the top of the neck directly behind the ears. 

I don't think the Gentle Leader causes pain, certainly no more pain than a pinch collar causes (and pinch collars do cause pain, it's how they work.)


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> I don't think the Gentle Leader causes pain, certainly no more pain than a pinch collar causes (and pinch collars do cause pain, it's how they work.)


I don't think Ann said that prongs do not cause discomfort. She said the area around the nose is a lot more sensitive than the area around a dog's neck. There is thinner skin and less fur and a lot more hyper nerves.


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## codog11 (Sep 28, 2010)

My problem with Ruby (9months) is that she is biting the leash and jumping on me during walks. I have a pinch collar which helped with the pullin. Would a gentle leader help with the jumping/leash biting? I've also seen the halters that go around the body. 

Which would be better for me a gentle leader or halter?

thanks


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## FlyingQuizini (Oct 24, 2006)

codog11 said:


> My problem with Ruby (9months) is that she is biting the leash and jumping on me during walks. I have a pinch collar which helped with the pullin. Would a gentle leader help with the jumping/leash biting? I've also seen the halters that go around the body.
> 
> Which would be better for me a gentle leader or halter?
> 
> thanks


I'm not generally a fan of pinch collars, so my answer is admittedly biased. I'd try either the Gentle Leader Headcollar or EZ Walk Harness for the pulling. As for the jumping, keep her in active thinking mode by working lots of obedience while out on walks. And make that more rewarding than jumping (which, if jumping makes you yell and get all excitable in your frustration, that's a pretty big reward to a dog). So start your walk with three steps, then sit, reward the sit with a small treat. Go two steps > sit > treat. Then five steps > sit > down > treat, etc. Help her use her brain for good and not evil.


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## dcbeattie (Mar 20, 2011)

codog11 said:


> My problem with Ruby (9months) is that she is biting the leash and jumping on me during walks. I have a pinch collar which helped with the pullin. Would a gentle leader help with the jumping/leash biting? I've also seen the halters that go around the body.
> 
> Which would be better for me a gentle leader or halter?
> 
> thanks


This is sort of useful..
http://www.premier.com/App_Content/media/gentleleader/GL_EWHComparison.pdf


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## codog11 (Sep 28, 2010)

thanks for the link


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## Obiscus (Oct 15, 2011)

interesting. i think we will try one of these for our pup.


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## MikaTallulah (Jul 19, 2006)

This is probably old news. But I heard the is a recall on some of the gentle leaders the clip was not secure.

Gentle Leader Headcollars Recalled Due to Defective Buckles | petMD


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## Max's Dad (Apr 23, 2012)

We began using the Gentle Leader because it was required for Max's obedience class, along with a 6 foot leather leash. He was probably about 6 months old. Max resisted at first, but by the end of the first class, he was walking and heeling very well. That was nearly 1.5 years ago. 

We continue to use the GL. Today, he requires the "extra large" version because he is quite big; we purchased his last one on Amazon. The most recent version is "padded" and seems to be more comfortable. I do not think he likes it, but he knows when the GL is on, he must walk and heel. 

If we stop to visit with a neighbor, he will scrape off the nose piece, so you have to keep an eye on him. A couple of times, we forgot, and left it on him in the car, and he took it off and chewed it in half! 

Also, since he has been on the gentle leader, he walks much better with a regular collar. Although, walks with the GL are much more trouble free.

We take Max out in public often, and people sometimes think the GL is a muzzle. When they ask, I politely explain the difference.


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## Kaila (Feb 1, 2012)

diane0905 said:


> So, I felt a tad guilty for doing this -- but by the time we were about halfway through our walk he was acting all happy again. I feel like it is the safer option for both of us.
> 
> Yay!
> 
> Have any of you heard of any bad effects caused by using a gentle leader?


Actually, I have heard that with the head collars that have a leash attachment UNDER the chin, that they can cause strain on the neck from constantly turning the head sideways when the dog tenses against the leash.

There are other varieties of head collars available and they provide the same amount of control. I can personally recommend both the Canny Collar (The Canny Collar - The Best Collar to Stop Dogs Pulling on the Leash) and the Bold Lead Designs Infinity Lead (infinity lead head collar -- you'll have to e-mailed Katrina Boldry at [email protected] if interested). These collars differ from the Halti or Gentle Leader because the leash attaches at the back of the head instead of under the chin. When the dog strains against the leash, their head is controlled much like a horse's. When a dog strains against the Gentle Leader, his head is turned sideways.. and if he hits the end of the leash suddenly, it can cause whiplash.

As you can see from my signature, I used to use the Gentle Leader, so I've tried three different types. 


PS: Also, take the time to create a positive association with the head halter. Even if he's doing fine with it now, it couldn't hurt. It'll just make him even happier to put it on and go for a walk! Here's how to do it:


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## RKA (Sep 20, 2010)

Kaila said:


> Actually, I have heard that with the head collars that have a leash attachment UNDER the chin, that they can cause strain on the neck from constantly turning the head sideways when the dog tenses against the leash.


For the dogs that respond to this type of collar, it usually takes them a day or two to get it (but you will see results immediately). And you should NOT be using this type of collar on a puppy (<6 months). An older pup won't be harmed. Now, if the dog just resists and refuses to respond to the collar, you probably need a different style that squeezes at the top of the legs (forget what they are called). FWIW, one of the trainers we used tried Chili's gentle leader on another golden that was using this other style of harness. That dog responded well to that harness, but he behaved very differently than Chili did the first day we put the GL on him. Each dog is different and for that dog the other harness was the ticket. The owners warned the trainer they had tried the GL and it didn't work for them. 

Gentle leader does provide a training video with their kits and they have videos on their website. If you're using it properly and the dog is an appropriate age, there should not be any risk of whiplash. I'm pretty confident in saying I think those claims are overstated. 

An equivalent but better alternative to the Gentle Leader brand is Halti. Our trainer recommended it because it provides a better fit over the dogs muzzle. We were skeptical but took it on faith and ordered it. She was right. It's built a little better and does fit over a dogs muzzle better. It's no more expensive than the GL to boot! Our 70 lb golden wears a size 2 for reference.


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## Kaila (Feb 1, 2012)

RKA said:


> For the dogs that respond to this type of collar, it usually takes them a day or two to get it (but you will see results immediately). And you should NOT be using this type of collar on a puppy (<6 months). An older pup won't be harmed.


Actually, the Gentle Leader is marketed as safe for puppies. This is from the Premier website: "Unlike the choke chain or prong collars, the Gentle Leader Headcollar is safe to use on puppies as young as 8 weeks old. There is very little pressure applied to the dog’s muzzle and no pressure on the throat."

The whiplash-style injury can still occur even in fully grown dogs. I've heard of dogs being attacked out of the blue by another dog who surprised them off-leash and the dog using the GL had serious neck sprain while thrashing, trying to get away from the other dog. Even if you follow the DVD instructions, this situation can still occur (and did, to someone I know who had to retire their service dog because of the injury).

The Halti doesn't solve the problem. It may have a better fit on the dog's muzzle, but that has nothing to do with this issue. The Canny Collar (or other head collars with leash attachments behind the head) are FAR safer and accomplish the same amount of control. They're already very popular in Europe.


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