# HELP, Please: "New Moon Goldens" Reputable Breeder?



## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

jeannettem said:


> I know many people are against the idea of English goldens, but I am asking for help with reputable breeders.


I don't have personal information about the breeder, but I don't know anybody on the forum who's against English-type Goldens (they may not prefer them, but they're not against the idea).

Lots of people on the forum have a problem with selling dogs by color or false claims about English-type or dogs from Europe, but I don't know anybody who's against the type.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

PS - a quick look at their site seems to confirm that you'd be getting a Russian Golden Retriever, not an English one.

I can't find records for the dogs on offa.org to confirm their clearances. It doesn't mean they don't exist, but if they're done in Russia, they may be hard to confirm. There's a dog on k9data with a claim of hip and elbow clearances, but they have no numbers, and there's no information about heart or eye clearances.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

Zosya's dam (Rus Pekos Doris) is listed on k9data as belonging to Silvermine Kennel in Kentucky which has no fewer than 25 (I kid you not) breeding females listed on the site, not including her. I guess she was recently sold or retired? Also, a quick scan of k9data shows that she was bred at around 18 months. That girl's other parent was also bred young.

The red flags are cropping up pretty thick here. It's starting to look like one miller is helping create another.


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

Well their 'Zosya' female seems to be missing hip clearances alltogether - elbows are done but hips, not listed. Which to me means likely they were done, failed and so aren't advertised as such.
Pedigree: JunCH.RUS Rus Pekos Zosya

Their other dog, 'Layla' only has heart listed with OFFA - no hips or elbows, it does say on her site they are excellent (hips) and normal for elbows, I'm guessing with an overseas clearance though. 

A 'fair' rating is not the total picture. Remember the dog's genes are PART of the picture, and how the dog was raised, fed and so on is the other part. You can have excellent hips on both parents etc. and still have a displastic dog if you do the wrong things (there is one breeder website, they have had FOUR females bought with the intention of breeding, all of them have had good hip clearances for generations back and all of them are displastic, spayed and they get another female, yet the siblings are all fine). You can have displastic parents and in some cases get an excellent on a dog - again depends. You need to look at the siblings, background and so on of the dogs in question before tossing one dog as a fair rating.

On that note, personally I'd go with Tanglewood simply because the dogs there have more of a background of clearances, and they seem to be more active with their dogs. Another route to consider is looking in Canada, where there are more light coloured dogs.


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## tippykayak (Oct 27, 2008)

I'd rather see a fair dog with a strong background of multi-generational clearances than an HD-A dog bred underage, imported from Russia or Kazakhstan, with no clear history.

A single clearance does not tell you as much nor provide as much reliability as a 5+ generation history of passing clearances.


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## jeannettem (Dec 10, 2010)

Hmmm... she just sent me all of the clearances (yes, they are Russian). I found Silvermine earlier in my search and dismissed them VERY quickly. Yikes. I am currently looking through the paperwork she sent. It looks like (according to the paperwork) they were all imported within the last year or so. Interesting.


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

Another option would be to check with Kyon in Canada, they have a lot of dogs and are a bigger operation but do clearances and such. They may have one of their boys siring a litter with a smaller breeder near you, or know of others who have more english type goldens. I'd avoid anything to do with Silvermine based on ethics, the breeder you're dealing with may totally be on the up and up but going to Silvermine for a dog says a lot....


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## HiTideGoldens (Dec 29, 2009)

I agree with tippykayak that I don't think anyone is against English type goldens. In general, I have a problem with people who breed dogs solely for color and/or market their dogs as "English cream/creme/platinum/white" dogs and sell the puppies for exorbitant amounts of money. I also have a problem with people who claim dogs from any type (American, English or otherwise) are healthier than another. 

I wouldn't immediately have a problem getting a puppy from a dog/bitch with OFA Fair hips (in fact our Chloe's mother has OFA Fair hips). I would look at the generations prior and check to see if there is a history of clearances for the dog and bitch being bred.


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## jeannettem (Dec 10, 2010)

Thanks for your input, I appreciate it. Other than Tanglewood, are there any other reputable English golden breeders that you're aware of? I have been looking at Wyndance Goldens, as well as Lucky Lady Farms. Thanks, and Happy Holidays!


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## eeneymeanymineymo (Oct 5, 2009)

Taken from the OFA website in regards to a dog/bitch with a Fair hip rating:

"Do not ignore the dog with a fair hip evaluation. The dog is still within normal limits. For example; a dog with fair hips but with a strong hip background and over 75% of its brothers and sisters being normal is a good breeding prospect. A dog with excellent hips, but with a weak family background and less than 75% of its brothers and sisters being normal is a poor breeding prospect."


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## Bender (Dec 30, 2008)

English Goldens in North America - Litters - Breeders - Stud Dogs

Just found this, should help. Again double check clearances and so on but they require a lot of the breeders that are listed, so it should help. Silvermine is not listed there, oddly enough, but Tanglewood is....


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

My mentor was adamant that she would never breed any dog with Fair hips and she never did. My 2nd golden came from at least 5 generations of clear hips and though she was Fair at 24 months, she was mildly dysplastic in one hip at 44 months. She was still jumping in the obedience ring at almost 12 and never limped. She had many famous dogs in her pedigree ...

My "foundation" bitch came from a long line of Fair bitches. She, herself, is a Good. Of the two girls that she produced, that I kept for potential breeding, one is Fair and one is Good(both produced by Good sires). The Fair girl in turn produced a bitch I kept who is Good(also produced by a Good sire). As said earlier, I would rather have a Fair from 5 generations plus of hip clearances then an excellent with nothing behind it.

I work with a technician whose bitch was sired by an Excellent out a Good dam and she is Fair!


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## TRE (Feb 11, 2011)

*Lips waving in the wind.*

Asking questions about people you don't know to people you don't know that voice opinions without ground about people they don't know.


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## Sally's Mom (Sep 20, 2010)

TRE said:


> Asking questions about people you don't know to people you don't know that voice opinions without ground about people they don't know.


What??? Three years later, please explain...


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