# *Desperately* Hungry



## Tayla's Mom (Apr 20, 2012)

Poop eating is not a hunger issue as far as I know. Behavior or medical issuse perhaps. I know Goldens are always big eaters, but could she seem hungry for a reason other than actual hunger. Is she bored?


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## Alaska7133 (May 26, 2011)

Have you tried giving vegies with meals? My boys are a bit overweight, like 5# each. So I've been giving them a 1/2 can per day of green beans. They like the beans and it fills them up. Maybe it might help her a bit with feeling full, if that's the real issue. I'll assume you've tested for thyroid issues. I've had pets with voracious appetites and it's the thyroid causing it.


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

I think you should have her thyroid checked if it hasn't been lately. Many Goldens have thyroid issues, usually it shows as hypothyroidism but your dog sounds like she might be hyperthyroid. I'm not sure what else to suggest, other than finding really filling foods for her so that she feels fuller during the day. You could try giving her more fiber in her diet, but that can be a problem if it messes up her digestive tract. I'm hoping others will chime in here. Good luck!


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## MGMF (May 13, 2009)

She is a big girl. Don't feed your dog due to hunger. Find the right amount that works for her to look the ideal weight and stick with it. You should only increase or decrease food amounts if they are over or under weight. There is no excuse for either as you control it. Some dogs are just piggies. Eating fast does not mean they are still hungry and want more. I have one who gets 2 1/2 cups a day and is at a perfect weight around 64lbs. If I feed her because she was showing hungry I would have to feed her 30lbs of dog food a day. One time when the food can was left unlocked she ate about 10lbs of food and would have kept going if she wasn't stopped. Her belly looked like she was full of puppies but she was still eating. She is my only one like that at this time. The others would stop at some point but this particular one is never satisfied. Pooped eating is more of a bad habit they can get into vs. not being feed enough. It is hard to break so make sure you pick up each time she goes. Don't increase unless she looks underweight. Some dogs also take a bit after they eat to get their heads out of the bowl until they finally settle it is empty. Eating really fast is not a sign of hunger either. If your dog is ideal weight then don't let your dogs guilt you into feeding them more. Many people have problems if their dogs intake of food is small. Example: I have some goldens that have only needed 1 1/2 cups a day to maintain a perfect weight. If your dog is overweight it is your fault and not fair to the dog. Many will say it is because they don't get enough exercise. Well if they can't that is fine but you need to lower the intake due to the activity level, it is that simple. Many switch to lower calorie food so they can feed more. I just don't see how that makes sense. Find a good diet and adjust up or down if they don't look the ideal weight. Make sure you find someone who is very familiar with an ideal weight of a golden and give you an outside view where she needs to be. Many owner feed more for guilt or because they just can't see what they need to change. You can also post pictures and the forum will help. No matter how small the amount that doesn't matter as long as she is at a healthy weight.


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## MGMF (May 13, 2009)

Thyroid should always be checked to make sure she isn't having a problem. You still would control the diet to make sure they are an ideal weight. If they were to find out she had a thyroid issue they would medicate her. The food advice would not change. You feed her for an ideal weight. When the medication is added you would continue to watch how much you feed her and adjust if she needs and increase or decrease. Ideal weight is ideal weight no matter if you are adjusting for activity level or medical changes. 

The dog I exampled above that will eat endlessly does not and never had a thyroid issue.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I was going to say that other than our first golden who had kidney problems all his life and our collie during that time when his intestines went to hell in handbasket, we've never owned a dog who didn't act like he was being STARVED TO DEATH if he knew there was food around.  

My golden eats 2 cups a day, sometimes less than that if I'm loading up on treats. The treats you give your dog adds to the amount of food they eat a day and can make your dog overweight. 

He's 23.5 and thankfully on the south side of the 80 lb mark at 78. 

Our 25" collie is about perfect at 55lbs... he gets about 3 cups a day. 

This is a dumb question, but why would celiac dictate what goes into your dog's food? You don't eat the food.... grains actually might make your dog feel full with less to eat.


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## quilter (Sep 12, 2011)

With our last dog, we switched him to a weight management food when he was older. Fewer calories for the same volume. It worked well - it felt like he got a full meal and he maintained a good weight.


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## Chaos (Nov 13, 2012)

Thank you for all of your replies! 

I think it is important to now mention that Honey stands at 27.5 inches at the shoulder; yes, she is a BIG girl! I have been varying her food intake so as NOT to put her over the ideal weight that the orthopedist mentioned (preventative measure due to past knee injuries and a family history of CCL tears). This is *very* important to me.

The poop eating is a new phenomenon. I know that it can sometimes indicate nutritional issues which is why, when coupled with both her behavior (wired; out of character) and her ravenous appetite I decided that maybe it's time to change something, or get her checked out. I'm very familiar with dogs who are convinced they don't get fed enough. 

Now that you mention it, her coat has been growing (or not growing) funny as well. If I recall correctly, that can point to thyroid issues as well?

Thanks again everyone!

Edited to add: regarding the Celiac question: let me tell you, it is very easy to accidentally allow the creatures who live with you to lick you on the face (especially when those creatures are wiggly balls of happiness). ;-) It doesn't seem like a big deal, but when you deal with it everyday it is much simpler to find a food that is safe for everyone (and I don't get sick as often).


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## Vinnie's Mom (Jun 9, 2012)

I don't have advise as I'm not an expert, bit I would love to see a picture. 


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Chaos*

I'D love to see a pic too and let us know what you find out at the vet!


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

> Edited to add: regarding the Celiac question: let me tell you, it is very easy to accidentally allow the creatures who live with you to lick you on the face (especially when those creatures are wiggly balls of happiness). ;-) It doesn't seem like a big deal, but when you deal with it everyday it is much simpler to find a food that is safe for everyone (and I don't get sick as often).


But you don't swallow their drool. I have friends with celiac disease and it's specifically related to food they eat, not what they handle or get on their skin.


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## Chaos (Nov 13, 2012)

Megora said:


> But you don't swallow their drool. I have friends with celiac disease and it's specifically related to food they eat, not what they handle or get on their skin.


Everyone has different thresholds with regard to how much gluten they can tolerate. Aside from the gastro. symptoms, celiac also manifests in the skin form for me, Dermatitis Herpetiformis. Individuals with "DH" are much more sensitive to gluten touching their skin. As far as the drool goes: my dogs sometimes get me on the lips. Celiac can be triggered by gluten which touches any kind of mucous membrane. You might be surprised how easily gluten can get into your mouth! My goal is to minimize how much I get sick; removing gluten from my dogs diet helped me and hasn't seemed to hurt them (they've been grain free for 3+ years).

I will search for some pictures of her!


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## Chaos (Nov 13, 2012)

Hopefully these links work...

Screen Shot 2012-11-13 at 5.55.13 PM.png

Screen Shot 2012-11-13 at 5.58.35 PM.png

Screen Shot 2012-11-13 at 6.03.42 PM.png

These photos are fairly recent, though it was clearly much warmer outside than it is now! Ok excluding the one in the snow: that was last winter.


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## vcm5 (Apr 20, 2011)

I just cut Riley down a little bit because he wasn't getting enough exercise during the week of the hurricane rain. Literally the next day after I cut him down he started eating poop! I've never seen him do that before and I immediately put him back up after a couple days and he stopped. So weird!


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

Chaos, beautiful dog! She is big. She should meet Max, our other really big GR. I think he's 27 inches at the shoulder. Hope everything works out ok--please come back and let us know.


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## MGMF (May 13, 2009)

When trying to find the ideal size for your dog don't worry about weight. It is more important to go by how they look. 
When it comes to diet poop eating usually develops from the lack of nutritional needs vs. being hungry. 
You may see them eat it if they are bored. Just don't let it become a habit. 
Lets just face it dogs are animals and will eat and roll in anything disgusting. 
There mothers ate theirs when they were babies. 
The only real fix is clean it up as soon as they go. Make sure you offer a good diet no matter how little they need. Don't make a fuss when they eat it. Sometime your attention will attract them as negative eeeewww, yuck is still attention.


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## MikaTallulah (Jul 19, 2006)

Buddy is always hungry and is a table/counter surfer. He already weights 95 pounds- He gained 5 pounds over the summ because he does not do hot weather! So in a month or 2 he should be 88-90 pounds. I won't cut his intake he will just get more exercise. His ortho. weight wants him at no higher than 90- Long term! He does not need to eat more food- He gets 2 cups of kibble daily plus fresh fruits and veggies. His coat and body show he is fine so the can be hungry! 

Buddy and the yorkies love deer raisinettes! They will also eat other animal poop but deer is their fave! So I try to stay on top of the yard about that. Thankfully they don't like their own or cat poop. If she like her own poop- Clean it up ASAP.

Have you tried food additives to discourage the poop eating such as pineapple, etc.?


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## Vinnie's Mom (Jun 9, 2012)

She's a beautiful girl!


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## MGMF (May 13, 2009)

Chaos, Such cute pictures. She sure does look happy. Those pictures are difficult to use if you are looking for a size opinion. Can't use the snow pic as it is to long ago. Send one from top and side standing up could help.


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## jimla (Oct 9, 2008)

The first picture of your girl shows that she has a nice waist. What is her name? I think her weight is close to ideal. Our Elliot is a tall boy too, 27 inches at the shoulders. His ideal weight is 85 lbs. It is important to keep the big dogs lean to reduce joint problems. We feed Elliot 3 cups of grain-free Fromm a day and he eats fast too. Roxy is our poop eater but she looses interest if I keep the yard clean.


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## OutWest (Oct 6, 2011)

Am adding a link to this chart. It will help you evaluate her body on an ongoing basis and you tweak her intake accordingly. I find it very helpful: http://www.purinaveterinarydiets.com/resources/Files/dog_chart.pdf


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## heureuse_jesuis (Oct 10, 2012)

*Food thoughts*

Hello Chaos,

My Ryley was 27.5 inches... Very tall - at his heaviest he was 86 and with that frame never looked tubby.

Have you thought about raw feeding? With extra veggies? Ryley was not hungry but the raw improved his coat and eyes and seemed to fill him up. His ideal weight of 74 - 76 he was eating 3/4pound mixed raw twice a day.

At 72 he was skinny with ribs sticking out - this is in case anyone says he was overweight in any of the 70 lb range..


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## Chaos (Nov 13, 2012)

Thanks guys!

Her name is Honey... and she is definitely a very happy girl. I could (and do!) learn a lot from her on a daily basis about living in the moment, gratitude, patience and the list goes on. They are such great companions. 

It's silly that I didn't immediately start thinking about changes I might've made around the time that I began noticing a shift in her mood/behavior. I was actually thinking of my other dog (also a Golden) who has been EXTREMELY itchy... this started around the same time I began noticing changes in Honey's mannerisms. I switched the variety of food I was giving them from Taste of the Wild Pacific Stream formula to TOTW High Prairie right around that time as well. :doh: I think I'm going to try switching them back to see if that resolves the issue. Of course if it doesn't, Honey will have to take a trip over to the vet... much to her displeasure.


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## Wendy427 (Apr 4, 2009)

Chaos said:


> Thanks guys!
> 
> Her name is Honey... and she is definitely a very happy girl. I could (and do!) learn a lot from her on a daily basis about living in the moment, gratitude, patience and the list goes on. They are such great companions.
> 
> It's silly that I didn't immediately start thinking about changes I might've made around the time that I began noticing a shift in her mood/behavior. I was actually thinking of my other dog (also a Golden) who has been EXTREMELY itchy... this started around the same time I began noticing changes in Honey's mannerisms. I switched the variety of food I was giving them from Taste of the Wild Pacific Stream formula to TOTW High Prairie right around that time as well. :doh: I think I'm going to try switching them back to see if that resolves the issue. Of course if it doesn't, Honey will have to take a trip over to the vet... much to her displeasure.


Re the itchiness, search for "ACV" (organic Apple Cider Vinegar) here on the Forum. There are quite a few links. ACV is excellent for any/all itchies, and can be added to their food and swabbed on their skin/fur.


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## Charliethree (Jul 18, 2010)

Just wanted to mention: I have been feeding the same food for quite a while. My female golden mix needed to lose a little weight so I reduced her food. What I didn't realize was that, at about the same time I reduced her food, the company had changed the food and reduced the calories. Of course the 'new' packaging was very similar to the old packaging, so there was nothing to 'alert' me to the change. Poor girl got double 'whammied' and yes, it certainly changed her behavior! she was not a happy camper.


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## Lil_Burke (Aug 14, 2010)

I think every dog is different and it depends on the food too. When we had Sawyer on TOTW (Lamb) he was so skinny so we upped his food to 4 cups a day and he just didn't seem to put on any weight. He is also very active.

We switched him to Acana and he gets 3 cups a day and is now holding a steady weight of 68lbs. I think he was 61-62 before the food switch. I think you just have to try different things and find out what works for you.

And Sawyer always acts like he is starving too. In fact he won't let us sleep in on the weekends until he is fed his breakfast promptly at 6am. He will paw at us and whine until he gets fed. Then he can go back to sleep and so can we.


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## Chaos (Nov 13, 2012)

Thanks everyone! I'm just about to head out to the store to pick up a bag of Acana (gonna try something different :crossfing ), but I wanted to post a picture of Honey from above (boy is she hard to catch holding still!)... I think she's put on a couple pounds since summer. Clearly my fault!

Screen Shot 2012-11-15 at 1.59.50 PM.png

Thank you for helping me figure out what could be going on with my girl.


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## Vinnie's Mom (Jun 9, 2012)

She looks like she's a healthy weight to me. I'm no expert though.


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## Chaos (Nov 13, 2012)

They LOVED the Acana. Hopefully it loves them back!


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## desi.n.nutro (Mar 18, 2011)

It seems like for her size, upping the food was the right way to go. It seems to me that my guys and gals couldn't be begged into eating enough when they were puppies and young adults. Then, like turning on a switch, they seemed to all of the sudden start acting like I was starving them. I would check the Thyroid but rest easy that it might just be age. The nutro website has feeding charts based on activity levels and ideal body image if you want to check those out. And isn't Celiac primarily about wheat and wheat gluten? There are a lot of foods that have good fiber with all the benefits and don't have wheat or gluten. Mine uses oatmeal.


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## Chaos (Nov 13, 2012)

Well, it looks like, so far, switching to Acana was a very good decision. Honey has completely stopped inhaling grass, is acting much less frantic and seems to be back to her happy, content self. The itchy dog is itching less, but I am definitely going to try the organic apple cider vinegar with her. I appreciate everyones help and I am happy that they appear to be feeling better. 

Regarding the celiac: Celiac is an autoimmune disease triggered by the gluten peptide in specific grains: wheat, barley, rye and depending on the person and their disease process, sometimes oats (and a few other less common grains). I react to the gluten in oats like it is wheat, barley or rye gluten.


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## Jennifer1 (Mar 31, 2012)

I have celiac disease as well, so totally understand your dilemma!
For those unfamiliar, it takes only 20ppm of gluten to make someone ill. Or even those who don't get physically sick from that low level (me) you still get intestinal damage each and every time you get exposed-which can eventually lead to malabsorption issues or even cancer.
A vague idea of what 20ppm is: take a slice of bread and cut it into 5000 pieces. Just 1 of those crumbs is enough to make someone ill.
The issue with dog food is that if you get it on your hands (from feeding or getting licked) and don't wash your hands before you eat something like a sandwich, you can contaminate the sandwich with the residual gluten on your hands.

To the OP, I feed my guys Solid Gold Sun Dancer. It's not grain free, but is gluten free (it has quinoa and something else) I'll also give them Solid Gold Barking at the Moon, which is grain free. I just like the more medium protein levels of the sundancer.


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