# No More Fun Bumpers



## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Went field training with my group for the first time in a month (life got complicated for many of us). It poured all morning and we came back drenched. Anyway, Scout ran beautifully nice long marks, brought them right to side position. She's very fast and fun to watch.

As I have mentioned before she is a very up dog, and my experienced friend told me that with more up dogs like hers and mine it is not a good idea to always be throwing fun bumpers. In fact, she no longer throws fun ones anymore and suggests I don't. And you know what--I think it makes sense. Because you don't want the dog to expect them at a show, and because at least for Scout, going to get them is the fun itself. So, I think no more fun bumpers for us.

We also did a nice double which got us some complements. Go Scout! Plus a friend who told he loves to watch Scout run because she is pretty and driven. (Yes I am still grinning).

I also picked me up SmartWorks Volume I book and have started the long and slow, careful process of teaching her to handle. It is an intimidating thing to train for your first time, which is why I am sticking to this book. I spent some time teaching right and left back casts, just recently added the side piles. It's been interesting trying to get her to focus on the back pile and not the sides, but she is slowly getting better. Right I'm now only working her facing the pile until she has that learned, then I will try with her facing me and giving left/right back casts.

Keeping our eyes on the prize of running a junior in the spring. :crossfing


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## Swampcollie (Sep 6, 2007)

I think you may find that fun bumpers will help a lot when you get further into pile work to help the dog relieve stress. Marks are fun, going to piles over and over again can get boring.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

My trainer would agree with Swampcollie. Whenever he's put a lot of pressure on Tito doing pile work or anything else, he breaks it up with a couple of fun bumpers....preferably into water if at all possible!


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

Hmm...good point maybe she just meant on marks. I'll have to ask her. I definitely don't need them on marks and can see the wisdom in preventing her from thinking she gets one after doing a few good marks.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

Fun bumpers are a great way to injure your dog as well. No more fun bumpers for Fisher. He sprained his knee last winter retrieving a fun bumper and we had to take 4 months off training.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

why would he be more likely to sprain/strain something going after a fun bumber vs. a tennis ball or a short mark? Just curious....



K9-Design said:


> Fun bumpers are a great way to injure your dog as well. No more fun bumpers for Fisher. He sprained his knee last winter retrieving a fun bumper and we had to take 4 months off training.


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## EvanG (Apr 26, 2008)

Fun bumpers are a two-edged sword. They can be a great attitude boost for a dog that may be getting too stressed during a training session. Sometimes it's just the right thing to get them back in the game and ready to learn.

More often than not, trainers throw too many fun bumpers, and throw them too far. Why do I say that? Let's look at it logically.

Your dog won't be any happier running 30 yards for one than he would have been had he only run 15-20 feet.
Sometimes we throw a fun bumper because we're so happy with the dog's work, when we should have just praised the dog and put him up thinking about the work, instead of a wild protracted recess.
Sometimes we train on unfamiliar grounds. Throwing numerous, long fun bumpers places the dog at risk physically because he's running with myopic enthusiasm in places where he may risk stepping in a hole, or being stuck by some object...all of which has happened. In those places, keep them very short and limited to only one or two in plain sight.
There is more, of course. But there are more considerations than might normally meet the eye. In reference to #2, we develop our dogs through drill work in order to focus on specific tasks or concepts. As a dog struggles with the work, they get stressed sometimes and really have to try hard to get it right. Now, you finally get there, the dog has success, and you wipe it all away because you just have to throw a fun bumper (or 3 or 4), rather than merely praising your dog genuinely and putting him up with the work as his focus. A good training session was just diminished, and the lesson all but forgotten.

Under #3, I had a nice little girl with 19 Derby points, a qualifying win, and two Amatuer wins break her leg during a wild sprint on unfamiliar ground for a fun bumper. She could never run again and was retired. My client/friend was very sorry he let his emotions overcome his intellect. So, I'm sure, was his dog.

I think you have to be more responsible, and consider what's really best for your dog...even with fun bumpers.

EvanG


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## gabbys mom (Apr 23, 2008)

I like huppies/fun bumpers as a way to relieve stress from force to pile/force fetch/anything really mentally tough. My boy is young and needs a release from the stress. 

As for the ground, yes, easy to miss something in new ground. My trainer has drilled into my head that "we walk a field before we run on it" so we have any idea of rough spots/holes, etc. Obviously, no one is perfect and those things are easy to miss.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 30, 2008)

hotel4dogs said:


> why would he be more likely to sprain/strain something going after a fun bumber vs. a tennis ball or a short mark? Just curious....


Well, a lot of the people I field train with will not let their dogs play with balls because they don't want them to practice the bad mouthing habit. Also, I think terrain plays an important factor--when I throw a fun bumper it is probably out in the brush, but when I play ball I am probably in my backyard or at a grassy park.

I can also say with Scout on fun bumpers she is not required to be steady and having me throw it adds to her enthusiasm level when she races out to get it. Much different from having to watch and wait to be sent on a short mark.

--

I also think the fun bumpers are not helping us on our steadying fight since you do not (or at least I haven't) expect steadiness.


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

I no longer throw tennis balls for Fisher either, unless it's in water or heavy cover. The problem is not him running over the ground it's pouncing on the object in motion when he gets to it. That is how LOTS and LOTS of dogs rupture ACLs. Plant and turn to catch a skidding ball. No more.
Also as Evan pointed out, many people overuse fun bumpers to the point of being detrimental. I see no reason why they should be used as a "reward" for marks -- marks are the reward for marks. Same with blinds, especially if the dog is having a problem with confidence on cold blinds -- after running one successfully you reward him with an in-your-face no brainer toss of a bumper? Why not revel in his success on the blind and no remind him how hard that was by giving him a mark that's impossible to screw up on? Fun bumpers really can wipe out any recollection of the lesson you achieved with your dog.
The only time I really use fun bumpers is during hard drills to relieve tension. It's one fun bumper and back to work. And I hold the collar and let the bumper hit the ground before letting the dog go after it.


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## hotel4dogs (Sep 29, 2008)

We've never used a fun bumper on marks, only on drills. What my trainer does is works Tito in the "obedience field", then after some pressure will toss a fun bumper as far as he can throw it, usually into the clean pond (which is obviously next to the obedience /yardwork field). Then back to work.
So I guess I'm not disagreeing with anyone, just explaining how Dan uses them.
About the tennis balls, I have to wonder. 
No one has a control group study to determine whether or not the dogs who retrieve/mouth tennis balls will mouth birds. People *claim* it can cause a problem, but I have to wonder if the dog would have had a problem anyway. No real way to know.
We've always allowed Tito to retrieve (and yes, chew) tennis balls, we had no plans to do field with him at all so never gave it a second thought. And he has no issues at all mouthing or crunching birds.


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## hollyk (Feb 21, 2009)

Good thought about keeping the fun bumpers short and avoid acrobatic retrieves. We are on day 3 of nick fetch so fun bumpers do relieve the tension. I throw 2 short, less than 10 feet, fun bumpers at the end of the session. So far we are moving though this quickly.


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## EvanG (Apr 26, 2008)

K9-Design said:


> I no longer throw tennis balls for Fisher either, unless it's in water or heavy cover. The problem is not him running over the ground it's pouncing on the object in motion when he gets to it. That is how LOTS and LOTS of dogs rupture ACLs. Plant and turn to catch a skidding ball. No more.
> Also as Evan pointed out, many people overuse fun bumpers to the point of being detrimental. I see no reason why they should be used as a "reward" for marks -- marks are the reward for marks. Same with blinds, especially if the dog is having a problem with confidence on cold blinds -- after running one successfully you reward him with an in-your-face no brainer toss of a bumper? Why not revel in his success on the blind and no remind him how hard that was by giving him a mark that's impossible to screw up on? Fun bumpers really can wipe out any recollection of the lesson you achieved with your dog.
> The only time I really use fun bumpers is during hard drills to relieve tension. It's one fun bumper and back to work. And I hold the collar and let the bumper hit the ground before letting the dog go after it.


I would say you have a good vision of what is and isn't practical about fun bumpers. I sure would not eliminate them. Just use good judgment about them.

EvanG


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## Maxs Mom (Mar 22, 2008)

K9-Design said:


> I no longer throw tennis balls for Fisher either, unless it's in water or heavy cover. The problem is not him running over the ground it's pouncing on the object in motion when he gets to it. That is how LOTS and LOTS of dogs rupture ACLs. Plant and turn to catch a skidding ball. No more.
> Also as Evan pointed out, many people overuse fun bumpers to the point of being detrimental. I see no reason why they should be used as a "reward" for marks -- marks are the reward for marks. Same with blinds, especially if the dog is having a problem with confidence on cold blinds -- after running one successfully you reward him with an in-your-face no brainer toss of a bumper? Why not revel in his success on the blind and no remind him how hard that was by giving him a mark that's impossible to screw up on? Fun bumpers really can wipe out any recollection of the lesson you achieved with your dog.
> The only time I really use fun bumpers is during hard drills to relieve tension. It's one fun bumper and back to work. And I hold the collar and let the bumper hit the ground before letting the dog go after it.


Anney you make a good argument. My Teddi who had her hip replaced, the surgeon said "no tennis balls, no frisbees, nothing where she runs at break neck speeds, stops and turns, or leaps in the air and lands on her hind legs" that is the hardest thing you can do on a dogs body. Now in Teddi's case... she doesn't run at break neck speeds and does not stop fast or turn fast... she turns like a semi truck. LOL So I do throw frisbees for her, I just make sure there is no chance in heck, she is going to try to leap and catch it either. So far (3 years post op THR) she is just Teddi.


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