# The horse thread...2011



## Elisabeth Kazup

I searched back to the end of December and couldn't find the old horse thread so I thought I start a new one.

I finally got to have my first ride of the year yesterday. He was so good! And I was better than last year. Guess my exercising is paying off. I think we're finally past the cold weather and sloppy footing. I think we can really start riding now. And I happy to report that while I remembered what being scared felt like, for the first time I wasn't actually afraid. He even had a little, tiny, mini spook at the lope which didn't bother me. You know the kind where they tilt their head, point an ear toward "IT" and veer a little to the side?! Like that.

I am really sore today, mostly in my upper back/neck/shoulders.

How about everyone else? Riding?


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## Ranger

Sadly, not riding yet! I'm hoping my ankle/achilles tendons heal up enough that i can hop on mid-may. Though my friend had a good point. She asked me how long Virgil has been off work and I said over a year. Then she asked how far can I drop my heels...and my answer was nil. Oops. Not sure how the heck I'm going to stay on when he decides to put on a bucking bronc show or do his hugely extended trot. I need a seatbelt!

Virgil came out of the winter with a nice round belly, though!









Not bad for 16, eh?









Too bad he still has the mentality of a 4 yr old!


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## Maxs Mom

Virgil does look good. Get on a step when you can and start stretching your heels down. However, my old man who was the bucker, I climbed on him in the spring and thought about taking him on the roads (the grass was too soft) however when a car went by past the driveway, we were not to the road yet, I remembered why that was a bad idea. He just let me ride, and was FABULOUS, maybe the time off made Virgil happier too. I don't think I lunged Sayler after the last year we showed. I knew he wouldn't buck me off, he knew I wouldn't piss him off. It was a great relationship. LOL

I am sure this spring I will miss Pete. When the weather is nice, and I have a quiet weekend. I have not sat on a horse since July. I got an email from the girl who has him, she is showing him. It broke my heart, he is MY show horse. I still have serious mixed feelings about giving him away, but I do know he has a great home, and I am glad she is showing him, he should still be in the ring. He is a NICE horse!!! 

He's just still MY horse in my heart. 

I may call my trainer and ask if there is something to ride if I get to one of those weekends where I miss riding.


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## Megora

I am debating about riding tonight or taking Jacks with me to hang out at the barn. I probably will just go out to groom and fuss... 

I've been pretty much off from riding the past 2 months because of illness (pneumonia). Then I was worried about him this winter too and didn't ride him very much, just in case he wasn't feeling OK. He got very thin which isn't like him at all.  We had him wormed and I hope that was just it. He is eating normally, has normal poop, and is bright eyed and active. <- They actually had to move him from his usual stall because he was fighting with a new horse. 

I'm pretty sure I'm going to be all noodly when I get on him again. And of course he still bucks and rears...


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Ann, that would break my heart too. I wish we were closer, I think you would really like Daz. We're 35 miles SW of Saline. Kind of far for any regular riding. But the offer stands.

I've been lunging Harry even though he's not a bucker. I like to get them going without a rider for the first few times. He was really winded Sunday after about 15 minutes. I don't think I was on him for more than 5 minutes. Amazing how sore I got and still am!


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## Maxs Mom

Penny's Mom said:


> Ann, that would break my heart too. I wish we were closer, I think you would really like Daz. We're 35 miles SW of Saline. Kind of far for any regular riding. But the offer stands.


And it is a VERY generous offer. I have not forgotten. Not sure yet I am 'ready' to ride. I really am not missing the riding.... just my horse. My dogs are keeping me really busy right now. 

{{HUGS}} You are so kind!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I know what you mean Ann, and I understand. When I lost Rocket I would have given everything to have him back in the barn even if it meant I could never ride or drive him again. I just wanted to be able to see him and take care of him.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Michigan had another decent day today...that makes 2 in a row. Harry and I rode way out back on the bridle path. I wanted to go all the way around but the neighbors on the north path got a new pit bull and he was right by the fence. I don't know how the dog would react to a horse walking by or if Harry would be afraid if the dog made a fuss. We rode further than ever before and turned back. It was lovely. I don't know how I'm going to handle the meet and greet with the dog. I really want to be able to ride all the way around and back to the barn.


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## coppers-mom

I am so sorry there is an obstacle in your way (pit bull).
Would the neighbors be willing to come out with him and make sure all is well while you ride by at first?
Make sure you face Harry towards the dog as long as it is making a fuss. They tend to get more aggressive if the horse is moving away and the horse gets more worried (scared) if the dog is behind them. Most (but not all) dogs will back down if the horse is facing them.

My friend got bucked off a couple of months ago because she turned and ran from some dogs that came after us. The horse's energy and fear escalated into a buck fest once they headed away. The dogs actually stayed and gave me heck, but backed down pretty quickly once I managed to keep the horse facing them.


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## Megora

I think you are smart in not testing the situation alone. 

My horse is afraid of hay rolls (I'm not so country that I know the proper word for them... ). And one of the few times I went flying was when we were outside and he saw the rolls in the field across the road. He must think they are aliens. Or something. 

But I have known people who've gone out and nobody has known anything happened until the horses come back home again without their riders.


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## Ranger

Everyone make sure to keep your cell phone ON YOUR PERSON when riding! It's no good having your cell phone on a saddle bag if you ever get separated from your horse!

I've totally been neglecting my horse for the past 2 weeks. He was supposed to get dewormed last weekend and I've been too busy studying to take 2 hours of my day to go deworm him. Poor boy. He'll be fine, it just makes me feel super guilty. I can't wait til 4pm on Friday...I'll be done finals and will be zipping out to the barn to spend a few hours with Virge-man. A bran mash, apples, carrots, molasses, and a loooong grooming session with a shedding blade! I can't wait!


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## Maxs Mom

Happens a lot when people ride out... the horse comes home first. 

YEARS ago a lady who owned a barn went out for a ride (pre cell phones) by herself and came off her horse. Broke her hip. She had to drag herself all the way back to the barn and call for help. She was alone... things we should not do. She was a TOUGH old bird. She died close to 100, survived colon cancer, breast cancer (both breasts) and falling off a horse on her own. It was rumored she killed her husband. I don't know if any truth to that but I would not put it past her. LOL She was TOUGH!!!! 

I am not a trail fan, but I do admit a nice spring hack in the country side sounds appealing (or in the fall) My horses were always too barn bound.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Our 'trail', what we call the bridle path has the farm fence on one side (all around her 10 acres) and the hot wire pasture fence on the other side making a lane about 20' wide. It's kept mowed and we spread the manure on it so it's soft and lush with grass. The dog's property backs up to about 200 feet on the side, way in the back. Fortunately, although we're about 1/2 mile from the house, we're always in sight.

My SIL said the guy is a 'good guy' so next time we want to ride back there, I'm going to go to his house and let him know. I'm sure he won't mind keeping his dog in check or putting him in if he gets to wild. OTOH, the horse's back pasture is right across the bridle path from the dog so they probably 'know' him already. I'm just not sure if the dog will charge the fence when we ride by and become an attack monster. 

Copper's Mom, what do you use for a saddle bag? I was thinking I should make a simple drawstring pouch to hang from my saddle horn; just big enough for my camera, my phone and a soda for insulin shock.


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## coppers-mom

My horn saddle bag is two sided and insulated since I tend to wander quite a ways off and always have to carry dog snacks, horse snacks and me snacks. They do have smaller ones and even ones that fit on the cantle and are much smaller. It is a matter of preference I think. Mine is a little bulky, but I am used to it and don't find it to be a bother and I sure do like the snacks and drinks. I'll check the brand when I get home since it escapes me right now.:doh:

You can get a phone pouch that attaches to your belt and is quite secure too. I got both my horn bag and my cell phone pouch at a local tack shop. I'm sure yours would love to have you come in and see how much you can improve the economy.

Since your neighbor is a "good guy" it would be a good idea to have him with the dog when you decide to go that way. Hopefully the dog will quickly learn to leave you alone. Most have in my experience.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Thanks for the information. I don't really have a tack shop nearby so I'll check the catalogs. Most of the shops are 30-50 miles away so it's easier to just pay shipping and the shops are geared for showing not trail riding.

I'll have to figure out something for the phone. I don't wear belts, usually don't have pockets. I'll have to sew on some pockets with velcro closing or fix up something to tie onto my boot.

Here's some photos from our ride. This one is not quite all the way out back. Daz was over to our right; Harry was looking at him. I don't know why it turned out so small. 










I love this one. DD is schooling her horse and Penny is just hangin' around.


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## coppers-mom

I love the "view between the ears".

I believe the make a cell phone holder that straps to your ankle that works well for english riders and those without pockets. Check out horse.com. I believe that is the magazine I have seen it in. I'll look later and see if that is it.

Happy riding to you.


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## DNL2448

*Pasture Decorator*

I had horses most of my life, until I moved back to Oregon. I miss them terribly, and wanted to get one when we purchased our home in October. DH is not a big horse person, so is against getting one. However, our friend “gave” us one to graze our 7 acres (can you say getting a horse, the sneaky way;-). She is a retired roping horse at the young age of 30. We still have a lot of work to do on the fencing, but that will have to wait until the spring finally gets here. 

Here is Buttons...


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## Megora

Laura - beautiful picture! And by goodness that horse looks good for somebody so old! What a sweetie - and it looks like she likes dogs too<: Why is she named Buttons? Or does she have spots elsewhere that I'm not seeing in the pic? 

Question I have for any horse people out there... and I think Ranger you mentioned this happened with your horse? 

My guy was wormed in early February and again in April and his poop is fine. 

But this was the first year he came out of winter really thin. Or I think he's thin because he generally has a belly after winter. I know he's lost a bit of his muscle tone from not being worked too much (I ride him, but that's not the same as actually working him every other day like we used to), but he's definitely lost weight too. 

It's a good thing that he's lighter because of his various problems (he has arthritis around his shoulders and knees and has had ligament issues), and he looks GREAT (next time I'm out to the barn I'll take updated pics). 

I've asked my barn lady to keep an eye on him - and she's not alarmed. She even took me for a walk around to show me some of the other horses who came out of winter a bit lighter. But this is completely different for _him_ and I'm worried. 

He just turned 25 (May 11 was his birthday). 

Oh and omghjdjksh.... >.< 

I guess to keep my worries about my horse's health in check and realistic, the vet was over treating another horse at the farm for a ruptured abcess in his neck. That has got to be the most disgusting and stomach upsetting thing I've ever seen. It was like an open wound and the insides (flesh and muscle stuff) were bulging out. :yuck::yuck::yuck:


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## Karen519

*Ranger*

Ranger

Have fun with Virge-man and that is a great point you made about having your cell phone on your person!!


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## Megora

Just thought I'd throw this out here since I'm feeling a little depressed and sad today... 

My guy's mom is in her mid-30's and she's starting to go a little senile. She's not drinking on her own. I saw her mother go through this many years ago when she was about the same age. 

And my guy's half sister died two weeks ago (I just found out). She came in from the fields and just collapsed. They think it was heat stroke? These horses have shade and water in the fields and aren't left out too long, but this still happened. She was only 20.

My horse is healthier and in better shape than he's been in a long time. But it's scary that things can go bad so fast with these guys. 

Remember to give your horses hugs and kisses - and spoil them with all the new blankets and apple oat treats that they need.


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## Ranger

Amen, Megora. You just never know...

Glad to hear your boy is healthy and doing well. I've got a soft spot for those chestnut geldings, myself. I just got back from the barn and seeing Virgil...he's putting some weight on and is starting to look way better. His coat is blooming so hopefully the fat starts covering his ribs soon!


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## Megora

Random comment but I realized two things:

1. My golden has absolutely no fear of horses. Possibly because he thinks they are dogs. Hence he will walk beneath my horse. He will flop down and show his belly to my horse. He will try to sniff my horse's stuff. 

And he has no idea why I'm reaching in and yanking him away. 

And he didn't get why I freaked out when he went anywhere near two horses that I know kick and bite dogs...

2. My golden apparently has a sibling rivalry with my horse. He doesn't like being locked outside of the bullpen when I'm in there with my horse. He will lunge forward and try to walk between me and my horse. 

And I'm clearly insane for taking my dog out to the barn since he was such a little pest today. :doh::doh::doh:

My horse looks GREAT!!! As I said in previous post, I'm so happy to be able to work him in the bullpen without seeing any stiffness on his right side.

And it was a beautiful riding day today (though I didn't ride because of pest). 60 degrees. Felt like October - but in a nice way.


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## coppers-mom

I spent most of Thursday evening (until Midnight), most of Saturday and about 5 - 6 hours Sunday helping a friend with a sick horse. He is a senior (age unknown) and was having a flare-up of laminitis. She stalled him with no fan and he overheated to point of incipient heatstroke. We hosed and cooled him and he got better Thurday and then started overheating again Saturday.

Here's the point of my story - he got so hot becasue he became a "non-sweater". Anhydrosis - a term I had read, but really paid no attention to. The most likely triggers are heat, humidity and pain...... She ordered something named One-AC that is supposed to be THE treatment for this, but it won't be here until today at best. One vet told us to give him two beers - the darker the better. We have cooler weather thanks to Lee and after a few days of electrolyte supplementation and Guiness Stout) he has expensive taste) this old fellow started sweating some yesterday.:crossfing

The vet also recommended he be started on Pergolide (spelling?) a drug for Cushings. She says it will cause no harm and may help. He has some muscle mass loss and a patchy harcoat earlier this year. It seems many seniors benefit from this drug. Megora - it might be a good idea to see what your vet thinks of trying pergolide on your good looking senior. It sounds like some of the same symptoms my friend's horse has/had. His joints creak audibly and she thinks it will help with his general "ageitis". I'd better not let her hear me get up from a squat or she'll have me on it too.

Copper only "roo'ed" a few times and it was most often when I got Cotton out to go for a ride. That old fellow sure did love our trail rides.


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## Megora

> The vet also recommended he be started on Pergolide (spelling?) a drug for Cushings. She says it will cause no harm and may help. He has some muscle mass loss and a patchy harcoat earlier this year. It seems many seniors benefit from this drug. Megora - it might be a good idea to see what your vet thinks of trying pergolide on your good looking senior. It sounds like some of the same symptoms my friend's horse has/had. His joints creak audibly and she thinks it will help with his general "ageitis". I'd better not let her hear me get up from a squat or she'll have me on it too


I'll keep that in mind.... 

I think the main reason why my guy lost his muscle mass is because I stopped riding/working him 3 times a week because of him reinjuring his suspensary ligament back in the summer of 2009. He has other things going on with him including arthritis in his neck/shoulder which is why we usually have a chiropractor work on him every month or every other month. The neck/shoulder means he has a hard time flexing on the right side and may be stiff when he overdoes it. <- The nice thing is he hasn't seen the chiropractor in 2 or 3 months and looked sound and loose yesterday.  

And he's feeling good since he practically kicked the wall down behind him when he heard a lawnmower get too close outside.  I'm so glad I don't have to pay for damage that my horse does to his stalls, because ack. The wall is alluminum and that's buckled. The glass was broken. And the wall is partially peeled away from the stall.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

So sorry for all the senior woes. My darling Rocket the Wonder Horse had Cushing's and foundered repeatedly. I spent time everyday nursing him, changing wraps. He had abscesses. I finally ended his suffering Nov 10, 2001. 

On a bright note, here's a picture of us loping yesterday.


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## Megora

Gorgeous<: 

And I want that bridle.


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## Ranger

ooh nice pic!

coppers- mom: that sounds awful! poor horse and poor owner, too. We had a horse up here who had anhydrosis and she had to be especially careful at summer horse shows. Though I saw the horse again ten years later (last summer) and she was sweating, so who knows what happened there.

Megora - it's hard seeing the older ones lose their toplines, eh? My guy's in the same boat. I was looking through his pics yesterday and saw his passport photo. WAY different than how he looks now and it's enough to break my heart. But, I just keep thinking back to 2006 when the vet told me I'd be lucky if he was able to stay pasture sound and not have to be euthanized by winter...and realize how lucky I am to still have him. It's hard seeing them get old. Virge is only 16 but compared to the fire-breathing 4 year old he was when I bought him...it can be pretty sad.

On the plus side, he's putting on weight and looking good!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Thanks! I love it too! This was a dress rehearsal with the new bridle, breast collar and reins. I decided I don't like the reins...too much silver. So those are going back and I've ordered a different set. AND much cheaper without as much silver. DH picked out the ones in the picture. I should know better than to let him pick...too masculine. Sackett Ridge Saddlery, btw.



Megora said:


> Gorgeous<:
> 
> And I want that bridle.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Ranger, he's looking great. And I can see how you wouldn't want him any leaner. He's a gorgeous color and love his shiny coat. What did you decide on as the best way to put weight on him?


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## coppers-mom

Penny's Mom said:


> So sorry for all the senior woes. My darling Rocket the Wonder Horse had Cushing's and foundered repeatedly. I spent time everyday nursing him, changing wraps. He had abscesses. I finally ended his suffering Nov 10, 2001.
> 
> On a bright note, here's a picture of us loping yesterday.


I think I'll just take the entire setup and put me in that saddle.


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## Ranger

Penny's Mom said:


> Ranger, he's looking great. And I can see how you wouldn't want him any leaner. He's a gorgeous color and love his shiny coat. What did you decide on as the best way to put weight on him?


Thanks! The BO moved the hay-thief out and put in another super slow eater so Virgil is finally getting his portion of hay. I think that's the main reason he's gained weight. His grain portion for the past month has been:
- 2 scoops 12% complete feed
- 1 scoop BOSS
- 1-2 scoops Equine Power 2000 (which has flax, hulls, etc. It looks like garden dirt)
- 1/4 cup canola oil
and his joint supplement + vit/minerals. I water the heck out of it so the flax doesn't bother him and so far, so good. It gets very soupy but he's happy slurping it up! Sometimes I'll throw in a handful of sweet feed as a treat, but I try to keep his sugars low due to his arthritis and joint issues in his fetlock. 










It's not a ton of grain because I'm always a little leery about feeding too much. I think it's maybe a pound or two but it's doing the trick. Virgil likes to smear it all over his face, the edge of the bucket, and my clothes. He's a treat, that's for sure! :


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Wow, that looks like a bowl of oatmeal with raisins, almonds and milk.

And yes, my horses use my clothing as a napkin too...especially with wormer!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Let me know when you're in the neighborhood...Harry loves everybody! 

Our dress rehearsal was in advance of going to a show this weekend. I just can't be ready to leave day after tomorrow. I'm not used to the new set up for one thing, have ordered a different set of reins and know that Penny wouldn't be able to come. DH would have to stay home and take care of her and he's kind of a ditz when it comes to animals. Another show in October...aiming for that one now.



coppers-mom said:


> I think I'll just take the entire setup and put me in that saddle.


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## Megora

Ranger said:


> Megora - it's hard seeing the older ones lose their toplines, eh? My guy's in the same boat. I was looking through his pics yesterday and saw his passport photo. WAY different than how he looks now and it's enough to break my heart. But, I just keep thinking back to 2006 when the vet told me I'd be lucky if he was able to stay pasture sound and not have to be euthanized by winter...and realize how lucky I am to still have him. It's hard seeing them get old. Virge is only 16 but compared to the fire-breathing 4 year old he was when I bought him...it can be pretty sad.


For better or worse, every time I think my guy is starting to look like he's losing his back, I look over at his older brother or his mom and think he's looking pretty darn terrific for an almost 26 year old.  I tell my barn lady every time I see her that I appreciate whatever she's doing. I'm the money lady. She's the miracle worker. 

He still bucks when I ride him and he's that old man in the field that keeps all the young colts under control. He's my sweetmeats. <: 

Virgil looks GREAT!<:

Elisabeth - I love Harry's coloring. And this is probably the gypsy in me, but absolutely love the silver reins with the bridle. I would almost be tempted to ride western just so I could use the shiny bridles you guys get to use. :smooch:


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## Ranger

Ahhhh, there's a huge sale with horse blankets and I ended up buying TWO for Virgil. Both were clearance priced so I nabbed an amigo medium weight (200 g fill) and some sort of amigo rainsheet. Sadly, the only colours left in Virgil's size were RED. So he's got two bright red blankets heading his way! Red on a chestnut...a light liver chestnut. Hmmm. Oh well. The rainsheet cost 50 bucks and the medium weight one was 90. With S&H it came to 155.00!

This is the sheet:
Products - Rugs - Amigo Turnout 600D Lite

and the midweight blanket:
Horseware Ireland USAmigo 1200D Turnout Medium with leg arches Red&

Yeesh! All these sales! I know he's going to need a new rainsheet probably within the year so I couldn't resist getting him one, especiall when it's only 50! Even if it is a bad colour. I figure in a year it'll be so muddy and dirty, no one will know what the original colour actually was!

I need to stop looking for sales though. This makes THREE blankets I've bought my retired boy in the last month. A rambo supreme, amigo midweight, and amigo rainsheet. Someone is spoiled...and for once it's not Ranger!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Not only that, we get to wear glittery clothes. I have a t-shirt that says "I ride western for the show clothes". Love Love Love the swarovski crystals, beads, glitter and rhinestones!



Megora said:


> Elisabeth - I love Harry's coloring. And this is probably the gypsy in me, but absolutely love the silver reins with the bridle. I would almost be tempted to ride western just so I could use the shiny bridles you guys get to use. :smooch:


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## Angelina

Ranger...I am very happy you figured out what was going on with your horse and corrected it so the horse is gaining weight; especially before winter. I was a bit worried about it.

Regarding topline...I'm going thru the same thing...I noticed my 24 year old is getting a little sway backed and no longer has muscling in his hind. I worked so hard to keep him in shape for so many years doing hill work etc., it is very sad to see. I only ride him around the ranch now and no hard work since last fall as he had a neck injury and also revealed arthritis. Here is a picture of him...Mystery the Morab, 24 years old..


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## Ranger

Wow, he is gorgeous!! Absolutely stunning! I love his face: what a nice eye he has and his lower lip looks extremely squeeze-able! (What I do to my my guy all the time). He doesn't look 24 at all!

It is hard to see them age and lose muscle...especially when, as you noted, you've devoted so much time to them in their younger years trying to keep them fit. I'm hoping I'll be able to get Virgil at some point this winter (if i ever heal up!) and hopefully some walk/trot under saddle will help him gain some muscle. If not, well, at least he's still happy and healthy! I hope he looks as good as Mystery the Morab when he's 24!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

He's gorgeous, Angelina. I would never guess he was 24 and I wouldn't have noticed his 'sway' back if you hadn't mentioned! I see more Mor in him than Arab but then again, I'm bias towards Morgans! 

He reminds me a lot of my Daz.


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## Ranger

Going through all pics and found this one...it's one my uncles (not sure which one) showing back in the '70s. 










Thought you guys might like it!


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## coppers-mom

Well, it's time to 'fess up and update you guys.
After Ranger's colic episode and refusal to get on the trailer in the middle of the night to go to the vet I decided I couldn't keep him. I believe he is even older than the 15 my vet says. Yes - I'm an ageist, but it is where I am right now. He is a safe ride and a sweet horse. I sold him to a very nice lady who lives 5 miles from here and she is getting a month's free riding lessons here until she is comfortable ridig him alone.
I finally admitted I am not enough rider for Shelby at this time. I took her to a barn yesterday for a 2 week trial with a trainer and 16 year old girl. Based on their reaction, I don't think she will be coming back.

So, I know I souldn't look at all right now. I really need to destress and get over some of this grief, but.......

Any and all critiques of this guy would be appreciated. I don't like how his topline looks in his side view, but am certainly no authority. She said he will go after dogs who come in his paddock so that is a BIG red flag for me too.

Claywood Farm Registered Morgans Homepage=


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## Ranger

Aw, I'm sorry to hear about Ranger but at least you found him a nice home. Horses are expensive so I think it's important to find one that's a perfect fit. An easy keeper, one who'll trailer, safe to ride...there's certainly nothing wrong with that.

As for 'Adonis'...I'll admit I'll be looking at him with more of a hunter/jumper - even dressage - viewpoint. But here goes:

1. The first pic: it could just be a snap in time, but from this pic he looks like he's a little spirited/hot blooded. Head up, ears alert and stiff through his jaw and neck. And that's with a hackamore. Though this could be just a bad pic (like say a bird startled him), I'm thinking it's more than that. The rider is riding on a slack rein and her leg isn't touching his sides. One could argue it's just the rider's way of riding, but it looks like she's actively trying to keep the leg off his side which means (to me, anyway) a sensitive horse that hasn't been taught to accept leg contact. 

Now, I know some disciplines like polo don't have their legs on their horses and I'm not sure about pleasure...but judging from the no-leg-contact, stiff jaw, head up, ears pricked full - I'd say he might be handful on the trail. 

2. Another thing that strikes me is the amount of neck muscle on the underside of his neck. I'm not sure if it matters on the trail where a horse carries his head, but this neck muscle underneath the neck (and not much on the crest) also backs up my opinion that he's a little hot. A guy who carries his head up and looking around.

3. Conformationally, he's got somewhat of a straight shoulder and a short stride. I'd assume he's a little choppy at the trot which might be a concern on trails if you do a lot of trotting, like your lower back might get sore. He's not tracking up either, even in the pic trotting free, but again I'm not sure if that's as big a deal as the choppy stride. Not helping the problem is how far forward that saddle is on the horse's back in the first pic. The saddle is not only on the shoulder, but it looks like it's on the withers too. That could be a reason why he's trotting so short (and could also explain why he routinely carries his head high to the point of developing the wrong muscles and the stiffness in neck/jaw). 

On the plus side, I like how compact he is. I like his shorter back - I think that would be good for trails. He's nice and sturdy and besides his slightly shorter-than-ideal-neck, he's nicely balanced. 

I hope that helps. I tried to gear it towards what I'd imagine someone would look for in a trail/pleasure horse. Good conformation is good conformation is good conformation, no matter what the discipline, but there are some different things people look to suit a specific discipline.


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## Megora

I think he's gorgeous - reminds me of some of the morgies at our barn. 

I'm not as experienced a horse person to know how you can judge a trot or canter without getting on him and test riding him. The head being up and out (instead of up and tucked) could be due to training. I know I'd get yelled at if I rode with my horse's head out like a dog's.  

One mare who had a similar thickly muscled look as that guy had a very deep and comfortable trot and cancer. It's why she was always used for the beginner riders because they could ride and learn balance very easy on her. 

I don't like the look of that saddle at all. Heehee. An old saddleseat person here, but I think morgans look better with a bigger saddle.


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## coppers-mom

Well some of the comments seemed to hit home with me and I sure don't want high headed and hot blooded any more. I've aged and want less umph.

The owner said he will chase dogs out of his paddock and after watching mine get all under Ranger I knew that is not a good idea so I didn't even try this little guy.

Ranger's owner came for another lesson today and made huge progress. I thought she was a beginner who had ridden some, but she is a true beginner whose husband attempted to teach on a reining horse. Not a good idea and she has some trust and fear issues now.

She rode in the little arena, trotted poles, climbed the dirt pile and then rode up to the house solo. Ranger does want to get into a trot to come to the porch and get undsaddled and she kept him slow and calm. I was very impressed since this is only her 5th lesson and the first two we spent a lot of time doing ground work. She loves him, he loves her and it is good.


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## Angelina

That is great and as you most likely know, with horses, one must always 'follow their gut' and listen to what your inner voice is telling you. As I get older I also try to err on the side of caution. I've become a much more conservative rider and won't just hop on any horse....I have to work that horse from the ground first and drive the owner crazy with questions first before I will put my foot in that stirrup. There are so many good horses out there right now; many needing to be rescued since Canadian and Mexican slaughterhouses are alive and well and the US economy is in a freefall. There really is no need to get involved with a problematic horse when there are so many well trained horses out there...many for free. At least in my part of the country!

On an aside, I taught my horse to chase dogs...I had to. I did alot of single track trail rides which one wrong step meant falling sometimes 100s of feet. Idiots would let their dogs off leash on these trails an many times they would come rushing at us. I taught Mystery to turn and run after the dog; but on command and he LOVED it. I can't tell you how many times this saved us or our friends. (maybe he has some 'cow' in him!).

If a horse is going to automatically attach a dog underfoot, that tells me the horse was attacked in the past. I've seen a pit bull go after a horse in a paddock, get trampled multiple times, get right back up and go after the poor horse while the owner (of the dog), stood there and cried! My friend went in there with a shovel (sooo dangerous) and finally the dog left. That horse was a mental wreck for months after and you couldn't even bring a leashed dog close to it without a panic attack. There is always a reason why.....

I am sure you will find the right horse in time... take care, K


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## Megora

*Random Blanket Shopping*

So.... I'm pinching pennies this year and am not going to buy a mondo expensive blanket. Because my guy needs both a blanket and a sheet. It's been cold at night already but not cold enough for a winter blanket. :doh: 

So I'm thinking about these options:




^ That's Stormshield classic euro contour collar turnout, midweight and red/black or blue/black (red's my first pick). It's going to cost me around $90. 

He won't get that blanket put on him until maybe November? Depends on when we dip down into the 30-40''s during the day. 



^ And I kinda want to get this sheet. The tiger print. :smooch: I could be wrong, but looks like it would be $60? I think that has to be wrong, but they are out until mid-october.


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## Megora

So.... I feel horrible right now. 

I decided to bring Jacks out to the barn with me. Forgot how crowded it is during the school year so had to keep him with me vs tying him inside the aiseway while I'm lunging my horse or whatnot. 

And instead of lunging my horse I turned him loose in the arena with the stall-less mare and pony out there. I felt uncomfortable about doing that since I KNOW how my big idiot is around mares, but my barn lady said it should be fine. 

Sure enough he went rushing in to tease the mare and the horses stalled at the one end of the arena every time I let my guard down and stopped shaking the rattle bottle him.

Anyway. She kicked him on his good side. He deserved it, but geesh. 

He wasn't cut or obviously injured, but he had weird muscle (?) bubbles all over the spot where he was kicked. I've never seen that before.  

I iced him down (gave him gooey mineral ice side) and hand walked him a bit to get him to relax. And the weird bubbles went away - thank God. He looked pretty sound by the time I sent him back out into the pasture with the other guys. My barn lady's going to keep him out as long as possible, if not overnight to make sure he doesn't stiffen up on that side.

And ohg. I love her. I was stressing out and making sure they'd give him a bute if he was gimpy tonight or tomorrow. And she took me on a tour to show me all of the other horses with their various injuries. Needless to say, I felt pretty good that my guy didn't have a single mark on him and looked sound when I left him out back. 

I still feel like a bad owner because I should have known better than let him run with a mare. >.<

ETA - And on the flip side of things, I absolutely love Jacks' coat. I initially tried working in the bull pen at the barn, but it was a giant mud puddle from the rain yesterday. And Jacks went running around in the bull pen as well as the thick mud between the barn and the race track, the sandy mud on the race track, and the yucky mud at the entry way to the field where my guy was hanging out. From the shoulders down he was black from the mud. 

In the couple hours that I was working with my horse, Jacks dried off and the the mud all flaked off. By the time he got in my car you never would have known what he got into. His coat is a wonderful thing.


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## Ranger

Hmm, interesting about the weird little bubbles. I'd say little hematomas but I don't think disappear that fast. Sometimes they don't disappear at all...ask me how I know. 

Virgil was cantering around the corner of the ring and hit a wet spot. He fell onto his side in the blink of an eye. One minute we were heading to a fence, the next I was standing at his head holding the reins and thinking, "*** just happened?" as he lied there stunned. I'm still not sure how I got off so fast that I wasn't pinned down under him. After that day, Virgil had a hematoma on his off haunch. It's never gotten any bigger (nor smaller), doesn't bother him at all...but it was his first 'blemish' and I've always remembered it.

here's a pic - you can kinda see it - it's next to his big Bend'Or spot:


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## Megora

I initially thought they were hematomas - and was amazed they popped out so fast! After the kick he was hobbling around the arena a bit until I caught up with him, but it was only a minute if that between the kick and when I got him. And there were all of those creepy bumps. Like the kick gave him hives. 

And after I put half a gallon of mineral ice on his side/shoulder and hand walked him a little, they all went down. I think it was some weird reaction from his body to the kick and the adrenaline. Because they went away as I got his side numbed up + he calmed down. I've just never seen that before. And neither did the other boarder who intially calmed me down and held onto Jacks while I took care of my guy. She was thinking maybe it was the same as veins jutting out after a horse has gotten worked. But I don't know...????  

I'm heading out tonight to check him out, lunge him, and probably ice him down again. I had dog class yesterday so didn't go out, but my barn lady said they checked on him and he looked sound.


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## Ranger

Hoping he's feeling/looking better! I'm in a bit of a panic because Virgil seems reluctant to put full weight on his left front when he's in grazing position. His leg wobbles a bit, like he's trying to keep the weight on the toe instead of the heel. This is especially worrying since his RIGHT front has always been the "bad" one. Now it's his left? Son of a gun. I've got the farrier coming out on Tuesday so I'll see if he spots anything. There's no heat, no lameness...it's just odd.

On an unrelated note: Do not EVER try to pull your horse's mane when it's dusk out and getting hard to see. I was pulling Virgil's 2 nights ago around 8:30pm and I THOUGHT I had enough light...the next night i went out a little earlier and AHHH!! It looked like I'd gone razor happy. Luckily it was fixable!


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## Megora

As of last time, my guy still is stiff and I found a bump where the kick landed. I loaded up on mineral ice again so fingers crossed it goes away. He was stiff and sore looking but came out of it as I lightly worked him. No cantering, just really light trotting and a lot of walking. 

Hope Virgil's doing better... 

We went through something similar a while back and did a "in case" treatment for abcess (just soaking the foot in epson salts) and iced the leg and shoulder in case there was a muscle strain. It took him a couple months to get better - pretty sure it was a muscle strain from him putting all his weight on the "good" side. 

Somebody else groomed my horse last month and while shaving his face managed to take out a good portion of his forelock. It's drives me nuts looking at it. And of course I was ticked off anyway that they clipped him - they aren't supposed to. Because my horse isn't a show horse anymore, I don't go too nuts clipping him in summer. I just tidy up his feet, get rid of the whiskers, and trim the pull.


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## Ranger

Oooh yes, clipping forelocks is a no-no! I remember me and the BO/head trainer were taking some lesson kiddies to a schooling show...and one of the kids CUT OFF the horse's forelock! RIGHT off. 2 years later, someone "banged" a schoolie's forelock so he looked like a friar. Next year, someone decided to bang a school horse's tail...god, those mornings were awful. We'd do clinics and lessons on horse show prep (geared towards schooling shows) and then on horse show morning, all the kids would panic and do something stupid. Try as we could, we couldn't possibly keep an eye on all 10-14 kids at once! Thank god for the patient natures of school horses.

My mane pulling job was hideous. I guess there's a big difference between "think you can see" and "actually can see." I think I was able to fix it up but still not great. Oh well. At least it's not 12 inches long now. I also banged his tail and curried the crap out of him. He's gleaming and looks goooood. He'd better; this new barn we're going to isn't a retirement facility or primarily western/NH like the place he's at now. We're back to a hunter/jumper barn in a few weeks, though he'll still be retired. I want him to at least look the part!


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## Ranger

Virgil's moving to his new home tomorrow! Loading him is always an interesting experience, so please keep your fingers crossed that everything goes smoothly! 

On the downside, it looks like Virgil is getting sidebone on his left front...which means wearing his bell boots for hauling tomorrow is only going to aggravate it, since he seems to be a little tender right now. 

But, one thing at a time! On the trailer and to a new home, then I'll worry about keeping him comfortable! Wish us luck!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

If he will stand quietly, maybe no bell boots? We never wrap legs or put boots on anymore. A bit risky if something goes wrong traffic wise, but they just stand there.

Wishing you luck on the loading thing and Congratulations! on going to a new home.


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## Ranger

Oh, he will definitely not stand quietly. That's just not in his repertoire! He doesn't like standing quietly on a good day, let alone on a trailer. Plus he's prone to bolting when being led in new environments when things get 'too much' for his poor little WB brain to handle, so the boots are a must. We're not going far and he's always shipped in his boots and been ok, it's just the new addition to sidebone on top of everything else. Thanks for the well wishes, though! Hopefully all goes well!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Alrighty then!  Definitely will be thinking of you!


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## Ranger

Sorry if that came off as 'blowing you off' - I definitely didn't mean it that way! Virgil's always been a bit of a special case mentally and I could never treat him like other horses. I was always jealous of my friends who could walk their horses on a loose lead rope at shows and not have to worry about them bolting. Now that Virgil's gotten older and leaves the property less and less, he's gotten worse about things that he used to be okay with, trailering and going new places being one of them.

I remember the vet was out about 6 years ago doing floats. He was telling me about an older horse who'd been trailered to the vet clinic that morning. Old, opinionated horse got out of the trailer and threw a histrionic fit that ended with him throwing himself to the ground and refusing to get up. Owners said he hated changes in his environment. The vet looked at me, looked at Virgil and said, "You know that's probably going to be Virgil once he hits 20, right?" Hopefully once Virgil is ensconced -safely- in his new home, he won't have to leave for awhile!


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## Ranger

V-man is in his new home:










He was a little sweaty from the trailer ride, and then kept trotting and cantering around. Especially when his neighbour horse went inside the barn for a lesson and Virgil felt like he was all alone!









Coming in full blast!


















It's a gorgeous place - lots of trees and shade! He'll be on a round bale when they get delivered and in the meantime, gets all the flakes he wants. Plus there's grass in the paddock that he gets to munch on! Overall, we are loving this place! I love it for indoor ring's footing, the HUGE tack lockers and a bunch of other reasons!


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## Angelina

He looks wonderful! He will adjust I'm sure and start to appreciate his new digs! K


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## Megora

He looks gorgeous - and from the pictures and sounds of it, you found a great place for him<: 

So he's getting along with his new pasture buddies?


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Oh no, that's not what I meant at all. I've had horses like that and there's no negotiating with them. That's what I meant with "alrighty then". Sometimes the horse just makes the rules and there's not diddly we can do to change it. We had one who scrambled so bad he got trailered by himself...two trips to show 2 horses. It's just how he was. :no:



Ranger said:


> Sorry if that came off as 'blowing you off' - I definitely didn't mean it that way! Virgil's always been a bit of a special case mentally and I could never treat him like other horses. I was always jealous of my friends who could walk their horses on a loose lead rope at shows and not have to worry about them bolting. Now that Virgil's gotten older and leaves the property less and less, he's gotten worse about things that he used to be okay with, trailering and going new places being one of them.
> 
> I remember the vet was out about 6 years ago doing floats. He was telling me about an older horse who'd been trailered to the vet clinic that morning. Old, opinionated horse got out of the trailer and threw a histrionic fit that ended with him throwing himself to the ground and refusing to get up. Owners said he hated changes in his environment. The vet looked at me, looked at Virgil and said, "You know that's probably going to be Virgil once he hits 20, right?" Hopefully once Virgil is ensconced -safely- in his new home, he won't have to leave for awhile!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

He is so handsome...every picture could be on a calender! It looks like a lovely place and WOW grass! It was meant to be!


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## Ranger

Virgil hasn't adjusted to his new place yet. Poor guy. I went out there yesterday and I didn't get the usual, low rumbly nicker; I got the frantic high pitched, "There you are!!" whinny. He's not trotting/cantering around as much or calling as the first day, but he's definitely pacing his paddock and isn't able to stand still...not even for his bucket of grain. Mouthful, walk off, pick at grass, stare at something, come back, mouthful, walk off, etc. He didn't even want to eat his apple treats! 

I guess it's to be expected. The last place he moved (the place we just moved from) was super quiet, no one around, and he immediately went into a paddock with a horse he'd known for 6 years. Then he got used to the quiet environment in the past 2 years. Now he's back at a busier barn - there's dogs, cats, people walking around all the time, etc. Worse, there's only the horse across the fence from him as the two are both in quarantine. The other horses are out of sight behind the barn in the summer paddocks. 

I do feel like this will be a good move for him - eventually. It'll be tough adjustment but in the end, I think he'll like the busier environment since he always had in the past. We'd take him to the shows and he'd sleep by the jumper rings once he was done working...try taking him back to the trailers and he'd panic and freak. Hopefully once the paddocks are full with horses he'll settle down a little more.

I was also unimpressed with my first meeting with the BO's daughter (around my age). I was brushing Virgil in the field and while he stood for the currying, he started walking off when I got to his tail. Fine, he doesn`t like his tail brushed plus he`s still unsettled and pacing. I stopped him from walking off and he was plainly unhappy: head up, ears askew and a worried eye but it wasn`t just from me not letting him walk around. Anyway, the daughter walks by, introduces herself and then says, `he doesn`t seem happy to see you.`` Who says that! Gee, sorry my older horse is stressed and yeah, may not look happy at this point when I`m stopping him from doing something he wants to do. I was left thinking that this girl doesn`t have many social skills. 

Hopefully Virge is a little more settled today. I`m about to go out and give him his Thanksgiving Day snack!


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## Angelina

Poor guy but he will adjust. Now you know to avoid her and her unsolicited (incorrect) observations. I think the older a horse gets the tougher it is on them to move them. I am hoping I'll never need to move Mystery again but one just never knows....

My friend's horse won't trailer either unless it is a wide open slant load and even then he panicks. She has to keep him at barns close to trails. It is too bad since she can't go join her friends out on the coast...but it is what it is. Scary as heck when you are trailering a horse who acts up...


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## Ranger

A very happy update: Virgil is happy and settled! I went out there and the BO had moved him into the other horse's paddock while they build a shelter in the other one. He was already calmer, just by having this horse in with him. Amazingly, I think this horse is bossing Virgil around! That'll be the first time since he was four that he hasn't been the boss. I'm kinda thinking once Virgil is more adjusted that his natural dominance will assert itself but in the meantime, both him and the black horse seem happy with each other`s company. Yay!


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## Angelina

Thats great. He will like the ability to constantly graze. Mystery has always been number 2 or number 3 and I like it that way! Number 1 has too much pressure to stay up there. Now that he is retired with only 7 other geldings in 30 acres and is very savvy about where to go during the day they follow him and he is 'kind of' the boss. Everyone gets along great so there are never any bites or kicks (the BO moved the mares into their own pasture and things settled). It is a good life for a retired guy....

So Penny'sMom: when are we getting pictures of the horse show???? ???:cavalry:


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## Elisabeth Kazup

First the camera crapped out on my. I got it going again and gave it to DH to take pictures. They all came out either fuzzy or looking like negatives. He got his camera out and it wouldn't work at all. Don't know why. So all I have is one picture of the truck and trailer when we pulled in, before we unloaded and one he chopped off while we were waiting for his class to go in. I intended to photo-document the whole show.  Here's a couple that were salvagable. She's started her diet challenge along with me!










Here's one from between classes









And here's a victory pass from back in May, with his old silver. She really needs to get another outfit.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I'm so happy to hear that Virgil is settling in. Amazing what a buddy can do for a horse's confidence. 

You handled that girl very well, I might have spouted off that what he misses is his old place. :


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## Elisabeth Kazup

So, going to get on Daz today. If he can't go for training, then I/we will just have to get off our lazy arses and DO IT! I asked DD where his saddle was. "At the bottom of the stairs in a blue bag". My first thought was: that's probably exactly how you will find me! lol

What I used to do is lunge him w/saddle and bridle in the Vienna rein. I can't ride him long enough to really work him, so I would work him on the lunge. Then I'd get on, do as much posting trot as I could. A lot of walking and flexing. My riding was actually his cool out.

I'm not worried about him dumping me again because he always snorts a lot when he's nervous and about to spin and bolt (his signature 'shy'). He's never snorted when working in the ring w/t/c. 

I have a slideshow on photobucket but don't know how to post it without exposing my whole photobucket account.


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## Angelina

Nice pictures above so how did they do at the show? Can you haul him for lessons a couple times a month? Then you could work on it inbetween...


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## Elisabeth Kazup

They placed second in every class and then Reserve Ch. The other horse had a different way of going, so clearly she had a preference for the other one. I was tickled with the way Harry showed. He is what he is, nearly every picture looks the same so either the judge likes that or not. Jennifer grew up showing/competing with the other woman, so it's kind of all in the family.:smooch:


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## Angelina

Well done, congrats! I've never showed and have only won the 'Turtle Award' for endurance riding! It must be a thrill!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Let me guess: Turtle award does not go to the fastest?? ;-)

It is exciting! Kind of nerve wracking too. And then it's over so fast! It's just so nice to get away and concentrate on my horse and my horsey friends.

Actually, we think showing is about the stupidest thing to do with a horse. At least endurance riding is athletic and a sport. We go around one way, then go around the other, line up and get a silly ribbon. After the show, on the way home we always have to laugh at how absurd the whole thing is. 

But, it's fun and keeps us young!


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## Angelina

Well, and the journey to get to it entails those types of exercises for both horse and rider which will help the horse in the long run use its body correctly and last for years. The horse needs to lift the rider and push from behind or will just get into all kinds of physical problems. Mystery use to 'trip' until I had a trainer show me he was heavy on the forehand and how to lift his should and teach him to use his body correctly. Once I learned how to balance myself correctly it became easier for him too. Oh how I miss riding!

Well, I just started the weightwatchers path (again) and I hope by spring I can afford to half-lease a horse. My friend says there is a nice paint gelding at her barn who needs a job; he is western ridden so it depends. I would only do it for a horse I can trailer out to Pt.Reyes. Or just take lessons. I just can't imagine getting out of horses completely because mine is retired.... 

Sorry, did not mean to make this about 'me' again...when will you ride Daz again? Are you able to ride every day? Did you take Penny to the barn? How is she doing? K


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I love hearing about your horse stuff.

No Penny didn't go to the barn. It makes me a little nervous to let her have to much opportunity to do damage. She's doing great and getting used to the non-greeting greeting. Today when I got in from the barn, she didn't even get up from her rug. Kind of sad, but good. My wild girl is still in there, she'll be back.

I don't get to ride everyday. I have to ride outside so weather matters a lot. I think I want to lightly lunge him everyday, tho, to start building up his respiratory capacity, lost fat and gain muscle. I think if I ride him 2 or 3 times a week in addition to the lunging, that will be good. I'm talking 10 to 15 minute sessions where I give him a lot of leeway to chose his gaits. I don't want to push him.

I want to be riding Harry too. Get in more equitation practice with him. First show is mid-April...not a moment to lose! lol Harry is good right off the trailer so he doesn't really need schooling, just work to keep his condition up.


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## Ranger

Today marks the first day in 2 months that I haven't gone to see Virgil. It feels weird but on the other hand, it was nice to not have to go out when it was pitch black and fumble around with a flashlight, try not to break an ankle (again) on uneven ground, and listen to the coyotes howl while standing in an isolated acreage on an even more desolate country road to make sure my skinny horse is going to get some much needed calories and roughage in his gut to last him through the night.

Instead, I know he's got grass and hay to snack on all night. I can go out anytime during the day now. The BO's house is directly behind his paddock. The property is securely fenced at 10pm til 8am. There's always people walking past his paddock. The BO feeds his grain in the morning on the days I'm not going to be there and she'll blanket him if the weather suddenly drops. Whew. A big sigh of relief. It's been awhile since I haven't been worried about him at night.


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## Angelina

Ranger that is a great feeling! I can go several weeks although I try not too but I can knowing my horse is fine. Then I go see him, give him a brushing, a little equine senior, carrots and he just wants to go back out with the boys! So I don't feel guilty at all. But, he has always been an 'easy keeper' and is still one of the fattest out there....

I am so glad you found a good place to board Virgil and that he is adjusting fine...


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## Ranger

Thanks Angelina! It's definitely a relief to know that I can go awhile without seeing him IF I need to...and chances are I will when school gets super busy. I got way behind going out every day so I'm trying to catch up now. Worse case scenario, I only go out on the weekends. But it's a lot easier to sleep at night knowing he's happy and not hungry!


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## Megora

Ranger said:


> Thanks Angelina! It's definitely a relief to know that I can go awhile without seeing him IF I need to...and chances are I will when school gets super busy. I got way behind going out every day so I'm trying to catch up now. Worse case scenario, I only go out on the weekends. But it's a lot easier to sleep at night knowing he's happy and not hungry!


This is awesome... I guess I only would say that this is the reason why I board my guy where I do (10 minute drive) even though there are cheaper places within walking distance of my house. :doh: I never worry about him. That's a bonus value worth paying and driving extra for.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

So wonderful to be able to 'let down' a little; you must have felt a bit like a racehorse yourself.

Every boarding situation I was in ended up with me going out every day to make sure they were fed and cared for. I know the relief you are feeling.

btw, your first paragraph scared the bejeezus out of me: I'm afraid of the dark; you are so brave.


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## luvbuzz

After Friday, I have two weeks off work. Plan on doing lots of riding. Fall is my favorite time of the year...weather is starting to get a bit colder here (PA). The only negative is hunting season is starting.
Nice having a horse thread. Riding is so much better when Buzz joins me. Not always sure how much the horse enjoys going, but I know Buzz loves to go.


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## Angelina

How many "horse people" does it take to change a lightbulb? 

WESTERN PLEASURE RIDERS: Oh, my God, someone fix that bulb, I have to have light so that my silver and spangles all glow to their best and so that all the highlighter on Old Peanut Head makes his nose look so smooth and sparkly and oh, my diamond studs have to flash in the light, you know, so oh, someone has to fix it. Oh, maybe you without all the silver on your Saddle, obviously you can't ride, you can do it. 

ENDURANCE RIDER: Light bulb? Do you mind, I'm trying to get my horse's pulse/respiration/hydration levels down to respectable levels. Once that is done, I have another 50 miles to go before I can even think about changing a light bulb. 

Dressage QUEEN: Change a light bulb? Are you joking? I couldn't possiblybe expected to subject myself to such a menial task. Change it yourself. Oh, and wash your hands when you are finished. The very thought! 

CLASSICAL DRESSAGE QUEEN: These things cannot be rushed, but must be approached slowly, with great patience, and adherence to the principles laid down by the classical masters, otherwise the light bulb will not attain its true potential, but will forever just be a shadow of its true self. Never, ever, use any type of gadget when changing the light bulb. That is an offense to the principles of classical light bulb changing. 

EVENTERS: Wuss! As soon as my arm is out of this sling broken after falling off at that large stone Wall while riding **** Bent for Leather cross country, I'll change it. Until then, deal with the dark. It'll put hair on your Chest. Only dressage riders require lights, anyway. 

SHOW JUMPER: Why on Earth would I need to change a light bulb when the whole world knows that the sun shines out of my butt. Why, when I release over a jump, the spectators are practically blinded. 

HUNTER RIDER: Well, I'm waiting for my trainer to tell me exactly how but he's changing light bulbs somewhere else right now. 

BACKYARD HORSEMAN: Do I have to do everything??!! Oh yeah, I do, don't I? I'll get to it as soon as I'm done mucking stalls, cleaning and filling the troughs, cleaning and filling the water buckets, stacking my hay, setting up for night feeding, cleaning my tack, picking out manure from the paddock, brushing and exercising the horses, and whatever else needs to be done. 

NATURAL HORSEMAN: You must instill respect in the light bulb, so that it sees you as the Alpha light bulb, using "light bulb dynamics" (video set available at $179.00 on my Website). Once you have done this, you will find that there is really no need to change the light bulb at all, but that the light bulb will, with very little coaxing from you (using patented "light bulb coaxer") designed by me - $99.00 each, for extra $49.99 you get a introductory video thrown in) will behave as all good light bulbs should.


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## Ranger

Hilarious!

Anyone else going to have a great horsie weekend? I'm going to pick up some new supplements for Virgil tomorrow morning then head out to the barn to play for awhile. I've decided I need to make things easier for the BO so I'm bagging all Virgil's feed. It'll just be dump baggie with feed and supplements into bucket, add water, and feed. Can't make it much simpler than that!

Speaking of which, what supplements does everyone use? I've had Virgil on a few over the years but am about to do another switch. I'm trying to simplify his feed and now that he doesn't need to gain weight, I won't need to give as much or as many different products. Here's his new menu (I think):
- 2 scoops (2 quarts) Moorglo
- 1 scoop BOSS
- 1 scoop multi vit/min
- 1 scoop joint supplement

The only thing is I'm thinking of changing his vit/min and joint supplement. He was on pureform performance one and I'm thinking of changing him to Source. Either Source Focus Senior or Source Nuggets. Not sure which. It's got fewer vit/min than pureform 1 and some in lesser dosage, but I think the quality of hay Virgil's getting is better now. 

His joint supplement...I'm really not sure. He was on Recovery EQ last year, was on Regenerex this year, but I'm looking at changing him to Corta-flx CORTA-FLX, Inc. - EQUINE CORTA-FLX¨ Solution or Biomax HA Biomax HA functions by attracting water to the synovial fluid.. But the Biomax HA has some vit/min in it and I don't want to overdose Virgil or have him pee out all the ones he doesn't need and I'm wasting money on. Plus, while he's getting sidebone, I'd like a natural painkiller in his supplements for the next little while. 

Anyone have any ideas? I like the corta-flx because they did a study on it (double blind placebo study) and it was useful when dealing with degenerative joint disease which is something Virgil has. Arrghh! Too many supplements!


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## Megora

I use Corta-flex with my guy. And that's the one our vet, farrier, and chiropractor recommended.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Quote:

"WESTERN PLEASURE RIDERS: Oh, my God, someone fix that bulb, I have to have light so that my silver and spangles all glow to their best and so that all the highlighter on Old Peanut Head makes his nose look so smooth and sparkly and oh, my diamond studs have to flash in the light, you know, so oh, someone has to fix it. Oh, maybe you without all the silver on your Saddle, obviously you can't ride, you can do it. "

This would be me on show weekends!

Quote:

"BACKYARD HORSEMAN: Do I have to do everything??!! Oh yeah, I do, don't I? I'll get to it as soon as I'm done mucking stalls, cleaning and filling the troughs, cleaning and filling the water buckets, stacking my hay, setting up for night feeding, cleaning my tack, picking out manure from the paddock, brushing and exercising the horses, and whatever else needs to be done. "

This is me between my glittery weekends!

I can't fix the light bulb if it's dark! Somebody else needs to go in there first!

I feed supplements from March until now: electrolytes, b complex, smart hoof. Nothing for joints yet. 

My horsey weekend is going to be a thorough grooming on Daz. He has a very full tail that I haven't brushed out in a long time. I remember the first time he was comfortable with me behind him, brushing, not quite 3 years old. Before that he always circled in his stall, not sure, not trusting. Then one day he stood still, next thing I know he's sleeping over his hay. Ever since then he has LOVED getting his tail brushed out. So curry comb, hair brush and major treats, of course.

Weather is supposed to be windy, rainy. Probably not much for riding.


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## Angelina

I have beautiful weather, the truck, the trailer and no horse to ride. Maybe I'll throw a leg on Mystery bareback but that isn't a real ride, is it? 

Enjoy your horses, I'll just have to hear your stories!

No supplements for Mystery, pasture and grass hay is fine for him, my easy keeper! K


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Beautiful setting! Wish you were closer!


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## Ranger

Megora said:


> I use Corta-flex with my guy. And that's the one our vet, farrier, and chiropractor recommended.


Did you find it makes a big difference? Is it for general mobility like msm plus anti-inflammatory? I guess I'm hovering between that and the other because I'm not sure if there's a general pain killer in the corta-flex. Right now Virgil is uncomfortable putting weight on his left front due to his sidebone...would the corta-flex help with that, do you think?


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## Elisabeth Kazup

This really help DD's horses hocks. Might be useful for you. We hand feed 2 a day.

Cosequin® HA + ASU Treats - Equine Joint Supplements from SmartPak Equine


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## Ranger

Sadly, Smartpak doesn't deliver to Canada. I'm constantly drooling over their website and the blanket sales they had awhile back! I can't find those around here, either. You'd think for being in Horse Country, there'd be more options for feed. But we have Triple Crown, no Pennfield, hardly any Nutrena options...it's so frustrating!


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## Megora

Penny's Mom said:


> This really help DD's horses hocks. Might be useful for you. We hand feed 2 a day.
> 
> Cosequin® HA + ASU Treats - Equine Joint Supplements from SmartPak Equine


My horse won't eat these... it would have been way too easy giving him a "treat" every day. 

@Ranger - I'm not sure how to answer? We started my guy on Cortaflex back when he had an injury that really left him hobbling around. He is never going to be as strong and sound as he was ten years ago, but we are talking a little stiffness vs limping. 

I also give him MSM.


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## Megora

I feel a little nervous... 

I finally sat down to get blanket shopping done. And I wound up buying a blanket from State Line for $64. Simply because the shipping was free and I was only paying $64. 

I buy a blanket every other year for my guy because he shreds them so much, so technically cheaper is better.

But then I'm worrying if I was too cheap in this case and I just bought a blanket that will be too big and too heavy for him. >.<

It's 75 inch instead of 74. And 250 fill instead of 220. 

Ugh. What did I do.


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## Ranger

Ah, I hate online tack shopping. Well, I love it when I have money and when I know what blankets and sizes work, otherwise I panic. 

I don't think a one inch increment will be too a big deal...it's not like you bought a 76 or 78. Sometimes Virgil is an 80, sometimes 82. Once an 84! But usually I figure between 80-82 and we're good. I am jealous of you blanket shopping...I really, really want a new one for Virgil! I keep reminding myself that I just got him a new one this year. A rambo supreme...420g!!

Have you looked at the Amigos? The Amigo Mio is supposed to be good and fairly inexpensive considering it's from horseware. I have a huge wishlist of blankets for Virgil.


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## Megora

I hate blanket shopping. It's why I dragged my feet and missed a lot of the early sales.... >.<

I looked at the Amigo Mio and thought they looked snappy... but it's so hard to tell looking at these blankets. The one I looked at seemed to have less coverage or shorter on the sides than the one I wound up picking out? 

I was aiming for the $70-90 range and had one picked out from Schneiders Tack (my usual blanket place). But they were all sold out. Except for pink.  I couldn't do that to my boy. 

The sizes _confuse_ me. I've bought him 76's in the past. But the last time I did that I wound up trading blankets with my barn lady because he was swimming in the 76.


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## Ranger

Yeah i find it really depends on the cut of the blanket. A QH cut blanket (like Big Dee) won't fit my guy no matter what, even if it's the right size, i.e. ahead of the withers and ending at the top of the tail. The shoulder is too tight and then the quarters tent out and from the back it looks like he's swimming in it. Hate those! And of course, some blankets run big like Rambos. I just read that you're supposed to order rambos a size smaller than what you'd normally order. I ordered an 80...was I supposed to order a 78?? But Virgil is sometimes an 82, so will the 80 work? Argh. Who knows. I like weatherbeetas. I loved the lady who used to custom make blankets. She'd come out measure your horse in 8 different spots and then you could customize it. How much fill, what colour, what trim, what piping and get it monogrammed. I miss those blankets. They were nice and contoured, too...something that's almost impossible to get these days. 
This is Virgil's last custom blanket before the lady stopped making them - 400 gram, custom to fit, hood attachments, embroidered with Virgil on the shoulder and in custom colours...for 200 dollars!!









I got so spoiled with this lady. She supplied his whole wardrobe and I never had to worry about rubs or fit. When Virgil outgrew the blanket I'd bought him in 2000 when he was 4, she put inserts in it to make it longer! Free of charge! The only downside is that they weren't waterproof but I'd just throw a rainsheet over top when needed.


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## Megora

That is a gorgeous blanket (and he looks great modeling it).  

The problem with my guy is he's a roller when he gets out in the field and even in his stall. So come February or March and he's wearing a dirty and ripped blanket.

I love Weatherbeetas!

This is the one I wanted (including the neck thingy)...

Weatherbeeta Landa Freestyle Combo T/O Blanket - Statelinetack.com


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## Ranger

Oh hahaha - that was the first day he wore it!! That's why it looks so nice and clean and shiny. That lasted about a day. If that. His black model is now perma-gray and that bronze blanket is now perma-crayolahasn'tmadeupacolourtodescribeityet. 

Have you tried the 1200 denier blankets? They hold up amazingly well. I find I might as well throw my money right into the garbage if I get 600 denier ones. And my guy isn't even that rough on his blankets! Back when I was young and dumb(er than I am now) I thought it would be okay for him to wear a NYLON sheet outside. In turnout. Amazingly it lasted about 3 weeks before he shredded it. And I mean, shredded it. I was picking scraps of it up off the ground and the BO asked me what the heck it was. It didn't even look like a blanket anymore!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Does he chew them? Harry used to chew his...baby behavior. I sprayed the front lower edges with no chew and he eventually matured or got used to having blankets on but in either case, doesn't chew them now. I also had to spray the back ends of the other boys blankets. We're missing two tail flaps from the other boy's blankees. Hmmm, wonder who did that...considering Harry's tail flap is still on....



Megora said:


> I buy a blanket every other year for my guy because he shreds them so much, so technically cheaper is better.


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## Ranger

OMG - showed some self-restraint and didn't buy the GORGEOUS blankets that were on sale today!!! Weatherbeetas for under $100!! I did however buy a burgundy cotton sheet since i apparently lost Virgil's other one. It was on sale for 50! Rain sheets were on sale, too...I need one but don't NEED one yet. His old one is still workable.

I decided to go with Source supplement (the original powder - here's hoping he eats it) and Recoverex since it has msm, glucosamine, vit c and e, chondroitin, and yucca. Once the sidebone is less painful, I'll switch him to cortaflex since it's cheaper. I'm going to be dreaming about horse blankets, though.

THIS one was on sale for $129.00: WeatherBeeta Orican Freestyle Standard Neck Heavy

This was on sale for under $100: WeatherBeeta Taka Original Standard Neck Medium

If I hadn't dropped a gazillion dollars on supplements...I would have walked away with one!!


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## Megora

Well... I need to buy my guy a sheet since we are in the in-between weather (chilly but not cold enough for blankets). I will have to remember to buy the 1200 denier vs 600. 

All these years I've been buying horse blankets, and I never really paid attention to those numbers. :doh:

Now I know. 

@Penny's Mom - I think that the colts he goes out in the field with might be helping him tear his duds. But I'm pretty sure it's mostly him rolling around, bucking, rubbing in his stall... bad horse. :smooch:

*** I guess I should add that I'm also replacing a leather halter, lead rope, and a couple grooming brushes since these items went mia during the summer.  

I'm only really upset about the halter because it was $50. And it was pretty nice leather and just right for grooming. 

I guess that's the fun part of boarding.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I have to get another halter too. Nylon with leather crown. Harry likes to get his off and then use it as a chew toy...about every other month or so. I buy halters in pairs so I always have an extra until I find the one left in the tall grass. Wish they made dayglo orange!


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## Megora

Do you leave the halters on when they are turned out or stalled? 

We remove everyone's halters when they go outside or are stalled. Otherwise it's a search party in the tall grass to find where the horses left their halters. 

^ Right now I'm just borrowing the barn extras for when I bring my guy in from the field and am fussing with him. But it bugs me that he doesn't have his own. And I just prefer the leather halters darnit.  

This time I'm getting a plate put on it and also marking his name on the new halter. I should have had that done with the last one, but I bought it at a tractor supply store and it was too much a pain tracking down somebody who'd make the plate and hammer it on.


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## Ranger

We always leave the halters off when turned out, as well. Too many horror stories about horses getting caught up in them and injured, especially the nylon ones. Those ones will NOT break under stress. There was a schoolie that pulled back in a nylon halter and almost broke her neck. She pulled back so hard that she had cuts behind her ears where the nylon halter had dug in and swelling that didn't go down for weeks. I'm a leather halter fan, but made sure to get the triple stitched one. I had Virgil tied outside with a chintzy leather one, he lifted his head up, took a step back, and it snapped! I'm not sure who was more surprised, him or I! Thank god we were at home and not at a show. 

This is the one he wears now Weaver Leather Thbd. Halter [HAH4766] except his has a movable ring under the jaw instead of a fixed one. Actually, now that he's at a barn where he gets handles more often by people that are not me, I might get him one without clips on the side. I hate when people use the side clip and slip it over his head - it just doesn't work with a stud chain! Next one I buy won't have the side clip and will have a fixed ring under the chin.


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## Ranger

I am SO annoyed right now!! I went out to the barn to see Virgil - my reward for working so hard at school work all weekend - and the place was closed!! The hours are 9-9 every day, so why were the gates closed on sunday at 2pm on a beautiful day??? That was a waste of time and gas, never mind the fact that the only "look" I had of my horse was looking at him from the road. WHY didn't the BO tell me the barn would be closed when i sent her a message yesterday saying I'd be out??

And now, I won't get out to see him until thursday or friday. Saturday, even. That'll be close to 2 weeks. ARGH!!!


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## Angelina

I've NEVER heard of that! I've heard of having a combination lock or lock and key for the gate; but "I" want access to MY horse 24/7. Plus someone should be there in case one of the horses gets hurt or has a colic. I hope you clear up the non-communication with the BO soon, I would be pissed.


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## Megora

My guy's blanket came yesterday!!!!!!

I'm all excited about taking it out to the barn and trying it on him. *fingers crossed that it fits* I usually get blue or red for him. This year I'm going with purple.  

And it came with a catalog. I forgot how much I love state line catalogs. It's like a wish book.


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## Ranger

ooh, pics! I have yet to try Virgil's new rambo on him. I should probably do that before I actually need to put it on him when it hits -20!

And...I may have picked up a new summer sheet for him, too. 50 bucks. Burgundy. I've never tried burgundy on him before. I think it'll either look great or look awful. I WAS going to try it on him on Sunday and have him wear it all week, but...I couldn't get access to him and haven't been able to get back out yet. I'll head out tomorrow and try it on him. Hopefully it'll look great! Also going to start him on some new supplements. Hopefully he dapples up...I've only ever gotten dapples from him one year. 

I think it'll be blanketing time soon, too. I'm so happy I got weight on him or else he'd have had a rough time the last few weeks when it's too hot in the day to blanket but cold at night. At least now he's got some insulation with hay all night and some extra fat to keep him warm!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Our boys have leather crest pieces on their halters...break away.

Ranger, that's one of the reasons I hate boarding. Many of my friends have their horses with a trainer friend of mine. I've know her since she was a young teen. She runs a top notch barn. They just got back from Nationals and NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO RIDE THEIR HORSE until January 15. Trainer says they need r & r from show season. I think SHE'S the one who wants the r & r.

There could never be a day when someone could tell me I can't ride my horse for 3 months! And pay them for their time anyway. :no: The owners are not allowed to ride even a little bit, not even a bit of a trail ride through the pasture, not a little bit of walk trot in the arena...NOTHING....NADA.....ZILCH!!!


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## Ranger

Oh, I guess I forgot to update the whole gate closed fiasco. Apparently it was a mix up; the gate SHOULD have been opened but the BO was away and someone else was left in charge. Regardless, that really messed up my week. It's been almost a week since I "saw" Virgil, but that was from the road in my truck. It's been almost 2 weeks since I've actually been able to brush him or feed him. Can't wait to go see him tomorrow!! I've been saving apple cores for the last 2 days!

Penny's Mom - that's ridiculous. At the show barn I was at, the horses got one month off in the fall usually November, at the trainer's insistence. BUT if someone didn't want to, it wasn't that big a deal. i can't imagine a trainer telling me 3 months off for my horse...he'd have been a rodeo bronc by the time we started in work again!

Also, the horses "break time" was usually broken down like this: 2 weeks of NOTHING but being in the paddock and allowed to rest and relax and recoup. 3rd week, chiro and massage and hand walking. 4th week, light under saddle riding ONLY walk and trot, no small circles, no cantering no jumping. No fussing either - no manes pulled, no baths, no clipping etc. I usually went a step further and let Virgil get all shaggy and hair the whole winter until schooling shows started in February. He was brushed, hot toweled, etc and still looked good, but definitely not like a show horse.


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## Megora

Oh...my. 

I was at the barn and had a panic attack when I put the blanket on my guy. 

Remember I was fussing about buying him a blanket that isn't long enough? 

Well, he looked like he was wearing a dress when I put it on him. It's longer than any blanket I've gotten him before. 

Fortunately another boarder was there and she calmed me down when she looked over the blanket and checked it out on him. Heheh. 

I turned him loose inside the arena to see how he gets around wearing the blanket. He was trotting and galloping around fine. 

And of course he was going from teasing the Friesan stalled at the one end of the arena to sneaking in the hay stacks at the other end of the arena. 

I'll try to get pics of him before he ruins the blanket. I was very quick to take it off of him and stow it back in my locker. It's not blanket weather yet.... 

@Penny's Mom - that's insane! If you have a show horse in prime shape, you are asking for them to fall out of shape and pick up bad habits in those three months!


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## Ranger

Longer as in on the sides? Or longer from withers to tail? Could it be the cut of the blanket, like extra baggy in the haunches? That's why i can't buy Big D blankets. Even if they fit properly from withers to tail, the shoulder is tight and the huge baggy back half makes it look like Virgil is wearing a skirt. It's not the fit in that case, it's the cut. 

I didn't make it out to the barn tonight. Still slogging away on my annoying essay. But the end is in sight! (Even though i said that to myself at 2pm this afternoon). So tomorrow, I will be going out to see my love-muffin and taking pics of him in his new sheet. Hopefully it fits! It's a new brand. Then, like Megora, I will be taking it off him and storing it since while it IS blanket weather up here, it's definitely not sheet weather! The sheet will have to wait until next May or June! Or, realistically, until July.


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## Ranger

I finally got to go out and see the Virgeman today!! He is happy and looking good. Filling out nicely, though it was a little tricky to see since it was a little chilly out and he had fluffed up his coat. His round bale hasn't arrived yet, but he's on 4 (big) flakes of alfalfa plus 4 big flakes of timothy. I think the BO thinks he's been sheltered most of his life; she was saying he was reacting to people "popping" out of the walkway into his view, the quad, etc. Uh, no he's just a reactive kinda guy...he's been a show horse for 8 years! 

He's not in charge, which is the first time since he was 4. The other horse isn't mean but can get pretty bossy when Virgil's getting fed and chases him away, which is annoying. Especially since he tries to keep Virgil away from me. 

I brought Virgil into the barn today and he had to deal with a new type of door - Virgil hates doors - but was really good. A little looky and spooky since the barn is darker and lower ceilings than he's used to, but he relaxed after about 10 minutes. Started scratching his head on everything and then stepped in my tackbox, just like the old days!

Only downside is his coat is looking awful. He's an awkward between-colours right now and i think it looked worse with his coat being fluffed out, but yeesh. Also his mane has gone insane. It looks awful. Hopefully his new supplements kick in and start sleeking up his coat!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

DD's hunter actually changed color after he got healthy again. From an orangey chestnut to a milk chocolate bay. It will take some time, tho.

It's a beautiful day here, sunny and 60 and of course I'm all full of pain and down in the dumps...not staying on my diet always makes me cry. So, going to have a little bit of a ride; just the stuff we're good at like walk and jog. I think I need to get out of the house and into my horse for a while.


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## Ranger

Aw, horses are so good for the heart. I hope you have a lovely, uplifting ride!!

I'm going to head out again, too. I think it's time to start blanketing...REAL blanketing, not just sheets. -4 at nights and only up to 5 or 7 during the day. He's probably fine without one, but I want him to keep gaining weight and being cold won't help. So, off to the barn I go! With pockets full of carrots and apples!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Yes, being cold definitely uses up the calories. Ours are fat going into winter and just right coming out and we REALLY up the feed: a bale a day outside for 3 horses plus their night time stall hay. Plus medium weight blankets.

Nice ride. They were wascally wabbits. We didn't tune up in the ring, just got on and rode in the yard. WooHoo...school's out!!! Fun, not dangerous.

And how do they know, when the mounting block is positioned just so that 1/2 step towards the block and 1/2 step back makes it impossible to get on??? Once he quit f*rting around and stood still, I was able to mount from the 2 step. That's a first, usually it's my tall 3-stepper. I'm happy about that.


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## Ranger

Glad to hear you had a good ride! I gave Virgil a quick brush, put his oooold blanket on, and then stuffed him full of watermelon-molasses cookies. 

Here's the Virgeman from today, sporting his 8 yr old blanket that was once black and is now gray. I also had it made for him when he was much more TB looking and only 16hh at 4 yrs old. Then he shot up 2.5 inches, filled out and muscled up and I had me a warmblood! The blanket-maker had to put an insert in the blanket to make it fit him again!









Virgil wanting another watermelon-molasses cookie..."FEED ME!"









and a glam shot (I clipped his whiskers a few days ago)


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## Angelina

Nice pictures Ranger! I am glad he is doing so well! I hope you are feeling better to E!

I saw Mystery over the weekend. We've had gorgeous weather in the 70s and this weekend in the 80s. Unfortunately it brought out the ticks. He had them under his jaw and neck, belly and of course his man parts. All I had with me was some repel so I put that on him, let them soak and picked them out (with gloves). He enjoyed that.

BO has a almost 30 year old horse 'Zippy' that was abandoned a few years ago. He is a white arab and did everything for kids, gymkana, shows etc., etc. He just loves people and won't go eat out with the herd. Well he is dropping weight left and right and the BO is feeding him seperate with a couple flakes of alfafa a day. So I am giving Todd (the BO) some money toward buying him some senior feed and hope it helps. I think Todd is pretty generous supporting the old guy..had his teeth floated and dewormed, does his trimming and get no income from him. He even told me he ran into the old owner recently and asked if she wanted him back. "Oh no, I have enough horses". I cannot stand this 'throw away' attitude...

So that is the extent of my horsey adventures...just to keep the thread going...K

PS picture is Mystery leading the herd...


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Wow, love the picture. We've never had that many, nice to see a real 'herd'. How big is their field?

I should do something with Daz today but I'm too lazy to walk 1/2 mile (RT) to go get him. But it's beautiful, 66 degrees and sunny. Probably lots of flies.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Ranger, how do you keep the other horse away when you're feeding cookies? I always end up with a good-natured shoving match with Daz being left out because he's not pushy.


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## Angelina

Go do something with Daz! You are so lucky to be able to do it!!! Think about it...soon you will have snow on the ground! ....

The entire ranch is 280 acres but divided into pastures. He also raise grass fed (organic) beef which is an eye opener for me. If one gets sick they cannot use antibiodics and it most like dies. But that is another subject...

Mystery's pastures are around 30 acres but also divided by gates. Todd rotates them and rests them; for example he just opened up the front pasture after keeping it closed all summer so as the grazed pastures now have green grass popping up, the horses are in the front eating the mature stuff. He also feeds the horses.

We have the Mediterranian climate here and just had rain a couple weeks ago. This means we have new green grass coming up (candy) and all winter it will be green, green, green. Winter is like spring back east. Summer it becomes brown (Cal. hills of gold...).

Now go play with Daz and think of us poor people who are working and cannot go ride!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Of course, you are right! I'll put out my "gone fishin' " sign. Besides, it's nearly 3 p.m. here, he'll probably come when I call him. ttyl


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## Ranger

Angelina said:


> Nice pictures Ranger! I am glad he is doing so well! I hope you are feeling better to E!
> 
> I saw Mystery over the weekend. We've had gorgeous weather in the 70s and this weekend in the 80s. Unfortunately it brought out the ticks. He had them under his jaw and neck, belly and of course his man parts. All I had with me was some repel so I put that on him, let them soak and picked them out (with gloves). He enjoyed that.
> 
> BO has a almost 30 year old horse 'Zippy' that was abandoned a few years ago. He is a white arab and did everything for kids, gymkana, shows etc., etc. He just loves people and won't go eat out with the herd. Well he is dropping weight left and right and the BO is feeding him seperate with a couple flakes of alfafa a day. So I am giving Todd (the BO) some money toward buying him some senior feed and hope it helps. I think Todd is pretty generous supporting the old guy..had his teeth floated and dewormed, does his trimming and get no income from him. He even told me he ran into the old owner recently and asked if she wanted him back. "Oh no, I have enough horses". I cannot stand this 'throw away' attitude...
> 
> So that is the extent of my horsey adventures...just to keep the thread going...K
> 
> PS picture is Mystery leading the herd...


That's a great pic!! Is that the gray arab in it? How nice of the BO to look after him. I hate the throwaway society we've become. I had so many people tell me I should sell Virgil once he went lame and had to be retired. So, what? He's now "useless" because I can't ride him/show/jump him? BS. He carted me around for most of his life, he's earned his retirement. His retirement in a nice paddock with cookies and brushing sessions as opposed to be selling to god knows who and not knowing what fate awaits him. Actually, I have a pretty good idea of what his fate would have been if I'd sold him; lame plus mental issues? Not good.



Penny's Mom said:


> Ranger, how do you keep the other horse away when you're feeding cookies? I always end up with a good-natured shoving match with Daz being left out because he's not pushy.


Usually it's not a problem since Virgil's always been alpha but now this bossy dark bay keeps pushing Virgil away and it bugs me!! I either go into the paddock and shoo him away, or shoo him away from the outside...sometimes I end up shooing Virgil away accidentally...he's pretty reactionary!:uhoh::doh:



Angelina said:


> Go do something with Daz! You are so lucky to be able to do it!!! Think about it...soon you will have snow on the ground! ....
> 
> The entire ranch is 280 acres but divided into pastures. He also raise grass fed (organic) beef which is an eye opener for me. If one gets sick they cannot use antibiodics and it most like dies. But that is another subject...
> 
> Mystery's pastures are around 30 acres but also divided by gates. Todd rotates them and rests them; for example he just opened up the front pasture after keeping it closed all summer so as the grazed pastures now have green grass popping up, the horses are in the front eating the mature stuff. He also feeds the horses.
> 
> We have the Mediterranian climate here and just had rain a couple weeks ago. This means we have new green grass coming up (candy) and all winter it will be green, green, green. Winter is like spring back east. Summer it becomes brown (Cal. hills of gold...).
> 
> Now go play with Daz and think of us poor people who are working and cannot go ride!


Oh wow, that sounds great! See, that's what I wanted for Virgil when I found the last place we were at...but sadly the BO didn't seem to care about the horses and their physiology. Not feeding for 12 hours and thinking that's ok? Not cool. 

The place we're at now offers grass in the summer and rotates the paddocks between summer and fall. When Virgil went into it 2 weeks ago there was knee high pretty dead grass and now it's gone. I think next summer I'm going to ask to have him pasture boarded so he can run around and graze all summer. He'll love it! If they stay in the paddocks, they open the paddocks to an individual grass area and they can graze for 4-6 hours a day. Either way, it'll be more grass than he's used to!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I had a good time with Daz...not sure he appreciated being put to work.:no: I lunged him in the side reins and was disappointed at his difficulty breathing...just really huffing and puffing.

His weight is a real problem. I opened the back pasture 2 weeks ago. There are 6 pastures that are gated and rotated. I decided to open the way back, next to the woods, pasture for a few weeks before hunting season.

Daz has plumped up about 100 pounds. He is positively obese. And it's not winter coat, I pinched him and checked. So I need to figure out how to keep him outside with minimal grass. I think he's going out 1/2 day with the other 2 with minimal hay. Then 1/2 day in the barn yard where there's a bit of grass to pick at. I'll be able to give the other 2 a snack if necessary. I hope he does okay being by himself. He has a tendency to run/pace the fence line. Although it's exercise, he gets sweaty, digs up the turf and turns sharply. I worry about his legs.

I can't wait for deep snow cover. It's the only time his weight is under control. Most old horsemen would call him an easy keeper. Actually, it's very difficult to keep him at a healthy weight.


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## Ranger

Virgil turned into a fat potato when he was first retired. Retired + round bale = potato with legs. Exercise for him wasn't an option since I was told he'd be lucky to live out the year comfortably...thank god that didn't come true! 

Have you looked into a grazing muzzle? You need to spend some time getting the horse used to wearing it and putting it on/off, but usually with a treat or two it's okay. Virgil had an old school basket muzzle on him for 8 hours a day and wasn't blanketed until December, which meant cold temps to -15ish (and he didn't grow much of a coat). He couldn't drink with the basket muzzle (it was too big to fit in the automatic waterer) but the vet said that's fine since horses don't usually drink throughout the day. You could also look at the nylon muzzles with the hole in the bottom; they let horses graze still but slows them way down and they can drink with it, since it's more flexible. Just hooks over the halter. Virgil eventually figured out how to take it off and the BO got too annoyed putting it on him multiple times a day. Worth a shot...I always worry about the heavy ones since it's so much extra weight on their joints, especially bad for the older guys. if Virgil gets too fat on his round bale (which is coming in next week), he's going to get his grain cut back to nada and probably get moved into the fat pen next summer. I'm hoping I can start riding him soon, though so that'll help...even if it's just walk and trot!!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I've thought about the muzzle and got turned off by the price...stupid, I know. Plus I think Harry will pull on it; those two are quite 'chewy' together and play a lot of tuggy with halters. But at this point, I think I need to give it a try. 

Today's plan is that he has been out since 6:30 this morning. I will go out about 10 and bring him into the barn yard. We use it as a round pen for lunging; it's about 20m x 20m with a little rectangle off one side for accessing the barn door. The grass is very eaten down because we opened the gates and gave them access a couple of weeks ago when it was cold, rainy and windy. But there's enough to pick at.

Jennifer feeds and turns out in the a.m. until fire arm season starts. Then I take over so they get turned out after day light. I turn out and clean. I will have to go back and move him to the barn yard. Then I have to go back again at 5 to bring them in once we get into real winter. I end spending all day doing nothng but horses. This is kind of why we wanted to board them all out this year and/or have Daz in training so he'd get worked but it just wasn't meant to be. I haven't figured out how NOT to be going to the barn 3 times a day.

On the bright side, I'm saving up what I would have spent for board on 2 and training on 1 of them towards a new show saddle. It's gonna be a long, cold winter!


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## Angelina

PENNY'S MOM: Do you grain them at all? If so you probably do not need to especially if they are not working it off. Here I don't mind the horses getting a bit heavy before winter as they will use that fat to keep warm but, I do watch out for cresty necks and signs of I.R. intolerance. That goes hand in hand with foundering and brings up totally new and serious issues.....K


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## Elisabeth Kazup

He gets 1/2 cup of grain...just enough so he doesn't feel left out. I think I know what plumped him so much in the last month. I opened the back pasture AND we got a new load of the better, alphalfa hay. He can't eat grass AND good hay.

I went to my hay guy today and got some stemmy, stalky grass hay. Just roughage to keep his insides moving. Also we're going to feed hay in the stalls, only so he doesn't get the better hay or eat more than his share. He tends to grab big mouthfuls and chew fast. He always gets more than anyone else even though he's low man because he eats so fast.

I think this change with more exercise will keep him from gaining any more. He literally froze his butt off last winter...much thinner in the spring, much healthier weight. 

Having lost my darling Rocket to Cushing's, I'm especially concerned about I.R. and founder. So far so good with Daz, he's not cresty but he does look like a fat draft horse.


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## Ranger

Is there a dirt paddock you could make into a fat pen? Or a paddock you could turn into a dirt paddock? Toss him in there with some of that stemmy hay, let him out to graze for a few hours, and back into the fat pen. If he's not great by himself (I can completely relate), what about putting the other ones in a paddock right next to it, so they can visit over the fence? So he could be in the fat pen by himself for 6-10 hours a day and then out with his friends for the rest.

If you can't longe, what about handwalking him around the property a few times a day? Are there any hills you could walk him up? You could do some in hand work with a lunging cavesson/surcingle and some side reins, too. I had to do that with Virgil for a few years but it was more for his issues on the ground than anything else. It's a great, non-impact way to build up the topline.


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## Luv4puppiessk

My Ride last night 
My friend helped me setup some jumps in the indoor arena since its finally getting cold in California and dark early. We set up a small course. We had four verticals and one line. Terra is half thoroughbred and half quarter horse. She loves the jumps!


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## Ranger

Very cute horse! I especially love her jumping in the last pic - nice knees and neck! How old is Terra?

Thanks for sharing!


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## Luv4puppiessk

thanks shes a good girl! and I love that one too shes got good form there.
and she's 10 years old !


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Very nice girl!! And you look great too! She looks like a fun ride and sweet.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Poor Daz doesn't like his diet hay. It's stemmy and stalky. I wondered about that. Last night after feeding, Jen and I chatted in the barn a bit. Daz would get a mouthful, chew it for a while and then spit it out over his half door. But this morning it was all gone. I know how he feels...my diet food is tastey enough but it isn't what I'd RATHER have. :no:

I'm letting him have one flake of the good stuff at night and replacing 3/4 of his daily ration with the crummy stuff. I luff my hay guy...he has all qualities of hay available and it's all put up clean and cured properly. Plus since I'm an old customer, figuratively as well as literally, it's only $3 a bale for huge bales.


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## Angelina

OOOOOHHHH, Love those big red mares! Pennys Mom that is a good price...hay is so expensive out here this year. But yeah, you don't need to feed that alfalfa especially if trying to trim him down! I'm glad you are working with Daz and getting out there! K


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Thanks, Kim. I'm seeing an upside to being there so much everyday: I'm getting used to the drop in temps day by day. Also getting used to working in less than ideal conditions. It's misty/rainy today and our 'round pen' is soggy so I'm not going to work him there today. Don't want to tear up the grass and make it full of foot prints. I think I will line drive him at a walk around the yard if it stops raining. Better than nothing. I have to earn my new saddle. :wink:


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## Maxs Mom

Cute mare Luv4puppiessk!!! I didn't know they had indoor arenas in CA. Learn something new every day. LOL 

Just checking in on the horse thread. Been toying with the idea of trying to catch a ride somewhere, but still don't really have the time. I think going through all my horse stuff has made me a bit nostalgic. I have a friend who is going to buy my bit box, and wall box that hubby made for me. I feel bad selling them but it was his idea. We really can't use them for anything. I have six trunks around my house. I am selling 2 of those too. 

I have a lot of stuff. It took up pages when I was writing stuff down and that is just the major stuff I could sell for anything. I have so much. What was really funny was how many pairs of spurs I have. I do NOT remember buying all of them. I swear I have over 20 pair. I only wore 2-3. LOL It is amazing how much horse stuff you accumulate over the years. 

I haven't heard from Petie. I guess I should write Sarah. I do want to know how he is doing but it makes me miss him more. I am sure he is LOVING Georgia. Especially as winter is coming here in MI.


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## Ranger

Aw, it is hard to go through all the riding stuff. You're stronger than me...I JUST did that a few months ago and Virgil's been retired since Oct 2006. I found all his show stuff, including the shipping boots/wraps and show sheet he was wearing at the show where he injured himself. Sigh. I've got the opposite problem regarding spurs! I had 3-4 sets and now I can only find my old pair of spurs that aren't long enough...no idea where the other sets went. Though I do know when people found out I was leaving the old barn, they considered my stuff "fair game", including my brand new body clippers...


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## Angelina

Regarding getting rid of stuff...consider donating to a rescue. Many here auction them off and they are deductable. Also Ranger lots and lots of indoor arenas here in CA. especially because it rains so much during the winters.

Have a great weekend all and don't forget to hug your horses!! (and dogs!). K


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## Ranger

I gave away lots of my stuff to riding school barns or to friends. When I had to pack up my stuff when I moved from the barn I had been at for over 8 years...wow, I couldn't believe the crap I had! I ended up giving away 2 blankets, 2 fly sheets, and some saddle pads I didn't like. Made me feel good to know that the school horses would benefit from some warmer blankets (as opposed to their paper thin 15 yr old blankets) and some plushier saddle pads.

I'm fairly annoyed today. I was telling myself all week that if I got enough school work done by the weekend, I'd go ride Virgil...for the first time in three years. But, it's saturday and I've barely started the two essays I have due. One tomorrow and one on wednesday. Argh! So, no riding for me. Just pick up some horse feed if I have time and then a quick visit. Guess I'll have to ride next week!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I have a question for you guys. Daz's lunge work is up to 17 minutes now and he gets nicely warmed up but not hot. I feel bad getitng him warm and then sticking him out in the windy pasture. I lunge outside so he's working in the cold/wind.

Is it bad to put a warm horse out after getting their blood circulating and muscles warmed up? It 'feels' bad to me. I'm wondering if I should blanket him after his workout. If I worked him late in the day, I could leave him in but then that schedule kind of wrecks my own diet supper preparations which I desparately need not to be wrecked. 

What do you think is the best way to do this?


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## Megora

Penny's Mom said:


> I have a question for you guys. Daz's lunge work is up to 17 minutes now and he gets nicely warmed up but not hot. I feel bad getitng him warm and then sticking him out in the windy pasture. I lunge outside so he's working in the cold/wind.
> 
> Is it bad to put a warm horse out after getting their blood circulating and muscles warmed up? It 'feels' bad to me. I'm wondering if I should blanket him after his workout. If I worked him late in the day, I could leave him in but then that schedule kind of wrecks my own diet supper preparations which I desparately need not to be wrecked.
> 
> What do you think is the best way to do this?


If he's steaming I'd put a cooler on and keep him in a stall until he cools down. But it's so hard at this time of the year. It doesn't take too much for the horses (carrying all that extra coat and fat) to get hot. :uhoh:

My guy is wearing his brand new blanket!!!! If I head out to the barn tonight, I might try to get pics. <- It depends on how fast I can get pumpkins carved for halloween. : I don't care about the pumpkins or trickortreaters, but I want my seeds, darnit. I love baking them (garlic salt, worcestshire sauce, and butter) for a crispy snack. 

My barn lady thinks the blanket is too loose around the shoulders. Told me that depending on if she has any new spare blankets she'll switch it out for me. But if not, it's not _so_ big on him. And should work. She loves the color. :uhoh: I'm going to suggest that on a nice day (if we have any), I take the blanket home to sew a dart in the sides, or put a velcro strip on to custom fit it. But you see why I avoid spending too much on blankets.


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## Angelina

> I have a question for you guys. Daz's lunge work is up to 17 minutes now and he gets nicely warmed up but not hot. I feel bad getitng him warm and then sticking him out in the windy pasture. I lunge outside so he's working in the cold/wind.
> 
> Is it bad to put a warm horse out after getting their blood circulating and muscles warmed up? It 'feels' bad to me. I'm wondering if I should blanket him after his workout. If I worked him late in the day, I could leave him in but then that schedule kind of wrecks my own diet supper preparations which I desparately need not to be wrecked.
> 
> What do you think is the best way to do this?


Is he warm and sweaty, or just warm? May I ask what is the purpose of lunging him? Are you trying to work his cardiovascular, his topline (going over poles) or behavioral? When you lunge are you changing directions and working on flexion? Is he clipped at all and will he be? Does his chest and between his hinds get soaked in sweat and do you have to rinse it off when done?

My rule of thumb is never blanket a wet horse and/or turn a wet horse out into the wind...you have to give them opportunity to dry. IF the horse gets sweaty you can put a polyester type blanket under his normal blanket or sheet to wick up the moisture, then remove it after a good half hour or so. You do not want to trap moisture between the coat and the blanket or they will become more chilled.

For me winter meant a entire different working schedule...I had to have the horse back in plenty of time to dry especially if I had to sponge the sweat off him first. That just means we started earlier, came back earlier. I never blanket my horse (no snow here) and never clip. Nature's blanket works great as long as it is dry enough to get allow those air pockets to form next to the skin. He also has a shelter in the pasture if he so chooses...

When I was conditioning at the beginning of the ride season I would do low impact work with Mystery. This would include walking over poles to lift the feet. If the roundpen was muddy he would walk in the mud...believe me that creates a big workout. Riding up hills is another great way to get them into shape. And of course LSD...Long Slow Distance works them up and gets them ready for interval training. That is a combination of slow then fast rides. But their muscles have to be up to it first...

I normally take it easy in the winter as well and give the the horse time off. I would do groundwork if he needed it; exercises to enforce my leadership and to get him to flex, change direction, back up etc. etc. Once they are in shape and have a good base, it is easy to get them back into shape again. They are really amazing creatures.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Not hot, just warmed up. I keep the exercise low-key, just to get him moving w/t/c. I think even if it 'feels' wrong to me...like pulling the covers off the bed when you're nice and warm...it will help him burn some fat if he's turned out without a blanket as long as it isn't brutally cold...like below 20 or wind chill in the teens.

Kim, he's on a diet and exercise program. I lunge him because that's about all I can do with him for exercise right now. I am riding challenged with him. So far I'm up to: got on once 2 weeks ago and walked around for 10 minutes. Hoping to show him at least Intro Level dressage next year.

http://www.usdf.org/docs/tests/dressage/introa.pdf

Also, he lunges completely on voice command. We work on flexion with circle in/circle out. I usually have him in side reins. I plan on line driving him tomorrow and riding again on Wednesday...such as it is. I'm at least going to get on and walk around some more. And a little trot. He's really fun to work with on the ground.

He's very obese and when I first started lunging him he seem to labor with his breathing. He's much better now, I think he's lost 25-40 pounds in the last 2 weeks. Also, he's on low calorie hay. Everybody gets fed separately in their stalls so he only gets what he's allowed. Then they go out to the pasture which is very sparse.


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## Angelina

I think if he is not sweating and just warm you are fine turning him back out. His body will continue to heat him from the inside and you will probably see steam rise off his body as he 'cools' down. I would just suggest you make sure he has a good warm up and cool down before and after you canter him so you do not have any muscle strains or cramping. Just being able to move in the pasture will help him tremendously after exercise....


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## Elisabeth Kazup

We start by circling out at the walk, about 1/2 of the lunge line. Then trot out to the end of the line. He does several revolutions before getting more line. I canter him when he's at the end of the line. Then we circle back in with downward transitions.

I usually reverse after a complete out and in. 

Oh, and he's usually been turned out for a few hours before I school him.


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## Ranger

Yep, I agree with Angelina. Make sure he's not sweating, even on the 'hidden' spots: lower chest, between the hind legs, etc. But, if you're longing outside in the wind, chances are he's not going to be getting too sweaty since the wind will be drying it off. An idea for if it gets chillier would be to lunge him in a quarter sheet for warm up, remove it for the hard work, and put it back on for the cool down. By the time he's cool, take it off and he can go back to the paddock.

Also, make sure there's a cut-off point. Sometimes it gets cold enough up here that the horses work in quarter sheets the whole time, mostly because we're not going to be doing hard enough work to keep them warm because it's so cold. If it's colder then -15, the quarter sheets stay on, indoor or out, and it's just walk/trotting with hardly any consistent cantering. Once it hits -25, the horses aren't even brought in - never mind worked - because it's unfair to them to get their core temps up, then put them back outside. So, have a cut off point of when it's too cold to work outside, with or without a quarter sheet. 

Also, exciting news: I will DEFINITELY be riding Virgil this weekend!! First time in about 2-3 years. I can't longe him beforehand due to his leg issues so it might be a bit of a rodeo. While I know for conditioning purposes, he should mostly walk...I have a feeling holding him down to even a trot will be hard. Last time I rode him, he was showing off his extended trot and bucking whenever he thought I was asking him to slow down. He's never been in this ring before, either. It's bigger than the old one and the footing is a lot softer (almost too deep) so it'll be better for the concussion on his joints.

I'm so excited! I'm hoping one of my friends and old students will want to do a bit of a half lease on him and ride him 1-2 times a week once he gets fit (and sane). Here's hoping!


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## Maxs Mom

I use polar fleece (wicks moisture away from the horse) coolers and I still have and LOVE my 1970's holey coolers. They look like fish net. I put those on first then the polar fleece over top. It allows air to flow under the cooler and my horses cool and dry quickly. Also using a chamois to towel them will help them dry quickly. It is hard this time of year, they are growing their winter coats, but the weather might still be warmer. 

I went to a horse show this weekend. I sold my bit box and wall box to a friend and I went to the show to deliver them to her, watch and visit. I had a great time. It was just a really small schooling show but it was fun to see a lot of people. I got a lot of amazed hello's since I have not been around shows for so many years. Of course the anal side of me came out. Kids from my barn were heading to the ring with shavings in their tails.... Uh nope. I got brushes and brushed out tails, smoothed out sweat marks. Cheered the kids and their ribbons. Got to snuggle with some horses, I love horse smell. I decided "maybe" part of the reason I have not wanted to get on one, is the fear I will want to start up again. I don't have time or money. 

Found out the facility having the show is having a dressage show (once a month for the next three months) also. They have a consignment tack shop there, so I am going to try to get my silk top hat there before the weekend. The only place I can sell that is to a dressage rider. I have no dressage connections. So that is a thought. I hate the consignment commissions but if it sells for a good price....


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## Elisabeth Kazup

How exciting to ride again! Congratulations! And hoping he is sensible and keeps the rodeo-ing to a minimum.

I think my biggest deterrent to working him will be the snow before it gets too cold. I don't see how I can safely lunge him when it gets slippery. I will probably go to line driving around the property. SIL has a new snow thrower for the tractor...a BIG one...so I'm hoping he or we can blow out a path. But with the frozen ground, it will be straight lines only. 

I don't mind light work for them when it's in the 20s but lower than that is probably too cold and would have to be with blankets on. There's no protection from the wind there. It's usually blowing double there what it is here. 

So I'm hoping I can get a lot of weight off him in the next few weeks. If we have a winter like last year, that will take off the rest and we'll be good to go in the spring.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I used to have really neat coolers that I made myself out of polar fleece. It went from ears to tail and had a couple of clips under the neck. I made the cinch 12" wide. I'll have to make Daz one of his own. 

I also made quarter sheets. Rocket had an assortment of holiday and winter themed. He especially like his Snobear one!  The skiing penguins with Santa hats was also a favorite of his.

Where are the schooling shows being held.

DH is all excited about getting Daz back to work and me getting back to riding him. He's all excited about me showing him again. I don't think he'll be all excited when he finds out I don't have a stitch of dressage clothes or boots.:no: That would be AFTER I get my dream silver saddle. :curtain:


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## Angelina

Polar fleece. I forgot what it was called, thank you! That stuff is great!

Good for you Ranger! I need to hop on Mystery and would love to do some bareback in the pasture but need a bit more confidence. He is the type of horse you can get on after months off and he behaves but since he is a bit herd bound it could get risky. There is something to be said for having a (almost too) mellow horse!

Penny's Mom: I hope you are starting your Christmas list for your hubby!

Well, I am waiting for word from my riding partner (before I had to retire Mystery) about her little arab Jeep. I am afraid he will be put down today and am heartbroken. He became IR resistant although he is young (and an arab!) and around 6 months ago foundered with some rotation. No more pasture, very low protein foods....she was so careful but he kept getting worst. She put him with a very (expensive) but well known equine sports vet facility (same one I take Mystery too) whose had him for 3 months and still he is getting worst. Today she meets with two vets and a decision. His quality of life would be pasture pony at best IF they can get it under control and so far they are not. She cannot afford more care and I am afraid today will be the day. I am prepared for the news but so sad; will probably know tonight if he is gone.

I am heartbroken for her, and for Jeep...he is a beautiful horse with quite a one person personality. It is sad.

Here is a picture of him at one of the last rides I did with them...


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Oh my, please give her a hug for me. I lost Rocket to Cushing's, I.R. and founder. We tried so hard for 2 years to get him pasture sound but he went downhill too far. The rotation from so many flares of founder was so profound, at the end he was getting 8 bute tabs a day and still could barely walk. He lost the ability to fight off infection. His frogs were nearly gone from thrush and even cleaning and treating 3x a day couldn't halt it. He got abscessess that we would open but the sole of his foot wouldn't grow the opening closed.

It's such a painful life. I feel so bad that I kept trying. Bless her heart for letting him go. Lovely boy, lovely place to ride.


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## Maxs Mom

Penny's Mom said:


> Where are the schooling shows being held.


They are in Chelsea on Liberty Rd, at Woodbine Farm (formerly Stoney Ridge Farm) They were pretty lax at the hunter show. A lot of breeches and half chaps. Not a lot of hunt coats but of course the approved head gear. They let one family ride the same pony in the short stirrup stuff. Triplets it was really cute. It is just a schooling show. 

Sorry to hear about Jeep. Please extend my condolences.


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## Ranger

Aw, I'm sorry to hear about Jeep...looks like a real cutie in the pic.

Here's a question for everyone:
So I moved V into a new place where it's pretty much full board. This isn't 'new' to me but the BO includes a lot of extras that ARE new to me! Like, feeding his grain every day to him at no extra charge and blanketing him for free, too. This is the first time I've had this since it's not usual for a horse on 24/7 turnout.

The only tricky thing is I'm not used to someone making decisions FOR me, regarding him. Don't get me wrong the BO is GREAT and I really like her and trust her horse knowledge. It's just weird. Like, now V is blanketed according to if she thinks he needs a blanket. She checks him, assures me he's warm, etc. but the other day I put a light winter blanket on, it got taken off, and since then he's been wearing his unlined rain sheet. He is NOT cold, he gets checked frequently throughout the day...it's just odd.

The feeding...that's interesting. I cut back on his grain when we moved since he was getting more hay and thus getting fatter. And he's not a hard keeper, which is what made his weight loss earlier in the year so shocking. Now he's got a round bale in and I'm anticipating him getting fat, so his grain has cut back even more. I talked to BO about watering his feed since he's got some powders in it, and she said she had been mixing it with a little beet pulp and that had been wetting it down. While she didn't run it past me before doing it, I didn't think it was a big deal; I figure she thinks he needs fattening up because she doesn't know the round bale is going to do it. (I think she thinks he IS a hard keeper). 

All was well until I got my board and saw that I'd been charged for the beet pulp, which I think is unnecessary anyway. So i ask her politely to not feed it and she agrees...and says she'll mix his grain with the hay cubes I have left. I'm definitely getting the feeling she thinks I'm not feeding him enough! So...is this normal? Like I said, as long as he's been healthy, shiny and happy - which has been since i've owned him - I've never had anyone ask me about my decisions regarding him. And now, I'm trying to get used to someone making the decisions for him! Is this normal for full care? Will this feeling go away...or does everyone think I'm crazy? I've usually had BO's caring not enough, not too much!!

Oh, and Virgil is very happy with his round bale. First one he's had in 3 years. He's back to his routine of snacking then sleeping in the sun, repeat all day. No more worrying/stress about meal times and no more other horses stealing all his portion! I am SO happy I moved him!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Argh, that's the problem I have with boarding. I'm such a control freak when it comes to how to raise my kids or keep my animals. 

Based on mistakes I've made in the past, I suggest you keep a very open, honest discussion going with her. Going as far as a once a month sit down over coffee to discuss how everything is going. She may be used to other boarders who are happy to drop it all in her lap and just doesn't know that you like to be consulted before changes...AND charges...are made.

The discssion would also give you a chance to tell her how happy Virgil is at her barn, all the things she's doing that you appreciate...a chance to give her some thank you's and atta boy's...something I think barn owners don't get much of.

Is Virgil not eating his grain because of his supplements (powder)? We never wet our boys grain. I found that Daz absolutely didn't like one of his vitamins and was leaving most of his feed so I quit giving it to him. 

It sounds like you have a 95% good relationship going. Considering it's a new one, you definitely have to let her know how involved you want to be.

Around here full service means you still would have to pay for blanketing, holding/cross tying for farrier, additional 'in' time for illness/injury. I was even charged extra for bedding for a messy horse at one place. And that place, who promised me they'd be in for the night at 6 would make mer turn him back out @ 9 p.m. after driving him. I hated having him all warm and then making him go outside when it was cold (20 F and dark) Turns out that 6 was what was promised to get us to move there...midnight is what was actually being in time.


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## Angelina

well Jeep is still with us but more consulting today...thanks girls...I think I know what the final outcome will be. If not today next month....he is on a downward spiral just as Penny's mom describes...

Ranger: I've been to many, many barns and the tough thing is you don't know how knowledgable your barnowner really is but she thinks she knows it all! It will be a hard balance keeping her ego satisfied without having any harm done to your horse. Beet Pulp is wonderful if the horse will eat it; I personally would be happy if my BO would feed it and stay away from the grains. But the bottom line is everything going into your horse should be YOUR decision; not hers. What if he has medical issues and cannot be fed certain things? She should ask you first.

What she is doing with the blanket is 'over care' ...better then 'under care' but not if he is sweating in them. If her blanket is not harming him and you expect he will stay with her all winter then you should decide if you want to rock the boat or not. Pick your arguements. I like the once a month idea of having coffee and a chat although there is also a risk to that! Horse people have such strong opinions....

There is an article I think in this month's equis about how horses grow their coats. It is determined from daylight,yes, but also from environment. You could let her know you want him to grow a nice winter coat and the means keeping the blanket off until it gets REALLY cold. There is plenty of research on this so you could always print it out.

But really, you will need to determine if you can live with this personality all winter; is she harming him in any way? You are not going to want to have to move him in the middle of the season. Good luck and let us know how it goes!


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## Ranger

Thanks for the advice, guys. I really, really like this BO and her management, it's just so different than what I've had before. Me blanketing, me feeding, and nothing else. With this BO, once the horses are under her 'umbrella' of care then she's going to take care of them! I like the idea of chatting and keeping expectations - on both sides - clear. She really is concerned about Virgil's best interests which is how the whole feed thing came up. She wants to give more calories so she was giving beet pulp and now she's giving him the extra hay cubes I had left from our barn move. 

Penny's Mom - She's adding the wet stuff - beet pulp and now soaked alfalfa - because Virgil likes his grain wet. Sometimes the powders can bother his airway, which is why I can't feed ground flax, so I feel better wetting it and he likes it eating it better.

Angelina - Sadly, it's ME wanting him to wear the thicker blanket! He doesn't get much of a winter coat and still trying to get weight on him, so I had put an actual blanket on. He acted the fool, got it soaking wet by running around so she took it off and put a sheet on...and says he's doing fine in the rain sheet. 

I'm sure we'll figure it out soon. I imagine its just growing pains and me getting used to 'full care'. I am really happy with the place so far!


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## Angelina

ohhhhh gotcha! Well according to that article you keep them on light or no blanket in the fall and it will grown it thicker! Lets hope that is true! You really are lucky to have someone so attentive! Is that big bay still bossing him around or is he moved somewhere else?


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## Ranger

Well...I tried it for a few years when he got too rotund. I thought not having his winter blanket would help him shiver off some pounds, so he didn't wear a blanket from September til December...once it dropped to -15 or colder, I put a light one (most years I'd do a heavy one or double blanket if he'd been clipped). By January, he still didn't have much of a coat plus he was miserable. Some horses grow coats like yaks up here! He just never has. 

He is still in with the big bay and I think they're doing a power shift now that there's other horses by them and Virgil is getting less stressed and more his usual self. Case in point, last time I was out I was giving Virgil cookies and Adam (big bay) came over but didn't chase Virgil away...he got to Virgil's hip and stopped, and Virgil was pinning his ears but not moving. So, I'm not sure what's going on. I imagine Virgil's going to make a bid for alpha soon. I can understand why he was happy to be a follower the first few weeks when he was nervous and stressed; that's not a good alpha. But now his confidence is coming out again. I hope he will be...I hate having him getting chased away when I'm trying to fuss over him!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Good News! Daz's diet is working. The surcingle started out with cinch straps barely meeting top of buckle now reaches it easily, threads through and tightens easily. Another week or 2 and I'll have to take it up on the off side. 

He's up to working 30 minutes now. The work is somewhat easier for him because I've been ground driving him...a lot more work for me!!! That's a win-win. 

I'd forgotten how much fun he is to work with and what a love-sick puppy he turns into with a little attention. For him, work is love; he's such a sweetie. I was brushing his glorious tail and he was so relaxed the crossties were holding his head up. I still remember when he was a baby the first time he let me get behind him to brush his tail. Before that moment, I followed him around his stall brushing like crazy. Finally he stood still, munched on his hay and got so relaxed he was (as my mom used to say) running in the cracks. He has loved getting his tail brushed ever since.

I'm hoping to ride him this weekend. Me and Ranger going for it!


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## Ranger

I had such a great time with Virgil today!! There were some...yahoos in the barn when I went out there, so I waited til they left before bringing in Virgil. He doesn't need people waving brooms around, slinging cords around, or talking in super high pitched voices. Neither do I, for that matter. But once they left, I brought Virgil in. He was sooo much more relaxed than the other times. Got a nice brushing, hooves picked and a little hot towelling since his skin is looking rough. It's all scurfy and dry though his coat is looking nice and shiny. 

Sadly, didn't get to ride him. There weren't any horses in the ring and I didn't want him to freak out and spoil our nice time since he hates being by himself (especially in new places). So, we went back outside and did some in-hand work for a few minutes and then he went back to his paddock. It was a beautiful day to be outside at the stable!! Sunny, a wee bit chilly, and no wind at all. Spoiled Virgil with some granny smith apples and mints. Absolutely fantastic day! Tomorrow, we're going to do some in-hand work. I dug out my lunging surcingle, side-reins, dressage whip and longe line so we're all set. Whoo!

Hope everyone else had a great day with their horses, too!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Sounds like just what you and Virgil needed. No need to rush, ground work will just make him better and better.

I didn't get to ride either. DD was gone in the afternoon. Today it's so windy I don't think I could lunge effectively before riding. So, going over at 4 to wash his tail. Going to let it air dry over night and put it up tomorrow.

There will be other days....


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## Angelina

Hi horsey friends,

I am glad you got to visit and play with your horses, even if you did not ride. I visited with Mystery on Sat., love that whinny from across the pasture and the trot to the gate. He has a nice coat coming in and had just finished breaksfast so he was ready to nap. What a life.

Had an unexpected painful experience yesterday; one unexpected and one I don't want to tell my local horsey friends as it will only make them feel bad. Was walking the dogs and 4 riders went by, all at a trot dressed in their biothane endurance garb. Watched as they rode past (grabbed Cannellas collar and fed her treats), watched the flea bitten arab on the end act up a bit, riders all smiling, having fun. I've spend so many of those days on horseback; have been so lucky, but it really hit me hard those days are over. I have not ridden my horse since last fall (not a real ride) and I am not going to cause him pain, but man did it hurt seeing them go by.

I had a dream (nightmare) and all I remember was waking up yelling I can't handle not having a horse! I don't know if it is hormones hitting me or if it has just sunk in; but it was (is) just so painful retiring one's horse and not being about to afford a second. I knew this day would come and it is really here...

On the plus I am going to put out my connections and try and find a freisian to ride for my birthday...just a lesson but that is ok. I have 'Freisian friends' and it will be my 50th, so a special day and a special horse. Next spring I am going to take some tax return money and sponsor a horse for 3 -4 months, I have plenty of rescue friends who would love me to sponsor and try to get a horse adopted for them. So those are the positive things to look forward too.

Until then I will live via my horsey friends here locally....so get out there and ride! You never know when it will be your last one...

Kimberly (&Mystery the Morab; soon to be 25)


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## Angelina

Well I made an appointment for a lesson this Friday...why wait. It is with:

www.*blacksterlingfriesians*.com/

Wish me luck! K


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## Angelina

One of my friends who breeds a couple Friesian mares a year and is in the 'club' is arranging for me to go on a drive with her friend Ann and Ann's gelding in the grape fields at her house in Napa on Dec 3rd! I'm so excited! My friend will meet me there 'with bubbly' and of course my partner will go (she is afraid to ride but maybe she will join us in the carriage)...how exciting! I love Friesians; could never afford one (or afford to campaign one) but have been around them quite a bit as there are alot of Freisian breeders here who also allow boarding on their ranches. I am feeling better!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Sounds so wonderful, so exciting and best of all: so postitive. Turning your grief into a way forward.

I know just how you felt. For years after I lost Rocket, I could not bear to see a horse and carriage. I avoided the carriage classes at shows like they were the plague.

When I knew that at best he would be a pasture ornament, I knew my life depended on having a horse to work with. That's when I got Daz, before Rocket even left.

I can't wait to hear all about your lesson and carriage drive. I can't imagine anything more beautiful than driving thru the vineyards.


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## Angelina

Pennys Mom: my friend is on facebook so I don't want to put undo pressure on her as it is not finalized yet. She arranged it on her own when I told her I was looking for lessons somewhere. She won't finalize it until Friday but I am excited. I've never been in a carriage before and the idea of being behind one of these big guys in the vinyards just sounds awesome (unless it is raining of course)! But here in the SF Bay area, Decembers are often dry and clear and I've spent many a Christmas out at the beach with a bottle of wine and good friends....


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Sounds perfect! You sound happy!


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## Angelina

Well, I need to do something horsey. The dogs are great and lots of energy goes into them, but there is just something about a horse....


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Daz and I have such a symbiotic relationship: I worked him and boy, did HE work me!!! Such a pissant he was! :uhoh:

Just would NOT change rein and get 'in' the outside rein, mostly going right. We were steering...or not steering as was the case most of the time...like we'd never driven before. :doh: 

By the time I finished he was hot and sweaty (love that perfume), I was hot and sweaty but HE WAS IN THE OUTSIDE REIN and steering.

We had a little bit of "ooooo no, I can't go forward into contact" and "Oh, you mean canter in little teensy steps?" Noooooo. It takes a lot of coordination to get that when you don't have legs on him. Between handling the lines, the whip, the half-halts, the clucks...I was giving it everything I had.

I should have known when I was tacking him up and he was head butting me whenever he could that today was going to be one of 'those' days! But I'm German, way more patient that he. 

I just don't know why I'm not skin and bones by now????

btw, Kim, I took my reply off fb and made one that was more neutral. I don't want your friend to feel pressured.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Yes, you do. I think lessons is a great idea. At least you'll get to ride and keep your skill level up. Something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a woman. 



Angelina said:


> Well, I need to do something horsey. The dogs are great and lots of energy goes into them, but there is just something about a horse....


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## Ranger

Aw, that's great you're taking a lesson on friday! I looove friesans! There was one at the last barn I was at and she was just beautiful. They are such a majestic breed.

Penny's Mom - glad you won the 'war'. Some days they're just like that, eh? I haven't been out to see Virgil since Sunday, but will hopefully head out there tonight. Hopefully he is NOT in a mood like that! 

Not much happening horse-wise for me so far this week...gotta change that!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Thanks, Ranger. That's the thing about Morgans. They eventually get to "Oh alright, if you insist". My carriage horse was that way too.

Angelina, Daz is most often mistaken for a Freisian.  And goes like a warmblood.


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## Ranger

Holy crap...

I was out at the stable a few days ago and pulled out by bridle bag in anticipation of riding Virgil. Inside the bridle bag, I found my old Stubben schooling bridle (complete with fancy blinged browband and good luck apple charm), my hunter bridle, and one I had completely forgotten about: a figure 8 bridle that an old boyfriend had bought for Virgil. I think I schooled in it twice and had it on at Spruce when Virgil went lame...tossed it back in the bridle bag and hadn't looked at it since. That was 6 years ago now. Anyway, I'm checking it out thinking I'll find a name brand and see how much I could possibly sell it for...since it seems silly to have 3 bridles for one retired horse. Didn't recognize the name brand, figured it was probably an obscure no-name brand but whatever. It's nice, padded, and has a fuzzy nose part which I always liked. 

Went online to price out some other things I was thinking of selling and stumbled upon my bridle...I've never heard of the name brand before - Dyon - but it's the same as mine. The price tag? $450!!! Ahhh!! I'm hoping it wasn't that expensive when it was purchased! And now the question is...to sell it or to keep it and hope it fits my next horse? Which is a few years down the road...I just can't contemplate ever dropping close to 500 for a bridle!

That was my shock of the day. That and realizing Grand Prix show jackets are now in the 500 to 600 dollar range!


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## Angelina

Sell it if you can! Why not? IF / When you get another horse you will have fun buying for that horse! 

Lesson went ok but really reminded me how out of shape I've become. I use to be able to post the trot for 50 miles (when I was a lot younger), now I was sweating, exhausted..could not keep my lower leg still, felt like I was slamming on his back. I have a lot of work to do! I have another lesson lined up for Dec and will try a few a month; all I can afford. Barn was beautiful with all kinds of Friesians, she imports and sells them. Arenas perfect; quiet barn. But man am I out of shape!

Hope everyone is having a good Monday! K


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## Ranger

Whew, some lessons can be so humbling...but at the same time motivating! Sounds like it was a good lesson, overall!

I had a fairly horsie weekend. Farrier was out on friday and man, something was in the air. All the horses were acting like maniacs, even before I brought in my guy. And of course, he's so sensitive and reactive that I was anticipating it to be a disaster. His appt didn't start off great - the first few minutes were scary - but then he settled down was good. It did NOT help that some dummy was letting her aggressive daschund run all over the property barking his fool head, PLUS letting her daughter play in the feeder tubs in the paddocks. Not to mention run around in the same paddock as her skittish 3 month old weanling. Brilliant. The BO wasn't around, so I think it's safe to say that things go to heck when she's gone. 

Then, found out that Virgil wrecked one his blankets and it needs to get fixed. Of course he does this the week winter's finally going to hit. I got home at 2pm today, walked Ranger, then disappeared downstairs for 3 hours. I just looked outside and there's 2 inches of snow on the ground!! 

On the plus side, Katie and Paddy's Mom came out to visit Ranger and I this weekend! We had an awesome time and she got to meet Virgil, too! I think she got some good pics of him, too. It was really windy so he was super alert with pricked ears!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I miss the people part of boarding but not THAT kind of people part!! 

Daz was a putz on Friday too. We're pretty far from you but maybe Canadian air? Farrier stood me up yesterday...he never wrote our appointment in his book.  I waited 3 hours for him. Worked Daz while I was waiting.

Friday he was out of sorts because he didn't want to get into the outside (left) rein. He has a 'problem' with dropping his right shoulder and it's most noticeable when it's on the inside. So yesterday, I started him lunging first...he was very tense especially through his neck. Everytime he tried to veer off the circle I held on and he was shaking his neck and head in protest. Finally he worked off some of his excitement/energy.

I bridled him and got him in the surcingle and long lines but instead of letting him out right away I stood close and cued him to flex with the handle of my whip where leg would be. He walked in small circles around me. Gradually I let him take the lines out and he did beautifully. He broke the contact once so I brought him back to me and started again. 

He was so 'in' the outside rein that I was able to give very soft half halts on the inside rein and have him drop his poll lower and lower. And at one point, briefly, we achieved self-carriage. I love working him in the long lines. Not only is it like riding but I get to watch at the same time! Can't get that view from the saddle.


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## Angelina

I would love to watch you work with Daz. I have not worked with long lines in years. I free lunge and turn Mystery (not so much now). He may be telling you he has some pain or stiffness somewhere. Have you ever done chiropractic adjustments with him? Sounds like he just needs a good warm up too before too much bending. Mystery was like that. Bummer on the farrier. I hate that. This new one schedules with me and calls me the day before so I can fake a doctor appointment at work. He just gets a barefoot trim. I was trimming myself but my neck won't let me anymore...

Ranger sounds like typical barn drama. At mine there was an idiot that would put his kids on the hood of his truck and take them down the driveway..I mean these are YOUNG kids. He would yahoo around no helmet and one day I caught him chasing the cows. Of course I told and he was gone. Be sure to let the BO know..she has liability for their stupidity....

I think too the horses all feel good at this time of year and get 'frisky'. They get their woolies in and the cold temps feel great to them. Remember, horses are most comfortable at around 50 degrees. Hard for us hairless apes to imagine! K


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I keep meaning to set up the video camera just so I can have something to look at on nasty days. :smooch: One of these days.... And then figure out how to post it. :curtain:

I never thought about the chiro but good idea. We used to get Rocket and PJ (r.i.p. both boys) massaged, chiro-ed and accupunture. And WOW what a difference. They loved it.

Going right, Daz doesn't want to stand up on his inside shoulder. I usually start him to the left and encourage him (inside hind) from that side. Then we got right and I really work on getting the inside hind well under him at the walk. That usually does it. Then we get nice round circles instead of triangles or diamonds.


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## Angelina

There are some ground exercises you can do before long lunging him to help him warm up and stretch those mucles. One is yielding his hindend from the side (let me know if you already know these. He pivots on his fronts and crosses his inside hind in front of his outside hind and moves. You do it on both sides. Then you can change and have him move his front end around, pivoting on the hinds. It is telling that he warms into it and just like us, working those muscles that are out of shape make also just create some stiffness the next day or two. (I am relating to that now)!!

It is great you are making progress with him! How fun!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

That's a good idea. Somewhere, I have a book of long line exercises. The ones that don't require more than a walk from me are ones I could do correctly. If I get to running, my hands aren't as quiet as I'd like...not to mention how annoyed he would get if I fell down and yanked him. :doh:

He also hates ground poles...that's what led to his big about face, rear and leap which left me in the dirt. So I want to work with them too. These nice days are so special here. Soon we'll be frigid and snow covered. Still I want to do as much as I can, even in the snow. Really could use an indoor but @ $60K, not anything we can bite off right now. Maybe if the economy improves and things start looking up again. But, it's a huge chunk of change!


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## Ranger

It's cold tonight!! This is the coldest it's been all fall...winter has officially hit. Highs this weekend are -16C and with windchill closer to -24C and some snow, too.

I went out to see Virgil and make sure he's warm enough. The BO does a good job of blanketing him but I still need to see for myself...plus stuff him full of apples and mints. It was pitch black, cold, and windy but he was an all-star for getting his blankets changed in the paddock. Alpha horse came over and was bugging him so I kept shooing Alpha away nicely (didn't want him to take off and Virgil to follow suit). BO had put Virgil's heavier winter blanket and rain sheet on, which was great. Virgil was a little chilly though so stripped him down to the skin and threw another blanket on underneath. He stood like a statue while I took off two blankets, then put three back on. I accidentally swung one a little too enthusiastically and a strap hit alpha horse who was on the other side of Virgil so he decided to vacate the premises pretty quick. Luckily Virgil stuck around.

So, in the blizzard-wind-snow-cold...Virgil has one light-to-midweight blanket, one mid-to-heavyweight blanket, and a rainsheet. AND he's nice and plump. Felt for his ribs and there was a nice layer of fat over them so he's doing great. So happy! Any colder and I'd have been breaking out his new heavyweight blanket...I'm sure that weather is on the way, though.

How're everyone else's horses doing? Wearing their winter gear yet?


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## luvbuzz

The cold temps haven't really hit yet. (PA) Day temps 50-60, nites in the low 40s. I use a medium blanket at night, a turn out sheet in the day. The grass has been great this year...my girl has been very happy eating.
Perfect riding weather (no bugs) but hunting has started. Need to be a bit more careful where I ride. Buzz wears his bright orange coat. I love this time of year.


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## Ranger

Our perfect riding weather is the sad few months we call summer and then a bug free zone of about a month for fall. I'm jealous of everyone who can still ride outside! The ground's been frozen for the last month.

And it's currently snowing -16C/2F but feels like -25C/-13F. Awesome. Tonight, it's actually going to be -25 before windchill. SO happy I put on 3 blankets last night!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

We had a couple of below freezing nights and really windy days. There was an inch of ice on the water tank today. We'll put out the heated tank once it's consistently below 32F at night. 

The boys have their windbreaker/rain sheets on to give some relief from the wind. Above freezing temps forecasted for the next 10 days.


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## Angelina

I am cold just reading your descriptions! I am spoiled here! We are expecting rain but it will remain in the 50s. The horses grow their own coats and have run in shelters if they need them. I will only blanket if we have a big storm in Jan or Feb that lasts for days...

This is his fall coat. By end of Jan it will be twice as thick but for now it is all he needs. He sweats in it during the day...


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## Ranger

That's about as thick as my guy's coat gets! It's a little thicker than normal this year but it's supposed to be a cooold looong winter so maybe that's part of it. It's currently -18C. At least it stopped snowing!


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## Ranger

Any new horsie news? I have nothing to report besides the weather here has been crazy and it's hard on the horses. -20 two days ago...and today it was +11. Virgil went from 2 blankets + sheet to nekkid in the span of 2 days. 

Also, his natural "leadership" seems to be re-asserting itself now that he's getting more comfortable in his new surroundings. He was moved into a paddock with another so now there's 3 and he chases away the third horse whenever he/she (don't know yet) gets too close to him or Adam. Then the other night when i was stripping him down, he did a mock charge at Adam. Pinned ears and galloped 3 strides towards Adam then veered off when it was obvious Adam wasn't going to move. Definitely getting into being a bossy pants again. I'm just surprised it took this long...I guess the move was harder on him than I expected it to be.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

No horse news here. Wasted a beautiful day yesterday..45 and sunny, no wind. Really very nice. My back is still pretty tight and I felt totally 'done in'. Spent the time in the grocery store getting turkey and stuff.

Today was a total loss to the pouring down rain. Tomorrow will be even nicer than yesterday but we have a 6 hour commitment for Penny's appointment. I'm hoping we'll get back early enough to do some driving with Daz.

My ying is out of sync with my yang. 

We're going to be getting a hay delivery before Monday. 150 bales. 

Other than that: sosdd.


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## Angelina

Nothing here either except Ranger is making me very COLD! 

Saw my guy on Sunday and he is fat, wooly and very happy. The barnowner said they had a 'conversation' about opening up gates. Todd rotates pastures and Mystery wanted in and told him so. I can imagine that too.

I am taking on a skinny old arab that has lost too much weight. Zippy was abandoned a few years ago at the ranch and Todd supports him which is pretty darn nice for a cattle rancher to do with the price of feed, trims, meds etc. But Zippy wants a person, not a herd and can't seem to settle in. He gets two big helpings of alfalfa a day on his own but just runs the fence the rest of the time and now he is too skinny. So I'm spending some time with him grooming and paying for some soaked senior feed. He is too small for me (even if he was in good shape) but has done it all, been there and back but we just cannot find a home for him.

My other friend was hand walking her normally calm arab the other day as he was spooking at nothing (change in weather?). A cat crossed the path and he slammed right into her, knocking her down. So she broke her tailbone. Ranch is only 10 minutes away so I'll have turnout duty for her for the next few days too. I may not be riding but at least I'll be around them! And really, most arabs I know are very level headed; just athletic!

Other then that, rain is coming for the next few days but temps will stay in the 40s and 50s. Cold enough for me and yes, I am a spoiled California girl! 

Have a nice Thanksgiving all...

Here is a picture of Mystery for fun, stuffing his face, at Pt.Reyes during the summer during better days (when I was still trailering and riding him). He is my hay belly fat boy....


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## Ranger

Aw, that's a great pic of Mystery! And way to go for taking on the welfare of another horse - that's awesome!! 

I haven't been able to see Virgil this week except for today. My tendon was bugging me all week and I'm trying to finish a bunch of papers. I'm totally behind since I had to spend all day yesterday - seriously, from 10am til 11:00pm - working on a paper due at midnight...that I thought was pretty much done. Too bad my prof had other ideas. Needless to say, that set me back timewise. Now I'll be up all night working on my second paper. 

BUT, I did sneak out to go see Virgil. I got a call from the BO that the complete feed went rancid (!) so I had to go pick up some more. Not impressed. I had probably another 2 weeks left of the feed, but wow - it stunk. Dumped that, then spent ten minutes trying to get the smell out of the bin by wiping it with damp cloths and then drying it. Hopefully that works, since I dumped the new bag in. (Later I thought, "why I didn't I just put the bag in the bin instead of dumping it" but it was too late at that point).

So Virgil's got fresh feed and got stuffed full of peppermints and stud muffins. I think he's now the bossypants of the paddock. Adam didn't follow Virgil up to the gate like he usually does and Virgil was able to get prime spot at the hay bale. Prime spot to Virgil that is, i personally don't see what the difference is but apparently there is one.

And that's it! Hopefully I can get out tomorrow to see him again but I won't be holding my breath. I'm working on doing carrot stretches with him in the paddock and once I'm done finals, we'll be back to handwalking. Then hopefully riding!! Whoo!!


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## Ranger

Also, is anyone's dog obsessed with paddock boots? Ranger never seemed to care before but now that I'm at this new place he's gone nuts for my boots when I get home. He was rubbing his face all over one last night and carried the other one downstairs onto his bed so he could sleep with it.  He usually carries footwear to his bed but he is obsessed with my riding boots. I just caught him licking one! Not even the bottom where I'd imagine the 'good' smells would be, but the laces. What an oddball.


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## Angelina

Funny about the dog Ranger! I wonder if he is smelling another dog or cat on your boots? Does your feed have molasses in it? I wonder why it went rancid?

No horsie news here except my friesian carriage ride is switched to the weekend of Dec 10th. No big deal and it appears I'll be driving which I've never done before, but will be under guidance. Also thinking of canceling the riding lessons on the friesians, they have such big action and my friends are telling me to take lessons on a horse not so bouncy to begin with. I'm inclined to follow that advice and work my way up. They aren't going anywhere...

I hope everyone had a lovely Thanksgiving and have a good week..back to work for me~


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## Ranger

I think the complete feed when rancid because the sunflower seeds I had in the same bin - but in a bag - went rancid first. THOSE I got from walmart and I'm not surprised they had a short shelf life. I think the rancidness "jumped" from sunflower seeds to complete feed. I'd only had that bag for about a month, so it shouldn't have gone bad. No molasses in it. It's rice bran based so it can spoil more quickly than other feeds but I hadn't run into a problem with it before, though I am only on my 4th bag. Hopefully I cleaned out the bin well enough that it won't spoil the new feed.

Also, Virgil has grown the fluffiest coat he's ever had!! EVER. It is sooo lush and SOFT. I'm thinking the cold nights in august when he was a scarecrow resulted in this. He had no fat on him and no hay to keep his internal furnace going and I couldn't blanket since it was so nice during the days. It'd be +10/+17 then drop to zero at night. 

I am SO happy I moved him. Even though we had crazy hurricane winds yesterday which is SUPER rare for up here. They closed the downtown core because glass windows were breaking on condos/office buildings, told people to stay inside and stay away from windows...so of course, there were horse shelters flying around in the country. I guess one shelter got picked up and smashed in the lower fields where Virgil is at (he's in the top fields and it's more protected, thank god) and the wind blew two barn windows out! Absolutely insane weather. Luckily no horses were hurt and it's calmer now. Whew.


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## Angelina

Oh wow! I'm glad he is ok...what horrible weather! We are in the 60s here (I know, spoiled) until next weekend when another storm comes in. Glad you figured out what spoiled the feed as well....


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Not much going on here. I had a nice ride on Saturday. I'm really getting the feel of sit up, cue, wait and STAY SITTING UP. I tend to lean forward into the motion which totals screws up Harry. He stops when I do that. Which brings me to my other problem: stopping. I just can't get the hang of SIT DOWN. I always have to post a couple of steps. Not good in a western pleasure class. Our downward transitions are supposed to be seamless. I'm learning that there are many places I have to check my equitation: the cue, the upward transition, the gait itself, preparation for the downward trans, the cue, riding the trans, cueing for the next gait and riding that. It isn't all one big thing but a series of things.

At one point Daz got to running along side us..on the other side of 2 fences. I had to WHOA...one of us, Harry or me, was getting airborne!!!! 

Today we brought in enough hay for a few weeks. Tomorrow is supposed to be drenching rain followed by our first measurable snow on Wednesday. Darling Daughter is planning to feed both mornings for me so I don't have to go out if I don't want to. She's a sweetie!:smooch:


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## Elisabeth Kazup

That is scarey windy, Ranger. Glad he's okay and nothing hurt him. Amazing how different they are with plenty of good food. He really needs his fluffy coat 'up there'! And I'm so happy that you are happy with the move. You need to be able to trust your people.


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## Angelina

Nice daughter Penny's Mom! Do you know the one rein stop? It is to cue a horse to stop and you do it over and over and over again with the deep seated stop cue until the horse has it so embedded in its little pea brain that it translate it to using that seat to stop him. It enforces the stop and helps the transition to the seat for those of us who can't seem to be able to just stop with our seat from the beginning. Look it up but also be aware it should not be used to turn the horse and force a stop or at speed, but just as a learning device and a safety measure. As you know horses are so habitual so it has to become habit to just listen when those cues are given and finally drilled down to one cue...the seat....

A friend of mine just relearned this lesson of horses and habits. Her new leased horse spooked and ran into her, fracturing her tail bone. There are a series of exercises one can do from the ground to help a horse respect your personal space. I told her you need to do this not just this month, but next month, and the following. When the horse is 20 years old you still do this one a month and you enforce your personal space at all times, all situations. I'll be showing her this Thursday after work. I can't tell you how many times Mystery has spooked while leading him and he avoids me. But she is like me; rode the same horse many years and now has to get use to a new one.

Happy to hear about that wooley coat too Ranger... you'll have to take pictures next time you are out if you are able! K


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## Ranger

I do a ton of in hand work with Virgil, too. He's got a nasty habit of bolting when being led. Apparently it goes back to when he was a foal and his people were scared of him...as a FOAL. He learned he was bigger and stronger than people so when he didn't want to face something scary, he'd bolt. (Interestingly enough, he never bolts when being ridden even when there's something scary). So, he not only gets led EVERYWHERE with a stud chain but in extreme cases, he gets it under his lip and over his gums. 

I do a ton of inhand work with him. He won't run anyone over and he doesn't barge into me to get loose, overall his handling manners are great 99% of the time. That 1% being when he bolts. Anyway, Angelina I'm curious what you do for ground work respect-wise. I'm always looking for new ideas!

The best one that works for Virgil and really improved his bolting (at least with me) was getting the side reins on him, longe line through the bit, and dressage whip in hand. We march nicely down the ring, starting with him against the wall and on my right side. We walk and he stays with his head/neck at my shoulder - i know the ideal position is shoulder to shoulder but virgil uses that against people who lead him - and when he lags, he gets a touch with the whip to encourage him. When I want him to stop, I turn my body into him and invade his space and say whoa (which sounds more like a long "hoe"). If he stops in line with me, he gets praise and a treat. If he stops slow or pushes past me a little but without touching me, he has to rein back. Then we go from walk to trot and work on the same thing. Then, we switch sides and this is MUCH harder on him. Working him on his "off side" really messes him up. Sometimes I get temper tantrums which is when the side reins come in handy. 

Anyway, I need to do some more sessions like that. I've fallen off the wagon on them in the last year and it's starting to show in his respect issues. So, I'm curious - what do you for respect lessons on the ground? Having a few tricks up the sleeve is always handy!

ETA: I'll try to take pictures when I'm out next. I've got 3 papers due this week (including one tomorrow that I'm 'supposed' to be working on right now) so the earliest I'll be able to get out is...next monday?? A week from now?? Boooo. Everyone give your horses big hugs and carrots for me!


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## GoldenGirlsMom

I want to say a big "thank you" to Ranger and Penny's Mom for your horse stories and especially Angelina for the link you posted to Black Sterling Fresians. I dont have a horse, never did but I have loved watching them. I clicked on that link and those horses are breathtaking! A friend at work has a younger daughter that is taking lessons and of course I had to show him these beautiful Fresians. He says to me "come out to the barn, there is one there that you can ride"! At this point I am so excited but yet very apprehensive about this. I am 53, never rode much, have not been on a horse since I was a kid and it sure wasnt one of these! I thought about it for a week and I got the nerve up to go to the barn. Well the lady at the barn that owns the Fresian says sure you can ride him. So I got on that big black horse and started out at a trot. I was bouncing all over the place. The trainer yells for me to try posting. I did it, not very good but I did it. Coming from a beginner, it is a lot harder to do than it looks. Anyway I got my ride on this beautiful horse and now I am hooked. I have started to take riding lessons. Last Tuesday was my first lesson and I was tired after 15 minutes. My lesson is a half hour long and by the time it was over I was worn out. When I was dismounting, I was sliding down the horse and when my feet hit the ground, I went down to my knees. My legs were rubber. Everyone including me had a good laugh. So I will continue my lessons and hope that I can build up the legs and endurance. To those of you that can ride a lot like this and make it look so easy, I am so jealous!


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## Angelina

That is wonderful GoldenGirlsMom! How exciting! I have to admit I cancelled my next lesson with the freisian. I just feel their action is too much for me right now and I need a horse with less action so I can really concentrate on balance and feel, not just try and direct and post. I'll work up to it and then revisit them again. They are beautiful horses but I can really see why they are used for carriages more then for riding....

Ranger, I have to think about articulating or google some of the exercises. They are a combination of Dennis Reis and John Lyons. The one you describe at the shoulder is one, except you basically walk into the the horse using a hand at their eye and get them to yield the front away from you. Their front legs should cross..you only start with one step and praise but the goal is they step away from your personal space. So you are not teaching them to just stay out of your space; but to actually avoid your space.

Another is from standing you are at the side shoulder (far enough away to avoid a kick). You bend their head slightly to you and you ask them to move their hinds away...again this is a hind end yield where the back crosses over and the pivot is on the front. You can use a crop or if you have a long lead to enforce it. Soon the horse will move just from body language, you won't need to use any tools. This again teaches the horse to move away from you and stay out of your space but it also helps them with their flexing.

And of course having them back up with just your body language...opening the chest and walking strongly toward them. You can use a halter lead and ask to move back, if they don't one up and down movement with the lead but as soon as they 'think' of moving or move do not move it...that is the reward. Soon you can play games where they move away from you backing up in the roundpen with nothing on them.

I'll try and find some video links later today and post....


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## Ranger

A Virgil update:

I put Virgil on a new supplement a few weeks ago and it has plumped him up GOOD. I can't think of anything else that would have caused it. He'd been on the round bale for a month and gained weight, but was holding steady. Then he moved into a new paddock with two horses instead of one and is busy being a bossy pants and lost a little. I put him on this new supplement and WOW. His winter coat - thickest it's ever been - is gleaming. He's put on enough weight that I had to readjust all his blanket straps. And it's super affordable, too.

When I think of how much he was on in the summer when i was frantically trying to get weight on him:
3-5 lbs (dry weight) of alfalfa/timothy cubes
2 cups canola oil
1 cup equine power 2000
3 lbs rice bran based complete feed
2 cups BOSS
2 oz multi vit/min supplement which was $$
in addition to the BO giving 'him' 9-12 flakes of hay a day (not a lot, especially since he wasn't the one eating it!)

Now?
3 lbs rice bran based complete feed and joint supplement and other supplement. Plus the round bale which I know is making a huge difference. Still, sooo happy!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Just now catching up. Boys are put away for the night. It always feels so good to bring them in on a cold, snowy night to a warm, dry stall. I'm kind of a sucker for their comfort...bed way too deep to be practical. But Hershy and Harry are pretty neat and Daz seems to be neater with more bedding. He likes to scatter his piles. 

We don't really have a problem...meaning doesn't bother us...with them in our space. Hershy came to us as a friendly biter, mainly when he's excited to go out. He's not the type to lay ears back and really go for the flesh. More like "Oh, there's an arm. Pinch" Annoying when he's REALLY excited. I've learned to work around it by blanketing while he eats his grain or giving a treat while haltering. He came to us that way from a frantic trainer's barn. Also with severe worms and ulcers. We cut him some slack because he's so safe and pliable under saddle.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Yay! Good for you. You're never too old; there's a horse suitable for everyone! And isn't it fun being a horseman and hanging out at the barn?!? I have always admired the riders that make it look effortless. I'm still sore from using my legs on my last ride. I think I need to get a ThighMaster! No joke! Or squeeze a beach ball. It feels like a tremendous amount of effort on my part. DD says all she uses is a 'touch' of calf muscle. Obviously I have a lot of strengthening work to get to that point.

I'm so happy you found a great place to ride!




GoldenGirlsMom said:


> I want to say a big "thank you" to Ranger and Penny's Mom for your horse stories and especially Angelina for the link you posted to Black Sterling Fresians. I dont have a horse, never did but I have loved watching them. I clicked on that link and those horses are breathtaking! A friend at work has a younger daughter that is taking lessons and of course I had to show him these beautiful Fresians. He says to me "come out to the barn, there is one there that you can ride"! At this point I am so excited but yet very apprehensive about this. I am 53, never rode much, have not been on a horse since I was a kid and it sure wasnt one of these! I thought about it for a week and I got the nerve up to go to the barn. Well the lady at the barn that owns the Fresian says sure you can ride him. So I got on that big black horse and started out at a trot. I was bouncing all over the place. The trainer yells for me to try posting. I did it, not very good but I did it. Coming from a beginner, it is a lot harder to do than it looks. Anyway I got my ride on this beautiful horse and now I am hooked. I have started to take riding lessons. Last Tuesday was my first lesson and I was tired after 15 minutes. My lesson is a half hour long and by the time it was over I was worn out. When I was dismounting, I was sliding down the horse and when my feet hit the ground, I went down to my knees. My legs were rubber. Everyone including me had a good laugh. So I will continue my lessons and hope that I can build up the legs and endurance. To those of you that can ride a lot like this and make it look so easy, I am so jealous!


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## GoldenGirlsMom

Yes, I love hanging out at the barn. There are the teenage girls there and then there is me, the barn owner and another lady there. Us three have hit it off really well and we are having a great time together. I went to my second lesson last night and it went much better. My legs are not as sore, I felt better riding and I could do it longer before I needed a break. YAH!! It was a good night.


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## Ranger

Aw, that's so great GoldenGirlsMom!! Glad you're feeling better already! There's nothing like hours in the saddle to gain that muscle memory. I'm sure if I hopped on Virgil tomorrow that I'd be sore the next day! Probably from where he dumped me...!

I don't think anything beats a good barn atmosphere. I've been in some crappy ones, but the good ones? You never want to leave! 

Have you experienced the "horse world time continuum" yet? Like you go to the barn for "just an hour or two" and then next thing you know, 5 hours have passed? My family and old boyfriends learned to add 2 hours to anytime I said I'd be back when I was heading out to the barn. I'd say I'd be home at 5 and then wouldn't get home til 7. Did not know WHERE the time went!


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## Ranger

I went out and saw the Virge today!! I hate only seeing him once or twice a week. He nickered when he saw me, which was both sweet and heatbreaking at the same time. I felt like I had to apologize him for not being out there more often! Then I gave him a boatload of mini carrots and did his carrot stretches. Also snapped some pics!

He's turned the oddest shade of chestnut. His coat has always changed colours...from dirt coloured which is the most normal, to orange-ish, to chocolate brown...and one time to a deep liver chestnut. he's not usually 'red' despite being a chestnut. 

Right now, he's turned a really dark colour which isn't unusual, but he has the nicest tinge of dark red on him! It's definitely the reddest I've ever seen him. But here's the odd thing: his legs and face are getting dark brown, almost black, hairs on them! He almost looks merled! His legs are a golden chestnut, dark knees, and now flecked with black all the way on his cannon bones, from knee to pastern! It is so odd.

But he's happy and plump, despite it being freezing out there. He likes his paddock mates and is overall very happy! Yay!


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## Ranger

Some pics of today's visit:

Virgil looking incredibly dark...and fat!









Turn your head to the left









and straight ahead! (This is Adam)









see what i mean about his legs?









A closer pic:









Doing carrot stretches









His winter coat! Thickest ever!









Look at that!









And in all these pics, the flash was going off and making Virgil seem lighter in colour. The first pic and this one are truest to the actual colour he's turned: very very dark with a nice red tinge









Compare that to the colour he is in my signature!

Before, the darkest he ever got was this and he only did this ONE year:









I wish I knew how to get/keep him super dark! I love it!


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## desilu

Virgil is beautiful! He looks very happy - I'll bet that makes you feel wonderful!


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## Ranger

Aw, thanks! He is very happy in his new home and they take great care of him when I can't make it out to see him...lessens the guilt a little, at least!


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## Sally's Mom

It is tough to own a horse that doesn't live with you. I euthanized my boy 5 years ago. He was the "golden retriever" of the horse world. He would do anything I told him to do.He was so trusting...


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## Ranger

I'm so sorry to hear that Sally's Mom. Virgil is my first horse and it's been hard to see him age and get older...I can't even think about having to say goodbye one day. Makes me tear up just writing about it. I've had him since he was 4 and he's 16 (17 in 2012!) and been retired for 5 years now. Even retiring him was hard.

I've never had a horse property so we've only known boarding barns. I'm hoping at some point I'll be able to get a nice rural property and have a few horses...I'd love if Virgil was still around to rule the roost! It is hard boarding them and wondering about them constantly...luckily this new place is amazing!


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## coppers-mom

Ranger - there is a book by lyons I think named horse-man-ship. It has a lot of lessons on the ground for respect. Yielding the front end, yielding the hindquarters, backing away on lead etc. It explains lateral lunging which I do a lot since going in circles make me very, very dizzy. If you can't find it, PM me and I'll copy some pages and send them to you. With my horses I have had a LOT of need for such knowledge. In fact, I have to start them with my new guy this weekend. He's small but sure able to drag me off when he wants to...... and he wants to a lot.


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## Ranger

I will definitely look for that book - thanks for the recommendation! 

I've done some NH with him before, since he was PARELLI trained :doh: when I got him and the last place we were at was big on NH as well and had some Josh Nichol(s?) clinics. The only issue is...he bolts. That's the problem with only having the halter on. Whenever he gets "pressured" he up and leaves and there is NO holding him or stopping him. There's no warning, no chance. He subtly puts his inside shoulder at you and then he's gone in the blink of an eye. From a halt or walk to a flat out gallop in half a stride. When we've done NH work before, his bolting actually got worse.  I had to pull the plug on it when the BO had been using him for NH lessons after she told me that he'd been bolting every time they led him but "not to worry". Well, I do worry. I worry either he or the person leading him will get hurt and especially that his bolting had gotten worse, not better.

And now my issue is that he can't do much lateral work since it puts pressure on his bad leg. Crossing over, small circles, etc are things the vet told us not to do anymore. He's pretty much restricted to straight lines and circles larger than 20m. That's why I can do the inhand work with him because it's just walk-trot in straight lines down the ring. And the sidereins help if he bolts. I will look at the book and see if there's some stuff we CAN do, though. I'm sure there's more exercises out there that will help! They'll just have to be "Virgilized" i.e. done on a straight line and with a bridle!


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## Angelina

Thanks for the pictures Ranger! John Lyons and now his son Josh has some great exercises (especially for trailer loading or starting a colt) and a website. Parelli I run away from as fast as possible! 

Did you know the reason he is dark is that is his new coat coming in and the red tinge is the old coat just getting longer? I love my bay who turns absolutely black in the spring when he sheds but by fall he is pretty bleached out from the sun so becomes a big shaggy reddish brown thing.

Sorry for your loss as well Sally. Mystery will be 25 in Feb and is also my first horse, just retired last year. I know he lived a wonderful long life but am not looking forward to that day either. I can only hope it is as painless as possible. It has been very hard for me not being able to just grab my horse, trailer him out and go riding for miles every weekend with my friends. But I am grateful for the many years we were able to do that together...


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## Elisabeth Kazup

He looks GREAT!! I love it when they are so comfortable with their buddy to hang out at the gate together.
And that coat!!!! OMG, he looks like a wolly mammoth!!!

My boys are almost black this year. If it wasn't for the 'brown' around their muzzle, you'd think! Hershey is the color of milk chocolate; a vast improvement from the washed-out orange he was when Jen got him and he was so wormy and ulcery. 

I'm so happy that I get to see mine at least twice a day...just a short drive of 6 minutes. But you know, sometimes I get so busy working around the barn, putting them out, bringing them in, etc that I forget to look up and actually LOOK at them. I make myself remember to give them a once over glance whenever I'm there.


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## Ranger

Thanks guys! This is definitely the thickest his coat has ever been. It's so soft I just want to keep hugging him forever. He and Adam are definitely buddies, Virgil still chases away the third horse in the paddock but apparently only when I'm there. I drive in and see all of them eating together but as soon as Virgil sees me, he chases the other guy away. Silly.

Angelina - The weird thing is about the colour is that he's not ever this dark in winter. ONE time he was dark, but that was his fall coat. Most of the time he looks like this in winter:









or








(That was his first winter of retirement...he got a little porky before he realized he didn't have to eat as much when he's not working!)

I hope his summer coat grows in dark, even if it's not this dark. Don't have to worry abou bleaching up here!


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## Ranger

Wow, we're in the midst of a freak snow storm. 5-10cm! Already about 2 inches have fallen and the temps dropped with a windchill of -11. Poor Virgil isn't outfitted properly...but I trust the BO is checking on him. AND he's got a round bale so I'm not nearly as worried. He's wearing a midweight blanket instead of a heavy one, but with hay burning in the belly he'll be fine. Whew. It's nice to not have to worry OR have to drive out in the pitch black night in a snow storm to check on him!!

I need to get the BO something nice for Christmas!


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## Angelina

I hope the weather has let up out there you all! We are cold but crystal clear skies and Sat. is my carriage ride with the Freisian. Not sure I have anyone to take pictures, my little camera broke.

I did get another horse. He is pretty small but durable and was born in Colorado...at an art gallery! Meet Clunker!

Take care all! K


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Oh My Gosh, he's adorable! Get a disposable camera. We WANT pictures...no we DEMAND pictures. Have a great time!


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## Angelina

Ha, ha, ha well I will try my best with the old iphone..... K


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## Ranger

That is so adorable Angelina!! Wish I had one! Also, totally agree with Penny's Mom...you need pics of your carriage ride! 

Weather's not so bad up here anymore. We had a huge dump of snow on the weekend and it got down to -20 last night (Virgil needed 3 blankets) but it's supposed to warm up today and tomorrow. I think above zero tomorrow, even. I put Virgil's liner on to make things easier (hopefully) for the BO. If it's nice, then just the liner and rainsheet to protect it. If it's cold, then another blanket on top of the liner. The liner is closed front and he's a little odd about it going over his head so I'd rather do it myself than worry about someone else doing it.

Also, he's looking FAT and shiny. I'm so happy!


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## GoldenGirlsMom

Ahhh, Clunker is so cute! I hope you find a camera for Saturday! I cant wait to see the pictures! Have fun and you have to tell us all about it!

Everyone, keep the pictures coming! Virgil, Hershey and all the others are gorgeous!


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## Ranger

Oh, well...if you insist! :

I was out at the barn yesterday evening and ALL the horses were feeling good:









I swear Virgil isn't this goose necked, I was accidentally shooting with a wide angle lens! But, his woolly mammoth coat is SOO shiny that I had to post the pic!









Flash off (his real colour)









Flash on:









making faces, as per usual









Can't believed I missed his whole tongue









Making another face









Trying to 'talk'









Still talking...









Little 3 month old in her big winter blanket!









Neighbours' horses playing:









and trotting/cantering off!


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## Angelina

WOW, really nice pictures Ranger! He is living the good life! Lots of activity around him, beautiful coat. I bet part of it is he is happier and not stressed. I love watching babies on the ranches too; wonderful to let them just grow up and socialize as horses!

Well I did get my carriage ride. This horse was so personable and just licked, licked, licked. The owner told me all Friesians are like that and wierd thing, they only live to about 20 if that! I only have a few pictures today and have to see if I have better ones on my big camera later this week. They have a track around the ranch and we were flying..trotting and cantering! Then a little drama as a new horse was freaking out. She stopped and talked to the owner (he was in a stall / paddock) and she is like "don't worry, he will get over it". Well, he did. The fence. The 3rd time around she was not there and we stopped since he was in the stall freaking out. He came out of the stall and tried to crash thru the back of the paddock (we are still stopped). Then he went full blast back to the stall and cleared the stall door. Oh, he was also a 2-1/2 year old stud colt. So I get out of the carriage and he is just standing there (good boy) and he saw an open stall door and went straight inside (yeah). I let the barn people take it from there!

So then I headed to my own ranch to meet the trimmer and rode Mystery bareback a bit. He was feeling so good and energized that Sunday I went back up and rode him around the ranch. Was he ever surprised! But we had a short ride around the parimeter (he is a nosey gus and loves to look at the neighbors mules and facilities) and I think I will start riding him a little more. Then I will get him re-evaluated in spring after my taxes come in and see how he is. I just really, really miss riding MY horse and hanging out with him...

So here are a few pictures and I think his name is Woody but I have to confirm that!

Hope you all have a great week! K


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## Ranger

Wow, stunning!! I love friesans! They are just so gorgeous and majestic! That's scary about the stud colt. I always worry about them flipping out like that, too. Stalls are only good if they feel SAFE in stalls. Yeesh.

Thanks for sharing about your carriage lesson and your ride on Mystery! I know what you mean about wanting to ride your own horse. I feel the same way. I'm so hoping I'll be able to hop on Virgil over Christmas break and into the new year. I'd love to get him working - even a little - again!

I also can't believe there's no snow or blankets or jackets in your pics...jealous!


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## GoldenGirlsMom

Thanks Ranger for the horsey pictures! They are beautiful to look at! I like the little cutie with her big blanket and of course Virgil looks wonderful Are you sure Virgil wasnt trying to give you a kiss since he was feeling so good? Oh about that time loss thing you experience when you go to the barn. Yes I have experienced it also, multiple times. I go for a half hour lesson and three and half hours later I am just leaving to go home. 

Ahhhh, what a beautiful carriage ride! Thank you for the pictures! That looks like it would be fun and the Fresian looks gorgeous. Scary moment with the stud colt, wow! You are braver than me to get out of the cart.


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## Ranger

Oh Virgil might have been trying to give me a smooch! He's a big snuggle bug who loves hugs and kisses...except when he thinks other horses are watching him! Then he turns into Mr. Tough. He's done that weird 'talking' thing since I've had him. An animal communicator told me once it's him trying to 'talk' and express things to me...take that with a grain of salt! He does it when he's happy (like in the paddock) or when he's stressed. Basically, he loves telling me how he feels at all times. If he's sad, scared, happy, mad, cold, whatever, he's going to let me know...and then expect me to do something about it! He's a big personality. 

Isn't that little filly adorable?? She follows people when they walk past her paddock and has the most adorable little whinny! OMG she is so adorable I just stare at her. Of course Virgil is scared of her...these tiny critters, you just can't trust them!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Catching up a bit. Great pictures, all! Love Virgil talking! And boy do I miss that view from the box seat!!! Part of what I loved about driving is that I could watch my horse work too.

Now some worrying news. Please say a little prayer for Daz. All of a sudden, in the last 3 days, he's drinking tons more water than usual. Usually his bucket in the morning was still 2/3 full. Now it's drained. Jennifer gives him a fresh bucket @ 6ish and it's drained by 9. Also huge wet spot in his stall, which is at least good that the water is going thru him. But his wet spot was usually so small that sometimes I couldn't find it. Now, it's 1/4 of his stall, very wet with a puddle underneath. Poor guy has to lay in it. I can tell because his neck looks like it's been wet.

Vet is scheduled for Monday to draw blood. I've been so worried about his weight and the poor health that that can lead to. Morgans are prone to Cushing's, which is what killed Rocket. I had a complete blood panel done on him when I bought him as a base line for comparison. At least we know what his Cushing's risk was then compared to now. I really don't know what to expect.


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## Ranger

Keeping you and Daz in my thoughts and prayers! Hopefully it's nothing or something minor...maybe he's not drinking outside (water too cold? automatic waterer frozen or shocking the horses?) and then making up for it by drinking more when he goes into his stall at night. Fingers crossed!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I wish, but no. Monday morning he went out and drank a whole 5 gallons without stopping. Yesterday, Jennifer gave him water in the morning when she fed because his bucket was empty. It was empty again when I got there at 9. She watered him again this morning, I got there around 10:30 and he still had 3/4 bucket. And his wet spot wasn't as wet and his neck hair had not been wet. I hate the thought of him having to sleep in urine. I bedded deep today. 

When I turned him out he wanted to come back in...we're in the 40s F with a steady rain...not his ideal weather. I started to wonder if he was feeling sick. I got the other 2 out with him and they all went cantering to the way back...about 1/4 mile with Daz either in the lead or second. I knew Harry was last because he's the only one with his tail braided up in a sock. So he felt well enough to do that.

He has an allergy to clover which makes him drool excessively in the spring. I'm wondering if maybe this is a reaction to eating the clover after the frost has killed it, although he isn't drooling. In the spring, he drools so much that I put some shavings outside his door where he hangs his head over. He opens his mouth and it's like a bucket...I need a towel handy when ever I put the bit in!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Years ago, we did have an episode with stray voltage. The horses would lower their heads to get a drink and then pop it back up. Whaaa????

I didn't get a tingle until I put my finger in the water. Now we use a 40 gallon heated water bucket nestled inside a small water tank. Haven't had a problem with this set up.


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## Angelina

Oh dang about Daz! Is he running a temp? Did you notice if his hair growth is accessive? I am glad you are getting his blood (and thyroid) checked and you are on top of it. Hoping it is nothing serious.

My friend sent me a link to a person on their list who was 3 freisian stallions hanging out in her wooded No.Ca. pasture. She takes wonderful photos and has a website where you can enjoy them. Here is the link:


http://www.lauraz.net/Laura_Z/The_Forest_Boyz/The_Forest_Boyz.html

Enjoy! K


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## ILoveMyGolden

Ok, I am jumping in!!

I have been reading, but never know when the right time is to jump in! I think I popped in a loooong time ago as I lost my horse June 2009 and wasn't riding, etc.......

I am back riding (woo!) and have horses back in my life and it feels so good! I am riding at a dressage barn 20 minutes from me, a big change from my hunter/jumper roots, though I must say the dressage saddle I ride in is so comfy and safe feeling! When I got back into a jumping saddle I felt like I was sitting on a slippery rock! I didn't ride from when Mer passed (colic) June 2009 until this October. A friend who just moved into a barn manager position at this barn caught wind of a TB who needed a few extra rides thought of me because I am TB c-r-a-z-y and she knew I needed to get back in the saddle. The owner/coach of the farm started lessons with me on him (7 y/o TB Gelding) and then we added a 2nd ride per week on my own. About two weeks in she asked if I would be interested in riding one of her homebred mares, this one was a 5 y/o Dutch WB mare. So I am barning 4 days a week again, been thrown off (by the mare) just once and am having a blast fitting up again in the saddle! 

I hope everyone's horses are doing well and I will read and post along a little more now (if that is ok....) If my tone is a wee tad excited here, I am sorry....I was excited to post this!

Some pics of the crew:

This is Harry, he is a TB on stall rest in the first stall where I tack up, I am slightly obsessed with him because of his cuteness and sweet nickers!









This is Spud, the TB I am riding









And this is Belle/bigmare (as I will likely refer to her)


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## Angelina

Yeah, I am glad you are jumping in! What a great opportunity for you! I love those big bays. We have a TB rescuer here that supplies all the local barns with good, athletic horses..... he is www.tbfriends.org

It is amazing how many are thrown away from the horse racing industry but because of Joe, many go on to new homes and careers. How old was Mer when he passed?


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## Ranger

Yay, another horse person on the thread!

Gorgeous horses! I love big bays. The first guy, harry, has such a cute expression! 

I am also jealous of your excited tone...I wish I could ride my guy again (soon, soon, I keep telling myself) and be that excited! There is just something comforting about being in a barn, especially in the winter.

Make sure to keep posting about your horse times!


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## ILoveMyGolden

Mer (Merlin) was 19. I got him when we was 12. He raced for nearly 7 years (insane, 68 starts) mostly in low end claiming races throughout the US when he was claimed off the track for his 2nd of 2 Canadian races at Erie and then 'became' a riding horse. I back tracked via his papers the owners who bought him off the track to find out more history about him, the tailspin of bad humans began after they sold him and kept going until he landed in my arms. Sweetie from the ground, but a nightmare under saddle. When he was 16 I just opted to retire him and let him enjoy life, he was mostly sound (bone chip front knee) and easy keeping, low stress when there was no riding involved. Least "colicy" horse there was and on May 31st (a Sunday night) I got that awful phonecall from my BO that the vet was on the way and that it wasn't good. I opted to not go for surgery (about $8K to get him on the table around here) so the vet and I did about 16 hours of everything else and lost the battle late morning on the 1st. I had his winter blankets wrapped around me to stay right by his side through that night. Memories of that day still kick me in the gut and thankfully as time passed the better Mer memories are what I/everyone remembers most.

His paddock buddies (Mer is in the middle):









Lazy boy (dog in a horses body?)









He had quite the view....









Some girlfriends all got together to take our horses to the CNE (Canadian National Exhibition) one year. Mer and I did the Children's Hunters! Didn't pin in any of the classes (expected!) but had so.much.fun.









This is video (what luck!) of the last time I was on him about 6 weeks before he passed! I hadn't ridden him all fall/winter and into Spring, hopped on and got what you see in the video, I was pretty happy and am so lucky to have had my friend there to video it obviously having no idea that would be it.


One of my favourites...!









ok, lots of pictures, sorry, I really liked looking at all those again!!


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## ILoveMyGolden

The bigmare is 17.2 I think? Just a spec of white on one foot and a phantom sock on her front left. She is so beautiful, and a handful. Seriously, I am using to little TB's, I feel so helpless on her when she acts like she's 5 (90% of the time) and she dumped me pretty good my first time on her, my coach/her owner felt awful, I was fine and it was such good motivation to get back on and fix that!

I am out to ride Spud tonight, lesson on Belle tomorrow.....eeep!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Beautiful TBs. Especially the one with the view. My Daz looks just like the far horse in the 'buddies at the gate' picture. Even a nearly matching star.

And what is it about the Harry's in the world...just really cute sweeties. Yours looks almost like mine!

Glad you're back in the saddle and glad you'll be posting here! How far are you from Windsor?


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## ILoveMyGolden

Windsor is probably 4 hours from here? Perhaps a little less.


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## Angelina

What a beautiful horse Mer was and so lucky to finish his life with you. I am sure he appreciated it and loved you to the end. I hope it was not too painful to share. There are so many TB going to slaughter right now and I hope you will consider adopting another when the time is right. Not everyone can handle them. I am looking forward to reading about more of your adventures. You are so lucky being able to ride these different horses! K


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Just wondering. We're about 2 hours west of Windsor, in Michigan.



ILoveMyGolden said:


> Windsor is probably 4 hours from here? Perhaps a little less.


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## ILoveMyGolden

Penny's Mom said:


> Just wondering. We're about 2 hours west of Windsor, in Michigan.


I have family in Kalamazoo, they used to be in Brighton! I think Kalamazoo is eons away though, where they were in Brighton was much closer.


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## Ranger

What beautiful pics of Merlin. So sorry you lost him that way. Colic is just brutal. At least he had great years with you.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

We used to live just a few miles west of Brighton. Fowlerville is where we had our first farm! What a small world it is. I'm glad you're on the horse thread with us.



ILoveMyGolden said:


> I have family in Kalamazoo, they used to be in Brighton! I think Kalamazoo is eons away though, where they were in Brighton was much closer.


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## GoldenGirlsMom

OHHHH! I hope and pray that Daz is going to be ok. My fingers are crossed for you. I dont know much about horse care but that sounds like a whole lot of water. I know about Cushings though, I had a Lab that had it. 

YEAAA! Another horse person on here that is back in the saddle!! I love your pictures and Mer is a beautiful horse. I hope you have the big dog picture of him and you framed, that is a great picture.

I had a riding lesson last night and my news on it is that I cantered. Finally! WOHOO!! I was so proud that I did it. I was just as tired from it though. Now I am supposed to be working on my endurance so I can do everything longer. Being 53 is a bitch. Next thing to learn is posting on the leg and diagonals. I have no clue what all this is but that is what Google is for. I havent fallen off yet. I am sure it is coming though and I am scared to death of it.


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## ILoveMyGolden

This is my absolute favourite picture of him, one of my best friend's had it drawn as a bridesmaid gift to me for her wedding! 

It is framed and I see it everyday, love love love.

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/39140_897861761251_58008484_52419175_2606562_n.jpg


I am excited for my lesson on the bigmare tonight, I had an awful ride on her last, well, I thought -coach said it was great, but it felt awful so I am hoping I walk away more positive this time.


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## Angelina

Beautiful drawing of Mer! That is so special! GGMom, better places then google to learn this stuff! One book I would recommend is sally swift centered riding. I'm sure others here (Ranger?) can recommend straight forward books about trotting on the correct diagonals. I think cantering is easy and trotting is hard! Make sure you have a trainer that will teach you to feel it without looking....

Here are a few pics of my boy from last weekend. Sat. he needed a trim so all I need to is call him and he whinnys, trots over. (love it). Sunday I decided to ride him so he was a bit unsure why I was back so soon (me work? I'm retired!). It will be interesting to see his reaction next time I go up although I think he enjoyed the ride! 

First are a couple more of the freisian too since I downloaded pics from my big camera. Lighting was all wrong so they are not that good.


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## GoldenGirlsMom

I agree, that is a beautiful picture of Mer. Thanks Angelina for the book recommendation, I will get it. I did Google a little last night and there is not that much info available. I did get a little better understanding but a book would be a great help. Love the pics of your boy and I am glad that you are able to ride him again. It must feel so good. Yes cantering was easier than trotting. I am excited to do it again now that I know what to expect. I think I was worrying myself for nothing thinking that I would fall off. I think I need to fall off and get it over with so I will quit worrying about it.

Penny's Mom, how is Daz? Any news?


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## Elisabeth Kazup

You're just a spring chicken. If I can do it at 64 you can do it at 53. I work on an exercise ball to strengthen abs. My problem is sitting up straight. I tend to sit on my pockets, too round, too deep into the saddle. I think this makes it hard for him to walk when we're supposed to be walking. He wants to jog, I think because my seat is pushing him on.

I think Daz is getting better. Daughter thinks it's because I took him off his 'diet' hay and put him back on the second cutting grass/alfalpha mix they he was getting before. She thinks he was making a digestive adjustment. I didn't even think about that because he was getting some of the second cutting each day. Still having the vet out Monday to give him a once over and discuss possibilities.



GoldenGirlsMom said:


> OHHHH!
> Being 53 is a bitch.


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## ILoveMyGolden

I had a fantastic lesson on Belle last night! I am still working on the lunge with her as she is just too baby brained and coming back into work in the cooler weather was a good recipe for me to be thrown off our first ride! Next week I am coming off the lunge! Last night the line was so loose/slack as Lesley (coach) held on, I really felt totally independant. Our canter transitions were amazing, really getting that "spot" where she is being wonderfully reactive. Her trot energy was unreal, she is bad for really dropping her shoulder and dive bombing away from what she is spooking at, she did it last night but I nipped it and pushed her forward again. That is how I went the first time and surely how I will go again, but it's good motivation to always keep my hands active and have her paying attention to me and not everything else. Lesley thinks we may put her in a standing martingale (if we can find one big enough, LOL) just to contain the stupidity if she were to get silly, the ability to have her head "down" (not cranked down of course, but so she can't shoot it up as high as she can go) would really help control her power/the situation and perhaps prevent a fall. All this and then next week's lesson and then I am away for 10 days......bah! I am not back at the barn until Sunday now, and already can't wait!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Oh, you're a true horseman for sure...when you hate to be away from the barn.

Penny's Dad gets a little annoyed with me because I won't go to Florida in the winter. I just hate to leave my boys behind and hate leaving all the work to Penny's sister. She commutes 2 hours a day, that's a lot plus having to feed and clean. And it's a long day for them to be out: she'd put them out @ 6 a.m. and they wouldn't get back in until 7 p.m. She'd have to come home from work and clean. Too much work!

Daz is continuing to improve. His bucket was full when I turned him out. She had filled it @ 6 when she fed hay. I'm so glad...I was really worried.


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## Angelina

I am glad Daz is feeling better..are you still going to have the vet come out? I've heard of stomach upsets from change of feed but not accessive drinking. How is he doing with his salt intake? 
How is Penny doing since her little episode the other day?

You are dedicated...I'd be in a warmer climate no questions asked! Maybe you could compromise and hire someone to help during those days? K


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## Angelina

Ok Penny's mom, tell us about Harry!


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## Ranger

Well, the candy canes were a bust! I could only find mini ones so I snapped them up...and Virgil ate them a little reluctantly and I couldn't understand why. I tried one myself and turns out they're spearmint instead of peppermint...my bad. So after eating 3 mini ones, he turned up his nose at the others and I resorted to licorice horse treats. 

Now I'm stuck with a box of spearmint candy canes. Why wouldn't they SAY they were spearmint on the front?! 

Virgil's also getting a tail cord for his NEW rambo blanket. I bought a rambo supreme heavy weight a few months ago for under 300 dollars but it didn't come with a neck cover OR tail cord. ***? Me calling has done nothing so I've resigned myself to just buying a tail cord and foregoing the neck cover. It was an awesome price so oh well.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Had a nice little Merry Christmas ride this afternoon. A bit nippy: 35F/wind chill 26F but the sun is sort of shining. Pretty darned okay weather for Michigan at the end of December.

I can see the value of riding at least 3 or 4 times month during the winter. I had to convince him to lope, not too much. Once he got in the groove he went along pretty nicely. I'm not used to winter riding so maybe he needs a bit more warm up. 

Anyway, Merry Christmas to all the wonderful horses!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Another nice ride today. I even put the reins down and let him jog around while 'steering' with my legs and seat. He was fine but quit steering when he turned and saw daughter. He jogged on over and stopped by her, waiting for treats.

She helped me work on untwisting my left twist. An amazing :doh: when I squared my position toward the front, he didn't drop out of the lope to the right. I can't imagine how uncomfortable it is for him to try to flex right when I'm twisted left.

I also tried blunt spurs and I LIKE THEM! My cue isn't very strong and doesn't send a clear message. It's easy for him to ignore. I don't think I'll need them in the show ring tho because he's usually 'up' then and knows what to do.

The rest of the year isn't going to be very inviting. Colder, wetter, snowier. I got a pair of insulated breeches and glove today. Going to get ski goggles because my eyes water in the cold wind and I can't see where I'm going. lol

Oh and dismounting? Instead of my foot not clearing his rump (I usually have to stop on his rump and work my foot over until it falls off his rump) it went sailing right on over. I nearly ended up on my back on the ground...wasn't ready for THAT!

So the year is dwindling down to a precious few rides


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## Ranger

Haha, love that he jogged on over to your daughter! My guy would do that, too. My mom would be riding him and I'd instruct from the ground. Whenever he would canter or trot past me, he'd slow way down 'just in case' I wanted him to stop and I don't know, maybe give him a cookie? He'd love to come into the middle since I'd give him a cookie for looking after my mom and scratch his itchy spots while i talked to my mom. Funny guy. He figured that out pretty quick!

I stopped by the tack store today since they were having a big boxing day sale! Got a new bucket - bright orange - for 2 bucks. Some supplements, 15% off, and miracle groom to try. He's getting a little dandruffy so hopefully the miracle groom will help. Currying doesn't seem to be helping, unfortunately. I'm going to try currying the heck outta him, spraying him with the miracle groom and brushing, then using my new rub rag on him and see if that helps. 

Other than that, though, he's looking really good!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I need to find me some $2 buckets: Harry like to bite the edge of his. I usually just get Daz a new bucket and pass along the old one to Harry. Hate to waste a brand new bucket on him.

Our boys can actally be treat aggressive. Don't start feeding them until AFTER you're done 'cause they won't think about anything else. lol

Another ride today. Jen and I went to the tack shop Monday. I got a spare pair of boots so I can leave the spurs on, insulated breeches (Kerrots) and some new hi-tech gloves. Gotta try them out. Mid-20sF with w/c in the teens. But major sunshine! I'll try to get some pictures.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Jen posted some of her early pictures on fb, thought I'd share the trip down memory lane here.

This is her first Class A blue ribbon. Road Hack, 1981. She was 12









She rode saddleseat as a junior exhibitor. I was her riding coach after age 12. This is her 13 and under equatation and English Pleasure mount, Rusty. We called him Chester the Child Molester because he was push button AND you'd better know which buttons to push!  She finished her last 13 and under year by winning the Michigan Horse Show Association top honors in eq and pl along with winning in our Michigan Morgan Club.








This is Donny. He was one of our foals that I trained. I was also her riding coach for him too. She finished her 17 and under year by winning the same top honors as before. She rides beautifully!








This is PJ. He was a TB and she rode him dressage after finishing her Morgan equation years. He was the sweetest, best manner horse we've ever had in the barn. A real gentlemen. If he was a person, he'd have been an English butler. Sadly, he had pain issues and after throwing her badly was retired. He was PTS 3 years ago because of arthritis in his hocks. He was in his mid-20s.


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## Ranger

Wow, beautiful pics! What insanely shining horses, too!!! They all look mirror-like! Thanks for sharing them!

I hear ya about buckets. I probably should have bought a few more at that price. Virge is rough on his buckets, too. He eats, then paws at them, rolls them around, picks them up by edge and gnaws on them or throws them. If it's something he doesn't want to eat, he'll strike at the bucket. His poor red one can never look clean because he's gnawed crevices into the edges and then the dirt gets in there and will never come out.

Gnawing on the bucket halfway through his meal (yes, there's still feed in there)









About to bring it back to me:









After he decided he didn't want to his hay cubes...slammed his foot onto the bucket and everything went flying. That carrot got some air time!









And that poor looking bucket is only 2 years...and he didn't even get fed out of it for a year!! Oh well, now he has a garish orange one to destroy!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Thanks for the compliment!

Daz likes to rub on his. Everyday I was trying to shove them back into something resembling roundish. Finally put up a corner board in front of his grain bucket. He leaves the water bucket alone because it was splash his butt.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

He has so much personality!! I love the Virgil stories!


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## Ranger

So tell me, what did you do to get those coats so shiny!! I have always struggled to get a gorgeous bloom on Virgil's coat since he can tend to look either orange or dirt-coloured. Sadly, it wasn't til he retired that he finally got a gorgeous bloom to his coat...but probably because he'd also gotten so heavy he looked like a potato with four legs. His coat dappled for the first time ever - I didn't even know it COULD dapple - and he gleamed. But then, he was too fat and I had to cut his feed and supplements...and now I can't remember what it was I was giving him back then!

His coat is shiny right now, but the skin itself is flaking. Big patches of skin at the roots and it's fairly icky. Usually a good currying helps but it hasn't been working this winter...I'm not sure what do!

Here he is 6 months after being retired...I'd NEVER seen his coat looking so good. This was just after a brush. No bathing, no show sheen, nothing.









But then he turned into a potato with legs...still super shiny and slick, but muchos too fat. Here he is after a roll in his pasture, not even brushed:









Sadly, his coat wasn't nearly as nice when he was being shown...for whatever reason. He was still shiny, but not dapply and satin-looking.









and now, his coat is shiny but all gross at the skin. Any ideas? I just bought some miracle groom in the hopes that will help, plus I brought a rub rag out to the barn. Going to try rubbing him down every grooming session. Right now currying is just bringing all the nasty stuff up to the top and there's no end in sight. His coat looks dull and gray after I'm done grooming.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Probably the biggest thing that I can think of is that they stay in a lot. During show season, April until October, they go out about 4-6 hours a day, from 6 a.m. to noon at the latest. 

Also that period they get supplement: B1, electrolytes (SmartLytes). We feed Patriot 12% pelleted feed with lush grass and 2nd cutting grass/alfalpha hay. 

They get rinsed off after every ride (when it's warm), bathed with shampoo the week before the show and after arriving at the show. One coat of show sheen (not where the saddle goes) and then rinsed after every class. I really think, tho, that being in out of the sun has the biggest effect.

Here's a picture from today. Temp is 27F; wind chill 17F. I was toasty warm in my new insulated breeches. We probably won't ride when it's in the teens...just to cold for their lungs. And today was my second ride with the spurs. He was so relaxed; I think he really enjoys getting very clear cues. THOSE he knows what to do with. I think I was sending jumbled messages before which just confused him and made him uncertain. I hope!


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## Ranger

Oh hahaha, looks like Virgil won't get that nice of a coat then! I'd think he'd go nuts if he wasn't out for at least 16 hours a day. He did well at horse shows when he had to be stalled for 2-3 weeks at a time, but he was working hard when he was out and we did a lot of hand walking besides showing or hacking on days off.

That's a very cute picture!!

I went out to see Virgil and am having a very annoying time with the feed store. We do NOT have a lot of options for feed which is stupid considering we're in 'horse country'. Virgil's been low on feed for the last 3 weeks and each time I got the store, I get told it'll be in next week...so finally, I go in today and they tell me TWO weeks...maybe. Virgil is officially out of feed as of tomorrow.

The only bright side is that he is one fat boy so he doesn't 'need' it. It's basically just something to mix his supplements with. I'm contemplating changing his feed, but not sure what to switch to or if I should. He was on this feed to gain weight (was getting 5 lbs of it a day and it's high fat) but has been only getting under a quart for the last month. So do I change or not? I'm leery about changing feed in the winter, too. 

In the meantime, I think BO's going to have to mix his supplements with beet pulp. He HATES the liquid corta-flx I got him. Knocked his bucket over and walked away in a huff. I finally made a bran mash and mixed it in with molasses and he ate it, but very reluctantly. 

He's also spending the night unblanketed. It was howling wind and cold this morning but the wind stopped, the sun came out and it was glorious. I went out to the barn and poor guy had soaked through his liner. Luckily, HE was pretty much dry at that point - just a little damp on his shoulders - and it was still nice out with the sun out. I took his blanket off, rubbed him down, and he'll be naked the next few days. I can't imagine him getting too cold at night with his round bale to munch on and his buddies next to him.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

I bought this fleece sheet for when Harry gets too warm after riding. IT IS BEAUTIFUL! I think for the price, you can't go wrong. Beautiful to look at, beautifully made. Under $50 delivered in the U.S. Canada might be more.

Dura-Tech® Polar Fleece Dress Sheet with Braid in Fleece Sheets at Schneider Saddlery


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Our boys LOVE to be in. A couple of hours outside each day would be plenty for them. They always come when I call them; they think they're coming in. About the only time I have to go get them is in the spring when they are stoned on new grass! 

I was told a long time ago that horses will grow thicker winter coats if they are allowed to be a little cold...not too cold or shivery, of course. So, his naked nights with his buddies should be okay. Better too cold than too hot and sweaty, imo. 

What a bummer on the feed problem. When you do get it, buy a couple of extra bags. We have 2 grain bins and as soon as we empty one and start on the other, we fill up the first one. That means we always have about 3-4 weeks of feed on hand when a bin is empty. Each bin holds 50 pounds. We don't go thru grain very fast.



Ranger said:


> Oh hahaha, looks like Virgil won't get that nice of a coat then! I'd think he'd go nuts if he wasn't out for at least 16 hours a day. He did well at horse shows when he had to be stalled for 2-3 weeks at a time, but he was working hard when he was out and we did a lot of hand walking besides showing or hacking on days off.


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## Ranger

Yep, definitely agree - better too cold than hot and sweaty. I thought I was in the clear until wednesday, but the temps just dropped for the weekend so I'll probably have to go out and put a blanket on. I hate these temps! One day it's plus 7, then the next day it's -7. Hard on the horses. 

I don't think I can buy more than one bag at a time since there's not a lot of room to store it. My feed tub is pretty small (has to fit into the feed room) and can only hold one bag. I only buy one bag a month so it's not too bad. Just annoying. I'm thinking of switching to a ration balancer so I can feed less and stretch the feed out a little more. Right now he's only getting it to mix in with his supplements...including the one he hates!


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## Ranger

Well, exciting news...for me, at least! 

I'm going to go out tomorrow and do some in-hand work with the V-man! There are some...less than smart people out at the barn, and I prefer to avoid them. V is already a little nervous -still- at the new barn, so he doesn't need to have a moron child whipping an extension cord all around his legs while she blow dries her pony. Nor does he need said moron child jumping up and down in a bale feeder while we walk by. NOR does he need an aggressive weiner dog barking hysterically and mock charging when I'm a) leading Virgil anywhere b) trying to groom him or c) when I'm trying to go into the tack room to get my stuff without getting my jeans bit. Last time this stupid dog charged me when I entered the tack room, I 'accidentally' dropped my heavy leather halter - complete with stud chain - on him. Plus, it would appear there's only room for 3 horses to be tied up at a time, and Virgil likes to move a little and look behind him. 

At any rate, I scrutinized the lesson schedule and I think I found a time where the dummies will be gone or riding in the ring. Then I'm going to groom him and when the one moron is done her lesson, I'll take Virgil in the ring to do his handwalking. Hopefully, all goes well! 

Virgil will be on his third day of the loading dose of his new joint supplement and we're just walking anyway (well, the plan is to just walk, sometimes Virgil has other ideas) but I feel better knowing he's on his supplement. Yay Virgil!


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## Megora

@Penny's Mom - I'm loving the Saddleseat pics! The best way to ride.  

@shine - I definitely think it has to do with being inside. My guy has been outside a lot during the past 2 years (chiropractor's recommendation) and he's not as glossy as he used to be. He still is healthy looking and sound, so that is what's important. 

Random update... we put snowshoes on my guy for the first time ever. And of course all of the snow melted.  

Normally we just take his shoes off and let him be barefoot all winter, but I hate how bad his feet get without his shoes.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

Thanks, Megora! Our guys go barefoot in the winter. They were a plain keg shoe during the season. 

Ranger, that's the down side of boarding...along with 'helpful advice' on training and caring for your horse, on riding, on your love life. Other than that....

When Daz was in training for the cante-lope the kids dressed up for St. Patrick's day. He had little leprachans running thru his lesson. BUT, he's a Morgan, not flighty and it was good for him. Not so with a TB!


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## Ranger

Soooo happy to report how amazing Virgil was today!!! Today was Day 1 of getting him out of retirement and back into work and he was sooo unbelievably good. I'm just thrilled!

I was a little worried when I got out there as i could see he was spooking and galloping in his paddock. But brought him in and he didn't even spook at the weanling, not even when she touched her nose to the electric tape right as we went by! Had a bit of a look at the tree limb that was sticking out but the door opening and closing no longer bugs him as much. No morons were around inside the barn, which was great!

Had him tied up and he was a little flighty for 10 minutes then settled down nicely for the rest of the grooming. Put the surcingle on, side reins attached, and bridle. Hooked up the longe line and went inside the indoor ring for the first time. I was expecting some spooks or snorts, even some prancing or airs above ground...but hooked up the side reins and started walking. Past all the 'scary' corners, the scary jump standards in the shape of silhouette horses and bubbles...past the mirrors and viewing area...

And not one single spook!! He 'looked' at things out of the corner of his eye once or twice but he was unbelievable. Didn't put a step wrong. Whoa-ed when I asked verbally, never needed a reminder. Didn't fuss with the side reins. I had them on for extra control for the first time in the ring, but I think I'll keep them on to help build up his topline while I do handwalking. We walked for 10 minutes, he got lots of cookies and lots of positive reinforcement. He didn't even get antsy when the little pony in the class started trotting! He was AN ANGEL. 

We had an awesome time. Afterwards, I curried the heck out of him and rubbed him down with my rub rag and some miracle groom. His coat is WAY nicer than I thought it was. Even before the rub rag and miracle groom! The mud fell off with barely a touch of the dandy brush (and my dandy brushes are soft since he's thin skinned) and he was gleaming just after that. After the rub down and miracle groom, he was glistening! I wish I'd had my camera! Maybe I'll bring someone to take pics of him walking next time. He looked so nice and most of all, SO HAPPY.


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## Elisabeth Kazup

He sounds fantastic! What a way to end one year and start the next! On a really positive note.

They work so well when they are well fed, comfortable in their herd and feel safe. I'm so happy for you. And so happy that his coat is improving, too.


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## Ranger

Thanks Penny's Mom!! It was definitely a great note to end the year on! Bring on 2012! 

Yes, thank goodness his coat is looking better. There's still 'scurf' by the roots, but he's grown such a long coat it's hard to get to it, even with the curry. I'm hoping the rubbing with the rag and miracle groom will help that a little. His mane and forelock are really starting to shine, too. I'll have to take pics tomorrow when I'm out, but knowing him he's already rolled in a big puddle of mud. He is getting his new year's day bran mash tomorrow morning, though!


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## LilTuffGirl

Not 2011 anymore.. but...
Here is Skip. Oddly he came with the house I just purchased...








They think he is a QH and I agree.. I don't think anyone who has owned him has really known much about horses and it kinda shows. I've taken him out and cleaned him up and he really tried to push me around. He wanted graze and didn't care what I wanted to do. Granted I was going to let him sit there and chew on some grass as I cleaned him up but kinda wanted it on my terms. So we bumped heads a bit.. He kept pinning his ears back but not doing anything else. I finally let him eat while I did my thing and we did fine lol

Although he has an odd swelling on his rear leg that looks like a high ring bone... I couldn't get to it to feel if it was soft or hard since he wouldn't even let me brush his rear legs. (didn't have anything to tie him up to)
My pasture is pretty much hillside and muddy so I asked the guy whom i'm buying to property from if Skip can stay with him in his barn/pasture and he agreed. See if his leg gets better. If not he needs a home with flat ground. 

Also I need to work on a better shelter for him.....
shew i'm starting to have a zoo now..


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## Ranger

Aw, what a pretty guy. He does look a little 'rough around the edges'. Thank goodness he fell into your hands! He has a nice eye...I like him!


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## Elisabeth Kazup

He's cute! He'll figure out that you're one of the good guys and then be putty in your hands. A few treats will win him over.

We've started a 2012 horse thread. Be sure to keep us updated there!


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