# Dumb Question



## bethlehemgolden (Aug 2, 2014)

When I go to some shows. And right after a dog shakes, their is a puff of what I think is powder coming from the dogs coat. 

And when I was talking to my Breeder she looked at me and said. "You see the puppies noses. They are black. That is what you will be getting.". Sure enough. Kelvin has a black noes.

But at a show, after I meet with another dogs breeder to just introduce my self. After I petted their dog, I had black on like substance on my hand. Why would you "paint" a nose. Is it that big of a deal?

Why did my breeder make a point to say that my dogs nose will be black? And how come this other golden gave off black stuff. 

I also do not know the person or the name of the dog. They left right away after I looked at my hand. I am just so confused. If this is an issue, shouldn't the judges and the people working the shows be looking for these issues that what I see as cheating?


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## Bosn'sMom (Feb 11, 2013)

First off, I know some dogs (including mine) get snow nose. His nose his a little lighter in the winter than it is in the summer. Also, I have been told (not sure if it is a myth or lie) that plastic bowls can irritate the nose when the dog eats and rub on the nose causing it to be less black. 

Personally, my dogs nose could be purple and I'd love him just the same


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

I'm just laughing here, because I'm going to guess that what you experienced is the reason why so many handlers are hyper about "thou must not touch" w/regards to the dogs.  

Powder in the coat - I wasn't aware that golden people use powder throughout the coat. I know with rough collies they do. A lot of people use chalk or powder on the feet to get them to poof before going into the show ring. And even there it's not overdone too much, relatively speaking. 

Black noses - it's preferable that the dogs look like they have good pigment out there, even when they don't. I don't know if they do this so much locally (it's not something I've had to deal with since Bertie's got fairly good pigment so I never had to ask), but elsewhere they probably do touch up the noses. 

I think there's probably other things that cause snow nose (because sometimes you have dogs that have crazy good pigment but whose noses are more brown than black)... but pigment is very hereditary. So if your breeder is telling you that your dog's nose is going to be black, I assume that's her knowing what she breeds and how they will turn out.


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## Lucky Penny (Nov 13, 2011)

The things people do to make their dogs look a certain way will blow you away. Painting the nose is just one thing!


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## Susabelle (Oct 7, 2014)

I don't know the answer, but I just thought I would pipe in with I don't think this is a dumb question at all. Seems dishonest to blacken a nose if that is what they were doing.


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## bethlehemgolden (Aug 2, 2014)

My thing is with just starting out with confirmation.

Before I even step in the ring. I need to bond well with Kelvin. We have a blast playing walking and training. He will also need the proper vaccines, and medical care to ensure he is healthy enough to be around other dogs.

My next step is to learn how to properly behave in the ring. The right gate, the right stack, holding the lead. ect.

Once we have done enough practicing, he and I will do some shows, just to see how it goes. I do not expect to win. A more mature dog should in my mind easily beat a 6 month old puppy.


The thing is I know I need to learn so much, then do so much to even get in the ring. But if people often cheat in this sport. Why should I even bother? The point of confirmation is to ensure the dogs who are being breed are what they should be. Right? I want to help my breeder show she does right by the breed. Other than confirmation, is there another way to help her? By the way... this is my idea to help her. She is ok with me not showing him, I will just need to get him neutered. But dog shows have always fascinated me, and I have a good intact male dog. That is young enough to learn, it just seems like timing is working out for me.


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

Golden confirmation shows in my mind are kinda like the dog version of the Victoria Secret runway models.

No matter were you show some breeders in the know will seek out favorite judges to get points, use chalk and paint for their dog to be "pretty"

My kids are rescues, I prefer them with a bit of mud for makeup


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## K9-Design (Jan 18, 2009)

You don't have to cheat to win. You do need a good dog, and good presentation. It's a lot of hard work and steep learning curve. I've never used powder in grooming, and my dogs all have black noses so no need to touch that up.

It's CONFORMATION, not confirmation.


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## GoldenCamper (Dec 21, 2009)

K9-Design said:


> It's CONFORMATION, not confirmation.


Yikes! so sorry, gee whiz..

I will go crawl back into my cave now.


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## OnMyWay2MyDreams (Feb 13, 2011)

I have not seen powder or anything being put on goldens but I dont pay much mind to what others are doing. I just focus on my dogs and dont add in any extra stuff. I too think its a bit dishonest but if you walk around a show you will see it being done even in other breeds. Poodles are the worst IMO, with hair extensions, hair spray... I saw bull terriers who had lots of white getting chalked to make them appear whiter. 

You dont have to do any of those things to your dog. Show him the way you want too, period.


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## Megora (Jun 7, 2010)

bethlehemgolden said:


> The thing is I know I need to learn so much, then do so much to even get in the ring. But if people often cheat in this sport. Why should I even bother? The point of conformation is to ensure the dogs who are being bred are what they should be.


Just quickly - don't assume people are all cheating if a few are. And even those who do "cheat" - don't assume that they are content with the status quo and will continue to breed what they have to get more of what they have.

I can think of a breeder who used to have to fix noses before showing their goldens back 20 years ago or so. In their words, they introduced a dog in their breeding who had very good pigment, and they haven't had to color noses ever since. 

Other thing too is that conformation is not going to be the most fun thing if you really hate losing. Because unlike other dog sports, you could basically pay $30 to enter a show where the judge might not even look at your dog. It stinks when that happens and generally is a reason why a lot of people start writing off certain judges that they will show to. And even picking out certain judges to show to - you still aren't guaranteed to win under them.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

K9-Design said:


> You don't have to cheat to win. You do need a good dog, and good presentation. It's a lot of hard work and steep learning curve. I've never used powder in grooming, and my dogs all have black noses so no need to touch that up.
> 
> It's CONFORMATION, not confirmation.


I agree with this post. Let people cheat-many judges were handlers and are not fooled. 

If you have a nice dog with good qualities of breed type and good structure /movement, you will win your fair share. No one always wins. 

I push the envelope in the opposite direction at times- like hopping the dog out of Damariscotta lake and having to blowdry without a proper bath bc out of time- that isnt the best thing either. 

Preparing well without cheating on the one hand or being uninformed about small tricks and techniques for grooming on the other is best. 

My dogs luckily have good pigment, but you can buy nose-black at cherrybrook.com. 

Showing dogs is partly an exercise in to-thine-own-self-be -true, and focusing on how and why you do what you do with your own dog/dogs. There are always people doing a range of things from excellent to horrible, but the trick is to be in a zone with your own dog and team/friends, ignoring lots of other stuff.


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

There are other titles you can get that will help your breeder prove her dogs. First of all every dog should get their CGC, but obedience and agility titles show brains. We showed Sailor in a couple puppy sweeps, and I will show her next month in our specialty, both in the puppy sweeps and the senior puppy class. She will be just a couples days short of 18 months. We are still waiting for her to mature. In the meantime, I have done classes, she has gotten her CGC, we have gotten two of her four clearances, and in am waiting for the summer agility classes to start.


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## Ljilly28 (Jan 22, 2008)

Growing up with show horses, my grandfather had a saying, you can't tell a flower when to blossom and you can't tell a colt when to mature. I agree with the last post, showing is always fun but winning and winning streaks can be about your dog being in bloom right then. Dogs come into themselves at vastly different ages.


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## CarolinaCasey (Jun 1, 2007)

I don't use chalk. I am shocked a dog shook and powder when flying, but then again, I don't use it. We all (colllective) blow dry coats to create a fluffy dog, we are opening the coat. Not really what the standard says either... 

When showing I do a happy medium, it's what I am comfortable with. I always bath and blow out before a show. I will use hairspray, maybe product to volumize hock hair before going in the ring. I have two nice honest dogs so I am lucky in that respect that I don't need to sculpt them into something they're not and don't need to use grooming products to create an illusion. Their noses are black and if they get a little lighter in the winter, so be it. If you stand in the grooming area and watch some big time handlers or long time breeders, you would be amazed at some dogs' transformations in their time on the table.


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