# Feeling gutted - hips :(



## nolefan (Nov 6, 2009)

Hey, stop beating yourself up about laminate. That is not what did this. I know it's tough, but try not to borrow trouble until you get some answers after the xrays. If you are like me and have to be proactive, do a little reading and come to your apt with a list of questions for if the xrays show a problem and also for if they don't. After you have answers, be sure to contact her breeder so that they know what's going on. Sona is precious and you will get her the care she needs no matter the outcome, just try to stay calm until you know for sure what's going on. I'm sorry for your worry, I know it's hard to worry the dog you love so much is in pain and they can't tell you exactly what is wrong.


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## G-bear (Oct 6, 2015)

Please do not blame yourself for this! Whatever may be wrong with your beautiful girl you did not cause it. From your post it sounds as if you were extremely careful and tried to do everything possible to make sure she would be healthy with healthy joints. From where I am sitting it sounds like you are a careful and loving dog mom to your fur baby. Since you won't know anything definite until x-rays are done I think Nolefan is right that you should research possible outcomes and come up with questions for potential scenarios. Be proactive but, please, please, please, do NOT blame yourself! You did not cause this by having laminate floors! Sending good thoughts your way
Please keep us posted.


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## Pilgrim123 (Jul 26, 2014)

You ask if hip dysplasia stops dogs from having a long, happy and active life. It certainly didn't stop Pilgrim, though we did have to be a bit careful not to let him overdo it. From time to time, he had to have Cartrophen (Rimadyl) injections, and was on painkillers and supplements for the last six years of his life. He still came swimming, accompanied my son and his friends on hikes and dug rabbits out of holes. If you watched him chasing kangaroos off our place, you would never know about his hips. Sure, he developed arthritis, but I don't believe he missed out on much. He lived until he was nearly 13, when his arthritis and doggie dementia became too much.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thank you all soo much your responses. After a nights sleep I'm feeling a bit calmer. You are all right I need to wait and see and I'll be prepared for whatever the outcome is. Sona will get the best - I'll make sure of it! Thank you for listening to a crazy panicked dog mom!!! It's good to hear common sense from other!
Pilgrim - thanks for sharing about your boy it's good to hear the good outcomes when you have become obsessed with the negative view.


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## rooroch (Nov 7, 2012)

Sorry to read this. What the others say is correct. You did everything more than right, taking so much care that many people do not do. One thing, is your vet specialised in hip x rays? If the positioning of the hips is not done well (even slightly off) the reading can be incorrect. Many vets are not used to doing hips often and one can see some really bad positioning. Just a thought. Maybe your breeder can help with suggesting a good vet for this.


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## Prism Goldens (May 27, 2011)

And I want you to pat yourself on the back- you have kept her at a wonderful weight!


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thanks rooroch I would not have thought to check that. Regardless of outcome I think it is good to have her hips scored as the more data available to researchers and breeders has to be a good thing - high and low scores. 
Thanks Prism - every little bit plays a part. I'm glad I brought her to vet regularly to monitor her weight.


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## Monkey&Marshall (Aug 17, 2015)

I am so sorry to hear this.  Maybe it's just a bit of soft tissue injury and not actual hip dysplasia at this point? I'm crossing my fingers for you. Either way, a good joint supplement isn't going to hurt! I have my boys on Dasuquin beef chews, and they LOVE them.  And fish oil will also help with inflammation / joint health. Both of these I started after seeing my 2.5 year old start to be a bit creaky.

Good luck.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thanks Monkey&Marshall yes I'm looking forward to getting the X-ray done so I have more answers. I'm hoping the supplement will make things a bit easier for her - it looks good it has glucosamine green lipped mussel chondroitin epa and dha. She was already on fish oil although I stopped it a few weeks ago as her tummy was a bit upset so she is back on that again now.


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## 2tired (Oct 19, 2011)

Sounds so familiar. I was hesitant about getting a puppy from my dog's litter as his mom's hips were only rated as fair. I expressed my concern to the breeder, who said this was the third breeding of this pair with no hip problems.

Sure enough, around the age of 14 months, I notice his gait is off. Xrays showed mild to moderate dysplasia with one hip, and mild dysplasia with the other.

We started him on omega 3 and glucosamine/chondroiten. He gets cartrophen injections bi-monthly. He swims in our pool in the summer. He takes classes and has his CD. He is now 4 1/2 years old, between 74-76 pounds, and appears to be managing well with his hips.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thanks 2tired it is good to hear your boy is doing well. Sona had a good stable anaesthetic and has come around. I have an appointment in a couple of hours to review the X-rays with vet so it will be good to have some answers then.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Sona*

Praying for Sona and you. We adopted a female Samoyed, that had Hip Dysplasia and the Vet did an FHO surgery on her worst hip and after she recovered she walked pain free.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thanks karen and to everyone for the kind words and advice. 
The outcome is probably as good as could be expected in the circumstances. She had mild dysplasia - right worse than left. They said she will develop arthritis but she is not in pain now and has full range of motion and the joint is not popping in and out or anything like that. I don't need to limit her exercise but she is to be referred for physio to develop her thigh muscles. My goal now will be to keep her lean and athletic and maintaining the stability of the joint. Vet also agreed that there is no harm adding turmeric to her supplement so will be starting that next week. 
Again thanks to you all it's nice to have been able to download here when in a panic and upset and have people offer good and calming advice


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Wicky*

Wicky: You are so welcome. We are all here for one another.
Your girl is beautiful!


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## nolefan (Nov 6, 2009)

Wicky;6491482...... I don't need to limit her exercise but she is to be referred for physio to develop her thigh muscles. My goal now will be to keep her lean and athletic and maintaining the stability of the joint....[/QUOTE said:


> Ok, I have been thinking and thinking about you all and am just thrilled to see that while this is not a perfect situation your little girl is about as lucky as she can possibly be to live with an owner who is doing such a great job caring for her. Just so happy for you that what you've done up to now is setting her up for the best possible scenario and you will get her the care and continue the diet that has kept her at such a healthy weight so far. Thank heaven this isn't life threatening and she has such great odds for a happy, healthy life with you. Thank you for updating, I really have been hoping so much that it would be a manageable prognosis and good quality of life for her.


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## Pilgrim123 (Jul 26, 2014)

That's really good news, all things considered. It's what we did with Pilgrim - keep him moving. Now you can look forward to a long and happy life with your girl.


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## rooroch (Nov 7, 2012)

That's good news. With supplements and correct exercise she should have a great life. I see she goes swimming, that is the best. Well done getting all the necessary information while she is young to enable her to live with this in the best possible way.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thanks to you all for the support. I managed to get a physio appointment for next week so looking forward to getting her assessed and started on exercises


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## anamcouto (Aug 15, 2015)

Hi Wicky,

So many of us sharing the same hip issues around here :frown2:
My puppy Ella similar age was diagnosed when she was 5months, wonder if you could share image of her xray and the advises you get from your vets so that others like for example can be better informed different vets different backgrounds and studies who knows all is good info to make our puppies life as full as possible.

Good to know you have access to phisio vet, me and another member currently stationed in Korea I believe are not so lucky plus we both share a very big problem, language and culture barrier between us and our community (I'm lucky as I have a Portuguese vet instead of Chinese). The communities where we live don't see dogs like we do, they see tend to see them more of an object to have or a live teddy bear that you have at home, it's hard to explain. So we basically rely on other peoples experience and what we can research online.

I have my one thread where I vent out my concerns and also try and share our limited experience, really believe that if other GR owners that live in areas with more resources can share their experiences and given advises that would be of great help to the general GR community.

Pretty sure that your puppy will be fine and have a great happy life, for sure you will appreciate more the time spent with Sona and provide even better care, so not all are bad news.

Anyway a big hug for strength from China/Hong Kong/ Macau from me and Ella the Asian cousin :x

If you want to check what's been happening with us you can follow the below thread link, I try to update any development on Ella's condition, x-Ray, supplements


And I just realized that your Sona is the Sona from the March 2015 puppies, so both Ella and Sona are the same age!


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Wicky*

Wicky:

Please keep us posted!


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thanks Karen and Anamcouto for checking in!
Anamcouto it's funny I went went to look for your thread again when Sona was diagnosed as I remembered Ella had some issues from the March 2015 thread and I had seen your thread a number of months before. For some reason I couldn't find it so I need to check properly and catch up on your story.
I need to ask the vet for the X-rays as I would like to send them to her breeder as 'mild' doesn't really tell her much. I also want to look into getting them BVA scored as some of the research papers I've read class mild as '11 to 20 total score: mild changes that may worsen with age, sometimes developing into osteoarthritis'. With the median breed average being 12 there must be many goldens falling into this category. Although the vet said Sona 'would' rather than 'could' develop osteoarthritis. I guess I'm still trying cling onto a 'best' outcome. 
We started physio last Friday and it was really interesting and probably grounding for me. He spoke about the future and maybe I should get her used to a car ramp etc. They did a gait analysis which showed her offloading more from her left hind than right hind leg. Funnily when I brought her to the vet initially I thought the left was worse - although X-ray showed showed opposite. Physio though it was odd the vet said not to restrict exercise but for some reason they had not sent him the X-ray. He also felt she was in some discomfort which is hard to hear. Hopefully this is mainly due to offloading onto her front legs causing her muscles to be really tense. He showed me how to massage her and gave a series of exercises. Mostly these are focused on moving her centre of gravity back towards her hind legs or stretching muscles (getting her to eat from a raised bowl with her feet on a step so she only lowers her head / standing on a step get her to reach off to the side for a treat). I also need to get her to walk over a series of poles which (I think) forces her to extend her reach and place her legs correctly when walking. Our next appointment is Friday so she will be having electrotherapy for pain relief and we will be continuing with strengthening exercises. I do realise how lucky I am to be located somewhere I can get good vet physio support.


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## mylissyk (Feb 25, 2007)

Building good muscle in the hips can really stave off surgery in the future. One of the rescue's dogs has pretty bad HD, but her adopters have kept her fit and active and built a lot of muscle on her, she is a little mini body builder, and even the vets that have seen her xrays are impressed with how well she's doing.


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

*Wicky*



Wicky said:


> Thanks Karen and Anamcouto for checking in!
> Anamcouto it's funny I went went to look for your thread again when Sona was diagnosed as I remembered Ella had some issues from the March 2015 thread and I had seen your thread a number of months before. For some reason I couldn't find it so I need to check properly and catch up on your story.
> I need to ask the vet for the X-rays as I would like to send them to her breeder as 'mild' doesn't really tell her much. I also want to look into getting them BVA scored as some of the research papers I've read class mild as '11 to 20 total score: mild changes that may worsen with age, sometimes developing into osteoarthritis'. With the median breed average being 12 there must be many goldens falling into this category. Although the vet said Sona 'would' rather than 'could' develop osteoarthritis. I guess I'm still trying cling onto a 'best' outcome.
> We started physio last Friday and it was really interesting and probably grounding for me. He spoke about the future and maybe I should get her used to a car ramp etc. They did a gait analysis which showed her offloading more from her left hind than right hind leg. Funnily when I brought her to the vet initially I thought the left was worse - although X-ray showed showed opposite. Physio though it was odd the vet said not to restrict exercise but for some reason they had not sent him the X-ray. He also felt she was in some discomfort which is hard to hear. Hopefully this is mainly due to offloading onto her front legs causing her muscles to be really tense. He showed me how to massage her and gave a series of exercises. Mostly these are focused on moving her centre of gravity back towards her hind legs or stretching muscles (getting her to eat from a raised bowl with her feet on a step so she only lowers her head / standing on a step get her to reach off to the side for a treat). I also need to get her to walk over a series of poles which (I think) forces her to extend her reach and place her legs correctly when walking. Our next appointment is Friday so she will be having electrotherapy for pain relief and we will be continuing with strengthening exercises. I do realise how lucky I am to be located somewhere I can get good vet physio support.


Thanks for the update and I hope Anamcuoto keeps us updated, too!


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

*Working hard!*

We have been working hard on Sonas physio. It's been hard watching her struggle with some actions when all she wants to do is please - but we are getting there! I hope one day she will be able to do a full and stable 'beg' but baby steps!!!
I have some guttering set up as cavaletti outside but borrowed this hurdle set from our trainer which lets us work on improving her proprioception at any time!


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

Wicky is just beautiful and looks like she is doing well in the video. You are a great Mom!!


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## Karen519 (Aug 21, 2006)

I meant Sonia is beautiful!


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

I'm wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this.... I'm considering getting Sonas hips scored. My breeder has given me the details of where she gets her dogs xrayed. On the plus side they do it under sedation rather than GA, but I'm not sure I want to put Sona through even sedation when it could be considered unnecessary. Part of me wants to get it done so I can quantify the extent of the problem but then it's not like it will change anything in term of treatment so it feels a bit selfish. I guess I just have a question mark that the vet X-rays that were done might not be the very best as they wouldn't do lot of hip scoring X-rays. Then again Sona is doing well right now regardless.


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## Pilgrim123 (Jul 26, 2014)

I'm far from the pedigree/breeding set so take my answer as a layperson's opinion. I can remember reading somewhere on the board that you should check the hip scores of offspring, etc, before buying a puppy. My thoughts on getting more authoritative hip score is that it won't hurt Sona, it may help you decide what treatment may be needed as she gets older and it may help with the breeding of sounder dogs in the future.
How's she doing with her hips?


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

Wicky said:


> I'm wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this.... I'm considering getting Sonas hips scored. My breeder has given me the details of where she gets her dogs xrayed. On the plus side they do it under sedation rather than GA, but I'm not sure I want to put Sona through even sedation when it could be considered unnecessary. Part of me wants to get it done so I can quantify the extent of the problem but then it's not like it will change anything in term of treatment so it feels a bit selfish. I guess I just have a question mark that the vet X-rays that were done might not be the very best as they wouldn't do lot of hip scoring X-rays. Then again Sona is doing well right now regardless.


Wait until she is two, and then have them done under sedation. I had a friend whose dog came back dysplastic the first time because of bad positioning. Went to another vet, vet said they actually could be Good, but the came back as Fair. They only put them under for a very short amount of time, I picked Sailor up a couple hours later and she was not groggy at all.


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## 3 goldens (Sep 30, 2005)

Your girl is beautiful. Last year we adopted an 11 year old golden with very bad knees and hips. Her back legs bow out and her back feet turn in. Reminds me of a pigeon toed, bowlegged cowboy. She has been on Cosequin which has helped some and we are considering Adequan injections. BUT she has had some seizures and we do not know what brought them own. She got her rabies Thursday and had a bad seizure on Saturday. She had a mild one a few weeks ago and we had given them a Bravecto flea/tick cube thing around that time, but do not remember if it was before or after. Same with last Auguest, her worst ever, and she had had the flea/tick cube that month, but again, I don't know if it was before or after. So we really don't know if it is these things or not that sets off the seizures. So, to be on safe side, we are delaying doing the Adequan injections.. Hope all goes well with your little girl.


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## rooroch (Nov 7, 2012)

Cubbysan is right. Wait until 2 and do the hip Xray under sedation. When the dogs are relaxed (sedated) the vet can (should) get the correct position and the reading will be as accurate as possible. You are doing a great job with her and hopefully the results will be good. I am glad your breeder is helping you with this and given you the name of the vet she uses for hip xrays. I used to breed Bassets in Switzerland and they are notoriously difficult to position correctly due to their morphology. Sedation was the only way to get a good result.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thanks all for you thoughts and suggestions. Yes I would definitely go with sedation - this would mean going to the the place recommended by by breeder. It's a highly recommended place with a radiologist and they specialise in hip/elbow scoring. My issue with my vet (and most over here I think) was that they would only do it under a GA and I definitely don't want to do that just for a non-essential X-ray. 
Sona is doing well and has moved to treadmill work with added resistance in physio. It's halted at the moment as she is in season but we are continuing to work at home on wobble cushions etc. She also started to go into a beg position naturally which is not something she did before so I like to think her awareness and strength in her back legs has improved. I must try to find a photo.....


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Here we go! Not a great photo but you get the idea!!


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

3 goldens said:


> She got her rabies Thursday and had a bad seizure on Saturday.


Sorry to hear this 3 goldens. I hope your girl is doing well. It must be such a worry wondering about the cause. Hopefully delaying the injections works well


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## swishywagga (Nov 13, 2012)

Wicky said:


> Here we go! Not a great photo but you get the idea!!


Love your girl, she looks beautiful in all her photos!.


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## anamcouto (Aug 15, 2015)

Ella got her second x-Ray when sedated for the spay surgery. At this time my Vet was not so worried on getting her in the right position as we already know the diagnosis. Her concern was checking for calcification spots, arthritis and bone degeneration.
The spay surgery was the fastest she ever preformed in a dig Ella's size so she was pretty confident on getting enough to time for the x-Ray.

The progression of the HD is the expected for the time frame between x-Ray and considering also the glucosamine.

Since Ella had a nasty reaction to the suture line between 15 days and 1month after I'm now considering not getting any surgery done unless critical. Ella rejected the most common used type of suture line way after what is even normal for that situation so right now I don't want to take any risks. I'll focus on getting the best life I can for her.

Will see how it goes but it helps having a Vet that thinks things through so that she can due additional X-ray together with other procedures that require sedation anyway.

I do see a big difference on how Ella walks and moves when I can a long swimming seasons paired with some ball fetch play on grass. Or when we any go swimming because the beach or the weather doesn't allow.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

*Improving balance and core strength*

So we have been working hard to get Sona to do some balance work. She is doing well on the foam as you can see in the video so I think I may up the ante and try putting some wobble cushions underneath!


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Thought I would update this thread as it is almost 10 months since I did and over a year since diagnosis.
I was so upset when I started the thread yet a year of physio and a chunk of savings and Sona is living her life happily. I may not allow her to jump from heights or push her for long walks regularly but when I took her on a few days away in the mountain she coped fine with a days hiking. I keep her swimming as much as I can. Her core strength and body awareness is much improved - she moves and free stacks nicely and it is so nice to hear this from our ringcraft trainers who have seen the improvement. I have started doing competitive obedience her - or attempt to anyway ? She has even started basic agility (tailored to her special needs). Who knows when she will become symptomatic but I will do everything I can to delay it and regardless right now Sona is happy and lives life to the full and at full speed.


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## nolefan (Nov 6, 2009)

Thank you so so much for this update, the moment I saw the title I was hoping it was you with a good update. This is wonderful to hear, all of it (well, except for the amount of money you've had to spend) but I'm glad to hear you're in better spirits and that you're figuring out how to manage this and give her as much quality of life as you can. You're an awesome owner and she is one heck of a lucky girl to be so loved and well cared for. Hopefully you can continue to let us know how she is doing and your story will be a guide for someone in the future who is looking for guidance with this issue. Sending you and Sona continued good vibes for health and happiness....


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## cubbysan (Mar 13, 2007)

Didn't know what to expect when I saw the date of the original thread. Happy to hear she is doing well.


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## Berna (Jun 14, 2016)

My dog who has really bad hips lived a really happy, active life. We went hiking, swimming, he even played lots of fetch. I didn't even know he had bad hips (accidental finding) because he didn't show any symptoms. The vet told me then that is because he has a really good muscle tone that keeps the joints stable. He is 11 now, and doing good for a dog his age. His left elbow is bothering him more than his hips (degenerative changes in elbow).

My friend has a Gordon Setter who was diagnosed with mild hip dysplasia when he was about your dog's age. She even considered surgery. The dog is now 7 years old and still happy and active, doesn't show any symptoms either.

Another friend had a Lab with really, really bad hips. The dog lived to be 14, with a good quality of life.

Sona looks happy and healthy and I bet she will do fine for many years to come. Older dogs do develop arthritis, but that can be managed too. There's a saying about arthritis, you die with it, but you don't die from it. So, don't worry, keep up the good work and enjoy her.


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## Gleepers (Apr 20, 2016)

Glad to hear a positive update. My little Golden/mutt Ted was DXed at 11mo. 
Pretty sure my world crumbled for about 2 weeks. This was in early March. He is now on supplements and an herbal formula and doing very well. 
Good stories of dogs with HD make me feel much better about our future outlook.


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

nolefan said:


> (well, except for the amount of money you've had to spend)


Well she could have my last penny but I know I'm lucky I could cover it after we reached the insurance limit on physio.
Thanks for your kind words


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Berna said:


> )The vet told me then that is because he has a really good muscle tone that keeps the joints stable. . The dog lived to be 14, with a good quality of life .


This is what I'm hoping for!!
Thanks for your story it's always good to hear good stories


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## Wicky (Aug 27, 2015)

Gleepers said:


> Glad to hear a positive update. My little Golden/mutt Ted was DXed at 11mo.
> Pretty sure my world crumbled for about 2 weeks. This was in early March. He is now on supplements and an herbal formula and doing very well.
> Good stories of dogs with HD make me feel much better about our future outlook.


This is exactly how I felt. Sona is on a joint supplement too. Glad to hear Ted is doing well and the thread was useful. Was not sure about updating it but everyone who offered a positive story to me helped so was hoping this may help someone else. I'll be looking out for a Ted updates - he is a cute little fella.


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