# Antibiotic Responsive Gastroenteritis/Diarrhea



## GoldenMom999 (Apr 14, 2017)

Did they do an Elisa test to determine if there is a parasite? So far my puppy (who eats everything including some dirt...with or without worms...) has had Coccidia, Giardia, and "Other non-host specific parasites which would have been obtained by scavenging or predation". Metronidazole was for Giardia and intestinal inflammation. Albon was for the Coccidia.


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## Siandvm (Jun 22, 2016)

My dog, Rayder (15 months) has that. We went through months and months of testing, diet changes, rounds of metronidazole, etc. Finally, the metronidazole stopped working and we tried Tylosin (almost certainly the sprinkle you are talking about) and we haven't looked back. 1/4 tsp in a meatball (its super bitter, so best not sprinkled) once a day and he has the best poops of his life and has not had diarrhea since March. 

I would recommend trying the tylosin and if he responds, you know you were not treating giardia with the metronidazole, but the antibiotic responsive diarrhea. Dr. Marks at UC Davis, a world famous veterinary gastroenterologist, was mortified that I had spent so much time giving him metronidazole, as he says Tylosin is far preferred for the antibiotic responsive diarrhea. I was a student of his in vet school, so he was horrified that I had not come to see him sooner!


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## cinder (Dec 8, 2013)

Ditto what Siandvm said about tylosin.

Dixie is 2 ½ and frequently gets bacterial overgrowth, which for her means bloody diarrhea and vomiting. Usually a short course of metro will get it under control.

She was pretty bad a few months ago, so we put her on a 2 week course of metro but it didn’t quite do the trick this time. For the past 5 weeks she has been on tylosin powder and is doing much better. She’s about 75% normal, and we can tell she is feeling good again. Our vet suggested adding psyllium husk to her food which helped a little but wasn’t quite enough. We stopped the psyllium husk and are experimenting with adding a little higher fiber kibble to her food and it seems to be working (fingers crossed).

She can be on the tylosin long term if she has to be. She takes 1/8 tsp in the morning and evening, and we give her good probiotics at noon. We’re just trying to find a good balance in her diet right now. And, yes, it is bitter. We tried covering it up in different foods and she knew it was there. We make homemade pill pockets for her and since she swallows them whole, it works like a charm.


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## Siandvm (Jun 22, 2016)

cinder said:


> Ditto what Siandvm said about tylosin.
> 
> Dixie is 2 ½ and frequently gets bacterial overgrowth, which for her means bloody diarrhea and vomiting. Usually a short course of metro will get it under control.
> 
> ...


You should make sure, if you haven't already, to test her B12 and folate levels. Rayder also receives B12 supplementation as a result of apparently inadequate absorption from his food. It is common in this condition.


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## cinder (Dec 8, 2013)

Siandvm said:


> You should make sure, if you haven't already, to test her B12 and folate levels. Rayder also receives B12 supplementation as a result of apparently inadequate absorption from his food. It is common in this condition.


Thank you, I didn't know that. We will make sure to get that done.


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## hokiethegolden (Sep 19, 2017)

GoldenMom999 said:


> Did they do an Elisa test to determine if there is a parasite? So far my puppy (who eats everything including some dirt...with or without worms...) has had Coccidia, Giardia, and "Other non-host specific parasites which would have been obtained by scavenging or predation". Metronidazole was for Giardia and intestinal inflammation. Albon was for the Coccidia.


Yes we have done two or even three Elisa tests and everything has come back negative every time. I thought it could have been Coccidia or Giardia but the vet said there is no way it could be either at this point.


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## hokiethegolden (Sep 19, 2017)

Siandvm said:


> My dog, Rayder (15 months) has that. We went through months and months of testing, diet changes, rounds of metronidazole, etc. Finally, the metronidazole stopped working and we tried Tylosin (almost certainly the sprinkle you are talking about) and we haven't looked back. 1/4 tsp in a meatball (its super bitter, so best not sprinkled) once a day and he has the best poops of his life and has not had diarrhea since March.
> 
> I would recommend trying the tylosin and if he responds, you know you were not treating giardia with the metronidazole, but the antibiotic responsive diarrhea. Dr. Marks at UC Davis, a world famous veterinary gastroenterologist, was mortified that I had spent so much time giving him metronidazole, as he says Tylosin is far preferred for the antibiotic responsive diarrhea. I was a student of his in vet school, so he was horrified that I had not come to see him sooner!


Oh my gosh, you have just given me so much hope. If your dog is 15 months now may I ask when his diarrhea started. And how long your vet plans to keep him on the Tylosin. We got Tylan powder yesterday which I believe is the same exact thing so I am very excited to hear it worked for you! Our vet seems to believe this is a puppy thing and he will outgrow it. Does Dr. Marks believe the same?


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## Siandvm (Jun 22, 2016)

hokiethegolden said:


> Oh my gosh, you have just given me so much hope. If your dog is 15 months now may I ask when his diarrhea started. And how long your vet plans to keep him on the Tylosin. We got Tylan powder yesterday which I believe is the same exact thing so I am very excited to hear it worked for you! Our vet seems to believe this is a puppy thing and he will outgrow it. Does Dr. Marks believe the same?


He had diarrhea or at least not normal stool form the time we brought him home at 8 weeks. He was positive for giardia and coccidia, but the diarrhea persisted after treatment. We tried changing his diet and everything made it worse except canned Hills i/d. On the advice of a different veterinary internal medicine specialist, we tried a high fiber diet (even though it wasn't labeled for puppies, which was a source of consternation for me) and his poops finally firmed up, although they were very voluminous from the fiber. 

We maintained him on the high fiber food from about September through March. However, he still had diarrhea about once a month. It was always very responsive to metronidazole, though. That is, until the episode in March when it wasn't. That's when we tried the tylosin and within 24 hours his poop was normal. We also, for unrelated itchiness reasons, changed his diet to a hydrolyzed protein diet and, despite not having the fiber, his poop remained normal (and now not so bulky, yay!). 

We ran some blood work pre-anesthesia (to assess some dental issues) and that sent us down the rabbit hole checking on some abnormalities. Everything turned out normal on further (more expensive -- thank goodness for insurance) testing, except that, as I mentioned earlier, his B12 was low, so now he gets supplemented with that. 

I went to see Dr. Marks just to make sure we were covering all our bases as I was so tired of all this. He said we could do Tylan once a day instead of the twice we were doing as studies show it works just as well that way for most dogs. He also upped the B12 a little. Otherwise, he seemed unconcerned. In answer to your question, a long course of Tylan may clear this up, but there are also some dogs who must be maintained on it because when you take them off they relapse sooner or later. I have been reticent to take Rayder off because he is doing so well, but I suppose I really must try it!


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## hokiethegolden (Sep 19, 2017)

Siandvm said:


> He had diarrhea or at least not normal stool form the time we brought him home at 8 weeks. He was positive for giardia and coccidia, but the diarrhea persisted after treatment. We tried changing his diet and everything made it worse except canned Hills i/d. On the advice of a different veterinary internal medicine specialist, we tried a high fiber diet (even though it wasn't labeled for puppies, which was a source of consternation for me) and his poops finally firmed up, although they were very voluminous from the fiber.
> 
> We maintained him on the high fiber food from about September through March. However, he still had diarrhea about once a month. It was always very responsive to metronidazole, though. That is, until the episode in March when it wasn't. That's when we tried the tylosin and within 24 hours his poop was normal. We also, for unrelated itchiness reasons, changed his diet to a hydrolyzed protein diet and, despite not having the fiber, his poop remained normal (and now not so bulky, yay!).
> 
> ...


We can't say thank you enough for taking the time to thoroughly describe your experience. I think they most definitely are in the same boat. They just took blood yesterday and get the results tomorrow. They did a cortisol level and antech geriatric profile (not exactly sure what this is) but wondering if either will detect B12 deficiency. They were really expensive and no insurance here but oh well, very worth it. I don't want to be missing anything. 

I am really hoping he will not be on the Tylan after the 8 week treatment though. Praying anyway. Please feel free to keep us updated on Rayder's progress with this. Fingers crossed he can be off soon!


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## veronica.miller (Oct 19, 2018)

Has the Tylan given your baby an upset stomach? My 7 month old puppy has also been diagnosed with ARD. She has been on Tylan for 4 weeks and is expected to stay on for another 4 weeks. However, I she has developed GERD, as diagnosed by the internal medicine specialist she has been referred to. I am wondering if your dog has experienced this since being on Tylan and if so, is there anything you have been able to do to help the symptoms.


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## Siandvm (Jun 22, 2016)

No, we never had any problems stomach-wise with the Tylosin. I would follow the specialist’s advice re. the GERD. Hopefully you can stop the Tylosin after a time and the GERD will resolve. Best of luck.


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## intercede007 (May 30, 2018)

Really want to thank ya'll for the info in this thread. 

We're burning down possibilities with Chloe now, who is 9 months old. We've been around this spin cycle with her since she was about 3 months old, and we got her at 2 months. 

Currently we've just finished another round of Metronidazole, and the vet put her on a strict diet of Hills I/D. Unfortunately, while still on the metro she had a pure liquid movement. She is also on FortiFlora once a day. Like all other past occurrences she had 24 hours of chicken and rice and was back to more normal the next day. I expect that we'll be in the vet later this week to talk about blood tests and things of that nature. My gut says she's got inflammatory bowel disease. 
*
Quick question *- those of you that have dealt with ARD and have had a diagnosis other than food allergies - did you notice your dogs breath smelling bad? When she is on the metro, and off the metro but with solid stool, her breath has no smell. When things start going south and she has puddle poops, her breath is awful. I'm starting to be able to predict when things are about to get bad based off of that.


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